Hoping for minimal continuity...

Because then I can go on pretending that Escape from Monkey Island either never happened or that it happened and just had a way cooler and far more sensible ending than the one we saw. I'm talking about the HT thing mostly, of course..

But then I'm sure I'm not alone in this. The casting of Alex Boyd as Elaine is a good sign!

Comments

  • JakeJake Telltale Alumni
    edited June 2009
    Tales of Monkey Island doesn't throw any continuity out the window, but we've picked and chosen the elements of the old Monkey games which actually make it into the story. I have some thoughts about Monkey 4 and why it's important to the Monkey series and character arcs as a whole, but I should probably save them until after our games are done.
  • edited June 2009
    The game happened , get over it or get help !
  • edited June 2009
    ...sorry, I'll need psychological evaluation to help me through life if I take issue with media with a disregard for it's own continuity? I'd recommend not looking too hard at the internet - your hair will turn gray.

    I liked EMI for the most part actually. It was just it fell apart massively at the end, like it got rushed out for release, and had some very stupid last minute twists. That's why I said minimal continuity. As in, I don't want Elaine's 'daddy' popping up constantly or even getting too many mentions. (Okay, I admit it, my dream scenario would be a certain character saying that he was just playing an overly-elaborate practical joke at Guybrush's expense...)

    In fact, like others, I'd probably have no real issues with EMI if it wasn't meant to be part of a series..
  • edited June 2009
    They could do it Ward/Whedon-style: two writers. One to kill off the main character and the other to bring him back. 200 years in the future, when the previous events don't mean jack to him anymore. Nor you. Cloned. From a drop of his blood. From there on they could kick-start an all new planned for series loosely based on previous characters!

    They could have LeChuck drooling goo and eventually let him giving birth to an army of newborn zombies and everything! Near the end, there'd be a really suggestive scene involving Guybrush8 and what seems like a giant womb made of monkeys. Eventually Guybrush, Elaine and a firefly from the always-night-time woods of Melee manage to escape via a life boat going by the name of Armato. Fade out, credits start rolling, Ron Gilbert sueing Telltale for not appearing in there. Surviving cast to possibly make it into the next sequel, but that depends.

    Hey, one chapter already goes by the title of "The Trial And Execution Of Guybrush Threepwood"... :eek:
  • edited June 2009
    Ignoring one game (or it's ending) completely would just create more continuity errors.
  • edited June 2009
    But what if that one game, in this case Monkey Island 4, completely screws up continuity just by existing? Ignoring Monkey Island 4 makes the story make sense again and not turned into a complete joke, I mean, do you really want the Secret of Monkey Island to be a giant Mortal kombat rip off Monkey Robot?
  • edited June 2009
    Ash735 wrote: »
    But what if that one game, in this case Monkey Island 4, completely screws up continuity just by existing? Ignoring Monkey Island 4 makes the story make sense again and not turned into a complete joke, I mean, do you really want the Secret of Monkey Island to be a giant Mortal kombat rip off Monkey Robot?

    There are themes to which new adventure doesn't have to return. I have no specific wish to see monkey robot or Ozzie again, but ignoring the game completely would just create more problems. You can't just reset the storyline and start where CMI ended. Because time has passed there's no need to develope those storylines any further, but I wouldn't be sorry if some characters from EMI, like Pegnose Pete, would appear also in Tales.
  • edited June 2009
    Because then I can go on pretending that Escape from Monkey Island either never happened or that it happened and just had a way cooler and far more sensible ending than the one we saw....
    What was wrong with its ending? My only problem with it was the loss of the giant monkey head. And, tbh, I think I can live with that. It wasn't even in the third game.
    Ash735 wrote: »
    do you really want the Secret of Monkey Island to be a giant Mortal kombat rip off Monkey Robot?
    It wasn't 'The' Secret of MI. It was 'A' Secret of MI.
    Also, I prefer to see 'Monkey Kombat' as a parody of as, apart from the insignia between the health bars of the final battle, the combat was in no way similar to Mortal Kombat.
  • JakeJake Telltale Alumni
    edited June 2009
    Marduk wrote: »
    What was wrong with its ending? My only problem with it was the loss of the giant monkey head. And, tbh, I think I can live with that. It wasn't even in the third game.

