Fair points.
Perhaps they really did corner Marlon out on his own and convinced him to give up a few of his own so that he and the others would be left alone--otherwise, they simply find the school(which they seemed to know the general location of anyway) and just burn it down. Thus, making it something he mulled over before making the decision to surrender Violet and the twins, with the former being swapped out with Brodie at the last minute.
If it were just a 'get down Brody! don't let them see you!' 'But what about the sisters?' 'I have no choice!' then the raiders wouldn't be s… moreo eeducated on Marlon. And if Marlon did reveal himself, then the raiders could've tortured him into revealing the site of the school, or taken him aswell. I can't think of anything that actually makes sense.
I hate the fact that your choices can get you killed. It's like yes Telltale finally let me kill people and choose crazy things. Then they kill you... Real disappointment. Other then that nothing major.
Honestly, my question during that moment was "where did she even get that knife?"
Well, she is a soldier, so don't any soldiers hold… more knives for defense and in case they run out of ammo?
Does he ever?
He shot that double barrel shotgun twice and he was supposed to reload it since it holds 2 bullets only.
Was Mike the black guy or the white jock?
The guy who doesn't die at all until the final chapter of the game.
Recruiting child soldiers doesn't make sense. They're extra mouths to feed and they won't be loyal to you.
The kids at the school changed their attitude toward Clem and AJ way too fast. First, they kicked us out. The next day they let us in again.
Mitch's bomb had little to no effect. The explosion destroyed one cart and scared away one horse. That's it. It didn't kill anyone or stop the raiders from capturing the kids.
The Raiders plan made no sense. You're going to risk the lives of 6 soldiers to possibly obtain about 9 kids? The rewards don't outweigh the risk.
God bless everyone.
* Recruiting child soldiers doesn't make sense. They're extra mouths to feed and they won't be loyal to you.
* The kids at the school chang… moreed their attitude toward Clem and AJ way too fast. First, they kicked us out. The next day they let us in again.
* Mitch's bomb had little to no effect. The explosion destroyed one cart and scared away one horse. That's it. It didn't kill anyone or stop the raiders from capturing the kids.
If you're talking about Lily, that's just realistic and/or kinda common sense considering she's in charge of that operation and the one thing keeping Abel in particular from just wrecking everyone.
I hate the fact that your choices can get you killed. It's like yes Telltale finally let me kill people and choose crazy things. Then they kill you... Real disappointment. Other then that nothing major.
How can they fight when they're starving? If what James said was true, those raiders would train them to become soldiers. They can't let them fight on an empty stomach.
How can they fight when they're starving? If what James said was true, those raiders would train them to become soldiers. They can't let them fight on an empty stomach.
The situation is different. When you fight zombies, you're fighting for you own life. When you fight for raiders, you're fighting for a bunch of assholes who stole you away from your friends and starve you. Plus, the training will take days or even weeks. They can't survive that long without food.
The situation is different. When you fight zombies, you're fighting for you own life. When you fight for raiders, you're fighting for a bunc… moreh of assholes who stole you away from your friends and starve you. Plus, the training will take days or even weeks. They can't survive that long without food.
You will run away or turn against them the first chance you get. If they give you weapons, you will most likely use them on them first. There's no way they can be sure of your loyalty. That's why I said the whole idea doesn't make sense.
Recruiting child soldiers doesn't make sense. They're extra mouths to feed and they won't be loyal to you.
I think the idea is that they're getting really low on soldiers and expect the teens to at least fight for their lives against the enemy.
Also, they kinda have to feed them in order to keep them alive in between survived battles.
The kids at the school changed their attitude toward Clem and AJ way too fast. First, they kicked out. The next day they let us in again.
To be fair, that was mainly on Louis, Ruby, and Violet, the former two of which recognized what condition AJ was in and scrambled to help despite what the group agreed on.
Mitch and by association Willy clearly weren't happy.
Mitch's bomb had little to no effect. The explosion destroyed one cart and scared away one horse. That's it. It didn't kill anyone or stop the raiders from capturing the kids.
* Recruiting child soldiers doesn't make sense. They're extra mouths to feed and they won't be loyal to you.
