AJ and Louis' huge bond
MaikelRRR
Banned
Let's take a moment to appreciate how strong bond there is between AJ and Louis:
- Louis is the one that looks out for AJ after Clem had the accident.
- Louis calms him down and plays songs for him.
- He shows AJ how to play a piano and complements him.
- He is giving up his food for AJ.
- He makes him laugh and smile all the time during the hunting.
- When Marlon pushes AJ on the ground, Louis immedietaly runs to help him get up.
- If you decided to make AJ give his gun to Louis then Louis will give it back at the end of the road, because he doesn't want him and Clem to go out there unarmed.
- Louis carries AJ to The School (the scene is even more powerful is Louis got shot before).
- Louis helps Ruby patch him up and then he stays by his side hoping he will be okay (which is incredible considering AJ just murdered his 'brother' and they know each other for 2-3 days).
- He comforts him during the card game when AJ was sad about not knowing how pre-walkers world looked.
And it's also pretty clear that AJ likes Louis (and Tenn of course, but it's different case) the most if it comes to their whole community. So it's quite outstanding that they have such a good relationship despite what happened after he shot Marlon and despite that they don't know each other for that long.
Rebecca and Alvin don't have to worry anymore - Clem has found a perfect father/big brother figure for AJ.
If I forgot about any important moment that should be on the list then feel free to add something from you:)
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Comments
I don't know why or how Louis or anyone have such a close relationship with AJ or Clementine.
What do you mean?
Before the 2 week timeskip, they only knew Clem and AJ about 2 days and then AJ killed his best friend and leader.
Now he's just happy go lucky with him which is rather fascinating.
Can you blame him for that? He killed his best friend. Besides, it's not their fault that he got shot. They aren't the raiders, after what he has done it was fully understandable and justified to vote to kick them out and also it's not like they owned them anything.
We can agree that both of them made some solid mistakes which they both regret. And they both forgave each other already. So if you ask me, then it could be another point in our list
That isn't Louis fault that Abel and Lily shot at them. And if anything, AJ is to blame for them being kicked out in the first place.
Louis is great for AJ, but even AJ has seen and done worse things than he has. Their relationship is about as awkward as a poor central african kid from a warzone being friends with a guy who thinks it’s edgy to skip school and smoke pot. It may not seem that way now, but it might be more apparent later on.
Many people tend to really ignore the fact what AJ has done. Also quite many people tend to be like "He has done the right thing, what's wrong with you?". It's pretty stupid if you ask me. He killed their leader. Their leader who was unarmed already. Yeah, sure, he has done some serious bad shit, but that's not how you deal with that kind of situation.
I didn't romance Louis but I still hope he survives and can be a good friend to both Clem and AJ. For the most part he is very nice to AJ which goes a long way with me.
I also loved how he tackled Lilly and saved Clementine in my game. His war cry as he dive tackled her was completely badass.
I understand why he did it alright, I just find it bullshit. AJ is a kid, his mentality has long ways to go before these kids should start branding him as a dangerous psychopath. I taught him to show remorse and they all heard his apology.
Don't expect me to like Louis or awww at his "bond" with AJ after he basically sentences us to death by throwing us out on the road. One single decision by him almost led to AJ's death, and you'll be sure as hell my Clem won't just take that lightly. It also doesn't help how indecisive he comes off when he changes his mind about it all literally one day later.
It doesn't matter how old AJ is it doesn't change the fact he murdered their leader without a second thought while he was unarmed to add
They've only knew AJ for about 2 days of which he had been rather difficult from biting ruby, taking Assaim's journal without his permission, lowblowing Marlon and even being difficult with Tenn.
As Kenny said in S2 just because you are "sorry" doesn't make it go away or because your a kid it's ok to get people killed. It doesn't matter what AJ said after murdering their childhood friend and leader, AJ is a stranger who had been nothing but difficult to deal with.
It's not just about Lilly. Louis knew exactly where he was dumping Clem and AJ: in the brutal unforgiving wilderness of the apocalypse. His "you've done this before so this is alright" line was a pathetic attempt at himself trying to soothe his conscience. It's also worth noting he was aware by that point that the group that kidnapped Sophie and Minne was lurking out in those woods.
How old AJ is definitely does matter. It, combined with the fact that his only social experience relies on his relationship with Clem were the only reasons he did what he did. He wasn't even aware he was hurting anybody before you tell him in episode 2. You're asking me to empathize with people who did not empathize with AJ. To understand people who refused to understand. I'll never not hold a grudge.
It's also ridiculous to paint the situation as if Marlon did nothing to warrant his fate. Even more ridiculous to ignore that Clem saved that school, not only by finding the kids food on that very same day, but by also making everyone aware of the raider situation. Know where all the kids in the school would be without Clem? Getting carried away by carts to the Delta, like livestock, with their "friend" Marlon alongside them, to be made into soldier slaves. They owe her everything.
