“Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.
And yeah I am kind off feminine and when I was in high school people often confused me with a girl so I'm not arguing against that.
As to… more whether I'm all talk or not, well I can't prove that on the Internet where all I am is words and code so I guess there's no point to that part of your argument, whatever I say will be that just words, but if I'm all talk so are you after all to me you are nothing but words, this does not invalidate my argument in any way.
In any case being in his shoes would I last? Who knows, I can tell you that I've had to deal with a lot of shit in my life and unlike Kenny in Season 1 I know how to fight so that's one advantage I have over him, I've had to go without food many times and I know I can last about 3 days without eating anything and still be able to do hard work and 5 days and still be able to walk, are these things that would give me an advantage? Maybe. I'm also fairly agile and very good at climbing … [view original content]
I know, I was really expecting them to go somewhere interesting with that whole Kenny/Arvo thing but they chose a pretty boring and uninteresting path, that whole thing was rather disappointing.
I really hope they learn from all the mistakes they made this Season, because otherwise Season 3 is going to be pretty disappointing.
They could have done so much more with his character. Was very disappointed in the way they treated him, Kenny, Clem being shot, and the entire situation.
Arvo was planning something to break free and escape.
Arvo shot Clementine because he thought Clementine killed his alive sister.
Arvo manipulated the group by provoking Kenny in certain situations.
(determinant) Arvo lied about the medicines being stolen by Jane and Clementine. (S02E04)
Arvo tried to hid the medicines from his group when Clementine and Jane were at the obversation deck. (S02E04)
-Of course the kid wanted to escape. He was a prisoner in a group with a woman who robbed his gun, a girl who killed his sister, and an abusive redneck.
-Well...yeah, we never had the chance to explain ourselves to him, that his sister had died and turned. We never got the chance to relate to him
-Okay...I don't think Arvo had some grand master plan that involved manipulating someone...perhaps you are thinking of Jane?
-Arvo never said they robbed his medicine, he said that they robbed him by taking his gun.
-Unexplained.
About: Kenny
Kenny knew something was going on with "the kid" Arvo, but not everyone saw it.
Kenny was being ruthless against Arvo.
Kenny always tries to do his best for the group. but his methods aren't always.
-Kenny didn't know shit he just wanted someone to blame. Enter defenseless foreign kid.
-Yes
-His methods aren't always....the best. He think what he does is the best and doesn't consider what anyone has to say. (I fixed this truck so I get to say where we're going!)
About: Jane, Mike and Bonnie
Jane thinks that Kenny is out of control, and tries to convince the player (Clementine) about this.
Mike is very easily manipulated.
Bonnie was acting less caring to Arvo then Mike was.
Jane and Kenny talked about Kenny's attitude / behavior against Arvo while Clementine was putting pressure on Luke's wound.
-Jane leaves it up to Clem to determine what her relationship with Kenny is worth. Of course, however, she does see Kenny is unstable and worries about Clementine's well-being.
-Mike was intentionally left as a blank slate of a character who we knew nothing about. This left the door open for him to comfort Arvo and elave the group.
I'm not religious but there is a lot of wisdom in that passage, in any case I'm mostly just pissed at Kenny because throughout Season 1 and 2 I gave him a lot of chances and he failed to prove to me that he was a good man, and to be fair he judged me pretty harshly when I was Lee too so if the saying is right he kinda asked for it.
I can judge him all I want
“Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.
I know, I was really expecting them to go somewhere interesting with that whole Kenny/Arvo thing but they chose a pretty boring and unintere… moresting path, that whole thing was rather disappointing.
I really hope they learn from all the mistakes they made this Season, because otherwise Season 3 is going to be pretty disappointing.
The characters were pretty inconsistent, decisions didn't really matter as unlike in Season one they didn't really colour your relationships to other characters, sure the same shit happened in Season 1 no matter what you did but characters reacted pretty differently based on your decisions and Season 2 has almost none of that, even something as important as staying to watch Kenny brutally murder Carver only gets 1 mention by Luke and 1 by Kenny both of which are determinant.
That's probably the biggest one, but there were a lot, I still enjoyed it but I think it's pretty safe to say that Season 1 was better.
I feel Kenny was the most realistic character out of anyone in S2. He felt like a true jerk which made me enjoy his character even more because it felt was alive. I always liked Kenny because of our ties to the past, however he was a jerk then and was a jerk in S2, but i still chose Ken over Jane because even though Ken is a grade a nutjob, he is our nutjob.
Ha! I guess I'm burned then.
I'm not religious but there is a lot of wisdom in that passage, in any case I'm mostly just pissed at Kenny … morebecause throughout Season 1 and 2 I gave him a lot of chances and he failed to prove to me that he was a good man, and to be fair he judged me pretty harshly when I was Lee too so if the saying is right he kinda asked for it.
