How would you describe Shane?
I think Shane was always a bad man, deep down inside.
But the circumstances for him to show his true nature, had not yet come about, until ZA.
What kind of man hooks up with his best friends wife, after he's only been presumed dead for only a couple of months?
What kind of man holds a loaded shotgun on his best friend, who has just returned?
What kind of man shoots someone who is trying to help, just so he can get away?
Shane seemed like he cared for Carl, but that was a lie.
If Shane had indeed cared about the boy, than he would not have been hellbent on murdering his father.
He would considered the grief it would put the boy through, and would have reconsidered his course.
Shane was a deeply selfish and unsympathetic man, who didn't really care about anyone, except himself.
Comments
He was a scum.
Also agree with your points 100%
Shane was a creep.
I'm watching through season 2 again and I must say that Shane changed so much. He became the opposite of what Rick is. The apocalypse brought out the worst in him, and that's a real shame,. He could have turned out to be a great character. What he did to Otis was terrible, and then trying to kill Rick as well? He just wanted Lori and Carl all to himself.
Dead
A good man who was shoved away from Lori and Carl even though he adored them. He adapted to the apocajypse quicker than anyone, and was never going to kill Rick, as confirmed by his actor. Shane led him away from everyone so he'd finally make a hard decision, and after that, Rick becomes a lot like him.
*"The idea was that Shane had never intended to kill Rick at all, but had brought Rick out into the woods to kill him. Jon Bernthal is convinced that Shane knew he was a cancer to the group and that he had to go. He just wanted Carl and Lori to be safe and for Rick to man up and take the role he was supposed to take. He said he truly believes that Shane was never as heartless as he wanted to appear that he was, and that's what makes him so entertaining to watch."**
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MnokUWBQwHs
Bad ass! He's one of favorites from the show.
One of the best characters from the show.
I describe him as the ultimate betrayer and that's why I grew to loathe him.
I like Shane. He reminds me of myself. Rick killed Shane because he wanted him out of his life, because he didn't want to compete for Lori's affection. That is why he stabbed him.
If Shane didn't become completely obsessed with Lori and Carl, then I would have wanted him to stay on the show. He was an interesting character and it would have been cool to see how he reacted to the Governor and all. But since he was obsessed, it was necessary that he was killed off. Sucks Rick had to do it though
Dead.
InShane.
Probably the most pussy whipped man in the long sad history of pussy whipped men. And by Lori of all people.
When he beat up Ed, is wasn't like the man didn't deserve it.
Ed continuously beat up on poor Carol, his own wife.
A REAL MAN does not do treat his wife that way.
So when Shane beat up on him, that was good thing, as the guy had it coming.
That was probably the only decent thing Shane did on the show, in my opinion.
Rick killed Shane because Shane was trying to kill him. Plain and simple.
The perfect survivor who could make great choices to keep the group safe but eventually his dick took over his mind thanks to that Lori bitch.
Shane made his own choices. He chose to go after his best friend's grieving widow. It's not all her fault.
How do you know it wasn't Lori the one who started it back when everyone thought Rick was dead?
She's the one who made Shane go crazy again after forgiving him at the farm when he was fixing the windmill. The final conflict between Rick and Shane was caused by Lori.
I wasn't there with them but I seriously doubt it. Shane was the one who told her Rick was dead and she clung to him because he was the only friend she had left. I believe he took advantage of that. In any case, I get tired of people blaming Lori for everything and acting like Shane was somehow her victim. Did you hear how he was talking about women in the very first episode? He had no respect for women.
I'm starting to feel like Rick is becoming more like Shane. He transformed from a great leader, who wanted to do right things, instead of doing things that are best for the group, to a Psychotic Maniac who takes no shit anymore. I mean, he just straight up became a psycho at the end of Season 4.
And he's killed shit ton of people that didn't deserve death, and hell. He doesn't save anyone anymore, It's like whoever is in danger, stays there. Because survival of the fucking fittest, Rick!
He was batshit inshane.
Lets not forget that scene in the CDC building where he forces himself on her.
Who didn't deserve it? And I think anyone would go psycho on the man who tried to rape their 12 year old son in front of them. The difference between Rick and Shane IMO is Rick cares about everyone in the group. Shane only cared about himself and the family he was obsessing over.
Bitch though Lori was, I doubt this as well. Even if I'm wrong, Shane had a moral duty not to fuck his best friend's wife immediately after tragedy had befallen the family.
Moreover he had a duty to himself (a nature of duty that Shane seems to take seriously) not to let himself get involved with that conniving perma-scowling skeleton-faced harpy bitch. Rick has an excuse. He was a teenager who had trouble with girls when she expressed an interest in him. They married young before Rick had a clue. Shane KNEW what she was like and he still wanted to get with her. That's on him. He really shouod've known better.
god i love you so much
Personally, I think Shane Walsh wasn't as awful as he gets made out to be sometimes. He didn't plan to betray Rick from the get go like some people think. He did the best he could for Rick in the hospital.And, if we are to believe him which I do, he genuinely thought Rick was dead. I don't fault the man for having trouble letting go of a family he had come to consider his own.
He did some shit and took some positions I would never take, even that I think are dead wrong (my personal philosophy is much closer to Dale's.) But he wasn't some kind of monster nor was he insane. Much lke Bill Carver he was just a guy, an asshole yes, but a just an ordinary asshole like all the rest you may know and even love who let fear and anger drive him to allow his baser nature the better of him. Alot of people forget that our beloved Lee once made the same mistake.
