Because people thought Greg was attacking disabled people (even though he wasn't).
And this presents the possibility that her mental cond… moreition, the severe dependancy, was induced by her father's choices in her upbringing, not because she was disabled.
Sarah had so much potential but oh my fucking god Telltale was too lazy to develop such an interesting character. Of course the feels and all the overrated bullshit and junk get in the way of innovational writing and origination. Such ingeniousness was non-compensable. WHY, TELLTALE? GG FUCKING WP I AM FUCKING DONE
Because people thought Greg was attacking disabled people (even though he wasn't).
And this presents the possibility that her mental cond… moreition, the severe dependancy, was induced by her father's choices in her upbringing, not because she was disabled.
But people thought that she had mental disabilities that were a result of severe intellectual disabilities resulting from birth or an accident, and that Greg was making fun of this. If I thought he actually did this and had this sentiment for real life people, of course I'd be pissed. But I don't think he does, which is why I disagreed with you.
Here, it is the result of Carlos' coddling. The problem is her inability to adapt to the zombie apocalypse, and requiring other characters we care about, including Clem, to risk their lives in order to save hers. We want to save the lives of people that are inherently unable to save or protect themselves - like babies. For Sarah, it is different and there is a limit to the extent that we make sacrifices to save/protect her.
When the platform collapses, you could have dropped Jane down so she could attempt to save Sarah. But without knowing what would happen when you drop Jane down: she could fall and break her leg, or her arm or hurt her head; and both Jane and Sarah could have died. Also, the debris appeared to be too heavy to lift off by a single person.
Choosing to pull Jane up is ok because the risks would have been too great. We also like Jane AND she contributes to the group's welfare, especially Clem's safety.
But of course, in classic telltale fashion, she dies regardless of our choices. Also, as its been said countless times, the other characters move on without a care. Its puts you out of the experience. It reminds you that it is a game that has wonky writing as well as mediocre gameplay; which is a big problem because these games were great because of the storytelling. It reminds that its just a game, and that its not a game worth getting emotional about because Clem is probably going to survive.
Also, Kenny vs Luke is annoying.
Also, scenes with Sarah weren't fun or interesting at all after episode 1. They didn't do anything that was interesting or added new facets to her character that endeared her to us. Nick was barely in episode 3 and was still more endearing. And Red sweater guy was even more endearing than Nick in my opinion, considering he also saves Nick's life (based on certain choices you make), which makes him more interesting than Sarah.
But people thought that she had mental disabilities that were a result of severe intellectual disabilities resulting from birth or an accident, and that Greg was making fun of this. If I thought he actually did this and had this sentiment for real life people, of course I'd be pissed. But I don't think he does, which is why I disagreed with you.
No they didn't. 2/3 (yes I know this is horribly simplified) forms of autism often do not come with severe behavioural or learning disabilities and autism was the main thing directed at her. I've always said the same thing as the OP and I agree with the anti-greg thread. Noone I know of thinks she is mentally retarded, but she plainly has disabilities.
Also, scenes with Sarah weren't fun or interesting at all after episode 1. They didn't do anything that was interesting or added new facets to her character that endeared her to us.
This was because of bad writing, not because she was a hopeless character. I think we ALL regret her neglect as a character. That's part of the issue we had. She's "that abnormal girl" as far as the story cared, that's her character and that's part of the problem.
But people thought that she had mental disabilities that were a result of severe intellectual disabilities resulting from birth or an accide… morent, and that Greg was making fun of this. If I thought he actually did this and had this sentiment for real life people, of course I'd be pissed. But I don't think he does, which is why I disagreed with you.
Here, it is the result of Carlos' coddling. The problem is her inability to adapt to the zombie apocalypse, and requiring other characters we care about, including Clem, to risk their lives in order to save hers. We want to save the lives of people that are inherently unable to save or protect themselves - like babies. For Sarah, it is different and there is a limit to the extent that we make sacrifices to save/protect her.
When the platform collapses, you could have dropped Jane down so she could attempt to save Sarah. But without knowing what would happen when you drop Jane down: she could fal… [view original content]
It was the bad writing that made her a 'bad' character. Telltale failed to make use of the potential of her character, and included scenes like that christmas tree scene. And then that leaf cutting scene, which just made Sarah look bad.
It could have just been replaced with Clem seeing Carver randomly pushing Reggie off a ledge whilst she was working on the fence. And then Carver takes her to his office and gives the 'weakness' speech he always gives her, which then tells the audience that Carver is ruthless, psycopathic, etc.
Also, I'm pretty sure that people attacked Greg and vindicated him because they thought he was making fun of people that were born the way they were.
