Cant believe people are still defending that shitbird Arvo
Pete_Joseph_Randall
Banned
Look im not saying Kenny is a perfect man, hell even Kenny fanboys cant ignore that the guy has issues, he even admits it himself, but what most of you dont seem to get is that his heart is always in the right place, for the people he set out to protect.
Hell he even says that he is really TRYING to get better, which is a far more formidable personal trait than any thing what that manipulating master Jane has to offer.
Now that being said, it boggles my mind that so many people here keep blaming Kenny for beating up an enemy (YES AN ENEMY) that tried to get your whole group KILLED! How the heck do people forget this one MAJOR detail?
This shows just how soft and how out of touch with reality most community members are here, but that doesnt honestly suprise me since the majority of posters here are kids. In real life you'd be lucky to have a companion like Kenny to have your back (under the same circumstances as TWD) who makes the tough choices when neccesarry, i mean you guys STILL blame him for Larry's death when you all know that he had to go.
And the point that the game (and by that i mean Jane) is trying to get across about how Kenny has turned into Carver is absolutely ridiculous. Its apples and oranges. They both have very different motives for doing what they do. But of course Jane thinks otherwise and leaves Clementine no choice but to let one of them die. Oh and by the way how many times did Jane ask Kenny how he was doing? Because i clearly remember Kenny asking her multiple times if she was okay, even when they were in a heated situation (once where Kenny pulls the car over, and the other at the cabin in the blizzard). Yeah wait, she was too busy planning out an evil scheme to get in between Clem and Kenny... Yup that psycho is definetely the right guardian for her.
Kenny is tough, but he has the personality of someone you wanted to know, someone you could easily see hanging out with when your life wasn't in danger. People like Jane might teach you how to survive, but that's all they have going for them. You might not think this is important, but there's more to survival than not dying, and that's not something people like Jane can understand.
Comments
Peter_Joseph_Randall You're alive!PETE CONFIRMED FOR SEASON 3
I got lucky... real lucky!
what i don't understand is how people actually like arvo i mean what character did he have? all he did was cry, speak russian, be kenny's bitch, shoot clem i just can't see how people like him ben was a better character than arvo yet ben gets more hate
I agree with everything you said about kenny. we know he has issues but he wouldn't hurt clem, he does these things to protect his family and the people he trusts. Kenny>Jane.
I agree with you in all of your points, Uncle Pepe, but I was expecting this to be about that fucking shitbird Arvo.
But how would you even know of Kenny and Arvo to begin with unless you've been aliv--? INCEPTION HORN
I was going to type out a long winded reply with huge words in order to give my views on why beating Arvo is wrong and how doing so makes Kenny a pretty big bastard. But then I looked at your username.
Can't disagree with Uncle Pete. We should've left that shitbird Arvo to rot.
We don't know everything that went on with the robbery regarding Arvo. Buricko and Vitali could have interrogated him as to where he had been, and Arvo might have mentioned a nearby group. Buricko and Vitali (judging by their translated lines) seemed to be the much more violent ones out of the group, and they may have forced Arvo into coming with them to catch the group off-guard. Arvo never (throughout that whole encounter) seemed like he was out for blood. He tried to quell things as they heated up, translating between the groups. Do you seriously look at that kid and think "Oh, that's a cold-blooded murderer if I've ever seen one"?
And regarding Jane, she showed many times throughout the episode (and episode 4 as well) how caring she was of Clem. It was her who was focused on getting a fire started when Kenny wanted to beat the shit out of an innocent kid. It was her who was focused on assisting Clem and giving her advice while Kenny held a grudge against Clem for a death that wasn't her fault. I don't think Jane is perfect (anywhere near it) nor do I think anyone in this world is perfect. But Kenny has shown himself to be a cruel kind of man (beating the shit out of Arvo, threatening to slap Clementine, going into murder-mode on Jane, wasting time to fulfill his murder porn fantasies with Carver, etc etc) and that's not the kind of man I want around my Clementine.