* The kids at the school chang… moreed their attitude toward Clem and AJ way too fast. First, they kicked us out. The next day they let us in again.
* Mitch's bomb had little to no effect. The explosion destroyed one cart and scared away one horse. That's it. It didn't kill anyone or stop the raiders from capturing the kids.
If you're talking about Lily, that's just realistic and/or kinda common sense considering she's in charge of that operation and the one thing keeping Abel in particular from just wrecking everyone.
Also, it'd really fuck up the storyline.
The plan against the raiders was stupid as shit. Did the kids really think they could take on a bunch of big adults with guns using one mediocre bomb? They should have just fled from the school in my opinion, but who knows how long the kids would last outside the school walls, considering they've been there the entire apocalypse.
Mitch's death was the most random thing ever. It's clear they only killed him to further Willy's development in episode three. I think he should have at least been determinant.
Who got kidnapped at the end also should have depended on our choices.
Mitch's... bomb... only... destroyed... one... cart... like, excuse me what the fuck.
The trap decision doesn't even matter because both traps only ending up killing one raider.
I can't think of anymore right now, but despite these small annoyances, Suffer the Children is one of my favorite episodes in the entire series. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Edit: Also, this didn't bug me that much, but did anyone think the Ruby/Aasim stuff came out of nowhere?
I dont understand why the idea of kidnapping kids and forcing them to fight as soldiers seems unrealistic. It has been happening as far back as recorded history. Heck, they still do it in parts of Africa and Asia today. Groups come in, murder the adults, take the kids, turn them into soldiers.
And a homemade pipe bomb using poor materials like propane and fertilizer wouldn't do much in reality. It's not like he was Timothy McVeigh with a truckload of fertilizer to work with...I guess people are just upset that it was ineffective? If that is the case, blame Mitch for positioning the bomb on the cart instead of near people or taking a few extra steps to make it a more effective bomb.
As for issues with this episode: I agree that Aasim having a crush on Ruby seemed to come out of nowhere, but that could be written off as Clem being new for her not having seen it before.
Where the hell was the " we're leaving option?" from Clem? Why in the hell would Clem want to stay asides supplies? She been good on the road for 5 years. 5 years! The moment that A.J. kills Marlon, is the time that we should've had that option.
I hate the fact that your choices can get you killed. It's like yes Telltale finally let me kill people and choose crazy things. Then they kill you... Real disappointment. Other then that nothing major.
I kinda liked it. Telling AJ to shoot at Abel is dumb; obviously the grown man is going to have the faster reaction time. Shooting at Lilly is too; the game makes it clear that there are a bunch of raiders including a sniper with their full attention on you. You were meant to be a distraction in that moment, not a one-man army. It sets the tone, and adds a little more suspense before the crazy shit that actually does pay off (tackling Abel while he has a gun pointed at AJ).
The Walking Dead S1 did the same thing a few times with Duck and Brenda St. John.
I hate the fact that your choices can get you killed. It's like yes Telltale finally let me kill people and choose crazy things. Then they kill you... Real disappointment. Other then that nothing major.
The plan against the raiders was stupid as shit. Did the kids really think they could take on a bunch of big adults with guns using one mediocre bomb?
I assume they would've had more defenses and weaponry in place myself, but I guess Mitch could only get one that he knew would work.
Meanwhile, Aasim's trap was as widespread/effective as you'd think it'd be..
They should have just fled from the school in my opinion, but who knows how long the kids would last outside the school walls, considering they've been there the entire apocalypse.
Probably.
It's clear they only killed him to further Willy's development in episode three.
Development that really should've gotten a headstart on in this episode.
I think he should have at least been determinant.
Perhaps.
Who got kidnapped at the end also should have depended on our choices.
It sorta does, but I agree there should've been a little more correlation/criteria for Violet/Louis getting taken.
Also, this didn't bug me that much, but did anyone think the Ruby/Aasim stuff came out of nowhere?
Eh, in the sense that it was a reveal about something on the side?
At the very least, neither character had much interaction/screentime despite being somewhat notable based on pure personality and concerns, so it coming out here under the context that only Louis caught on & Aasim wanted to keep it a secret makes some degree of sense.
Oh boy, my favorite kind of thread.