    Yes it was. It had a giant roller coaster coming out of its mouth.
  • edited June 2009
    ...sorry, I'll need psychological evaluation to help me through life if I take issue with media with a disregard for it's own continuity? I'd recommend not looking too hard at the internet - your hair will turn gray.

    I liked EMI for the most part actually. It was just it fell apart massively at the end, like it got rushed out for release, and had some very stupid last minute twists. That's why I said minimal continuity. As in, I don't want Elaine's 'daddy' popping up constantly or even getting too many mentions. (Okay, I admit it, my dream scenario would be a certain character saying that he was just playing an overly-elaborate practical joke at Guybrush's expense...)

    In fact, like others, I'd probably have no real issues with EMI if it wasn't meant to be part of a series..

    I don't do this often, but I think I am going to agree with you. Yes, seeing Herman turn up non stop would be painful , and regarding monkey island as a giant monkey head transformer would be shit . There's not alot of detail in the 4 games anyways . MI3 respects the continuity of the first 2 games, its the 4th one that makes all those horrible twists as you've noted. They should ignore the 4th game , the most.

    I wouldn't mind hearing small details reoccur from all the games, but you're right about game 4. At the same time however I am a cannon fanboy type.
  • edited June 2009
    Maybe if Monkey Island is visited during TMI, the SACRED Giant Monkey Head will somehow return to it's rightful spot. To me in SoMI, it sort of became a symbol of, well, the game. And all that you had accomplished up to that point. I was really irked by what they did to it in EMI. *sigh*
  • edited June 2009
    Well, one thing that probably plays from EMI is Elaine not longer being the Governor of the Tri-Island Area... maybe.
  • edited June 2009
    Eduardo wrote: »
    Well, one thing that probably plays from EMI is Elaine not longer being the Governor of the Tri-Island Area... maybe.

    I would like that, MI-4 was interesting because of the politics, but not having her be a governor allows new character development in my opinion. Gives her more material , dynamics .

    :D
  • edited June 2009
    But what did 4 ADD to the series but gaping plot holes? To be honest, I don't recall any of story as being that well... cohesive to the overall arc of the series. It was just like, a chapter of random stuff that happened.
    But then, 3 was a lot like that as well.
    Only things I can think of is Elaine and Guybrush's relationship and her not being Governor.. but then, you can explain those things as being rather inevitable anyway even if we ignore the 4th game.

    I liked 3, it's a pretty game and was obviously made by die hard fanboys... 4 however, while a good game, is sort of like the Dune books written by Frank Herbert's son... still decent enough sci fi, but NOT DUNE. It's a good little adventure game, but it's not Monkey Island. The comedy is a bit more stupid, the giant monkey robot was lame and let's not even talk about the HT/Herman problem.

    Picking and chosing sounds like the best bet really. Ignore the glaring continuity errors, don't even try to explain them and focus on making a damned good game instead.
  • edited June 2009
    I liked 3, it's a pretty game and was obviously made by die hard fanboys

    Of course, Act 5 in Curse was pretty much the perfect example of that, it gave you the choice to just continue with the level or have a 30 minute discussion with LeChuck about the Continuity from the first two games as he respectfully manages to link everything up in a neat package. :)
  • edited June 2009
    Ash735 wrote: »
    Of course, Act 5 in Curse was pretty much the perfect example of that, it gave you the choice to just continue with the level or have a 30 minute discussion with LeChuck about the Continuity from the first two games as he respectfully manages to link everything up in a neat package. :)

    I enjoyed that. Not just for the continuity, but also for taking the "villain explains his plan" trope to a hilarious extreme.
  • edited June 2009
    You see, you can't have minimal continuity. Otherwise you'll have to throw away the first two games as well, and make this completely stand-alone, which is a complete no-no.
  • edited June 2009
    Jake wrote: »
    Tales of Monkey Island doesn't throw any continuity out the window, but we've picked and chosen the elements of the old Monkey games which actually make it into the story. I have some thoughts about Monkey 4 and why it's important to the Monkey series and character arcs as a whole, but I should probably save them until after our games are done.
    Please remember to share this after they're all out. :)
  • edited June 2009
    Curse introduces plot holes as well.

