Ok so Sarah falls on top of the rubble but somehow breaks her legs and ends up under the rubble? First how does the rubble get on top of her, second, would she have really broken her legs from a fall like that when she has been shown to jump down from a high place without trouble or injury when escaping the walkers when you go to save her and Luke? Also why doesn't anyone give her a gun at all to protect her when literally everyone has a weapon but her, I guess that's Carlos' coddling though. Plus, in the Observation Deck scene, we saw about like, maybe 20 Walkers at most, the group could've taken them on, they obviously had enough bullets which was evident during their fight with Arvo's group and Bonnie and Mike only took out 1 Walker each with a single bullet, they were precise at aim so I think they would've been able to kill the other Walkers plus Jane is experienced at close combat with Walkers, she could've taken them on with aid, but she did get hit on the head with a plank.
Sarah could have and should have survived. About half a dozen things could have logically taken place in the plot. Though she wasn't the sole character to get taken out in an idiotically written way. I can understand how Nick, Sarita, and Rebecca had gotten killed but Sarah probably could have at least made it to episode 5 or early part of season 3, if you determinately saved her from the trailer home. However in truth I sort of stopped caring much about how they fell off the wagon with S2 long ago since whats done is done far as season 2. I am still thankful to have experienced the continuation of the story.
Mike wasn't doing anything. If the wood was to heavy for Jane he or Luke should've gotten down and helped her instead of watching her struggle to pick up the wood. Bonnie and Luke also could've kept shooting but didn't. Sure Jane was reluctant but I would be too. Atleast she actually goes down and attempts to do something while everyone else just watches.
I'm not saying they're not at fault, but Mike and Bonnie were covering Jane. And Luke and Clementine probably thought Jane had it under control, considering all she had to do was lift up wood and let Sarah squirm out of there and run up the deck.
You know, when I think about it, they actually got consecutively worse with the handling of the determinant characters and their deaths as the season went on.
You start with Pete, who if you save him at the end of episode 1 leads to a different opening with a completely different tone than Nick's does, and even though he still dies, he has a rather impacting death that goes on to effect the rest of the group, specifically Nick.
Then you have Alvin, who even though he is basically out of the picture for most of episode 3, he still gets a pretty good death out of it. And even though he doesn't talk too much, he's still actively acknowledged in the episode. Rebecca mentions Carver having him locked up in the office at various points during the episode, Clementine sees him, Clementine and Carver both talk about him a little bit. It's better than Nick who is sort of just there, and who is only brought up once in a blue moon if only to remind players that he still exists. At least Alvin's brought up now and again by characters. Outside of Tavia mentioning his name, the only time anyone else really acknowledges Nick is when he says something, which he barely does in episode 3.
Then there's Nick, who after going mute and getting shoved into the background for almost the entirety of episode 3, gets shot the last time we see him, and is then found (un)dead later on, having died off screen. You just put him down, and that's that. Rebecca, Clementine and Luke are the only ones that really react to his death, and for whatever reason, Rebecca's the one that seems to take it the hardest.
And finally there's Sarah, who if she's saved, dies no more than 40 minutes after you saved her, in the same episode. On top of that, her second death is just flat out stupid, which is further compounded by the fact that almost no one even cared about her dying 3 feet below them. Luke shouts out to her, and Jane and Clementine both mourn her a little bit, but that's about it. By episode 5, she is practically forgotten, and is only brought up when Luke's talking about everyone that's died. Not even Jane or Clementine bring her up again.
I'm not counting Kenny/Jane since they can potentially be alive still.
she freaked out and didn't want to move which could easily happen again, she couldn't perform simple tasks, she didn't understand social situations, she can't in anyway look after herself and would always need somebody to look after her, there is nothing you can tell her to do which you can rely on her doing, meaning there is nothing she can help the group with, and yet the group has a duty to help her.
she is essentially a baby or a toddler, and has the same duty of care as a baby or a toddler but people lack the ability to just pick her up and control her.
i don't see why people are pretending not to have noticed how useless to the group sarah was, and that she provided no advantages making her just a resourse vacuum.
this faux ignorance people are displaying pretending she isn't a burden and pretending not to know how she could possibly be seen as one is just obnoxious, i have decided to play along and "explain" here but seriously, you already knew the answer.
She freaked out and couldn't move, there's a difference between being able to and not being able to, it could only happen again easily if something major, like Carlos' death, occurred but that is pure assumption and you can't state it could happen again when we've only seen it happen once. She could still perform simple tasks, even so the word simple is a subjective term, what is simple to one individual can be difficult for another. How do you know she didn't understand social situations? How would you know whether she can take care of herself or not? She was never put into a situation where she had to care for herself, everyone coddled her and she escaped the Walker herd alone without scratch and found somewhere to hide, all this during the dark of the night. The game doesn't give you the option to rely on Sarah, apart from, oh, giving you medicine if you sneak into the house and stand up for you when Carver slaps you, she's loyal and a good friend, overall a kind person, the game doesn't give you much option to tell most of the characters what to do. Sarah was never given tasks to help the group, so far I don't see much evidence on how much some of the group members have really helped the group. The group has a duty to help anyone who is part of the group.
She is obviously a Teenager, in the early Teen Years it seems, she has not shown to have the same care as a Baby or Toddler, she doesn't cry when she needs a diaper change, she doesn't require aid in eating or doing her business. I don't see a very good comparison. You can't just pick up a human being and control them that easily, even so that means you are forcing them to do what you bid and that's not a very fair thing to do.
Because Sarah wasn't useless, she was a character who was kind, loyal and had potential, Sarah wanted to learn how to survive but people wouldn't help her learn how or gave her a weapon to protect herself when literally everyone else had a weapon, she helped out Clementine with medicine and even sticks up for her on multiple occasions. She shows she's loyal to Clementine as she's one of the only people Sarah will talk to if you were friends during Episode 4. Plus all the characters were useless at several points, does that make them resource vacuums too? Because literally any group member can undergo something that makes them allot less useful than Sarah, Luke with his broken leg, Rebecca with her pregnancy, Kenny with his anger issues, Jane with her abandonment issues etc.
No one has provided good evidence from the Season of how she is a burden, heck you state all of these things about Sarah and yet provide no actual explanation or example.
she freaked out and didn't want to move which could easily happen again, she couldn't perform simple tasks, she didn't understand social sit… moreuations, she can't in anyway look after herself and would always need somebody to look after her, there is nothing you can tell her to do which you can rely on her doing, meaning there is nothing she can help the group with, and yet the group has a duty to help her.
she is essentially a baby or a toddler, and has the same duty of care as a baby or a toddler but people lack the ability to just pick her up and control her.
i don't see why people are pretending not to have noticed how useless to the group sarah was, and that she provided no advantages making her just a resourse vacuum.
this faux ignorance people are displaying pretending she isn't a burden and pretending not to know how she could possibly be seen as one is just obnoxious, i have decided to play along and "explain" here but seriously, you already knew the answer.
heck you state all of these things about Sarah and yet provide no actual explanation or example.
i if you are going to continue being ignorant and need specific examples because you are unwilling to figure out what i am referring to, here they are:
she couldn't perform simple tasks
she couldn't sort plants.
she didn't understand social situations
when confronted with carver she didn't know to just shut up.
she can't in anyway look after herself and would always need somebody to look after her
her own father had to ask a 11 year old (he had just met) to babysit his teenage daughter
i am not saying she may not have reasons as to why she is a burden, however that doesn't change that she is one
Plus all the characters were useless at several points, does that make them resource vacuums too? Because literally any group member can undergo something that makes them allot less useful than Sarah, Luke with his broken leg, Rebecca with her pregnancy, Kenny with his anger issues, Jane with her abandonment issues etc.
making the odd mistake or occasionally needing help doesn't make somebody a resource vacuum if you can contribute to the group the rest of the time.