* The plan against the raiders was stupid as shit. Did the kids really think they could take on a b… moreunch of big adults with guns using one mediocre bomb? They should have just fled from the school in my opinion, but who knows how long the kids would last outside the school walls, considering they've been there the entire apocalypse.
* Mitch's death was the most random thing ever. It's clear they only killed him to further Willy's development in episode three. I think he should have at least been determinant.
* Who got kidnapped at the end also should have depended on our choices.
* Mitch's... bomb... only... destroyed... one... cart... like, excuse me what the fuck.
* The trap decision doesn't even matter because both traps only ending up killing one raider.
I can't think of anymore right now, but despite these small annoyances, Suffer the Children is one of my favorite episodes in the entire se… [view original content]
I guess because canonically Clem is yearning to "settle down", but the idea of settling down at the school was clearly killed off soon as they were kicked out and the Ericson kids more or less hated them and Clem and AJ accepted their fate. Everything after that is jarring, though. They barely made up and Clem had no obligation to stay once AJ got better.
Where the hell was the " we're leaving option?" from Clem? Why in the hell would Clem want to stay asides supplies? She been good on the road for 5 years. 5 years! The moment that A.J. kills Marlon, is the time that we should've had that option.
Clem, Louis, and Violent were blinded by love is the only explanation that makes sense. Louis wants Clem at the start and been flirting with her since she got there. Strangely, forgiven her for the murder of his life time friend. This is similar to a high school kid dropping sports and aliening his friends when he gets a girlfriend, even when she treats him bad and gets kicked in the nuts by her.
Violent saving Clem and wanting her to stay. Can only be explained by her wanting to fill a void that minie left.
I guess because canonically Clem is yearning to "settle down", but the idea of settling down at the school was clearly killed off soon as th… moreey were kicked out and the Ericson kids more or less hated them and Clem and AJ accepted their fate. Everything after that is jarring, though. They barely made up and Clem had no obligation to stay once AJ got better.
Clem and AJ just want a place to call home. I doubt you can find many friendly communities in their current timeline.
Even if they got kicked out she still wants to stay ("All I ever wanted was to be forgiven" or something like that).
She clearly doesn't want to go back on the road because... well... what is there to do ? Run from walkers, find food, find somewhere to sleep, repeat ?
Louis forgave her because even though AJ killed his best friend, he realizes that Marlon's decisions were fucked up, he shows some remorse through the whole first half of the episode, like he said: "I didn't wanna kick you out, I just didn't know what to do".
In Violet's case it's pretty easy: she clearly liked Clem from the start, so naturally she wants her to come back.
Clem, Louis, and Violent were blinded by love is the only explanation that makes sense. Louis wants Clem at the start and been flirting with… more her since she got there. Strangely, forgiven her for the murder of his life time friend. This is similar to a high school kid dropping sports and aliening his friends when he gets a girlfriend, even when she treats him bad and gets kicked in the nuts by her.
Violent saving Clem and wanting her to stay. Can only be explained by her wanting to fill a void that minie left.
Clem is complex.
No lie, the scene will be like in the jail where the others are and Clem will be like "Where's Omar) Cut to kitchen Omar: "Who's ready for bisque?" Crowd cheers.
Violet doesn't like Clem from the start. Her first interaction with Clem is actually a passive aggressive comment, and Clem visibly notices that and you can even sort of check her there. Louis is the only one who's attachment makes some sort of sense but even then I don't really like it.
Clem and AJ just want a place to call home. I doubt you can find many friendly communities in their current timeline.
Even if they got ki… morecked out she still wants to stay ("All I ever wanted was to be forgiven" or something like that).
She clearly doesn't want to go back on the road because... well... what is there to do ? Run from walkers, find food, find somewhere to sleep, repeat ?
Louis forgave her because even though AJ killed his best friend, he realizes that Marlon's decisions were fucked up, he shows some remorse through the whole first half of the episode, like he said: "I didn't wanna kick you out, I just didn't know what to do".
In Violet's case it's pretty easy: she clearly liked Clem from the start, so naturally she wants her to come back.
Violet doesn't like Clem from the start. Her first interaction with Clem is actually a passive aggressive comment, and Clem visibly notices … morethat and you can even sort of check her there. Louis is the only one who's attachment makes some sort of sense but even then I don't really like it.
