Posting multiple posts stating it is all good and okey, does not change the fact many was disappointed.
It dont help trolling and go at everyone. Many as I was disappointed and it doesnt go any further than that.
The dialog isnt funny that all for Me, when the expected dialog is forced in another direction with a different reaction.
Its not two jokes in one, its a half joke ending with a wtf, that was not what I wanted to say.. In other words an expected conversation which is not happening.
I thought this was due to Wiiware limitations, so that they'd be able to cut a few lines which would save a bit of space. Unfortunately it will probably be like that the rest of the season but it's not THAT bad. The only time it's blatantly obvious is when you first meet the journalist, from there on it's a lot more balanced.
I am aware this issue is only really obvious and irritating with the Nipperkin conversation, but it is right for people to complain about it, because it does happen too frequently in that one conversation and make any choice merely a facade of interactivity. If people don't speak up about it, there's a chance it might happen again and do we really want that?
Beyond that one conversation though I didn't notice it at all. If Telltale take note of this issue then the end result might be that future episodes will have no conversations like the Nipperkin one. I can't imagine anyone being upset by that idea. Perhaps those that are reacting with such a strong defence of the game are just worried that by criticizing it, the whole thing will crumble to dust, but it won't. The deal is done as it were.
I do not however agree with those that feel this brought the whole game down or that a majority of the dialogue was treated in this fashion.
Episode 1 is a bloody good start and frankly I reckon it will only get better going on!
And also, it's a shame that it is happening for the first conversation after things kick off in earnest, as it sets the tone for the rest of the game.
I was thinking about giving him this as a gift for his birthday, as he was a die-hard Money Island I and II fan, but he was really disappointed with 3 (just because it wasn't the old low-res style) and has never really touched a computer game since.
It will be a bit more difficult to tell him "This is actually really good!" if something like that happens right at the beginning.
It's not a major disaster, but it's a bit of a shame, for various reasons.
must agree with most people. I like the way it is now. Its fast and easy to get an overview of your answers, and then the voice actor makes it funny, by saying the same thing you chose in a different funny way.
It really appears to me that none of the people complaining have actually played through the game. These kind of dialog trees happen pretty much only in the intro of the game. It's been said over and over, but you guys seem to simply ignore it just for the sake of whining more.
Saddest part is that these crazy and irrelevant dialog choices (what the hell would you be able to answer to "I need to go, I need to get back to my monkeys!" for instance?) were probably meant as a joke... Well, at least I know I laughed.
As for these complaints being actually useful, I really don't agree. They just might mislead people who are still undecided into believing this game is terrible, which it isn't by far. It's as good as any other quality Telltale point & click game with an added monkey twist. Seriously, play it first. Then complain.
I certainly liked the original MI dialog style better. In the original games, there were a couple of occasions where Guybrush said something other than what you'd expected, and that added comic effect.
When you do it in EVERY DIALOG, the comic effect is lost.
+1 ...such a thing is really hilarious if you get the choice of saying something that in the real world would own you a set of blue eyes and a broken nose, then the cowardly guybrush would say something else to protect his hide. It gets old soon when repeated over and over.
It really appears to me that none of the people complaining have actually played through the game. These kind of dialog trees happen pretty much only in the intro of the game.
are you reffering to the demo that I am told is the selling piont?
*you have completely ruined the MI style of dialogue that is so central to the game.
*in Tales of Monkey Island, it is a joke.
*this is ridiculous.
*really disappointing!
*this takes away so much of the joy for me.
*I'm really almost heartbrokenhere...
*a cosmetic gimmick that serves no purpose.
*I just hope the other stuff weigh up to this catastrophy.
And to think I believed my kids whined a lot, even if they were younger than 6 years old.
I hope your kids are less hostile and unfriendly than you are. this is a thread of two sides arguing why they feel the way they feel. attacks like these have no place here. what a disgusting post.
Hey guys thanks for giving us your opinion on this stuff. Can I say "we hear you, we get it!" and end this thread for now?
does this mean that you actually understand where I'm coming from, or that you don't care? that post seemed really rude... but I'm hoping I've just misinterpreted it.
does this mean that you actually understand where I'm coming from, or that you don't care? that post seemed really rude... but I'm hoping I've just misinterpreted it.