I don't think bringing Kenny back was a mistake. The biggest mistake they made was not developing the ideas introduced in early episodes. Alvin was a useless character. Carlos is killed off for no reason other than to show that Sarah is hopeless. Nick and Sarah gone with no consequence. Luke/Kenny rivalry thrown away just to be "unpredictable" which equals sloppy consistency.
I've mentioned this before, but I would have left Kenny at Howe's. With Kenny out of the picture, we are forced to bond closer to the Cabin Group. (Luke, Nick, Sarah, Carlos, Rebecca). Leave Mike out of the picture as well. He did nothing and he was nothing, not even an attempt at developing a character. Nick could take his spot.
Yeah, I mostly agree, he was the most real character, I ended up not killing him too but I stayed at Wellington, I just couldn't bring myself to kill him, though I thought of it as giving him one more chance to redeem himself by not killing Jane, I knew he would kill her though.
I feel Kenny was the most realistic character out of anyone in S2. He felt like a true jerk which made me enjoy his character even more bec… moreause it felt was alive. I always liked Kenny because of our ties to the past, however he was a jerk then and was a jerk in S2, but i still chose Ken over Jane because even though Ken is a grade a nutjob, he is our nutjob.
That was two mistakes, but I can definitely agree on both. Especially the last one. The lack of reaction from characters made it pointless to even choose an option. They didn't react to it, and if they did it was assuredly going to be forgotten soon after. I didn't feel like I was being nice, or mean, or sassy, because no matter what happened the other characters didn't interact with Clementine hardly, only the next event in the overzealous plot.
The characters were pretty inconsistent, decisions didn't really matter as unlike in Season one they didn't really colour your relationships… more to other characters, sure the same shit happened in Season 1 no matter what you did but characters reacted pretty differently based on your decisions and Season 2 has almost none of that, even something as important as staying to watch Kenny brutally murder Carver only gets 1 mention by Luke and 1 by Kenny both of which are determinant.
That's probably the biggest one, but there were a lot, I still enjoyed it but I think it's pretty safe to say that Season 1 was better.
I concur. There were many problems that could be attributed to bringing him back. Including, but not limited to, a lack of realism pertaining to his actual survival and reuniting with Clem; and a severe overshadowing of other characters such as... everyone in the cabin group.
I know it was 2, but they kinda go hand in hand, you can't have them react properly to your actions if they don't have consistent personalities, the most jarring of all is Rebecca though, I didn't even know what to think of her.
In any case the lack of reaction from everyone was definitely the worst part of Season 2, in Season 1 it felt like even normal conversations mattered, besides it felt like I didn't really have a real relationship with anyone, I wasn't really anyone's friend, enemy, rival or whatever I was just kinda sorta there and that's probably the biggest mistake you can make in a game whose main draw is supposedly player choice.
I mean I understand Clementine is a child but still people should react differently towards her depending on how she acts, instead it feels like they use the fact that she is a child to give characters a reason to ignore her and brush aside almost everything she says but it's even more jarring because when they want you to do something important they magically start treating you like an adult.
They made other mistakes but that's the one I'd like them to take into account the most when going into the next Season.
That was two mistakes, but I can definitely agree on both. Especially the last one. The lack of reaction from characters made it pointless t… moreo even choose an option. They didn't react to it, and if they did it was assuredly going to be forgotten soon after. I didn't feel like I was being nice, or mean, or sassy, because no matter what happened the other characters didn't interact with Clementine hardly, only the next event in the overzealous plot.
Define a hero - a person with morals who will stand up and do the right thing, doesn't turn he's/her back on people who need help, brave and fights in bad situation.
Kenny isn't a hero, and its not just because of this Arvo thing, he hardly trust anyone new he meets - and you know that's good in the zombie apocalypse. But in the past it shows he doesn't really want to help strangers, he just wants to take of his family. While he doesn't give up and fights on in a bad situation he's morals are more invert, he thinks about himself more then the rest of the group, and while he love to be the leader of the group he is in, he isn't a good one. Half of the time in series 2 I told him to carm down and think about things logically, he treats clementine like she is stupid in that situation - when she isn't at all. Look people love Kenny to death, but I would not classified Kenny as a hero, and he isn't a good leader. When he is around you just have give him what he wants because there is no auguring with him.
I concur. There were many problems that could be attributed to bringing him back. Including, but not limited to, a lack of realism pertainin… moreg to his actual survival and reuniting with Clem; and a severe overshadowing of other characters such as... everyone in the cabin group.
