The Dark Side of Loyalty
It's interesting what happens when people like characters, become loyal to them, then Telltale tests that loyalty when those characters do terrible things. Often people justify and defend the character, no matter how atrocious their actions, instead of criticizing them. Loyalty is more important than right or wrong. People bend the truth far to protect characters they like. After a player makes up their mind about a character, then they look for evidence to support their opinion, rather than evaluate actions for what they are, good or bad.
Here are some examples. It's ok if people don't see them the same way. It's more an exercise in thinking about whether people view actions differently based on who does them, rather than based on the action itself.
If one of the Russians had grabbed Clem and held her hostage, threatening to kill her unless Clem's group surrendered, people would have wanted the Russians dead. In contrast, Kenny grabbed Arvo, a kid who had just lost his sister, was probably forced to lead the Russians to Clem's group, and wasn't trying to attack Clem's group. When Kenny threatened to kill him, it's no big deal, just Kenny protecting the group. If Clem had been forced to betray her group, then someone kidnapper her, stole her supplies, then beat her, everyone would hate them. But when Kenny did it to Arvo, he was just on edge, thinking of the baby, so it was ok.
Another example is that people still like Mike and Bonnie, even though they were going to steal the supplies, steal the truck Kenny fixed, and leave Clem (maybe), Kenny, Jane, and AJ behind to die. Even after Arvo shot Clem and Mike and Bonnie left her to bleed to death, people still like them. If someone outside the group had done that, people would want them dead.
There are many examples like this, where characters in the group do unforgivable things that would not be tolerated by outsiders ... and then players justify and forgive them because they're loyal and like them. Whether you agree with the specific examples or not, were you loyal no matter what in TWD? Did you turn on people based on their actions? Is whether an action right or wrong in TWD based on who does it rather than what they do?
Comments
Alright I want to start out by saying that this is a deep OP, man.
I judge people by what they do and the things they say. Whether there part of the 'group' doesn't really factor into it. I may be overly loyal to Kenny because no matter what you do he saves Lee at the end of S1e1, I can admit that... but I don't overlook his mistakes either. If he screws up I choose the option to tell him he screwed up if there is one. If his plan is stupid I tell him his plan is stupid if I can.
As far as morality is concerned, the zombie apocalypse makes everything kind of blurry on the good/bad spectrum. But if someone is trying to directly screw over my character or someone I trust, yeah, FUCK that person.
I was loyal to Jane despite pushing Kenny's to the last straw.
Honestly, when I started season 2 I was determined to stay with Kenny till the end. In EP. 3 it really tested my feelings about him. I felt really unsure of who he would be. So, I decided that if I had to choose between Luke and Kenny, I would choose Luke. I evaluated both characters actions despite my bias to like Kenny and want to be with Kenny more.
By Ep. 4, I was 100% Team Luke. I still liked Kenny, but I felt safer with Luke. By the end, I didn't care what happened to either of them. I was coming onto the, Mike and Bonnie Train.
But as EP. 5 progressed, and Luke ... passed ... and it became clear that the group was tearing, I wasn't sure what I'd do. Then after Bonnie's reaction to Luke, and Kennys conversation with Clem, I could see Kenny is coming back to us. He's realizing his mistakes, regretful of them, but still his typical stubborn self. I've come to see that Kenny will do ANYTHING to protect the ones her loves. And Kenny, NEEDS people to survive. They give him a meaning to live. Just look at the facts! Is this me saying Kenny is some selfless, god like savior? No. I'm saying he's just the type of man who found that when he had people he loved around him, he had a reason to live in the apocalypse after all.
So, in conclusion, I was Team Kenny, Team Luke, Team Bonnie/Mike, Team Luke, Team Kenny.
I was loyal to the people who seemed to treat Clem the best and others as well. In the end, I was loyal to the people who needed Clem the most. Kenny. So, yes, if things had turned out different, I would've chosen Luke. I would've gone with Luke to where ever, and left Kenny. But Kenny redeemed himself in my eyes. Not 100%, but enough to where I could like him again.
So, I wasn't blindly loyal. I definitely thought about this game more than I should've. Lost more sleep than I should've. But this game has become more than a game to me. It's crazy how much so many things in this game parallel to my own life, and how I make decisions. I'm a dork. I overanylze. But there ya go.