But people thought that she had mental disabilities that were a result of severe intellectual disabilities resulting from birth or an accide… morent, and that Greg was making fun of this. If I thought he actually did this and had this sentiment for real life people, of course I'd be pissed. But I don't think he does, which is why I disagreed with you.
No they didn't. 2/3 (yes I know this is horribly simplified) forms of autism often do not come with severe behavioural or learning disabilities and autism was the main thing directed at her. I've always said the same thing as the OP and I agree with the anti-greg thread. Noone I know of thinks she is mentally retarded, but she plainly has disabilities.
Also, scenes with Sarah weren't fun or interesting at all after episode 1. They didn't do anything that was interesting or added new facets to her character that endeared her to us.
This was because of bad writing, not because she … [view original content]
No, she wasn't a bad character. Just because you didn't like her character doesn't mean she's a bad character. I don't particularly like kenny or larry, but they're not bad characters. Sarah was a good character with a lot of potential, regardless of whether you loved her or hated her, but it was wasted.
Also, I'm pretty sure that people attacked Greg and vindicated him because they thought he was making fun of people that were born the way they were.
How does this translate to "had mental retardation"? It doesn't. This thread does not destroy anyone's argument. Also I don't think you used "vindicated" correctly there (unless you were referring to his defenders).
It was the bad writing that made her a 'bad' character. Telltale failed to make use of the potential of her character, and included scenes l… moreike that christmas tree scene. And then that leaf cutting scene, which just made Sarah look bad.
It could have just been replaced with Clem seeing Carver randomly pushing Reggie off a ledge whilst she was working on the fence. And then Carver takes her to his office and gives the 'weakness' speech he always gives her, which then tells the audience that Carver is ruthless, psycopathic, etc.
Also, I'm pretty sure that people attacked Greg and vindicated him because they thought he was making fun of people that were born the way they were.
Lol, you're right, I used it wrong. I meant victimise, thanks for that.
I thought she was a bad character in comparison to the rest of the cast. Not because I disliked her but because there was not much to her that made her interesting after you know her. Her relationship with Clem wasn't as interesting as it was with Nick, or Rebecca. I also found Alvin boring. He was concerned about the baby, he was nice to Clem but it was one-note and he didn't have much going on.
For example, Red sweater guy> Sarah>Alvin. I found that guy more interesting because of the whole 'Nick killed his boyfriend' aspect, he was very kind to complete strangers, could still forgive Nick, etc. Way more interesting from his introduction to death.
But like I've said before, they wasted Sarah's potential character development.
No, she wasn't a bad character. Just because you didn't like her character doesn't mean she's a bad character. I don't particularly like ken… moreny or larry, but they're not bad characters. Sarah was a good character with a lot of potential, regardless of whether you loved her or hated her, but it was wasted.
Also, I'm pretty sure that people attacked Greg and vindicated him because they thought he was making fun of people that were born the way they were.
How does this translate to "had mental retardation"? It doesn't. This thread does not destroy anyone's argument. Also I don't think you used "vindicated" correctly there (unless you were referring to his defenders).
"Greg is refusing to acknowledge that his behavior was not only unprofessional but extremely ignorant and offensive. This isn't a matter of "well we disagree so I hate you". This isn't just people's feelings being hurt. Disabled people like Sarah have been physically abused and killed just because they exist. And then Greg comes along, joining the thousands of others who hate her and want her dead because she did exist."
"However, Sarah immediately struck me as someone with a mental disorder precisely because she acts like no ordinary teenager. It's not simply "sheltering" that makes you act like an 8 year old, nor is it implied that Carlos' fear of her "ceasing to function" is an irrational concern. I think the writers were playing it safe by never stating outright that "she's autistic", but providing enough evidence to infer that there's something unusual about her mindset."
"Not to mention that the Nazis killed off disabled people...
You know, like Sarah."
I don't think Nazis intentionally found people with panic/separation disorders and killed them on a massive scale. Then again, I'm not a history professor (oh Lee...), so I could be wrong on that.
And when I saw comments like those, I thought people were angry with Greg because he insulting someone who was born with a mental disability. Not specifically mental retardation, but an impairment that she had to live with since birth/accident.
This is why I disagreed, because I did not think that this was the case. And as this OP has written, it could have been panic/separation disorder. Something Sarah could eventually get better from and cope with, assuming she lived long enough. But as with all zombie shows, something they're standing on always breaks and someone dies.
