Lee Vs Joel!
Lee Everetts, from TWD.
Vs.
Joel from The Last Of Us.
Both are Hellacious fighters!
But in a fight-to-the-death scenario, who do you think would win?
I'm a bit undecided at this moment, and I will add my own thoughts later.
But in the meantime, I invite you to share your thoughts.
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Comments
Joel
Well Joel has more experience seeing as he's caused the death of likely millions through his actions, so him probably.
Why all these TLOU threads
Lee's dead lol
Easier question? Please? No...? k
joel lasted 20 years+ and is still alive, lee didnt last a year.
Wow dude. I would love to "share my thoughts" on the subject, but I don't think this even counts as a thought: Joel would destroy Lee. 10 billion times over before Lee even gets the chance to blink.
How you are "undecided" about this it out of my world.
Sorry about the attitude, I just find your question very stupid.
Joel for sure. I love Lee, but Joel survived 20+ years in the apocalypse compared to Lee lasting about a year.
Milions? That's gross exaggeration.
I honestly don't know, yes Joel has survived way longer but Lee didn't die because of weakness or stupidity, he just got unlucky one second, Joel himself says that the reason he's still alive "it's called luck, and it's gonna run out". Then, think that Lee got an arm chopped off and he could still make extraordinary jumps, choke a man to death even after getting shot and open his way through a horde of zombies even after getting infected. Would Joel be able to do this? Who knows...
So, Clementine survived two years, Lee four months, hence Clementine would beat Lee to a pulp in a fight.
That's your logic.
You call a man who's got past a horde of zombies with one arm after being infected a chicken?
It's a "fight to the death" scenario. None of what you said matters. Lee wouldn't stand a chance.
Oh, and comparing walkers to the infected in the last of us is just ridiculous.
In TLOU there's active military activity, there are settlements, it's a relatively easier apocalypse in which to survive. What I said was meant to explain why Lee would stand a little chance, he's done things no ordinary man could do (all that fatigue merely minutes after getting an arm chopped off). And I've never compared the two kind of zombies, I was actually wondering if Joel could defeat a horde of TWD zombies with just one arm and a meat cleaver.
Yes there is. But that's not the point in this discussion. And even so, wouldn't there be some kind of settlements or somewhat working societies in the TWD universe after 20 years as well? I get your point that it's easier to survive in the last of us from the start and that Lee had a tougher time doing so. But don't forget what happened to Joel during the outbreak, that's a serious psychological baggage to carry during the following rough years. Sure, kind of the same thing happened to Lee. But not in that gruesome way and he wasn't that close to his family, there's the difference.
Oh I'm sorry for the misconception then. Joel did go through some incredible shit as well. Don't forget that steel thing that penetrated him before the winter chapter. No ordinary man as you put it could manage to survive that. He did get help from Ellie yes, but still, it's an incredible feat.
Either way, none of that really matters in a fight to the death. And I've assumed all along that this scenario consists of a flat environment and fists only. Joel would win that fight simply because he's stronger, more experienced/trained and just tougher in general. Even with weapons.
The real question should be if we suppose a 20 year younger Joel. That one is interesting,
Hello again Handsome. But yes, Joel's actions pretty much doomed mankind. The exact number only depends on how many was still alive at that point.
All he did was not allow Ellie's operation to go on, he hasn't killed those million people directly. What Joel did is something that even Lee might have been capable to do.
You're right about that
Well, Rick Grimes in the comic got pierced to the hip by a crossbow bolt during a battle, sure he received proper medical care two hours later, but it's not much different from what happened to Joel, so it doesn't require much of a strength to survive such a thing.
More experienced and trained? Yes. Tougher? Yes. Stronger? That I don't know, Lee's strangled an armed person with one hand after a severe trauma, and since strength is the most important factor, I'd say Lee has at least a chance against Joel.
Joel at the beginning of the outbreak is 28/29, Lee is 37, I'd guess Lee to be the winner for that one.
umm i never said clementine could beat up lee
I know, your logic did.
k
If it was early-apocalypse Joel vs. Lee, Lee would probably kick his ass
If it was current-day Joel vs. a 20-years-later Lee, that would be pretty interesting too see as well. Lee didn't even survive half of a year in the apocalypse, but he seemed to be quite capable in the short time he was around. What 20 years surviving in that world could do to Lee would certainly be interesting, to say the least.
