Season 2 Ending
So I've seen a lot of the youtubers shoot Kenny at the end and that got me thinking what if it was the other way around. Just imagine that Jane prevails and is about to kill Kenny and you get the option to look away or shoot her. Or another option being for a choice to shoot either one with no option to look away. I just feel like some people were really screwed because of this decision for assuming that Kenny was the bad guy while Jane was the psycho all along. Anyway I chose Kenny and I'm happy but I always wonder if there would be a significant difference if you had the option to shoot Jane. What do you guys think?
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I would be happy.
The thing is it was originally planned for Jane to be on top of Kenny and you would be given the option to shoot Jane instead. And I'm sure if they kept it that way, a lot more people would have shot Jane. I think a lot of people that chose to shoot Kenny did so because they thought Jane was the victim of Kenny's aggression and felt that it was time to stop Kenny in order to protect her.
I really wanted that to happen. Jane was an annoying shit.
I kind of liked Jane before she developed that harebrained scheme of hers. In episodes 3 and 4 her character was a lone survivor with tragic past and trust issues, but in the final episode it turns out that her tragedy has made her paranoid. Jane started to become obsessive about Kenny and it was more and more obvious that Jane can't be trusted, even before she risked the lives of the entire group just to make a point. I would have shot her myself if there would have been such option. But as there wasn't I allowed Kenny to kill her.
Jane was just another Molly the moment I saw her in Episode 3. I was proven right when she mentioned her sister and the fact that she works alone.
Yes, everyone who chose Jane only did so because they were tricked. No-one would ever in their right mind disagree with what you think is right. You're Jesus.
I think its pretty funny how many ways people come up with to continue the Jane v. Kenny debate.
He kind of has a point though. How the alternatives are portrayed can affect to the outcome. In this situation where man is killing a woman many people instinctively decide to protect the woman, despite the fact that the woman is portrayed like she might have murdered a baby few moments earlier.
Personally I almost shot Kenny just because I wanted to pull the trigger and make Clem shoot someone during the game's final battle. But in the end I decided against it, because Kenny had been part of the team since A New Day and Jane was just a newcomer who had possibly killed a baby (or so I thought at that time).
Telltale want to make balanced choices as much as possible - they have stated this before.
They changed who was on top because otherwise too many people would have sided with Kenny - you're right that lots of people instinctively shoot the attacker over the attacked (really don't think gender has anything to do with the situation here...), but lots of people instinctively side with someone they've been with for 9 episodes over 3 episodes. They had to balance it somehow, and considering most people who shot Kenny still went with Jane, they can't have been too thrown by the positioning of the people in the fight.
Wasn't Jane actually supposed to have the upper hand in the fight originally, and then it was changed to Kenny on top of Jane? Ultimately my decision would not have changed, I would have saved Kenny and shot Jane, and went onward to Wellington with him. Then left Wellington with Kenny.
Jane was not another Molly. Jane treated some members of the group like liabilities (like Sarah, because of her anxiety/whatever it was that she had). This is exactly what Crawford did. I imagine that Molly would not be too fond of Jane, since she stands for everything that Molly is against. However, I do see the similarities in that they both had younger sisters and preferred solitude.
I think she was obsessive over clem and was desperate to make her her 'new little sister' that she would do anything to win her over, even if that meant getting kenny (clems friend) out of the way.
I think they changed that because they knew everyone would shoot jane if she was trying to kill kenny, clearly. I know I would've.
That's so true, I was tricked and ended up staying with her and forgiving her because I knew it would be the best thing for AJ. (There was formula back at Howes)
It's not always true. I don't think that for example Doug and Carley was very balanced.
In this case they managed to make Kenny look bad, but somehow it felt forced. The ugly truth is that, despite the aggressiveness, Kenny's behavior was much more rational than Team Arvo's. Seriously considering everything that guy did and how much he caused trouble to the group, they should have put a bullet through his head the first time they encountered him.
And I think that gender can affect to decision, because people usually consider that violence against the women is a very bad thing and it might be against their morals to allow Kenny to kill Jane, despite the fact that Jane actively tried to make Clem abandon Sarah and then she came up with this plan that she pretends to be a baby killer. She clearly was a bad influence to Clem.
True. I believe that a few knew that Jane was tricking by how she talked to Clementine though.
I'm more worried about the guy who named the newborn baby in the exact same way he named his son. "Alvin Jr." just like "Kenny Jr."; a nickname like "AJ," just like a nickname like "Duck"; and naming the baby after the father--"Alvin Jr." just like "Kenny Jr."