She freaked out and couldn't move, there's a difference between being able to and not being able to, it could only happen again easily if so… moremething major, like Carlos' death, occurred but that is pure assumption and you can't state it could happen again when we've only seen it happen once. She could still perform simple tasks, even so the word simple is a subjective term, what is simple to one individual can be difficult for another. How do you know she didn't understand social situations? How would you know whether she can take care of herself or not? She was never put into a situation where she had to care for herself, everyone coddled her and she escaped the Walker herd alone without scratch and found somewhere to hide, all this during the dark of the night. The game doesn't give you the option to rely on Sarah, apart from, oh, giving you medicine if you sneak into the house and stand up for you when Carver slaps you, she's loyal and a goo… [view original content]
Silly plot. And police did nothing. Oh sorry, they placed posters. Did they even search for her? Never heard about the mines below? Her rich parents would check every inch of the mountain. Ah, no sense at all.
Silly plot. And police did nothing. Oh sorry, they placed posters. Did they even search for her? Never heard about the mines below? Her rich parents would check every inch of the mountain. Ah, no sense at all.
Well, you have a point that Sarah and Hannah look very similar. And I agree that the police never noticed a mine shaft in Washington mountain because FUCK THE POLICE!!!
I don't see how I'm ignorant when there is not ample evidence to say that Sarah is a burden.
You meant cut off dead leafs off plants, she couldn't do that after she got slapped in the face, hard, by her father, the first time he's ever hit her like that, she was harmed by the person who coddles and takes care of her, that's going to cause her to feel too sad to do provide any effort in working, besides, she does her work if Clementine helps her by showing her and giving her the motivation she needs, even going to the point where she doesn't want to make mistakes, showing she can learn and provide her maximum effort.
I don't see how not shutting up when Carver is spouting about his rules and whatnot is that important anyway, she didn't seem to care much about Carver, earlier, she can stand up to him for slapping Clementine, just because she doesn't show any respect towards Carver doesn't mean she doesn't understand social situations, your example only shows one area of that so really you should be saying 'she didn't understand a social situation' not 'she doesn't understand social situations'. Anyway, just because she did talk back to Carver doesn't mean she didn't understand the situation.
He asked her to look after Sarah because he knew that Clementine was taught enough to look after herself, as shown by how she can steal medicine from the Cabin Group, also, Clementine is the only person currently in the Cabin at the time as Rebecca storms out and Carlos chases after her, of course he'd ask Clementine to look after his daughter, but just because someone asks someone else to look after someone doesn't mean that the person being looked after is any less of a burden than the one looking after them. She obviously has some anxiety issues, but so far it's only put herself in danger.
Tell me how much more did anyone else really contribute to the group as a whole? Barely anyone in the group did anything that helped out the entire group, plus people like Nick, Rebecca and Kenny did more harm to the group and were more of a burden on the group than Sarah was, she had the evidential potential of being a confident and strong member of the group, she wasn't given the chance and it was obvious how the writers just wrote her off. You still haven't proven how she is a 'burden' to the group.
heck you state all of these things about Sarah and yet provide no actual explanation or example.
i if you are going to continue bein… moreg ignorant and need specific examples because you are unwilling to figure out what i am referring to, here they are:
she couldn't perform simple tasks
she couldn't sort plants.
she didn't understand social situations
when confronted with carver she didn't know to just shut up.
she can't in anyway look after herself and would always need somebody to look after her
her own father had to ask a 11 year old (he had just met) to babysit his teenage daughter
i am not saying she may not have reasons as to why she is a burden, however that doesn't change that she is one
Plus all the characters were useless at several points, does that make them resource vacuums too? Because literally any group member can undergo something that makes them allot less useful than Sar… [view original content]
After Carlos' death, no, it'd take way too much time to bring her back to herself. Maybe if Carlos hadn't "protected" her from the apocalypse, she could've survived.
it is ignorant to ask me to explain every single little detail in an attempt to prove you are right, how about you explain in every single little detail how sara isn't a burden, and then i will say "i don't see how that explains how she isn't a burden" and then that will make me right and you wrong
I don't see how I'm ignorant when there is not ample evidence to say that Sarah is a burden.
You meant cut off dead leafs off plants, she… more couldn't do that after she got slapped in the face, hard, by her father, the first time he's ever hit her like that, she was harmed by the person who coddles and takes care of her, that's going to cause her to feel too sad to do provide any effort in working, besides, she does her work if Clementine helps her by showing her and giving her the motivation she needs, even going to the point where she doesn't want to make mistakes, showing she can learn and provide her maximum effort.
I don't see how not shutting up when Carver is spouting about his rules and whatnot is that important anyway, she didn't seem to care much about Carver, earlier, she can stand up to him for slapping Clementine, just because she doesn't show any respect towards Carver doesn't mean she doesn't understand social situations, you… [view original content]
You're the one who began attempting to ignorantly prove Sarah is a burden without any viable evidence, your lack of explanation and detail of how Sarah is a burden contradicts your own statement and just shows how there is lack of evidence that she is indeed a burden. My evidence of Sarah not being a burden can simply be put by how you lack evidence to show otherwise.
it is ignorant to ask me to explain every single little detail in an attempt to prove you are right, how about you explain in every single l… moreittle detail how sara isn't a burden, and then i will say "i don't see how that explains how she isn't a burden" and then that will make me right and you wrong
You're the one who began attempting to ignorantly prove Sarah is a burden without any viable evidence, your lack of explanation and detail o… moref how Sarah is a burden contradicts your own statement and just shows how there is lack of evidence that she is indeed a burden. My evidence of Sarah not being a burden can simply be put by how you lack evidence to show otherwise.
You haven't in any way proven she is a burden, so there would be no point in proving she isn't a burden, if you can prove how she is a burden with full examples and explanations, I will have a reason to give you full examples and explanations of how she isn't a burden.
You haven't in any way proven she is a burden, so there would be no point in proving she isn't a burden, if you can prove how she is a burde… moren with full examples and explanations, I will have a reason to give you full examples and explanations of how she isn't a burden.
So you want me to explain in full detail of how Sarah isn't a burden when you haven't done so yourself? I replied to your comment and have been asking you how Sarah is a burden. She hasn't shown any signs of being a burden:
Episode 1: She can help Clementine get Medicine for her Bite, if Clementine didn't get the medicine, she could've gotten infected and died, Sarah prevents this from happening if you, as Clementine, break into the Cabin.
Episode 2: If Clementine is Friends with Sarah, she shows her a Gun and asks Clementine to teach her how to use it, which evidently shows that she wants to learn how to survive, after Clementine says she doesn't think it's a good idea, Sarah replies by saying what if she'd need to use it, she knows she might have to protect herself and she wants to, but no one teaches her how to, this emphasises how Sarah's character is being kept weak because no one even attempts to give her a way of defending herself, even though she knows she needs to learn to survive.
Sarah takes the blame for taking the picture, regardless of what Clementine says, this shows she doesn't rely on other people lying for her, that she's truthful and can admit to mistakes she's made, unlike many characters in this game.
Episode 3: If you as Clementine help her, Sarah tries to do the job she was assigned perfectly, she doesn't want to mess up, this shows how after a character teaches her the proper way of doing something, she can strive to learn how to perfectly do what she was thought, if she was taught how to defend herself, we could have seen her practicing her aim and trying to be precise.