Clem, Louis, and Violent were blinded by love is the only explanation that makes sense. Louis wants Clem at the start and been flirting with… more her since she got there. Strangely, forgiven her for the murder of his life time friend. This is similar to a high school kid dropping sports and aliening his friends when he gets a girlfriend, even when she treats him bad and gets kicked in the nuts by her.
Violent saving Clem and wanting her to stay. Can only be explained by her wanting to fill a void that minie left.
Clem is complex.
The card game is determinant, you can have Clem be incredibly anatagonistic towards Violet during that.
Violet doesn't hate Clem by the end of E1 but I still personally don't find the switch-up in E2 all that believable.
Comments
Fair points.
Perhaps they really did corner Marlon out on his own and convinced him to give up a few of his own so that he and the others would be left alone--otherwise, they simply find the school(which they seemed to know the general location of anyway) and just burn it down. Thus, making it something he mulled over before making the decision to surrender Violet and the twins, with the former being swapped out with Brodie at the last minute.
I hate the fact that your choices can get you killed. It's like yes Telltale finally let me kill people and choose crazy things. Then they kill you... Real disappointment. Other then that nothing major.
Some pacing issues here and there. Lily's reunion felt a little rushed and the greenhouse scene felt kinda clumsy. Aside from that, it's pretty good.
...Fair enough.
She just seemed to suddenly have it given how fast the moment is.
Ah.
So, the game ignoring how ammo actually works for the sake of the scene?
White jock it is then.
It's possible they had to really argue with their leader(?) to even get that many.
Do you really think they were going to feed them? Also not everyone was happy when they came back.
If you're talking about Lily, that's just realistic and/or kinda common sense considering she's in charge of that operation and the one thing keeping Abel in particular from just wrecking everyone.
Also, it'd really fuck up the storyline.
How can they fight when they're starving? If what James said was true, those raiders would train them to become soldiers. They can't let them fight on an empty stomach.
They do it all the time in the Walking Dead Universe. Fighting zombies I mean.
In what way(s) in particular?
The situation is different. When you fight zombies, you're fighting for you own life. When you fight for raiders, you're fighting for a bunch of assholes who stole you away from your friends and starve you. Plus, the training will take days or even weeks. They can't survive that long without food.
You are still fighting for you life. Cause they will probably kill you if you don't do what they ask.
Still wouldn't make sense unless they thought there was a lot more kids there.
You will run away or turn against them the first chance you get. If they give you weapons, you will most likely use them on them first. There's no way they can be sure of your loyalty. That's why I said the whole idea doesn't make sense.
I think his point is just that it's easier to kill walkers than soldiers so children would obviously need to be trained.
But a counterargument for children is that although they're extra mouths to feed, they don't need to eat as much as adults/
I think the idea is that they're getting really low on soldiers and expect the teens to at least fight for their lives against the enemy.
Also, they kinda have to feed them in order to keep them alive in between survived battles.
To be fair, that was mainly on Louis, Ruby, and Violet, the former two of which recognized what condition AJ was in and scrambled to help despite what the group agreed on.
Mitch and by association Willy clearly weren't happy.
Eh, could've been worse.
I agree. Just feel like a waste of a choice though
Oh boy, my favorite kind of thread.
I can't think of anymore right now, but despite these small annoyances, Suffer the Children is one of my favorite episodes in the entire series. ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Edit: Also, this didn't bug me that much, but did anyone think the Ruby/Aasim stuff came out of nowhere?
Mainly just the way it was paced. Clumsy might not be a good word. I just thought it went on for a lot longer than it needed to.
I dont understand why the idea of kidnapping kids and forcing them to fight as soldiers seems unrealistic. It has been happening as far back as recorded history. Heck, they still do it in parts of Africa and Asia today. Groups come in, murder the adults, take the kids, turn them into soldiers.
And a homemade pipe bomb using poor materials like propane and fertilizer wouldn't do much in reality. It's not like he was Timothy McVeigh with a truckload of fertilizer to work with...I guess people are just upset that it was ineffective? If that is the case, blame Mitch for positioning the bomb on the cart instead of near people or taking a few extra steps to make it a more effective bomb.