No, she wasn't a bad character. Just because you didn't like her character doesn't mean she's a bad character. I don't particularly like ken… moreny or larry, but they're not bad characters. Sarah was a good character with a lot of potential, regardless of whether you loved her or hated her, but it was wasted.
Also, I'm pretty sure that people attacked Greg and vindicated him because they thought he was making fun of people that were born the way they were.
How does this translate to "had mental retardation"? It doesn't. This thread does not destroy anyone's argument. Also I don't think you used "vindicated" correctly there (unless you were referring to his defenders).
But people thought that she had mental disabilities that were a result of severe intellectual disabilities resulting from birth or an accide… morent, and that Greg was making fun of this. If I thought he actually did this and had this sentiment for real life people, of course I'd be pissed. But I don't think he does, which is why I disagreed with you.
Here, it is the result of Carlos' coddling. The problem is her inability to adapt to the zombie apocalypse, and requiring other characters we care about, including Clem, to risk their lives in order to save hers. We want to save the lives of people that are inherently unable to save or protect themselves - like babies. For Sarah, it is different and there is a limit to the extent that we make sacrifices to save/protect her.
When the platform collapses, you could have dropped Jane down so she could attempt to save Sarah. But without knowing what would happen when you drop Jane down: she could fal… [view original content]
Sarah had so much potential but oh my fucking god Telltale was too lazy to develop such an interesting character. Of course the feels and al… morel the overrated bullshit and junk get in the way of innovational writing and origination. Such ingeniousness was non-compensable. WHY, TELLTALE? GG FUCKING WP I AM FUCKING DONE
Yeah, you still didn't address the nazi comments. They clearly implied that Sarah had a severe mental disability, which I disagree with.
I already said birth/accident.
She wasn't that great of a character. The story/characters in this season started going downhill in episode 3, even in episode 2, so taking it seriously is pretty difficult. So not only is she a fictional character, she is a fictional charcter in a game that is now bad in terms of gameplay and story. Hating characters and laughing at their deaths becomes ok when they're shoddy characters in a shoddy narrative. Like a crappy b horror movie.
Similarly, your choices also lack any real effect in the game, so the inevitable deaths are also pretty annoying. Not only does Sarah die, but Rebecca dies right afterwards. And I've already seen 'pregnant woman in zombie apocalypse dying' trope twice. Addition of russians did not make the story any more compelling.
So now you have shoddy, uncompelling game with mediocre gameplay and characters. Really makes it hard to get serious over something like this.
People at your Shame post exaggerated what Greg and Telltale did, accusing them of essentially hating disabled people, when I very much doubt that is the case. This is the major problem I have with people at your post. Some people playing weren't even aware she had a disability, and thought her child-like behaviour was due to excessive coddling by Carlos. I'm not even sure she even had a panic disorder, since her behaviours could just be due being sheltered and then having to experience seriously fucked up things. Running away screaming when your only family dies is not that much of an aberration in zombie apocalypse behaviour.
OP believes that Sarah's disabilities were exacerbated by Carlos' coddling. I don't.
and even if they were, they're still disabilities. Whether she was born that way or not. Reggie wasn't born with one arm. But he's still disabled.
Yeah, you still didn't address the nazi comments. They clearly implied that Sarah had a severe mental disability, which I disagree with.
… moreI already said birth/accident.
She wasn't that great of a character. The story/characters in this season started going downhill in episode 3, even in episode 2, so taking it seriously is pretty difficult. So not only is she a fictional character, she is a fictional charcter in a game that is now bad in terms of gameplay and story. Hating characters and laughing at their deaths becomes ok when they're shoddy characters in a shoddy narrative. Like a crappy b horror movie.
Similarly, your choices also lack any real effect in the game, so the inevitable deaths are also pretty annoying. Not only does Sarah die, but Rebecca dies right afterwards. And I've already seen 'pregnant woman in zombie apocalypse dying' trope twice. Addition of russians did not make the story any more compelling.
So now you hav… [view original content]
OP believes that Sarah's disabilities were exacerbated by Carlos' coddling. I don't.
and even if they were, they're still disabilities. Whether she was born that way or not. Reggie wasn't born with one arm. But he's still disabled.
I was very disappointed with how Telltale treated Sarah's character. It just felt way too cursory and one-dimensional... Even Mika and Lizzie from the television show were better developed characters than Sarah was, and the TV show is pretty mediocre at times (and those two little girls weren't the greatest of actors by any means).
I just felt like there was nothing more to her than she had problems and would have panic attacks/"cease to function." There was little sign of her growing or becoming stronger, little sign of her even possibly turning a new leaf and maybe adapting some to her new circumstances. It just seemed like TTG made her as annoying as possible so most people would want her to die. Doing so had the opposite effect on me.
