Why TWAU is my least favourite current TT game...
I'm aware that there are lots of fans of TWAU, and before I begin I'd just like to say that this is only my opinion: many other people will feel that TWAU is one of TT's best creations. I, however, don't.
Firstly, the game is spoiled by the secondary characters. I assume most, if not everyone, likes Bigby, but the characters surrounding him (with perhaps the exception of the Crooked Man) are boring, irritating and bland. Snow White is frankly quiet a dire character; whenever she spoke I started to nod off. Those surrounding her were equally boring and shallow, and there were so many different characters that there wasn't any time to get to know who they were. Now I know that TWAU is less of a character based game and is more dependent on the storyline, but they could have at least made an effort to make the secondary characters more interesting.
As I said, arguably the exception to this was the Crooked Man, who intrigued me throughout and was very well portrayed when he did appear. I was generally excited- having had to fight through a bunch of second rate villains, I was finally going to lock horns with the man who had been co-ordinating the entire operation. And then...TT killed him off within a single episode. Really? All that time building up to the Crooked Man and it was that easy to kill him? Now some might argue that Bloody Mary is really the main villain and that might be true, but after all the tension that TT built up over the Crooked Man his demise was very anti-climactic. It left me feeling very, very disappointed.
And while I'm talking about villains, lets put the Crooked Man and Mary to the side for a moment and talk about the others. It's been a while so I can't exactly remember all the names, but what I do remember was that they were all spectacularly dull- the Tweedles, the guy who owned the strip club, the Jersey Devil. All played bit part roles and all of them were never much of a threat to Bigby. They were all just tedious rather than intimidating- they really left it too late to introduce the two main villains, and then they killed one off immediately (many that happens in the comics, but personally I just don't like the way it was done).
A general complaint with all TT games is that there isn't actually that much choice, but with TWAU it was taken t quite extreme. If you decide to kill one of the Tweedles (don't know the name again), nothing really happened; that's just one example, and I'm not going to go on about it for too long (plus I've forgotten most of the game already). You could make the same criticism with all TT games, I know, but killing the Tweedle person was made out to be a big deal and in the long run it meant nothing.
The storyline also is a bit all over the place. Obviously there's a main story running through it (and to be fair, it wasn't all that bad- it was actually quite good). But then they added in stupid little things, like going to Toads place (which, as I recall, doesn't really have anything to do with anything). Then you just get characters being spontaneously introduced and you have zero time to figure out who they are and what they're like. Your just thrown into the fray. This means you get a game filled with (in my opinion) far too many characters, and TT then littered the storyline by adding these meaningless characters in here and there. It just spoiled it for me- I don't want to be going to Toads place and babysitting him! I want to get on with the actual investigation, let someone else check out his place so I don't have to do both tasks. I know Bigby is meant to be the Sheriff, but surely someone else could do one simple thing on their own and report back to him.
Also, I know that TWAU is supposed to be serious and a thriller, but (to me at least) the game was ruined by the fact that, though it's meant to be dark and the whole plot is dark, it was...too dark. More often than not I was miserable rather than intrigued. Mixed in with the awful characters, it just became very, very dull. Like that scene when your in the strip club and you start smashing things up- what the heck was the point of all that? And all the way through it I was bored, very bored. Now I'm not complaining about games in general being dark, but it felt as if TWAU was trying too hard. It's a comic about fairytale creatures that use magic to look like humans. You could argue that the genius of the game is that it takes an innocent set of characters and turns the whole thing on it's head (fair play to the comic writer, it's a clever idea) but I generally just didn't like the feel of the game. I suppose whether you enjoy it or not just depends on the person you are.
Also, when you compare it to other TT games, it's a bit...meh, if you understand what I mean. TWD is about different characters and portrays humans and human emotions brilliantly; GOT is intriguing and it's tendency to be spontaneously violent and suddenly shock people is what makes it good (amongst other things); Borderlands is funny and has a set of very likable characters. But TWAU...I get the sense it's trying to be a dark thriller or murder mystery (whatever you call that genre), but (to me at least) it doesn't quite achieve it.