Earlier in the episode if Clementine is slapped by Carver, Sarah stands up to Carver, this shows how Sarah isn't afraid to stand up for the people she cares about.
In the Walker herd, she runs her way out without a scratch or bite, this shows how capable she can be at avoiding being caught or grabbed, this shows an aspect of survival, you need to be able to avoid dangerous situations without harm to survive in a zombie apocalyptic world.
Episode 4: If you saved Sarah, she will warn everyone about the approaching Walkers, even in her state of anxiety she knows when an urgent situation is at hand, she shows her usefulness to the group even when going through her supposed first major loss in the apocalypse, she did Luke's job better than he did it.
Sarah didn't cause a single death, people say that she indirectly caused Sarita's death, but Sarita chose to interfere on her own accord, in no means did Sarah ask for anyone to help her while in the herd, nor did she intentionally get anyone killed.
Sarah isn't a burden, she hasn't slowed down the group at any point, she hasn't caused trouble for the group as a whole, only for herself, it is completely optional for Clementine to also coddle Sarah, it's not forced upon you.
So you want me to explain in full detail of how Sarah isn't a burden when you haven't done so yourself? I replied to your comment and have b… moreeen asking you how Sarah is a burden. She hasn't shown any signs of being a burden:
Episode 1: She can help Clementine get Medicine for her Bite, if Clementine didn't get the medicine, she could've gotten infected and died, Sarah prevents this from happening if you, as Clementine, break into the Cabin.
Episode 2: If Clementine is Friends with Sarah, she shows her a Gun and asks Clementine to teach her how to use it, which evidently shows that she wants to learn how to survive, after Clementine says she doesn't think it's a good idea, Sarah replies by saying what if she'd need to use it, she knows she might have to protect herself and she wants to, but no one teaches her how to, this emphasises how Sarah's character is being kept weak because no one even attempts to give her a way of defending hersel… [view original content]
True, but what I mean is no one has taught her to fight off walkers (aside from Clem optionally teaching her to shoot), so I wouldn't exactly say her survival would be guaranteed.
they are just excuses as to why she is a burden, not how she wasn't one, potential doesn't equal useful, it mean she has the potential to be taught to be useful, maybe she should have been taught in the relative safety of the cabin how to be of some use to a group of survivors on the move, but in the circumstances of actually being on the move in the zombie apocalypse they don't have time to teach her, hence burden.
maybe she is you favorite character, but if you were to look at her objectively you would see that potential is not the same as actual skills.
Sarah didn't cause a single death, people say that she indirectly caused Sarita's death, but Sarita chose to interfere on her own accord, in no means did Sarah ask for anyone to help her while in the herd, nor did she intentionally get anyone killed.
Sarah isn't a burden, she hasn't slowed down the group at any point, she hasn't caused trouble for the group as a whole, only for herself, it is completely optional for Clementine to also coddle Sarah, it's not forced upon you.
that is complete fantasy though, helpless people require help, sure sarita could have just be like "screw it, let her die" but if she didn't need help sarita wouldn't have had to help, however i wouldn't blame her for that either or Reggie's death which you could also say was indirectly her fault.
sarah did slow down the group and caused trouble by almost causing the death of luke, jane, and clementine and she is likely the cause of nick's death, and obviously i am talking about when she freaked out and wouldn't move, excuses or reasons why she did that don't change that she did that.
but seriously i don't know what you think burden means, but it basically means she is a net loss to the productivity of the group as a whole (she takes more than she gives) and throughout the game she demonstrated that she was a burden.
liking her or even her being nice has nothing to do with the practicality of survival.
So you want me to explain in full detail of how Sarah isn't a burden when you haven't done so yourself? I replied to your comment and have b… moreeen asking you how Sarah is a burden. She hasn't shown any signs of being a burden:
Episode 1: She can help Clementine get Medicine for her Bite, if Clementine didn't get the medicine, she could've gotten infected and died, Sarah prevents this from happening if you, as Clementine, break into the Cabin.
Episode 2: If Clementine is Friends with Sarah, she shows her a Gun and asks Clementine to teach her how to use it, which evidently shows that she wants to learn how to survive, after Clementine says she doesn't think it's a good idea, Sarah replies by saying what if she'd need to use it, she knows she might have to protect herself and she wants to, but no one teaches her how to, this emphasises how Sarah's character is being kept weak because no one even attempts to give her a way of defending hersel… [view original content]
How could she be the blame on Nick's death? Nick made his own decision to go for help injured without weapons. I guess Luke didn't bother to stop him for being his best friend or give him his gun or machete.
they are just excuses as to why she is a burden, not how she wasn't one, potential doesn't equal useful, it mean she has the potential to be… more taught to be useful, maybe she should have been taught in the relative safety of the cabin how to be of some use to a group of survivors on the move, but in the circumstances of actually being on the move in the zombie apocalypse they don't have time to teach her, hence burden.
maybe she is you favorite character, but if you were to look at her objectively you would see that potential is not the same as actual skills.
Sarah didn't cause a single death, people say that she indirectly caused Sarita's death, but Sarita chose to interfere on her own accord, in no means did Sarah ask for anyone to help her while in the herd, nor did she intentionally get anyone killed.
Sarah isn't a burden, she hasn't slowed down the group at any point, she hasn't caused trouble for the group as a whole, only … [view original content]
How could she be the blame on Nick's death? Nick made his own decision to go for help injured without weapons. I guess Luke didn't bother to stop him for being his best friend or give him his gun or machete.
Everything would have been screwed anyway cuz Carver's men were shooting. There were a lot of moments during that herd escape which made no sense like Carlos being the only one shot, walkers not noticing Bonnie shooting her AK, some walkers noticing Clem even with her body covered in guts etc.
well if sarah wasn't freaking out they would have all gone together, one person had to stay with her at least.
you can say "Nick made his own decision to go for help" but he wouldn't have had to make that decision if it wasn't for sarah.
Also if you consider season one you have Doug, Carley, and Ben. All of whom had great stories even though they were determinant characters. They should be the prime example of how to handle determinant characters and I feel they were the reason why so many people were disappointed by this season's determinants since they were the golden standard.
You know, when I think about it, they actually got consecutively worse with the handling of the determinant characters and their deaths as t… morehe season went on.
You start with Pete, who if you save him at the end of episode 1 leads to a different opening with a completely different tone than Nick's does, and even though he still dies, he has a rather impacting death that goes on to effect the rest of the group, specifically Nick.
Then you have Alvin, who even though he is basically out of the picture for most of episode 3, he still gets a pretty good death out of it. And even though he doesn't talk too much, he's still actively acknowledged in the episode. Rebecca mentions Carver having him locked up in the office at various points during the episode, Clementine sees him, Clementine and Carver both talk about him a little bit. It's better than Nick who is sort of just there, and who is only brought up once in a blue moon if only to remind… [view original content]
How are they excuses to how she is a burden when all the things I've listed are what she can do that actually shows how she stands up for others and even helps in situations. I never said potential equalled useful but it's evident that she could've been very useful which I threw in there as a side point not a main one. They did have time to teach her at the Cabin, how long since the Apocalypse began? Heck, we know they've been in the Cabin for a while too.
Potential is created from the Skills a person has, she has shown confidence, willingness to learn, fearlessness and yet still showed compassion and innocence.