Out of all the characters (besides Clem), I wanted Sarah to survive somehow so she could grow stronger and prove all the doubters and haters wrong. Maybe she wouldn't be a badass like Clem, but I thought they could at least give her a moment or two where she does something remarkable that helps/saves the group. But, as has been pointed out about the Greg Miller interview, apparently TTG couldn't wait to be rid of her, so fuck character development, I guess... =/
Yep. I slapped her to save her. Felt kinda bad about it, but unlike so many others, I did it because I WANTED her to make it.
Was very disappointed to have TTG pull the rug out from under us just a few moments later... As with many other characters this season, felt like they wasted the chance to do something interesting with her character. Instead, Carver's "survival of the fittest" and Jane's "lone wolf" bullshit prevailed and being an uncaring asshole is the best way to live seems to be what TTG wants us to take away from this season... =/
The major difference between how Carol treated Lizzie in the TV show and how TTG treats Sarah in this season is that, at least in Carol's case, she did EVERYTHING (and more) that she could do to try to help Lizzie. When it finally came time for Lizzie to "look at the flowers," you could tell it tore Carol (and Tyreese) up inside to have to give up on her. In contrast, TTG's characters only acted annoyed by Sarah and seemed not to give two shits about her once she was finally out of their hair.
I don't think it would have been necessary for her to have some huge heroic moment. All I expected from Telltale's writing this episode was for them to continue to treat her as fairly and importantly as she had been prior to this episode. She didn't have to change dramatically from her former self or have some out of the blue badass moment. I would have been happy enough for her to have been treated as sympathetically and honestly as I thought they had in the past.
I was very disappointed with how Telltale treated Sarah's character. It just felt way too cursory and one-dimensional... Even Mika and Lizzi… moree from the television show were better developed characters than Sarah was, and the TV show is pretty mediocre at times (and those two little girls weren't the greatest of actors by any means).
I just felt like there was nothing more to her than she had problems and would have panic attacks/"cease to function." There was little sign of her growing or becoming stronger, little sign of her even possibly turning a new leaf and maybe adapting some to her new circumstances. It just seemed like TTG made her as annoying as possible so most people would want her to die. Doing so had the opposite effect on me.
Out of all the characters (besides Clem), I wanted Sarah to survive somehow so she could grow stronger and prove all the doubters and haters wrong. Maybe she wouldn't be a badass like Clem, but I thoug… [view original content]
When I say a moment where she does something remarkable that helps save the group, I didn't necessarily mean something totally bad ass or heroic. I just meant that maybe she has some talent or knowledge that she picked up from somebody in the past that helps them escape a tight spot, or gives them a new way of looking at their situation.
Hard for me to think of an example, but just imagine they get trapped in a hospital or something and maybe Sarah recognizes some kind of medical tool that can help them escape or something.
I don't think it would have been necessary for her to have some huge heroic moment. All I expected from Telltale's writing this episode was … morefor them to continue to treat her as fairly and importantly as she had been prior to this episode. She didn't have to change dramatically from her former self or have some out of the blue badass moment. I would have been happy enough for her to have been treated as sympathetically and honestly as I thought they had in the past.
Oh I agree, at first I just thought that you wanted Sarah to suddenly turn into some badass zombie killer or something. It's not that I don't think she should have had a chance to be heroic, imo it would have been a bad thing to suddenly erase all signs of her disability by trying to change her into something she's not. I actually think it would have been interesting for her to have some innate talent that helps the group, like you said. It would have been a great way to balance Jane's negativity and insistence that she has no chance for survival or any worth.
and also, the fact that her dad was a doctor should have been noticed too. Sarah was a bookworm, and I'm sure that she would have picked up random bits of knowledge from her dad. Whether he told her directly or not.
When I say a moment where she does something remarkable that helps save the group, I didn't necessarily mean something totally bad ass or he… moreroic. I just meant that maybe she has some talent or knowledge that she picked up from somebody in the past that helps them escape a tight spot, or gives them a new way of looking at their situation.
Hard for me to think of an example, but just imagine they get trapped in a hospital or something and maybe Sarah recognizes some kind of medical tool that can help them escape or something.
I meant that only the separation anxiety disorder had been indeed caused by her father's coddling and sheltering, it is not uncommon for children who are subject to that treatment to develop this condition. It's safe to say that from what we've seen from Carlos' interactions with her, that she developed that particular condition because of him.