As for issues with this episode: I agree that Aasim having a crush on Ruby seemed to come out of nowhere, but that could be written off as Clem being new for her not having seen it before.
Kenny's hat wasn't one of the collectible items.
True dat.
Where the hell was the " we're leaving option?" from Clem? Why in the hell would Clem want to stay asides supplies? She been good on the road for 5 years. 5 years! The moment that A.J. kills Marlon, is the time that we should've had that option.
Mm...it's possible
I kinda liked it. Telling AJ to shoot at Abel is dumb; obviously the grown man is going to have the faster reaction time. Shooting at Lilly is too; the game makes it clear that there are a bunch of raiders including a sniper with their full attention on you. You were meant to be a distraction in that moment, not a one-man army. It sets the tone, and adds a little more suspense before the crazy shit that actually does pay off (tackling Abel while he has a gun pointed at AJ).
The Walking Dead S1 did the same thing a few times with Duck and Brenda St. John.
Really bad decisions = really bad outcomes
I assume they would've had more defenses and weaponry in place myself, but I guess Mitch could only get one that he knew would work.
Meanwhile, Aasim's trap was as widespread/effective as you'd think it'd be..
Probably.
Development that really should've gotten a headstart on in this episode.
Perhaps.
It sorta does, but I agree there should've been a little more correlation/criteria for Violet/Louis getting taken.
Eh, in the sense that it was a reveal about something on the side?
At the very least, neither character had much interaction/screentime despite being somewhat notable based on pure personality and concerns, so it coming out here under the context that only Louis caught on & Aasim wanted to keep it a secret makes some degree of sense.
I guess because canonically Clem is yearning to "settle down", but the idea of settling down at the school was clearly killed off soon as they were kicked out and the Ericson kids more or less hated them and Clem and AJ accepted their fate. Everything after that is jarring, though. They barely made up and Clem had no obligation to stay once AJ got better.
I can't imagine the leader will be too happy that Lilly only got 3 kids and lost 2 soldiers.
Probably not. Especially considering one of them is a fat boy with a bullet in his leg.
Clem, Louis, and Violent were blinded by love is the only explanation that makes sense. Louis wants Clem at the start and been flirting with her since she got there. Strangely, forgiven her for the murder of his life time friend. This is similar to a high school kid dropping sports and aliening his friends when he gets a girlfriend, even when she treats him bad and gets kicked in the nuts by her.
Violent saving Clem and wanting her to stay. Can only be explained by her wanting to fill a void that minie left.
Clem is complex.
Yeah, well he could be their cook.
Clem and AJ just want a place to call home. I doubt you can find many friendly communities in their current timeline.
Even if they got kicked out she still wants to stay ("All I ever wanted was to be forgiven" or something like that).
She clearly doesn't want to go back on the road because... well... what is there to do ? Run from walkers, find food, find somewhere to sleep, repeat ?
Louis forgave her because even though AJ killed his best friend, he realizes that Marlon's decisions were fucked up, he shows some remorse through the whole first half of the episode, like he said: "I didn't wanna kick you out, I just didn't know what to do".
In Violet's case it's pretty easy: she clearly liked Clem from the start, so naturally she wants her to come back.
Great, now I want a scene where one of Sophie's Delta colleague's just hanging out in the cafeteria and gushing about Omar's food.
No lie, the scene will be like in the jail where the others are and Clem will be like "Where's Omar) Cut to kitchen Omar: "Who's ready for bisque?" Crowd cheers.
Violet doesn't like Clem from the start. Her first interaction with Clem is actually a passive aggressive comment, and Clem visibly notices that and you can even sort of check her there. Louis is the only one who's attachment makes some sort of sense but even then I don't really like it.
After that moment she clearly likes her. The ending of the walker fight, the card game, the discussion in the dorms.
It really is the only good explanation for the pacing issue of this episode in particular.
It just comes off as poor writing to me. Violet is even less believable than Louis.
The card game is determinant, you can have Clem be incredibly anatagonistic towards Violet during that.
Violet doesn't hate Clem by the end of E1 but I still personally don't find the switch-up in E2 all that believable.
Hmm that's ok, I find it to be fine but to each their own I guess