I dont know if this will help or not for you guys but if you want to have or try to have a better experience with Episode 5 i made a thread on some tips on how to do so its Here
The game is very unsubtle about giving Clementine the exact same psychotically angry look that Carver had when he smashed Kenny's eye to bits.
Is that the right kind of parallel you should draw?
This thread has been viewed over 33 thousand times, has about 300 likes and 28 pages of comments, yet somehow doesn't contain a single comment from a Telltale staff member.
I dont know if this will help or not for you guys but if you want to have or try to have a better experience with Episode 5 i made a thread on some tips on how to do so its Here
This thread has been viewed over 33 thousand times, has about 300 likes and 28 pages of comments, yet somehow doesn't contain a single comment from a Telltale staff member.
Anybody else find that odd?
I disagree that Nick was just "a new Ben". Sure, they may have had a similar habit of alienating themselves from the group and getting into trouble without thinking things through, but really I think all comparisons pretty much end there.
It wasn't just one episode. Episode 3 was also pretty damn bad. I wrote some of this here already:
They didn't spend enough time exploring Carver's prison/safe zone. There were heaps of other survivors there, but you didn't get an opinion on what they think or feel. Some of them might have been good, some bad. And yet all we saw we were lazy cameos of the 200 days characters. Well, except for Bonnie.
Sure, things were bad for your group and the indian guy, but the Carver's group were well fed and well armed. We didn't even get to see how they lived their lives or what they thought at all.
And didn't anyone else think Clem and others kind of doomed people that were there lol?
Remember in the first ep, when we first thought Rebecca (pregnant lady) was a bitch to Clem? Because she was mean and didn't want the group to help her? And we all hated her for it?
She then goes all apologetic, and boom, everything's supposed to be all amiable and good. 'Cause you know, refusing to help a child because you're pregnant is reasonable. Or is it? But the story chugs along regardless, so we give her a pass.
Carver's character itself was pretty shallow. He was essentially violent psychopath, murdering indian dude and alvin, regardless of what you do. Seeing him die or not was not satisfying either way.
Nick was barely in episode 3. I still don't get why people miss him when he wasn't that great in the first 2 eps.
Also, Kenny vs Luke was become an obvious pattern. Its pretty obvious where they're going with this.
Anyways, its been pretty bad writing did not bring out the full potential and emotional realisations of characters like Nick and Sarah, and often makes it difficult for the player to empathise with them (especially when everyone else in the cast just moves on without a care). Additionally red-sweater guy, alvin, and rebecca also die regardless of whether you get meds or not.
TWDG had previously been well known and praised for an inclusive and dynamic cast of diverse characters. It was also a refreshing change fr… moreom the run of the mill doom & gloom apocalypse stories because even though it was just as dark and just as tragic and everybody died, in the end the story was about hope. It was about the value of life, holding onto humanity and the struggle between survival and morals. This season the cast became even more diverse, it seemed to be starting out as such an improvement but now the story has taken a nosedive and all those characters are gone forever, potential wasted. For the story to completely twist everything the Walking Dead Game was all about in the space of one episode is just weird.
I was referring to Sarah's character portrayal, but yes I definitely agree that episode 4 was not the start of their problems, like I said before problems can be seen as early as the very first episode, ep2 is where we start getting consistency problems etc and then it's all downhill from there.
It wasn't just one episode. Episode 3 was also pretty damn bad. I wrote some of this here already:
They didn't spend enough time explorin… moreg Carver's prison/safe zone. There were heaps of other survivors there, but you didn't get an opinion on what they think or feel. Some of them might have been good, some bad. And yet all we saw we were lazy cameos of the 200 days characters. Well, except for Bonnie.
Sure, things were bad for your group and the indian guy, but the Carver's group were well fed and well armed. We didn't even get to see how they lived their lives or what they thought at all.
And didn't anyone else think Clem and others kind of doomed people that were there lol?
Remember in the first ep, when we first thought Rebecca (pregnant lady) was a bitch to Clem? Because she was mean and didn't want the group to help her? And we all hated her for it?
She then goes all apologetic, and boom, everything's supposed to be all am… [view original content]
This thread has been viewed over 33 thousand times, has about 300 likes and 28 pages of comments, yet somehow doesn't contain a single comment from a Telltale staff member.
Anybody else find that odd?
This thread has been viewed over 33 thousand times, has about 300 likes and 28 pages of comments, yet somehow doesn't contain a single comment from a Telltale staff member.
Anybody else find that odd?
Done !
I read all about these...nice one,btw !
Ehhhh,don't worry...this is the world of Robert Kirkman.
This thread has been viewed over 33 thousand times, has about 300 likes and 28 pages of comments, yet somehow doesn't contain a single comment from a Telltale staff member.
Anybody else find that odd?
They don't need to do this.
