Well, I wouldn't Andy and especially Brenda were completely irredeemable. While I can't really speak much for/against Andy since I don't have much of a grasp on him, Brenda at the very least seemed to be legitimately wholesome outside of that aspect and the options to encourage her to change her viewpoint does seem to briefly get through a bit, it's just that she was in too deep at that point to completely consider it.
I think I wasn't clear on that part myself lol XD.
What I meant to say was that Reggies screentime should've gone to Nick because everybody forgots he existed
Reggie:I didn't like his voice but what a waste of space in the storyline that should've been used for Nick or someone else in EP3 and he di… morees no matter what. I don't see the point of his story besides letting Carver looking evil -_-
Russell: I thought he was oké in 400 days... Now he just looks like a douche and what a waste like again** his screen time could've been used for the other characters** and maybe he appears in S3 but I don't know for now he looks like a douche
Uh...you wanna explain those there, pal?
I'm assuming you mean either replacing him with Nick or invoking the "Kenny-distraction" effect in Reggie himself. Cause not only do I think Reggie could've functioned better in that role(though it could've been a neat take on the scene), you also have to account for the fact that Nick wasn't always guaranteed to still be alive in the episode.
I think I wasn't clear on that part myself lol XD.
What I meant to say was that Reggies screentime should've gone to Nick because everybody forgots he existed
* Utter contempt
Hmm, well, don't really have anyone who'd fit here?
* Hatred
Carver.
* Dislike
Jane, Joyce.
* An… morenoyance
Lilly (though after Larry's death it turned more into pity), Christa, Pete, Carlos.
* Irrelevance
Larry, I just couldn't bring myself to care much about him.
I was just trying to fit him on this scale, bc he is one of my least favorite characters, but I wouldn't say I dislike him all that much. I'm more annoyed by what a big deal some people seemed to make of him, I think? And well, some of things he did grated on me too.
Oh, I guess it's kinda like Hype Backlash, maybe? I think people just really liked that he was the one member of the Cabin Group who was broadly likable. Sarah is a basebreaker, Luke is sometimes seen as just a nice guy, and I've seen Alvin get flak for being henpecked and/or being Carver's rival.
I was just trying to fit him on this scale, bc he is one of my least favorite characters, but I wouldn't say I dislike him all that much. I'… morem more annoyed by what a big deal some people seemed to make of him, I think? And well, some of things he did grated on me too.
I dunno, Rebecca & Nick were my favorite cabin group characters, & I honestly don't know what's so broadly likeable about Pete, he doesn't really stand out positively in any way for me.
What exactly about him did you find grating.
His treatment of Nick as first & foremost. I fail to see how him trying to aggravate or humiliate him were supposed to work out. I know he claimed to do it bc he cared (& I do believe that he did), but from where I stand, he wasn't even trying. Pete's strategy was basically telling him "you're an idiot whose opinions don't matter, get over it" & expecting that to toughen him, but isn't it kinda obvious this can never work & that a person saying this is naturally viewed as an asshole, regardless of whether they're right or not?
If he tried talking to him at the right moment, not when Nick was irritated, if he showed that he cared about his feelings, by, like, not telling embarrassing stories about him to a stranger, whom he certainly is not supposed to prioritize over his nephew, maybe Nick would've listened to him. For me, his attitude in that situation is just a major lack of tact & foresight with no good reason behind it.
Oh, I guess it's kinda like Hype Backlash, maybe? I think people just really liked that he was the one member of the Cabin Group who was bro… moreadly likable. Sarah is a basebreaker, Luke is sometimes seen as just a nice guy, and I've seen Alvin get flak for being henpecked and/or being Carver's rival.
What exactly about him did you find grating.
I honestly don't know what's so broadly likeable about Pete, he doesn't really stand out positively in any way for me.
It's that he saved Clementine, vouched for her even though she could've been lying to him, offered to do whatever it took to help her survive, and was one of the few who was both reasonable and wasn't overly aggressive towards her. Combine that with what I say below and all of these traits make people like Pete because he did what was best for everyone even when it meant using himself as an eatable scapegoat, something Luke repeatedly struggled with.