The group doesn't care about AJ'S background all they care and know is that AJ has no problem killing a person in cold blood without question. The fact that he was ignorant of the ramifications of his actions make it even worse.
If a kid you've known 2 days who had been causing constant problems then shot and killed your childhood friend and leader, I doubt you'd have "empathy" for him. And hear him say "He didn't know" he was hurting anyone make it ok.
They don't "owe" Clementine everything considering they met her 2 days prior to the skip. Just because she gave them food doesn't mean AJ gets off Scott free of murder of their leader.
Regarding Marlon, he really didn't have much of a choice in trading kids to the delta. His options were refuse and have everyone taken and their camp destroyed or to agree and minimize their losses. I will say Marlon handled the situation very poorly with his group as he should've been transparent and honest with them what the agreement with Delta. You saw firsthand what Delta did to the community with 2 weeks of preparation. They would have been destroyed without a chance by Delta had Marlon refused. Marlon for the most part did the best he could to keep the community functioning and safe and minimizing their losses best he could, but he was wrong in withholding the truth of their predicament. The entire community would be a delta way before Clementine showed up if Marlon had try to oppose them.
Louis and AJ connected almost instantly and it's not surprising considering the warm, inviting aura Louis carries with him. Louis is the type of person who'd be great with kids. The energy, the comedy, and the care for his health and safety, despite the rough patch they went through.
Part of the reason I romanced him is because of their bond. Hell, it's come to a point where AJ's mimicking him "Flip, flip, flip, flip." He really looks up to him as a big brother. I just hope Telltale doesn't punish me for trying to find happiness by killing him cause I romanced him. It was petty when it happened to Carley and it'll be super petty now.
Seems like you don't understand it. Just because he is a kid it doesn't mean that he isn't dangerous. The fact is that he is even more dangerous cause he is unpredictable. I don't know how about you, but I certainely wouldn't want to be around a kid that kills someone like nothing and then is like "what?".
Throwing you out when you even weren't a part of that community? They saved your asses already, they feed you, they let you spend there sometime and you are mad at them like you they would owe you anything at all, which they don't. Besides, they made it on the road for years so it's not like they can't handle themselves.
And you still don't get it. You just go along with "He is a kid, he didn't know that's bad" and you expect everyone else to be "oh ok, he is a kid... fine! no problem!!!" . Stop excusing him because excuses don't play a role there. What plays a role there is that he is dangerous and that's what they have to worry about. Because that was the fact. He killed a man in cold blood. That's the fact and excusing him isn't gonna do anything to change it.
They don't owe her shit. They saved her and AJ. They fed her and AJ. They gave home to her and AJ. Yeah, she also has helped them with the food, but it's not like they do owe her. They both helped each other so that's all.
And yeah, Marlon turned out to be a scum. Still - you don't deal with those kind of situations like this. You do really miss a big picture in everything. You keep excusing a dangerous kid and then you are mad at people that are afraid of him.
Guess we can't stop that. They always kill off best characters and Louis for sure is one of the best this season. For me one of the best in the whole series. Let's enjoy the time we will get.
@MaikelRRR @Chibikid
The fact that he is a kid is exactly the reason their whole "he is dangerous and will kill us all" logic is bullshit. We all saw AJ's unawareness after he shot Marlon, he really didn't know better, and this is not to be disregarded just because you want to demonize him. It takes literally one conversation to get AJ to understand what he did was wrong, because that's literally how kids his age work. They are easily influenced by their mentors, their personalities are literally being developed at this very age. Again, if you see a toddler stealing because their parents didn't teach them better is it your first instinct to call the cops on the kid? Do you want them sent to jail? Or maybe you're a reasonable person and you probably just pin it on the parents and incentive them to teach their kid better? Sure, I understand that murder holds way more gravity than simple theft, but that's the whole point: AJ never got that notion, once he got it (and he did for me) he immediately changed his way of thinking.
No, I absolutely did not expect everyone to be just fine at Marlon's death. You're putting words in my mouth. I expected them to scream at him, be mad, belittle him and I also expected to get the chance to. That's how I expected he would learn that murder is not something to take lightly. What I did not expect however is for them to deem an unknowing 7 year old as a lost cause and send them out supply-less into the woods to die. Especially after what Marlon, one of them, tried to do.
And Marlon is the pinnacle of the ridiculousness of the kids' logic. Acting as if what AJ did was just sudden and completely unjustified is willingly ignoring the fucking sociopathic murderer and human trafficker Marlon turned out to be. No for god's sake, AJ didn't just wake up one night and decided he'd murder Marlon. Marlon killed Brody and you all know what he did next. No, not turn himself in for what he'd done, he instead decides to murder yet another person, leaving us to be devoured and showing no remorse whatsoever about it. Lee, Kenny and Jane wouldn't think twice before shooting Marlon, except those are actually ethically aware adults. Marlon only ever "saves" anyone so he can sell them to child slavers later. And that was his intent from day one. You want to paint the picture of "just a misunderstood scared kid" fine, just know that you're, just like Louis, burring your head in the sand. Except Louis actually acknowledges it later on.