The panic disorder, though, could have been influenced by genetics. It is still a highly treatable condition, and even in the apocalypse, choosing to shelter Sarah was far from the right decision for Carlos to make. Keeping her from the new world would only serve to make the shock she'll experience when she inevitably had to face reality all the more severe. In those two years they were alive during the apocalypse, a lot could have been done to help her adapt to this new world. She could have been introduced to it slowly, not brutally as she was in EP3 and 4. It would have helped her immensely.
Had Carlos made the right choice at the beginning of the ZA, it was entirely possible for us to have met a completely different Sarah.
OP believes that Sarah's disabilities were exacerbated by Carlos' coddling. I don't.
and even if they were, they're still disabilities. Whether she was born that way or not. Reggie wasn't born with one arm. But he's still disabled.
She has a mental disability. The only one that comes close to making your point is the second one and if all you have is one example then my point stands.
"Greg is refusing to acknowledge that his behavior was not only unprofessional but extremely ignorant and offensive. This isn't a matter of … more"well we disagree so I hate you". This isn't just people's feelings being hurt. Disabled people like Sarah have been physically abused and killed just because they exist. And then Greg comes along, joining the thousands of others who hate her and want her dead because she did exist."
"However, Sarah immediately struck me as someone with a mental disorder precisely because she acts like no ordinary teenager. It's not simply "sheltering" that makes you act like an 8 year old, nor is it implied that Carlos' fear of her "ceasing to function" is an irrational concern. I think the writers were playing it safe by never stating outright that "she's autistic", but providing enough evidence to infer that there's something unusual about her mindset."
"Not to mention that the Nazis killed off disabled people...… [view original content]
Also, I've made it pretty clear that she is a bad character caused by bad writing.
I've made it pretty clear that the story is also crappy, making the overall game a joke.
I've made it clear that several people thought Greg was making fun of people with severe mental impairment.
And I didn't she was disabled at all; it was initially a faint possibility but it was never brought up as a theme in itself. Sarah's 'condition' was never clearly explained at all, if she ever had one. Besides knowing she was sheltered, we had to infer based on what her video game character does; and her behaviours could be attributed to being coddled and treated like a child.
Remember Carley? And her fucking ridiculous radio/battery problem? Or what about Ben taking out the axe that blocking the door full of zombies? Or how Jane and Luke just suddenly wanted to do the deed DESPITE HAVING JUST ESCAPED A HERD OF ZOMBIES?! OH AND LUKE CLEARLY INJURED HIS RIBS TOO! Or what about Kenny surviving that horde of zombies that had surrounded, when people being approached by 1 or 2 zombies immediately get bitten?
We don't think of them as being mentally impaired, but instead we see them as really freaking stupid, odd, unrealistic acts that we simply accept as stupid written situations by Telltale's writers. Similarly, we can attribute various behaviours that Sarah exhibits as being coddled or just being really stupid writing decisions by Telltale.
I find it hard to believe that Carver, who kills Reggie for being weak and incompetent, fails to kill Sarah right afterwards. Themes of having to survive with disabled people or disabled people coping with the zombie apocalypse isn't explored at all.
Instead it becomes Jane's story about the will to fight and live on, and how those that can't do that will die. Slapping Sarah saves her life, great, but then she dies again anyways. So there wasn't much point to saving her in the first place, and so the theme becomes a moot point because you can randomly die in zombie apocalypse.
Also I doubt that I would be able to persuade you either way.
She has a mental disability. The only one that comes close to making your point is the second one and if all you have is one example then my point stands.
All I took from it was she had an extreme anxiety disorder, and because Carlos always sheltered her it made her moments of fear that much more stressful.
I am a student of psychology too and thought the same. But I'm still not over her death. That carlos is an Idiot was clearly shown in episode 1 and it wouldnt be better in the next episode. Dat idiot. At this rate a mentaly breakdown was programmed for sarah. Her death breaks my heart...and it fcking hurts me that nobody cares about her death(I mean the characters)... -.-
But we should analyzed more Clementines character. She's much more interesting in my opinion.
Comments
Panic disorder is a disability.
Sarah had so much potential but oh my fucking god Telltale was too lazy to develop such an interesting character. Of course the feels and all the overrated bullshit and junk get in the way of innovational writing and origination. Such ingeniousness was non-compensable. WHY, TELLTALE? GG FUCKING WP I AM FUCKING DONE
Let me add onto that.
OP's words, not mine.
But people thought that she had mental disabilities that were a result of severe intellectual disabilities resulting from birth or an accident, and that Greg was making fun of this. If I thought he actually did this and had this sentiment for real life people, of course I'd be pissed. But I don't think he does, which is why I disagreed with you.
