What exactly has Gabe messed up?
I know this discussion will cause some debates, but I honestly just want some clarification on one thing. What exactly has Gabe messed up? One of the most common complaints I hear about his character is that he always messes things up and that he is a f*ck up and all that jazz. I rewatched some gameplay from each episode and I could not find many examples prior to episode 4 in which his actions cause the group any harm or anyone to lose their life. Most of the problems the group faces is in no way caused by Gabe so I am confused as to why people blame him.
After episode 4, everyone just brings up the same point which is this; He sold Javi out. While this point is valid (if this occurred for you), keep in mind people were saying he messes things up prior to episode 4.
This leads me to believe one of two things.
One: Gabe's character is determinant based on your actions, or
Two: People just hate Gabe for the sake of hating Gabe
These are the only mistakes he made that I could find and some are even determinant.
- He could accidentally mess up Kate's surgery and run away. However, this is determinant.
- He gets Javi stabbed by impulsively trying to take on a guard.
- He tells the group Javi killed Conrad, causing problems with the group. This is also determinant.
Aside from this, what exactly has he messed up? Keep in mind only getting Javi stabbed happens regardless, so up until that point he didn't really do much bad. Here is a list of some notable good actions he can do as well.
- He pushed Kate out of the line of fire in the junk yard
- He helped out Javi in protecting Kate from walkers both during the Prescott attack and on the way to Richmond
- He could also help Javi break out of his cell. However, this is determinant.
Now I would like to ask that people make their points respectfully and avoid insulting others for their opinion or making passive aggressive or sarcastic comments. I know talking about certain characters causes a lot of conflict but I am honestly just trying to get clarification. Please if you have any constructive points feel free to comment.
Comments
I believe that people count Gabe pulling a gun on Conrad as one of his mistakes.
I think people say he messes up a lot because they often compare Gabe to Ben and Nick (more so Ben than Nick) so they use similar or the same complaints. I could be wrong but that's just how I see it as complaints about Gabe seem really exaggerated to me.
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I mentioned before, please avoid non constructive comments. Maybe try explaining a point that is relevant to this discussion.
Why would that count as a mistake? The way I see it, pulling a gun on Conrad had no consequence and in the moment it was justified. I believe the same though. You make good points.
Justified or not, the poor kid was scared. He had just lost Mariana, his sister, and he was afraid of losing someone else close to him.
People only really hate him because of Gabentine. I like Gabe.
Well honestly I don't even hate Gabe and my only criticism is that he sold me out for offing Conrad. I still don't hate him now despite the fact that what he done in Episode 4 is a major screw up considering how it was to protect him and Clem, and also how he is very hypocritical about the situation.
I can't really speak for the other issues since I don't find them to bother me as much as others, but I find that his impulsiveness caused by his age, puberty etc. can cause him to act unreasonably at times and so it makes sense that he may act aggressively and that would account for most of the problems people have for him.
I just hope he can do a whole lot of good in Episode 5 to make up for ratting me out.
Just because his mistakes are determinant doesn't make them okay. It seems to me that many players have gotten these determinant mistakes in their playthroughs which causes their resentment towards Gabe and that's completely justified. But the argument that he messes up all the time isn't true, but he does fuck up enough for players to dislike him. He's also been helpful as well but that's not enough for players to like him. Besides all that Gabe is an annoying teenager, that's enough to piss anyone off.
I'm sure most people wouldn't say his mistakes are ok just because they are determinant. That being said I agree. It seems lots of people have made choices that end up with Gabe acting up a lot more. I guess Telltale might have intended for him to be like Kenny was in season 1. After all his attitude towards Lee was completely determinant. However, the way it plays out isn't as clear. And, yeah I agree. I found that he has more positive non determinant moments than he does negative non determinant moments, but that is not considered most of the time. Aside from this, I can see why being a hot headed teen would cause him to be disliked, but you have to also remember he is very loyal to his family. That's a good trait.
That seems like a very silly reason to hate someone lol. After all, his crush on Clem would more than likely mean he would die if it meant keeping her safe. That seems like a positive if you ask me. Clementine seems to not hate Gabe so I am unsure why people who claim to care about Clem are going against what Clem seems to want.