Helpless people required help? Isn't that a contradiction? Especially since they're help-less, meaning you can't help them regardless of what you do, which was the case of Sarah's second and illogical death. It may be a Fantasy, but this is a Fantasy World. Sarah didn't need help, there wasn't a Walker trying to grab her in an unsafe radius, we see Sarita taking out a Walker that isn't even close to Sarah, just heading her way, Sarita chose to help because she wanted to, just because someone helps doesn't mean the person they're trying to help indefinitely needs help. As for Reggie's death, it wasn't Sarah's fault that Carver killed Reggie, Reggie didn't bother to check with Sarah or show her what she's meant to do properly, he had a job which was to supervise them and ensure they were both working efficiently, did he do that? No, he left to take care of his own matters. But that still doesn't mean he deserved his death, but I wouldn't blame Sarah at all, an Indirect cause of death is never intentional or thought out.
How did Sarah almost cause the death of Luke, Jane and Clementine? Luke CHOSE to go find Sarah at his own will, he could've left her the same way Nick did, he chose to risk his life to try and help Sarah, it's evident that Sarah didn't ask for anyone to help her at that moment, as for Jane, she wanted to leave Sarah behind, in truth it's Clementine who endangers Jane as she's the one who makes the decision to try and force Sarah to come with them or not, and still Clementine has the choice of saving Sarah. They chose to put their own lives in danger to try and help Sarah, who was grieving for her dad and facing anxiety issues, she didn't put them in a dangerous situation, she put herself in a dangerous situation as everyone else put themselves in the same dangerous situation, if anything it was Clementine and Jane endangering one another because they wanted to save Luke and Sarah. If Sarah put them all in danger, in that same logic so did Luke because he was also stuck with Sarah, in fact, Sarah only responded to Luke, Luke kept trying to force Sarah to snap out of her panic and loudly too causing Walkers to become attracted to the sound he made. The likely cause of Nick's death is the Walker Clementine fights past that point as it has blood on it's mouth if you saved Nick and lacks blood if you didn't, plus Nick was shot in the neck, he may have also bled to death too. Of course she freaked out and wouldn't move, people with anxiety can suffer panic attacks when they are literally not in control of their bodies, you can make the situation worse as Clementine by being rude to Sarah and saying she'll die, the same way Luke and Jane kept saying they want to abandon her right in front of her face. She lost her father and she couldn't defend herself, she seemed to have a panic attack and would've also been blind without her glasses, they are good reasons as to why she couldn't control her own actions, if you've ever had a panic attack or have anxiety like some of us do, you might understand the situation she was in.
You haven't proven at all how Sarah is a burden, you keep blaming her for putting other people in danger when they chose to be in danger themselves, Sarah has never asked anyone to help her, let alone force them to do anything for her. She is definitely an asset to the group as a potential survivalist, someone Clementine can trust, and possibly the reason why Carlos still lives through the Apocalypse at that time and why he's with the Cabin group. She was overall an asset to the group, especially in the point where she can give Clementine medicine, Clementine could've died that night if it wasn't for her.
Liking someone or someone being nice does have allot to do with survival, do you honestly think someone is going to help you stay alive or even let you join their group if they disliked you, or especially if you were a rude and mischievous person? That's a net loss to the group, being hated can be a loss for a person as it lowers your chances of surviving.
they are just excuses as to why she is a burden, not how she wasn't one, potential doesn't equal useful, it mean she has the potential to be… more taught to be useful, maybe she should have been taught in the relative safety of the cabin how to be of some use to a group of survivors on the move, but in the circumstances of actually being on the move in the zombie apocalypse they don't have time to teach her, hence burden.
maybe she is you favorite character, but if you were to look at her objectively you would see that potential is not the same as actual skills.
Sarah didn't cause a single death, people say that she indirectly caused Sarita's death, but Sarita chose to interfere on her own accord, in no means did Sarah ask for anyone to help her while in the herd, nor did she intentionally get anyone killed.
Sarah isn't a burden, she hasn't slowed down the group at any point, she hasn't caused trouble for the group as a whole, only … [view original content]
Do you seriously blame Sarah for freaking out when she's shown to have anxiety and her father, Carlos, whose been coddling her for years, just dies right in front of her while she's surrounded by the dead knowing she could die any second? She evidently had a panic attack and that's not something a person alone can get out of easily or quickly, regardless of what you try to say about her stiffness or sudden urge to sprint, she is still human and allot of humans would do what she did under the right circumstances. No one had to stay with her, they chose to stay with her, she didn't ask or force anyone to stay with her.
Nick did makes his own decision to go for help, he chose to expose himself by leaving the Trailer, Luke told us it was his idea. You can't blame Sarah for that decision when it was entirely his choice to follow Luke to find Sarah and then to leave the Trailer, Luke was the one chasing down Sarah and Nick was right behind him by choice. Say all you want but there's always a choice to do something in most scenarios, no one had to chase Sarah and endanger their lives, what was stupid of everyone to do as separate in the herd so that they'd all be in different areas.
well if sarah wasn't freaking out they would have all gone together, one person had to stay with her at least.
you can say "Nick made his own decision to go for help" but he wouldn't have had to make that decision if it wasn't for sarah.
antonyms: independent, capable of looking after oneself
uncontrollable.
"they burst into helpless laughter"
she didn't give clementine medicine, clementine had to convince a naive child into letting her take it, and you still don't understand (or are intentionally avoiding acknowledging your understanding of the word) burden, i didn't even bring up the danger she put other people in, i am saying she is a burden because she is helpless, the danger she puts other people in because they have to help her is just a byproduct of her helplessness.
you can make excuses for the danger she put other people in and say they CHOSE to help her, but are you really saying they should just leave her to get hurt or killed?
How are they excuses to how she is a burden when all the things I've listed are what she can do that actually shows how she stands up for ot… morehers and even helps in situations. I never said potential equalled useful but it's evident that she could've been very useful which I threw in there as a side point not a main one. They did have time to teach her at the Cabin, how long since the Apocalypse began? Heck, we know they've been in the Cabin for a while too.
Potential is created from the Skills a person has, she has shown confidence, willingness to learn, fearlessness and yet still showed compassion and innocence.
Helpless people required help? Isn't that a contradiction? Especially since they're help-less, meaning you can't help them regardless of what you do, which was the case of Sarah's second and illogical death. It may be a Fantasy, but this is a Fantasy World. Sarah didn't need help, there wasn't a Walker trying to grab her in an u… [view original content]
As I recall she is only helpless 3 times in the game:
After Carlos slapped her hard for the first time and no one was coddling her for the first time she was unable to do her task for the Community without getting help from Clementine, but Reggie didn't do his job to make sure Sarah was working or knew what to do, she is just a kid and she was just physically abused, however, she didn't really need help to me, more of support in this instance.
In the Trailer, after Carlos died right in front of her in the middle of a Walker Herd and as she lost her glasses and went into a panic attack which rendered her immobile, she couldn't defend herself or act without getting physically hurt by one person she can trust, if you see someone die in front of you and go into a panic attack, the experience is twice as horrifying, especially when you're partially blind.
The final one is on the Observation Deck that clearly had a plot hole of how the planks somehow fell on top of her when she fell down after, that doesn't even make sense and even if it did, her legs seemed to be lodged and she couldn't move, of course she'd be defenceless.
The biggest reason she is helpless at these stages is due to the years of people coddling her and not helping her learn how to protect herself, she wanted to learn how to but no one even gave her a weapon she could use to protect herself with, literally everyone in the group but Sarah had a weapon, when it was clear she wanted one to defend herself if she ever needed to.
There's no difference in both instances Sarah gives Clementine the Medicine she needs to disinfect her wound. Being helpless doesn't make someone a burden in my opinion, because often times someone who is helpless is made helpless and can be helpful in their own way, Sarah was made helpless by those around her, only Clementine can show her how to use a Gun and after that no one shows her anything about survival apart from rubbing Walker guts on yourself. Can you blame Sarah for not being given a chance to learn how to survive as all the others have gotten that chance? Can you blame her for being defenceless when weapons were literally handed out to everyone except her?
