Doing this in part so Hero1 doesn't have to spoil himself searching up reviews
Better yet, the puzzles in Episode 4 are more challenging. In this latest episode, the developers have struck the perfect balance between difficulty and outrageous logic. You won't be combining old gum and bread crust to make a shrimp canape. Everything follows reasonable logic, but the solutions to puzzles aren't brutally telegraphed as they were in the previous two episodes.
The reviewer means that they thought the puzzles in episode 4 weren't obviously stated from the get-go -- like, when a character says something to set up a puzzle, the reviewer felt that they weren't able to reverse engineer a possible puzzle solution just from the setup.
Funny, that's always the case for me when it comes time for the final puzzle, especially in Episode 1 when you talk to Max and Brady Culture. Looking back on it now, it makes sense what to do, but I didn't have the slightest idea when I first heard the hints.
Right, the final puzzles were like that, but every puzzle leading up to it were fairly blunt and almost condescending.
I really liked how Episode 4 didn't have the "do 3 explicitly stated things" motif that episodes 2 and 3 had.
Yeah, but the 'three tasks' is a classic Adventure Gaming (LucasArts, in particular) setup, from Monkey Island right up through Full Throttle and more. I see it as an affectionate nod to those games.
I especially liked the self referential "To join the mafia you need to do two tasks... make that 3 tasks" line in Meatball. Made me laugh out loud, as I was thinking "Only two tasks, but that goes against all convention"...
I especially liked the self referential "To join the mafia you need to do two tasks... make that 3 tasks" line in Meatball. Made me laugh out loud, as I was thinking "Only two tasks, but that goes against all convention"...
I thought that was a referance to Monty Python's Spanish Inquasition.
The puzzles involved in the game aren’t overly difficult, but nor did I figure all of them out immediately so I felt like it was a good balance. When it’s Sam and Max you’re working with you have to think well out of the box and that’s where your solution will spring from, but there are patterns that can be seen through the games that give guidance as to which side of the box to go to.
The previous three episodes were indeed easy to complete and on the short side time wise. This never really bothered me because the settings were fun, the scripts sharp, and the puzzles weren’t damningly hard. I never expected a long quest or deep gameplay from Sam and Max, just a lighthearted adventure with some humor above the grade-school level of most games. This is what I got, and it was quite good. But as expected, our friends in the community, led by their fearless leader, constantly demanded more bang for their mere ten bucks (may we offer some sound advice for the future?). And so Telltale have created an episode filled with stopgaps and contradictory choices in order give them what they want.
The first three episodes followed a fairly strict pattern; a few opening puzzles, then three major puzzles of a similar theme, culminating in a final boss puzzle. Ep. 4 deviates from the formula - defeating the boss requires solving a multitude of subsequent puzzles that almost total the rest of the game in length. This in and of itself isn’t a problem, since the extra brain teasers aren’t all recycled. What makes it hard to swallow is the excessive amounts of backtracking that it entails. Previous episodes had you go back to your home street twice, maybe thrice on a good play. That number is about doubled in Episode 4, and if you ever get stuck or confused the number gets higher. By the end of the game, you’ll find yourself walking from
the bowel’s of the White House
to your car, then across the street to Bosco’s, then back to the car, and back to
the inside of the White House
. It might add only a few minutes to actual game time, but it adds heaps to my impatience. Of course this wouldn’t have been a problem if critics didn’t also complain about not spending enough time in new locations.
There’s also the simple problem that this is the fourth episode wherein our heroes have to trick Sybil or buy something from Bosco in order to solve a puzzle. I enjoy these characters, but they highlight an interesting problem with episodic design; we should expect the same characters and settings, but we may also have to expect the same gags.
Puzzle difficulty is a tricky subject. They are much harder overall than in the past, but it’s tough for me to say whether they’re challenging in a good way. The essential thing to notice is that this episode is less about finding an item and figuring out where it is used, but instead about knowing what you need and then having to go out and find it. I find the latter approach is more frustrating at this point, because Telltale has recycled so much content that there are certain things in each area I just don’t bother with. This wasn’t a problem in the past (which is why I didn’t slam them for it), but in this episode some of those areas are hiding the things you need. Now I won’t play another episode without checking every nook and cranny in case there’s something I’m missing. I thought that Sam and Max was saving us from such silliness, but that’s no longer the case now that the Consumer Reports gamers have gotten their way.
On the other hand, some of the puzzles that gave me the most trouble weren’t entirely unfair. Like a similar one in Ep. 2, they involved
going to an older area that had a logical purpose for the given situation
. While tricky, they weren’t impossible, though one in particular involved
paying very close attention to what it was showing you, for the solution involved a visual clue that you wouldn’t expect to be of importance
. From the adventure gamer’s standpoint the progression found in Ep. 4 can be nothing but a good thing. Yet I’m afraid of the series delving into Myst levels of trickery. I’m a big fan of logic, but I don’t want puzzles that hang on the importance of clues that are too subtle for their own good. Let’s leave the difficulty range at this level and no harder.
Okay, enough with the complaints about the episodes being too easy, it's time to start complaining about the episodes being too hard! This is the only way to achieve the community hidden purpose: make Dave and Brendan go totally insane.
I found Episode 4 harder but in a good way. Myst levels of trickery? Come on...
Okay, enough with the complaints about the episodes being too easy, it's time to start complaining about the episodes being too hard! This is the only way to achieve the community hidden purpose: make Dave and Brendan go totally insane.
I know, it's kind of funny--damned if you do, damned if you don't.
Episode 4 also improves the basic gameplay elements that had begun to decay in Episode 3. The game is longer, for one thing. That's partly due to some unnecessary shuttling between
the White House and Sam and Max's office near the end of the game
, but mostly it's because the puzzles are better, more challenging and fit more organically into the world. There aren't any massive brain teasers, but compared to the barely-there speed bumps of Episode 3, Abe Lincoln Must Die! offers a solid suite of conundrums.
