Yes, she was. She didn't give us the right to go with who we wanted. She took it upon herself to do what she thought was right and didn't even take Clem's opinion into consideration. She manipulated her into shooting a long time friend. That's the whole point of what she did. She engineered a situation where it would be okay for her to murder Kenny or make him go mad to the point of Clementine becoming frightened and killing him instead. Something she determinantly does. She knew for a fact Clementine would be pissed off when she saw the baby alive and would go with the guy who would bash people's faces to protect her. Not the woman who put a baby at risk and indirectly tried to murder someone to prove her own point.
I could flip that around and say that you simply became Kenny's toy instead. Jane was not manipulative, contrary to popular belief... She was simply the only one with the balls to say what everyone was thinking. Sometimes the truth hurts.
I gotta admit i shoot him in my first playtrhough and then rewinded to see Kenny's ending. but 'cause i wanted to see both endings i would choose the one that i like the most, and the best imo is staying at Wellington.
I was mad at her until I caught on, fairly quickly, that it was a trick. I knew she didnt kill the baby so I tried to have Clem break up the fight. That didnt go so well. Clem got knocked around quite a bit.
He was a good guy who could not control his rage there was no way I was letting him take that baby so I was mad for a second when Jane clued Clem in that something was up but it had to be done.
Whether she considered Clem's opinion or not is actually determinant - before the fight with Kenny, there are numerous opportunities for Clementine to say that she thinks Kenny is getting worse. If this is the case, then Jane actually does take Clem's choice into consideration when she fights Kenny.
On the other hand, if you don't agree with her, then it could just be a case of Jane wanting to protect Clem by killing what she perceives to be a threat to her - specifically, she thinks that because of Kenny's violent and unstable nature, one day he'll turn on Clem and either seriously harm or kill her. This is understandable given how Kenny's sanity (in my opinion, at least) looked like it was dropping rapidly over the past few episodes.
Jane repeatedly told Clem not to get involved in the fight with Kenny. Whether or not Clem chooses to ignore her is up to the player - if you did get involved, that was on you, not Jane.
As for the baby being in danger, I actually doubt she was in any danger at all. It was almost certainly just as cold inside the car as it would have been outside, and even if walkers did notice the baby (a highly unlikely event) they wouldn't have been able to get to him before one of the group came along and rescued him. Even then, I genuinely believe that the baby would have been in even more danger if Kenny had survived, given his anger issues.
Yes, she was. She didn't give us the right to go with who we wanted. She took it upon herself to do what she thought was right and didn't ev… moreen take Clem's opinion into consideration. She manipulated her into shooting a long time friend. That's the whole point of what she did. She engineered a situation where it would be okay for her to murder Kenny or make him go mad to the point of Clementine becoming frightened and killing him instead. Something she determinantly does. She knew for a fact Clementine would be pissed off when she saw the baby alive and would go with the guy who would bash people's faces to protect her. Not the woman who put a baby at risk and indirectly tried to murder someone to prove her own point.
She is manipulative.
I shot him because I/Clem believed Jane when she said AJ died in an accident and thought Kenny was way out of line. I then proceeded to tell Jane to fuck off once the truth came out.
But that's just the point I'm trying to make. If Clementine wanted to be with Kenny, Jane is no one to get in her way. She did so because she wanted her for herself and even if you hate Kenny the game forces the idea that Clementine still cares about him. Something that turns out to be true. We see her crying her eyes out when he died. So? Clementine could've easily changed her mind. Jane, for that very reason, tried to get rid of Kenny as soon as she could.
Oh, he was in danger. The area was infected with walkers. Additionally, there are all kinds of bandits and parasites that could have taken AJ. The fight took a while.
Taking Clem's opinion into consideration would be:
"Clem, I think this is the end. What do you think we should do with him?"
Or
"Clementine, I'm outta here! Decide now who you're coming with!"
