I would feel kind of bad if I would allow AJ to die just to save myself, and would feel that everyone that died as a result of trying to save him would've died in vain. Clementine must've felt this way in ANF, which is probably why she went to the extreme to save his life by stealing medicine, as well as threatening to Kill David. Also, it's my belief that if I were to let Clementine die, Lee's death would've been in vain as well. He got bitten, had his arm chopped off, and STILL died trying to save clem. Nobody risked more than him, so to kill the person he gave up his life for, would mean that he died for nothing. So to answer your question, no, I wouldn't sacrifice clem for AJ.
Folks can die whether or not it's for something. Clementine could of died before Lee did had he never came along. Or even if Lee made it through season one with her she could of died still. So I never get the whole "will have died for nothing deal" folks push.
I would feel kind of bad if I would allow AJ to die just to save myself, and would feel that everyone that died as a result of trying to sav… moree him would've died in vain. Clementine must've felt this way in ANF, which is probably why she went to the extreme to save his life by stealing medicine, as well as threatening to Kill David. Also, it's my belief that if I were to let Clementine die, Lee's death would've been in vain as well. He got bitten, had his arm chopped off, and STILL died trying to save clem. Nobody risked more than him, so to kill the person he gave up his life for, would mean that he died for nothing. So to answer your question, no, I wouldn't sacrifice clem for AJ.
I never get the whole "will have died for nothing deal" folks push.
What it means is that someone made the choice to die in order for you to live. And if Clementine dies to save AJ, Lee's death would've been for nothing. Yeah, she could've died even if she made it through season one with Lee, but the fact that he gave up his life in order to preserve Clem's was done with the intention of making sure that she kept on living, so for her to kill herself would mean his death was in vain.
Also, If she ends up sacrificing herself, Lee would've been better off leaving her with the stranger once she went missing. Had he given up on her, he probably wouldn't have gotten bitten, and could've possibly been the protagonist of season 2 instead.
Folks can die whether or not it's for something. Clementine could of died before Lee did had he never came along. Or even if Lee made it th… morerough season one with her she could of died still. So I never get the whole "will have died for nothing deal" folks push.
What it means is that someone made the choice to die in order for you to live. And if Clementine dies to save AJ, Lee's death would've been for nothing.
That is another thing Lee died more so by unexpected accident really, than conscious choice to put himself in harm's way. Lee didn't make a choice to say take a bullet for Clementine or push her out of the way of a moving car or train and he get hit in a split second heat of the moment decision like Conrad did for Javier. Clementine was nowhere around when Lee got bit and by the time he reaches her his fate is sealed due to the toxic bite I'm sure he didn't want to die. Earlier in S1 Doug literally took a bullet for Ben thus dying by Lilly.. Doug's sacrifice is in "vain" because he knew in a split second that he might not live through getting shot and Ben still dies two different ways later on anyway yet no one brings these deaths up. Only the main character is treated special when all characters are suppose to be on the same level of mortality if were dealing with realism and not fantasy heroism where the hero never dies.
I never get the whole "will have died for nothing deal" folks push.
What it means is that someone made the choice to die in order fo… morer you to live. And if Clementine dies to save AJ, Lee's death would've been for nothing. Yeah, she could've died even if she made it through season one with Lee, but the fact that he gave up his life in order to preserve Clem's was done with the intention of making sure that she kept on living, so for her to kill herself would mean his death was in vain.
Also, If she ends up sacrificing herself, Lee would've been better off leaving her with the stranger once she went missing. Had he given up on her, he probably wouldn't have gotten bitten, and could've possibly been the protagonist of season 2 instead.
What it means is that someone made the choice to die in order for you to live. And if Clementine dies to save AJ, Lee's death would've been … morefor nothing.
That is another thing Lee died more so by unexpected accident really, than conscious choice to put himself in harm's way. Lee didn't make a choice to say take a bullet for Clementine or push her out of the way of a moving car or train and he get hit in a split second heat of the moment decision like Conrad did for Javier. Clementine was nowhere around when Lee got bit and by the time he reaches her his fate is sealed due to the toxic bite I'm sure he didn't want to die. Earlier in S1 Doug literally took a bullet for Ben thus dying by Lilly.. Doug's sacrifice is in "vain" because he knew in a split second that he might not live through getting shot and Ben still dies two different ways later on anyway yet no one brings these deaths up. Only the main character is treated special when al… [view original content]
@Cocoa2736 It's not selfish of someone for wanting to preserve her life over AJ's, at least not in this case. If the player is put in the position to either have clem or aj die, then clementine and aj have to be isolated from any kind of outside help. And if she does give her life for AJ, his chances of surviving would still be really low
In a way, Lee did sacrifice himself for Clementine, however it was unbeknownst to him.