His treatment of Nick as first & foremost. I fail to see how him trying to aggravate or humiliate him were supposed to work out. I know he claimed to do it bc he cared (& I do believe that he did), but from where I stand, he wasn't even trying. Pete's strategy was basically telling him "you're an idiot whose opinions don't matter, get over it" & expecting that to toughen him, but isn't it kinda obvious this can never work & that a person saying this is naturally viewed as an asshole, regardless of whether they're right or not?
If he tried talking to him at the right moment, not when Nick was irritated, if he showed that he cared about his feelings, by, like, not telling embarrassing stories about him to a stranger, whom he certainly is not supposed to prioritize over his nephew, maybe Nick would've listened to him. For me, his attitude in that situation is just a major lack of tact & foresight with no good reason behind it.
Yeah, I should'a figured that's what it'd be, given that Luke has also gotten flak for a similar reason. I was actually watching some alternative choices a few days ago and noticed how tough he was coming off at times when talking to Nick, so it got me thinking about whether someone like you may have picked up on it as well. What Pete was trying to do during the fishing trip was convince Clementine that Nick really is a good person: the story about the deer was meant to show that he cares about all life, the comment about his dad was meant explain why he has a metaphorically chip on his shoulder, and as you said, his tough love was meant to teach him how to carry himself. However, I do see how he was being a little too insensitive about it that time.
See, this is an [admittedly minor] example of the story's shifting direction and morality making something not work as well as it was meant to. In a way, Pete's tough love towards Nick was a contrast to Carlos's babying of Sarah in that they show two different ways of parenting that has mixed results in that while their intentions are unambiguous good, it also ignores certain aspects of the kids' behavior. since he's allowing Nick to be in a position where he will make mistakes so he can learn from them, whereas Carlos sheltering Sarah meant she couldn't reliably act under stress; however, Carlos is also protecting Sarah from any legitimate danger, while Pete taking up the mantle of keeping Nick in line is making Nick resent him for it. Contrast this with Carver's and to a lesser extent Jane's Darwinistic ways, where things like weakness and incompetence are not tolerated and anyone can be severely punished for a relatively minor offense. And while he certainly meant well, Kenny's overzealous actions concerning AJ meant that he did more harm than good in the name of good intentions.
Of course, Pete's treatment of Nick is objectively the better, since Nick was eventually able to mellow out after his death and takes on any responsibility he feels he has to take seriously, while Sarah unfortunately never gets nearly as far due to the actions of Clementine and/or Jane and AJ will hopefully never have to live up to his possible father's expectations but Clementine(and determinately, a reforming Kenny)'s instead.
I dunno, Rebecca & Nick were my favorite cabin group characters, & I honestly don't know what's so broadly likeable about Pete, he d… moreoesn't really stand out positively in any way for me.
What exactly about him did you find grating.
His treatment of Nick as first & foremost. I fail to see how him trying to aggravate or humiliate him were supposed to work out. I know he claimed to do it bc he cared (& I do believe that he did), but from where I stand, he wasn't even trying. Pete's strategy was basically telling him "you're an idiot whose opinions don't matter, get over it" & expecting that to toughen him, but isn't it kinda obvious this can never work & that a person saying this is naturally viewed as an asshole, regardless of whether they're right or not?
If he tried talking to him at the right moment, not when Nick was irritated, if he showed that he cared about his feelings, by, like, not telling embar… [view original content]
Where did this stealing from his group thing come from? Considering that bag was full of medical supplies for his sister, I sincerely doubt that's what he was doing unless he wanted to keep her a steady supply away from the other two.
this occurs right when you first meet him. he is stuffing the bag into a trash can to hide it. he says as much during the encounter, as well as to the why. the player is given a choice to take the medicine or not, though either way his gun is taken from him.
Lily I like as a character, but she grew increasingly hard, then she snapped and killed an innocent (carly) in cold blood because she pretty… more much wanted her dead.
I'm pretty sure Lilly didn't want Carley dead (unless that's the "Die For My Ship" mentality kicking in). Sure, I kinda got the vibe that they don't really get along but her killing Carley came down to the fact that she was sorta out for blood and Carley got mouthy at the wrong moment.
Arvo was twitchy when encountered at first, while attempting to steal from his group (hiding medical supplies),
Where did this stealing from his group thing come from? Considering that bag was full of medical supplies for his sister, I sincerely doubt that's what he was doing unless he wanted to keep her a steady supply away from the other two.
so he had his gun taken away and sent on his way (quite a kindness really).