FWIW, I didn't interpret Jake's comment as rude. I think he's saying they get it, and there's no point in discussing it further. I agree, seeing as how this seems to be getting people's dander up, well after the point has been made loud and clear.
I hope your kids are less hostile and unfriendly than you are. this is a thread of two sides arguing why they feel the way they feel. attacks like these have no place here. what a disgusting post.
does this mean that you actually understand where I'm coming from, or that you don't care? that post seemed really rude... but I'm hoping I've just misinterpreted it.
If it makes anyone feel any better, the jungle maze is unique to Flotsam island, and its looking like the amount of dialog text/voice matching and superfluous choices is going to be reduced noticeably from here on out. I don't think it was ever intended to be as extreme as it feels, especially in the first 30-40 minutes of the game, but people are being more conscious of it here on out. I'm sure we'll also tweak the controls a bit in future episodes, but it won't be point and click.
Back to the original discussion for a bit, there was another same choice dialog tree that bothered me, although it was for different reasons than the reporter one.
When you give Winslow a reason as to why you're hesitant to let him be aboard your ship, he'll interrupt you and act like you just gave a approval. Now, this is a tried-and-true gag, but I wonder if they would've been better off having different responses here. The reason being, by seeing how he'll react to your objections, it would've allowed us to get to know his character better and emphasize with him more. Anyone else feel this way, or is it just me?
before this thread grinds to halt from bickering, I want to say I think it's an important issue.
As a 30 something hard core adventure gamer that mostly lurks, and represent, I think, a large market group - geeky-gamer with some cash to spend.
The dialogue was the big miss, (runner up is -- way too short, for an epic series)..
But yeah, the dialogue system is broken, I can't understand how anyone can argue against it. This seems to be the result of some internal brain storm that somebody (who isn't a hard core MI enthusiast), with the unreasonable argument that is repetitive....
that somehow by reading and then hearing it is redundant, because I know what to expect.
by that argument, you could say "I clicked the mouse on an item, I know where he's going to go, so why not just teleport him there? why walk him over?
the reason is I want to see the story played out (completely acted out) from my input, I want to direct the conversations.
But the real reason seems to be cash and time, It would take _a lot_ more development effort to code up responses and dialogue for every possible choice.
But Monkey Island should have been, or should be worth it, the sales will come, if the game is right...
I write because I'm a little sad, so close to being a solid, immersive MI experience (maybe a little more subtle (or non-obvious) puzzle trees and
longer run time...
but the dialogue system, in my opinion, was a critical component, that shouldn't have been 'tweaked' for cash or someones 'great idea'...
So, nice work, there are a few things that can make it almost perfect, and one of the advantages of the episodic delivery is you can make those fixes, if you (telltale/lucas) have the will to...
On the flip side of this argument, nobody complains when a player tries to use two incompatible items, like a u-tube and treasure map, even though they 'commanded' Guybrush to.
The reason for this is because in this (and pretty much every adventure game), the player doesn't actually control the star-character. Instead, they pretty much take on the role of that character's id, giving it basic impulses and ideas that are generally followed, but sometimes the character's higher order thinking wins out.
Such is the case with some of the more outlandish dialog trees, which isn't anything new the MI series.
by that argument, you could say "I clicked the mouse on an item, I know where he's going to go, so why not just teleport him there? why walk him over?
Well Sierra games DID have an option to make characters walk at light speed, and it's one I always used, because I'm not much interested in watching him walk around slowly (CoMI needed this badly. ToMI is fine because you can run).
the reason is I want to see the story played out (completely acted out) from my input, I want to direct the conversations.
But the real reason seems to be cash and time, It would take _a lot_ more development effort to code up responses and dialogue for every possible choice.
See, this is where you keep losing me. There are responses for every line. The lines are just reworded in spoken form, but he's still expressing what you chose, and the characters are still responding to it. Opinions about how you like the system aside, you're just factually wrong on this one. The system requires more effort to do this way, not less.
I'm really perplexed as to how anyone could not realize that the lines being said DO in fact correlate completely to what was chosen and that they are all unique responses except for the aforementioned first conversation with Nipperkin.
by that argument, you could say "I clicked the mouse on an item, I know where he's going to go, so why not just teleport him there? why walk him over?