I see your point. I did find that scene really didn't play out in a way that made sense. I do agree about his attitude. The issue is that people seem to have a hard time separating his attitude from his actions. If he complains let him complain so long as he doesn't harm the group. However, people seem to think complaining = messing up and that's not correct. Aside from that, he has good traits that more than make up for his bad ones. He is very loyal to his family and refuses to leave anyone behind. He is also pretty brave, or fierce as Eleanor put it. I also just hope he makes up for whatever it is people are upset about. If he can live that would be a good thing as well. We need more reoccurring characters to give the story meaning.
I wouldn't call Gabe loyal, he can sell out his own uncle and that's fucked up. Especially after encouraging the player to shoot Conrad. Gabe's betrayal outweighs his positive aspects imo. I can't respect anyone who's willing to do that kind of shit.
That action was determinant so it would also not be fair to say he isn't. For one, he refuses to leave his dad and he worries a lot about Kate despite having a rocky relationship with her. He also really cares about Javi. Remember how relieved he was to see him when he got back to Richmond after being exiled. And if he doesn't help him escape his cell, he also shows that he worried a lot when Javi gets to the apartment.
So he can still be loyal to many. It's a reason why I felt that scene didn't play out well. I honestly think it was due to inconsistent writing. But fair enough, you explained your point well.
Tells people to only write constructive comments
Writes non-constructive comment
Yeah right. The least you can do for your own good to not be viewed as a hypocrite is to hold yourself to your own standard.
I hate Gabe because I view Clementine as my daughter and my protective instincts go red whenever I see a male or female approach Clementine sexually. Yes Gabe's feelings is simply him wanting to reproduce with Clementine which is big no-no. Nothing special there.
You know what is more positive? Him keeping off Clementine sexually and actually listening to his uncle.
If I did not care about Clementine, I would not mind gabentine because I would not care about her. The only reason I passionately hate gabentine is because I care about Clementine a lot. There is plenty of ships which I don't care about because I don't care about the females as I care about Clementine.
It seems you forgot to read what came after aka my explanation as to why I made that comment. It seems you are just trying to attack people for simply disagreeing with you. I and everyone else who has commented thus far have not attacked anyone for their opinion so I would suggest you tone down your attitude. Aside from that, your comment is still not pertaining to this discussion. This is a discussion on why people think Gabe messes up all the time. This is NOT a "Gabentine" discussion. If you hate the idea of Gabe and Clem being an item, that is your right, but keep this discussion relevant. The original comment simply made an observation that Gabe is mostly hated no because he messes up but because of that reason. So that comment was still constructive.
Ps. If you really care about Clem, you would let her make her own decisions.
Very well said sir
He ruined boss baby's phone call with king Jon un...
Stick to answer each piece.
I am just responding with a respectful tone to what you imply about people who holds a certain opinion as silly. Really? Silly?You think I like to joke that I hate gabentine for fun? No. You attacked and made certain people of view as "silly", and I simply responded respectfully why without undermining what you think. I disagree with a lot of people, and mostly I reply when the other person has misunderstood something. But a person undermining what I think(sometimes feel if founded on valid base) as silly? That person guaranteed to have me replying if I have not missed their text.
Thank you for you suggestion but I don't undermine myself by undermining others. That would be counterproductive.
My comment is valid because I explained why I hate Gabe. Possibly other people think the same or somewhat like that which adds up the hate/dislike.
"keep this discussion relevant." Then don't undermine things that is not "relevant".
"The original comment simply made an observation that Gabe is mostly hated no because he messes up but because of that reason. So that comment was still constructive."
"Ps. If you really care about Clem, you would let her make her own decisions."
So if I decide for a child to not touch a poop means that I don't care? It means that I care for that child to not get dirty and sick.
Edit: The numbers screwed up and does not display the same number. So regard them as text.
omg!!! gabe calls boss baby 100% real (not clickbait) xdxdxd
Yes for freedom to do illogical actions is a good thing in today's society.
finally someone says it i agree
Again, this is not a, "why do you hate Gabe", discussion. This is a "what has Gabe messed up", discussion. If you wish to discuss why You hate Gabe there are plenty of threads for you. However if you consider Gabe liking Clementine as messing up, explain why without getting aggressive.
Stop avoiding the arguments. Gabentine was only an of the reason of the hate and me explaining why the hate for it exist because you undermined my view as "silly" while telling other to be constructive. Hypocrisy.
