Actually I partly agree with the execution. The acting was great no problem in that but they could have made it more clear that Sansa was submitting herself for it since it was the only thing she could do. And that is how they wanted the scene to be according to Bryan Cogman.
I think it's just made worse by the way in which they executed the scene, and the fact that it was the last scene in the episode.
It's go… moreing to be an excruciating week until the next episode, and here's hoping she comes back from this swinging.
I cannot wait for Stannis to show up and whip the everloving crap out of the Boltons. :S
You bring up points that make me understand your opinion, still I do not share it. I'm not an optimist about it either, but I rather wait.
Both of those examples were important turning points in the plot.
We don't know yet what will happen to Sansa and how this relationship with Ramsay will affect her and we're going to look like fools if they proove us wrong in the next episode if we complain too much about it now, no?
They're going to forget about it in the very next episode, just like the Jaime/Cersei rape
Yes, this really could happen. I'd also hate to see the rape just becoming a plot device for Theon to take action. In another post I stated that I really would like to see how this affects Sansa rather than Theon or Brienne or any Sansa supporters we don't know by now. And that she actually knows what she's doing or has some kind of plan or perspective besides waiting for rescue. Right now I still have some trust in D&D to handle it well, but it really could go either way.
And, you know, it would just feel really unnatural if Ramsay would spare Sansa his psychopathic ideas of fun. This is just a logical conclusion of walking into the lion's (or rather the flayed man's) den in the previous epsiodes. You could say Sansa has been convinced/tricked by Littlefinger (who hasn't been by now) and now she regrets it and is trying to make the best of it. Yeah, her plot is a bit of a mess, but not beyond recovery.
Both of those examples were important turning points in the plot. This was fucking pointless and just another excuse to generate controversy… more around GoT. They're going to forget about it in the very next episode, just like the Jaime/Cersei rape.
It's a middle finger to Sansa fans because she's safe and happy in the books, which is nice to see. In the show she's just been made to suffer even moreso than before, which is getting tired. What Sansa put up with in King's Landing was already "going against viewer wish fulfillment." Putting her in an unnecessary situation like this, when there's a better alternative that's better for her character, is poorly-thought out writing.
Well you prefer she should have a storyline where she is "safe and happy", right? And I already answered to how she "should be" imo so read again if you didn't understand.
...yes. I want a character I like, who's been through enough shit and is in a different position in the books, to be in the Vale where she'll be relatively safe and happy. How exactly did you extract "no harm must come to her EVER" from that?
Let me just re-iterate my argument here. I think it's bad writing to put a character who they've shown to have gone through development back into the same situation as before and have her end up worse in that position. I don't want her to be invincible. I don't think she should be exempt from harm. Obstacles to overcome on her path to development are fine. Dumping her back into the same shit she's just gotten out of is bad writing.
Sigh I feel like I have to repeat myself, but as I have said before I DO want her character to develop and I think she is developing, just in a more dangerous place than in the books (or do we even know? she might have to go through a lot of shit in the Vale too.) Clearly you just have decide that nope, she has problems = she isn't developing
Putting her back in the exact same position will not develop her in any way, especially not in a realistic way. I think they've fluffed Sansa's characterization entirely at this point.
And in which way is my definition of independent funny? Have I made some kind of definition of it in the first place? I have said that she is growing to be independent not that she is independent now - she isn't independent now in the books either so what's the problem with that?
You think this plot is going to lead to her becoming independent, as opposed to just being more dependent on the people around her to rescue her. She can actually "play the game" in the Vale. I don't see a scenario in which she could "play the game" here.
I wont judge the Vale storyline not being realistic because I haven't had the pleasure to read it yet since we have only had one sample chapter of it. However I do think the way Sansa matured so quickly between AFFC chapters and the sample chapter was a little weird. That of course doesn't mean that the storyline will be bad.
She literally almost cries because Harry is a little bit snooty towards her. I wouldn't call that a massive leap in maturity.
??? No. Why do you keep saying that? I never said it. I just said I'm sick of the "Sansa is a punching bag" plot. Doesn't mean she should be… more invincible. Do you think she should be invincible? It'd explain why you keep saying it.
