LiS1 Theory...The Evil of Rachel Amber
We know the story and the choice you are left with. We know the problem with changing time for the most part...you save Chloe's father...he buys her a truck...she get in a wreck...she is ejected from the vehicle and feels her back break...the last feeling she will have in her body.
The situation of Father alive equals Chloe in a wheelchair is causality in effect.
You save Chloe by hitting the fire alarm...Chloe lives...but a massive storm will appear and destroy the town is not real causality as the series presented it in the save dad issue. It is implied that the spirit of Rachel is leading you to find her body via the Ghost Doe...but at the same time almost apocalyptic signs are appearing that something bad is going to happen. Max's dream of a massive storm destroying Arcadia Bay seems all but certain.
This falls under the vengful spirit trope of story telling. Finding her Body is what frees her spirit to either destroy Arcadia Bay...the place she has wanted to the point she gets herself killed befriending unsavory characters...or take Chloe a person who was totally devoted to her even though she was using her. Either way becalms the anger that her spirit feels as it's spite is becalmed.
In life, Rachel Amber was her father's daughter...any and all relationships were stepping stones to achieving her goal of escaping Arcadia Bay. From Chloe to Frank to Mr.Jefferson who had the most power to help her achieve her aims. Rachel died tragically in The Dark Room, her goals unfinished.
So what ultimately is the answer to saving Chloe and Arcadia Bay...the answer is to change what happened to Rachel Amber. Max does have that power, it is just a question of will she figure this out. One obvious clue is that at the end of season 1 when you save Arcadia Bay...Joyce gives you a box of Chloe's things...including pictures and such...what if Chloe's journal is in there as well. Would Max be able to piece together the nature of Rachel Amber's power?
Oh it is an interesting what if...only time will tell what happens.
What do you guys think...how could Max save the Bay and Chloe?
Comments
im gonna read this when i get home. Just sayin this so you know someone is interested ?
So I was thinking... If we save the bay does Mr Jefferson get away with it? He could still be at large in season 2 ?
I don't think Rachel causes the storm, I believe Max's powers cause the storm, if you pay attention to the handwriting some of the ominous foreboding messages are written by max. After letting Chloe die max doesn't need to use her powers anymore because she won't need to keep saving her (Chloe is destined to die) so the feedback loop thing caused by back and forthing through time can finally end. Max is the doe and she's showing herself what she needs to find because she can time travel she already knows what young max doesn't and can help. I feel like bae doesn't end their problems it just stretches them out for longer, bay solves the chaos caused by time travel and saves multiple versions of max from getting stuck in between time hell. Some maxs are angry spirits, some are guides and the storm is sciencey fictiony chaos stuff caused by time travel.
The storm does not make sense as a Max issue...she saves Chloe's dad...no storm...but as a vengeful spirit trope it works...either Rachel gets revenge on Arcadia Bay for her death...or she takes someone with her to keep her company. Max saves Kate...no storm...the only thing out of place is the storm.
And no..if we save Arcadia Bay...Nathan informs on Mr. Jefferson and he is arrested as seen in the photos at the after Chloe is shot...Max and Kate watch Mr. Jefferson being escorted out in cuffs.
I like to think of it in a slightly more romantic way.
The storm is Rachel´s anger and the only person that can calm Rachel down is Chloe. But for Chloe to reach Rachel she first has to die.
But that´s one of the fun things about LiS. It´s all vague enough to interpret it however you want.
It is true..I see Rachel as a self absorbed bitch that had no trouble cheating on Chloe and running drugs into the school. Others might overlook those facts.
I forgot about that scene with Jefferson, that's good.
I think your forgetting the beached whales. There were repercussions to saving Chloe's dad and she didn't know Rachel in that timeline.
If the storm is caused by Rachel then she's one controlling bitch and I pity Chloe for having to spend eternity with her, let's not forget Rachel didn't treat her well between lis and BTS, she cheated on her for one and now she wants her dead? It doesn't make sense to me unless Rachel's evil.
I would say that Rachel..is not pure evil...but I will say that she has no idea what real love is...remember how Mr. Jefferson and others described her...She was a Chameleon...able to adapt and function in any social setting. Much like her father being able to work with people he found repugnant...it is a game for her. She plays the friend yet shows disdain for those she walks among.
As for the wales...I am thinking that it is more a reflection of the oncoming storm than Max's use of time. However you could be right about that.
Yeah she's not very nice. I think she's the crow, a trickster with a secret agenda.