Here, it is the result of Carlos' coddling. The problem is her inability to adapt to the zombie apocalypse, and requiring other characters we care about, including Clem, to risk their lives in order to save hers. We want to save the lives of people that are inherently unable to save or protect themselves - like babies. For Sarah, it is different and there is a limit to the extent that we make sacrifices to save/protect her.
When the platform collapses, you could have dropped Jane down so she could attempt to save Sarah. But without knowing what would happen when you drop Jane down: she could fall and break her leg, or her arm or hurt her head; and both Jane and Sarah could have died. Also, the debris appeared to be too heavy to lift off by a single person.
Choosing to pull Jane up is ok because the risks would have been too great. We also like Jane AND she contributes to the group's welfare, especially Clem's safety.
But of course, in classic telltale fashion, she dies regardless of our choices. Also, as its been said countless times, the other characters move on without a care. Its puts you out of the experience. It reminds you that it is a game that has wonky writing as well as mediocre gameplay; which is a big problem because these games were great because of the storytelling. It reminds that its just a game, and that its not a game worth getting emotional about because Clem is probably going to survive.
Also, Kenny vs Luke is annoying.
Also, scenes with Sarah weren't fun or interesting at all after episode 1. They didn't do anything that was interesting or added new facets to her character that endeared her to us. Nick was barely in episode 3 and was still more endearing. And Red sweater guy was even more endearing than Nick in my opinion, considering he also saves Nick's life (based on certain choices you make), which makes him more interesting than Sarah.
No they didn't. 2/3 (yes I know this is horribly simplified) forms of autism often do not come with severe behavioural or learning disabilities and autism was the main thing directed at her. I've always said the same thing as the OP and I agree with the anti-greg thread. Noone I know of thinks she is mentally retarded, but she plainly has disabilities.
This was because of bad writing, not because she was a hopeless character. I think we ALL regret her neglect as a character. That's part of the issue we had. She's "that abnormal girl" as far as the story cared, that's her character and that's part of the problem.
It was the bad writing that made her a 'bad' character. Telltale failed to make use of the potential of her character, and included scenes like that christmas tree scene. And then that leaf cutting scene, which just made Sarah look bad.
It could have just been replaced with Clem seeing Carver randomly pushing Reggie off a ledge whilst she was working on the fence. And then Carver takes her to his office and gives the 'weakness' speech he always gives her, which then tells the audience that Carver is ruthless, psycopathic, etc.
Also, I'm pretty sure that people attacked Greg and vindicated him because they thought he was making fun of people that were born the way they were.
No, she wasn't a bad character. Just because you didn't like her character doesn't mean she's a bad character. I don't particularly like kenny or larry, but they're not bad characters. Sarah was a good character with a lot of potential, regardless of whether you loved her or hated her, but it was wasted.
How does this translate to "had mental retardation"? It doesn't. This thread does not destroy anyone's argument. Also I don't think you used "vindicated" correctly there (unless you were referring to his defenders).
Lol, you're right, I used it wrong. I meant victimise, thanks for that.
I thought she was a bad character in comparison to the rest of the cast. Not because I disliked her but because there was not much to her that made her interesting after you know her. Her relationship with Clem wasn't as interesting as it was with Nick, or Rebecca. I also found Alvin boring. He was concerned about the baby, he was nice to Clem but it was one-note and he didn't have much going on.
For example, Red sweater guy> Sarah>Alvin. I found that guy more interesting because of the whole 'Nick killed his boyfriend' aspect, he was very kind to complete strangers, could still forgive Nick, etc. Way more interesting from his introduction to death.
But like I've said before, they wasted Sarah's potential character development.
"Greg is refusing to acknowledge that his behavior was not only unprofessional but extremely ignorant and offensive. This isn't a matter of "well we disagree so I hate you". This isn't just people's feelings being hurt. Disabled people like Sarah have been physically abused and killed just because they exist. And then Greg comes along, joining the thousands of others who hate her and want her dead because she did exist."
"However, Sarah immediately struck me as someone with a mental disorder precisely because she acts like no ordinary teenager. It's not simply "sheltering" that makes you act like an 8 year old, nor is it implied that Carlos' fear of her "ceasing to function" is an irrational concern. I think the writers were playing it safe by never stating outright that "she's autistic", but providing enough evidence to infer that there's something unusual about her mindset."
"Not to mention that the Nazis killed off disabled people...
You know, like Sarah."
I don't think Nazis intentionally found people with panic/separation disorders and killed them on a massive scale. Then again, I'm not a history professor (oh Lee...), so I could be wrong on that.
