Feedback: The Walking Dead (Determinant Characters)
First off I want to say that The Walking Dead and The Wolf Among Us are 2 of the best written narratives I've ever had the pleasure to experience. TWD rates right up there with other critically acclaimed films and TV for me.
While I would herald TWD as a masterpiece, I don't think anything in this world is immune to feedback and there's one thing TTG/TWD fall flat on AFTER getting it perfectly right the first time.
Determinant Characters.
The characters who have a brush with death, but will be dealt a critical hit later on regardless.
The Issue:
Determinate characters quickly become a shell of their former selves, sometimes losing all touch with the player and becoming a meaningless NPC, due to a number of reasons.
1. Predictability of Death - The moment where a character becomes "determinant" is too routine. Often being a "Save X or Y" or straight up "Save or Do Not Save X". After a character is saved from a determination event, the player progressively anticipates their timely death at some point in the season because, so far in TWD, all determinate characters die within the same episode or eventually in the same Season.
2. Lack of continued Character Development - When a character is marked as determinant after their brush with death, the player loses emotional investment into the determinant character because the determinant character barely have a few lines of dialogue from that point on. They tag along, occasionally chipping in, until their timely fate arrives.
3. Loss of Impact to the Story - When a character is earmarked as determinant, they also fail to make any meaningful actions or maintain any real connection with the other survivors from that point onwards, like they exist in their own little bubble. This only enhances the players anticipation of their death, removing all shock or suspense when it happens as the connection to that character and the player wither's away over time.
Examples:
S1 E4 Ben - Ben becomes determinant at the bell tower. If you drop him, the story progresses well. If you save him however, the story doesn't seem quite as developed and Kenny's "death" and survival in Season 2 seems even more implausible. Since he was saved, he gets one good moment of screaming at Kenny, but otherwise his character becomes stagnant and he never actually redeems himself before being annihilated by an alleyway fall.
S2 E2 Nick - You get a hunch that Walter might blow a casket and kill Nick, but when the 2-option dialogue pops up basically saying "Truth or Lie" it might as well be "Dead Nick or Alive Nick". From then on Nick provides little/no input to the group discussions for the remainder of the Season, and his interactions with Clem are limited at best. He eventually dies off-screen and get a mere "oh" from me, despite having been my second-favourite character in Episode 1 and 2 out of sheer sympathy.
S2 E2 Alvin - Alvin either gets murdered by Carver at Walt's lodge, which produces a really interesting dynamic between Kenny and Rebecca at Howe's Hardware; or he survives, has almost no input into the season from that point on, loses all interest as a character he had built up from the lodge, and is locked away into an office until his eventually timely death.
S2 E4 Sarah - Similar to Ben, you could leaver her behind in the Caravan for fear of your own safety, but if she survives, she sulks around a bit for an hour, and then inevitably dies anyway. While determinant she also stagnates in terms of player interest and her own development as a character, though I will give brownie point for the option to try and save her at the collapsed decking, and because leaving her in the caravan to begin with was such a hard but viable choice.
Okay, so that's what I believe makes determinant characters TTG's weakness. Now for the positives - where was it done right and why?
The Good Ones:
S1 E1 Doug/Carley - Seriously, whomever you save, their character continues to foster and grow. There's even some hints towards a growing romance between Carley and Lee while Carly is marked as "determinant". The determinant character plays out really well, has an invested role in episodes 2 & 3, and their UNtimely death was a massive shock to the system.
S2 E3 Sarita - Choosing to chop her arm off was probably the hardest choice I've ever made in any TTG game so far. Start of next episode, she dies anyway. WHAT! Well played TTG. That hit me like a horsekick. If you chose to save her however, she wither's away in a tent a lá Duck style.
S2 E4 (kinda) Sarah - leaving her behind was a hard choice and I thought someone else (Jane) might've perished. while her character became weaker after this incident, it wasn't a total write-off and her mental state played into it well. The option to try and save her at the collapsed decking later was a nice twist though. I thought it was either her or Jane, but I was so, so wrong.
Bottom Line:
When a character has a determination moment, it's becomes more and more cliché the more times it occurs throughout the season. Likewise, the surviving determinant character becomes a shell of their former selves with little to no impact on the remainder of the story, and as a player I feel I lose all investment in that character over this period of time and that I even start anticipating their death due to the common nature of determinants dying later that episode or season anyway.
The biggest impacts for me at this point are the characters who die regardless of your actions (Luke! Sarita! Carley! Katjaa!) or if a character continues on for several episodes with progress and involvement in the story and the player (Carley/Doug!) making the player believe that the determinant character is in for the long haul and has an equal chance at survival as the rest of the group.