When you think about it, it's hard to say how much of what Joel does is the result of him actually being that strong and capable, and how much is because of the fact that he's the playable character in a third-person action game. He's a 50-something year old guy that used to be a carpenter or something. Sure, 20 years living in a world like that, especially when he took to the darker side of survival explains a lot of his skills, but still. How many living people do you kill throughout the game again? 100, probably even more? And almost all of those kills are during actual fights. Then you have the fact that half of the people he fights are organized groups of people that are just as ruthless and hardened as he is (Hunters, bandits) or trained fighters and people with actual military experience (the Fireflies and actual military). And in the case of the Hunters, they're a group of people that managed to over-turn the military control of the city, and have killed what we can presume to be hundreds of people that have come through. Then Joel comes along and manages to take a large fraction of them out with ease, to the point where they actually start to fear him? Even with a military humvee they still can't seem to take him out. The initial Hunter ambush and him getting impaled are about the only two times he ever comes relatively close to actually being beaten in a fight, or where he really displays some level of mortality.
If you were to strip all of the game-y elements out of the equation for Joel, he'd probably be an above-average fighter at best
Very Valid Points.
You're right. I'm not sure what Flog61s point was. I just reacted to "caused the death of likely millions through his actions". Which is true. But you are right, it's irrelevant.
Well there's a difference in my opinion. I haven't read the comics, so I'm not totally sure. But don't you agree there's a difference between getting pierced in the hip with proper medical care two hours later and getting a hole in the stomach(we're not sure if it caused damage to vital organs though, but I guess it didn't) without medical care? Without Ellie, Joel would've died, sure. But I'd rather be in Rick's shoes when I compare!
You are right, Lee too is strong.
I think so too. But by this I presume their history doesn't matter att all. Because we don't now much about them. Except that Lee actually killed a guy. Which might come in handy.
You're right about that, Rick's situation is way less grave than Joel's, I just wanted to point out that a healthy adult male can sustain this kind of damage and live through it without too many problems,
And yes, their story doesn't matter since we know very few things about them before the apocalypse.
I would say Joel because Joel doesn't care about the value of human life, Lee actually looks sad when he has to kill those girls in the street, so, probably Joel on that fact. It wouldn't be a fair fight, it would be like putting someone normal against a PTSD person. Those people will win because when you have a episode, trust me your body is flooding with adrenaline, it would be like fighting someone on Meth.
To be honest the two are nothing like each other, Joel has no care for humans he doesn't bat an eye after murdering people, whereas Lee on the other hand actually shows some signs of sadness when he is forced to kill someone...
Is it? The virus was widespread, made many areas inhabitable, limited resources etc etc.
In the time it could take for another person who's immune to be found, a very large number of people more would have fallen to the illness, and even then the person who's immune could easily die without making it to scientists capable of working on a cure.
It took like 40 years for someone immune to be born, and survive until she was in a position to cure it. Another 40 years means a whole lot of pain for others.
He caused those deaths indirectly, inasmuch as he didn't shoot them in the face, but if he'd changed one (primarily selfish) action, many people's lives would have been saved. Including the lives of many other children.
Even if the cure wouldn't 100% work (which we have no reason to believe - the neurosurgeons we murder are supposed to be highly skilled, and they seem very confident that this will work), the life of one girl who herself wants to use her immunity to help mankind and who wouldn't feel an ounce of pain upon her death is not more valuable than the chance of saving huge numbers of people like her, of children like her.
Alright, but, as I said, even Lee could have done that if it were Clem's case, so this specific thing doesn't mean that Joel is stronger than Lee.
Ellie is a human, Tess is a human, Tommy is a human. Joel ain't a sociopath you know... And Lee didn't seem so sorry when he killed the St Johns, the bandits and the Stranger.
Joel kills so many people he makes Ted Bundy Blush.
I 'spose it depends on how you play, but when he killed the St Johns he had every right to not bat an eye!
in my playthrough he didn't kill them.
People that tried to kill him, he's done what any other person would have done. He cares for some people and tries to reason with any stranger whenever he can.
In my playthrough he killed the Stranger with sheer fury and didn't feel sorry at all, despite the guy's story.
20 years of experience against all kinds of zombies vs. 3 months of experience against slow af zombies?
that's a very easy question to answer tbh
Joel is stronger to be honest. He survived 20 years in an apocalypse which is worse than the apocalypse in TWD.
I would say that TWD apocalypse is worse, amongst other things, a dead man stays dead in TLOU, while in TWD you gotta be sure to destroy the brain, or it'll come back. Also, in TLOU there are working facilities, military organizations, well reinforced settlements, from the beginning. All things that TWD does not have yet.
What if there were runners, clickers and bloaters in TWD? Everyone would have been screwed.