Well you prefer she should have a storyline where she is "safe and happy", right? And I already answered to how she "should be" imo so read again if you didn't understand.
They jumped her forward out of it with that "Dark Sansa" bollocks to stop her "haters" from complaining, then continued to put her through the exact same plot again only this time at Winterfell. If you actually like seeing characters go through the exact same arc again and again, that's good for you, but I'd appreciate it if you and D&D could keep it out of GoT, please.
Sigh I feel like I have to repeat myself, but as I have said before I DO want her character to develop and I think she is developing, just in a more dangero… [view original content]
To each their own I guess, I was just disappointed to see her once again in this kind of awful situation. My response is made worse by knowing this traumatic incident originally happened to another character in the book.
Actually I partly agree with the execution. The acting was great no problem in that but they could have made it more clear that Sansa was su… morebmitting herself for it since it was the only thing she could do. And that is how they wanted the scene to be according to Bryan Cogman.
To each their own I guess, I was just disappointed to see her once again in this kind of awful situation. My response is made worse by knowing this traumatic incident originally happened to another character in the book.
Well we clearly disagree in one thing: I don't think the situation is the same that it was in KL. Simply because Sansa has already grown from who she was then. And I do think this storyline can and will serve her development just like the Vale storyline will, you talk about people who "will rescue her". Eh, maybe watch the storyline to the end before deciding things. She can play the game in the Vale? Well, as long as it pleases Littlefinger.
Mm, she almost cried because of Harry and then she suddenly bewitched him with her new wittiness that came out of nowhere.
Well you prefer she should have a storyline where she is "safe and happy", right? And I already answered to how she "should be" imo so read … moreagain if you didn't understand.
...yes. I want a character I like, who's been through enough shit and is in a different position in the books, to be in the Vale where she'll be relatively safe and happy. How exactly did you extract "no harm must come to her EVER" from that?
Let me just re-iterate my argument here. I think it's bad writing to put a character who they've shown to have gone through development back into the same situation as before and have her end up worse in that position. I don't want her to be invincible. I don't think she should be exempt from harm. Obstacles to overcome on her path to development are fine. Dumping her back into the same shit she's just gotten out of is bad writing.
Sigh I feel like I have to repeat myself, but as I have said before I DO want her charac… [view original content]
Wait a second, how come you're objecting to the "wittiness" that "came out of nowhere" in TWOW, but you haven't mentioned her sudden schemey powers and black cloak that come even more out of nowhere in Episode 8 of Season 4? The change, the only real development she's shown to go through, happens in literally 1 episode in the show. Yet "sudden wittiness" is the one that annoys you? Despite the fact she's been hanging with Myranda and Littlefinger, and made fun of Corbray earlier in the chapter, so it's not really that "sudden" at all and she could've easily picked it up?
Well we clearly disagree in one thing: I don't think the situation is the same that it was in KL. Simply because Sansa has already grown fro… morem who she was then. And I do think this storyline can and will serve her development just like the Vale storyline will, you talk about people who "will rescue her". Eh, maybe watch the storyline to the end before deciding things. She can play the game in the Vale? Well, as long as it pleases Littlefinger.
Mm, she almost cried because of Harry and then she suddenly bewitched him with her new wittiness that came out of nowhere.
Yes 407 had the vibe that Sansa had changed to a different character, but we know better now. And lying to Royce&co. wasn't that big a thing.
And yes there was making fun of Corbray - which is also part of this "sudden wittiness". And I haven't said it annoys me, just felt weird.
Feels like you just try and pick some things from my posts you can be a smartass about instead of taking note of what I'm actually saying so I won't waste anymore time arguing with you. Have a good day.
Wait a second, how come you're objecting to the "wittiness" that "came out of nowhere" in TWOW, but you haven't mentioned her sudden schemey… more powers and black cloak that come even more out of nowhere in Episode 8 of Season 4? The change, the only real development she's shown to go through, happens in literally 1 episode in the show. Yet "sudden wittiness" is the one that annoys you? Despite the fact she's been hanging with Myranda and Littlefinger, and made fun of Corbray earlier in the chapter, so it's not really that "sudden" at all and she could've easily picked it up?