Whether she considered Clem's opinion or not is actually determinant - before the fight with Kenny, there are numerous opportunities for Cle… morementine to say that she thinks Kenny is getting worse. If this is the case, then Jane actually does take Clem's choice into consideration when she fights Kenny.
On the other hand, if you don't agree with her, then it could just be a case of Jane wanting to protect Clem by killing what she perceives to be a threat to her - specifically, she thinks that because of Kenny's violent and unstable nature, one day he'll turn on Clem and either seriously harm or kill her. This is understandable given how Kenny's sanity (in my opinion, at least) looked like it was dropping rapidly over the past few episodes.
Jane repeatedly told Clem not to get involved in the fight with Kenny. Whether or not Clem chooses to ignore her is up to the player - if you did get involved, that was on you, not Jane.
As for the bab… [view original content]
You really think that Kenny would have just let Jane and Clem escape with AJ? He would have come after them and probably end up fighting Jane anyway for possession of AJ, with exactly the same results. Killing him was the safest option. As for Clem caring about Kenny regardless of player choice, this is likely just a case of Stockholm Syndrome.
You're also exaggerating the threat to AJ. The odds of a bandit or walker stealing AJ were negligible.
But that's just the point I'm trying to make. If Clementine wanted to be with Kenny, Jane is no one to get in her way. She did so because sh… moree wanted her for herself and even if you hate Kenny the game forces the idea that Clementine still cares about him. Something that turns out to be true. We see her crying her eyes out when he died. So? Clementine could've easily changed her mind. Jane, for that very reason, tried to get rid of Kenny as soon as she could.
Oh, he was in danger. The area was infected with walkers. Additionally, there are all kinds of bandits and parasites that could have taken AJ. The fight took a while.
Taking Clem's opinion into consideration would be:
"Clem, I think this is the end. What do you think we should do with him?"
Or
"Clementine, I'm outta here! Decide now who you're coming with!"
No one had to die, but it's what Jane wanted.
They didn't have to take the baby. It was wel established by then that Kenny was the de facto parent. If they wanted to have that lovely sister4life relationship and live happily ever after they could've just left. And again, you seem to be jumping to many conclusions. MY Clementine wanted to stay with Kenny. What about that? Jane took the opportunity of deciding for myself away from me.
Not exaggerating at all. Just pointing out it's possible. While you, not surprisingly, think leaving a baby like that is totally okay. I would've liked to see your reaction to Kenny doing the exact same thing.
You really think that Kenny would have just let Jane and Clem escape with AJ? He would have come after them and probably end up fighting Jan… moree anyway for possession of AJ, with exactly the same results. Killing him was the safest option. As for Clem caring about Kenny regardless of player choice, this is likely just a case of Stockholm Syndrome.
You're also exaggerating the threat to AJ. The odds of a bandit or walker stealing AJ were negligible.
I shot him because I thought AJ was dead and I didn't think he could come back after something like that even if Clem was still alive. After finding out AJ was okay though I immediately regretted it and left Jane's lying ass behind.
Given his unstable nature, the baby was in grave danger with Kenny. Taking AJ was the most reasonable option to save his life - the only reason he survives in the end if you side with Kenny is pure luck. Also, if your Clem wanted to stay with Kenny, after verbally abusing and acting threatening to members of the group, guilt tripping them, putting his own pride before the group's safety, and then scaring off Mike and Bonny, then your Clem has Stockholm Syndrome.
Jane noticed this, and made a decision to save Clem from an abusive relationship. I don't know if you have experience being on the receiving end of an abusive relationship, but I have, and I know what one looks like. Kenny was a vile, abusing person in the end, and I have zero regrets killing him.
If Jane and Kenny switched places, and it was Kenny who left the baby in the car, then my reaction would be exactly the same. The danger was negligible, and I will not repeat that again.
They didn't have to take the baby. It was wel established by then that Kenny was the de facto parent. If they wanted to have that lovely sis… moreter4life relationship and live happily ever after they could've just left. And again, you seem to be jumping to many conclusions. MY Clementine wanted to stay with Kenny. What about that? Jane took the opportunity of deciding for myself away from me.
