Clementine - Human Kill Count.
So I just found it quite interesting at how few humans Clem has directly killed or how many depending on player choice.
So the max she can directly kill (NOT including being the indirect cause of) is 4 I believe. I could be mistaken...
The first is the stranger, if Lee fails to kill him then Clem will shoot him in the head. Next is Lee himself to stop him from turning followed by Kenny and finally that dude in ANF who sold her dodgy bullets (even though it was an accident but still technically her fault).
Again, sorry if I missed any major possible kill(s).
The fewest she can directly kill is 1 (That guy in ANF who sold her dodgy bullets). Who knows if it was though, she may have killed more people between the end of season 2 and A New Frontier... maybe even in cold blood I dunno. Though that does seem rather unlike her character. But she didn't seem hesitant of killing somebody when she had that shotgun against Javi's back.
I was pretty shocked though, because in my playthrough the only person she ever directly killed was that guy in ANF (yes I chose to leave Lee to turn...please don't hate me) and I thought she would be a little more broken up over it just because she'd presumably never killed a fellow human being before like that.
So in conclusion, Clem can directly kill any number of 1 to 4 people in TWD games. I wonder if this will affect dialogue or the way her charcter develops further in the future. Like if somebody asks if she's ever killed a person before she will either say "Just once...by accident" or "Yeah, I've had to do it before." perhaps.
Comments
Just like to sum something up real quick...it might actually be 5 max kills if you count Sarita.
It never occurred in my gameplay but if she's bitten and you cut off her arm outside of Howe's, Kenny will be standing over her as she's turning with Mike and Clem both asking him to leave her as she's already gone.
Clem can kill her at this stage with her hatchet although it looks to me like she did it after she had already turned but it's difficult to tell. So it could be classified as a direct human kill I guess?
Also after Mariana's death, Clem and Javi fire at Badger's gang of New Frontier members and a few get shot and killed. I dunno if Javi shot them or not or if Clem actually managed to kill any of them...
Clem had to kill the stranger in my game because Lee messed up. Then she had to kill Lee, but thankfully didn't have to directly kill anyone in season 2.
I would really like to see this affect Clem's behavior. We didn't even really see her coping with this in s2 if she had already killed like in my game.
Turns out Clem did touch the racoon in her treehouse making it go batshit crazy. It attacked Sandra, made her infected, she infected the town, that causes the outbreak...
Clem has the highest death count.
I think this is the overall list of people she can kill or get killed:
She also killed (and proposes to kill) numerous New Frontier red shirts in the junkyard and at Prescott.
Her real kill count is probably unknown to us now. And as someone who tried to make Clem against killing as much as possible, it's frustrating as hell.
That's a fairly comprehensive list, yeah.
If you want to be really cruel you can even pin Duck on her for distracting Lee from continuing to cover everyone else, and Conrad for refusing to go along with his plan and having Javier shoot him.
Oh yeah, Conrad! I forgot about him, though I don't recall if she was necessarily calling for his death and it was just Gabe.
Duck is more happenstance and bad timing than anything else, even in [Jake] the Bandit Leader and Ben are technically the catalysts.
There were a few other names on there but I removed them in favor of just focusing on those she can intentionally get killed.
When you had yourself a grand ol time in S1 and S2 and had Clem not kill a single person but S3 comes around and shes out here killing everyone
Omg...Clem caused the outbreak!!!!...CONFIRMED!!
Oh how did you keep her from killing Winston?
Clem killed the stranger in my playthrough, but that was because i didnt really want to have to kill anyone in front of Clem, I guess I was naive to think I could still convince him
I just stopped choking him when the press x prompt disappeared. He sort of took the fire out of me when I found the truth, really wish i had killed him.
Uh... What?
I went into that room ready to fuck him up but my resolve was weakened once i found out that I basically ruined his life by stealing the food.
How was Reggie's death intentional? I doubt she had the intention of getting him thrown off of a building. The same goes for Jane's unborn child, how can she intentionally kill her unborn child by 1) not knowing she was pregnant 2) Kenny being the one who intentionally killed her and 3) if she hangs herself, that was not intentional on Clem's part.