Your saying he accidentally sacrificed himself?
He risked life and limb trying save her.
Should that really exempt her from her own death forever? Wouldn't every parent's or guardian's kids be safe in the Walking Dead then if they risked themselves trying to save them? I'm thinking folks have main character bias where common consequences don't apply to the main character but does for everyone else. If this is the case then I can't agree to it nor accept it. But if they do make her live I'm hoping it's for a good reason other than because Lee risked himself and "died for her". If anything Lee got killed because of Clementine's treachery with the Stranger. Even Clem herself admits guilt to this in S2.
Lee died more so by unexpected accident really, than conscious choice to put himself in harm's way.
In a way, Lee did sacrifice hims… moreelf for Clementine, however it was unbeknownst to him. I'll rephrase it then: He risked life and limb trying save her.
I mean.......yeah .
Also, that's just how I see it. Not saying that she should only continue living because Lee unknowingly killed himself for her safe return, but I wouldn't want to see her die because of what he went through to get her back. imo, that would pretty much just be the creators pissing in Lee's face, saying "yeah you went to hell and back for this girl,but fuck you, we're gonna kill her anyway." Lol. If her sacrifice/death is inevitable in TFS, I wouldn't be mad or upset, i'd actually commend Telltale for doing what I didn't think they would. I'd just be thinking "Damn......Lee could've just said fuck it, she's gone."
In a way, Lee did sacrifice himself for Clementine, however it was unbeknownst to him.
Your saying he accidentally sacrificed himsel… moref?
He risked life and limb trying save her.
Should that really exempt her from her own death forever? Wouldn't every parent's or guardian's kids be safe in the Walking Dead then if they risked themselves trying to save them? I'm thinking folks have main character bias where common consequences don't apply to the main character but does for everyone else. If this is the case then I can't agree to it nor accept it. But if they do make her live I'm hoping it's for a good reason other than because Lee risked himself and "died for her". If anything Lee got killed because of Clementine's treachery with the Stranger. Even Clem herself admits guilt to this in S2.
No, not because I am a baby hater or anythung, but 1. this is a video game, and AJ is and will be a nonexistant character due to hus age, thus I dont care about him and 2. Its all fine and dandy that we need "to preserve humanity", but preserving a baby doesnt matter if multiple adults die in the process, a bunch of people in season 2 died for AJ to live, so his life is already a net loss in life. Besides, people who grow up in the apocalypse are way more likely to choose a villainous path since they have never known the "good" world, so their only priority will be survival
people who grow up in the apocalypse are way more likely to choose a villainous path since they have never known the "good" world, so their only priority will be survival
I believe survival is everyone's priority, good and/or bad. Whether that child was raised by people with morals determines if they'll be villainous or not. Even when you're surrounded by warm-hearted people, losing them to zombies/raiders can make a person turn cold.
No, not because I am a baby hater or anythung, but 1. this is a video game, and AJ is and will be a nonexistant character due to hus age, th… moreus I dont care about him and 2. Its all fine and dandy that we need "to preserve humanity", but preserving a baby doesnt matter if multiple adults die in the process, a bunch of people in season 2 died for AJ to live, so his life is already a net loss in life. Besides, people who grow up in the apocalypse are way more likely to choose a villainous path since they have never known the "good" world, so their only priority will be survival
No, and not because Clementine is 'off-limits'. AJ has simply been handled poorly. There was opportunity to form an attachment, however he's been nothing more than a plot device. Everything that occurs with AJ happens off screen, therefore there's no bond with the player even if there's a contrived one with the characters he's nearby.
It would be selfish of Clementine, not the player, and that goes against the Clem I've roleplayed as at that point. Also no conditions were specified in the OP like how old AJ is at that point, what survival skills he had learned and why exactly Clem has to sacrifice herself. It only asked if you would force Clem to give her life for AJ and, if she chose not to, she would be putting her own life before AJ's, even if the reasoning is understandable. Unless there are more details to the scenario I'd still choose to save AJ.
@Cocoa2736 It's not selfish of someone for wanting to preserve her life over AJ's, at least not in this case. If the player is put in the po… moresition to either have clem or aj die, then clementine and aj have to be isolated from any kind of outside help. And if she does give her life for AJ, his chances of surviving would still be really low
I know it only asked if we would sacrifice her for AJ. I was speculating how she'd even be in a position to do such a thing, which is why I said Clem and AJ would have had to be isolated from any kind of outside help. That's the only possible scenario I could imagine where she'd be in such a position to sacrifice herself.