If your right and the storm was Rachel dragging Chloe to hell then the bay ending was a terrible choice.
i agree with squishy about max being the cause. i don't think rachel was a bad person. i also don't think her feelings towards chloe were strong enough for something like that. it's more likely to be a reference to the butterfly effect/chaos theory thing about a butterfly flapping its wings and causing a storm. and max is literally the antichrist. her entire existence is about hurting others.
and in rachel's defense, i don't think she cheated on chloe. at least i didn't see it that way. if you read the note she wrote and crumbled up in the junkyard, she only talks about being afraid to tell chloe about the new guy she's seeing because she doesn't think chloe would approve of him, not because she's cheating. so at best they have an open relationship, but it's also possible they weren't actually an official couple at that time. i think i understood rachel a lot more after watching twin peaks and seeing laura palmer. they're p much the same char but with different back stories.
No she was a bad person...if they had an open relationship...Chloe would not have felt so betrayed when she found out about Frank. The worst thing is Rachel may have cared about Chloe....but it did not stop her from betraying Chloe to try and finish her goal of escaping Arcadia Bay.
i really don't think rachel was a bad person deep down. imo, the reason chloe felt betrayed was the secrecy, not really the fact rachel was seeing someone else. rachel p much had this whole other life while chloe who was supposedly her best friend/gf was shut out of it.
i don't doubt rachel cared about chloe, it's just that chloe's feelings towards rachel were much stronger. and i think chloe had different ideas about what their relationship status was. they were wrong for each other from the start. chloe was alone and trying desperately to grab onto anyone out there who isn't named eliot, and when she finally got rachel she held on waaay too tight. that was probs a bit much for rachel and rachel def didn't take their relationship that seriously. it was maybe more of a crush for rachel.
You think her will took on the form of some sort of.....celestial doe, leading Max and Chloe to her body, huh? That actually sounds pretty interesting. But that, along with her causing the storm, also sounds kinda unreal. I don't know if the extent of her supernatural abilities can extend from beyond the grave. Besides, why would she want to destroy the entire town? She wasn't that much of a bitch
Actually, I take that back. She did basically set fire to the entire forest over NOTHING.
If Rachel Amber is in fact linked to the storm, then saving her would definitely be the answer to saving the town. I don't know why Max didn't just rewind all the way back to when she was in Seattle, go to Arcadia Bay or call Chloe, and warn her about Jefferson. Then again, saving one one life could mean ending another.
There's no denying Rachel had supernatural abilities, but what were they? The LiS wiki's theory section for Rachel says
If Rachel had mind reading powers, the whole father lying to her part of the story doesn't make much sense anymore.
...
What you have to remember about Chloe is that she had some serious abandonment issues, and if there's one thing people with abandonment issues are good at it's finding ways of sabotaging their relationships and pushing people away.
And they usually don´t even realize they´re doing it.
So I think it´s a bit unfair to put all the blame on Rachel.
I hope Rachel comes back from the dead to terrorise Chloe and Max
Nope...it is completely fair...she knew best of all Chloe's issues and still did it...so fuck her.
If only relationships were that uncomplicated.
But anyway, we actually have no idea what Chloe and Rachel´s relationship was like and how it evolved after the events of BTS. Only that they were very close.
In season 1 there's no concrete evidence that they were romantically involved. The most Chloe will admit to is having had a crush on Rachel.
And in Before the Storm it all depends on how you play Chloe.
Aside from the platonic playthrough, there are also differences in the playthroughs where Chloe has feelings for Rachel. In one of my playthroughs it was quite obvious Rachel didn't share Chloe's feelings (and was using her) and in another she was all in too.
For instance at the end of episode one after Chloe has admitted to feeling something more than friendship for Rachel, Rachel can either apologize and say that Chloe's confession caught her offguard, or she can say that she also has feelings for Chloe.
And the potential kiss scene can play out in different ways aswell.
In one Chloe will ask for a second kiss and Rachel refuses, and in another Rachel will initiate the second part of the make out session.
What I guess I'm trying to say is, the amount of hatred Rachel deserves all depends on how we played through BTS and on how we fill in the blanks about what happened afterwards.
So, nobody's wrong? I can live with that.
i just got done with my second playthrough of BTS and my impression of rachel kinda changed. i'm still totally sympathetic to her and all, but this game drops mad hints about her that i didn't pick up the first time. like the dream sequence with william basically spells it out. he says darkness blinds with absence and loss (talking about his own death) and fire blinds with beauty (obv rachel), both having a negative impact on chloe's life. he even says chloe's "too blinded to see the danger" and she's about to get burned. there's also the quote at the lookout that says ravens are to be "respected but never trusted". then there's the astrology poster in rachel's room describing her personality traits. negative ones being self-centered, volatile, possessive, and dramatic.
i still don't consider rachel a bad person, just a selfish one. she was the complete opposite of the kinda person chloe needed in her life at that time.
I like that scene with William. When he says "a greater beauty is yet to come" I like to think he's talking about Max.
