Addition to Obidanten: Woody was angry at faith for "not knowing who he was." Think about it... someone pretending to be faith... can't remember someone she never met... hmmm.. His theory has a lot behind it... more then OP thinks.
Okay, SOMEONE just down voted every single post I made in this thread. Including posts I made less then half an hour ago. They also up-voted most of Retneug's posts in this discussion chain. In including his most recent, which was less then half an hour ago. Of course, an account can't upvote his own posts... Then again, this account has only been online for less then a week so it wouldn't be surprising if there was another one that you had.
The timing is extremely suspicious. I would really hope you are not so petty a person as to do something like that, Retneug.
Anyway, while it's true that the mirror breaks the strict letter of the law, it does not break the spirit, and I don't consider your truth to be damaging enough that it smashes the idea that this is a fair play mystery.
I'm done arguing the matter since we have both stated our positions.
If you believe that the Knox rules are broken enough by the Mirror argument, then please feel free to avoid this thread from now on. If you wish to continue though, I would ask you drop the matter. No good can come out of continuing this.
If you like, however, you can try reword Knox's 2nd so that it's not broken by the mirror and I'll consider adding it. Otherwise, I would hope for you to drop this manner and try to enjoy the thread by posing some other theory/argument.
If the mirror's information was used by the detective to rule out Faith's father as a suspect, it is pertinent to the investigation. Period.
… more I'm not concerned with whether Bigby could have acquired that information another way. As I said in my last post:
"The Umineko version of rule #2 explicitly states; "It is forbidden for supernatural agencies to be employed as a detective technique". It doesn't say "It's totally cool as long as the same information could be arrived at through mundane means". Regardless of whether Bigby could gather the information he acquired from the mirror elsewhere, he chooses to rely on the supernatural instead, and it helps with his investigative process."
It's a fact that Bigby relies on the mirror as an investigative technique. It's a fact that ruling out suspects is inexorably tied to pursuing the resolution of the case. Therefore, the detective relies on the supernatural to make progress in his case, which invalidates Knox's 2nd.
I understand your position. To be honest, I actually consider it a strong possibility that Faith isn't really dead, or that the head we found is a fake of some sort. It's just that, if it IS a fake, regardless of whether or not Faith is the culprit, then that means Knox's 10th was broken, because the detective of the story examined it closely and found no clues to indicate that it's a fake. On the other hand, Snow's head, has NOT been examined by Bigby yet. So, I would say that Snow's head could be faked, without it breaking Knox's 10th, but Faith's head cannot.
As for your second theory. We can look at it a bit more.
Theory: The culprit has not been revealed yet. Part two of the game can be also considered the "early" part of the story.
Rebuttal: No laws broken.
Objection: Numerous people have been mentioned that have not had a speaking role, such as Bluebeard. There is no reason to add these suspects in episode one, unless Tell Tale wanted the player to have the complete list of possible culprits in episode 1. Even so, it's still possible. Theory effective
.
If I'm being fair, then I have to concede that it is quite possible for episode 2 to have the culprit and still be following Knox's rules. However, there are so many characters that we have seen, or even just heard being talked about, such as Bluebeard, the redhead, the photos in the bar... I just can't imagine a good reason why the actual culprit wouldn't be among all of this. Which is why I was coming done hard on the suggestion beforehand.
Basically, it's possible but somewhat unfair. If Tell Tale isn't trying to play fast and loose with the rules, then the culprit should be in episode 1. Episode 2 would be the absolute latest though. Anything past that would be absurdly unfair.
I wasn't arguing that Faith was secretely the murderer, but that it perfectly possible for "Faith's head" to be something else through the use… more of glamour.
We know Faith is in some trouble she can't talk about, possibly through the use of magic (her lips are sealed). The mirror's lips are also sealed, but we know the mirror is capable of showing us dead people because it had no problem showing us her father. We had also seen her corpse, so there isn't a particular reason from a storytelling perspective to hide it from us, so I suspect shenanigans
On the crime scene we found Faith's ribbon with her ring tied to it. Considering Faith's ribbon was located roughly at the same point where the killing blow would have landed, it was surprisinlgy bloodless and undamaged. I also don't recall her wearing that ring. Also notable, her purse can be found on a trash bin, though Bigby doesn't comment on it for some reason.
My guess: Faith faked her deat… [view original content]
Not that you'll believe me, but I only downvote posts that are insulting or that threaten physical harm. I've never made an alt account in my life, much less used one to support my statements. I'm conceited enough to think that my arguments don't require external support. As for the newness of my account, I purchased TWAU about a week ago with the money left over from my Black Friday spending spree on XBL. I joined this community as soon as I recognised its excellence, and it's not a decision that I regret because the community is quite friendly and respectful, including yourself.
I acknowledge that I've drawn your ire, and I apologise for that. I was really just playing devil's advocate at first, not really expecting that it would turn into a serious debate... But your suggestion that I abide by your rules, break them, or stop posting rubbed me the wrong way, and I continue to pursue the argument doggedly for that reason. And so, without further ado, I will give my last statements and be entirely out of your hair should you choose not to address them.
Firstly, it's easy for the spirit of a law not to be broken when the "spirit" is nothing more than an interpretation one stubbornly latches on to for personal reasons... Like maintaining the validity of a forum thread in the face of contrary evidence, for example.