    But nobody cares about those.

    I think nobody likes the art direction. It's painful to see the 3d models.

    After much retrospect, I think Escape is given an overly hard time even if it is lacking a great bit from the older three.
  • edited June 2009
    PariahKing wrote: »
    Curse introduces plot holes as well.

    But nobody cares about those.

    I think nobody likes the art direction. It's painful to see the 3d models.

    After much retrospect, I think Escape is given an overly hard time even if it is lacking a great bit from the older three.

    Painful for the old fans because they can't focus their eldery eyes on modern high res graphics, 3d models , they damaged them by looking at low res pixel art all day long every day of the week.
  • edited June 2009
    I hate DisContinuity (when fans just ignore parts of a franchise because they don't like it). Likewise, I don't want TellTale or anyone ignoring the 4th game.

    We get it, people of the internet. Some of you long-time fans didn't like EMI. 3d graphics were ugly. HT and the monkey head were gaping plot holes and blasphemies. There may have been some good things about the game, even things you didn't hate, but you don't want to talk about that.

    Because a connection between two previously-considered-to-be-separate was made, and wasn't done in the most efficient, clear, or technically accurate way, you say throw the whole game out. People who liked it can just get over it. They have bad tastes anyway.

    We get it.

    But I for one don't share that view. If the game was made, it was made. It's in the canon. There are ways to harmonize the revelation of EMI with previous games. You can argue that characters misspoke on some of the details, for example.

    But in the end, I personally find it insulting to the people who worked hard to make EMI, and to people like me who really enjoyed the game, for folks who've never made a game in their life to waltz in and say EMI sucked and should just be ignored. If you feel that way, you're entitled to your opinion. But I'm entitled to find it insulting.

    In the end, I say, calm down. These are supposed to be fun adventure games. Find what you like about it, and what you don't like, don't have a fit over.
  • edited June 2009
    Following taken from "The Giant Monkey Head: A Visual History" seen on
    http://home.comcast.net/~ervind/monkhead.html

    """According to Dave Grossman, the Giant Monkey Robot was an idea originally conceived for The Secret of Monkey Island. LeChuck's ship was supposed to transform into a giant robot at the end of the game. Then the Monkey Head would have become the Giant Monkey Robot, under Guybrush's control, and there would have been a battle.

    So the bizarre ending of EMI is not entirely Sean and Mike's fault."""
  • edited June 2009
    So they just used what would have been the ending to the first game, interesting????
  • edited June 2009
    Where do those scans of what looks like a book come from?
  • edited June 2009
    Funny, isn't it, how everyone on the internet assumes party B is 500% more angry than they actually are, isn't it? Be sure to let me know when I'm acting just like Hitler...
  • edited June 2009
    PariahKing wrote: »
    Where do those scans of what looks like a book come from?

    I don't see any in this thread, but I assume you mean the MI2 original artwork?

    They're from Rogue Leaders. See here...

    http://www.mixnmojo.com/features/read.php?article=rougeleaders
  • edited June 2009
    I honestly don't think it is possible to stay true to all elements of the game. If certain things are used again, such as the Monkey Head (which MUST be in any monkey game) or Scumm Bar, they have to choose. If the Scumm Bar backs onto water, it's ignoring MI4, if it's in the middle of the island inexplicably, it's ignoring MI1.

    Personally, I hate the lack of continuity in layouts on islands, and I wish there was a map where they said 'this is it' instead of everything having numerous supposed locations and the tri island area involving more than 3 islands. But that's just me :P

    I think the best thing for future MI games to do, is to not be afraid of continuity, but also deciding how things are and keeping them like that. That way we don't have swarms of cont errors like in the last two.

    What about the biggest continuity of all? Monkey Island's secret is completely changed despite it being revealed at the end of MI2 :-)
  • edited June 2009
    jp-30 wrote: »
    I don't see any in this thread, but I assume you mean the MI2 original artwork?

    They're from Rogue Leaders. See here...

    http://www.mixnmojo.com/features/read.php?article=rougeleaders
    Huh. Thanks. Reviews seem a bit dissapointing - I was hoping for like a 20 or 30 page expose on Monkey Island or adventure games. But it seems to jump around a lot.
Sign in to comment in this discussion.