Well in my opinion and lets be honest after sansas behavior in season 1 we all wanted her to take a lesson and in later seasons she took more than enough but after all she has been throuth instead if growing up and to become more mature we see the same old and stupid arrogant sansa but of course that doesnt excuse what ramsey did to her.
Not going to start a feminist debate, but feminists are people who want 100% equality for everyone, they are just referred to as feminists because their ideals started during the civil rights movement with women activists and their ideals have been going ever since, so...
As for the people who are freaking out about this scene? Aye, THEY can go to hell.
Who gives a damn what feminist want? They already dictate what people play, now they want to dictate what people watch?
They can go to hell, and if they dont like the show then they can stop watching any time.
Please don't generalize, I'm a feminist and still a fan of the show. Marital rape happens in the real world and fiction can reflect that if it's relevant to the story.
Me. Because I'm not a dumb tumblrtard who gets easily offended about the reality of such things. Noone complained about dany being raped, or theon being mutalited, or Theon nearly being raped.
They treated it like it was a big thing though. Ultimately the show is really inconsistent in its portrayal of Sansa and this new thing is really just the latest in a long line of weird moves.
I was trying to spot an inconsistency in your logic, which is what you're supposed to do in arguments, but...okay.
Yes 407 had the vibe that Sansa had changed to a different character, but we know better now. And lying to Royce&co. wasn't that big a t… morehing.
And yes there was making fun of Corbray - which is also part of this "sudden wittiness". And I haven't said it annoys me, just felt weird.
Feels like you just try and pick some things from my posts you can be a smartass about instead of taking note of what I'm actually saying so I won't waste anymore time arguing with you. Have a good day.
I don't remember this much outrage when Talisa, who was pregnant, was stabbed right in her womb, multiple times. I suppose these feminists don't care as much about married mothers and their unborn babies though. Theon was castrated. Where was the outrage for him? If Sansa had her breasts cut off, they'd probably drop dead from their hysterical outrage. Men, expecting mothers, and babies don't matter though, I guess. The Ramsey/Sansa scene was very tame by GoT standards. I wasn't outraged by either scene, nor any others for that matter. I just can't stand feminist hypocrisy. Turn the channel if you don't like it. Nobody's forcing them to watch. If they haven't figured out that GoT is brutal by now, they're idiots.
There have been worse scenes in the series, there will be worse still.
This whole debate is stupid and pointless. I didn't see anything about Ramsay letting his dogs rip someone apart.
Personally, I think it must have been a slow news day for this to have been given so much publicity outside of GoT forums, message boards, etc. Yes, it was uncomfortable to watch and I felt horrible about what happened. However, this is the world that has been presented to viewers/readers. It is harsh and at times brutal. That's why we root for our heroes/heroines so much. Anyone who reads what goes on in the real world today or has read about the dark parts of our history knows that brutality is (unfortunately) a part of reality and GoT is presented as (excepting fantasy elements) a realistic world.
I will continue to watch the show as long as it remains true (at least in spirit) to the world, characters, and situations in the book that make GoT such a dynamic and entertaining show.
I will still watch because honestly, what else could you expect considering the situation Sansa is in? Even if she reached Littlefinger levels of manipulation, you can't manipulate Ramsay because he is a freaking sociopath. He only cares for himself and will do whatever the fuck he feels like, and often he feels like torturing people for the lulz.
What will determine Sansa's strength and how much she's grown is how she reacts and deals with it in the future. Just because she was raped doesn't mean she is back to square one and a weak person.
I don't remember this much outrage when Talisa, who was pregnant, was stabbed right in her womb, multiple times. I suppose these feminists d… moreon't care as much about married mothers and their unborn babies though. Theon was castrated. Where was the outrage for him? If Sansa had her breasts cut off, they'd probably drop dead from their hysterical outrage. Men, expecting mothers, and babies don't matter though, I guess. The Ramsey/Sansa scene was very tame by GoT standards. I wasn't outraged by either scene, nor any others for that matter. I just can't stand feminist hypocrisy. Turn the channel if you don't like it. Nobody's forcing them to watch. If they haven't figured out that GoT is brutal by now, they're idiots.