Oh and while we're at it, if you count a dog as a person on a thread named Clementine - Human Kill Count
then we might as well say that every walker she has killed was a human kill count considering walkers are more like people that dogs are imo.
The same goes for Nick, Bonnie, Sarah, Alvin and Conrad. She did not intentionally kill them nor was she really the major cause of any of their deaths.
Nick either gets eaten by walkers because Walt didn't help him or just dies unknowingly. (Walts fault or his own fault).
Bonnie drowned because she tried to save Luke (her own fault).
Sarah died because she refused to move in the mobile home (her own fault) or fell off the balcony thing at the museum and was eaten by walkers (nobody's fault really).
Alvin died because Kenny attempted to kill Carver, even if Clem told him to take the shot it still wasn't her directly killing or intending to have Alvin killed. That's just ridiculous logic. Or Alvin dies because he was shot by some dude in Carver's office.
Finally Conrad. Really?! He had a gun pointed at Gabe's head and threatened to shoot him so Javi killed him.
He did it for his nephew imo, if you think he did it so Clem could go then it still wouldn't be her fault at all. It was entirely Conrad's own fault.
Why does she look like she's stuck in TS3 instead of ANF?
maybe because she has more screentime there (-2 < 0)
What if you have Clementine in the mobile app "The Walking Dead: Road to Survival"?
Does this also counts because of all the kills in PvE and PvP ?
http://walking-deadroad-to-survival.wikia.com/wiki/Clementine
http://walkingdead.wikia.com/wiki/Clementine_(Road_to_Survival)
Okay, let's bloo this:
She can blame him for not watching her and Sarah to make sure they did their work, so him getting punished is an expected result of doing so. It just so happens that the punishment is Carver flipping out and using that as an excuse to murder him--Oops!
She was on the list I got off the Walking dead wikia and I just forgot to remove her. Then again, she can intentionally not shoot Kenny and let Jane be killed, so I guess that's why she was on there as well.
Again, he was on the list and Clementine both kicks him into the prongs and can puncture his throat to put him out of his misery. But you're right about dogs not really counting, so I'll edit that.
Meanwhile, the walkers might've been human once, but they came back as something else. Keep in mind that "killing" walkers is portrayed as not only an often necessary part of self-defense, but also the merciful/noble thing to do for the honor(?) of the person they used to be. Hence why I didn't include someone like Beth.
For some reason, the game has it set to where you have to tell Walter he's a good man so that Walter will save him, rather than only showing Nick the picture of Walter and Matthew together to help him fully realize what he's done and come clean. Telling Walter otherwise would logically make him more likely to kill Nick anyway.
Eh...debatable, so I'll give you that much. But Clementine has to attempt to correct her mistake by breaking the ice in a last ditch attempt to save Luke in order for Bonnie to survive.
Giving into Jane's pressure and not helping Sarah is still Clementine leaving her knowing full well she'll be killed seconds afterwards, just as Lee not shooting Oberson's Walker will get Ben killed, Jane leaving Jaime on the rooftop likely got her killed, and Clementine not shooting the lurker in the Russian's territory could've gotten Kenny killed had he not already been holding a gun.
The "canon" death is certainly up to the individual's preference given that it's more bad luck that gets her killed than anything else. There are many variables that contributed after all but it's undeniable Jane making Luke the offer is what set the stage for that exact situation as a whole to happen in the first place. Well, that and Clementine pushing the cannon up to the gate only for it to break through the deck was unexpected, so not blaming that on her.
I'm pretty sure she can tell Kenny to take the shot anyway if she goes out to look for him and Luke. She still made a choice that risked his life and got him killed.
And the guy's name was Hank.
That's not an argument for why I shouldn't blame her, though. Saying she never encouraged Javier to shoot him would be, since I admittedly haven't seen that scene since December/January.
I think you're misunderstanding what I said.
Do you not see you're own contradiction? You claim that the list you made were of people she intentionally kills now you're saying that she risked his life which ultimately resulted in his death. NOT INTENTIONAL!
I was disagreeing with your statement which claimed she intentionally got all these people killed, not that she had a role (no matter how minor) in their demise.
Finally if you actually read the description of this discussion you will clearly see the line ...(NOT including being the indirect cause of.) Which is something you seemed to have overlooked.