While I would that made his easy target status … [view original content]
Does he? Cause I'm pretty sure he tells you he was keeping it there for safety after hesitating, which is after you can ask him about his group and his sister.
Btw, this is actually interesting old news because it was confirmed that Arvo was trying to technically steal in the sense that he was gonna take his sister and run away from the other two. He was just trying to store the medicine at the deck as a rendevouz point for them to rest before taking it with them.
Where did this stealing from his group thing come from? Considering that bag was full of medical supplies for his sister, I sincerely doubt … morethat's what he was doing unless he wanted to keep her a steady supply away from the other two.
this occurs right when you first meet him. he is stuffing the bag into a trash can to hide it. he says as much during the encounter, as well as to the why. the player is given a choice to take the medicine or not, though either way his gun is taken from him.
There's an unused audio where he talks about how little girls look pretty in their summer dresses or something like that. In another one he asks Andy to keep "the girl" (implying Clementine).
Hated - Bonnie, Arvo, Bonnie a few more times. Going out of your way to help/support them still sees the same end result from them.
Utter contempt - Javier. He's a generally shitty person and a shitty protagonist, especially compared to Clementine and Lee in the previous seasons, one of the things dragging down A New Frontier.
Dislike: Larry, Lily, Vernon, Gabe, Kate. Various reasons.
he doesn't go into the running away with his sister, but he does say that his sister needs it and that he doesn't trust his group with the medicine. of course i think you have some options to how tactful you are, so it might be determinate (like him telling you about running away with his sister later on). he was told to pick a better spot to hide it, i took it that was due to avoid a confrontation with his group, though in hindsight it would have been a better bet to just shoot him in cold blood (kinda sucks the game chooses what and when you get to say things, though talking your way out of a major plot point would mess with the story quite a bit).
Does he? Cause I'm pretty sure he tells you he was keeping it there for safety after hesitating, which is after you can ask him about his gr… moreoup and his sister.
Btw, this is actually interesting old news because it was confirmed that Arvo was trying to technically steal in the sense that he was gonna take his sister and run away from the other two. He was just trying to store the medicine at the deck as a rendevouz point for them to rest before taking it with them.
Hating Javier as a character is like hating yourself as you generally have control over what kind of person he is. I think you just don't like that he's taking the spotlight from Clementine.
Hmmm.
Hated - Bonnie, Arvo, Bonnie a few more times. Going out of your way to help/support them still sees the same end result from them.… more
Utter contempt - Javier. He's a generally shitty person and a shitty protagonist, especially compared to Clementine and Lee in the previous seasons, one of the things dragging down A New Frontier.
Dislike: Larry, Lily, Vernon, Gabe, Kate. Various reasons.
Except I generally didn't have control over him being a terrible son and brother. The unclear dialogue options kind of played into that last one, but holy crap, what a terrible way to stop an argument. You can literally say nothing or be a gigantic ass, though its not really made clear that this will happen until it does. His entire first encounter with NF was a face palming result of stupidity I had no control over, though that's just as much as him being ineptly written as it is a lazy excuse to jumpstart the plot. Dude goes from being shitty to "four years passed, he's awesome now!"
Hating Javier as a character is like hating yourself as you generally have control over what kind of person he is. I think you just don't like that he's taking the spotlight from Clementine.
Ok I'll toss in my 2 cents
Utter Contempt: Jane, Arvo
Hatred: Bonnie, Randall, Vernon, Troy, Carver, Sarah, Larry, Lily (although I wo… moreuld probably flip if I saw her again)
Dislike: Reggie, Gabby, Brie
Willing to forgive under the right circumstances: Mike
I also think Christa is pretty bitchy but I wouldn't exactly say I don't like her.