Not exaggerating at all. Just pointing out it's possible. While you, not surprisingly, think leaving a baby like that is totally okay. I would've liked to see your reaction to Kenny doing the exact same thing.
Great explanation. It's not. The reasons the baby and Clementine survive is because despite his trauma, Kenny cares deeply about both of them. He's actually laughing and having fun with them in the end. It's not a coincidence, at all. Kenny wasn't vile. He was just losing it. Vile and crazy aren't always the same. His endings show he is not an evil person by any means.
Given his unstable nature, the baby was in grave danger with Kenny. Taking AJ was the most reasonable option to save his life - the only rea… moreson he survives in the end if you side with Kenny is pure luck. Also, if your Clem wanted to stay with Kenny, after verbally abusing and acting threatening to members of the group, guilt tripping them, putting his own pride before the group's safety, and then scaring off Mike and Bonny, then your Clem has Stockholm Syndrome.
Jane noticed this, and made a decision to save Clem from an abusive relationship. I don't know if you have experience being on the receiving end of an abusive relationship, but I have, and I know what one looks like. Kenny was a vile, abusing person in the end, and I have zero regrets killing him.
If Jane and Kenny switched places, and it was Kenny who left the baby in the car, then my reaction would be exactly the same. The danger was negligible, and I will not repeat that again.
I shot Kenny because didn't know AJ's true fate yet. We didn't know he was actually alive, and neither did we learn about her plan. I thought she might of accidentally dropped AJ, and he got eaten by walkers - that wouldn't necessarily be Jane's fault, and it would be unfair to kill her for that. I felt bad for shooting Kenny when I found out how much of a crazy bitch she was.
Let me tell you something about people in an abusive relationship: one of the key things you'll notice is that they go through cycles of aggression, and then regret. They'll unleash their anger on someone, and then later on apologize for it. Thing is, they never learn, and just end up acting aggressive again in the future, and then apologizing, and then acting aggressive, over and over and over again. The aggression gets more and more violent every time.
When Sarita died, Kenny blamed Clem for it, even though there was nothing she could do about it. If this was the only time something like this happened, then I'd accept it, but it wasn't. Later on, he beats the shit out of Arvo, and if Clem calls him out on it, he apologizes again, saying that that's "just the way he does things".
This finally comes to a head at the end when he flips out and attempts to murder Jane for something that was - for all he knew - an accident. No matter who wins, he ends up showing regret for it immediately afterwards. It's a constant cycle of aggression, regret, aggression, regret... And it didn't look like it was going to end any time soon. In fact, it was getting worse. He went from emotional abuse, to physical abuse, to potential murder.
So just because Kenny is laughing and having fun in the end, from the way he's been acting in the past, it's almost certain that it's just the calm before the storm. He will turn violent again - it's only pure luck that Clem and AJ got to Wellington before it happened. The implications of this are very disturbing if you end up staying with him.
pure luck
Great explanation. It's not. The reasons the baby and Clementine survive is because despite his trauma, Kenny cares deeply… more about both of them. He's actually laughing and having fun with them in the end. It's not a coincidence, at all. Kenny wasn't vile. He was just losing it. Vile and crazy aren't always the same. His endings show he is not an evil person by any means.
I felt the same way. I killed Kenny, and felt a bit conflicted until he said "You did the right thing". It would have been irresponsible to let him live and continue to be a threat to myself and others. Then I told Jane she was fucking crazy and walked off alone, too much drama with that one. I watched the Kenny/stay in Wellington ending on Youtube, and it was touching to the point where I was tempted to replay it, then I thought - nah, I like my ending better.
I shot Kenny because I didn't think he was worth saving. He was a man who had lost everything, who was unstable and depressed, and who, I th… moreought, would be much happier and better off gone from the world that took everyone he loved away from him. Kenny was a good man, and loyal, but I felt like I was giving him the mercy he needed. He was broken forever, and I eased his pain.