I feel the other characters gave too much interest in what Clementine had to say. In S1 Clem had a lot of influence on the player, but it wasn't through directly telling us what to do or what she thought most of the time. It was how we saw we were affecting her that made us rethink our stance on what we needed to do. And I agree on your stance on the characters coming to an 11 year old for all the troubles they don't want to take upon themselves. This leads to my biggest annoyance with the season, the fact that the game designers make things that should only be important to the audience also important to the characters. Clem is an 11 year old girl, but in order to give her role in the story more importance they make her do things that she wouldn't normally do. Turning off a wind turbine for example. It makes no sense for her to turn it off, but her being the PC we need to feel that we are the center of attention. In reality she would be as far from the center of attention as anybody could be.
I know it was 2, but they kinda go hand in hand, you can't have them react properly to your actions if they don't have consistent personalit… moreies, the most jarring of all is Rebecca though, I didn't even know what to think of her.
In any case the lack of reaction from everyone was definitely the worst part of Season 2, in Season 1 it felt like even normal conversations mattered, besides it felt like I didn't really have a real relationship with anyone, I wasn't really anyone's friend, enemy, rival or whatever I was just kinda sorta there and that's probably the biggest mistake you can make in a game whose main draw is supposedly player choice.
I mean I understand Clementine is a child but still people should react differently towards her depending on how she acts, instead it feels like they use the fact that she is a child to give characters a reason to ignore her and brush aside almost everything she says but it's even more jarring becau… [view original content]
No. Because his "I know everything" and "treat everyone like shit attitude" literally broke the group apart. HAD he changed his approach, gone more calmer, then yes. But it was literally getting tiring begging Kenny to calm down. So no, in no way was he a hero.
Despite having a completely fluent conversation with Clementine and Jane, he feigns ignorance of the English language several times when talking to Kenny.
He repeatedly ignored Kenny's demands to stay put. He even runs across the ice at one point, and luckily Kenny, Mike, and AJ do not fall into the ice while pursuing him.
The hate in his eyes truly took me aback. Any rational person would take extreme caution if given looks like the ones Arvo was giving Clem and Kenny.
Kenny is the type of person that can pretty accurately judge the character of a person. He didn't like Arvo from the second he saw him, that says a lot to me. We need to keep in mind what Chuck said; you're either living or you're not, that's it. Yeah, Arvo is a teenager but that didn't keep him from becoming an extremely manipulative and vengeful individual.
That's the problem though, they care way more than they should or they don't care at all, it's pretty weird, if we were going to play as Clementine they should have just ran with it, not make us the leader but have us react to situations, maybe let you stay back if you have to or do something you weren't supposed to do because they didn't want you to help, it would have been interesting if you actually made things worse by trying to help once or twice, they had an interesting concept, I had never played an 11 year old girl in a video game but they just had her do what the adults should have been doing, I don't know I just feel like it could have been very interesting, but instead we're kicking down doors to save people... They had a really good premise and it was kinda wasted.
I feel the other characters gave too much interest in what Clementine had to say. In S1 Clem had a lot of influence on the player, but it wa… moresn't through directly telling us what to do or what she thought most of the time. It was how we saw we were affecting her that made us rethink our stance on what we needed to do. And I agree on your stance on the characters coming to an 11 year old for all the troubles they don't want to take upon themselves. This leads to my biggest annoyance with the season, the fact that the game designers make things that should only be important to the audience also important to the characters. Clem is an 11 year old girl, but in order to give her role in the story more importance they make her do things that she wouldn't normally do. Turning off a wind turbine for example. It makes no sense for her to turn it off, but her being the PC we need to feel that we are the center of attention. In reality she would be as far from the center of attention as anybody could be.
I completely agree. The idea of playing an 11 year old girl had me on my toes. I was excited to see the zombie apocalypse from the eyes of someone besides a fully capable adult. From the body of someone who shouldn't have been able to do whatever she wanted. Instead I get a dime a dozen do - all fully capable protagonist/PC in the shape of an 11 year old girl. Kill all the walkers? Fine. Turn of a wind turbine? Fine. Don't mind getting shot in the chest? Fine. Be charged with bringing someone a k from the brink of insanity? Fine. Twice. Be charged with scouting ahead? Fine. Be charged with entry to the bad guys area? Fine. Be charged with searching the building for food? Fine. The list goes on. It's not what I expected and even after I've played it it still makes no sense for it to work that way.
That's the problem though, they care way more than they should or they don't care at all, it's pretty weird, if we were going to play as Cle… morementine they should have just ran with it, not make us the leader but have us react to situations, maybe let you stay back if you have to or do something you weren't supposed to do because they didn't want you to help, it would have been interesting if you actually made things worse by trying to help once or twice, they had an interesting concept, I had never played an 11 year old girl in a video game but they just had her do what the adults should have been doing, I don't know I just feel like it could have been very interesting, but instead we're kicking down doors to save people... They had a really good premise and it was kinda wasted.