God you people come up with some absolutely horribly illogical arguments. How you can possibly think those are even remotely comparable situations is beyond me.
Just like to make more voice heard as a fan who doesn't want more dialog. This episode had enough dialog as is. Clicking for hours through dialog trees is not what I equal to fun.
Appreciated the funny options and also the effort to keep dialogs short - even if there was a mismatch.
the multiple dialogue choices are usually really funny... too bad it has NO relevance what you choose, because Guybrush will always say something else!
I didn't get the point, I would click on A in the dialog window and Scriptwood would say Z instead
If he is only going to say Z why do I have options A thru D? (complaint)
I'm fine with Guybrush wording my dialouge options differently from the text, as long as what he says mirrors the option I chose. What I do have a problem with is when you are given dialouge options, but Guybrush disregards them in favour of some generic response, like when you first talk to Nipperkin.
I like the new dialogue style mostly, but it'd be even cooler if the options were quite vague like 'what can you tell me about the winds?' and Guybrush had 3 or 4 different ways of phrasing it rather than him still saying the same thing each time.
In general though, well done, I think this is an improvement to the series... it's nice to laugh once the dialogue is delivered rather than before you've even clicked on anything
I'm fine with Guybrush wording my dialouge options differently from the text, as long as what he says mirrors the option I chose. What I do have a problem with is when you are given dialouge options, but Guybrush disregards them in favour of some generic response, like when you first talk to Nipperkin.
Yeah, that was one part of it I didn't like but still, it's only a small factor of a much bigger game
EDIT: didn't notice the post above, so sorry for this.
The way the conversations are handled in this game is at least a bit confusing if not even annoying.
I'm okay with the idea of just controlling the characters thoughts rather than words or that the conversation can be steered to other directions (mostly for comedic effect), but the way it's done in Tales of Monkey Island just removes all meaning from the dialog options.
In other games where you "control thoughts" the character generally starts by saying something along the lines of the option you just chose but then the conversation can head to another direction. (ie. return to the actual dialog tree) This achieves two things: a) feedback for the selection (it's a user interface thing) b) Making the player feel like he can actually do something besides just watch by as these characters blab about. I for one started to question whether I made a booboo in my dialog choices when none of them seemed to be anywhere close of what the character was saying.
I know that for many this might not be a problem, but I personally find it annoying enough for me to question whether this is worth the season pass. If telltale games are really getting, then that's good new for me.
For those of you who may be new to Telltale, you should know that they have a great record of listening to and acting on fan input and criticism. When the first couple of episodes of Sam and Max: Season 1 were released, many fans complained about how Sam would say the same thing when you clicked on a certain object in every episode, and so in the following episodes they made sure you got a different, unique, and hilarious response in each episode. People also complained about the tediousness of walking from one end of Sam and Max's block to the other over and over, so at the beginning of Season 2, they came up with an awesome plot device to shorten the block and also gave Sam the ability to run. They do listen to us, and if anything seems to be a big enough issue, they'll find some way of addressing it. This sort of communication and feedback between the developers and the fans is the real benefit of episodic gaming.
Now, that's not to say they'll definitely incorporate our every crazy whim, but it's safe to assume that we're being heard.
. I would go as far as calling it one of the most important things with the whole series.
You're... you're kidding, right? The most important thing in the series was not the in-jokes, parodies, hilarious cutscenes, wacky story or loveable character, but that when you clicked something, the character would repeat it. That the jokes were essentially given to you twice. Wow. I haven't played it (yet) but I'm pretty sure that it's an interesting idea. It just means you get two jokes for the dialogue lines.
People saying you have read it you don't want to hear it:
I'm pretty sure 99% of us have found the narrator feature on our computers and typed in rude, funny, strange phrases. Why? Because what we typed is funny and we want to here how the computer says it. The same applies to monkey island, I want Guybrish to say this because it is... but I want to know how he says it and how it develops.
Hey guys thanks for giving us your opinion on this stuff. Can I say "we hear you, we get it!" and end this thread for now?
Hey Jake. I think there are two distinct issues here.