Always found Sarah more annoying than anything. For one, the whole friends thing at the very start really turned me off. It's why I don't like Ava either. Like bitch, I've known you for all of 90 seconds and you're already calling us a team? Step back. Sarah was completely useless, with the one exception of her finding peroxide. She wasn't built for an apocalyptic world, and while I get that added depth to the Cabin Survivors, didn't mean I had to like her. Then when she kept bugging me when Carver was talking, like shut the fuck up already. You can ever hear Clem start to get sort of annoyed with her, even if you play as her best friend. S: "You're gonna put that on yourself?" C: "Yes Sarah! in a snapping tone." After Carlos, all she did was annoy me even more. I get it's how someone like her would react but from Clem's POV, she was a lost cause. I hate to side with Jane on something, but I agree with her on Sarah. As much as it sucks, Sarah wouldn't budge until the absolute very last second which, to me, isn't worth almost dying for someone I never liked in the first place. Again all this is just my opinion, if you like Sarah and disagree with me, (which I know you do in particular) more power to you!
I see this thread got picked back up for some reason--I like that! More older threads deserve soon attention every once in a while. Also, I forgot that I suggested this--how odd of me.
Anyway, I think this is an opportunity for me to be a little unambiguously negative for a change:
Hate/Loathe
1. Jane
2. Justin the Prisoner,
3. William “Bill” Carver,
Jane, Larry and the Stranger are the only characters I really can't stand. There are plenty others I don't care for because they were either not fleshed out enough or just poorly written.
Hate
1. Jane
2. Troy
3. Becca
4. Dee
Dislike
1.Nate
2.Larry
3. The St. John. Brothers.
4. Tavia
5. Vernon
Slightly Annoyed by
1. AJ (I know he's a baby but I mean.)
2. Lilly
3.Carver
4. Brenda St. John.
5.Walter
Ben was a kind personality but still a shitbird..and a coward.
I never have seen such character in the walking dead universe where everyone was doomed to die because of stupid actions.
But he is a great written character.
I guess in real life there would have been many peoples like Ben in a zombie apocalypse.
Danny St. John. Brenda and Andy St. John did something against their better judgment they could justify toward their survival. Danny was always a creep. You could tell.
There's pretty much no characters I truly hate or dislike in this series, in all honesty.
Except one. Danny St John. Just fuck that guy.
… more
He's one of the only characters that as far as I'm concerned has no redeeming qualities whatsoever, and doesn't even have any funny lines or an entertaining personality to make up for being an asshole, like Larry or Randall do. He's one of the few characters that really got under my skin when I first played the game, and I really don't regret killing him at all. I only regret that Clementine had to see it.
Comments
I have powers
Well, I wouldn't Andy and especially Brenda were completely irredeemable. While I can't really speak much for/against Andy since I don't have much of a grasp on him, Brenda at the very least seemed to be legitimately wholesome outside of that aspect and the options to encourage her to change her viewpoint does seem to briefly get through a bit, it's just that she was in too deep at that point to completely consider it.
But yeah, that was messed up.
I think I wasn't clear on that part myself lol XD.
What I meant to say was that Reggies screentime should've gone to Nick because everybody forgots he existed
I'm assuming you mean either replacing him with Nick or invoking the "Kenny-distraction" effect in Reggie himself. Cause not only do I think Reggie could've functioned better in that role(though it could've been a neat take on the scene), you also have to account for the fact that Nick wasn't always guaranteed to still be alive in the episode.
Pete annoyed you?
I was just trying to fit him on this scale, bc he is one of my least favorite characters, but I wouldn't say I dislike him all that much. I'm more annoyed by what a big deal some people seemed to make of him, I think? And well, some of things he did grated on me too.
Oh, I guess it's kinda like Hype Backlash, maybe? I think people just really liked that he was the one member of the Cabin Group who was broadly likable. Sarah is a basebreaker, Luke is sometimes seen as just a nice guy, and I've seen Alvin get flak for being henpecked and/or being Carver's rival.
What exactly about him did you find grating.
Ok I'll toss in my 2 cents
Utter Contempt: Jane, Arvo
Hatred: Bonnie, Randall, Vernon, Troy, Carver, Sarah, Larry, Lily (although I would probably flip if I saw her again)
Dislike: Reggie, Gabby, Brie
Willing to forgive under the right circumstances: Mike
I also think Christa is pretty bitchy but I wouldn't exactly say I don't like her.
I dunno, Rebecca & Nick were my favorite cabin group characters, & I honestly don't know what's so broadly likeable about Pete, he doesn't really stand out positively in any way for me.
