Are the Forresters the "low cost" version of the Starks?
Since I started playing this game I realized that house Forrester and house Stark had way too many similitudes between them. Starting on the father, Ser Gregor "The Good", who is loved by everyone, with his leadership everything went fine and the family was united. But he was betrayed and killed. If you change "Gregor" for "Eddard" on the previous sentence you will see how many differences they have (none).
Then we have Rodrick, the first born son and best warrior of the house, even though his appearance on this game is too short he reminds me to Robb (The young wolf did never lose a battle). Furthermore there is a elder daughter in King´s Landing facing a dangerous situation with the queen because of her surname. Do I have to say that it is just the Sansa´s story?
You may say that the youngest daughter of the Forresters doesn't looks like Arya but you will see that even there are similitudes. Arya loved Jon Snow to the point that she finds herself thinking on Jon´s smile from time to time (She loves him like a brother don´t get me wrong) Well, the little one of the Forresters is attached in some way to Gared, she actually looked concerned about him, what´s more, she gifts him a necklace.
To conclude we have Gared, he is not a Forrester (Jon is not a Stark), he is a squire (Jon is a bastard), Gared ends in the Wall (Jon ends in the Wall).
PD: The only Forresters who don´t look like a Stark are Ethan and Asher.
Comments
Actually, there have been at least two other threads about this...
Could you post the links to those threads then? I have been thinking on this some time but I haven´t see any other thread.
https://www.telltalegames.com/community/discussion/87525/house-forrester-is-too-similar-to-house-stark
Well, I was wrong about there being 2 others but still.
Ethan could be Bran though.
Have you finished the episode?
I did, however I'm not talking about the ending, but the role of lord which both had to play. Bran, as Robb's heir, becomes the Prince of Winterfell, and rules the castle. Ethan, as Rodrick's, becomes a lord of Ironrath.
Yes you´re right. For some reason I did firget that Bran ruled Winterfell, too many things happened since then.
So far, yes. Though Asher will be interesting. I know people relate Asher to Jon but Gared seems more like Jon IMO. Asher doesn't really have a similar character in the Stark household.
I hope they develop the characters in different ways though. Ryon better not become a crippled and Gared get together with a wildling or something lmao.
I think that was probably deliberate and I don't have a problem with it.
There's one difference though, The Forresters survived the Red Wedding.
Did they? As far as I know the only one that escaped was Gared...
Well, I can understand why you would say that, allow me to give my opinion on this.
The Starks themselves are pretty stereotypical, let's be serious for a minute, even though Game of Thrones is a good story with good characters etc... Are the characters themselves anything original ? Hell no. You have the inappropriate drunken King. The Honorable-to-Death Lord and friend, the noble daughter who'd rather scourge the land for adventures than be the traditional Lady, the son who seeks revenge for his father, the despotic King with a twisted personality, the overprotective borderline insane ready-to-do-anything Mother etc...
Just looking at it quickly, yeah they're pretty similar, but let's have a better look, especially at the circumstances:
Gregor for instance, died protecting something important and even gave Gared a mission, Ned died alone after being humiliated without even being able to put his children to safety, different impact.
Jon went to the Wall because he wanted to, Gared was forced to, different mindset.
Robb was more of a strategist actually, sure he was a decent fighter, but Rodrik on the other hand was really shown to be an excellent fighter, even having "his name carving fear in the ranks of the Lannisters". Robb was feared for his tactics and the fact he managed, despite his young age, to unite the North, different strengths and influence.
Mira has a clear goal in King's Landing, helping her family however she can and she is pretty determinate about it, Sansa was just a plaything for Joffrey and the Queen to torment, Mira strikes as a strong character mentally and even intellectually, earning the praise of Tyrion depending on how you answered to Cersei, different willpower.
I don't think I need to go over how Ethan and Bran are different.
Arya and Ryon either (although it might be more appropriate to compare him to Rickon but, well), one looks like Clementine, he needs to be guided, Arya on the other hand, well, does her thing.
Asher is plain different from any of the Starks.
So, I do agree that Forrester looks like the Starks, but when you think about it, every character looks like X or Y. It's the subtle things and the overall story and hardships said characters have to go through that makes them unique. Thanks if you bothered to read it all.
If you look hard enough, you can find similarities everywhere with stories and characters. Nothing is totally original these days.
It's their background, thoughts and actions that make them unique. Story wise, it is how a story's told that makes it unique as all ideas have pretty much been explored and stories are simply retold, but looked at from a different perspective while details change.
Well, nothing was ever 'original'. The boy up there is nitpicking because he doesn't get that simple idea (your comment, the idea, is, I mean).
Seriously, I can't agree with any negative critic that people write about this game here: they appear to not have thought through. They're all lacking real and reasonable arguments, instead of biased looks...
Let's just not precipitate ourselves on critics everybody...
I decided, a while ago, to try my best to not reply to negative posts. Or if I do, to not spend much time on the post.
That doesn't mean there's no place for it, but it's pointless debating, really. For instance, is the OP likely to change their view no matter how reasoned a counter argument is? I'd argue no.
At the end of the day, people either like something or they don't. No point trying to convince them to change their mind as everything's subjective. And I've found the constant replies are what help fuel the negativity anyway.
It's especially problematic when the negative points raised are very minor or non-sensical too.
Anyway, all this to say I mostly agree.