That's the thing, they have an option, you can't just blame someone for being the reason another person gets in danger just because that person chose to save the other, of course it's morally ill and wrong in my opinion to choose not to save someone who requires aid but that doesn't it's their fault if you yourself choose to save them. When person A chooses to save person B, that's a choice they make, an action they make, and if it gets Person A killed, that's Person A's fault because he/she made said decision. I'm evidently a Sarah fan so of course I'm not saying they should've just let her die, but they did, they can leave her to die in the Trailer and do nothing to help her on the Observation Deck, her second death was just an entire illogical plot hole.
Also I should add that the definition of 'helpless' works for all character as they've been in a scenario that made them unable to defend themselves or act without help.
for starters just have the definition of helpless to make it easy:
helpless
ˈhɛlpləs/
adjective
adjective: helpless
unable to… more defend oneself or to act without help.
"the cubs are born blind and helpless"
synonyms: dependent, incapable, powerless, impotent, weak, weakly, feeble;
antonyms: independent, capable of looking after oneself
uncontrollable.
"they burst into helpless laughter"
she didn't give clementine medicine, clementine had to convince a naive child into letting her take it, and you still don't understand (or are intentionally avoiding acknowledging your understanding of the word) burden, i didn't even bring up the danger she put other people in, i am saying she is a burden because she is helpless, the danger she puts other people in because they have to help her is just a byproduct of her helplessness.
you can make excuses for the danger she put other people in and say they CHOSE to help her, but are you really saying they should just leave her to get hurt or killed?
Being helpless doesn't make someone a burden in my opinion, because often times someone who is helpless is made helpless
that makes no sense at all, so if you are "made" helpless this somehow means you aren't a burden, that is just wrong, reasons for being a certain way doesn't change the fact that you are that way eg. if you were made to be weak it doesn't change the fact that you are weak, you can't just be like "oh it's ok i was made weak so i can actually lift heavy things"
As I recall she is only helpless 3 times in the game:
After Carlos slapped her hard for the first time and no one was coddling her for th… moree first time she was unable to do her task for the Community without getting help from Clementine, but Reggie didn't do his job to make sure Sarah was working or knew what to do, she is just a kid and she was just physically abused, however, she didn't really need help to me, more of support in this instance.
In the Trailer, after Carlos died right in front of her in the middle of a Walker Herd and as she lost her glasses and went into a panic attack which rendered her immobile, she couldn't defend herself or act without getting physically hurt by one person she can trust, if you see someone die in front of you and go into a panic attack, the experience is twice as horrifying, especially when you're partially blind.
The final one is on the Observation Deck that clearly had a plot hole of how the pla… [view original content]
she couldn't defend herself or act without getting physically hurt by one person she can trust
If you're referring to being forced to slap Sarah in order to get her to leave the trailer, then I can't help but feel that this was yet another stupid decision by the writers of Episode Four. The previous episode had established Sarah as a girl who practically shut down after her father struck her, and yet, just one episode later, slapping her in the face and screaming "MOVE!" is enough to motivate her into leaving with you? I'll readily admit that I don't have a degree in psychology, but wouldn't being physically hurt by the one other person she trusts only serve to drive her further inside herself? The Walking Dead game is clearly intended to be serious work of fiction, but suddenly treating an emotionally fragile character like a hysterical 1950s housewife in an old Hanna-Barbera cartoon doesn't help its credibility at all.
Granted, this situation wouldn't be so glaringly stupid if our choices weren't arbitrarily limited to slapping Sarah and abandoning her. Almost every other situation in the game gives us four options in how to approach it, yet in this case we're only given two? Even off the top of my head, I can think of four ways to approach that situation:
Talk Sarah into leaving with you
Slap Sarah (Same as before. This should still be an option. It just shouldn't be the only option)
Psychically drag out Sarah of the trailer
Leave her (Again, same as before)
Granted, depending on your choices in previous episodes, not every option you're presented with should work out in Sarah's favor.
For instance, attempting to talk Sarah into leaving the trailer should only work if you'd spent the past three episodes befriending her and gaining her trust. If you previously spent the game insulting and belittling her, she's only going to tune you out. After all, why should she expect you to start being friendly to her now?
On the other hand, if you had been her friend and gained her trust, slapping Sarah would only cause her to feel betrayed and become completely unreachable. Slapping her if you'd been a jerk to her, on the other hand, might break through her emotional defenses, and get her to follow your orders to leave.
Attempting to physically drag her out of the trailer wouldn't work no matter how you'd previously treated Sarah. Everything we've seen regarding Sarah indicates that this would only cause her to panic, break free, and run away blindly - likely right into the loving arms of a hungry zombie.
But, rather than give us multiple options that that would serve to reinforce our choices up to that point, Telltale decided to narrow everything down to an unrealistic "Slap" or "Leave" decision. A decision that, ultimately, didn't even end up mattering.
As I recall she is only helpless 3 times in the game:
After Carlos slapped her hard for the first time and no one was coddling her for th… moree first time she was unable to do her task for the Community without getting help from Clementine, but Reggie didn't do his job to make sure Sarah was working or knew what to do, she is just a kid and she was just physically abused, however, she didn't really need help to me, more of support in this instance.
In the Trailer, after Carlos died right in front of her in the middle of a Walker Herd and as she lost her glasses and went into a panic attack which rendered her immobile, she couldn't defend herself or act without getting physically hurt by one person she can trust, if you see someone die in front of you and go into a panic attack, the experience is twice as horrifying, especially when you're partially blind.
The final one is on the Observation Deck that clearly had a plot hole of how the pla… [view original content]
Comments
Ok so Sarah falls on top of the rubble but somehow breaks her legs and ends up under the rubble? First how does the rubble get on top of her, second, would she have really broken her legs from a fall like that when she has been shown to jump down from a high place without trouble or injury when escaping the walkers when you go to save her and Luke? Also why doesn't anyone give her a gun at all to protect her when literally everyone has a weapon but her, I guess that's Carlos' coddling though. Plus, in the Observation Deck scene, we saw about like, maybe 20 Walkers at most, the group could've taken them on, they obviously had enough bullets which was evident during their fight with Arvo's group and Bonnie and Mike only took out 1 Walker each with a single bullet, they were precise at aim so I think they would've been able to kill the other Walkers plus Jane is experienced at close combat with Walkers, she could've taken them on with aid, but she did get hit on the head with a plank.
Sarah could have and should have survived. About half a dozen things could have logically taken place in the plot. Though she wasn't the sole character to get taken out in an idiotically written way. I can understand how Nick, Sarita, and Rebecca had gotten killed but Sarah probably could have at least made it to episode 5 or early part of season 3, if you determinately saved her from the trailer home. However in truth I sort of stopped caring much about how they fell off the wagon with S2 long ago since whats done is done far as season 2. I am still thankful to have experienced the continuation of the story.
Mike wasn't doing anything. If the wood was to heavy for Jane he or Luke should've gotten down and helped her instead of watching her struggle to pick up the wood. Bonnie and Luke also could've kept shooting but didn't. Sure Jane was reluctant but I would be too. Atleast she actually goes down and attempts to do something while everyone else just watches.
You know, when I think about it, they actually got consecutively worse with the handling of the determinant characters and their deaths as the season went on.
You start with Pete, who if you save him at the end of episode 1 leads to a different opening with a completely different tone than Nick's does, and even though he still dies, he has a rather impacting death that goes on to effect the rest of the group, specifically Nick.