1 issue is the slightly-different-line system which TTG has been using since Sam & Max. I think it's a good system, and there are lots of fun jokes made with it.
The second issue is where Guybrush occasionally completely ignores which selection the player makes. In the first conversation with Nipperkin, it feels like you guys recorded the whole conversation as a cutscene, then broke it up with some choose-an-answer bits despite having only one answer recorded for each question. It's mostly an oddity, but it'd be nice to hear someone from Telltale say "that was a fluke" so the community doesn't think it's part of your core design. I don't think it's that big a deal since it only happens a couple of times, but the times when it happens, it is very obvious.
I think people are blurring the two distinct issues into one issue, which is making this argument go really out of hand. Some in this thread have blown issue 2 out of proportion, and some have overlooked it and focused on Issue 1 entirely, but many seem to be lumping them as if they go hand-in-hand, while they really don't.
before this thread grinds to halt from bickering, I want to say I think it's an important issue.
As a 30 something hard core adventure gamer that mostly lurks, and represent, I think, a large market group - geeky-gamer with some cash to spend.
The dialogue was the big miss, (runner up is -- way too short, for an epic series)..
But yeah, the dialogue system is broken, I can't understand how anyone can argue against it. This seems to be the result of some internal brain storm that somebody (who isn't a hard core MI enthusiast), with the unreasonable argument that is repetitive....
that somehow by reading and then hearing it is redundant, because I know what to expect.
by that argument, you could say "I clicked the mouse on an item, I know where he's going to go, so why not just teleport him there? why walk him over?
the reason is I want to see the story played out (completely acted out) from my input, I want to direct the conversations.
But the real reason seems to be cash and time, It would take _a lot_ more development effort to code up responses and dialogue for every possible choice.
But Monkey Island should have been, or should be worth it, the sales will come, if the game is right...
I write because I'm a little sad, so close to being a solid, immersive MI experience (maybe a little more subtle (or non-obvious) puzzle trees and
longer run time...
but the dialogue system, in my opinion, was a critical component, that shouldn't have been 'tweaked' for cash or someones 'great idea'...
So, nice work, there are a few things that can make it almost perfect, and one of the advantages of the episodic delivery is you can make those fixes, if you (telltale/lucas) have the will to...
sorry for the rambleing....
--treebark
I agree completely, and I feel like from reading these threads people are scared to say there are any problems with this game, but like you say its only the first part and if we all let telltale know whats wrong with this first part they can fix it. If we go on like its perfect they wont change a thing. Dont get me wrong I will pay any monkey Island game and enjoy playing it, but still they can sort these problesm out im sure.
I think there is a point where it becomes near-impossible to aspire towards the original 2 games style of dialogue trees (and comedic effect therein), and I personally feel that it happened as soon as speech was introduced. Nothing at all against Dom's reading (or anyone else's for that matter) - I think it's brilliant and he truly inhabits his version of Guybrush well - but as soon as we begin to hear lines being read out aloud after seeing them in plain text in the dialogue tree, the comedic delivery changes structure. Perhaps this is why it was thought that additional stuff should be inserted whereas in the original 2 games, the joke was delivered as you read it in the dialogue tree - and any further comedy would come from responses and then additional dialogue options.
A favourite example of mine, which incidentally is one of the earliest dialogue options in the whole MI saga:
Upon encountering the pirate leaders in the SCUMM bar, you are about to state your business. You are presented with the following options:
- I mean to kill you all!
- I want to be a pirate.
- I want to be a fireman.
It's when I saw that 3rd option that I realised that this was a very special game, with writing that had an absurdist edge that made you want to see what else they had come up with. I still think it's one of the funniest moments of all in the series because it foreshadows so well the style that was to come.
Of course, without super-flashy graphics and voice acting, the comedy became concentrated and focused on the writing to a much larger extent. Now, in "modern days", we get (though beautifully executed) slapstick moments with Guybrush flailing about, dancing, falling and doing silly stuff - but back then, reading the dialogue trees was where very much of the comedy was centered.
I fear that the depth and complexity of the current dialogue trees have been greatly reduced, and I'm not sure that it is a completely necessary design choice.