The very first scene of the show consists of a man being executed for running from some zombies, and a sheltered teenage girl having to have sex with a foreigner of whom she was more or less auctioned off to that she doesn't understand and clearly didn't want to have sex with at the time. It never diverged since. And if you forgot, then Cersei was happy to have a wine glass in her hand and tell Sansa surly stories about what would happen should King's Landing fall up to the point that she was willing to kill off her child and self before being conquered.
This is a setting where women are brood baby-making machines, and have minimalist rights. It was established also episode one. This doesn't mean there aren't strong females; I find the Wildlings-- as in Ygriette, Osha, and Gilly. (Also raped tons, Gilly. Implied, not shown.) Brienne, even though she's regarded as a freak for doing so. Even Margaery, Olenna (Especially Olenna, holy shit) and Cersei within the confines of the hands they're dealt, even if Cersei makes extremely poor decisions she does have a ruthlessness to her that you could equate towards a corporate ladder climber.
Also I find this the thinnest excuse of rape in the series. Which annoys me because it almost feels like justifying it, but two episodes ago she knew she was going to have sex with him, regardless of if it repulsed her or not. Littlefinger told her she didn't have to stay; who knows if he was lying or not. But since she did agree, and went with the plan, we can't say he would have forced her to or not. She even said herself by the time he came back she'd likely be a wed woman. Everyone knows what that means in that series-- Sansa has been romanticizing and raised upon the very principles of being wed to royalty. She knew she'd have to have sex with a man she hated who has conquered her home. Was she suddenly going to be really comfortable with her sexuality and be happy with a jerk she had to have a cool one night stand, especially with Theon lurking about whom she also hated? Absolutely not. This wasn't a controversial shock or anything. It was turning the page, with the previous pages saying "Sansa is going to be raped, or have sex with a man she hates." filled to the brim moments ahead. She, quite literally, walks into it. With an ulterior motive in mind.
Acting shocked that this happened? Its like they're ignoring the show and using it as a screensaver or background noise.
There's a tweet I remember reading a long time ago that I feel applies here. He puts "I'm old enough to remember a time when outrage took effort."
I feel it aptly applies here.
I am seriously getting fed up with these fake "SJW" who get on a soap box about something because it's all the sudden this trendy thing to do. If you believe in something then fine but don't sit there and stand on a soap box about things like rape and domestic violence only to pick and choose when to have a problem with it. It's complete BS and I can't stand those hypocrites, if you wanna stand against it I'm all for it but don't pick and choose which ones are okay and which ones aren't.
This whole scene apparently has so many up in arms but where were they when Cersei was raped huh? I didn't see a huge uproar over that. So people complaining about this one in particular is just a bunch of BS to me because it's all the sudden something trendy to do. I bet half the people complaining about it didn't even see it or don't even watch the show they just want to be "cool".
It pissed me off seeing women that I respect on Twitter come out and act like all men think that rape is ok because they didn't see what was wrong with this scene. That all men should die and that they glorify rape. It hurts me so much because in no way is that the case and it's crap. It's like these women act as if no woman has ever committed rape or done anything violent in their entire existence. This shouldn't be a male vs female issue. It just so happens that rape is a very common thing in the GoT's universe. So many of them say that they've read the books and love the books yet they didn't seem to be offended by what actually happened in the books which is much worse.
I'm just so sick of these fake soap boxers. I'm going to continue to watch the show despite this season being relatively boring because I support the show and like the show. If people wanna say that they aren't going to watch it anymore because of this scene? Psh, let them watch SpongeBob or something. Game of Thrones is a Mature show you knew what you were getting into by watching it.
Man, out of all the things people get pissed about, a freaking TV show of all things. Of course we know that this goes on everywhere, but just puzzles me when people could be worrying about a lot more important things in life. Correct me if I'm wrong( I don't watch the GoT show, but I read the books... only on book one though ), but if the show follows the book (with slight changes I believe) wouldn't half the GoT fan base already know that scene was going to happen?...If the books are even that far? Or is it extremely different now?
Yeah the new season is diverging in a lot of different ways, including merging or altering of certain storylines. People who read the books only have a loose idea of what might happen at this point.