Uncle Pete knows a lot, Dammit Luke listen for once...
Oh please dont give me that he looks innocent/was pressured into ambushing the group excuse. Arvo knew very well that the encounter would end in a blood bath, everyone who's been around that long in the TWD universe knows that there is only one way the a outcome of a meeting like that between two heavily armed groups are gonna go.
If you're gonna make a case for Jane caring about people, it might be wise to show us other examples other than Clementine. Nobody is denying she cares for Clem, thats why we got the finale ending in the first place, she wanted her all for her self. She was accusing Kenny for not letting Clem think for herself but her manupilative act in the end showed how hypocritical she was about it, and showed how she ONLY wanted Clem to see her own point of view of Kenny.
Besides, blaming Kenny for going hard on Arvo while Jane tried to keep Clem warm is hardly any proof of that he didnt care about Clem, he showed how much he did numerous times, but did you ever stop to think he lashed out on Arvo at that moment because he was indirectly the cause of Luke's death? Which by the way none of the other group members showed any real anger about.
And blaming Kenny for being hard on Clem right after his wife died is like blaming him for being a human.
I don't get how anyone could even like Arvo in the little screentime he had BEFORE HE SHOT A FUCKING CHILD. All he did was lie about his sister, bring his gang of Russians to Clem and the others, cry like a little bitch and yell in Russian. Plus, he also didn't help Luke's chance of getting across the pond alive.
But everything you said about Kenny is true as well.
Arvo is similar to Bonnie´s situation at the lodge, they are doing things that go against their morals for survival´s sake. It´s not like Arvo is the leader of the russians and wanted to set the ambush, it was clear how uncomfortable and scared he was, and never meant for anyone to die there. Kenny kept bullying him, totally unnecessarily considering he already been through a lot and just lost his whole group, including his sister. Kenny was the whole time assuming he was leading to a trap and kept treating him like shit, when he actually was cooperating, so he didn´t deserve to be bullied like that. Kenny is usually pretty shitty with his judgements, that repeated at the final showdown against Jane too, he assumed that she killed baby when he didn´t even see his corpse, only Jane´s guilty expression.
Kenny resembles Carver by his violent dominat behaviour, especially against Arvo. He also just wanna do whatever he wants regardless of other´s opinions, like a dictator, though he carries this since Season 1, it apparently got worse. Both have objectives about raising a child too. He may believe he is always doing the best for the group but most of the time he isn´t.
Jane saved Kenny´s life from the last russian and he didn´t even thanked her, i think you forgot this important part.
I don't blame Kenny for this, I think this choice was more based on fear than anything else. I don't think he was dead, people have heart attacks all the time, and just don't die. They get rushed to the hospital and recover.
I understand what you say about the fear but usually when someone has a heart attack and you have no idea if they're going to live or die added by the fact that they were stuck in a locked room with him. That was another reason he made the choice he did which was understandable, I kind of laughed at the idea of Lily rushing Larry to a hospital in a zombie apocalypse thinking it would save his life.
CPR (even though Lily was only doing chest thrusts) will only keep the blood circulating enough to keep a person alive, and it has to be given constantly. Without defibrillation it is practically impossible to imagine Larry surviving.
Regarding Arvo, what I meant by that was that he may not have wanted to rob them in the first place. Arvo was very likely stealing supplies from his own group for his sister, therefore requiring him to go hide it and keep it a secret. He comes back, with or without it. If he comes back with it, he says he found it and a group nearby robbed him of his only firearm (and think about it this way: if a walker catches him, with his leg, he doesn't stand a chance) or that he found supplies but a nearby group robbed him of it. OTHER PEOPLE such as Buricko and Vitali want to rob and attack them, and Arvo is dragged along simply because he knows two of the people.