Also I disagree Jane was being obsessive. Jane didn't do it just to get Kenny out of the way, but to stop his suicidal mission to find Wellington in the middle of nowhere.
I still would have left with Jane and turned away the family at the end.
You say that as if your opinion is fact.
Jane's attempts to stop that plan were stupid considering that Kenny's plan actually worked and he did find Wellington. Although it didn't turn out to be very welcoming place and Christa wasn't there, but at least they offered a place to live for the children.
Worst part of it is that Jane doesn't give a damn if Clem makes it perfectly clear to her that she doesn't want to go to Howe's or abandon Kenny. Jane just wants to make a point no matter what it costs. What kind of person makes a plan which forces a child to watch how her friend kills another friend or forces a child to shoot her longtime friend?
She wasnt expecting it to go that far, things just escalated because Kenny charges like a bull instead of thinking first.
She could have stopped it anytime she wanted by telling the truth, but even when she was about to die she decided to make a point and stay quiet. She not only refuses to back down, but she is also the first who uses a knife in the fight, which then escalates from a fistfight into a more serious confrontation.
Her silence could have also got AJ killed if Clem hadn't heard AJ's crying.
Thats not how it went in my playthrough. Thats the problem with so many determinant factors, I guess.
Hindsight is 20/20, isn't it? Also, this is the exact kind of argument that's so frustrating. By all logic, Kenny should never have found Wellington in such a short amount of time when they had no clue where it was. Honestly if you're being realistic they should have died first or at least have been starving to death when they found it because it would take so long to. Just because the writers favor Kenny so much and keep making him so lucky doesn't mean his plans are foolproof and the best thing to do.
The "point" she was making was Kenny is incredibly irrational--so irrational in fact that he wouldn't even consider a different plan than Wellington, and if she didn't stop him, he would get them all killed. She was protecting them all from Kenny's hare-brained plan. In my opinion she didn't want to fight or kill him in the beginning, and she actually offered to let Kenny go (there's no solid evidence you have that she wanted to kill Kenny from the start.) It depends on how you view the fight but that's what I believe (and I also believe in the concept of innocent until proven guilty.) Jane made the decision to kill him when she deemed his violent stubborn ways too much. She had to do something, or else he was leading them all to their deaths by looking for Wellington in the middle of nowhere.
If Kenny had just asked her exactly what had happened like any sane normal person would have instead of asuming the worst and attacking her, there wouldn't have been a fight in the first place, and Jane wouldn't have felt the need to execute him. It was obvious to most everyone I think that Jane wasn't telling the whole truth about AJ, and you could've gotten the real truth out of her eventually if you just properly questioned her, and I believe she would've cracked and told the truth eventually if Kenny was being rational and non-violent and she saw no need to keep the charade going. If he was that rational though (which is of course, out of character for him), then he would've been rational enough to listen to other options on where to go besides Wellington in the first place, and the whole mess would've never happened.
It's not just a hindsight, because they had general idea where Wellington was and they had heard about the place from many people. Just because Jane lost her faith to the plan doesn't mean that Kenny's and Clementine's plan was reckless. Wellington was there and it was just matter of time before they would find it.
Finding Wellington was Clementine's main goal during this season and Jane was trying to make her abandon the idea of finding Wellington and Christa. While Wellington turned out to be a disappointment it doesn't mean that Howe's was better or safer alternative. Jane's behavior can be justified if player makes a decision that Clem doesn't want to go to Wellington, then it's Kenny who is refusing to listen what Clem and Jane want. Although I still think that Jane's plan to act like she had killed AJ was idiotic. But there is no excuse in cases where Clem clearly states that she wants to go to Wellington and doesn't want to abandon Kenny.
And you're right that Kenny acted aggressively. However he was a broken man and provoking person, who is in a such state of mind, into a fight isn't a good idea. If you do that you'll deserve everything you get. Maybe he was bit unstable, but he did show regret when he realized how badly he had behaved.
From Clem's point of view it would have been probably best if both Jane and Kenny were dead, but personally I didn't want to execute an old friend just because he had suffered a lot (and I still felt sorry about Sarita's arm). Personally I think that only rational person in the final episode of Season 2 was Clem. Kenny had anger issues, although I agreed with him about getting rid of Arvo and finding Wellington. Jane (who had been good character in the previous two episodes) became obsessed and had that idiotic plan which turned out to be a complete disaster. And then there's Team Arvo, who were the biggest idiots of the entire game series. Arvo had just ambushed them with a bunch of Russian brutes and they decide to team up with him, rob their own group and worst of all they even gave a weapon to Arvo.