Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think anyone from the cabin group is there when you meet Bonnie--it's just Clem, Walter, and I don't remember if it's Sarita or Kenny but pretty sure they were from the lodge group.
So what you're saying is that Tavias group is Carvers group? A group that recruits people is also the group yhat attacks people? And that no… more one recognised Bonnie despite being from the se groip?
Do you have any semblence of common sense?
The more likely theoy is that Bonnie is playing scout like Tavia
You have made some excellent points, and like what I have stated in an above comment, a lot of time has passed since the end of 400 Days. Therefore, it is unfair to condemn Bonnie until we hear what her story is and what happened to her to make her follow a man like Carver.
As for Carver himself, I think what TT is trying to do is something similar to what they did with The Stranger - at first make him out to be this mysterious and dangerous Other, then move to some sympathy for him by suggesting the people Clem are with are the real "bad guys", then finally have Carver show his true colors as an dangerous (if not down-right evil) bastard the needs to be stopped at all costs.. My personal feelings on Carver at this time are as follows - Carver is the kind of man that suffers from the delusion that he is a wise, kind, and compassionate leader that is forced by others to do terrible things. The truth however is that he is a bully that uses intimidation and fear to force his will and "love" on others, and, if they refuse, there is hell to pay. The only reason he gets away with what he does is that his is charismatic enough to get the weak-willed, scared, and desperate to follow him and carry out his will. History is filled with monsters like him.
Sadly, Bonnie always struck me as someone weak-minded and passive. Just the kind of person that is easy to manipulate. I'm sure Carver has her loyalty... for now. Perhaps a part of episode 3 will be centered on trying to get her on Clem's side.
Picture Bonnie as Lilly's sister from the TV show. Misled by a charismatic leader she goes to spy. "Go unarmed we don't want to provoke a fi… moreght." He tells her. "Wow this man really wants peace." She thinks so she volunteers for this potential suicide mission partly out of guilt for murdering Dee and her former junkie lifestyle. But what does she find when she gets there? Cautious people but generous as well willing to give her food. Suddenly her brain is screaming "Abort abort!" she stammers about not wanting to take too much. Feeling guilty about taking anything from good people when she knows her own community doesnt need it. But she can't just yell "I'm a spy i'm sorry!" or drop the food so she takes it back. She gets back and she tells Carver about who she saw. Nobody meets Carver's description until she describes Clementine. Carver tells her that they need to go and bring back their people. Bring back his child. It's not safe out there.… [view original content]
Can you imagine if Episode 4 or 5 forced Clem into Carver's recently Vacated shoes? four pieces of food for nine people was a challenge. Imagine if you had to make decisions for dozens of people.
You have made some excellent points, and like what I have stated in an above comment, a lot of time has passed since the end of 400 Days. T… moreherefore, it is unfair to condemn Bonnie until we hear what her story is and what happened to her to make her follow a man like Carver.
As for Carver himself, I think what TT is trying to do is something similar to what they did with The Stranger - at first make him out to be this mysterious and dangerous Other, then move to some sympathy for him by suggesting the people Clem are with are the real "bad guys", then finally have Carver show his true colors as an dangerous (if not down-right evil) bastard the needs to be stopped at all costs.. My personal feelings on Carver at this time are as follows - Carver is the kind of man that suffers from the delusion that he is a wise, kind, and compassionate leader that is forced by others to do terrible things. The truth however is that he is a bully that use… [view original content]
In my play through. Only Wyatt and Bonnie went. I love Vince, Shel, Becca and Russel. I hope we get to see them next episode... We will definitely see them Episode 4.
I think it's just a problem of being a part of that scenario. Bonnie never struck me as a bad person and since we could control her in 400 Days, maybe how we affected those characters will make a difference to how we interact with them in Episode 3 and beyond. We could possibly sway Bonnie or maybe she has an attack of conscience after the events of Episode 2. I don't hate her just because she is involved with Carver. For all we know, she's a victim.
I actually thought that Carlos was a kind of evil guy too but in this episode (if you don't turn yourself in) you can see that he's just worried about protecting people, I mean he is all "Sarah don't look" when Carver is about to kill him, and when Carver kills Alvin he's all "Rebecca DON'T LOOK!!"
So I'm guessing he can do bad stuff ti protect people but will nto turn out evil.