I'm going to get a lot of hate for this probably, but that's okay. It's how I feel.
I gotta admit i shoot him in my first playtrhough and then rewinded to see Kenny's ending. but 'cause i wanted to see both endings i would choose the one that i like the most, and the best imo is staying at Wellington.
Comments
Uh...spoiler in the title...
Yes, she was. She didn't give us the right to go with who we wanted. She took it upon herself to do what she thought was right and didn't even take Clem's opinion into consideration. She manipulated her into shooting a long time friend. That's the whole point of what she did. She engineered a situation where it would be okay for her to murder Kenny or make him go mad to the point of Clementine becoming frightened and killing him instead. Something she determinantly does. She knew for a fact Clementine would be pissed off when she saw the baby alive and would go with the guy who would bash people's faces to protect her. Not the woman who put a baby at risk and indirectly tried to murder someone to prove her own point.
She is manipulative.
I gotta admit i shoot him in my first playtrhough and then rewinded to see Kenny's ending. but 'cause i wanted to see both endings i would choose the one that i like the most, and the best imo is staying at Wellington.
Oh, I was mad at her for pulling a stupid trick. Not mad enough to let her get murdered though.
Right, I agree.
He was a good guy who could not control his rage there was no way I was letting him take that baby so I was mad for a second when Jane clued Clem in that something was up but it had to be done.
Whether she considered Clem's opinion or not is actually determinant - before the fight with Kenny, there are numerous opportunities for Clementine to say that she thinks Kenny is getting worse. If this is the case, then Jane actually does take Clem's choice into consideration when she fights Kenny.
On the other hand, if you don't agree with her, then it could just be a case of Jane wanting to protect Clem by killing what she perceives to be a threat to her - specifically, she thinks that because of Kenny's violent and unstable nature, one day he'll turn on Clem and either seriously harm or kill her. This is understandable given how Kenny's sanity (in my opinion, at least) looked like it was dropping rapidly over the past few episodes.
Jane repeatedly told Clem not to get involved in the fight with Kenny. Whether or not Clem chooses to ignore her is up to the player - if you did get involved, that was on you, not Jane.
As for the baby being in danger, I actually doubt she was in any danger at all. It was almost certainly just as cold inside the car as it would have been outside, and even if walkers did notice the baby (a highly unlikely event) they wouldn't have been able to get to him before one of the group came along and rescued him. Even then, I genuinely believe that the baby would have been in even more danger if Kenny had survived, given his anger issues.
I shot him because I/Clem believed Jane when she said AJ died in an accident and thought Kenny was way out of line. I then proceeded to tell Jane to fuck off once the truth came out.
But that's just the point I'm trying to make. If Clementine wanted to be with Kenny, Jane is no one to get in her way. She did so because she wanted her for herself and even if you hate Kenny the game forces the idea that Clementine still cares about him. Something that turns out to be true. We see her crying her eyes out when he died. So? Clementine could've easily changed her mind. Jane, for that very reason, tried to get rid of Kenny as soon as she could.
Oh, he was in danger. The area was infected with walkers. Additionally, there are all kinds of bandits and parasites that could have taken AJ. The fight took a while.
Taking Clem's opinion into consideration would be:
"Clem, I think this is the end. What do you think we should do with him?"
Or
"Clementine, I'm outta here! Decide now who you're coming with!"
No one had to die, but it's what Jane wanted.
You really think that Kenny would have just let Jane and Clem escape with AJ? He would have come after them and probably end up fighting Jane anyway for possession of AJ, with exactly the same results. Killing him was the safest option. As for Clem caring about Kenny regardless of player choice, this is likely just a case of Stockholm Syndrome.
You're also exaggerating the threat to AJ. The odds of a bandit or walker stealing AJ were negligible.
