Amid The Ruins Defense Masterpost
So it has come to my attention that a ton of people hate Amid The Ruins, I'm gonna try and put that hate in it's grave with this thread. What are the reasons you might ask? Well, Nick and Sarah are the main ones but I'll get into why those aren't really practical reasons to call this episode "the worst this season" or an "awful episode". I'll start off by saying Amid The Ruins was great to me my 3rd favorite TWD episode all time, no question. It gave us everything we all felt was missing from the previous 3 episodes and how was it received by the community? With tons of undeserved hate and not being able to see past the deaths of Nick and Sarah. It has easily blocked most peoples views of this episode and how good it really was. So the masterpost starts here 
I'll start off with the characters (not including Clem though 
)
Jane
So in this episode we learn a lot about Jane, things about her sister, survival skills she's learned during her time in the apocalypse, but most of all her past experiences with a lot of groups and how she tends to stay away from groups. She actively tries to show Clem the reasons why staying with a group isn't a very good thing, while the rest of the group shows Clem the reasons why staying with a group is a good thing too. While it may seem like a bad idea to spend a lot of the time with a character that is just going to leave by the end of the episode, this was a great decision on TT's part since it was there to help you lean closer to Jane to make the Final decision in episode 5 a bit harder than you would think. If we didn't have time spent with Jane this episode I can guarantee more people would have sided with Kenny at the end of episode 5.
Rebecca
Rebecca is just her usual nice self in this episode, although we spend more time with her as it is the final few hours till the baby is out. Not much to say about Rebecca really other than her death at the end of the episode was great. It felt shocking to me even though it was pretty obvious she was going to turn, just not right then.
Mike & Bonnie
The Mike and Bonnie scene this episode was definitely one of my favorites, it made it really seem like Bonnie had changed and Mike wasn't just some random guy that was going to be in the group. Also "I'd eat the shit out of that raccoon" is the best line this season, don't deny it. That scene made the betrayal in episode 5 even harder to take in.
Luke
This episode for Luke I think I'll definitely say wasn't the greatest but it did reinforce the fact that all the characters are human and make mistakes. Also determinantly he can judge Clementine on her staying to watch Carver, I liked this because it shows how Luke really isn't the killer type of person and more of the morally good kinda guy. His "making it with Jane" was probably there so he could get in a fight with Kenny and make it more surprising when he died in episode 5 and it wouldn't be a Kenny/Luke choice. That's all really for Luke.
Kenny
This episode I felt they did great for Kenny, they made him go back to his season 1 jerk type of guy when he has to deal with Sarita's death, this was probably here just so the final choice in episode 5 wouldn't be so one sided towards Kenny, because let's face it Kenny had been a great guy towards Clem this season up to this point. It also made it really determinant on how you view Ken by the end of this episode, if you resist his accusations about Sarita being your fault he seems more of an asshole during the episode, if you zip your mouth and take it all in, he'll apologize making his accusations not so bad. The real moment Kenny shined though was in the moment when the baby was coming, he did all he could to help Rebecca get the baby out and in the end gained success. That's it for Kenny, I felt they did an awesome job with him this episode.
The Russians
While some people might argue, "why are their Russians in the middle of America" I answer, What? There can't be foreign people in America? it's just pretty weird how people think that theirs no way Russians can show up in America. Let's think about it, they could have moved to America as soon as the ZA started or they even could have made it here while it was going on in search of a better place, it's not really that far fetched as to why there are Russians here. Also the "stereotypical" Russian argument for Buricko is kind of dumb, it's just a nitpick, I don't think it's something to be taken very seriously like some do. Also Arvo, not really much to say about him, but this episode demonstrates that he's a kid and kids make lots of mistakes as shown by the ending where he comes after Clem's group no matter what chocie you make. That's all really for the Russians.
Nick & Sarah, and their so called "Awful deaths"
So this is the thing that everyone hates Amid The Ruins for, and I'm gonna tell you it's just stupid how everyone hates it just for this. Like seriously, Nick's death was bad, sure I can agree on that, but is a character death really going to turn the whole episode into shit just cause? No it shouldn't, people take it way too far. Did anyone really complain when Carlos had a death like he had in episode 3? No they didn't, did people say episode 3 is complete garbage because of the treatment of 400 days characters, yeah they did but they didn't take it as far as the Nick & Sarah death. Seriously, it baffles me as to how people think Amid The Ruins was the worst this season, when In Harm's way had that scarring line "Bill don't like idle hands". Getting into Sarah's death, people only really complained because the choice doesn't matter and she dies anyway, well first she was going to die anyway, SHE WAS DETERMINANT, if it wasn't then it would be someplace else, like 3 minutes into episode 5 in the gunfight, and I can guarantee no one would complain, just because she survived into another episode, that's how blinded so many people are with the fact that she can die 2 times in the same episode.
The choices don't matter!
Did you not play the last 8 episodes? THEY NEVER MATTERED ANYWAY! LOL
What is stupid about all this complaining and hatred
For the past 3 episodes of season 2 we had complained a shit ton, "UGHH NO HUBS, NO CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT, LENGTHIER EPISODES PLS!" and what do we get this episode? All the things we asked for, yet all people still did was find more shit to complain about, honestly some people can just never be pleased until something is absolutely perfect, which that is something that really bothers me.