I to think of Kenny as a hero.
How far he went to protect Clementine, proved that to me.
A bad man wouldn't go to such lengths.
I never trusted Arvo.
And I supported Kenny's harsh; and suspicious treatment of him.
Since I did not have Clementine steal from Arvo, and after he and his gang tried to rob the group, I never trusted him.
And the gun battle that ensued didn't help things.
After he shot Clementine, that sealed it.
Kenny saw what Arvo really was.
And I'm honestly surprised that Mike was standing up for him.
Yeah Arvo was a kid, but he already had shown what kind of person he was.
If Arvo was a good person, he wouldn't have tried to rob the group, especially if they hadn't stolen from him.
And a decent person, wouldn't ever rob from a group that was caring for a baby.
And the type of men Arvo was running with, were down-right dangerous.
The man that was shooting at Kenny, and who Jane later knifed, shouted, after Kenny had offered to let them go: "I'll kill all of you!"
Would that have included Alvie?
Kenny seemed to have a pretty good read on people.
Even though he was not the most educated, nor the most eloquent or tactful person in the world.
Kenny isn't a hero. He's an anti-hero. He lacks the typical qualities of a hero that Lee had (Unless you play Scumbag Lee, that is). He's stubborn, is prone to losing control, has one hell of a temper, and he can be a real son of a bitch a lot of the time, but he tries to do the right thing and what he honestly thinks is best for the group as much as he can. He's a pretty dark anti-hero, I'll admit, but to me he never crossed into being evil, or a villain. Just broken, likely beyond repair by this point.
He's more of an Anti-hero. He finds a potential problem, then tries to fix it in the easiest way possible. Sometimes that means straight up killing the problem. Truth is there are no typical heroes and villains in a post apocalyptic world. No black and white. Only perspective and grey area. Everyone has a reason for doing bad things, even Carver. He was just trying to keep his camp in line (but in the strictest way possible). If you try to be a hero and always make the good moral choice like my Lee did, you WILL get people killed eventually. He said it himself in the dream. There is just no right answer.
Lose your humanity and have a higher chance at saving the people you care about, or the be a good person and have a lower chance at saving the people you care about. Kenny understands that, he always has.
Would be nice to have a character that tries to and fails miserably though, I mean I get that's exactly what would happen and they keep telling us that but I think it'd be cool if they showed us, just to see what people think of that character, but not minor screw ups, like they are trying to do the right thing and get a really major character or a lot of people killed, I'd like to see if people side with that character because of their good intentions or if they condemn them for screwing up so badly.
He's more of an Anti-hero. He finds a potential problem, then tries to fix it in the easiest way possible. Sometimes that means straight up … morekilling the problem. Truth is there are no typical heroes and villains in a post apocalyptic world. No black and white. Only perspective and grey area. Everyone has a reason for doing bad things, even Carver. He was just trying to keep his camp in line (but in the strictest way possible). If you try to be a hero and always make the good moral choice like my Lee did, you WILL get people killed eventually. He said it himself in the dream. There is just no right answer.
Lose your humanity and have a higher chance at saving the people you care about, or the be a good person and have a lower chance at saving the people you care about. Kenny understands that, he always has.
They could do that by making our choices matter in S3. For example, say for instance it's Clem and Kenny alone. And you run across this guy who's scavenging. He pulls a gun on you but Clem and Kenny eventually get the upper hand on him. Then you have a choice. Kill him or let him go. Naturally most people would pick the "let him go" option because they wanna be a "good" person or whatever. But if you pick that then he comes back with his group and Kenny dies. But if you pick the "kill him" option then Kenny survives. Very basic example but you get the picture. So instead of showing some other character fail, it would be your fault instead.
Would be nice to have a character that tries to and fails miserably though, I mean I get that's exactly what would happen and they keep tell… moreing us that but I think it'd be cool if they showed us, just to see what people think of that character, but not minor screw ups, like they are trying to do the right thing and get a really major character or a lot of people killed, I'd like to see if people side with that character because of their good intentions or if they condemn them for screwing up so badly.
Yeah but that's you, and that already kinda happened with Arvo, still would be a great way to kill off Kenny though, I'd approve.