Am I the only one that remembers the dialog options in the previous games where you'd have a bunch of choices, but they wouldn't change how the other person responded? Sure, you'd pick out which of the four options you thought was funniest, and Guybrush would say exactly what you chose, but it wouldn't make a difference in their response.
This is exactly like that. You read the responses, see that they're clever and witty, chuckle to yourself, then the conversation proceeds regardless of the meaningless choice you made. Remember, in the other games, when you made a choice like this, one of a three things happened:
-Rarely, they dismiss you (rarely in a funny or unique way) and you have to start the conversation or just that dialog choice over.
-Rarely, they had an extra responding line before going on to the normal dialog.
-Usually, they responded the same normal way no matter what.
I'm willing to say that they overdid it a little in TMI, (what with the changing lines when it wasn't necessary, like "Prepare to be boarded"), I did notice it, but honestly, very little was lost by this type of thing. In the old games, 90% of the time, the only real value in seeing a dialog option was in seeing it there and finding it funny.
And this:
I would go as far as calling it one of the most important things with the whole series.
is one of the stupidest things I've heard all day.
I cannot believe that there are people who actually feel this is an issue, of any magnitude at all, and will raise criticism over it. Of all the trivialities in this world, this has to be on a few hundred top ten nonsense gripes of all time lists.
With reactions like this from people, is anyone surprised that LucasArts cut a deal with Telltale to take on the risk going of into new ground, while they're just rehashed the original game?
What does it tell you that haters have become SUCH irritants to the field that companies can't justify making new great games and must instead outsource innovation to smaller outfits with less to lose?
Comments
As an experiment, could we have your kids weigh in on this issue?
Posting multiple posts stating it is all good and okey, does not change the fact many was disappointed.
It dont help trolling and go at everyone. Many as I was disappointed and it doesnt go any further than that.
The dialog isnt funny that all for Me, when the expected dialog is forced in another direction with a different reaction.
Its not two jokes in one, its a half joke ending with a wtf, that was not what I wanted to say.. In other words an expected conversation which is not happening.
I am aware this issue is only really obvious and irritating with the Nipperkin conversation, but it is right for people to complain about it, because it does happen too frequently in that one conversation and make any choice merely a facade of interactivity. If people don't speak up about it, there's a chance it might happen again and do we really want that?
Beyond that one conversation though I didn't notice it at all. If Telltale take note of this issue then the end result might be that future episodes will have no conversations like the Nipperkin one. I can't imagine anyone being upset by that idea. Perhaps those that are reacting with such a strong defence of the game are just worried that by criticizing it, the whole thing will crumble to dust, but it won't. The deal is done as it were.
I do not however agree with those that feel this brought the whole game down or that a majority of the dialogue was treated in this fashion.
Episode 1 is a bloody good start and frankly I reckon it will only get better going on!
And also, it's a shame that it is happening for the first conversation after things kick off in earnest, as it sets the tone for the rest of the game.
I was thinking about giving him this as a gift for his birthday, as he was a die-hard Money Island I and II fan, but he was really disappointed with 3 (just because it wasn't the old low-res style) and has never really touched a computer game since.
It will be a bit more difficult to tell him "This is actually really good!" if something like that happens right at the beginning.
It's not a major disaster, but it's a bit of a shame, for various reasons.
Saddest part is that these crazy and irrelevant dialog choices (what the hell would you be able to answer to "I need to go, I need to get back to my monkeys!" for instance?) were probably meant as a joke... Well, at least I know I laughed.
As for these complaints being actually useful, I really don't agree. They just might mislead people who are still undecided into believing this game is terrible, which it isn't by far. It's as good as any other quality Telltale point & click game with an added monkey twist. Seriously, play it first. Then complain.
+1 ...such a thing is really hilarious if you get the choice of saying something that in the real world would own you a set of blue eyes and a broken nose, then the cowardly guybrush would say something else to protect his hide. It gets old soon when repeated over and over.
are you reffering to the demo that I am told is the selling piont?
Jake's trimming the forum fat. Do it, Jake. Save us from ourselves!
I hope your kids are less hostile and unfriendly than you are. this is a thread of two sides arguing why they feel the way they feel. attacks like these have no place here. what a disgusting post.
does this mean that you actually understand where I'm coming from, or that you don't care? that post seemed really rude... but I'm hoping I've just misinterpreted it.