Don't forget about this : "These lips are sealed."
Glenn didn't really get any kind of development other than that he felt sorry for the motel women, he was more of "a along for the ride" kind of character and he was a cameo from the comics and him leaving made sense, as he had friends in Atlanta and felt like he needed to help them out, that's not a very good comparison as Glenn didn't really have development.
You could be nitpicky about anything, i honestly dont care about what anyone else thinks. I think the episode was amazing for all those reas… moreons.
Who,later on, leaves and making it all pointless because we will never see her again, like Molly.
But its The Walking Dead, you get character development with Glenn and then he leaves, tons of characters get development and leave or die. Also who knows, she may return.
.that were ignored seconds later and forgotten forever by the characters in the game...even though the game has to have a realistic touch, it does not.
They didnt have time to dwell over deaths, if they did that on the deck Rebecca would have stopped pushing at the baby wouldve died. I agree Nicks was stupid though.
Ahh yes...showing how an 11 year old stays the same despite all adults around her losing their limits and bark at one another,(copy-pasting now) was expecting Clem to snap at the others cur… [view original content]
They went a realistic route. CEASE TO FUNCTION may be a meme at this point, but it's basically correct. I agree that the direction seemed of… moref, but the same could be said for Nick. In general, I've found this season to be more aimless. I think that's a flaw with the writing, but I don't think it has anything to do with being against disabled people. Everyone suffers the same in the universe of the walking dead.
It's funny to me how some people would take the criticizing more seriously if it's happening on YouTube rather than if if people are criticizing it on Tumblr. Even though the majority of the posts on tumblr that are complaints are well thought out, intelligent posts meanwhile on Youtube most of the comments are "lol no boobs no thanks bye fag"
Take a look at the facebook page. Look at the comment section to the accolades trailer of episode 4. If ppl on Youtube know that this wasn't their strongest episode, you know something's wrong.
Glenn didn't really get any kind of development other than that he felt sorry for the motel women, he was more of "a along for the ride" kin… mored of character and he was a cameo from the comics and him leaving made sense, as he had friends in Atlanta and felt like he needed to help them out, that's not a very good comparison as Glenn didn't really have development.
Nevermind. Fuck you. You clearly have learned nothing from this and it just made it obvious that you're using this apology as a bullshit PR campaign rather than any sort of actual sincerity.
Protip: when people are angry at you for your treatment of a disabled character, it's probably not a good idea to go on the very next episode and continue to talk about horrible she is and show no regrets for leaving her to die.
Hey, everyone--
It's me, Greg Miller from IGN! I just wrote a big ol' blog about everything over on IGN (http://www.ign.com/blogs/greggy-… moreign/2014/08/10/the-walking-dead-sarah-and-normal/), but I wanted to make sure y'all saw it, too. I'll stick around to answer comments...
Hey--
So, today's been a mix of a lot of different Tweets. Lots about Christine Lakin on The GameOverGreggy Show and some about Twitch, but then, there's been a couple about yesterday's Playing Dead episode and Sarah.
At first, I was pretty stoked; no one ever Tweets me about Playing Dead! But a few of them got really combative, and I was a bit lost. Finally, someone linked me to this Tumblr about it, which you should really read for the rest of this post to make sense.
I'll wait.
OK. Caught up? Outside of disagreeing/being pretty bummed about being referred to as "an asshole to female characters" and a "shitpile," I understand where Marissa (and the handf… [view original content]
Yeah well that's why I changed it to "Where S2 Went Wrong" hoping that might get them to speak up. Then it got to 28K+ views and still nothing. Then the Playing Dead interview happened.
The Playing Dead interview wasnt that bad, they HAVE gotten lots of positive feedback. Though they shouldn't be so rude i cant expect them to publicly say that they got negative feedback.
Yeah well that's why I changed it to "Where S2 Went Wrong" hoping that might get them to speak up. Then it got to 28K+ views and still nothing. Then the Playing Dead interview happened.
I'm 100% agreeing on this. I'm going to write an essay as well, so I can feel smart, because I'm feeling pretty stupid these days, and my brain needs a workout. I also may of copied something that you have said (because I don't read newspapers,) - if so I am sorry.
I thought that episodic games such as The Wolf Among Us or The Walking Dead were about noticing the public's feedback throughout the season, and making sure that every episode was better than their previous counterpart. Telltale has completely ignored the fans who have wished for a better choices in the story. Telltale have only thought about the other half of the fanbase - the people who hate and hate and hate on the character's that could be fixed with just a little bit of development. This causes us to see the deaths of characters that we would love to see grow up, and learn how to deal with loss. But Telltale follows the people that I personally believe are wrong; people who say "I'm glad that Sarah is dead!" or "Nick is the new Ben!"