About Luke in episode 1 I thought that too, but I think that Luke just hide because kenny and him weere allways disagreeing and he hide so he could save the people later (I mean he knows Carver better then Kenny, I'm sure Luke knew how Carver would work..."
Kenny is the one I'm worried about, I'm not saying he's going to be evil or dark, but somehting was off about him, some off his reactions putt me defensive towards him...
Let's not worry about Carver, he is just like the governor:
A mad control-freak whose ruthless behaviour keeps his community safe.
I'm m… moreore worried about Luke.
I don't like him always disappearing when someone needs help and I sure don't
like that bonding with him which TTG seems to do with us.
I have a feeling he (and maybe Carlos too) will turn out to be a bad guy.
Like Carver said: "don't you know who you are staying with ?"
why wouldn't they recruit people? More people would make him stronger. It's possible they get people with promises and stuff - more flies with honey, and all that - Then once they're there, they realise they're not allowed to leave etc.
So what you're saying is that Tavias group is Carvers group? A group that recruits people is also the group yhat attacks people? And that no… more one recognised Bonnie despite being from the se groip?
Do you have any semblence of common sense?
The more likely theoy is that Bonnie is playing scout like Tavia
But what if people come here, thinking it's regarding 400 days? They'll get more of a spoiler than just knowing she appears, by seeing what is written in the thread?
Changed your title to avoid specifically mentioning Bonnie's appearance in Episode 202.
Your title was fine else wise, but most people will likely consider Bonnie's appearance in Episode 202 to be a spoiler itself.
But what if people come here, thinking it's regarding 400 days? They'll get more of a spoiler than just knowing she appears, by seeing what is written in the thread?
Are you saying a jaded vince, a russell and Wyatt looking for people, A Shel and Becca afraid of Roman wouldn't jump at the oppertunity for safety and protection with a charismatic leader who Tavia could have already bought into? See K0t0 before you rule it out completely remember
Carver can politely come in and talk to Clem. If Clem never becomes too aggressive he's never threatening. Even putting the knife thats laying out in the drawer. He's looking for his people.
He is convinced Rebecca is pregnant with his child Carlos spat in his face and refused to tell where she was but his only other options were torture the people he didn't know who might not know where rebecca was, torture Sarah which his men might turn on him for, torture Al... wait he was hiding with Rebecca. Torture lu....wait he's MIA, Torture Nick? Like that would produce any useful information.
When Alvin is being Dragged to the window if you're inside you get a cutscene of Carver reminding Alvin about some guy named George who Alving killed. And although perspective is a pain I think he was doing it quiet enough {for michael madsens voice} to basically be between them.
Luke's conversation with Clementine "What is everyone looking for?" the answer he wants is "Family" So it's not inconcievable for Tavia to be part of Carver's group and at first Carver's group rescues the Ski Resort. But when Carlos gets uppity and Kenny starts shooting things go downhill.
From the brief bit you know about Tavia and from what you saw in the episode 3 trailer about love and welcoming back the family tell me theres no way Tavia took the group back home to Carver's group or that he was the guy on the radio tavia talked to who just happened to be Voice Acted by an actor who wasn't michael madsen just like walkie talkie stranger with clem wasnt hotel room strangers voice.
So what you're saying is that Tavias group is Carvers group? A group that recruits people is also the group yhat attacks people? And that no… more one recognised Bonnie despite being from the se groip?
Do you have any semblence of common sense?
The more likely theoy is that Bonnie is playing scout like Tavia
I'm kind of hoping that due to just Bonnie appearing that it is determinant who else is at the camp from 400 days. However that said that would mean Nick,Alvin,Vince,Wyatt,Shel/Becca and russel would all have determinant appearances that would be quite hard to pull off.
I didn't read through all the stuff you guys wrote there, but did anyone notice, that it was not so super-important to play 400 days before episode 2? The only thing we got from 400 days was Bonnie, well and Bonnie wasn't a variable anyway.
Well, I guess I just expected too much.
I think it's possible that going to Tavia's camp wasn't all bad. Maybe some of the good people from 400 Days who went to the camp will assist Clementine in a coup or an escape. I'm not quite convinced that all those people who went with Tavia will approve of Carver's actions. We'll just have to wait and see. It might turn out that Bonnie was the only bad apple in the group.
Bonnie was in a group with Dee and Leland we'll call it Group A.