His treatment of Nick as first & foremost. I fail to see how him trying to aggravate or humiliate him were supposed to work out. I know he claimed to do it bc he cared (& I do believe that he did), but from where I stand, he wasn't even trying. Pete's strategy was basically telling him "you're an idiot whose opinions don't matter, get over it" & expecting that to toughen him, but isn't it kinda obvious this can never work & that a person saying this is naturally viewed as an asshole, regardless of whether they're right or not?
If he tried talking to him at the right moment, not when Nick was irritated, if he showed that he cared about his feelings, by, like, not telling embarrassing stories about him to a stranger, whom he certainly is not supposed to prioritize over his nephew, maybe Nick would've listened to him. For me, his attitude in that situation is just a major lack of tact & foresight with no good reason behind it.
It's that he saved Clementine, vouched for her even though she could've been lying to him, offered to do whatever it took to help her survive, and was one of the few who was both reasonable and wasn't overly aggressive towards her. Combine that with what I say below and all of these traits make people like Pete because he did what was best for everyone even when it meant using himself as an eatable scapegoat, something Luke repeatedly struggled with.
Yeah, I should'a figured that's what it'd be, given that Luke has also gotten flak for a similar reason. I was actually watching some alternative choices a few days ago and noticed how tough he was coming off at times when talking to Nick, so it got me thinking about whether someone like you may have picked up on it as well. What Pete was trying to do during the fishing trip was convince Clementine that Nick really is a good person: the story about the deer was meant to show that he cares about all life, the comment about his dad was meant explain why he has a metaphorically chip on his shoulder, and as you said, his tough love was meant to teach him how to carry himself. However, I do see how he was being a little too insensitive about it that time.
See, this is an [admittedly minor] example of the story's shifting direction and morality making something not work as well as it was meant to. In a way, Pete's tough love towards Nick was a contrast to Carlos's babying of Sarah in that they show two different ways of parenting that has mixed results in that while their intentions are unambiguous good, it also ignores certain aspects of the kids' behavior. since he's allowing Nick to be in a position where he will make mistakes so he can learn from them, whereas Carlos sheltering Sarah meant she couldn't reliably act under stress; however, Carlos is also protecting Sarah from any legitimate danger, while Pete taking up the mantle of keeping Nick in line is making Nick resent him for it. Contrast this with Carver's and to a lesser extent Jane's Darwinistic ways, where things like weakness and incompetence are not tolerated and anyone can be severely punished for a relatively minor offense. And while he certainly meant well, Kenny's overzealous actions concerning AJ meant that he did more harm than good in the name of good intentions.
Of course, Pete's treatment of Nick is objectively the better, since Nick was eventually able to mellow out after his death and takes on any responsibility he feels he has to take seriously, while Sarah unfortunately never gets nearly as far due to the actions of Clementine and/or Jane and AJ will hopefully never have to live up to his possible father's expectations but Clementine(and determinately, a reforming Kenny)'s instead.
this occurs right when you first meet him. he is stuffing the bag into a trash can to hide it. he says as much during the encounter, as well as to the why. the player is given a choice to take the medicine or not, though either way his gun is taken from him.
Fuck Arvo
Does he? Cause I'm pretty sure he tells you he was keeping it there for safety after hesitating, which is after you can ask him about his group and his sister.
Btw, this is actually interesting old news because it was confirmed that Arvo was trying to technically steal in the sense that he was gonna take his sister and run away from the other two. He was just trying to store the medicine at the deck as a rendevouz point for them to rest before taking it with them.
Clementine in Season 2.
Making her the protagonist was the reason why it sucked.
There's an unused audio where he talks about how little girls look pretty in their summer dresses or something like that. In another one he asks Andy to keep "the girl" (implying Clementine).
Hmmm.
Hated - Bonnie, Arvo, Bonnie a few more times. Going out of your way to help/support them still sees the same end result from them.
Utter contempt - Javier. He's a generally shitty person and a shitty protagonist, especially compared to Clementine and Lee in the previous seasons, one of the things dragging down A New Frontier.