Another thing I hate is when they switch the character's whole persona with a lever without any character development. I hated the fact that Rebecca forget everything that had occurred in Episode 1 - and turned into a smart mother who cares. That's not the Rebecca I knew. I'd rather have Rebecca turn into a caring mother after the pregnancy, then midway through. Having a personality switch after the pregnancy seems more realistic, then having a personality switch because you left the cabin. This is one of the first hints to a shitty story line, and it makes you wonder - have Telltale thought this season through? I felt cheated - because I was one of the people who still liked Episode One Rebecca, even though she was a complete horror in the eyes of Clem. Now that Rebecca turned into a good guy, it was hard to feel a connection with her. In Episode One she was my enemy; In Episode Two and later, she was someone who was only there so that the baby could pop out of her. She was weak of character, and when her usefulness died out, she was shot dead.
Now the most controversial stuff that I can come up with...
I don't like Clementine.
Clementine has turned into the work loader - everyone and their mother asks her for help, when she's just a little girl. The only person who looks at Clementine realistically is a doctor. Carlos actually treats her like a girl - and I believe that this is what most would treat her like. Sarita also treats her like a little girl, but much less so than Carlos. But both of them are dead, so yeah.
I don't want Clementine to be a hero, which everyone looks up to. I want her to be a person, with actually flaws that make her weak. Jane and Carver treat her like she's special, but that's not what I want. I want a character with flaws. Just look at Lee, he was going to jail right at the beginning of Season One - and this affected the looks of people in the game, such as Larry, Carly and Lily. They actually noticed his flaws and told him or the group. It made him real. At the beginning of Season Two, Clementine left her gun out which caused Omid's heroic death. This flaw was wiped away clean when all the witness saw that flaw of hers were dead. I thought that maybe the fact that she's a little girl would become her flaw, but it wasn't, there was no flaw, (expect for cutting Sarita's arm off - but I killed the zombie.)
Another reason why I don't like her is not really her fault, I guess. It's just the fact that I wanted someone to protect. In Season One, it was Clementine, obviously. But in Season Two, it was Sarah. But that was short lived. I got angry at Carlos for sheltering her, and I got pissed at Telltale for not letting me teach her how to live. What did teaching her how to shot a gun do? Nothing. What did teaching her how to shut up do? Nothing. What did me taking the blame for the photo do? Nothing. What did restarting my game and trying to save Sarah during the pregnancy chapter do? Nothing. At All. I wanted her to become my Clem from Season One. But Telltale let her rot away as if she was filth, because they don't want any freaking development. This connection that I felt with Sarah was so strong, that I liked Sarah more then Clementine. Crazy, right? Whenever I try to replace Clementine from Season One with Clementine from Season Two, I can't. Clementine doesn't have the "I'm a little girl" weakness anymore, she doesn't need help. Clementine wasn't broken. Sarah was. Sarah was someone I could fix, but Telltale didn't let me fix her.
Ok. I'll stop with the negativity. I have to admit that the story is good in some places and that there are characters that are realistic - such as Kenny and Luke. I just feel like with a little bit of tweaking, it could have been an incredible game. They could have just made Luke's reason for having sex was because his best friend was dead, and all his memories that he obtained with everyone in the cabin group was long gone. They could have also let Sarah stay hidden for the whole duration of the season - and in Season Three, she could have grown up into somewhat of a decent survivor, stating how her father's death made her realize the world is complete shit. They could have made Clementine cry when she was told off by Kenny about chopping Sarita's arm (She's an 11 year old for freak's sake.) They could have done alot more. I'm still going to play the game - I'm addicted to choice games, and I have a few heart strings for Clementine - but it's mostly her innocence. I also like the cliff hangers and stories and stuff. Damn those cliff hangers.
Oh really? Because in fiction, everything has to be crazy? I suppose you've never heard of hard science fiction either, right? If you're under the understanding that realism has no place in fiction, I suggest you read more books.
Already talked about how the Playing Dead interview just buried the hole deeper on other threads so I'm going to copy paste this response:
Telltale's employees reflect their company as a whole, and for them to sit there and laugh and agree with him instead of making a move to defend their own character was just not cool. Not even addressing how people are offended by it, from a purely writing standpoint, it's like Greg was saying "LOL Your character was useless and pointless to the plot and I'm glad she's gone" and they went "Yeah, pretty much, haha!"
People call Greg out on this and he releases a statement say "sorry IF I was being offensive but I really wasn't" but continues to say that Sarah was useless and deserved to die.
And now this new Playing Dead. He keeps saying the EXACT SAME THING. What happened to his "apology"? What happened to "this was a tragic necessity but there was no other way"? Nope, "it was the RIGHT thing to leave her behind". And Jane's VA agrees, saying "THANK YOU" as if Greg is some kind of genius giving his enlightened opinion that no one can seem to understand. They can't even be bothered to get her frigging NAME right. It's hilariously bad.