And when I saw comments like those, I thought people were angry with Greg because he insulting someone who was born with a mental disability. Not specifically mental retardation, but an impairment that she had to live with since birth/accident.
This is why I disagreed, because I did not think that this was the case. And as this OP has written, it could have been panic/separation disorder. Something Sarah could eventually get better from and cope with, assuming she lived long enough. But as with all zombie shows, something they're standing on always breaks and someone dies.
OP believes that Sarah's disabilities were exacerbated by Carlos' coddling. I don't.
and even if they were, they're still disabilities. Whether she was born that way or not. Reggie wasn't born with one arm. But he's still disabled.
It just makes me feel sick how people curse at god...
"oh my f****** God"
I mean,what damn logic is this?
Yeah, you still didn't address the nazi comments. They clearly implied that Sarah had a severe mental disability, which I disagree with.
I already said birth/accident.
She wasn't that great of a character. The story/characters in this season started going downhill in episode 3, even in episode 2, so taking it seriously is pretty difficult. So not only is she a fictional character, she is a fictional charcter in a game that is now bad in terms of gameplay and story. Hating characters and laughing at their deaths becomes ok when they're shoddy characters in a shoddy narrative. Like a crappy b horror movie.
Similarly, your choices also lack any real effect in the game, so the inevitable deaths are also pretty annoying. Not only does Sarah die, but Rebecca dies right afterwards. And I've already seen 'pregnant woman in zombie apocalypse dying' trope twice. Addition of russians did not make the story any more compelling.
So now you have shoddy, uncompelling game with mediocre gameplay and characters. Really makes it hard to get serious over something like this.
People at your Shame post exaggerated what Greg and Telltale did, accusing them of essentially hating disabled people, when I very much doubt that is the case. This is the major problem I have with people at your post. Some people playing weren't even aware she had a disability, and thought her child-like behaviour was due to excessive coddling by Carlos. I'm not even sure she even had a panic disorder, since her behaviours could just be due being sheltered and then having to experience seriously fucked up things. Running away screaming when your only family dies is not that much of an aberration in zombie apocalypse behaviour.
Um if you want to discuss my thread how about you do it over there?
Lol, is it just me or did they remove downvotes?
Now I won't know how many people disagree/dislike me.
Oh wait, I guess that was probably the point.
Nah trolls were abusing it and going as far as making secondary accounts to down vote others.
Lol, these threads are kind of connected. Also, I already posted there several times.
New places, new faces, new threads to post in.
I was very disappointed with how Telltale treated Sarah's character. It just felt way too cursory and one-dimensional... Even Mika and Lizzie from the television show were better developed characters than Sarah was, and the TV show is pretty mediocre at times (and those two little girls weren't the greatest of actors by any means).
I just felt like there was nothing more to her than she had problems and would have panic attacks/"cease to function." There was little sign of her growing or becoming stronger, little sign of her even possibly turning a new leaf and maybe adapting some to her new circumstances. It just seemed like TTG made her as annoying as possible so most people would want her to die. Doing so had the opposite effect on me.
Out of all the characters (besides Clem), I wanted Sarah to survive somehow so she could grow stronger and prove all the doubters and haters wrong. Maybe she wouldn't be a badass like Clem, but I thought they could at least give her a moment or two where she does something remarkable that helps/saves the group. But, as has been pointed out about the Greg Miller interview, apparently TTG couldn't wait to be rid of her, so fuck character development, I guess... =/
Yep. I slapped her to save her. Felt kinda bad about it, but unlike so many others, I did it because I WANTED her to make it.
Was very disappointed to have TTG pull the rug out from under us just a few moments later... As with many other characters this season, felt like they wasted the chance to do something interesting with her character. Instead, Carver's "survival of the fittest" and Jane's "lone wolf" bullshit prevailed and being an uncaring asshole is the best way to live seems to be what TTG wants us to take away from this season... =/
The major difference between how Carol treated Lizzie in the TV show and how TTG treats Sarah in this season is that, at least in Carol's case, she did EVERYTHING (and more) that she could do to try to help Lizzie. When it finally came time for Lizzie to "look at the flowers," you could tell it tore Carol (and Tyreese) up inside to have to give up on her. In contrast, TTG's characters only acted annoyed by Sarah and seemed not to give two shits about her once she was finally out of their hair.
I don't think it would have been necessary for her to have some huge heroic moment. All I expected from Telltale's writing this episode was for them to continue to treat her as fairly and importantly as she had been prior to this episode. She didn't have to change dramatically from her former self or have some out of the blue badass moment. I would have been happy enough for her to have been treated as sympathetically and honestly as I thought they had in the past.