For you it may be selfish of the Clem you've role-played as, but for the actual character, it wouldn't be. She doesn't owe it to anyone to give her life for AJ. Besides, she has done more for him than anyone else who tried to keep him safe combined.There's not fault in someone being their own #1 priority. She can still try her best to protect him without having to kill herself and being labeled "selfish".
It would be selfish of Clementine, not the player, and that goes against the Clem I've roleplayed as at that point. Also no conditions were … morespecified in the OP like how old AJ is at that point, what survival skills he had learned and why exactly Clem has to sacrifice herself. It only asked if you would force Clem to give her life for AJ and, if she chose not to, she would be putting her own life before AJ's, even if the reasoning is understandable. Unless there are more details to the scenario I'd still choose to save AJ.
people who grow up in the apocalypse are way more likely to choose a villainous path since they have never known the "good" world, so their … moreonly priority will be survival
I believe survival is everyone's priority, good and/or bad. Whether that child was raised by people with morals determines if they'll be villainous or not. Even when you're surrounded by warm-hearted people, losing them to zombies/raiders can make a person turn cold.
Putting the stigma aside, a selfish act is one where someone does something that put's their own welfare and desires as top priority at the expense of others. Letting AJ die so Clem can survive unscathed is putting her own survival before his. That one act doesn't make selfishness a character trait of Clem's, but she's still putting herself first, even if she doesn't owe it to anyone to save him (though some may contest you on that.)
I know it only asked if we would sacrifice her for AJ. I was speculating how she'd even be in a position to do such a thing, which is why I … moresaid Clem and AJ would have had to be isolated from any kind of outside help. That's the only possible scenario I could imagine where she'd be in such a position to sacrifice herself.
For you it may be selfish of the Clem you've role-played as, but for the actual character, it wouldn't be. She doesn't owe it to anyone to give her life for AJ. Besides, she has done more for him than anyone else who tried to keep him safe combined.There's not fault in someone being their own #1 priority. She can still try her best to protect him without having to kill herself and being labeled "selfish".
Lol I'd like to see them try. Honestly though, Rebecca hated clem. She told Peter J. Randal(uncle pete) that he should've put Clementine out of her misery over a dog bite. A f*cking DOG BITE . She even went as far as to reach for Nick's rifle showing she had no issue shooting clementine, causing Nick to accidentally fire his rifle that barelymissed her. Rebecca also told clementine "If it was up to me you'd be dead already. Don't look to me girl, I want nothing to do with you.". Alvin was the most needy person in that whole group next to Kenny. He asked her to do the simplest jobs that would've required barely any effort, yet asked Clementine to do it just so he could sit on his ass. I want someone try to argue with that lol.
Putting the stigma aside, a selfish act is one where someone does something that put's their own welfare and desires as top priority at the … moreexpense of others. Letting AJ die so Clem can survive unscathed is putting her own survival before his. That one act doesn't make selfishness a character trait of Clem's, but she's still putting herself first, even if she doesn't owe it to anyone to save him (though some may contest you on that.)
What a horrible and predictable plot point/ decision that would be. I don't need any more protagonist 'sacrifices' that attempt to cheaply mirror s1's finale. My answer is no.
The thing is, it would probably be in Clementine’s character to save AJ. She has looked after him since his birth, if you had the Kenny ending, she tells Javi that she felt like a mom when she was with AJ, and if she was put in a situation where this was a choice, I’d imagine what Lee did for her would resonate quite heavily and she would willingly sacrifice herself for AJ.
That being said, I love Clem far more than AJ, and since I’m the one making the choices, sorry AJ, but I gotta look out for Clem above all else.
I hate letting leaving any friends behind to die but AJ just didn't grow up on me, he was basically just there with no character development, no wonder A New Frontier is The Last Jedi of this franchise. I know Clementine obviously cares about him more than anyone else but since I'm the one who is telling the story, if I had to pick between two characters, one being AJ and the other being a relatable friend, I would pick the one Clementine deserves to be friends and partners with. Sorry AJ, I did everything I could to keep you safe but you didn't give me any rewards. I hate the idea of Clementine beginning as a defenseless little girl only to turn into a badass and forced to be a baby's caretaker. The reason I chose not to leave Sarah behind is because she grew up on me, she had a personality that was kind of similar to me and I wanted her and Clementine to be best friends forever but Telltale just mercilessly killed her off so we can care more for a character who is not even a character itself.