The Playing Dead interview wasnt that bad, they HAVE gotten lots of positive feedback. Though they shouldn't be so rude i cant expect them to publicly say that they got negative feedback.
It's funny to me how some people would take the criticizing more seriously if it's happening on YouTube rather than if if people are critici… morezing it on Tumblr. Even though the majority of the posts on tumblr that are complaints are well thought out, intelligent posts meanwhile on Youtube most of the comments are "lol no boobs no thanks bye fag"
Which is why it's even more obvious. The comment section of youtube videos is usually just neverending trolling. When even the trolls recognize that the writing was poor, you know it was REALLY bad.
We've been through this argument so many times it's hard to take anyone saying it seriously anymore. The Walking Dead Game =/= Zombie Realism Simulator
Oh really? Because in fiction, everything has to be crazy? I suppose you've never heard of hard science fiction either, right? If you're under the understanding that realism has no place in fiction, I suggest you read more books.
Who said they are ignoring you? Because they aren't responding? I can assure you TTG staff read these forums and have noticed the complaints. They just chose not (or are forbidden to) to respond. Because it would do nothing but piss people off. Comment on the episode and try to defend it? Piss people off. Apologize about the mediocrity of the episode right before the finale? Piss people off and potentially hurt future sales. Hell, not even commenting pisses people off but its the safest and easiest option at the moment.
You may hear some things after the season is done a bit down the line. But TTG is not going to come and defend themselves on the forums. Its not worth it and they know it.
Yeah well it sure doesn't help their "the fan feedback counts" reputation. They're going to be losing fans now, ignoring all criticism, refusing to acknowledge their mistakes, and burying the hole deeper. At this point I really do not ever want to buy anything from them again. I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one that feels that way.
Who said they are ignoring you? Because they aren't responding? I can assure you TTG staff read these forums and have noticed the complaints… more. They just chose not (or are forbidden to) to respond. Because it would do nothing but piss people off. Comment on the episode and try to defend it? Piss people off. Apologize about the mediocrity of the episode right before the finale? Piss people off and potentially hurt future sales. Hell, not even commenting pisses people off but its the safest and easiest option at the moment.
You may hear some things after the season is done a bit down the line. But TTG is not going to come and defend themselves on the forums. Its not worth it and they know it.
Yeah well it sure doesn't help their "the fan feedback counts" reputation. They're going to be losing fans now, ignoring all criticism, refu… moresing to acknowledge their mistakes, and burying the hole deeper. At this point I really do not ever want to buy anything from them again. I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one that feels that way.
We've been through this argument so many times it's hard to take anyone saying it seriously anymore. The Walking Dead Game =/= Zombie Realism Simulator
You're missing the point. And I'm going to copy paste for the zillionth time now.
This isn’t supposed to be “realistic”. This isn’t Zombie Realism Simulator: The Game. And it was never meant to be.
Telltale Games is telling a STORY.
Real life doesn’t always make sense. Real life isn’t always fulfilling. A good story is.
A good story has something to say. It has themes. It has plot points and events that reflect those themes. It has characters who are portrayed purposefully and effectively.
Telltale’s story as it’s turned out this season has something to say too. At best, it’s message is convoluted and weak as a result of bad writing. At worst, it’s intentionally offensive.
The thing is, the writing this episode was problematic not just because it was lazy, but because it actively justified those saying "Sarah is useless/a liability and should die". It was a bad move of Telltale to cater to that crowd not just because we're offended, but because it's unsatisfying and contrary to their previous writing.
Sarah was a very involved and developed character in the story, but now she's suddenly treated as completely unimportant, nothing more than a "liability", who was "dragging the group down". Her death served no purpose to the plot; she was unmourned and pointlessly killed off. It's offensive because the idea that somebody should die simply because they weren't "meant" to make it is a very harmful and common cliche. It's bad writing because it's extremely unsatisfying and the way she died was completely nonsensical.
Prior to this, Sarah was never a hopeless cause. She had both good and bad qualities that could have allowed her to overcome her struggles. Instead, Telltale has taken the lazy way out, killing her off with no further involvement, with the only defense for which is "it's realistic".
Stop copy/pasting things. It doesn't cater to the person you're responding to properly, and it's just a generic sweep of ideas that don't address what I'm talking about. But since you can't put forth the time to write something due to apparent laziness, I'll keep my reply brief.
First, don't assume to know the creator's intentions. Just because the story is all that YOU care about, doesn't mean that's necessarily the only direction of the game. Realistic characters that you've grown attached to help drive the story, and it's realistic in the fact that not everyone gets a happy ending during an apocalypse.
I can't even respond to the rest, because I've actually already touched on it. With you. In this thread. Please in the future try to crack down on your copy/paste replies. I find it's really ineffective.