Man, out of all the things people get pissed about, a freaking TV show of all things. Of course we know that this goes on everywhere, but ju… morest puzzles me when people could be worrying about a lot more important things in life. Correct me if I'm wrong( I don't watch the GoT show, but I read the books... only on book one though ), but if the show follows the book (with slight changes I believe) wouldn't half the GoT fan base already know that scene was going to happen?...If the books are even that far? Or is it extremely different now?
Those "feminists" are giving women a bad name. So watching poor old Theon be tortured for hours before having his dick cut off, then being kept as Ramsay's "pet" is perfectly acceptable.
But a man taking his wife (dont get me wrong, I am aware it was rape) is not? In medieval times women didn't mean much, very few married for love, and I bet even less were happy. I didn't see this as rape, so much as Ramsay showing he had no more care for her, than a brothel whore. She was his, and he would treat and use her as he wanted to.
Sansa needs to come to terms with this Asap, accept it, live with it, and ultimately use it to get close to him and under his skin. Before using it against him if she wants a chance to survive. If not, she may as well slit her wrists, because this is her life now..
I thought the actors and the directors did an amazing job of implying a lot, with merely showing anything. All those people up in arms about it need to get a grip. This was realistic for the time period. And they did a great job.
Man, out of all the things people get pissed about, a freaking TV show of all things. Of course we know that this goes on everywhere, but ju… morest puzzles me when people could be worrying about a lot more important things in life. Correct me if I'm wrong( I don't watch the GoT show, but I read the books... only on book one though ), but if the show follows the book (with slight changes I believe) wouldn't half the GoT fan base already know that scene was going to happen?...If the books are even that far? Or is it extremely different now?
Well.. I think the scene was crossing the line a bit but on the other hand it is far from the worst I've seen game of thrones wise. I think if anything: that people should have reacted way more strongly towards the image of the flayed 'ironborn' in s04.08. This is the same serie where entire families are massacred together and then getting their bodies sacriledged without any respect for the dead. I am sorry but if people can't stand watching the rape I am surprised they manage to cope with much of the violence which is about 10 times worse. Don't forget the scene where Ramsay has his dogs rip Tansy apart in the forest either.
I don't get it. What show do they think they've been watching? What series?
GoT's always been a rancid place to be a gal, like, from the start.
Terribly unfair, but the fans ought've known that from the start. This is just par for the course, really.
Which is why I hope that the White Walkers succeed in killinating most of these unsavory characters before Dragonborne swoops in and takes care of business like her forefather with hopefully less megalomania.
Yeah the new season is diverging in a lot of different ways, including merging or altering of certain storylines. People who read the books only have a loose idea of what might happen at this point.
Comments
All I know is, if anyone tries to do this to Mira, they're dead.
COMMON guys seriously she married the guy what did u expect ?
he isn't tyrion he is Ramsy and u all knew what should have happen for a girl who got married (go to bed)
especially GoT
she accepted and he did it that's it
Actually I partly agree with the execution. The acting was great no problem in that but they could have made it more clear that Sansa was submitting herself for it since it was the only thing she could do. And that is how they wanted the scene to be according to Bryan Cogman.
You bring up points that make me understand your opinion, still I do not share it. I'm not an optimist about it either, but I rather wait.
We don't know yet what will happen to Sansa and how this relationship with Ramsay will affect her and we're going to look like fools if they proove us wrong in the next episode if we complain too much about it now, no?
Yes, this really could happen. I'd also hate to see the rape just becoming a plot device for Theon to take action. In another post I stated that I really would like to see how this affects Sansa rather than Theon or Brienne or any Sansa supporters we don't know by now. And that she actually knows what she's doing or has some kind of plan or perspective besides waiting for rescue. Right now I still have some trust in D&D to handle it well, but it really could go either way.
And, you know, it would just feel really unnatural if Ramsay would spare Sansa his psychopathic ideas of fun. This is just a logical conclusion of walking into the lion's (or rather the flayed man's) den in the previous epsiodes. You could say Sansa has been convinced/tricked by Littlefinger (who hasn't been by now) and now she regrets it and is trying to make the best of it. Yeah, her plot is a bit of a mess, but not beyond recovery.
