What is the biggest thing that bugs you about Lilly?
Aside from trying to kill Clem and possibly set in motion a series of events that could lead to Clem/Aasim/Omar/Louis/Violet getting killed, the fact that you could be nice to her as Lee for the whole game and she still doesn't give a shit that he's dead and then proceeds to shit talk him at the school. Even if you decided to try save Larry twice.
Sign in to comment in this discussion.
Comments
Putting aside the joke that she's back as a decoy main antagonist at all, it's how generally underwritten her inclusion and "updated" characterization is in that first scene.
Yeah, I was expecting more a heartfilled reunion like what we got with Kenny. It would've pleased the Lilly fans I'm sure. She doesn't even ask you how you've been for the last 9 years or ask about the old group at all. I know it's minor stuff, but still
That's a important part of it, yes, but I'll mainly focusing on where the antagonism comes in, the relevance of it at one point, and how dodgy her intentions-to-action integration is.
That's what I though too. Sure people can change after 9 years. But Lilly had no reason to hold a grudge against Clem. I don't know, maybe bad shit will happen to Lilly if she doesn't find more soldiers and thats why she needs the kids but still, she didn't have to be bitch to Clem about it.
Exactly.
That is very much a possibility.
Which is exactly why she decided to not only allow Abel to fire at their intended escorts to the school when they run, but repeatedly aims for the head with a loud ass rifle herself--Oops!
She really should have been nicer to clem. Now I’m gonna have to kill her because if I don’t AJ or Tenn will suffer the consequences.
you right it actually annoyed me the way she acted my lee was nice to her by all mean and telltale didn't even bother to put in consideration that the is to versions of lee for lilly depending on the way he treated her but that telltale for you i knew that nothing changed about the way the handle choices after i found out that aj kills marlon no matter what you teach him.
I feel like the people who are annoyed about Lilly not having a heartwarming reunion are missing the entire essence of her character. She's always been a cold bitch, from the moment we met her to the moment she left the group. She cares about herself and her survival, it's been like 8 years since she was in Clem's group and she has gotten even darker since then. Her offering Clem a hand getting up is about as close to a heartwarming reunion as you can hope for from her.
Her face honestly it's really punchable.
Her face
we should put a paper-bag over it.
Last time I checked, she stabbed Danny, shot Andy, and worked with Lee to save everyone from the bandits.
I'd personally have to disagree with that assessment. Her being cold, though? Alright, that one's fair game. But she definitely wasn't selfish, nor did she only care about herself. She just had a particularly pragmatic/practical outlook on things. Getting all mad about Lee and co bringing back two new people, one of whom is either missing a leg or has a bullet hole in their stomach? Given they've barely got enough food to sustain themselves, it's a valid complaint. Was she pretty harsh in how she dealt with it? Sure, but it's not entirely without reason. I mean hell, even if you side with Kenny, even Lee's like "once Katjaa patches that guy up you can kick them out, I couldn't care less" so clearly this line of thinking isn't exclusive to Lilly.
Not wanting to let Lee and co into the drug store at first in episode 1? Again, a mostly valid concern. They don't know who those people are or if they're dangerous, and secondly, opening the door and letting them in has a chance of putting everyone at risk. Trying to save a stranger from certain death is the moral thing to do... but it's not always the smart/practical thing. And as much as I hate to say it, sometimes the practical option is a lot safer than the moral option. I think you could compare this to say, shooting that girl in the street in episode 3. Putting her out of her misery would be the 'right' thing to do. Regardless of if she's being an idiot by screaming her head off, does that really justify leaving her to die a slow, agonizing death when you are in a position to prevent it? But shooting her has the consequence of drawing attention to yourself and compromising your own safety, as well as Kenny's. A majority of people seemed to recognize that, as the majority split was in favor of leaving her.
Trying to throw Duck out of the drug store in episode 1? In all honesty, that was pretty much all Larry. If anything, Lilly wasn't even necessarily in agreement with him, she was seemingly going along with what he said trying to calm him down. She never explicitly took his side like "my dad's right, we're kicking the little brat out," the most she says is something to the effect of "okay, calm down Dad, we'll figure something out." She was mostly trying to play diplomat in that scene, trying to get everyone to calm down and prevent anyone from instigating a fight. Obviously, that doesn't end up working, because even Lilly can't always stop her dad from going off on people.
Outside of those three calls she made, I can't particularly think of any other cold/heartless things she did. Nothing she did in a sound state of mind, that is. Shooting Carley was a heat of the moment decision that was dictated by nothing more than anger, and to a lesser degree, desperation. Shooting Doug was an accident, albeit she was still attempting to kill someone else with that bullet. But both of them were split second decisions made by someone that felt backed into a corner, with everything crumbling down around them. Probably how someone like Lee felt when he killed the senator; in the moment, the only response that makes sense in your head is to attack, to neutralize what you envision as a threat to either yourself, the people around you, or both.
If anything, she displays a level of pragmatism (and even a bit of ruthlessness) not unlike Kenny. Both of them are by and large two sides of the same coin. Head strong, pragmatic, prioritize their families first, willing to make tough calls and take action when no one else does... they both handle situations in a very similar manner. If anything, the only real difference is the one we see in pretty much everything; logic vs emotion. Kenny is emotionally driven, Lilly operates more on the basis of logic and practicality. Both equally valid viewpoints, both with flaws as well as upsides. Both are still trying to look out for a group of people in a pressure-cooker environment full of stress and strife.
Now with all that being said...
This I can agree with. She suffered a severe trauma in the form of watching her dad get his head caved in right in front of her, began to slowly unravel and grow paranoid, finally had that pressure get to her and made her kill someone, which led to either exile, or basically the entire group losing any trust/respect they had for her. Now take all that and tack on 8 years of survival in a post-apocalyptic hellscape. I can't see anyone really coming out on the other way of that all hunky-dory.
A heartwarming reunion never seemed like a possibility to me. How it plays out in game is pretty much how I expected a reunion with her to go; disbelief and a sense of nostalgia, that quickly fades away when the two of them realize that their motives are in direct opposition of one another. It's a foregone conclusion when you see her again-- the chances of the two of them ever being able to fully reconcile in the way Clementine and Kenny did was simply never possible. The circumstances wouldn't allow that kind of thing to happen.
Even her feelings regarding Lee seemed like a foregone conclusion, too: if Lee showed her kindness, she's probably learned the hard way that no good deed goes unpunished. Like she says herself "he had too much faith in other people. Probably why he didn't make it". If Lee left her, she's not necessarily in disagreement with him, if anything, she probably thinks that he was ahead of the curve, that he realized early on that some people simply don't deserve the benefit of the doubt.
I might be alone in feeling like this, but I'm really not against her characterization thus far in TFS. It feels like a (mostly) logical continuation of where she left off all those years ago, both in-game and out.