My Final Thoughts
This episode was amazing in my opinion, the third best in the series for me. I hope this post has opened the eyes of some of you, and you won't look at a piece of dog shit and say "still better than Amid The Ruins" The hate really isn't deserved, it did a lot of things better than some previous episodes did and had more pro's to it then con's. So there you have it, my defense masterpost for one of my favorite episodes yet
Comments
Nope, but that's just my opinion.
You didn't even read it, so step on a lego, But that's just my opinion
Completely agree. I can't believe people hated just because of two or one character's deaths. The rest of the episode was great, fun interactions with Mike and Bonnie, this episode made me love them, and great ones with Rebecca, Luke and Jane.
I don't really hate Amid The Runs that much, in fact I believe it's fantastic, but Nick's death felt odd and out of place, and that was the first time I disagreed with something that has happened in this game, which is the only reason I'd put it lower than anything else. I was fine with everyone else's death because they usually held some kind of purpose.
Still it's a great episode, it's just that that was the first time I had ever so vehemently disagreed with something in the series.
Yeah but I really don't understand that logic, how one death can be so bad/disagreed with that an episode drops in quality because of it. IMO there are much different things that make other episodes worse.
What didn't you like about it though?
Exactly! :P
I'm sorry, I really don't like this episode. The only things I did like were the Jane development, Sarita choice outcome and the 'our friends keep us strong' speech to Sarah, and then she died later in the episode.
I did exactly what I was aiming to do then.
Edit: Nope.
Nice thread, I think the best episode of the season was A House Divided but I'm not sure what I think the worst is...
Stepping on legos is a deadly thing, those who are fortunate enough to not experience the pain should forever stay that way.
This is my new catch phrase. And tomorrow is Monday, too!
Stepping on legos is a deadly thing, those who are fortunate enough to not experience the pain should forever stay that way.
Thanks :]
Good reasoning to why to justify killing Sarah so poorly.
People promised Uncle Pete they would look after him, and to see him die like that pissed off a lot of fans. He was a favorite.
Would you have liked it in the gun fight? Or her to have just died at the trailer no matter what?
Well is that a reason to hate the episode? No it sure as hell isn't
I agree, I fucking hated their deaths but that's how Telltale works, They wanted to show that Sarah could never adapt to Survive in the harsh world and With Nick, Telltale got lazy with him but they might have wanted to show that no matter what you can't protect everyone.
people are justified in hating whatever they want.
Yeah they are, and I'm also justified in calling out people when they stupidly hate something because of something so little.
I was totally willing to believe that there were Russians in the US--there are a lot of Russians here. I was a little disappointed that only one of the voice actors actually speaks Russian (Arvo), at least that I could tell. And did they have to be Russian mafia-looking guys with tattoos? I thought that was a little...well, cold war-ish, I guess. I thought Telltale could have done better by Russian culture.
That said, I also liked this episode, and you have an excellent point that people probably hated on it because of Nick and Sarah.
I didn't have a problem with Nick or Sarah's deaths, because zombies. Besides, if you think back to Season 1, remember the people we got to know and all too soon they were gone, like Molly, Doug/Carley, and Chuck, to name a few? You can't be sure that people are going to be around for long when there are zombies--an early death or exit doesn't necessarily mean ZOMG Bad Writingz. I could go more into why it wasn't bad writing, but I already did that at the time.
Well there was only one of them with tattoos, and I don't think the actors speaking Russian really mattered all that much :P
I like how Luke expressed his feelings about Jane and Kenny in the episode, foreshadowing the decision later on in Ep. 5
your opinion.
Yes me as well. I felt that whole Luke part was really well done.
Ok.....
your opinion does not = fact or do you need a calculator to figure that out?
Yeah neither does yours bud, also who shit in your frosted flakes?
Michael Ark (the guy who voice acted Arvo) actually took over the role of Vitali in episode 5. In case you were curious.
Do you see the fallacy here?
Nope.
It doesn't drop the quality of the overall episode, it just really disappointed me. Everything else was fantastic in the game series, that was just a low bump that I couldn't get behind. As I've said, everything was fantastic, except that, which is why it's my least favorite, because it contained the only thing that I didn't like.
exactly.
Exactly what? There is none lol.
Mondays are deadlier. The pain lasts for a whole day instead of 23 hours.
Thanks Green for making that, really good read.
Personally, I think some of players expected too much from Nick and Sarah, facilely choosing them as their favorites, forgetting their true nature. To be honest, I've never thought that Nick and Sarah were going to survive through the whole Season. Not everyone has to die like a hero, even if some characters fairly deserved it and the others wished for it to happen. World immersed in the zombie apocalipse is the place where people die in many ways. Somethimes just isn't an option to save them.
That was a pretty fast 360
You're welcome, and I completely agree.
Agree 100%.
? It's been my opinion since the first day it came out that Amid The Ruins was great. I only only complain about the whole Nick angle.