...yes. I want a character I like, who's been through enough shit and is in a different position in the books, to be in the Vale where she'll be relatively safe and happy. How exactly did you extract "no harm must come to her EVER" from that?
Let me just re-iterate my argument here. I think it's bad writing to put a character who they've shown to have gone through development back into the same situation as before and have her end up worse in that position. I don't want her to be invincible. I don't think she should be exempt from harm. Obstacles to overcome on her path to development are fine. Dumping her back into the same shit she's just gotten out of is bad writing.
Putting her back in the exact same position will not develop her in any way, especially not in a realistic way. I think they've fluffed Sansa's characterization entirely at this point.
You think this plot is going to lead to her becoming independent, as opposed to just being more dependent on the people around her to rescue her. She can actually "play the game" in the Vale. I don't see a scenario in which she could "play the game" here.
She literally almost cries because Harry is a little bit snooty towards her. I wouldn't call that a massive leap in maturity.
To each their own I guess, I was just disappointed to see her once again in this kind of awful situation. My response is made worse by knowing this traumatic incident originally happened to another character in the book.
Jeyne had it much, much worse...
Well we clearly disagree in one thing: I don't think the situation is the same that it was in KL. Simply because Sansa has already grown from who she was then. And I do think this storyline can and will serve her development just like the Vale storyline will, you talk about people who "will rescue her". Eh, maybe watch the storyline to the end before deciding things. She can play the game in the Vale? Well, as long as it pleases Littlefinger.
Mm, she almost cried because of Harry and then she suddenly bewitched him with her new wittiness that came out of nowhere.
Who ever in existence praised 50 shades of grey for anything? Lmao
Wait a second, how come you're objecting to the "wittiness" that "came out of nowhere" in TWOW, but you haven't mentioned her sudden schemey powers and black cloak that come even more out of nowhere in Episode 8 of Season 4? The change, the only real development she's shown to go through, happens in literally 1 episode in the show. Yet "sudden wittiness" is the one that annoys you? Despite the fact she's been hanging with Myranda and Littlefinger, and made fun of Corbray earlier in the chapter, so it's not really that "sudden" at all and she could've easily picked it up?
I don't remember anyone complaining when Tyrion told the story of his first wife.
Yes 407 had the vibe that Sansa had changed to a different character, but we know better now. And lying to Royce&co. wasn't that big a thing.
And yes there was making fun of Corbray - which is also part of this "sudden wittiness". And I haven't said it annoys me, just felt weird.
Feels like you just try and pick some things from my posts you can be a smartass about instead of taking note of what I'm actually saying so I won't waste anymore time arguing with you. Have a good day.
Well in my opinion and lets be honest after sansas behavior in season 1 we all wanted her to take a lesson and in later seasons she took more than enough but after all she has been throuth instead if growing up and to become more mature we see the same old and stupid arrogant sansa but of course that doesnt excuse what ramsey did to her.
Not going to start a feminist debate, but feminists are people who want 100% equality for everyone, they are just referred to as feminists because their ideals started during the civil rights movement with women activists and their ideals have been going ever since, so...
As for the people who are freaking out about this scene? Aye, THEY can go to hell.
Please don't generalize, I'm a feminist and still a fan of the show. Marital rape happens in the real world and fiction can reflect that if it's relevant to the story.
lol who gives a shit about what those degenerates(feminists) think or say.
Me. Because I'm not a dumb tumblrtard who gets easily offended about the reality of such things. Noone complained about dany being raped, or theon being mutalited, or Theon nearly being raped.
They treated it like it was a big thing though. Ultimately the show is really inconsistent in its portrayal of Sansa and this new thing is really just the latest in a long line of weird moves.
I was trying to spot an inconsistency in your logic, which is what you're supposed to do in arguments, but...okay.
Anyone who actually read the books knows just how lucky Sansa was.. (I know it's Jeyne aka FArya)
And you all think you actually hate Ramsey. HA!