Mass Effect 2 did this right. All characters were determinant for the finale with The Collectors, and if they died you felt a true sense of loss, but if they survived you felt massively relieved. In TWD when a character survives, it can be obvious at times to know if they are now "determinant characters" and if so, you still anticipate their deaths anyway and gradually but instinctively lose interest in them as their own narrative dies out before the character itself does.
TL;DR:
My feedback is to have less clear-cut or player-driven determinant characters, but where necessary, continue to develop the determinant character beyond the incident to re-establish confidence and a connection between the player and said surviving character. Also deaths like Luke's, Sarita's, and Sarah's were really effective because the inverse occurs - you're tricked into thinking you are at a character's determination point, but you're not and they die anyway. I think the balance is right and if it was done any more then it would lose its impact like determinate characters.
What are your thoughts on determinant characters? do you agree with my above feedback? Why/why not?
Thanks for reading.
EDIT: Tidied up post, clarified some reasoning 
Comments
Eh, I felt that Ben was a pretty good determinant character. His outburst at Kenny really drove home how pitiful and tragic his character was and there were some good moments with him and Lee in Episode 5. Alvin was pretty bad, but his death scene in the office was a bit more emotionally impactful and he died thinking about his family being safe rather than falling into Carver's hands, so there was at least something gained from that. Sarah's character stagnated, but I felt like this was kind of the point: to show that despite your efforts to save her, she wasn't going to recover any time soon. Nick was the worst one, since the only thing you gain is a scene where Clem gets to hack at his face a few times. The biggest contribution he had as a determinant character was as a zombie. That sucks.
Aye, they all usually have 1 moment while marked for death where they attempt to connect to the story or the player again, but usually only once. Ben was borderline IMO - the conversations with Lee didn't really feel like much more than filler to me.
The point I'm trying ot make is it's becoming predictable and paper thin. Future determinant characters need to be far less, and played out more like Doug/Jane/Kenny/Carley. Alternatively, the helplessness of Sarita/Sarah/Luke played out exceptionally well, but I'd be careful with it too in future seasons as Season 2 did turn into a bit of a bloodbath. It took place over 16 days or so, and yet basically everybody's dead.
Thanks for the comments.
Ben was, IMO, a great determinant character, especially if he comes with you to Vernon's hospital because he actually partakes in and effects the dialog, and his standing up to Kenny scene is still my favorite scene in the series. Also Ben adds two possible effects to the episode, if you don't shoot any bullets in the hallway, Ben will still pick up your gun, and you can later give it to Kenny when he goes to sacrifice himself or you can keep it and if you manage to choke the stranger to death you can shoot him in the head to prevent reanimation. Overall Ben was my favorite.
Nick on the other hand, what a waste of a great character, they didn't even give him some kind of development even though every other main determinant character has some sort of development. Carley/Doug had two whole episodes to develop and you got to know them, Ben had his amazing scene, Pete got a great sendoff in the cigarette truck when he tried to save Clem, Alvin got his sacrifice scene in episode 3 and Sarah learned that she didn't want to die. So why didn't Nick deserve any extra development? It was just a complete waste.
I'm gonna make this short for the time being, but having Kenny/Jane become determinant is a huge turnoff and sad expectation that they WILL be killed off early in S3. As for Ben, probably one of the best determinants I've come across, opposite of Nick. Basically turned into Sarah, but still had a small fire in him.
Determinants only work when everyone has some version in their story. Doug and Carley worked so well as you had to have one or the other. They should always do that, it could still resulting in saving someone but if you do some other person dies like with Sarah if you saved her at the trailer Jane dies as she cant get out in time. It allows the writers to account for them and also they can actually do something storywise even if the character is different.
I agree with almost everything, but Ben alive in 105 is a way more interesting story imo.
He lashes out on Kenny, which even I enjoyed (even though I love Kenny), because the shitbird finally tried.
And his death/Kenny's disappereance is more emotional for me. Ben just started to change for the better (not if you drop him), and THEN BAMM! He's dead.
And Kenny getting out of there was way more logic as Kenny getting out of Christa's mess. I could eleborate, but I don't think you'd like that.
No, go ahead!
Personally I thought the alleyway was worse because Omid/Christa were watching over the top. did they get carried away with the view or something? Why couldn't they see if Kenny got out of there or not?
I still have a document from January, but it contains pictures, so I will not be able to upload these here.
Basically, Kenny could have just pulled himself through a window (but there's more to it)
Ah, interesting