Then you have Alvin, who even though he is basically out of the picture for most of episode 3, he still gets a pretty good death out of it. And even though he doesn't talk too much, he's still actively acknowledged in the episode. Rebecca mentions Carver having him locked up in the office at various points during the episode, Clementine sees him, Clementine and Carver both talk about him a little bit. It's better than Nick who is sort of just there, and who is only brought up once in a blue moon if only to remind players that he still exists. At least Alvin's brought up now and again by characters. Outside of Tavia mentioning his name, the only time anyone else really acknowledges Nick is when he says something, which he barely does in episode 3.
Then there's Nick, who after going mute and getting shoved into the background for almost the entirety of episode 3, gets shot the last time we see him, and is then found (un)dead later on, having died off screen. You just put him down, and that's that. Rebecca, Clementine and Luke are the only ones that really react to his death, and for whatever reason, Rebecca's the one that seems to take it the hardest.
And finally there's Sarah, who if she's saved, dies no more than 40 minutes after you saved her, in the same episode. On top of that, her second death is just flat out stupid, which is further compounded by the fact that almost no one even cared about her dying 3 feet below them. Luke shouts out to her, and Jane and Clementine both mourn her a little bit, but that's about it. By episode 5, she is practically forgotten, and is only brought up when Luke's talking about everyone that's died. Not even Jane or Clementine bring her up again.
I'm not counting Kenny/Jane since they can potentially be alive still.
she freaked out and didn't want to move which could easily happen again, she couldn't perform simple tasks, she didn't understand social situations, she can't in anyway look after herself and would always need somebody to look after her, there is nothing you can tell her to do which you can rely on her doing, meaning there is nothing she can help the group with, and yet the group has a duty to help her.
she is essentially a baby or a toddler, and has the same duty of care as a baby or a toddler but people lack the ability to just pick her up and control her.
i don't see why people are pretending not to have noticed how useless to the group sarah was, and that she provided no advantages making her just a resourse vacuum.
this faux ignorance people are displaying pretending she isn't a burden and pretending not to know how she could possibly be seen as one is just obnoxious, i have decided to play along and "explain" here but seriously, you already knew the answer.
She freaked out and couldn't move, there's a difference between being able to and not being able to, it could only happen again easily if something major, like Carlos' death, occurred but that is pure assumption and you can't state it could happen again when we've only seen it happen once. She could still perform simple tasks, even so the word simple is a subjective term, what is simple to one individual can be difficult for another. How do you know she didn't understand social situations? How would you know whether she can take care of herself or not? She was never put into a situation where she had to care for herself, everyone coddled her and she escaped the Walker herd alone without scratch and found somewhere to hide, all this during the dark of the night. The game doesn't give you the option to rely on Sarah, apart from, oh, giving you medicine if you sneak into the house and stand up for you when Carver slaps you, she's loyal and a good friend, overall a kind person, the game doesn't give you much option to tell most of the characters what to do. Sarah was never given tasks to help the group, so far I don't see much evidence on how much some of the group members have really helped the group. The group has a duty to help anyone who is part of the group.
She is obviously a Teenager, in the early Teen Years it seems, she has not shown to have the same care as a Baby or Toddler, she doesn't cry when she needs a diaper change, she doesn't require aid in eating or doing her business. I don't see a very good comparison. You can't just pick up a human being and control them that easily, even so that means you are forcing them to do what you bid and that's not a very fair thing to do.
Because Sarah wasn't useless, she was a character who was kind, loyal and had potential, Sarah wanted to learn how to survive but people wouldn't help her learn how or gave her a weapon to protect herself when literally everyone else had a weapon, she helped out Clementine with medicine and even sticks up for her on multiple occasions. She shows she's loyal to Clementine as she's one of the only people Sarah will talk to if you were friends during Episode 4. Plus all the characters were useless at several points, does that make them resource vacuums too? Because literally any group member can undergo something that makes them allot less useful than Sarah, Luke with his broken leg, Rebecca with her pregnancy, Kenny with his anger issues, Jane with her abandonment issues etc.
No one has provided good evidence from the Season of how she is a burden, heck you state all of these things about Sarah and yet provide no actual explanation or example.
i if you are going to continue being ignorant and need specific examples because you are unwilling to figure out what i am referring to, here they are:
she couldn't sort plants.
when confronted with carver she didn't know to just shut up.
her own father had to ask a 11 year old (he had just met) to babysit his teenage daughter
i am not saying she may not have reasons as to why she is a burden, however that doesn't change that she is one
making the odd mistake or occasionally needing help doesn't make somebody a resource vacuum if you can contribute to the group the rest of the time.
Silly plot. And police did nothing. Oh sorry, they placed posters. Did they even search for her? Never heard about the mines below? Her rich parents would check every inch of the mountain. Ah, no sense at all.
We are talking about TWD, not Until Dawn
Oh. Sorry. Both girls look alike. Well, can't say I was wrong about Hannah.
Well, you have a point that Sarah and Hannah look very similar. And I agree that the police never noticed a mine shaft in Washington mountain because FUCK THE POLICE!!!
I don't see how I'm ignorant when there is not ample evidence to say that Sarah is a burden.
You meant cut off dead leafs off plants, she couldn't do that after she got slapped in the face, hard, by her father, the first time he's ever hit her like that, she was harmed by the person who coddles and takes care of her, that's going to cause her to feel too sad to do provide any effort in working, besides, she does her work if Clementine helps her by showing her and giving her the motivation she needs, even going to the point where she doesn't want to make mistakes, showing she can learn and provide her maximum effort.
I don't see how not shutting up when Carver is spouting about his rules and whatnot is that important anyway, she didn't seem to care much about Carver, earlier, she can stand up to him for slapping Clementine, just because she doesn't show any respect towards Carver doesn't mean she doesn't understand social situations, your example only shows one area of that so really you should be saying 'she didn't understand a social situation' not 'she doesn't understand social situations'. Anyway, just because she did talk back to Carver doesn't mean she didn't understand the situation.
He asked her to look after Sarah because he knew that Clementine was taught enough to look after herself, as shown by how she can steal medicine from the Cabin Group, also, Clementine is the only person currently in the Cabin at the time as Rebecca storms out and Carlos chases after her, of course he'd ask Clementine to look after his daughter, but just because someone asks someone else to look after someone doesn't mean that the person being looked after is any less of a burden than the one looking after them. She obviously has some anxiety issues, but so far it's only put herself in danger.
Tell me how much more did anyone else really contribute to the group as a whole? Barely anyone in the group did anything that helped out the entire group, plus people like Nick, Rebecca and Kenny did more harm to the group and were more of a burden on the group than Sarah was, she had the evidential potential of being a confident and strong member of the group, she wasn't given the chance and it was obvious how the writers just wrote her off. You still haven't proven how she is a 'burden' to the group.
Except maybe the occasional Psycho or Whisperer.
After Carlos' death, no, it'd take way too much time to bring her back to herself. Maybe if Carlos hadn't "protected" her from the apocalypse, she could've survived.
it is ignorant to ask me to explain every single little detail in an attempt to prove you are right, how about you explain in every single little detail how sara isn't a burden, and then i will say "i don't see how that explains how she isn't a burden" and then that will make me right and you wrong
You're the one who began attempting to ignorantly prove Sarah is a burden without any viable evidence, your lack of explanation and detail of how Sarah is a burden contradicts your own statement and just shows how there is lack of evidence that she is indeed a burden. My evidence of Sarah not being a burden can simply be put by how you lack evidence to show otherwise.
i don't see how that explains how she isn't a burden
You haven't in any way proven she is a burden, so there would be no point in proving she isn't a burden, if you can prove how she is a burden with full examples and explanations, I will have a reason to give you full examples and explanations of how she isn't a burden.
oh no, you go ahead, by all means explain, and i will need exact and full details or it won't count.