I will still try to keep him safe as long as possible but if it's by sacrficing Clementine or someone who is great friends with her, then the answer is no. It's not my fault Telltale forced us to care about shitty characters (Especially Gabe) over AJ who was basically just chosen to survive Season 2 (Given the fact that there was originally supposed to be an option to leave him behind to die in No Going Back) for what again? For a set up or for avoiding backlash?
Comments
I would feel kind of bad if I would allow AJ to die just to save myself, and would feel that everyone that died as a result of trying to save him would've died in vain. Clementine must've felt this way in ANF, which is probably why she went to the extreme to save his life by stealing medicine, as well as threatening to Kill David. Also, it's my belief that if I were to let Clementine die, Lee's death would've been in vain as well. He got bitten, had his arm chopped off, and STILL died trying to save clem. Nobody risked more than him, so to kill the person he gave up his life for, would mean that he died for nothing. So to answer your question, no, I wouldn't sacrifice clem for AJ.
Yes
No.
Of course
Yes it's what Clementine would prefer now.
Folks can die whether or not it's for something. Clementine could of died before Lee did had he never came along. Or even if Lee made it through season one with her she could of died still. So I never get the whole "will have died for nothing deal" folks push.
What it means is that someone made the choice to die in order for you to live. And if Clementine dies to save AJ, Lee's death would've been for nothing. Yeah, she could've died even if she made it through season one with Lee, but the fact that he gave up his life in order to preserve Clem's was done with the intention of making sure that she kept on living, so for her to kill herself would mean his death was in vain.
Also, If she ends up sacrificing herself, Lee would've been better off leaving her with the stranger once she went missing. Had he given up on her, he probably wouldn't have gotten bitten, and could've possibly been the protagonist of season 2 instead.
That is another thing Lee died more so by unexpected accident really, than conscious choice to put himself in harm's way. Lee didn't make a choice to say take a bullet for Clementine or push her out of the way of a moving car or train and he get hit in a split second heat of the moment decision like Conrad did for Javier. Clementine was nowhere around when Lee got bit and by the time he reaches her his fate is sealed due to the toxic bite I'm sure he didn't want to die. Earlier in S1 Doug literally took a bullet for Ben thus dying by Lilly.. Doug's sacrifice is in "vain" because he knew in a split second that he might not live through getting shot and Ben still dies two different ways later on anyway yet no one brings these deaths up. Only the main character is treated special when all characters are suppose to be on the same level of mortality if were dealing with realism and not fantasy heroism where the hero never dies.
Yes. I wouldn't force my Clem to live with the fact that she selfishly let a young child (who has been in her care for years) die.
In a way, Lee did sacrifice himself for Clementine, however it was unbeknownst to him. I'll rephrase it then: He risked life and limb trying save her.
@Cocoa2736 It's not selfish of someone for wanting to preserve her life over AJ's, at least not in this case. If the player is put in the position to either have clem or aj die, then clementine and aj have to be isolated from any kind of outside help. And if she does give her life for AJ, his chances of surviving would still be really low
Your saying he accidentally sacrificed himself?
Should that really exempt her from her own death forever? Wouldn't every parent's or guardian's kids be safe in the Walking Dead then if they risked themselves trying to save them? I'm thinking folks have main character bias where common consequences don't apply to the main character but does for everyone else. If this is the case then I can't agree to it nor accept it. But if they do make her live I'm hoping it's for a good reason other than because Lee risked himself and "died for her". If anything Lee got killed because of Clementine's treachery with the Stranger. Even Clem herself admits guilt to this in S2.
I mean.......yeah
.
Also, that's just how I see it. Not saying that she should only continue living because Lee unknowingly killed himself for her safe return, but I wouldn't want to see her die because of what he went through to get her back. imo, that would pretty much just be the creators pissing in Lee's face, saying "yeah you went to hell and back for this girl,but fuck you, we're gonna kill her anyway." Lol. If her sacrifice/death is inevitable in TFS, I wouldn't be mad or upset, i'd actually commend Telltale for doing what I didn't think they would. I'd just be thinking "Damn......Lee could've just said fuck it, she's gone."
No...that little shit was annoying me since he was the main focus on everything for this series.
Yes. I love the straw poll!
No, not because I am a baby hater or anythung, but 1. this is a video game, and AJ is and will be a nonexistant character due to hus age, thus I dont care about him and 2. Its all fine and dandy that we need "to preserve humanity", but preserving a baby doesnt matter if multiple adults die in the process, a bunch of people in season 2 died for AJ to live, so his life is already a net loss in life. Besides, people who grow up in the apocalypse are way more likely to choose a villainous path since they have never known the "good" world, so their only priority will be survival
I believe survival is everyone's priority, good and/or bad. Whether that child was raised by people with morals determines if they'll be villainous or not. Even when you're surrounded by warm-hearted people, losing them to zombies/raiders can make a person turn cold.