FWIW, I didn't interpret Jake's comment as rude. I think he's saying they get it, and there's no point in discussing it further. I agree, seeing as how this seems to be getting people's dander up, well after the point has been made loud and clear.
Threepcross, you remind me of Pat. Maybe try smoking more pot.
http://journeyintoreason.blogspot.com/2008/04/how-absolutely-insensitive.html
http://m.assetbar.com/achewood/uua336Zxz
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=16589898&postcount=534
When you give Winslow a reason as to why you're hesitant to let him be aboard your ship, he'll interrupt you and act like you just gave a approval. Now, this is a tried-and-true gag, but I wonder if they would've been better off having different responses here. The reason being, by seeing how he'll react to your objections, it would've allowed us to get to know his character better and emphasize with him more. Anyone else feel this way, or is it just me?
As a 30 something hard core adventure gamer that mostly lurks, and represent, I think, a large market group - geeky-gamer with some cash to spend.
The dialogue was the big miss, (runner up is -- way too short, for an epic series)..
But yeah, the dialogue system is broken, I can't understand how anyone can argue against it. This seems to be the result of some internal brain storm that somebody (who isn't a hard core MI enthusiast), with the unreasonable argument that is repetitive....
that somehow by reading and then hearing it is redundant, because I know what to expect.
by that argument, you could say "I clicked the mouse on an item, I know where he's going to go, so why not just teleport him there? why walk him over?
the reason is I want to see the story played out (completely acted out) from my input, I want to direct the conversations.
But the real reason seems to be cash and time, It would take _a lot_ more development effort to code up responses and dialogue for every possible choice.
But Monkey Island should have been, or should be worth it, the sales will come, if the game is right...
I write because I'm a little sad, so close to being a solid, immersive MI experience (maybe a little more subtle (or non-obvious) puzzle trees and
longer run time...
but the dialogue system, in my opinion, was a critical component, that shouldn't have been 'tweaked' for cash or someones 'great idea'...
So, nice work, there are a few things that can make it almost perfect, and one of the advantages of the episodic delivery is you can make those fixes, if you (telltale/lucas) have the will to...
sorry for the rambleing....
--treebark
The reason for this is because in this (and pretty much every adventure game), the player doesn't actually control the star-character. Instead, they pretty much take on the role of that character's id, giving it basic impulses and ideas that are generally followed, but sometimes the character's higher order thinking wins out.
Such is the case with some of the more outlandish dialog trees, which isn't anything new the MI series.
See, this is where you keep losing me. There are responses for every line. The lines are just reworded in spoken form, but he's still expressing what you chose, and the characters are still responding to it. Opinions about how you like the system aside, you're just factually wrong on this one. The system requires more effort to do this way, not less.
I'm really perplexed as to how anyone could not realize that the lines being said DO in fact correlate completely to what was chosen and that they are all unique responses except for the aforementioned first conversation with Nipperkin.
God you people come up with some absolutely horribly illogical arguments. How you can possibly think those are even remotely comparable situations is beyond me.
Appreciated the funny options and also the effort to keep dialogs short - even if there was a mismatch.
If he is only going to say Z why do I have options A thru D? (complaint)
Yeah, having played it now, I agree. It was a little excessive, but I got used to it eventually.
In general though, well done, I think this is an improvement to the series... it's nice to laugh once the dialogue is delivered rather than before you've even clicked on anything
Yeah, that was one part of it I didn't like but still, it's only a small factor of a much bigger game
Just quoting this to get it repeated...
The way the conversations are handled in this game is at least a bit confusing if not even annoying.
I'm okay with the idea of just controlling the characters thoughts rather than words or that the conversation can be steered to other directions (mostly for comedic effect), but the way it's done in Tales of Monkey Island just removes all meaning from the dialog options.
In other games where you "control thoughts" the character generally starts by saying something along the lines of the option you just chose but then the conversation can head to another direction. (ie. return to the actual dialog tree) This achieves two things: a) feedback for the selection (it's a user interface thing) b) Making the player feel like he can actually do something besides just watch by as these characters blab about. I for one started to question whether I made a booboo in my dialog choices when none of them seemed to be anywhere close of what the character was saying.