You're missing the point. And I'm going to copy paste for the zillionth time now.
This isn’t supposed to be “realistic”. This isn’t Zombi… moree Realism Simulator: The Game. And it was never meant to be.
Telltale Games is telling a STORY.
Real life doesn’t always make sense. Real life isn’t always fulfilling. A good story is.
A good story has something to say. It has themes. It has plot points and events that reflect those themes. It has characters who are portrayed purposefully and effectively.
Telltale’s story as it’s turned out this season has something to say too. At best, it’s message is convoluted and weak as a result of bad writing. At worst, it’s intentionally offensive.
The thing is, the writing this episode was problematic not just because it was lazy, but because it actively justified those saying "Sarah is useless/a liability and should die". It was a bad move of Telltale to cater to that crowd not just because we're o… [view original content]
Stop copy/pasting things. It doesn't cater to the person you're responding to properly, and it's just a generic sweep of ideas that don't ad… moredress what I'm talking about. But since you can't put forth the time to write something due to apparent laziness, I'll keep my reply brief.
First, don't assume to know the creator's intentions. Just because the story is all that YOU care about, doesn't mean that's necessarily the only direction of the game. Realistic characters that you've grown attached to help drive the story, and it's realistic in the fact that not everyone gets a happy ending during an apocalypse.
I can't even respond to the rest, because I've actually already touched on it. With you. In this thread. Please in the future try to crack down on your copy/paste replies. I find it's really ineffective.
I'm 100% agreeing on this. I'm going to write an essay as well, so I can feel smart, because I'm feeling pretty stupid these days, and my br… moreain needs a workout. I also may of copied something that you have said (because I don't read newspapers,) - if so I am sorry.
I thought that episodic games such as The Wolf Among Us or The Walking Dead were about noticing the public's feedback throughout the season, and making sure that every episode was better than their previous counterpart. Telltale has completely ignored the fans who have wished for a better choices in the story. Telltale have only thought about the other half of the fanbase - the people who hate and hate and hate on the character's that could be fixed with just a little bit of development. This causes us to see the deaths of characters that we would love to see grow up, and learn how to deal with loss. But Telltale follows the people that I personally believe are wrong; people who… [view original content]
Alot of people have already explained the "not heroic death argument" and why it works in season 1 and not in season 2, and besides the "it's realistic" argument doesn't hold any value and has become a shallow cliche defense for lazy writing, this is a fictional story about characters who have character arcs, not a zombie simulator.
Stop copy/pasting things. It doesn't cater to the person you're responding to properly, and it's just a generic sweep of ideas that don't ad… moredress what I'm talking about. But since you can't put forth the time to write something due to apparent laziness, I'll keep my reply brief.
First, don't assume to know the creator's intentions. Just because the story is all that YOU care about, doesn't mean that's necessarily the only direction of the game. Realistic characters that you've grown attached to help drive the story, and it's realistic in the fact that not everyone gets a happy ending during an apocalypse.
I can't even respond to the rest, because I've actually already touched on it. With you. In this thread. Please in the future try to crack down on your copy/paste replies. I find it's really ineffective.
Excellent - and it goes well with what the OP already said.
I especially agree with regarding Clem, and I have done so since the beginning. Not only is she poorly written and little regard is taken about what she learned in season 1, she is also not treated like the child she is. Simply put, she is not handled realistically by the developers - when a group of people include two healthy young men, they are the ones going at the front, no one else goddammit. The only time a child should be in action would be if there are absolutely no adults around - and that would include Rebecca.
And flaws... well, part of her being poorly written.
Poorly written by the way: That should be stamped all over season 2, and that is pretty much everything that needs to be said.
I'm 100% agreeing on this. I'm going to write an essay as well, so I can feel smart, because I'm feeling pretty stupid these days, and my br… moreain needs a workout. I also may of copied something that you have said (because I don't read newspapers,) - if so I am sorry.
I thought that episodic games such as The Wolf Among Us or The Walking Dead were about noticing the public's feedback throughout the season, and making sure that every episode was better than their previous counterpart. Telltale has completely ignored the fans who have wished for a better choices in the story. Telltale have only thought about the other half of the fanbase - the people who hate and hate and hate on the character's that could be fixed with just a little bit of development. This causes us to see the deaths of characters that we would love to see grow up, and learn how to deal with loss. But Telltale follows the people that I personally believe are wrong; people who… [view original content]
Comments
I dont know if this will help or not for you guys but if you want to have or try to have a better experience with Episode 5 i made a thread on some tips on how to do so its Here
I am only talking about the intentions of the player.
This thread has been viewed over 33 thousand times, has about 300 likes and 28 pages of comments, yet somehow doesn't contain a single comment from a Telltale staff member.