When I say a moment where she does something remarkable that helps save the group, I didn't necessarily mean something totally bad ass or heroic. I just meant that maybe she has some talent or knowledge that she picked up from somebody in the past that helps them escape a tight spot, or gives them a new way of looking at their situation.
Hard for me to think of an example, but just imagine they get trapped in a hospital or something and maybe Sarah recognizes some kind of medical tool that can help them escape or something.
Oh I agree, at first I just thought that you wanted Sarah to suddenly turn into some badass zombie killer or something. It's not that I don't think she should have had a chance to be heroic, imo it would have been a bad thing to suddenly erase all signs of her disability by trying to change her into something she's not. I actually think it would have been interesting for her to have some innate talent that helps the group, like you said. It would have been a great way to balance Jane's negativity and insistence that she has no chance for survival or any worth.
and also, the fact that her dad was a doctor should have been noticed too. Sarah was a bookworm, and I'm sure that she would have picked up random bits of knowledge from her dad. Whether he told her directly or not.
@TT247
I meant that only the separation anxiety disorder had been indeed caused by her father's coddling and sheltering, it is not uncommon for children who are subject to that treatment to develop this condition. It's safe to say that from what we've seen from Carlos' interactions with her, that she developed that particular condition because of him.
The panic disorder, though, could have been influenced by genetics. It is still a highly treatable condition, and even in the apocalypse, choosing to shelter Sarah was far from the right decision for Carlos to make. Keeping her from the new world would only serve to make the shock she'll experience when she inevitably had to face reality all the more severe. In those two years they were alive during the apocalypse, a lot could have been done to help her adapt to this new world. She could have been introduced to it slowly, not brutally as she was in EP3 and 4. It would have helped her immensely.
Had Carlos made the right choice at the beginning of the ZA, it was entirely possible for us to have met a completely different Sarah.
She has a mental disability. The only one that comes close to making your point is the second one and if all you have is one example then my point stands.
And what was your point?
Also, I've made it pretty clear that she is a bad character caused by bad writing.
I've made it pretty clear that the story is also crappy, making the overall game a joke.
I've made it clear that several people thought Greg was making fun of people with severe mental impairment.
And I didn't she was disabled at all; it was initially a faint possibility but it was never brought up as a theme in itself. Sarah's 'condition' was never clearly explained at all, if she ever had one. Besides knowing she was sheltered, we had to infer based on what her video game character does; and her behaviours could be attributed to being coddled and treated like a child.
Remember Carley? And her fucking ridiculous radio/battery problem? Or what about Ben taking out the axe that blocking the door full of zombies? Or how Jane and Luke just suddenly wanted to do the deed DESPITE HAVING JUST ESCAPED A HERD OF ZOMBIES?! OH AND LUKE CLEARLY INJURED HIS RIBS TOO! Or what about Kenny surviving that horde of zombies that had surrounded, when people being approached by 1 or 2 zombies immediately get bitten?
We don't think of them as being mentally impaired, but instead we see them as really freaking stupid, odd, unrealistic acts that we simply accept as stupid written situations by Telltale's writers. Similarly, we can attribute various behaviours that Sarah exhibits as being coddled or just being really stupid writing decisions by Telltale.
I find it hard to believe that Carver, who kills Reggie for being weak and incompetent, fails to kill Sarah right afterwards. Themes of having to survive with disabled people or disabled people coping with the zombie apocalypse isn't explored at all.
Instead it becomes Jane's story about the will to fight and live on, and how those that can't do that will die. Slapping Sarah saves her life, great, but then she dies again anyways. So there wasn't much point to saving her in the first place, and so the theme becomes a moot point because you can randomly die in zombie apocalypse.
Also I doubt that I would be able to persuade you either way.
But hey, YMMV.
All I took from it was she had an extreme anxiety disorder, and because Carlos always sheltered her it made her moments of fear that much more stressful.
I am a student of psychology too and thought the same. But I'm still not over her death. That carlos is an Idiot was clearly shown in episode 1 and it wouldnt be better in the next episode. Dat idiot. At this rate a mentaly breakdown was programmed for sarah. Her death breaks my heart...and it fcking hurts me that nobody cares about her death(I mean the characters)... -.-
But we should analyzed more Clementines character. She's much more interesting in my opinion.
Does downvoting even do anything?
Well other than cause others to disregard a persons legitimate opinion, being labeled as a troll, and cause others to rage no.
If someone disregarded my post just because it had downvotes then that person's opinion is not going to be worth anything anyway.