What I'd like to see is another character, someone who seems so good he would typically be the hero but he keeps getting people killed or endangering everyone, you see what I'm interested in is people's reactions not the character itself, since a lot of people seem to justify and even treat Kenny like a saint despite the fact that he is so morally ambiguous, I'd like to see how they'd react to someone who is clearly good but gets people in trouble/killed because of it, I mean some would immediately classify him as a liability, but would people like him despite that? Kinda like Nick, Sarah and Ben they are liabilities but they aren't bad but people still like them, except this guy is extremely good, kinda like Walter who was all around nice and kinda did the same but didn't live long enough to have it be interesting, you know, if they decided to explore that.
I don't really think it would necessarily be a good idea but I am very curious as to what people would think of a character like that.
They could do that by making our choices matter in S3. For example, say for instance it's Clem and Kenny alone. And you run across this guy … morewho's scavenging. He pulls a gun on you but Clem and Kenny eventually get the upper hand on him. Then you have a choice. Kill him or let him go. Naturally most people would pick the "let him go" option because they wanna be a "good" person or whatever. But if you pick that then he comes back with his group and Kenny dies. But if you pick the "kill him" option then Kenny survives. Very basic example but you get the picture. So instead of showing some other character fail, it would be your fault instead.
Others won't threat you as a little girl or little boy. Did you forget what people do in a zombie apocalypse? Michelle, the cabin group, Jane, Kenny, they all acted like Clementine is a adult, because of her intelligence and capabilities.
The wise words from Hobo King. While they are applicable to a vast array of situations, like teaching a little girl how to shoot a weapon, a… morenybody with a sense of morality will not simply see "alive" or "dead". There is much more to a person than living or not.
The wise words from Hobo King. While they are applicable to a vast array of situations, like teaching a little girl how to shoot a weapon, a… morenybody with a sense of morality will not simply see "alive" or "dead". There is much more to a person than living or not.
Kenny is love, Kenny is life.
Kenny is always right, Kenny is never wrong.
Glory to Kenny, the urban boat god.
Now my shit birds, l… moreet us pray. Hail Kenny full of boats, the stache is with thee Blessed art thou amongst urbans and blessed is the fruit of thy loins, duck holy Kenny father duck pray for us ♥♥♥♥birds now and at the hour of our bite.
-Arvo never said they robbed his medicine, he said that they robbed him by taking his gun.
neither of those. He literally said: "I told them you are the ones who robbed me."
-Kenny didn't know shit he just wanted someone to blame. Enter defenseless foreign kid.
That's not completely true in my opinion, yes it looked like he wanted someone to blame for all of this, yes he was being ruthless against Arvo, but most of his actions were of the thought that he was the one who started the firefight, and that hes playing the group.
About: Arvo aka "the Ruskie" aka "shitbird"
Arvo was planning something to break free and escape.
Arvo shot Clementine because he t… morehought Clementine killed his alive sister.
Arvo manipulated the group by provoking Kenny in certain situations.
(determinant) Arvo lied about the medicines being stolen by Jane and Clementine. (S02E04)
Arvo tried to hid the medicines from his group when Clementine and Jane were at the obversation deck. (S02E04)
-Of course the kid wanted to escape. He was a prisoner in a group with a woman who robbed his gun, a girl who killed his sister, and an abusive redneck.
-Well...yeah, we never had the chance to explain ourselves to him, that his sister had died and turned. We never got the chance to relate to him
-Okay...I don't think Arvo had some grand master plan that involved manipulating someone...perhaps you are thinking of Jane?
-Arvo never said they robbed his medicine, he said that they robb… [view original content]
Define a hero - a person with morals who will stand up and do the right thing, doesn't turn he's/her back on people who need help, brave and… more fights in bad situation.
Kenny isn't a hero, and its not just because of this Arvo thing, he hardly trust anyone new he meets - and you know that's good in the zombie apocalypse. But in the past it shows he doesn't really want to help strangers, he just wants to take of his family. While he doesn't give up and fights on in a bad situation he's morals are more invert, he thinks about himself more then the rest of the group, and while he love to be the leader of the group he is in, he isn't a good one. Half of the time in series 2 I told him to carm down and think about things logically, he treats clementine like she is stupid in that situation - when she isn't at all. Look people love Kenny to death, but I would not classified Kenny as a hero, and he isn't a good leader. When he is around you just have give him what he wants because there is no auguring with him.
Comments
“Do not judge, or you too will be judged. For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.
I'm seriously wondering that as well, so far he's told someone to go fuck themselves, called someone a queer and now calling someone a pussy.
I know, I was really expecting them to go somewhere interesting with that whole Kenny/Arvo thing but they chose a pretty boring and uninteresting path, that whole thing was rather disappointing.
I really hope they learn from all the mistakes they made this Season, because otherwise Season 3 is going to be pretty disappointing.
Arvo was planning something to break free and escape.