No, and not because Clementine is 'off-limits'. AJ has simply been handled poorly. There was opportunity to form an attachment, however he's been nothing more than a plot device. Everything that occurs with AJ happens off screen, therefore there's no bond with the player even if there's a contrived one with the characters he's nearby.
It would be selfish of Clementine, not the player, and that goes against the Clem I've roleplayed as at that point. Also no conditions were specified in the OP like how old AJ is at that point, what survival skills he had learned and why exactly Clem has to sacrifice herself. It only asked if you would force Clem to give her life for AJ and, if she chose not to, she would be putting her own life before AJ's, even if the reasoning is understandable. Unless there are more details to the scenario I'd still choose to save AJ.
I know it only asked if we would sacrifice her for AJ. I was speculating how she'd even be in a position to do such a thing, which is why I said Clem and AJ would have had to be isolated from any kind of outside help. That's the only possible scenario I could imagine where she'd be in such a position to sacrifice herself.
For you it may be selfish of the Clem you've role-played as, but for the actual character, it wouldn't be. She doesn't owe it to anyone to give her life for AJ. Besides, she has done more for him than anyone else who tried to keep him safe combined.There's not fault in someone being their own #1 priority. She can still try her best to protect him without having to kill herself and being labeled "selfish".
Possibly, my point still stand that AJ is too much of a noncharacter to ever be worth sacrificing anyone for at present In my opinion
I'm with you on that part, he's not worth dying for at all.
Putting the stigma aside, a selfish act is one where someone does something that put's their own welfare and desires as top priority at the expense of others. Letting AJ die so Clem can survive unscathed is putting her own survival before his. That one act doesn't make selfishness a character trait of Clem's, but she's still putting herself first, even if she doesn't owe it to anyone to save him (though some may contest you on that.)
No way..I was trying to leave the baby behind since the first season
Lol I'd like to see them try. Honestly though, Rebecca hated clem. She told Peter J. Randal(uncle pete) that he should've put Clementine out of her misery over a dog bite. A f*cking DOG BITE
. She even went as far as to reach for Nick's rifle showing she had no issue shooting clementine, causing Nick to accidentally fire his rifle that barelymissed her. Rebecca also told clementine "If it was up to me you'd be dead already. Don't look to me girl, I want nothing to do with you.". Alvin was the most needy person in that whole group next to Kenny. He asked her to do the simplest jobs that would've required barely any effort, yet asked Clementine to do it just so he could sit on his ass. I want someone try to argue with that lol.
What a horrible and predictable plot point/ decision that would be. I don't need any more protagonist 'sacrifices' that attempt to cheaply mirror s1's finale. My answer is no.
Considering this time AJ s gonna be an actual character with lines... yes.
The thing is, it would probably be in Clementine’s character to save AJ. She has looked after him since his birth, if you had the Kenny ending, she tells Javi that she felt like a mom when she was with AJ, and if she was put in a situation where this was a choice, I’d imagine what Lee did for her would resonate quite heavily and she would willingly sacrifice herself for AJ.
That being said, I love Clem far more than AJ, and since I’m the one making the choices, sorry AJ, but I gotta look out for Clem above all else.
I hate letting leaving any friends behind to die but AJ just didn't grow up on me, he was basically just there with no character development, no wonder A New Frontier is The Last Jedi of this franchise. I know Clementine obviously cares about him more than anyone else but since I'm the one who is telling the story, if I had to pick between two characters, one being AJ and the other being a relatable friend, I would pick the one Clementine deserves to be friends and partners with. Sorry AJ, I did everything I could to keep you safe but you didn't give me any rewards. I hate the idea of Clementine beginning as a defenseless little girl only to turn into a badass and forced to be a baby's caretaker. The reason I chose not to leave Sarah behind is because she grew up on me, she had a personality that was kind of similar to me and I wanted her and Clementine to be best friends forever but Telltale just mercilessly killed her off so we can care more for a character who is not even a character itself.
I will still try to keep him safe as long as possible but if it's by sacrficing Clementine or someone who is great friends with her, then the answer is no. It's not my fault Telltale forced us to care about shitty characters (Especially Gabe) over AJ who was basically just chosen to survive Season 2 (Given the fact that there was originally supposed to be an option to leave him behind to die in No Going Back) for what again? For a set up or for avoiding backlash?
Meanfully ... ! from the first it was it , LEE the same .... So touching , This game really hurts me.