Anybody else find that odd?
SIGHHHH
Yeah, one was willing to die for clem, the other ran the fuck away LOL
It wasn't just one episode. Episode 3 was also pretty damn bad. I wrote some of this here already:
They didn't spend enough time exploring Carver's prison/safe zone. There were heaps of other survivors there, but you didn't get an opinion on what they think or feel. Some of them might have been good, some bad. And yet all we saw we were lazy cameos of the 200 days characters. Well, except for Bonnie.
Sure, things were bad for your group and the indian guy, but the Carver's group were well fed and well armed. We didn't even get to see how they lived their lives or what they thought at all.
And didn't anyone else think Clem and others kind of doomed people that were there lol?
Remember in the first ep, when we first thought Rebecca (pregnant lady) was a bitch to Clem? Because she was mean and didn't want the group to help her? And we all hated her for it?
She then goes all apologetic, and boom, everything's supposed to be all amiable and good. 'Cause you know, refusing to help a child because you're pregnant is reasonable. Or is it? But the story chugs along regardless, so we give her a pass.
Carver's character itself was pretty shallow. He was essentially violent psychopath, murdering indian dude and alvin, regardless of what you do. Seeing him die or not was not satisfying either way.
Nick was barely in episode 3. I still don't get why people miss him when he wasn't that great in the first 2 eps.
Also, Kenny vs Luke was become an obvious pattern. Its pretty obvious where they're going with this.
Anyways, its been pretty bad writing did not bring out the full potential and emotional realisations of characters like Nick and Sarah, and often makes it difficult for the player to empathise with them (especially when everyone else in the cast just moves on without a care). Additionally red-sweater guy, alvin, and rebecca also die regardless of whether you get meds or not.
I was referring to Sarah's character portrayal, but yes I definitely agree that episode 4 was not the start of their problems, like I said before problems can be seen as early as the very first episode, ep2 is where we start getting consistency problems etc and then it's all downhill from there.
They are definitely just ignoring the thread. You can tell they are loving the valid feedback we are giving them.
No. Because they probably know any comment they make will simply fan the flames.
Done !
I read all about these...nice one,btw !
Ehhhh,don't worry...this is the world of Robert Kirkman.
They don't need to do this.
Don't forget about this : "These lips are sealed."
Sometimes I love the internet...
TheCrawfordWay
I don't know what are they gaining from this?
You mean, they are active on twitter asking for fan art of Clem, but refuse to adress any of the concerns raised on their own forums?
Edit: Just realised: a picture of Clem wearing a shirt with the text "The Crawford Way" might be a hint for them...
Glenn didn't really get any kind of development other than that he felt sorry for the motel women, he was more of "a along for the ride" kind of character and he was a cameo from the comics and him leaving made sense, as he had friends in Atlanta and felt like he needed to help them out, that's not a very good comparison as Glenn didn't really have development.
If no staff members have seen it maybe its because of the title perhaps?
i wouldnt click on a thread that said "Shame on you #TeamSarah"
Annd that's where I stop taking you seriously.
It's funny to me how some people would take the criticizing more seriously if it's happening on YouTube rather than if if people are criticizing it on Tumblr. Even though the majority of the posts on tumblr that are complaints are well thought out, intelligent posts meanwhile on Youtube most of the comments are "lol no boobs no thanks bye fag"
gg J.
After seeing your new Playing Dead episode?
Nevermind. Fuck you. You clearly have learned nothing from this and it just made it obvious that you're using this apology as a bullshit PR campaign rather than any sort of actual sincerity.
Protip: when people are angry at you for your treatment of a disabled character, it's probably not a good idea to go on the very next episode and continue to talk about horrible she is and show no regrets for leaving her to die.
They're trying to block out the criticism. Take attention away from it with all this new news and media.
(Conspiracy theory ahoy)
Yeah well that's why I changed it to "Where S2 Went Wrong" hoping that might get them to speak up. Then it got to 28K+ views and still nothing. Then the Playing Dead interview happened.
The Playing Dead interview wasnt that bad, they HAVE gotten lots of positive feedback. Though they shouldn't be so rude i cant expect them to publicly say that they got negative feedback.
Apparently the fan feedback only counts if its praising them to the high heavens
So ignoring it and hoping we'll just go away is the better option?
I'm 100% agreeing on this. I'm going to write an essay as well, so I can feel smart, because I'm feeling pretty stupid these days, and my brain needs a workout. I also may of copied something that you have said (because I don't read newspapers,) - if so I am sorry.
I thought that episodic games such as The Wolf Among Us or The Walking Dead were about noticing the public's feedback throughout the season, and making sure that every episode was better than their previous counterpart. Telltale has completely ignored the fans who have wished for a better choices in the story. Telltale have only thought about the other half of the fanbase - the people who hate and hate and hate on the character's that could be fixed with just a little bit of development. This causes us to see the deaths of characters that we would love to see grow up, and learn how to deal with loss. But Telltale follows the people that I personally believe are wrong; people who say "I'm glad that Sarah is dead!" or "Nick is the new Ben!"