Arvo shot Clementine because he thought Clementine killed his alive sister.
Arvo manipulated the group by provoking Kenny in certain situations.
(determinant) Arvo lied about the medicines being stolen by Jane and Clementine. (S02E04)
Arvo tried to hid the medicines from his group when Clementine and Jane were at the obversation deck. (S02E04)
-Of course the kid wanted to escape. He was a prisoner in a group with a woman who robbed his gun, a girl who killed his sister, and an abusive redneck.
-Well...yeah, we never had the chance to explain ourselves to him, that his sister had died and turned. We never got the chance to relate to him
-Okay...I don't think Arvo had some grand master plan that involved manipulating someone...perhaps you are thinking of Jane?
-Arvo never said they robbed his medicine, he said that they robbed him by taking his gun.
-Unexplained.
Kenny knew something was going on with "the kid" Arvo, but not everyone saw it.
Kenny was being ruthless against Arvo.
Kenny always tries to do his best for the group. but his methods aren't always.
-Kenny didn't know shit he just wanted someone to blame. Enter defenseless foreign kid.
-Yes
-His methods aren't always....the best. He think what he does is the best and doesn't consider what anyone has to say. (I fixed this truck so I get to say where we're going!)
Jane thinks that Kenny is out of control, and tries to convince the player (Clementine) about this.
Mike is very easily manipulated.
Bonnie was acting less caring to Arvo then Mike was.
Jane and Kenny talked about Kenny's attitude / behavior against Arvo while Clementine was putting pressure on Luke's wound.
-Jane leaves it up to Clem to determine what her relationship with Kenny is worth. Of course, however, she does see Kenny is unstable and worries about Clementine's well-being.
-Mike was intentionally left as a blank slate of a character who we knew nothing about. This left the door open for him to comfort Arvo and elave the group.
-Bonnie was just kinda there.
Ha! I guess I'm burned then.
I'm not religious but there is a lot of wisdom in that passage, in any case I'm mostly just pissed at Kenny because throughout Season 1 and 2 I gave him a lot of chances and he failed to prove to me that he was a good man, and to be fair he judged me pretty harshly when I was Lee too so if the saying is right he kinda asked for it.
What is the single greatest mistake you think they made this season?
The characters were pretty inconsistent, decisions didn't really matter as unlike in Season one they didn't really colour your relationships to other characters, sure the same shit happened in Season 1 no matter what you did but characters reacted pretty differently based on your decisions and Season 2 has almost none of that, even something as important as staying to watch Kenny brutally murder Carver only gets 1 mention by Luke and 1 by Kenny both of which are determinant.
That's probably the biggest one, but there were a lot, I still enjoyed it but I think it's pretty safe to say that Season 1 was better.
I feel Kenny was the most realistic character out of anyone in S2. He felt like a true jerk which made me enjoy his character even more because it felt was alive. I always liked Kenny because of our ties to the past, however he was a jerk then and was a jerk in S2, but i still chose Ken over Jane because even though Ken is a grade a nutjob, he is our nutjob.
Bringing Kenny back
I don't think bringing Kenny back was a mistake. The biggest mistake they made was not developing the ideas introduced in early episodes. Alvin was a useless character. Carlos is killed off for no reason other than to show that Sarah is hopeless. Nick and Sarah gone with no consequence. Luke/Kenny rivalry thrown away just to be "unpredictable" which equals sloppy consistency.
I've mentioned this before, but I would have left Kenny at Howe's. With Kenny out of the picture, we are forced to bond closer to the Cabin Group. (Luke, Nick, Sarah, Carlos, Rebecca). Leave Mike out of the picture as well. He did nothing and he was nothing, not even an attempt at developing a character. Nick could take his spot.
Yeah, I mostly agree, he was the most real character, I ended up not killing him too but I stayed at Wellington, I just couldn't bring myself to kill him, though I thought of it as giving him one more chance to redeem himself by not killing Jane, I knew he would kill her though.
That was two mistakes, but I can definitely agree on both. Especially the last one. The lack of reaction from characters made it pointless to even choose an option. They didn't react to it, and if they did it was assuredly going to be forgotten soon after. I didn't feel like I was being nice, or mean, or sassy, because no matter what happened the other characters didn't interact with Clementine hardly, only the next event in the overzealous plot.
I concur. There were many problems that could be attributed to bringing him back. Including, but not limited to, a lack of realism pertaining to his actual survival and reuniting with Clem; and a severe overshadowing of other characters such as... everyone in the cabin group.
I know it was 2, but they kinda go hand in hand, you can't have them react properly to your actions if they don't have consistent personalities, the most jarring of all is Rebecca though, I didn't even know what to think of her.