Shel and Becca were in a group lead by Roman we'll call Group B
Nate was probably in a group since he was chasing after Eddie and Wyatt we'll call that Group C.
The season 1 Bandits we'll call Group D
Russell was in a group that killed and looted people we'll call Group E
Luke's group from season 2 we'll call group F
Carver's group from season 2 we'll call group G
Tavia's group for the benefit of the doubt we'll call group H
Kenny's group from season 2 we'll call Group I
The bandits who attacked Clem and Christal we'll call group J
Rick's group we'll call group K even though there is no evidence they're involved in the game.
Woodbury we'll call group L even though there is no evidence they'red involved in the games.
Wellington we'll call group M
The bandits who attacked Roman's group if you let the spanish stranger go we'll call group N
Now with all these groups, and considering the time line. Which groups are connected in your opinion?
For example you might say the bandits who attacked Christa, are the same bandits that sent the spanish stranger to steal from Roman's group.
And are the same group Wyatt and Eddie ripped off of, and are the Save Lots bandits, and is the group Bonnie ,Dee, and Leland were part of.
Or you might say that Russell was part of the group Leland, Bonnie, and Dee were part of.
Just curious about everyone elses theories and opinions on the subject.
Comments
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think anyone from the cabin group is there when you meet Bonnie--it's just Clem, Walter, and I don't remember if it's Sarita or Kenny but pretty sure they were from the lodge group.
You have made some excellent points, and like what I have stated in an above comment, a lot of time has passed since the end of 400 Days. Therefore, it is unfair to condemn Bonnie until we hear what her story is and what happened to her to make her follow a man like Carver.
As for Carver himself, I think what TT is trying to do is something similar to what they did with The Stranger - at first make him out to be this mysterious and dangerous Other, then move to some sympathy for him by suggesting the people Clem are with are the real "bad guys", then finally have Carver show his true colors as an dangerous (if not down-right evil) bastard the needs to be stopped at all costs.. My personal feelings on Carver at this time are as follows - Carver is the kind of man that suffers from the delusion that he is a wise, kind, and compassionate leader that is forced by others to do terrible things. The truth however is that he is a bully that uses intimidation and fear to force his will and "love" on others, and, if they refuse, there is hell to pay. The only reason he gets away with what he does is that his is charismatic enough to get the weak-willed, scared, and desperate to follow him and carry out his will. History is filled with monsters like him.
Sadly, Bonnie always struck me as someone weak-minded and passive. Just the kind of person that is easy to manipulate. I'm sure Carver has her loyalty... for now. Perhaps a part of episode 3 will be centered on trying to get her on Clem's side.
Why don't you like, replay? But idk save in a different save and see what happens if you leave 3 and take 3?
Can you imagine if Episode 4 or 5 forced Clem into Carver's recently Vacated shoes? four pieces of food for nine people was a challenge. Imagine if you had to make decisions for dozens of people.
In my play through. Only Wyatt and Bonnie went. I love Vince, Shel, Becca and Russel. I hope we get to see them next episode... We will definitely see them Episode 4.
I think it's just a problem of being a part of that scenario. Bonnie never struck me as a bad person and since we could control her in 400 Days, maybe how we affected those characters will make a difference to how we interact with them in Episode 3 and beyond. We could possibly sway Bonnie or maybe she has an attack of conscience after the events of Episode 2. I don't hate her just because she is involved with Carver. For all we know, she's a victim.
Bonnie is easily manipulated, you can see it on 400 days she has kind off a weak personality
I actually thought that Carlos was a kind of evil guy too but in this episode (if you don't turn yourself in) you can see that he's just worried about protecting people, I mean he is all "Sarah don't look" when Carver is about to kill him, and when Carver kills Alvin he's all "Rebecca DON'T LOOK!!"
So I'm guessing he can do bad stuff ti protect people but will nto turn out evil.
About Luke in episode 1 I thought that too, but I think that Luke just hide because kenny and him weere allways disagreeing and he hide so he could save the people later (I mean he knows Carver better then Kenny, I'm sure Luke knew how Carver would work..."
Kenny is the one I'm worried about, I'm not saying he's going to be evil or dark, but somehting was off about him, some off his reactions putt me defensive towards him...
why wouldn't they recruit people? More people would make him stronger. It's possible they get people with promises and stuff - more flies with honey, and all that - Then once they're there, they realise they're not allowed to leave etc.