I'm glad that TTG did this. That they tested it vastly in ep 5. It was so much happening that** #MyClem would want them just to stop this craziness sit down and talk it over or something.**
But no. You are tested left and right and you have to act in split of the second while being shot, while freezing. I think that was pretty mature decision from TTG and I stand behind #MyClem as she recognizes that after all, Jane did show her how Kenny is broken down and that this end is happy end for him, release. And forgave Jane as she showed her also how much she care about her (to even let herself to get killed).
So yes, Dark side of loayalty is the perfect headline.
I think that's the whole point. How far are you willing to put up with and justify someones actions because of your relationship (and possible history) with said character? Its the ugly truth that loyalty is a huge factor in determining who you can trust, and its up to the player to decide how far that goes.
I don't so much "like" Bonnie and Mike as I do understand their feelings of being scared of Kenny and wanting to get away from him. I'm just surprised that they tried to leave Clem with him as well and causing a scene instead of forcing the underlying issue at hand from a neutral standpoint. Kenny was obviously unstable, but sneaking off in the middle of the night with all the supplies was not the answer.
I can't even completely blame Arvo for his actions, considering he came within inches of death at Kenny's hands, and despite our attempts to appeal and apologize to him, he still probably sees Clem as bad as Kenny (seeing as Clem doesn't get a chance to have a full conversation with him throughout the episode, which probably would have done wonders to relieve his tension around her). I don't have to like him, hell he even shot Clem with little provocation, but I can take a step back and see where his line of thinking probably leads to.
I do agree with you, though. People will bend over backwards to defend a characters actions, no matter how atrocious. Wait a minute. Isn't that exactly what characters in universe were doing for Carver back in episode 3? Hmm....
Well yeah. You can't be objective when you love.
You could argue this is the dark side, but I think it is also the bright side of loyalty. To me the beauty of loyalty is to see the good in people even when they are monsters, to know the good side of them and know that they can redeem themselves, and eventually by sticking to them they will, and that kind of emotional reward is really the best kind of experience with this game.
You don't have to choose a side that often in real life because real life don't contain so much drama, but I think in fictional world I'd be happy to stay loyal to someone no matter what they do or become, in the end I think I really value loyalty above morality.
But what if you actually see that person is beyond saving?
This idea that the truth is bent to support and protect the people you care about is true to some. Loyalty is sometimes seen to be just about sticking with someone to the end, never forsaking them even if there are better options out there. However, there is more to loyalty than persistence. In my view, loyalty is also about looking out for that person and preventing them from crossing a point of no return. It's not about one person being the dominant one (decision-making etc) and the other being the one that simply sticks with them. It's a level playing-field, where the need and the obligation to look out for and protect each other is mutual. That also includes protecting the person from themselves. If the person you are loyal to is on a dark path, it is an obligation for you to do all that you can to pull them back.
The place that confuses people is where to draw the line. At what point do you leave the person to themselves; at what point do you throw in the towel and say that you did all you could? Personally, I think that if that person is truly beyond saving (which I don't necessarily believe is true), then you putting them out of their misery is a right thing to do, because no one should suffer like that.
In regards to the original post, the idea that the truth can be bent in favour of those who you are loyal to is a dangerous fact of life. People will naturally ignore some bad parts of someone's character if they are close to them, which can lead to an uncomfortable choice between Loyalty and Morality.
In terms of Loyalty vs Morality, what should always come first is morality. It's better to do the right thing instead of doing something that someone you're close to wants to do. That's because wants and needs aren't constant in terms of morality, and in desperate times, most people would want to do something evil/malicious if that meant that they survived. Of course, in an imperfect world, this view is almost impossible to exercise in day-to-day life, but at least in a fictional universe you can.
There is no black and white, only shades of grey within every person. Are Mike and Bonnie completely evil to do what they did? No. Was their action a bad thing? Yes. Was Arvo completely evil? No. Was shooting Clem a shitty thing to do? Yes.
But he saw Clem put down his sister just a day before. No matter who you are, when you see your family member been shot like that in front of your eyes, you harbor some sort of bitter feelings to that person regardless of circumstances because family is family. When Lilly was on edge, still depressed and paranoid over her dad's death she shot Carley/Doug. But, it doesn't make her a completely evil person.
Yes, we judge other people for doing certain bad things that we consider immoral, but when our love ones did the same thing, we found ways to bend our morals in order to defend them.