Another thing I hate is when they switch the character's whole persona with a lever without any character development. I hated the fact that Rebecca forget everything that had occurred in Episode 1 - and turned into a smart mother who cares. That's not the Rebecca I knew. I'd rather have Rebecca turn into a caring mother after the pregnancy, then midway through. Having a personality switch after the pregnancy seems more realistic, then having a personality switch because you left the cabin. This is one of the first hints to a shitty story line, and it makes you wonder - have Telltale thought this season through? I felt cheated - because I was one of the people who still liked Episode One Rebecca, even though she was a complete horror in the eyes of Clem. Now that Rebecca turned into a good guy, it was hard to feel a connection with her. In Episode One she was my enemy; In Episode Two and later, she was someone who was only there so that the baby could pop out of her. She was weak of character, and when her usefulness died out, she was shot dead.
Now the most controversial stuff that I can come up with...
I don't like Clementine.
Clementine has turned into the work loader - everyone and their mother asks her for help, when she's just a little girl. The only person who looks at Clementine realistically is a doctor. Carlos actually treats her like a girl - and I believe that this is what most would treat her like. Sarita also treats her like a little girl, but much less so than Carlos. But both of them are dead, so yeah.
I don't want Clementine to be a hero, which everyone looks up to. I want her to be a person, with actually flaws that make her weak. Jane and Carver treat her like she's special, but that's not what I want. I want a character with flaws. Just look at Lee, he was going to jail right at the beginning of Season One - and this affected the looks of people in the game, such as Larry, Carly and Lily. They actually noticed his flaws and told him or the group. It made him real. At the beginning of Season Two, Clementine left her gun out which caused Omid's heroic death. This flaw was wiped away clean when all the witness saw that flaw of hers were dead. I thought that maybe the fact that she's a little girl would become her flaw, but it wasn't, there was no flaw, (expect for cutting Sarita's arm off - but I killed the zombie.)
Another reason why I don't like her is not really her fault, I guess. It's just the fact that I wanted someone to protect. In Season One, it was Clementine, obviously. But in Season Two, it was Sarah. But that was short lived. I got angry at Carlos for sheltering her, and I got pissed at Telltale for not letting me teach her how to live. What did teaching her how to shot a gun do? Nothing. What did teaching her how to shut up do? Nothing. What did me taking the blame for the photo do? Nothing. What did restarting my game and trying to save Sarah during the pregnancy chapter do? Nothing. At All. I wanted her to become my Clem from Season One. But Telltale let her rot away as if she was filth, because they don't want any freaking development. This connection that I felt with Sarah was so strong, that I liked Sarah more then Clementine. Crazy, right? Whenever I try to replace Clementine from Season One with Clementine from Season Two, I can't. Clementine doesn't have the "I'm a little girl" weakness anymore, she doesn't need help. Clementine wasn't broken. Sarah was. Sarah was someone I could fix, but Telltale didn't let me fix her.
Ok. I'll stop with the negativity. I have to admit that the story is good in some places and that there are characters that are realistic - such as Kenny and Luke. I just feel like with a little bit of tweaking, it could have been an incredible game. They could have just made Luke's reason for having sex was because his best friend was dead, and all his memories that he obtained with everyone in the cabin group was long gone. They could have also let Sarah stay hidden for the whole duration of the season - and in Season Three, she could have grown up into somewhat of a decent survivor, stating how her father's death made her realize the world is complete shit. They could have made Clementine cry when she was told off by Kenny about chopping Sarita's arm (She's an 11 year old for freak's sake.) They could have done alot more. I'm still going to play the game - I'm addicted to choice games, and I have a few heart strings for Clementine - but it's mostly her innocence. I also like the cliff hangers and stories and stuff. Damn those cliff hangers.
Oh really? Because in fiction, everything has to be crazy? I suppose you've never heard of hard science fiction either, right? If you're under the understanding that realism has no place in fiction, I suggest you read more books.
Already talked about how the Playing Dead interview just buried the hole deeper on other threads so I'm going to copy paste this response:
Telltale's employees reflect their company as a whole, and for them to sit there and laugh and agree with him instead of making a move to defend their own character was just not cool. Not even addressing how people are offended by it, from a purely writing standpoint, it's like Greg was saying "LOL Your character was useless and pointless to the plot and I'm glad she's gone" and they went "Yeah, pretty much, haha!"
People call Greg out on this and he releases a statement say "sorry IF I was being offensive but I really wasn't" but continues to say that Sarah was useless and deserved to die.