I made a thread similar to this
http://www.telltalegames.com/community/discussion/comment/1018186#Comment_1018186
But what if people come here, thinking it's regarding 400 days? They'll get more of a spoiler than just knowing she appears, by seeing what is written in the thread?
That's true, I'll try again.
I agreed to give supplies, since she was once a playable character, I was sure nothing bad would happen. Little bitch...
And I'm sure you meant Shel, not Sheil.
Are you saying a jaded vince, a russell and Wyatt looking for people, A Shel and Becca afraid of Roman wouldn't jump at the oppertunity for safety and protection with a charismatic leader who Tavia could have already bought into? See K0t0 before you rule it out completely remember
Carver can politely come in and talk to Clem. If Clem never becomes too aggressive he's never threatening. Even putting the knife thats laying out in the drawer. He's looking for his people.
He is convinced Rebecca is pregnant with his child Carlos spat in his face and refused to tell where she was but his only other options were torture the people he didn't know who might not know where rebecca was, torture Sarah which his men might turn on him for, torture Al... wait he was hiding with Rebecca. Torture lu....wait he's MIA, Torture Nick? Like that would produce any useful information.
When Alvin is being Dragged to the window if you're inside you get a cutscene of Carver reminding Alvin about some guy named George who Alving killed. And although perspective is a pain I think he was doing it quiet enough {for michael madsens voice} to basically be between them.
Luke's conversation with Clementine "What is everyone looking for?" the answer he wants is "Family" So it's not inconcievable for Tavia to be part of Carver's group and at first Carver's group rescues the Ski Resort. But when Carlos gets uppity and Kenny starts shooting things go downhill.
From the brief bit you know about Tavia and from what you saw in the episode 3 trailer about love and welcoming back the family tell me theres no way Tavia took the group back home to Carver's group or that he was the guy on the radio tavia talked to who just happened to be Voice Acted by an actor who wasn't michael madsen just like walkie talkie stranger with clem wasnt hotel room strangers voice.
Oops lol
I'm kind of hoping that due to just Bonnie appearing that it is determinant who else is at the camp from 400 days. However that said that would mean Nick,Alvin,Vince,Wyatt,Shel/Becca and russel would all have determinant appearances that would be quite hard to pull off.
I didn't read through all the stuff you guys wrote there, but did anyone notice, that it was not so super-important to play 400 days before episode 2? The only thing we got from 400 days was Bonnie, well and Bonnie wasn't a variable anyway.
Well, I guess I just expected too much.
I think it's possible that going to Tavia's camp wasn't all bad. Maybe some of the good people from 400 Days who went to the camp will assist Clementine in a coup or an escape. I'm not quite convinced that all those people who went with Tavia will approve of Carver's actions. We'll just have to wait and see. It might turn out that Bonnie was the only bad apple in the group.
I think she's regretting it.. you could see when Walt got shot and they were taking them out of the resort.
Here's a fun little game to try involving Bonnie.
Bonnie was in a group with Dee and Leland we'll call it Group A.
Shel and Becca were in a group lead by Roman we'll call Group B
Nate was probably in a group since he was chasing after Eddie and Wyatt we'll call that Group C.
The season 1 Bandits we'll call Group D
Russell was in a group that killed and looted people we'll call Group E
Luke's group from season 2 we'll call group F
Carver's group from season 2 we'll call group G
Tavia's group for the benefit of the doubt we'll call group H
Kenny's group from season 2 we'll call Group I
The bandits who attacked Clem and Christal we'll call group J
Rick's group we'll call group K even though there is no evidence they're involved in the game.
Woodbury we'll call group L even though there is no evidence they'red involved in the games.
Wellington we'll call group M
The bandits who attacked Roman's group if you let the spanish stranger go we'll call group N
Now with all these groups, and considering the time line. Which groups are connected in your opinion?
For example you might say the bandits who attacked Christa, are the same bandits that sent the spanish stranger to steal from Roman's group.
And are the same group Wyatt and Eddie ripped off of, and are the Save Lots bandits, and is the group Bonnie ,Dee, and Leland were part of.
Or you might say that Russell was part of the group Leland, Bonnie, and Dee were part of.
Just curious about everyone elses theories and opinions on the subject.