So you want me to explain in full detail of how Sarah isn't a burden when you haven't done so yourself? I replied to your comment and have been asking you how Sarah is a burden. She hasn't shown any signs of being a burden:
Episode 1: She can help Clementine get Medicine for her Bite, if Clementine didn't get the medicine, she could've gotten infected and died, Sarah prevents this from happening if you, as Clementine, break into the Cabin.
Episode 2: If Clementine is Friends with Sarah, she shows her a Gun and asks Clementine to teach her how to use it, which evidently shows that she wants to learn how to survive, after Clementine says she doesn't think it's a good idea, Sarah replies by saying what if she'd need to use it, she knows she might have to protect herself and she wants to, but no one teaches her how to, this emphasises how Sarah's character is being kept weak because no one even attempts to give her a way of defending herself, even though she knows she needs to learn to survive.
Sarah takes the blame for taking the picture, regardless of what Clementine says, this shows she doesn't rely on other people lying for her, that she's truthful and can admit to mistakes she's made, unlike many characters in this game.
Episode 3: If you as Clementine help her, Sarah tries to do the job she was assigned perfectly, she doesn't want to mess up, this shows how after a character teaches her the proper way of doing something, she can strive to learn how to perfectly do what she was thought, if she was taught how to defend herself, we could have seen her practicing her aim and trying to be precise.
Earlier in the episode if Clementine is slapped by Carver, Sarah stands up to Carver, this shows how Sarah isn't afraid to stand up for the people she cares about.
In the Walker herd, she runs her way out without a scratch or bite, this shows how capable she can be at avoiding being caught or grabbed, this shows an aspect of survival, you need to be able to avoid dangerous situations without harm to survive in a zombie apocalyptic world.
Episode 4: If you saved Sarah, she will warn everyone about the approaching Walkers, even in her state of anxiety she knows when an urgent situation is at hand, she shows her usefulness to the group even when going through her supposed first major loss in the apocalypse, she did Luke's job better than he did it.
Sarah didn't cause a single death, people say that she indirectly caused Sarita's death, but Sarita chose to interfere on her own accord, in no means did Sarah ask for anyone to help her while in the herd, nor did she intentionally get anyone killed.
Sarah isn't a burden, she hasn't slowed down the group at any point, she hasn't caused trouble for the group as a whole, only for herself, it is completely optional for Clementine to also coddle Sarah, it's not forced upon you.
Sorry xD Sarah is my favourite character of Season Two, so I'm gonna be defensive
Sorry what? I like how you explained her actions.
Oh lol I thought you said XD because you chuckled at this argument xD
She might've lived if highly sheltered by the group, but on her own? No way.
The fact of the matter is that being annoying was subjective and she didn't get anyone killed.
She got out of the herd on her own, you know.
True, but what I mean is no one has taught her to fight off walkers (aside from Clem optionally teaching her to shoot), so I wouldn't exactly say her survival would be guaranteed.
they are just excuses as to why she is a burden, not how she wasn't one, potential doesn't equal useful, it mean she has the potential to be taught to be useful, maybe she should have been taught in the relative safety of the cabin how to be of some use to a group of survivors on the move, but in the circumstances of actually being on the move in the zombie apocalypse they don't have time to teach her, hence burden.
maybe she is you favorite character, but if you were to look at her objectively you would see that potential is not the same as actual skills.
that is complete fantasy though, helpless people require help, sure sarita could have just be like "screw it, let her die" but if she didn't need help sarita wouldn't have had to help, however i wouldn't blame her for that either or Reggie's death which you could also say was indirectly her fault.
sarah did slow down the group and caused trouble by almost causing the death of luke, jane, and clementine and she is likely the cause of nick's death, and obviously i am talking about when she freaked out and wouldn't move, excuses or reasons why she did that don't change that she did that.
but seriously i don't know what you think burden means, but it basically means she is a net loss to the productivity of the group as a whole (she takes more than she gives) and throughout the game she demonstrated that she was a burden.
liking her or even her being nice has nothing to do with the practicality of survival.
How could she be the blame on Nick's death? Nick made his own decision to go for help injured without weapons. I guess Luke didn't bother to stop him for being his best friend or give him his gun or machete.
well if sarah wasn't freaking out they would have all gone together, one person had to stay with her at least.
you can say "Nick made his own decision to go for help" but he wouldn't have had to make that decision if it wasn't for sarah.
Everything would have been screwed anyway cuz Carver's men were shooting. There were a lot of moments during that herd escape which made no sense like Carlos being the only one shot, walkers not noticing Bonnie shooting her AK, some walkers noticing Clem even with her body covered in guts etc.
Also if you consider season one you have Doug, Carley, and Ben. All of whom had great stories even though they were determinant characters. They should be the prime example of how to handle determinant characters and I feel they were the reason why so many people were disappointed by this season's determinants since they were the golden standard.
How are they excuses to how she is a burden when all the things I've listed are what she can do that actually shows how she stands up for others and even helps in situations. I never said potential equalled useful but it's evident that she could've been very useful which I threw in there as a side point not a main one. They did have time to teach her at the Cabin, how long since the Apocalypse began? Heck, we know they've been in the Cabin for a while too.
Potential is created from the Skills a person has, she has shown confidence, willingness to learn, fearlessness and yet still showed compassion and innocence.
Helpless people required help? Isn't that a contradiction? Especially since they're help-less, meaning you can't help them regardless of what you do, which was the case of Sarah's second and illogical death. It may be a Fantasy, but this is a Fantasy World. Sarah didn't need help, there wasn't a Walker trying to grab her in an unsafe radius, we see Sarita taking out a Walker that isn't even close to Sarah, just heading her way, Sarita chose to help because she wanted to, just because someone helps doesn't mean the person they're trying to help indefinitely needs help. As for Reggie's death, it wasn't Sarah's fault that Carver killed Reggie, Reggie didn't bother to check with Sarah or show her what she's meant to do properly, he had a job which was to supervise them and ensure they were both working efficiently, did he do that? No, he left to take care of his own matters. But that still doesn't mean he deserved his death, but I wouldn't blame Sarah at all, an Indirect cause of death is never intentional or thought out.
How did Sarah almost cause the death of Luke, Jane and Clementine? Luke CHOSE to go find Sarah at his own will, he could've left her the same way Nick did, he chose to risk his life to try and help Sarah, it's evident that Sarah didn't ask for anyone to help her at that moment, as for Jane, she wanted to leave Sarah behind, in truth it's Clementine who endangers Jane as she's the one who makes the decision to try and force Sarah to come with them or not, and still Clementine has the choice of saving Sarah. They chose to put their own lives in danger to try and help Sarah, who was grieving for her dad and facing anxiety issues, she didn't put them in a dangerous situation, she put herself in a dangerous situation as everyone else put themselves in the same dangerous situation, if anything it was Clementine and Jane endangering one another because they wanted to save Luke and Sarah. If Sarah put them all in danger, in that same logic so did Luke because he was also stuck with Sarah, in fact, Sarah only responded to Luke, Luke kept trying to force Sarah to snap out of her panic and loudly too causing Walkers to become attracted to the sound he made. The likely cause of Nick's death is the Walker Clementine fights past that point as it has blood on it's mouth if you saved Nick and lacks blood if you didn't, plus Nick was shot in the neck, he may have also bled to death too. Of course she freaked out and wouldn't move, people with anxiety can suffer panic attacks when they are literally not in control of their bodies, you can make the situation worse as Clementine by being rude to Sarah and saying she'll die, the same way Luke and Jane kept saying they want to abandon her right in front of her face. She lost her father and she couldn't defend herself, she seemed to have a panic attack and would've also been blind without her glasses, they are good reasons as to why she couldn't control her own actions, if you've ever had a panic attack or have anxiety like some of us do, you might understand the situation she was in.