I know that for many this might not be a problem, but I personally find it annoying enough for me to question whether this is worth the season pass. If telltale games are really getting, then that's good new for me.
Now, that's not to say they'll definitely incorporate our every crazy whim, but it's safe to assume that we're being heard.
You're... you're kidding, right? The most important thing in the series was not the in-jokes, parodies, hilarious cutscenes, wacky story or loveable character, but that when you clicked something, the character would repeat it. That the jokes were essentially given to you twice. Wow. I haven't played it (yet) but I'm pretty sure that it's an interesting idea. It just means you get two jokes for the dialogue lines.
I'm pretty sure 99% of us have found the narrator feature on our computers and typed in rude, funny, strange phrases. Why? Because what we typed is funny and we want to here how the computer says it. The same applies to monkey island, I want Guybrish to say this because it is... but I want to know how he says it and how it develops.
Hey Jake. I think there are two distinct issues here.
1 issue is the slightly-different-line system which TTG has been using since Sam & Max. I think it's a good system, and there are lots of fun jokes made with it.
The second issue is where Guybrush occasionally completely ignores which selection the player makes. In the first conversation with Nipperkin, it feels like you guys recorded the whole conversation as a cutscene, then broke it up with some choose-an-answer bits despite having only one answer recorded for each question. It's mostly an oddity, but it'd be nice to hear someone from Telltale say "that was a fluke" so the community doesn't think it's part of your core design. I don't think it's that big a deal since it only happens a couple of times, but the times when it happens, it is very obvious.
I think people are blurring the two distinct issues into one issue, which is making this argument go really out of hand. Some in this thread have blown issue 2 out of proportion, and some have overlooked it and focused on Issue 1 entirely, but many seem to be lumping them as if they go hand-in-hand, while they really don't.
I agree completely, and I feel like from reading these threads people are scared to say there are any problems with this game, but like you say its only the first part and if we all let telltale know whats wrong with this first part they can fix it. If we go on like its perfect they wont change a thing. Dont get me wrong I will pay any monkey Island game and enjoy playing it, but still they can sort these problesm out im sure.
A favourite example of mine, which incidentally is one of the earliest dialogue options in the whole MI saga:
Upon encountering the pirate leaders in the SCUMM bar, you are about to state your business. You are presented with the following options:
- I mean to kill you all!
- I want to be a pirate.
- I want to be a fireman.
It's when I saw that 3rd option that I realised that this was a very special game, with writing that had an absurdist edge that made you want to see what else they had come up with. I still think it's one of the funniest moments of all in the series because it foreshadows so well the style that was to come.
Of course, without super-flashy graphics and voice acting, the comedy became concentrated and focused on the writing to a much larger extent. Now, in "modern days", we get (though beautifully executed) slapstick moments with Guybrush flailing about, dancing, falling and doing silly stuff - but back then, reading the dialogue trees was where very much of the comedy was centered.
I fear that the depth and complexity of the current dialogue trees have been greatly reduced, and I'm not sure that it is a completely necessary design choice.
This is exactly like that. You read the responses, see that they're clever and witty, chuckle to yourself, then the conversation proceeds regardless of the meaningless choice you made. Remember, in the other games, when you made a choice like this, one of a three things happened:
-Rarely, they dismiss you (rarely in a funny or unique way) and you have to start the conversation or just that dialog choice over.
-Rarely, they had an extra responding line before going on to the normal dialog.
-Usually, they responded the same normal way no matter what.
I'm willing to say that they overdid it a little in TMI, (what with the changing lines when it wasn't necessary, like "Prepare to be boarded"), I did notice it, but honestly, very little was lost by this type of thing. In the old games, 90% of the time, the only real value in seeing a dialog option was in seeing it there and finding it funny.
And this: is one of the stupidest things I've heard all day.
With reactions like this from people, is anyone surprised that LucasArts cut a deal with Telltale to take on the risk going of into new ground, while they're just rehashed the original game?
What does it tell you that haters have become SUCH irritants to the field that companies can't justify making new great games and must instead outsource innovation to smaller outfits with less to lose?