Seems kinda pointless to complain about "recycled" locations/characters/etc, since after all, you're still playing essentially the same game, just a different piece of it. And one of the major staples of episodic anything is reusing content and restating things to remind your audience what happened previously while advancing the story.
In terms of difficulty I was quite pleased with Ep4, I even got stuck once or twice, so you're probably heading the right way. As for pacing, I must admit that artificially lengthening the episodes by putting in several "drive there, do that one thing, drive back, do that on thing, go back again to do that"-situations is my major point of criticism. This is not what's been meant by "the episodes are too short" at all, and of course you know that.
Yet, it was very pleasing to see some new and more "epic" locations, but still, there wasn't a real "road trip" feeling to it (yeah, I know, this is no "Hit the Road"), and it still felt a little confined (
I mean, c'mon, driving to Washington, just to go back to the office for a single phone call, and going right back to D.C. as if it was just around the corner?
).
But I don't want to sound too critical, since - as I said - you're definitely heading the right way, and the humour is getting even better (and meaner... I like that) with every episode.
The difficulty was fine for me. Took me a litle over 4 hours vs 2-3 as usual since I actually got stuck with signs. Specifically the poster exactly like someone above me said. The other thing was the beacon, I knew it was there but expected to be able to remove the sign to get to it, so I got stuck courtesy of pixel hunting which hasnt had to be done before in the series. GAH!
I just finished the game and is suprised that you guys added more stuff after the focus group. I was quite suprised to see that one sequence after finishing a particular puzzle. Pretty cool and things make a bit more sense in the finish game.
Btw, in the credits, did you guys added the people who played during that focus group?
Better yet, the puzzles in Episode 4 are more challenging. In this latest episode, the developers have struck the perfect balance between difficulty and outrageous logic. You won't be combining old gum and bread crust to make a shrimp canape. Everything follows reasonable logic, but the solutions to puzzles aren't brutally telegraphed as they were in the previous two episodes.
OMG, I've played that game with the gum and the toast. It was quite hideously difficult. You had to come up with things like substituting sludgy water when you were supposed to have coffee, jamming a water fountain to increase the water pressure in an ornamental fountain four screens away to get an item, freezing a worm so you could pick a lock. . . ugh.
Ep 4 had a much better balance of easy and hard stuff. Although I needed some help on the puzzles that involved
using the phone
, because I was used to the fact that the other three games didn't.
And almost everything that had to do with Max in ths game was pure glee.
Is it sinking into a rut? Sure -- but then, it's not a problem when Lost features the same characters week in, week out, is it? It's practically in the nature of episodic content to sink into ruts. This is only a problem when taken to excess, and if Sam and Max was really churning out the same old jokes over and over again, we'd mark it down more harshly.
Ouch, thanks Yahoo! They found the one thing that may kill the concept of Episodic Gaming.
You know that series Cheers! from a few years back? It was OK, but man, every week same old characters, same old bar. Hell, even a variation on the "Nooorm" joke week in / week out.
I'm sure the show would have been way more popular if they'd used a different supporting cast each week, and maybe had less episodes based inside the bar...
Scooby-doo used the exact same jokes every episode, and they only added one or two locations each time, and that show was pretty popular for a while.
So I think we've got nothing to worry about.
But 30 years from now, people will make fun of it
Comments
http://www.frictionlessinsight.com/archives/2007/02/sam_max_episode_8.html
4.5/5
Same deal in Ep. 2 and 3.
I really liked how Episode 4 didn't have the "do 3 explicitly stated things" motif that episodes 2 and 3 had.
I especially liked the self referential "To join the mafia you need to do two tasks... make that 3 tasks" line in Meatball. Made me laugh out loud, as I was thinking "Only two tasks, but that goes against all convention"...
I thought that was a referance to Monty Python's Spanish Inquasition.
http://www.strategyinformer.com/pc/sammaxepisode4abelincolnmustdie/review.html
http://videolamer.com/index.php/1736
I found Episode 4 harder but in a good way. Myst levels of trickery? Come on...
I know, it's kind of funny--damned if you do, damned if you don't.
That's never been the approach in the classic lucasarts titles and certainly isn't from telltale games. More puzzle difficulty hysteria
http://pc.gamespy.com/pc/sam-max-episode-4/768776p2.html
Not to mention too unfunny, too funny, too short, or too long.
editor's choice, eh?.... awsome...
Yet, it was very pleasing to see some new and more "epic" locations, but still, there wasn't a real "road trip" feeling to it (yeah, I know, this is no "Hit the Road"), and it still felt a little confined (
But I don't want to sound too critical, since - as I said - you're definitely heading the right way, and the humour is getting even better (and meaner... I like that) with every episode.
Err, nope.
My only big complaint was
Btw, in the credits, did you guys added the people who played during that focus group?
OMG, I've played that game with the gum and the toast. It was quite hideously difficult. You had to come up with things like substituting sludgy water when you were supposed to have coffee, jamming a water fountain to increase the water pressure in an ornamental fountain four screens away to get an item, freezing a worm so you could pick a lock. . . ugh.
Ep 4 had a much better balance of easy and hard stuff. Although I needed some help on the puzzles that involved
And almost everything that had to do with Max in ths game was pure glee.
Score 8! That's a big improvment from episode 3 (6.6 I think)
http://videogames.yahoo.com/gamereview?cid=1994640782&tab=reviews&page=0&eid=507510
I'm sure the show would have been way more popular if they'd used a different supporting cast each week, and maybe had less episodes based inside the bar...
So I think we've got nothing to worry about.
But 30 years from now, people will make fun of it