I don't remember this much outrage when Talisa, who was pregnant, was stabbed right in her womb, multiple times. I suppose these feminists don't care as much about married mothers and their unborn babies though. Theon was castrated. Where was the outrage for him? If Sansa had her breasts cut off, they'd probably drop dead from their hysterical outrage. Men, expecting mothers, and babies don't matter though, I guess. The Ramsey/Sansa scene was very tame by GoT standards. I wasn't outraged by either scene, nor any others for that matter. I just can't stand feminist hypocrisy. Turn the channel if you don't like it. Nobody's forcing them to watch. If they haven't figured out that GoT is brutal by now, they're idiots.
Personally, I think it must have been a slow news day for this to have been given so much publicity outside of GoT forums, message boards, etc. Yes, it was uncomfortable to watch and I felt horrible about what happened. However, this is the world that has been presented to viewers/readers. It is harsh and at times brutal. That's why we root for our heroes/heroines so much. Anyone who reads what goes on in the real world today or has read about the dark parts of our history knows that brutality is (unfortunately) a part of reality and GoT is presented as (excepting fantasy elements) a realistic world.
I will continue to watch the show as long as it remains true (at least in spirit) to the world, characters, and situations in the book that make GoT such a dynamic and entertaining show.
People also said they would stop playing the Walking Dead if Kenny returned.
Do you watch the show or read the books anyway Flog? I forget if you do or don't.
I will still watch because honestly, what else could you expect considering the situation Sansa is in? Even if she reached Littlefinger levels of manipulation, you can't manipulate Ramsay because he is a freaking sociopath. He only cares for himself and will do whatever the fuck he feels like, and often he feels like torturing people for the lulz.
What will determine Sansa's strength and how much she's grown is how she reacts and deals with it in the future. Just because she was raped doesn't mean she is back to square one and a weak person.
You must really like talking about Kenny, huh?
This is a great discussion everyone. I never had this many people contribute to my threads before.
It's not the ending that bothers me, but Dorne. And Littlefingers plan is pretty ridiculous, but Dorne is the real problem.
I'm not going to stop watching, but seriously, couldn't they go with the Queenmaker plot and let Jaime take the role of Swann?
Rape is a touchy subject. People get way more outraged about that than almost anything else.
The very first scene of the show consists of a man being executed for running from some zombies, and a sheltered teenage girl having to have sex with a foreigner of whom she was more or less auctioned off to that she doesn't understand and clearly didn't want to have sex with at the time. It never diverged since. And if you forgot, then Cersei was happy to have a wine glass in her hand and tell Sansa surly stories about what would happen should King's Landing fall up to the point that she was willing to kill off her child and self before being conquered.
This is a setting where women are brood baby-making machines, and have minimalist rights. It was established also episode one. This doesn't mean there aren't strong females; I find the Wildlings-- as in Ygriette, Osha, and Gilly. (Also raped tons, Gilly. Implied, not shown.) Brienne, even though she's regarded as a freak for doing so. Even Margaery, Olenna (Especially Olenna, holy shit) and Cersei within the confines of the hands they're dealt, even if Cersei makes extremely poor decisions she does have a ruthlessness to her that you could equate towards a corporate ladder climber.
Also I find this the thinnest excuse of rape in the series. Which annoys me because it almost feels like justifying it, but two episodes ago she knew she was going to have sex with him, regardless of if it repulsed her or not. Littlefinger told her she didn't have to stay; who knows if he was lying or not. But since she did agree, and went with the plan, we can't say he would have forced her to or not. She even said herself by the time he came back she'd likely be a wed woman. Everyone knows what that means in that series-- Sansa has been romanticizing and raised upon the very principles of being wed to royalty. She knew she'd have to have sex with a man she hated who has conquered her home. Was she suddenly going to be really comfortable with her sexuality and be happy with a jerk she had to have a cool one night stand, especially with Theon lurking about whom she also hated? Absolutely not. This wasn't a controversial shock or anything. It was turning the page, with the previous pages saying "Sansa is going to be raped, or have sex with a man she hates." filled to the brim moments ahead. She, quite literally, walks into it. With an ulterior motive in mind.
Acting shocked that this happened? Its like they're ignoring the show and using it as a screensaver or background noise.