Shane certainly deserved to die, but I liked what the show did with his character.
Everything early on is easily rationalized. Rick was in a coma, what was he supposed to do, carry him on his shoulder out of the hospital with soldiers shooting everyone and walkers everywhere? And then what? Wheres he going to get IV feed for him? He was almost certainly dead and there was no reason for him to tell Lori otherwise.
Afterwards, it seems obvious he always had feelings for Lori. In the comic, he just went over the deep end immediately. In the comic, Id agree with you, he was a bad man. Lining up Rick in the woods in the beginning in the TV show though, he seems very conflicted and frustrated by the situation. He deeply loved both Lori and Carl, he knows Carl would be very depressed at his father dying, but when youre intensely jealous, you believe the other person is just innately inferior. Shane believes he could do a better job than Rick, make Carl into a better man and be a better husband to Lori. Killing Rick in his mind would be better for both of them in the long run. The fact that Rick is his best friend conflicts him throughout the series. Finally, seeing Carl get shot was his absolute breaking point. It seemed as though due to his jealousy, he blames Rick and Otis for Carl getting shot, because Rick decided to continue looking for Sofia, while Shane would have moved on. Going with Otis to get the medicine was a horrible decision, it gave him the absolute easiest good person for him to kill. Once he crossed that threshold and killed Otis, he wasnt coming back. He wasnt the man he was after he made that decision.
Seriously, man. I'm sure I'm preaching to the choir, but go back and watch her with this in mind. I doubt you can fill up a hand counting times that someone came to her for advice or to get her opinion or see where she sood on something orwhatever, where she hadn't completely flipped her position within 48 hrs. And not just, "On further reflection, I've changed my opinion on the matter." No, over and over she responded to people, especially Rick and Shane (especially poor Rick) with some variation of "How DARE you do that thing I just told you understood/said I was ok with/insisted upon/unabashedly demanded/publicly declared was your intended course of action even if it wasn't! You unfathomable bastard!"
I'm convinced if she ever came back as an actual ghost and not some hallucination, she would immediately tear into Maggie for cutting her open, never mind that Maggie hadn't wanted to and Lori had absolutely demanded they proceed that way..
Lee acted out of anger. He didn't systematically plan to lure his best friend of 20 years away so he could murder him. Everything you say about how Shane was with Rick in the beginning is true, and that's what makes what he eventually did so much worse. I loved Rick and Shane's friendship at first. I truly thought they were brothers, and then Shane turned on Rick so badly, I felt betrayed myself. How could he do that if there wasn't something really wrong with him?
He may be a dick but he's still a really cool character, love him.
I can't say Shane didn't go off the deep end a bit. That would be obtuse of me. But fear and rage and grief can put us all in a "What the hell is wrong with him?" situation under the right circumstances if we let it. It happened to Rick and Carl. It happened to Andrea and Daryl a little bit. It happened to Tyrese and Beth and Mike (I think that's the army medic's name) and Hershel too. None of those people jumped off of the precipice into the abyss in quite the same way, and I can't defend Shane's actions. They're indefensible. But to say he's some kind of insane monster whose motivations come from a place of evil, instead of from an understandable and normal human scope, is both shortsighted and kind of dense to me. That was more my point than to stand in defense of murderous betrayal.
Favorite character along with Merle and Michonne
I never said he was evil, but to me his actions were. Murdering that boy just so he could set up Rick. He went way more than off the deep end. There was no way those two could co-exist with the both of them trying to lead, but maybe it would have been better if Shane had just left the group like he wanted to at first. Of course, that wouldn't have been as dramatic, lol. Well anyway, I get that you're trying to understand where he's coming from, what drove him to that dark place. I just can't ever forgive him. He reminds me of Kenny in a lot of ways.
I know you didn't say that he was evil. My original post was in large part an indirect reply to some of the times I've heard that stated or implied by others in this conversation or elsewhere. I just meant to clarify my position. Didn't mean to put words in your mouth.
Though since you bring it up, the whole thing with the boy much like the Kenny/Arvo situation would've been far less deplorable if they had just killed him once they knew it was necessary. These things always seem to get worse when people try to cling to a process or a system that is obviously gone and they are clearly unfit to reinstate or administer. Ignoring that the only justice left is individually meted, and that being unwilling to take on reasonable custody of an offender and rightly being also unwilling to let them go and be tacitly responible for any further victimizations, leaves only one choice... it just gets people needlessly tortured before the truth of the situation can't be ignored. Setting the kid up was deplorable, but Shane had the right idea when he wanted to execute him and be done with it.
Not really, Shane was a very great leader, until the end. When he wanted to save Rick. He thought he died. And he had to leave him, and Lori thought he died, and realized Shane is the only friend she has, then they fucked. And got over it. Rick found out, became batshit inshane.
And, he wanted to keep Rick and his family safe, he realized he was a Danger to this group, a cancer. So, he brought Rick to the field, so Rick can end this. And his family could be safe again. Shane wanted to kill himself for the safety of this group. You could clearly see how he wants Carl to be safe by handing him a gun.
He wasn't really a great leader. If he was, the others wouldn't have basically thrown him over for Rick almost immediately. In the second episode, he was willing to let the group at the department store die without doing anything. He didn't really care about anyone.