Answer the texts which you all the time have avoided instead of putting words in my mouth. I never wrote Gabentine "a mess up".
My point exactly. This is not a Gabentine discussion. This is a what has Gabe messed up discussion. If you want an answer, feel free to start your own discussion. I will gladly comment there. This is not the place and I would ask unless you have something to say about this topic please avoid from spamming with unrelated topics. That's my final answer.
Please refrain from making comments that don't directly relate to the discussion. On a side note, that was funny in a random way.
You have not answered anything other than avoiding and putting words in my mouth. And you undermining comments as spam? Answer to begin with instead of avoiding and undermining, which you can't because you are logically incorrect.
If you don't a "unrelated", then don't undermine an unrelated thing in a thread, it is that simply.
Don't bother to reply with when it is all avoidance and undermining.
So you implied that all of Clem's decisions are illogical then?
We care about someone, that doesn't mean we can restrict them, right? We simply have to 'guide' them to be ready for the world they have to face against someday, not to tell them to stay away from all of the things that you think are bad for them. If you keep up with that, they won't grow out of their childishness. It will be on your liability.
take example of what Lee did in S1, Clem wanted to learn how to wield a gun, just so she could be helpful for others. At first Lee ignored her plea, but eventually he complied her wish by teaching her what she wanted. Does that mean Lee didn't care about her? about Clem's safety? Of course he cared for her! he knew that sooner or later that Clem had to grow up and made her own decisions to survive. He couldn't caged her for too long because he knew that he couldn't protect her forever.
All of those reasons have something to do with clementine so I'll just count them as one. I doubt there really is a real reason for people to hate Gabe because in my playthrough he has only done one thing wrong.
I wouldn't hate Gabe this much if he did 100 small mess ups than breaking the trust by snitching on Javier and thus risking not only Javier's life but his own, and Clementine's (because she was with them in the tunnel).
He blames Javier despite telling him to shoot Conrad. Not taking any responsibility at all and he wants independence without taking the responsibility.
He did this openly and had the nerve to blame Javier. It is one thing to do it privately and completely another to do it openly which greatly undermines Javier's status and trust which can reduce the survival chance greatly.
He shamelessly speaks to Clementine and attempts to increase his relationship with her despite him selling out his uncle who saved her life (yes I know that he only picked up his gun when Gabe was threatened and not Clementine which is a fault of Javier). Logically Clementine would be angry at Gabe and hate him a lot for blaming his uncle for not agreeing to trade Clementine to unknown people who God knows could do evil things to her. Her then even speaking to Gabe and responding is such bad writing.
If Clementine likes Gabe, then you actually deny her her happiness because of your so-called "parental instincts". Not your right to choose her partners for her.
Well what if I told you that Gabe doesn't even know the boss baby?
Who's this boss baby you're talking about? AJ?
If denying Clementine eating too much candy also denying her happiness? No.
One reason I deny her that is because I set the standard by logic of who is okay for Clementine. And yes, it is my full right to deny her.
Wait... YOU DONT EVEN KNOW WHO BOSS BABY IS!?!?!?!?
](https://www.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://www.dreamworks.com/thebossbaby/share.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.dreamworks.com/thebossbaby/&docid=SObm9AfFs8IbFM&tbnid=j0Pk3uNKc6v6fM:&vet=10ahUKEwiLzrv8lvzTAhVOyGMKHZquA3EQMwg3KAIwAg..i&w=1200&h=630&hl=en-ca&client=safari&bih=672&biw=1024&q=boss baby&ved=0ahUKEwiLzrv8lvzTAhVOyGMKHZquA3EQMwg3KAIwAg&iact=mrc&uact=8)
No?
"Yes for freedom to do illogical actions is a good thing in today's society"
It extends to real life where freedom is praised without taking to account the consequences which today's western society loves to do. I don't know the rest of your reply because I am for teaching Clementine to become better. Which I see relevant to mention because people tend to bring their real life views in TWDG.
Let's be honest, this is all about excuses, the real reason why people hate Gabe: Clementine.
Excuse me, I don't see how I can answer that question especially when I don't see the relevans of it.
No. I hate him because he threw me under the bus after everything I've done for him.
No. I hate him because he set me up about Conrad.