There's a tweet I remember reading a long time ago that I feel applies here. He puts "I'm old enough to remember a time when outrage took effort."
I feel it aptly applies here.
I am seriously getting fed up with these fake "SJW" who get on a soap box about something because it's all the sudden this trendy thing to do. If you believe in something then fine but don't sit there and stand on a soap box about things like rape and domestic violence only to pick and choose when to have a problem with it. It's complete BS and I can't stand those hypocrites, if you wanna stand against it I'm all for it but don't pick and choose which ones are okay and which ones aren't.
This whole scene apparently has so many up in arms but where were they when Cersei was raped huh? I didn't see a huge uproar over that. So people complaining about this one in particular is just a bunch of BS to me because it's all the sudden something trendy to do. I bet half the people complaining about it didn't even see it or don't even watch the show they just want to be "cool".
It pissed me off seeing women that I respect on Twitter come out and act like all men think that rape is ok because they didn't see what was wrong with this scene. That all men should die and that they glorify rape. It hurts me so much because in no way is that the case and it's crap. It's like these women act as if no woman has ever committed rape or done anything violent in their entire existence. This shouldn't be a male vs female issue. It just so happens that rape is a very common thing in the GoT's universe. So many of them say that they've read the books and love the books yet they didn't seem to be offended by what actually happened in the books which is much worse.
I'm just so sick of these fake soap boxers. I'm going to continue to watch the show despite this season being relatively boring because I support the show and like the show. If people wanna say that they aren't going to watch it anymore because of this scene? Psh, let them watch SpongeBob or something. Game of Thrones is a Mature show you knew what you were getting into by watching it.
Man, out of all the things people get pissed about, a freaking TV show of all things. Of course we know that this goes on everywhere, but just puzzles me when people could be worrying about a lot more important things in life. Correct me if I'm wrong( I don't watch the GoT show, but I read the books... only on book one though
), but if the show follows the book (with slight changes I believe) wouldn't half the GoT fan base already know that scene was going to happen?...If the books are even that far? Or is it extremely different now?
Yeah the new season is diverging in a lot of different ways, including merging or altering of certain storylines. People who read the books only have a loose idea of what might happen at this point.
Those "feminists" are giving women a bad name. So watching poor old Theon be tortured for hours before having his dick cut off, then being kept as Ramsay's "pet" is perfectly acceptable.
But a man taking his wife (dont get me wrong, I am aware it was rape) is not? In medieval times women didn't mean much, very few married for love, and I bet even less were happy. I didn't see this as rape, so much as Ramsay showing he had no more care for her, than a brothel whore. She was his, and he would treat and use her as he wanted to.
Sansa needs to come to terms with this Asap, accept it, live with it, and ultimately use it to get close to him and under his skin. Before using it against him if she wants a chance to survive. If not, she may as well slit her wrists, because this is her life now..
I thought the actors and the directors did an amazing job of implying a lot, with merely showing anything. All those people up in arms about it need to get a grip. This was realistic for the time period. And they did a great job.
The show no longer follows the books and most of the viewership hasn't read the books (or so I'm told).
I will continue. But this season is so boring imo.
Well.. I think the scene was crossing the line a bit but on the other hand it is far from the worst I've seen game of thrones wise. I think if anything: that people should have reacted way more strongly towards the image of the flayed 'ironborn' in s04.08. This is the same serie where entire families are massacred together and then getting their bodies sacriledged without any respect for the dead. I am sorry but if people can't stand watching the rape I am surprised they manage to cope with much of the violence which is about 10 times worse. Don't forget the scene where Ramsay has his dogs rip Tansy apart in the forest either.
I don't get it. What show do they think they've been watching? What series?
GoT's always been a rancid place to be a gal, like, from the start.
Terribly unfair, but the fans ought've known that from the start. This is just par for the course, really.
Which is why I hope that the White Walkers succeed in killinating most of these unsavory characters before Dragonborne swoops in and takes care of business like her forefather with hopefully less megalomania.
All right, thank you for clearing that up.
Thanks for letting me know!
If you think that scene was extreme then you didn't see this.
Warning! Pretty hardcore stuff!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5rUypc09_A
Thata not exactly true. Its mixing book plots with new material.