Dislike: Larry, Lily, Vernon, Gabe, Kate. Various reasons.
he doesn't go into the running away with his sister, but he does say that his sister needs it and that he doesn't trust his group with the medicine. of course i think you have some options to how tactful you are, so it might be determinate (like him telling you about running away with his sister later on). he was told to pick a better spot to hide it, i took it that was due to avoid a confrontation with his group, though in hindsight it would have been a better bet to just shoot him in cold blood (kinda sucks the game chooses what and when you get to say things, though talking your way out of a major plot point would mess with the story quite a bit).
And in a used line, Andy tells Danny to choose one to keep, but not the little girl, implying Danny would go for her if given the choice.
Hating Javier as a character is like hating yourself as you generally have control over what kind of person he is. I think you just don't like that he's taking the spotlight from Clementine.
Except I generally didn't have control over him being a terrible son and brother. The unclear dialogue options kind of played into that last one, but holy crap, what a terrible way to stop an argument. You can literally say nothing or be a gigantic ass, though its not really made clear that this will happen until it does. His entire first encounter with NF was a face palming result of stupidity I had no control over, though that's just as much as him being ineptly written as it is a lazy excuse to jumpstart the plot. Dude goes from being shitty to "four years passed, he's awesome now!"
Nah.
Disgusting characters:
-Bonnie
-Badger
-Carver
-Troy
-Ben shitbird
Dislike:
-Kate, please let her die this season
-Jane
-Mike
Okay, Bonnie is one thing, but Ben?
Damn, why is Sarah lumped in with those assholes, psychopaths, and Bonnie & Vernon?
Technically, people did die as a result of Ben's actions...
6 months ago. Really? :P
Always found Sarah more annoying than anything. For one, the whole friends thing at the very start really turned me off. It's why I don't like Ava either. Like bitch, I've known you for all of 90 seconds and you're already calling us a team? Step back. Sarah was completely useless, with the one exception of her finding peroxide. She wasn't built for an apocalyptic world, and while I get that added depth to the Cabin Survivors, didn't mean I had to like her. Then when she kept bugging me when Carver was talking, like shut the fuck up already. You can ever hear Clem start to get sort of annoyed with her, even if you play as her best friend. S: "You're gonna put that on yourself?" C: "Yes Sarah! in a snapping tone." After Carlos, all she did was annoy me even more. I get it's how someone like her would react but from Clem's POV, she was a lost cause. I hate to side with Jane on something, but I agree with her on Sarah. As much as it sucks, Sarah wouldn't budge until the absolute very last second which, to me, isn't worth almost dying for someone I never liked in the first place. Again all this is just my opinion, if you like Sarah and disagree with me, (which I know you do in particular) more power to you!
I see this thread got picked back up for some reason--I like that! More older threads deserve soon attention every once in a while. Also, I forgot that I suggested this--how odd of me.
Anyway, I think this is an opportunity for me to be a little unambiguously negative for a change:
Hate/Loathe
1. Jane
2. Justin the Prisoner,
3. William “Bill” Carver,
Dislike
4. Wyatt
5. Linda
6. Tess Campman,
7. Captain Kenny,
8. Rebecca
9. Lieutenant Badger
10. Tripp
Bleh
11. Oberson Crawford,
12. Buricko
13. Winston
14. Roberto
15. Marcus Crabtree,
16. Paul "jesus" Monroe,
17. Clive
18. Andy St. John,
19. Leader Clint
20. Rufus
21. Roman(Barely)
22. Eddie
23. Mariana Garcia,
Hate
1. Jane
2. Troy
3. Becca
4. Dee
Dislike
1.Nate
2.Larry
3. The St. John. Brothers.
4. Tavia
5. Vernon
Slightly Annoyed by
1. AJ (I know he's a baby but I mean.)
2. Lilly
3.Carver
4. Brenda St. John.
5.Walter
Jane, Larry and the Stranger are the only characters I really can't stand. There are plenty others I don't care for because they were either not fleshed out enough or just poorly written.
Dee and St. John.
Ben was a kind personality but still a shitbird..and a coward.
I never have seen such character in the walking dead universe where everyone was doomed to die because of stupid actions.
But he is a great written character.
I guess in real life there would have been many peoples like Ben in a zombie apocalypse.
Danny St. John. Brenda and Andy St. John did something against their better judgment they could justify toward their survival. Danny was always a creep. You could tell.
"That's good shootin' right there" always gives me a chuckle lol
Never cared for Jane.
...Eh, true.