Regarding Jane, she seemed to care deeply about Luke. Remember when Jane and Clem are talking and Jane mentions how much it hurts to lose him? And how Bonnie and Mike are riled up about Luke's death as well? Kenny wasn't the only one showing emotion, but he was the only one showing it violently. Jane did not want Clem "all to herself", she wanted Clem safe, and from how much she knew about Kenny (beating the shit out of Arvo, wasting time to fulfill his murder porn fantasies with Carver, both things I mentioned before) he was a dangerous person.
And when I mentioned Kenny being "hard on Clem" I was moreso talking about how he literally threatens physical abuse upon her in the scene where Clem comes to talk to him in the car.
Look at this wonderful example of a parental figure.
Well we just don't know, I feel like more could have been done. He might of just passed out for all we know, we don't really know what happened. All we know is he clutched his chest, and went down. Was he breathing? Did he have a heart beat?
For fucks sake, I can deal with all the Anti-Kenny arguments, but that is the absolute worst. He says that only after you pick Clem to say that Lee shouldn't have went through all that trouble to find her. Even Ben would've "threatened" to smack Clem for saying that.
Really, you can bring up Kenny accidentally hitting her with his elbow, and I won't care, but using that line is ridiculous.
You're just clearly grasping at straws here, taking word out of context at what not, if you really that naive to think that Arvo is just an innocent little boy, then i'll leave you to your own fairytale and rainbow land.
I liked Arvo but hated him after he left right after shooting my clem! I bet he and his group of Russian people though they were gonna get this one, like they always do (bag of medicine) until it backfired, then he started hating our group. Not to mention shooting a 11 year old girl that almost froze to death on the same day? now that's low...
what i dont understand is how people actually like clementine i mean what character did she have in season 1, she cried a lot and wasnt helpful in situations, and acted like a baby.
Arvo is still a kid, he was scared, afraid, and broken.. his sister was killed and then he was treated like crap and also i dont like that Ben gets more hate than Arvo. I think Ben does deserve more hate Ben indirectly killed Carley, Duck, Katjaa, and Charles. Ben was Kennys bitch too, Ben left Clem to die in Savannah.
Looking back on this, I realize I may not have done the best job of conveying my point. I do not hate Kenny. I am not Anti-Kenny. I love Kenny, and I do wish I didn't have to kill him to save Jane's life. I'll admit that the point I made was somewhat ridiculous, and that it wasn't the best piece of evidence I could have chosen to display that Kenny has some flaws that need to be worked out. (this part of the comment is directed at the person above you as well)
However, you seem to be missing my point when I talk about Arvo. I do not claim he is "just some innocent little boy" and I do not think he is incapable of wrong or of mistakes. My point is that he is a human being, and people seem to be thinking of him as nothing more than wretched scum that has no moral fiber and simply seeks to wreck havoc and everything and anyone everywhere he goes. EVERYONE in this world is fucked up and has made their fair share of mistakes. That does not exclude them from understanding and forgiveness.
Because he wasn't a cackling villain about it. He could determinately be justified in doing it if you fucked with him first, in which case it's entirely your fault. Presumably, he does it anyway because Jane threatened him and took his gun, leaving him defenseless. Does it make it right? No, but one way or another he's assaulted and robbed in some fashion. And even then, don't forget that he tried to quell the standoff when he realized the group had a baby.
The fact that he was shown to be somewhat reasonable until treated like shit in episode 4 is likely what gets people to defend his position. Unfortunately, Breckon seemed to forget about all that in episode 5, along with Arvo speaking pretty good English and just made Arvo a walking plot device. So ignoring more inconsistent writing, and questions surrounding Arvo that were never answered because the writers didn't know what the fuck they were doing, what we can draw from Arvo prior to Kenny's abuse is that he was just a scared kid who made some bad decisions, and his reactions could be read as having regret for them, no different from Ben.