Secondly, telling me to "feel free to avoid your thread" is exactly the kind of passive-aggressive jibe that encouraged me to argue so persistently in the first place. That, and the fact that you literally invited me to argue against the validity of Knox's rules, (only to become upset with me when I did just that, I might add).
And finally, I think I'll take a pass on rewording Umineko's rewording of Knox's rules to fit the narrative they're supposed to be abiding by. To my mind, that sort of defeats the point of applying the rules to TWAU in the first place.
I wish you luck in reaching a solid conclusion as to the killer's identity via the theories posed in this thread. Should that become the case and I remember this thread at the time of completing Episode 5, I'll post again in the form of a congratulatory message. Have a good night.
Okay, SOMEONE just down voted every single post I made in this thread. Including posts I made less then half an hour ago. They also up-voted … moremost of Retneug's posts in this discussion chain. In including his most recent, which was less then half an hour ago. Of course, an account can't upvote his own posts... Then again, this account has only been online for less then a week so it wouldn't be surprising if there was another one that you had.
The timing is extremely suspicious. I would really hope you are not so petty a person as to do something like that, Retneug.
Anyway, while it's true that the mirror breaks the strict letter of the law, it does not break the spirit, and I don't consider your truth to be damaging enough that it smashes the idea that this is a fair play mystery.
I'm done arguing the matter since we have both stated our positions.
If you believe that the Knox rules are broken enough by the Mirror argument, then plea… [view original content]
Comments
Addition to Obidanten: Woody was angry at faith for "not knowing who he was." Think about it... someone pretending to be faith... can't remember someone she never met... hmmm.. His theory has a lot behind it... more then OP thinks.
Okay, SOMEONE just down voted every single post I made in this thread. Including posts I made less then half an hour ago. They also up-voted most of Retneug's posts in this discussion chain. In including his most recent, which was less then half an hour ago. Of course, an account can't upvote his own posts... Then again, this account has only been online for less then a week so it wouldn't be surprising if there was another one that you had.
The timing is extremely suspicious. I would really hope you are not so petty a person as to do something like that, Retneug.
Anyway, while it's true that the mirror breaks the strict letter of the law, it does not break the spirit, and I don't consider your truth to be damaging enough that it smashes the idea that this is a fair play mystery.
I'm done arguing the matter since we have both stated our positions.
If you believe that the Knox rules are broken enough by the Mirror argument, then please feel free to avoid this thread from now on. If you wish to continue though, I would ask you drop the matter. No good can come out of continuing this.
If you like, however, you can try reword Knox's 2nd so that it's not broken by the mirror and I'll consider adding it. Otherwise, I would hope for you to drop this manner and try to enjoy the thread by posing some other theory/argument.
Bravo! Brilliant! I completely forgot that there were pictures.
You just destroyed the theory.
I understand your position. To be honest, I actually consider it a strong possibility that Faith isn't really dead, or that the head we found is a fake of some sort. It's just that, if it IS a fake, regardless of whether or not Faith is the culprit, then that means Knox's 10th was broken, because the detective of the story examined it closely and found no clues to indicate that it's a fake. On the other hand, Snow's head, has NOT been examined by Bigby yet. So, I would say that Snow's head could be faked, without it breaking Knox's 10th, but Faith's head cannot.
As for your second theory. We can look at it a bit more.
If I'm being fair, then I have to concede that it is quite possible for episode 2 to have the culprit and still be following Knox's rules. However, there are so many characters that we have seen, or even just heard being talked about, such as Bluebeard, the redhead, the photos in the bar... I just can't imagine a good reason why the actual culprit wouldn't be among all of this. Which is why I was coming done hard on the suggestion beforehand.
Basically, it's possible but somewhat unfair. If Tell Tale isn't trying to play fast and loose with the rules, then the culprit should be in episode 1. Episode 2 would be the absolute latest though. Anything past that would be absurdly unfair.
Not that you'll believe me, but I only downvote posts that are insulting or that threaten physical harm. I've never made an alt account in my life, much less used one to support my statements. I'm conceited enough to think that my arguments don't require external support. As for the newness of my account, I purchased TWAU about a week ago with the money left over from my Black Friday spending spree on XBL. I joined this community as soon as I recognised its excellence, and it's not a decision that I regret because the community is quite friendly and respectful, including yourself.
I acknowledge that I've drawn your ire, and I apologise for that. I was really just playing devil's advocate at first, not really expecting that it would turn into a serious debate... But your suggestion that I abide by your rules, break them, or stop posting rubbed me the wrong way, and I continue to pursue the argument doggedly for that reason. And so, without further ado, I will give my last statements and be entirely out of your hair should you choose not to address them.
Firstly, it's easy for the spirit of a law not to be broken when the "spirit" is nothing more than an interpretation one stubbornly latches on to for personal reasons... Like maintaining the validity of a forum thread in the face of contrary evidence, for example.
Secondly, telling me to "feel free to avoid your thread" is exactly the kind of passive-aggressive jibe that encouraged me to argue so persistently in the first place. That, and the fact that you literally invited me to argue against the validity of Knox's rules, (only to become upset with me when I did just that, I might add).
And finally, I think I'll take a pass on rewording Umineko's rewording of Knox's rules to fit the narrative they're supposed to be abiding by. To my mind, that sort of defeats the point of applying the rules to TWAU in the first place.
I wish you luck in reaching a solid conclusion as to the killer's identity via the theories posed in this thread. Should that become the case and I remember this thread at the time of completing Episode 5, I'll post again in the form of a congratulatory message. Have a good night.