I'd like to quickly add that (if you've bothered reading this far- if you have, well done, as I tend to drone on) I'm only comparing this game with other TT games. I don't necessarily hate it and compare to most games its probably better. But TT have set that standard for making better than usual games with TWD, and now with GOT in my opinion. But TWAU- it feels sort of...sloppy, in comparison with other TT creations.
What do you people think? Do you like it or hate it? Why do you like/hate it? Oh, and if you disagree so entirely with my post that you feel the need to pull my arguments and points to shreds than your welcome to.
Comments
You make some good points about the game. Now, this is MY opinion and I'm sure a lot of people will tear me a new one or argue that I'm wrong BLAH BLAH BLAH.
I enjoyed the game. I recall being introduced to it from a good friend and I DID enjoy the 1st episode. However, the story and the way it ended, I'm not going to lie, really had me pissed off. They made the Crooked Man seem like this powerful, lock your doors, he's going to get you, kind of guy. I was expecting this HUGE, all out battle with him, his goons and a few other surprises we had yet to encounter. During the 5th episode, I was seriously hoping to attack the CM, have all his goons flee and we track them down. Like a Wolf does with its prey, WE track them down. But instead, it seemed too easy. All that and for what....the pimp did it!? Really? You're just a loanshark? Nothing, really?
I would have rather the ending been like this: We fight the CM in the lair. He escapes. EVERYONE runs off. Who you choose to chase down, like we did in episode 3 and 4, with the different locations, would have made for interesting outcomes. 'I went after Georgie because... or The Jersey Devil because he had the Pawn shop and knew more or whatever. Did I REALLY need to stab Georgie? Did it HAVE to be the pimp that killed those girls? How typical!
I was angry. And I'm sure I'll get 'But pie, he's your favorite so of COURSE you're mad'. No. It had nothing to do with Georgie! At all! As a gamer, I wanted the ending to be 'WOW' 'NO WAY' or 'HE or SHE did it?!' I would have LOVED for the 1st half of the 5th epsode to battle Mary. Jersey Devil. ANYONE! Find the Crooked Man, take Georgie (since he's the one that did it, I guess) and take BOTH to trial. That would have been interesting! A lot more memorable! Hearing those two argue, while you and the others make their decisions? Or, this option:
Okay, fine. Stab Georgie. Cool. That works. I would have rather found, oh I don't-HANS the killer a bit more interesting. We knew nothing of him. The quiet ones always snap first. Or, Grendel. I don't know. (Love him, though) Hell, Vivian did it all herself and Georgie was just there so she could put her master plan together! ANYONE other than the pimp! Now, you stab Georgie. You left him there. You found the CM, fought Mary and brought him back for trial. It would have been interesting to see not only Nerissa come back but have a severly wounded Georgie, in Hans' hands and let HIM tell you what happened. Then, you decide what to do with them.
I get what TWAU was trying to do; that whole Noir feeling and twisted, make you think, murder plot. I understand and it WAS fun for the most part. But it all seemed rushed towards the end. Like THIS is what they were hoping we all wanted. It wasn't a BAD game; I LOVE TWAU, don't get me wrong but I was highly disappointed with the end. TT has done wonderful with TWD and GoT has had its moments so far. I have no regrets playing this game, though. I DID love it....just not the ending.
Ok, wow, I have my fair share of things to say now:
That was a case of bad writing. I don't know if you know this, but TellTale had to re-write the plot of the game after Ep.1 was released cuz the Fables writing team noted how the game was interfering with the canon of the comics. So Toad's/Lawrence's place was kinda pointless (you don't keep any of the items you pick up in Lawrence's place anyways)
The game is a prequel to the Fables comics, now Fables isn't really a 'happy' comic, in fact it's kind of an in-betweener, it has it's good times and it's bad times, but it has a very big cast of interesting and likeable characters.