The problem is that Kenny exacerbates the whole thing by constantly abusing Arvo despite the fact that he's not a threat in any way. I'm sorry, but everything Kenny was doing just made him out to be a bully. Abusing Arvo was not one of those things that "needed to be done" in any way whatsoever, and you have a fucked up point of view if you think so. Kenny wasn't justified in being a xenophobic bully, end of story. Note that I am not justifying Arvo's choices, but focusing solely on the fact that Kenny was being a bullying prick, which is never something that needs to be done.
Well, again, there was nothing necessary about abusing Arvo, but on top of that, Kenny has consistently shown that he doesn't have the guts to do what's necessary when it personally affects him. No, I don't care if Duck was his son and Sarita was his girlfriend, you don't get to hold him up as the guy who knows what to do in these situations if he's going to freeze up and then cast blame all around when things get tough for him personally. You either do what you have to all the time, or you don't. That's the true survivalist mindset, and Kenny doesn't have it.
And guess what, he doesn't need to have it to be an interesting or good character. Nothing wrong with showing reservations when his family is at stake, but let's stop glorifying Kenny's propensity to do what "needs to be done", shall we? Because like most people who spout the same thing, he only does it when it doesn't affect him emotionally. And when it does, he's ready to blame everybody but himself.
Carver beat the shit out of Kenny because he didn't take his crap and acted against him in some way. Kenny beat the shit out of Arvo because he didn't take his crap and acted against him in some way. Carver thought his ideas on where to go and what to do were the right ones and fuck everybody else. Kenny thought his ideas on where to go and what to do were the right ones and fuck everybody else. Kenny wanted the baby to be raised in a safe place. Carver wanted the baby to be raised in a safe place.
Now, yes, ultimately Carver is an evil villain and Kenny is Jesus, but there were obvious connections being drawn, right down to Kenny using Arvo as a way to bait Vitaliy out the way Carver did in episode 2 when Kenny fired on his group and put them in danger. It's not just an evil plan of Jane's, that's the game telling you what to see. Up to you whether you want to or not.
You mean she saved him from a conflict which she caused by threathing Arvo.. gee i wonder why Kenny didnt thank her, i dont think i would've either
I cannot believe people are still defending Kenny beating up a kid who was bound and defenseless and saying that it was the right thing to do. People have Kenny on such a pedestal and I just dont understand it. I wonder if Lilly had showed up instead of Kenny, would she get the same treatment?
He proved how defensless he is by putting a bullet in Clem didnt he.
I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about all the times Kenny was beating on him while he was tied up, just because he could. Don't confuse the issue. This is about Kenny's behavior, his bullying and his uncontrollable rages.
That comment literally offends me so it's invalid.
Im surprised that offends you, especially since you called me soft for getting offended by being downvoted awhile back
Exactly what they wanted us to question, it worked well it took me a minute to think whether or not we should kill him. I completely agree, but I think that if I was stuck in a meat locker with a man whose had heart problems that only a hospital could save him from I would be a little on edge as well.
I can't believe you actually remembered that if I even said it, or me in the first place. I don't even know you. And it's called sarcasm.
I just cannot believe you'd compare Clem with arvo. Makes me wonder why i'm even replying to you in the first place.
Just because he's a kid doesn't mean he's innocent. He brought his goon friends over, what would you expect Kenny to do? Give him a hug and say everything's gonna be alright?
I gave Arvo every opportunity to figure out that Clem is a good person. Fuck Arvo. I hope he dies in a fire.
I
I want Arvo dead... now.
No, I expect him not to beat on him just for the heck of it. I don't believe it was for any reason other than he needed someone to take his anger out on.
Haters gonna hate.
Haven't seen people more delusional than Jane fans
Well hes blaming Arvo for acting like a teenager, i could easily blame Clementine for acting like a kid thats not saying i dont like Clementine i like her just as much as you do.
And sorry, unlike you i dont have magical powers that allow me too detect sarcasm over the internet,
Which is why i understand why it happened. I don't blame anyone, "it was just a bad situation that got worse."
Well he still causes problems to Clem through his "noble" actions.