As for the raven, I don't think it represents Rachel. William is the raven I believe, or more accurately Chloe herself. He's been a guide for Chloe ever since his death. And while she should respect everything dream dad stands for, it really isn't her dad. It's Chloe's idea of who her dad was, and most likely not an accurate portrayal at all.
Chloe shouldn't trust dead dad as her guide. In fact, it screwed up her life pretty bad. always falling back on dad and his death.
Or, more likely, I'm completely wrong.
Still, it's fun to think about.
ohh that makes sense. i never thought her dad could be the raven. but near the end of ep3 she's talking to her dad again wondering if he ever lied to her. and there's an option at the end when talking to sera where chloe can say she saw her dad as perfect but now realizing he wasn't and probably had secrets of his own like everyone else. there was a bunch of hints about chloe being the raven like her clothes and role in the tempest. so maybe you're right. and apparently the ghost doe in LiS1 represents rachel's spirit.
also i'm choosing to ignore your comment about max because i dont wanna get into that now ?
You know it is true.
Ah yes, I think I saw a comment of yours somewhere about Max burning in hell. Yes, best not go there.
Didn't Samuel say the doe was Max' sprit guide? Which actually makes the evil Rachel theory make more sense. I've been wiki'ing the Tempest and it had this to say about Prospero, the character Rachel played;
Prospero's sorcery is sufficiently powerful to control Ariel and other spirits, as well as to alter weather and even raise the dead.
What if Rachel is controlling all these animals? The doe, the butterfly... Not to mention the weather.
Hmmm...
I guess the ending of season 1 is Max stopping to play along with Rachel's game, no matter what choice you pick.
Lets hope she leaves the wolves alone in season 2.
I dont think Rachel is evil. There are more things that we dont know of her. Its still unclear and all we have got are theories. I think we need another game playing as Rachel.
Also im not sure should i buy unfinished LiS 2. Im afraid it can get same fate as Telltale did.
Square-Enix has stupid amounts of cash...money that could have bought Telltale hundreds of times over...the make Final Fantasy...they make Tomb Raider...Dragon Quest...and they have a vested interest in DONTNOD to continue the LiS franchise. You are safe getting LiS2.
i'm p sure it'll get finished but i'm still holding out for a while. can't decide if i should play as it's released or wait until it's done. the wait for TFS is killer. ?
i'm going through LiS1 again and this time i'm picking bay instead of bae because i honestly think death is a better option for chloe than spending another fucking minute with max.
yeh i think i remember samuel saying that too. also came across this on the wiki.
there's no citation or anything so idk how accurate it is.
I dont think its better to play as its released because at least for me it gets bored after you keep replaying.
I just finished LiS 1 again for a second time, in the first episode it was already kinda boring, i wanted to quit but it got quite interasting later, i mean there were so many things i missed so it was worth playing it again.
I finished BtS 3 times and LiS 1 2 times. I dont know when to stop, do you think i should start replaying it all over again xD
i'm on my second playthrough also. i finished BTS already. i avoided replaying it because i didn't wanna ruin my first impression, but it's still amazing. i get crazy nostalgia from BTS which is weird since i only played it once and recently too, like a bit over a month ago. not so much with LiS1 but it's still good. i think these games kinda work with replays because i'm picking up a bunch of things i overlooked in my first playthrough or didn't get to see because of all the different dialogue options. like at the end of BTS ep1 rachel comes out about how she's crushing hard on chloe which i totally missed the first time because she came off as kinda bitchy initially. there's also the part in the train when you can mention chloe's cat and then there's an option to talk about how william gave it to her, then rachel asks if he died and chloe thought she was talking about her father and oh it's just so awkward and sad. it doesn't have any less of an emotional impact than the first time i played. like when i was talking to samuel and he says something about how it's okay to not be okay and i just wanted to hug him and cry omg. and in LiS1 i'm realizing just how evil max is. there's a pic hanging up in ep1 of her friends from seattle showing them having fun together. then when you open one of her drawers, there's the pic of her and chloe. she put it in a fucking drawer while hanging up the pic of her new friends. then when she's sitting in chloe's room in the alternate reality she's thinking how she can't tell this chloe anything because letting her choose would be "cruel". she knows damn well chloe's so kind and sweet she wouldn't think twice about giving her life to let her father live. but max doesn't wanna accept that because she's selfish. goddamn do i hate max.
LoL...I sacrificed Chloe today...after she and Max had a nice romantic kiss....sigh. I think you hate a too hard...we really have no idea why Max stopped talking...maybe a type of survivors guilt who knows. Only thing I know...none of these ladies in LiS1 are what you would call innocent in the fuckery that goes on...Chloe blames everyone and refuses help. Max is in lala land...and Rachel uses people to get what she wants.
They all need slapped imho...they hurt each other and others.
During two truths and a lie, the "I hate country music" option also leads to some sweet dialogue. I won't spoil it by saying what it is exactly, but it's definately woth picking.