TWAU introduced new characters that we had never met before like Georgie Porgie, Jersey Devil, the Tweedles etc. And those characters had great potential, but given the limited time of each Episode, they couldn't be expanded upon as much as we would've liked them to be. The character of Bloody Mary was a wasted character imo, she had SO much potential to be a great and scary villain...
I personally love this game, it's my favourite TellTale game and it got me into the Fables comic books in their entirety, something I do not regret at all!
I actually really enjoyed TWAU, my only problem is when people say that TWAU was amazing but TWD S2 was trash or not very good. Because if you actually look carefully into it you can notice that the later 4 episodes of TWAU suffer a lot of the same flaws people claim that TWD season 2 does. That being said I do think it was my least favorite current TT game as well, but it is still amazingly great.
Well, I agree with pie. I didn't like the ending of it. I did enjoy the game, though. I loved it. Just not the ending. Bloody Mary SHOULD have been the main villian. Feel like they didn't do very much to her characters TRUE potential. The CM was a waste to me....It wasn't my all time favorite came but I like it.
Season 2...
I hope so, dude. I really, really do. Or DLC. Something.
Ehh, I think Wolf Among Us was more successful with its story and characters than TWD S2, the fact that TWD S2 had short running times and minimal interaction with the enviornment was only icing on the cake for how disappointing TWD S2 was.
Also, Carver. Just like how CM was introduced and killed quickly, so was Carver!! XP
"They made the Crooked Man seem like this powerful, lock your doors, he's going to get you, kind of guy. I was expecting this HUGE, all out battle with him, his goons and a few other surprises we had yet to encounter. During the 5th episode, I was seriously hoping to attack the CM, have all his goons flee and we track them down. Like a Wolf does with its prey, WE track them down. But instead, it seemed too easy. All that and for what....the pimp did it!? Really? You're just a loanshark? Nothing, really?"
I agree completely. It was so anti-climactic...as you say, I expected there to be a much greater struggle. I fully expected him to survive and once again be the main villain in following seasons (if TT ever intended to do so). But then they just killed him off like he was nothing.
And I agree, Georgie killing the girls was also very anti-climatic. I was expecting to meet a super villain running a highly sophisticated crime syndicate- instead, the Crooked Man died within one episode and all in all it was only made of a few badly portrayed, tedious crooks.
I've never read the comics before so I don't really know what the dynamic is between the comics and the game. But I agree that the numerous characters were underdeveloped and badly portrayed. Maybe TT could've got rid of a few (eg; Jersey Devil, who is pretty pointless) so that we knew the other characters better. And as I said, they were tedious- they didn't come across as the type of people who would be part of such a sophisticated and influential crime syndicate.
Why did you like it so much? I'm not saying your opinion is wrong or anything, it's just that I really didn't like the whole atmosphere and characters in the game.
I agree, but you should give the comics a go, man, they're awesome!
BigbyxSnow romance... my OTP forever XD
The way the game builds him up is definitely similar to Carver, but unlike Carver, he was written better and was a nice foil for Bigby and I do like that scene where he takes a last resort and tries to kill Bigby when he realizes he lost, and his arrogant, foppish attitude was amusing. Carver was lame.
Aren't they making a DLC?
But Wolf had those same things
In fact I think Wolf's run time was even shorter than TWD S2's
I disagree, I felt they were on par since with both we barely even got to know any of the characters apart from a few (Jane, Narissa, Kenny, Snow etc.)
We HOPE TellTale are doing SOMETHING with TWAU :P
Thing is, with the Crooked Man gone I find it a bit difficult to see were a second season would head. What, is Mary just going to take the Crooked Man's place? The crime syndicate is broken with the Crooked Man's sudden and ridiculously quick death. Mary is a threat, sure, but no super villain like the Crooked Man was built up to me.
Well, that's exactly it
I enjoyed the characters and atmosphere a ton.
Carver was just "I'm in control and I'm dangerous in an obvious way"
Crooked Man was mysterious in a way, and he had some great arguments...
The second Season could follow up on the Faith/Nerissa thing.