In any case the lack of reaction from everyone was definitely the worst part of Season 2, in Season 1 it felt like even normal conversations mattered, besides it felt like I didn't really have a real relationship with anyone, I wasn't really anyone's friend, enemy, rival or whatever I was just kinda sorta there and that's probably the biggest mistake you can make in a game whose main draw is supposedly player choice.
I mean I understand Clementine is a child but still people should react differently towards her depending on how she acts, instead it feels like they use the fact that she is a child to give characters a reason to ignore her and brush aside almost everything she says but it's even more jarring because when they want you to do something important they magically start treating you like an adult.
They made other mistakes but that's the one I'd like them to take into account the most when going into the next Season.
Define a hero - a person with morals who will stand up and do the right thing, doesn't turn he's/her back on people who need help, brave and fights in bad situation.
Kenny isn't a hero, and its not just because of this Arvo thing, he hardly trust anyone new he meets - and you know that's good in the zombie apocalypse. But in the past it shows he doesn't really want to help strangers, he just wants to take of his family. While he doesn't give up and fights on in a bad situation he's morals are more invert, he thinks about himself more then the rest of the group, and while he love to be the leader of the group he is in, he isn't a good one. Half of the time in series 2 I told him to carm down and think about things logically, he treats clementine like she is stupid in that situation - when she isn't at all. Look people love Kenny to death, but I would not classified Kenny as a hero, and he isn't a good leader. When he is around you just have give him what he wants because there is no auguring with him.
He is not. That douche left me behind in the Drugstore after I tried to help Larry in the Meat Locker, and he tried to come off as a hero after that.
heroes don't exist in the walking dead
Yeah pretty much, it should of been renamed Kenny & Clementine + others... not for long though.
I feel the other characters gave too much interest in what Clementine had to say. In S1 Clem had a lot of influence on the player, but it wasn't through directly telling us what to do or what she thought most of the time. It was how we saw we were affecting her that made us rethink our stance on what we needed to do. And I agree on your stance on the characters coming to an 11 year old for all the troubles they don't want to take upon themselves. This leads to my biggest annoyance with the season, the fact that the game designers make things that should only be important to the audience also important to the characters. Clem is an 11 year old girl, but in order to give her role in the story more importance they make her do things that she wouldn't normally do. Turning off a wind turbine for example. It makes no sense for her to turn it off, but her being the PC we need to feel that we are the center of attention. In reality she would be as far from the center of attention as anybody could be.
No. Because his "I know everything" and "treat everyone like shit attitude" literally broke the group apart. HAD he changed his approach, gone more calmer, then yes. But it was literally getting tiring begging Kenny to calm down. So no, in no way was he a hero.
Kenny is the type of person that can pretty accurately judge the character of a person. He didn't like Arvo from the second he saw him, that says a lot to me. We need to keep in mind what Chuck said; you're either living or you're not, that's it. Yeah, Arvo is a teenager but that didn't keep him from becoming an extremely manipulative and vengeful individual.
WOAH FUCK! Is that scene accurate? He totally didn't beat up Arvo when he was shouting "Leave me alone" in my playthrough.
Or is this a modded scene?
If you don't convince Kenny to rejoin the group at the fire he just knocks Arvo unconscious.
Not modded, all you have to do to trigger it is not have Kenny join the campfire.
That's the problem though, they care way more than they should or they don't care at all, it's pretty weird, if we were going to play as Clementine they should have just ran with it, not make us the leader but have us react to situations, maybe let you stay back if you have to or do something you weren't supposed to do because they didn't want you to help, it would have been interesting if you actually made things worse by trying to help once or twice, they had an interesting concept, I had never played an 11 year old girl in a video game but they just had her do what the adults should have been doing, I don't know I just feel like it could have been very interesting, but instead we're kicking down doors to save people... They had a really good premise and it was kinda wasted.
I completely agree. The idea of playing an 11 year old girl had me on my toes. I was excited to see the zombie apocalypse from the eyes of someone besides a fully capable adult. From the body of someone who shouldn't have been able to do whatever she wanted. Instead I get a dime a dozen do - all fully capable protagonist/PC in the shape of an 11 year old girl. Kill all the walkers? Fine. Turn of a wind turbine? Fine. Don't mind getting shot in the chest? Fine. Be charged with bringing someone a k from the brink of insanity? Fine. Twice. Be charged with scouting ahead? Fine. Be charged with entry to the bad guys area? Fine. Be charged with searching the building for food? Fine. The list goes on. It's not what I expected and even after I've played it it still makes no sense for it to work that way.
I to think of Kenny as a hero.
How far he went to protect Clementine, proved that to me.
A bad man wouldn't go to such lengths.