Okay, now on to the real reason I'm making this comment; defending Max! (sorry)
You really think the photo in the drawer is such a big deal? Photos on a wall, you walk by them everyday, you see them everyday, they lose their meaning. Photos you put in a drawer, you maybe take them out once in a while to really look at them, they're the special ones.
Giving Chloe the choice wether or not to save her dad would be cruel. Ofcourse she would choose to save her dad. Same as William would be glad to give up his life to keep Chloe out of that chair. But it's neither of their choice to make, nor it is Max' choice. The only thing she can do is turn things back to the way they were. Putting the responsibility and pressure on Chloe would be a very selfish thing to do.
As to not keeping in touch with Chloe. Yes, it is a shitty thing to do, no matter how you look at it. But Max is someone with low self esteem. She overthinks everything and doubts every decision she makes. I'm a bit like that myself, and it's real easy to think yourself into inaction if you are. You don't know how to handle a situation, so you postpone dealing with it, then you postpone it some more until at some point so much time has passed that you just let it go. And you convince yourself you're an asshole for doing so and that they're better off without you anyway.
The way Max treats her picture for the contest is a pretty good indication of how her mind worked when not contacting Chloe. Doubt, doubt, doubt. Postpone, postpone, postpone. Give up.
At the end of the day, Chloe, Rachel, Max, they all have their own personalities and their own issues which make them act the way they act. None of them are evil, they're just people, young people.
ps. Normally my comments are only one or two lines long. So, FUCK LIFE IS STRANGE for making me post fucking novellas like this. I'm already tired again and I only just woke up.
Selfish enough to save Chloe at least. I mean she did try to save her best friend over and over again. We can also see why she didnt call Chloe and its because of how awkward their conversation would be since they didnt see eachother five years, so i dont blame her. She probably wanted to avoid the awkwardness since she is shy.
Through out the game she did care and tried to do everything to save Chloe, and that proves she loves her and Chloe seems to love her too. They live happily ever after, i hope..
chloe gets a pass because she's still got a heart of gold and only has a tough exterior because it's a defense mechanism since she's so insecure and lonely.
rachel was dealing with a broken home too and despite her keeping secrets from chloe, she never left her. so rachel isn't all bad.
max. well fuck max. there's no one i hate in LiS more than max. she's a literal psychopath like jefferson but more dangerous because she's less obvious.
i also finished up LiS1 today with the sacrifice chloe ending but i didn't get a kiss since i decided to play BTS and LiS in a more natural way. felt a lot more real not forcing the romance. first time i played them thirsty af and i was like nah this ain't right.
yes. it is. compare max's photo of her and chloe to the one chloe has of her and max with william that she keeps hanging on the wall right next to her bed and talks to when she gets up in BTS ep1. that should show you who's good and who's pure evil (max.)
she even misses max so much that all her journal entries are unsent letters to her, where she signs them with things like "chloe, the unfriended" or "chloe, the twisted, shattered and ugly" after describing how she thought she screwed things up with rachel with her "awkward attempt" to cheer rachel up in the junkyard, and thinking she'll go back to "having no friends". that is low self-esteem.
those texts were the worst. i swear if i was chloe i'd hitchhike to seattle and as soon as max opened the door i'd be like "bitch your phone better be broke". max wasn't too awkward to return a text. she simply didn't care. she made friends just fine in seattle as evident from the photo and her fond memories of having fun with them when you look at it. chloe knows this too and you can read in her journal it says that she knows max "doesn't care about her" and "probably has all new friends up in fucking seattle". totally true. and sadly chloe says she still misses max and would "take her back in a heartbeat" which is what happened in LiS1 when she should've told max to fuck off and die. but chloe is too much of a sweetheart so people constantly take advantage of her and use her whether it's rachel or eliot or max.
i've heard that argument before and i don't buy it. they wouldn't have gone years without contact if max had taken 2 seconds to respond to a text. chloe was constantly sending max texts and almost never getting replies with the few replies she did send being rushed or late af until max completely shut her out and chloe by her own admission in her BTS journal gave up trying to contact her.
then there's alternate reality max. keep in mind alt max and alt chloe are the same as the regular timeline, only thing that changed are the events within those 5 years since william either lived or died. we can see who they truly were deep down. chloe is still a sweet girl and this time doesn't have the tough exterior masking her kindness while max is a vapid bitch in the vortex club chillin with people like victoria and nathan.
but yes they will probably live happily ever after since the official comic coming out is written by a damn pricefield shipper ??? still i can't forgive max for how much she hurt chloe.
I was about to post another small novel, but I have a feeling we won't ever see eye to eye about Max no matter what. So I'm just gonna stay out of it and let Max' actions be judged by the squirrels.
the squirrel also thinks she's a bit nutty