Or it could be a new story
Yeah, I don't agree with on par, it's really down to how the story was told and how the writing was executed, and I found Wolf Among Us to be the better alternative, plus Bigby was a much more interesting and fun protagonist than boring S2 Clementine, even some of the characters were a bit underdeveloped, the script and voice acting did an admirable job on giving them depth, plus you had Book of Fables which does a good job on fleshing out other things that weren't discussed.
I wouldn't call Clem a boring protagonist, she seems boring because she is just a kid, unlike Lee who got into the thick of it, Clem is always on the sidelines...
Bigby is a very fun protagonist though XD
I say Clem was boring in S2
I don't think she was, but that's just my opinion
I don't think the Crooked Man was intended to be the same kind of villain as Bloody Mary.
The way I saw it, the Crooked Man was designed to be a foil to Bigby. He was calm, composed, used his brain, was charismatic, had a lot of followers and influence. So he was basically the opposite of Bigby. However this also meant that he was supposed to be physically weak as this contrasted with Bigby's muscular character. So it made sense for the Crooked Man to be in the background for most of the game and simply coordinate his moves through others. He wasn't designed to be an up-front villain.
Maybe. Thing is the Faith/Nerissa thing is very, very vague. And what it actually means is still a mystery. A new story would probably be better; a different story each episode might work better than trying to follow a complicated story all the way through
Its probably my second favorite recent Telltale game, mostly because I dont think Telltale will ever top Season 1 of Walking Dead
Some decent points here I can agree some of the characters were one sided like many of the secondary villains. The Crooked Man was supposed to be the ambiguous mastermind behind the mayhem so him showing up late is understandable. My only real problem with it was it's length and how it dropped the ball in the last two episodes
That's what made him such a good villain- the best villains are those that use their head. He had a lot of potential and I could've seen he and Bigby being at odds and Bigby searching for the Crooked Man for a few seasons yet. The fact that they killed him off really, really spoiled it all.
Just one Season of 400 Days basically :P
Yea, pretty much
I'm sorry if I was hard to understand- I agreed with him turning up late, it made sense. What I didn't like was that he died so quickly.
And yes, the last two episodes were very, very rushed. It almost felt like it was only half-done.
Please don't remind me, it's too painful
crieverytime
But seriously: Carver was a different villain, he was more physical and up front. He used brawn (with a healthy dose of brains too, which was what made him so awesome). The Crooked Man was a puppet master, working from behind the scenes. I expected him to last so much longer, especially after the way he'd been built up throughout the entire season
Don't call Carver lame >:(
But...I'll be honest, the Crooked Man is a villain with more dimension to him: he was more complicated than Carver (they could've made Carver more interesting too, but they used the lazy "oh he's a psychopath" argument). I do prefer villains who use their brains usually, but I agreed with a lot of what Carver said which is why I liked him so much.
I don't really agree with that but I won't argue. People are entitled to their own opinions.
Agreed. Wolf was definitely shorter and the characters in TWD S2 were far superior to the characters in TWAU. But I must admit, there's more of an ordered plot to TWAU- but that's probably because TWD is set in a chaotic apocalyptic scenario.
Well he isn't always killed off. You can just have him turned into a crow so he's actually a determinant character. But being a determinant character often means you won't have an important role later on.
Besides Telltale wasn't planning on developing sequels to The Wolf Among Us when they were writing it. They only had a single season deal unlike TWD and GoT which are both multi-season deals. So they had to resolve everything in TWAU in just one season.
It added charm to his character however showing up late pretty much meant he was going to die no way around it I'm afraid
Why was going to Toad's place bad writing?
If Telltale made the episodes longer, (preferably episodes 2, 4, and 5) the season probably wouldn't have had the problem of certain side characters being underdeveloped and rushed, as well as a lot of pointless choice scenes.
But, I personally think the game would've been better if they stuck with the supposed 'original storyline' they cut from the game, which involved Brannigan and some cops finding about Fabletown. (apparently)
Plus, I hated how the whole Beauty and Beast subplot was done in a way as if it never happened! The fight between Beast and Bigby was the WORST fight in-game too. They really need to change the episode previews, damn it TT.