I never trusted Arvo.
And I supported Kenny's harsh; and suspicious treatment of him.
Since I did not have Clementine steal from Arvo, and after he and his gang tried to rob the group, I never trusted him.
And the gun battle that ensued didn't help things.
After he shot Clementine, that sealed it.
Kenny saw what Arvo really was.
And I'm honestly surprised that Mike was standing up for him.
Yeah Arvo was a kid, but he already had shown what kind of person he was.
If Arvo was a good person, he wouldn't have tried to rob the group, especially if they hadn't stolen from him.
And a decent person, wouldn't ever rob from a group that was caring for a baby.
And the type of men Arvo was running with, were down-right dangerous.
The man that was shooting at Kenny, and who Jane later knifed, shouted, after Kenny had offered to let them go: "I'll kill all of you!"
Would that have included Alvie?
Kenny seemed to have a pretty good read on people.
Even though he was not the most educated, nor the most eloquent or tactful person in the world.
Kenny isn't a hero. He's an anti-hero. He lacks the typical qualities of a hero that Lee had (Unless you play Scumbag Lee, that is). He's stubborn, is prone to losing control, has one hell of a temper, and he can be a real son of a bitch a lot of the time, but he tries to do the right thing and what he honestly thinks is best for the group as much as he can. He's a pretty dark anti-hero, I'll admit, but to me he never crossed into being evil, or a villain. Just broken, likely beyond repair by this point.
He's more of an Anti-hero. He finds a potential problem, then tries to fix it in the easiest way possible. Sometimes that means straight up killing the problem. Truth is there are no typical heroes and villains in a post apocalyptic world. No black and white. Only perspective and grey area. Everyone has a reason for doing bad things, even Carver. He was just trying to keep his camp in line (but in the strictest way possible). If you try to be a hero and always make the good moral choice like my Lee did, you WILL get people killed eventually. He said it himself in the dream. There is just no right answer.
Lose your humanity and have a higher chance at saving the people you care about, or the be a good person and have a lower chance at saving the people you care about. Kenny understands that, he always has.
Sorry, no.
And Jane isn't either.
I want burn both of them in Hell or something.
Would be nice to have a character that tries to and fails miserably though, I mean I get that's exactly what would happen and they keep telling us that but I think it'd be cool if they showed us, just to see what people think of that character, but not minor screw ups, like they are trying to do the right thing and get a really major character or a lot of people killed, I'd like to see if people side with that character because of their good intentions or if they condemn them for screwing up so badly.
They could do that by making our choices matter in S3. For example, say for instance it's Clem and Kenny alone. And you run across this guy who's scavenging. He pulls a gun on you but Clem and Kenny eventually get the upper hand on him. Then you have a choice. Kill him or let him go. Naturally most people would pick the "let him go" option because they wanna be a "good" person or whatever. But if you pick that then he comes back with his group and Kenny dies. But if you pick the "kill him" option then Kenny survives. Very basic example but you get the picture. So instead of showing some other character fail, it would be your fault instead.
Yeah but that's you, and that already kinda happened with Arvo, still would be a great way to kill off Kenny though, I'd approve.
What I'd like to see is another character, someone who seems so good he would typically be the hero but he keeps getting people killed or endangering everyone, you see what I'm interested in is people's reactions not the character itself, since a lot of people seem to justify and even treat Kenny like a saint despite the fact that he is so morally ambiguous, I'd like to see how they'd react to someone who is clearly good but gets people in trouble/killed because of it, I mean some would immediately classify him as a liability, but would people like him despite that? Kinda like Nick, Sarah and Ben they are liabilities but they aren't bad but people still like them, except this guy is extremely good, kinda like Walter who was all around nice and kinda did the same but didn't live long enough to have it be interesting, you know, if they decided to explore that.
I don't really think it would necessarily be a good idea but I am very curious as to what people would think of a character like that.
Others won't threat you as a little girl or little boy. Did you forget what people do in a zombie apocalypse? Michelle, the cabin group, Jane, Kenny, they all acted like Clementine is a adult, because of her intelligence and capabilities.
But it might not be clear now, untill you recognize it in reality.
No....
neither of those. He literally said: "I told them you are the ones who robbed me."
That's not completely true in my opinion, yes it looked like he wanted someone to blame for all of this, yes he was being ruthless against Arvo, but most of his actions were of the thought that he was the one who started the firefight, and that hes playing the group.
I agree with the other points about Kenny.
Agreed about Jane, and the others.
Good point.
Ha. yeah.
"Bros 4 life... Until you disagree with me." - Kenny
(not something actually said in the game...)
source:
They don't? What about the hobo? he saved Clementine when the shit bird ran off.