You haven't proven at all how Sarah is a burden, you keep blaming her for putting other people in danger when they chose to be in danger themselves, Sarah has never asked anyone to help her, let alone force them to do anything for her. She is definitely an asset to the group as a potential survivalist, someone Clementine can trust, and possibly the reason why Carlos still lives through the Apocalypse at that time and why he's with the Cabin group. She was overall an asset to the group, especially in the point where she can give Clementine medicine, Clementine could've died that night if it wasn't for her.
Liking someone or someone being nice does have allot to do with survival, do you honestly think someone is going to help you stay alive or even let you join their group if they disliked you, or especially if you were a rude and mischievous person? That's a net loss to the group, being hated can be a loss for a person as it lowers your chances of surviving.
Do you seriously blame Sarah for freaking out when she's shown to have anxiety and her father, Carlos, whose been coddling her for years, just dies right in front of her while she's surrounded by the dead knowing she could die any second? She evidently had a panic attack and that's not something a person alone can get out of easily or quickly, regardless of what you try to say about her stiffness or sudden urge to sprint, she is still human and allot of humans would do what she did under the right circumstances. No one had to stay with her, they chose to stay with her, she didn't ask or force anyone to stay with her.
Nick did makes his own decision to go for help, he chose to expose himself by leaving the Trailer, Luke told us it was his idea. You can't blame Sarah for that decision when it was entirely his choice to follow Luke to find Sarah and then to leave the Trailer, Luke was the one chasing down Sarah and Nick was right behind him by choice. Say all you want but there's always a choice to do something in most scenarios, no one had to chase Sarah and endanger their lives, what was stupid of everyone to do as separate in the herd so that they'd all be in different areas.
Because, people like that...they're just gonna die anyways. - Rick Grimes.
for starters just have the definition of helpless to make it easy:
helpless
ˈhɛlpləs/
adjective
adjective: helpless
unable to defend oneself or to act without help.
"the cubs are born blind and helpless"
synonyms: dependent, incapable, powerless, impotent, weak, weakly, feeble;
antonyms: independent, capable of looking after oneself
uncontrollable.
"they burst into helpless laughter"
she didn't give clementine medicine, clementine had to convince a naive child into letting her take it, and you still don't understand (or are intentionally avoiding acknowledging your understanding of the word) burden, i didn't even bring up the danger she put other people in, i am saying she is a burden because she is helpless, the danger she puts other people in because they have to help her is just a byproduct of her helplessness.
you can make excuses for the danger she put other people in and say they CHOSE to help her, but are you really saying they should just leave her to get hurt or killed?
As I recall she is only helpless 3 times in the game:
After Carlos slapped her hard for the first time and no one was coddling her for the first time she was unable to do her task for the Community without getting help from Clementine, but Reggie didn't do his job to make sure Sarah was working or knew what to do, she is just a kid and she was just physically abused, however, she didn't really need help to me, more of support in this instance.
In the Trailer, after Carlos died right in front of her in the middle of a Walker Herd and as she lost her glasses and went into a panic attack which rendered her immobile, she couldn't defend herself or act without getting physically hurt by one person she can trust, if you see someone die in front of you and go into a panic attack, the experience is twice as horrifying, especially when you're partially blind.
The final one is on the Observation Deck that clearly had a plot hole of how the planks somehow fell on top of her when she fell down after, that doesn't even make sense and even if it did, her legs seemed to be lodged and she couldn't move, of course she'd be defenceless.
The biggest reason she is helpless at these stages is due to the years of people coddling her and not helping her learn how to protect herself, she wanted to learn how to but no one even gave her a weapon she could use to protect herself with, literally everyone in the group but Sarah had a weapon, when it was clear she wanted one to defend herself if she ever needed to.
There's no difference in both instances Sarah gives Clementine the Medicine she needs to disinfect her wound. Being helpless doesn't make someone a burden in my opinion, because often times someone who is helpless is made helpless and can be helpful in their own way, Sarah was made helpless by those around her, only Clementine can show her how to use a Gun and after that no one shows her anything about survival apart from rubbing Walker guts on yourself. Can you blame Sarah for not being given a chance to learn how to survive as all the others have gotten that chance? Can you blame her for being defenceless when weapons were literally handed out to everyone except her?
That's the thing, they have an option, you can't just blame someone for being the reason another person gets in danger just because that person chose to save the other, of course it's morally ill and wrong in my opinion to choose not to save someone who requires aid but that doesn't it's their fault if you yourself choose to save them. When person A chooses to save person B, that's a choice they make, an action they make, and if it gets Person A killed, that's Person A's fault because he/she made said decision. I'm evidently a Sarah fan so of course I'm not saying they should've just let her die, but they did, they can leave her to die in the Trailer and do nothing to help her on the Observation Deck, her second death was just an entire illogical plot hole.
Also I should add that the definition of 'helpless' works for all character as they've been in a scenario that made them unable to defend themselves or act without help.
so you agree she was helpless
that makes no sense at all, so if you are "made" helpless this somehow means you aren't a burden, that is just wrong, reasons for being a certain way doesn't change the fact that you are that way eg. if you were made to be weak it doesn't change the fact that you are weak, you can't just be like "oh it's ok i was made weak so i can actually lift heavy things"
If you're referring to being forced to slap Sarah in order to get her to leave the trailer, then I can't help but feel that this was yet another stupid decision by the writers of Episode Four. The previous episode had established Sarah as a girl who practically shut down after her father struck her, and yet, just one episode later, slapping her in the face and screaming "MOVE!" is enough to motivate her into leaving with you? I'll readily admit that I don't have a degree in psychology, but wouldn't being physically hurt by the one other person she trusts only serve to drive her further inside herself? The Walking Dead game is clearly intended to be serious work of fiction, but suddenly treating an emotionally fragile character like a hysterical 1950s housewife in an old Hanna-Barbera cartoon doesn't help its credibility at all.
Granted, this situation wouldn't be so glaringly stupid if our choices weren't arbitrarily limited to slapping Sarah and abandoning her. Almost every other situation in the game gives us four options in how to approach it, yet in this case we're only given two? Even off the top of my head, I can think of four ways to approach that situation:
Talk Sarah into leaving with you
Slap Sarah (Same as before. This should still be an option. It just shouldn't be the only option)
Psychically drag out Sarah of the trailer
Leave her (Again, same as before)
Granted, depending on your choices in previous episodes, not every option you're presented with should work out in Sarah's favor.
For instance, attempting to talk Sarah into leaving the trailer should only work if you'd spent the past three episodes befriending her and gaining her trust. If you previously spent the game insulting and belittling her, she's only going to tune you out. After all, why should she expect you to start being friendly to her now?
On the other hand, if you had been her friend and gained her trust, slapping Sarah would only cause her to feel betrayed and become completely unreachable. Slapping her if you'd been a jerk to her, on the other hand, might break through her emotional defenses, and get her to follow your orders to leave.
Attempting to physically drag her out of the trailer wouldn't work no matter how you'd previously treated Sarah. Everything we've seen regarding Sarah indicates that this would only cause her to panic, break free, and run away blindly - likely right into the loving arms of a hungry zombie.
But, rather than give us multiple options that that would serve to reinforce our choices up to that point, Telltale decided to narrow everything down to an unrealistic "Slap" or "Leave" decision. A decision that, ultimately, didn't even end up mattering.