Hmm...I suppose. I definitely used an improper word, at the very least.
All I saw when I posted was "clementine kill count," so I just listed most of the ones I thought counted based on the wikia and specified those are the ones she can kill or get killed. So my bad for the confusion.
Pretty sure a zombie munch on Winston after it tumbled down on him. Clem can't help it if she's got sick dodging skills.
I was wondering why I couldn`t choke him out since I had my arms to do it
How the heck did she kill him, he got eaten by walkers while attacking her.
Exactly, nobody's gonna say you killed somebody because they attacked you and were stupid enough to get themselves killed because of it (and not even from the person being attacked being the killer if I might add).
I guess it's because she technically knocks him down from pulling free from another walker after intentionally guiding him towards the first.
I know right. Before S2E5, my Clementine NEVER killed anyone, and she's so casual about it all in S3.
This may not be the correct place for it but I have to get this off my chest because of how negative I feel about the entire scene. That bar scene in TTB was the WORST scene in the series. I once said that the entire shootout between Season 2's ATR and NGB was the worst scene for me but I can say this beats it as at least the shootout had the building of tension going for it where as I feel this scene for what it is had no positive qualities whatsoever. Clementine goes into a bar and starts shit with this bozo who apparently sold her chalk ammo. The whole interaction is pre determined and written in Clementine's favor. The dick head pulls out a knife simply for the sake of a shocking tension and everyone seems to ignore it. Then the worst part about it, through no choice of our own she kills him. From then we have the option to side with her because it was "self defense" or the option to side with her because "the gun went off". This is comical in the sense of the writing. She may as well have said "Aw, man I shot Marv.... short cough Eli in the face."
I agree, I hate to say it but I see very little resemblance between Clementine in season 1 and 2 (other than how she looks ofcourse).
Which hurts y'know. We've seen this character develop into a smart and mature character in seasons 1 and 2 only to have her do something so stupid and reckless that it's just not like it's really her anymore.
I thought that in this new season we might see a Clementine more like Lee which would have been great and maybe some hints of Kenny and Jane but what we got was nothing more than a complete clone of Jane tbh.
I kinda hoped that depending on who you bonded with the most in season 2 (Kenny/Jane/Luke etc.) we'd see some change in dialogue and tone of voice in Clem. Like you might see some hints of Kenny in her actions and dialogue...but sadly that's not what we got.
You just made my exact point. If her personality had differed between who we chose to be affiliated with it would have been an ingenious idea by Telltale instead she becomes a Jane 2.0 and sinks deeper into being unlikable as we the layer have no control how she behaves. It just makes me feel very disconnected from her and discredits the #MyClementine people
You done with your little rant? The whole point of this thread is possible Clem kills, and depending on your choices a certain character dies, like Luke whereas if you never chose those choices then he would have lived longer.
You share my frustration. It literally pissed me off so much I wanted episode 1 and 2 to be rewritten and released all over again. I ever said to Lee in the dream that Clem's biggest fear was killing someone.
You are aware that I am actually the creator of this thread (check the post), so who are you to say what the original point of the thread was? If you actually took a second to read the description then you'd know that I was referring to people who Clem could directly kill not indirectly.
And how exactly was it a rant? I respect DabigRG very much, that user certainly made some valid points that lead to our discussion (granted it may have seemed heated at times).
You are aware that Luke dies at that stage no matter what prior choices the player made, he won't live longer as you claim.
So if you're prepared to apologise for your ignorance I'll be more than happy to forgive and forget.
Yes I am aware. I was just pointing out to the others who were mentioning the indirect causes that clementine was the cause of their deaths.
No you weren't pointing that out to others, you claimed...
You clarified nothing of indirect or direct causes.
You also claimed that depending on the choices of the character Luke can live longer which is again, completely false...so you're basically giving people false information in you're attempt at proving a point.
People read the description of threads and know generally what it is about and yes, ofcourse sometimes people misconstrue things which is why myself and a fellow user had to correct someone who gave a list of indirect causes of death.
So please, no need to be so condescending with the line "Done with you're little rant?" in an attempt to belittle somebody. It's disrespectful and contributes nothing to the conversation.
I meant to say Nick srry