Yeah...I could tell that they were written this way to make you think of the Starks, because it makes you cringe/upset when they meet their untimely end. Make no mistake, they were made in the likeness of the Starks to pull on your heart strings more. In a large way, it does disappoint me though...Telltale is really good at making original characters that you either love/hate but are somewhat unpredictable, since they could do bad/good things you don't expect and shed new light on them and make you see them differently.
With the Forrester's....I just treated them like Starks and wasn't really surprised by anything they choose to do, it didn't really shed any new insight on what I saw they were at face value. Personally, I think Asher is going to be the wild card in all this. His character doesn't really match any know living Stark but he could be like Ned's brother Brandon which is nice, since we know very little on him other then his hot-headness and VERY gruesome death.
Well let me say that even if they look like the Starks I really like this game and that doesn't changes my experience with it.
But don´t say that "everything nowadays is copied and nothing is original so this isn't important". Everything gets inspired in something, in some cases the inspiration goes to deliberated copy, and when I play this game I see Gared but I also see Jon, same with Mira and Sansa. They both are just too much inspired on the Starks that they are a direct copy (for me). Probably in the following episodes their roles are going to be pretty different of the Starks roles.
I just found this "similitudes" a bitt excessive and I wanted to know if I was the only one who thought that. I didn't open this thread to start an argument
Not sure if you were clarifying that you 'didn't create this thread to start an argument' partly because of what I said or not, but if you were, I was speaking in general anyway. Not about your thread or you in specific. Though I did reference you, it was more to just make a point really, rather than to point fingers or what have you.
Don't think you have any reason to clarify anything anyway. And there is, afterall, nothing wrong with seeing if others share similar thoughts.
Theyre similar to the Starks, but theyre not THE Starks. Families in one region are probably similar to each other in some ways, unless they're completely off the wall cases like The Boltons. I wouldn't presume to know everything they're going to do. All we have left of the family is the mother and the two girls and we havent seen any evidence that the youngest daughter is going to be another Arya. Asher, from what we see is not much like either of the Starks either, as you said.
GRRM isn't going to have an actually important character die in the game, and this is GOT so a lot of people have to die. The Forresters won't affect the main story line much.
Not really, Gregor and Rodrik died and what's worse, Forresters get the bad end of the deal/war. So in a sense they didn't survive the Red Wedding. Surviving would mean the entire family is safe, Rodrik and Gregor out and in Ironrath.
They're not the low cost version, they're kinda like them. When I read the bios before the game, I immediately picked up they were like the Starks and thats great if you love the Starks (I love them lol) and it sucks because they're gonna suffer exactly like how the Starks suffered. F-ing Boltons. Cant believe and understand why they allowed them to be around. After all this, if Jon or Asher ever come back and rule, Boltons have to go, Root and Stem.
Huh, never mind then.
Honestly, I'm more bothered by how on the nose the names "Forrester" and "Whitehill" are. The Forresters have a forrest they cultivate! The Whitehills squandered their Ironwood trees and have bare hills!
In my opinion, only their appearances resembles the Starks, their situations, conflicts, roles and problems are different than the Starks.
I am going to talk about a few of the Forresters.
Mira is not a Sansa clone. She is not a prisoner. She is a handmaiden and she has a clear goal in mind, that is to gain support for her family. Which makes her situation much more interesting and exciting in my opinion, as unlike Sansa, she (and us) has to actively play the game of thrones.
Ethan is not Bran. He is not a cripple, he has his mother, his twin sister and little brother at his side, while Bran only has his little brother back in Winterfell. Almost everyone of his family are at home. This makes Ethan's role different and more adult-like, as he is forced to stop being a boy and become a lord in order to protect his family. Nothing feels more important than to protect your family.
Also, the Forresters owes a large forest of Ironwood, which is the source of their power. I can't remember if the Starks has something similarly important to protect.
Honestly, I think there's good reason for the Forresters to be similar to the Starks.
They were highly valued bannermen for house Stark, mostly probably because they shared the same values of honour and loyalty.
I don't think it's deliberately a copy of the Stark story, but the story may have been shaped based on the HBO tv series actors who agreed to feature in the game, actors playing the roles of Cersei, Tyrion, Margaery, Jon and Ramsay... which means that one family member needed to be at the wall, and one in kings landing....
Killing off the lords of the most influential family in Robb Stark's army just makes sense to the series.
Also, as far as looking like the Stark is concerned, I disagree. Their faces are different to the Starks. They do dress the same way and wear their hair the same way, but this is due to them both being houses in the North of Westeros. Fashion varies based on location, not house.
These families are mentioned in the books, if you don't approve, I suggest writing to George R.R. Martin. That's not the doing of telltale or HBO.
From a historical standpoint, its not unheard of for a family to be named based on where or how they live... the name "Smith" originates from someone being a blacksmith for example.
Asher strikes me as an expy of sorts for Theon Greyjoy.
Nah, I don't see it. From the first POV Theon chapter/some of his beginnging scenes in the show I could tell he was a scumbag. Asher seems to be more of a guy who is an asshole to people who deserve it.
Then again, we haven't even seen Asher yet so he could be like Theon.
And another reason for the descriptive surnames/ house names is because of the First Men culture behind them. If you don't know what I mean just read about First Men on SOIAF wikis out there.
and the daughter was 'taught how to defend herself'