And now this new Playing Dead. He keeps saying the EXACT SAME THING. What happened to his "apology"? What happened to "this was a tragic necessity but there was no other way"? Nope, "it was the RIGHT thing to leave her behind". And Jane's VA agrees, saying "THANK YOU" as if Greg is some kind of genius giving his enlightened opinion that no one can seem to understand. They can't even be bothered to get her frigging NAME right. It's hilariously bad.
Actually, no one takes youtube comments seriously.
Which is why it's even more obvious. The comment section of youtube videos is usually just neverending trolling. When even the trolls recognize that the writing was poor, you know it was REALLY bad.
We've been through this argument so many times it's hard to take anyone saying it seriously anymore. The Walking Dead Game =/= Zombie Realism Simulator
Who said they are ignoring you? Because they aren't responding? I can assure you TTG staff read these forums and have noticed the complaints. They just chose not (or are forbidden to) to respond. Because it would do nothing but piss people off. Comment on the episode and try to defend it? Piss people off. Apologize about the mediocrity of the episode right before the finale? Piss people off and potentially hurt future sales. Hell, not even commenting pisses people off but its the safest and easiest option at the moment.
You may hear some things after the season is done a bit down the line. But TTG is not going to come and defend themselves on the forums. Its not worth it and they know it.
Yeah well it sure doesn't help their "the fan feedback counts" reputation. They're going to be losing fans now, ignoring all criticism, refusing to acknowledge their mistakes, and burying the hole deeper. At this point I really do not ever want to buy anything from them again. I'm pretty sure I'm not the only one that feels that way.
Again, who says they are ignoring feedback?
And yet the characters and their situations are realistic. Something that is fiction can still be believable. Don't limit the genre or your viewpoint.
Well, let me put it this way. Can you name one single example where they have incorporated player feedback?
You're missing the point. And I'm going to copy paste for the zillionth time now.
This isn’t supposed to be “realistic”. This isn’t Zombie Realism Simulator: The Game. And it was never meant to be.
Telltale Games is telling a STORY.
Real life doesn’t always make sense. Real life isn’t always fulfilling. A good story is.
A good story has something to say. It has themes. It has plot points and events that reflect those themes. It has characters who are portrayed purposefully and effectively.
Telltale’s story as it’s turned out this season has something to say too. At best, it’s message is convoluted and weak as a result of bad writing. At worst, it’s intentionally offensive.
The thing is, the writing this episode was problematic not just because it was lazy, but because it actively justified those saying "Sarah is useless/a liability and should die". It was a bad move of Telltale to cater to that crowd not just because we're offended, but because it's unsatisfying and contrary to their previous writing.
Sarah was a very involved and developed character in the story, but now she's suddenly treated as completely unimportant, nothing more than a "liability", who was "dragging the group down". Her death served no purpose to the plot; she was unmourned and pointlessly killed off. It's offensive because the idea that somebody should die simply because they weren't "meant" to make it is a very harmful and common cliche. It's bad writing because it's extremely unsatisfying and the way she died was completely nonsensical.
Prior to this, Sarah was never a hopeless cause. She had both good and bad qualities that could have allowed her to overcome her struggles. Instead, Telltale has taken the lazy way out, killing her off with no further involvement, with the only defense for which is "it's realistic".
Stop copy/pasting things. It doesn't cater to the person you're responding to properly, and it's just a generic sweep of ideas that don't address what I'm talking about. But since you can't put forth the time to write something due to apparent laziness, I'll keep my reply brief.
First, don't assume to know the creator's intentions. Just because the story is all that YOU care about, doesn't mean that's necessarily the only direction of the game. Realistic characters that you've grown attached to help drive the story, and it's realistic in the fact that not everyone gets a happy ending during an apocalypse.
I can't even respond to the rest, because I've actually already touched on it. With you. In this thread. Please in the future try to crack down on your copy/paste replies. I find it's really ineffective.
Did you read what I wrote?
Nice explanation right there, have a like!
Alot of people have already explained the "not heroic death argument" and why it works in season 1 and not in season 2, and besides the "it's realistic" argument doesn't hold any value and has become a shallow cliche defense for lazy writing, this is a fictional story about characters who have character arcs, not a zombie simulator.
Excellent - and it goes well with what the OP already said.
I especially agree with regarding Clem, and I have done so since the beginning. Not only is she poorly written and little regard is taken about what she learned in season 1, she is also not treated like the child she is. Simply put, she is not handled realistically by the developers - when a group of people include two healthy young men, they are the ones going at the front, no one else goddammit. The only time a child should be in action would be if there are absolutely no adults around - and that would include Rebecca.
And flaws... well, part of her being poorly written.
Poorly written by the way: That should be stamped all over season 2, and that is pretty much everything that needs to be said.
Season 2 is poorly written.