They didn't have to take the baby. It was wel established by then that Kenny was the de facto parent. If they wanted to have that lovely sister4life relationship and live happily ever after they could've just left. And again, you seem to be jumping to many conclusions. MY Clementine wanted to stay with Kenny. What about that? Jane took the opportunity of deciding for myself away from me.
Not exaggerating at all. Just pointing out it's possible. While you, not surprisingly, think leaving a baby like that is totally okay. I would've liked to see your reaction to Kenny doing the exact same thing.
I shot him because I thought AJ was dead and I didn't think he could come back after something like that even if Clem was still alive. After finding out AJ was okay though I immediately regretted it and left Jane's lying ass behind.
Given his unstable nature, the baby was in grave danger with Kenny. Taking AJ was the most reasonable option to save his life - the only reason he survives in the end if you side with Kenny is pure luck. Also, if your Clem wanted to stay with Kenny, after verbally abusing and acting threatening to members of the group, guilt tripping them, putting his own pride before the group's safety, and then scaring off Mike and Bonny, then your Clem has Stockholm Syndrome.
Jane noticed this, and made a decision to save Clem from an abusive relationship. I don't know if you have experience being on the receiving end of an abusive relationship, but I have, and I know what one looks like. Kenny was a vile, abusing person in the end, and I have zero regrets killing him.
If Jane and Kenny switched places, and it was Kenny who left the baby in the car, then my reaction would be exactly the same. The danger was negligible, and I will not repeat that again.
Fuck na
I shot him because I make wrong decisions with my life.
Great explanation. It's not. The reasons the baby and Clementine survive is because despite his trauma, Kenny cares deeply about both of them. He's actually laughing and having fun with them in the end. It's not a coincidence, at all. Kenny wasn't vile. He was just losing it. Vile and crazy aren't always the same. His endings show he is not an evil person by any means.
[removed]
What a kind statement...
Do you agree with me?
No. They are just normal people who like a video game character.
I shot Kenny because didn't know AJ's true fate yet. We didn't know he was actually alive, and neither did we learn about her plan. I thought she might of accidentally dropped AJ, and he got eaten by walkers - that wouldn't necessarily be Jane's fault, and it would be unfair to kill her for that. I felt bad for shooting Kenny when I found out how much of a crazy bitch she was.
I think the ending where you get with him to Wellington is a way fairer treatment...
Let me tell you something about people in an abusive relationship: one of the key things you'll notice is that they go through cycles of aggression, and then regret. They'll unleash their anger on someone, and then later on apologize for it. Thing is, they never learn, and just end up acting aggressive again in the future, and then apologizing, and then acting aggressive, over and over and over again. The aggression gets more and more violent every time.
When Sarita died, Kenny blamed Clem for it, even though there was nothing she could do about it. If this was the only time something like this happened, then I'd accept it, but it wasn't. Later on, he beats the shit out of Arvo, and if Clem calls him out on it, he apologizes again, saying that that's "just the way he does things".
This finally comes to a head at the end when he flips out and attempts to murder Jane for something that was - for all he knew - an accident. No matter who wins, he ends up showing regret for it immediately afterwards. It's a constant cycle of aggression, regret, aggression, regret... And it didn't look like it was going to end any time soon. In fact, it was getting worse. He went from emotional abuse, to physical abuse, to potential murder.
So just because Kenny is laughing and having fun in the end, from the way he's been acting in the past, it's almost certain that it's just the calm before the storm. He will turn violent again - it's only pure luck that Clem and AJ got to Wellington before it happened. The implications of this are very disturbing if you end up staying with him.
I felt the same way. I killed Kenny, and felt a bit conflicted until he said "You did the right thing". It would have been irresponsible to let him live and continue to be a threat to myself and others. Then I told Jane she was fucking crazy and walked off alone, too much drama with that one. I watched the Kenny/stay in Wellington ending on Youtube, and it was touching to the point where I was tempted to replay it, then I thought - nah, I like my ending better.
I'm sure even with Clem alone she ends up at Wellington.