Deeming the details of the situation as mere excuses will make us never see eye to eye. If you're judging someone, you can't just ignore intent or the details.
Clem, in those two days at the school, more than fed herself. The food she finds at the train station would've sufficed to feed her and AJ for weeks, those two days of food are minimal compared to what she brings to the table.
Clem is brought to the school, promised by everyone she and her kid are safe, yet gets forced into a life or death situation by one of the kids. Of course, after Marlon is dead no one but Violet thinks about holding some responsibility for essentially fooling Clem into thinking she was safe there, when in fact she was being kept as currency.
Clem is brought to the school only so she can be sold later to the Delta, gets enough food to feed the school for days in one single night, gets an attempt on her life for no reason whatsoever, yet somehow, they don't owe her anything?
And you'll note I'm hardly saying that how AJ handled the situation was ideal. I'm merely refusing to care about the "excuses" of the people who almost got Clem and AJ killed since they didn't care about ours.
We all know none survives a close relationship with Clementine. AJ may be the only exception, but none else.
Dangerous person is a dangerous person? Even if that person is a kid. Still - it's a dangerous kid. It's not about him understanding what he has done wrong, but about that he did that and about those people that don't want to be around him. "Fixing" him isn't a on/off button and you can't expect people to be okay with him even if he apologizes.
Argument with a young kid stealing money and a young kid killing someone is a whole lot different case and please don't even compare such cases.
They weren't sent to die. They were sent because it was the only way for them. Keep them or get rid of them. And after what he did only the second option made sense.
Yeah. Shooting Marlon when he waved a gun at you and was insane? Sure, yeah. Killing him when he surrendered and dropped his gun? Lee wouldnt do that.
It wasn't Marlon intention. He hoped that they would never appear. And you could see that he was sad and mad that he gave Sophie and Minnie. He screwed up, but he wanted the best for the whole group. Then he made a mistake by not telling others and he pushed himself into the madness and a no way out situation. He simply couldn't bare the embarassment.
Don't come up at me with this shit. Louis was never glad that Marlon died. But he forgave AJ. It takes guts. He realized that Marlon was wrong, but he still wasn't ok with this whole situation. I will also never be okay with how the whole situation was played.
And Violet doesn't hold any resposibility. She just puts the whole blame on Marlon. Mainly because what he has done to Sophie and Minnie. It's not like she is special, it's simply natural for her in that case to put all the fault on Marlon. And she was doing it all the time. Even when AJ apologzied that he screwed up, she was like "No, no you didn't screwed up, it was Marlon!!!". That's why even Louis gets mad at her and said _"Jesus Violet, give him some f**king peace"_ because he is simply full of her blaming him for everything and not saying shit against AJ.
The whole situation was bad from the start. It's not only Clem and AJ being in danger. Every single one of them was in danger. So don't act like they put her in danger. They weren't like "Please, please stay with us, please!". She wanted to stay, fine. They weren't hotel service to walk with her 24/7 and then take responsibility because something like that happened. Marlon screwed up big time. AJ screwed up big time. Both of them should be punished. Marlon got killed, AJ was kicked and shot. Both sides are even.
To be honest we don't have that different opinions. It's just the thing about justifing AJ we are arguing over and over again. Also the fact is that you see all the kids from The School half guilty cause they kicked them out and I see them justified due to them having a solid reason to kick them out.
I'll settle by agreeing to disagreeing on this and stop derailing your thread with this argument. We'd be going in circles for a good time.
Well done.
That picture was such a great final touch as well.
The two best running characters of TFS so far.
Meh.
"but you can really blame Louis? Louis was his bess' frennn!"
Yes I can still blame Louis, because AJ is a fucking kid, as Clementine bluntly states.
Without AJ or Clem they'd all be dead.
FACTS.
For me, Louis is just too flimsy and flip-floppy of a character.
The entirety of Episode 2 he was passive-aggressive as hell. I don't know how any of you can stomach that. And then the corny come-around at the end where now hes suddenly friends with AJ again for no reason.
When AJ asks "are we still friends?", wounded on the bed, still recovering from the shrapnel, -- AND COULD HAVE DIED FROM IT-- and basically asking for his forgiveness Louis continues to be a passive-aggressive bitch who still obviously doesn't want to be around AJ.
Its insulting. And I can't accept that.
There's no other way around it. Clem and AJ's lives were put in danger due to the vote and nothing else. This is life and death, people.
I actually liked Louis in EP1 but this episode 2 just showed his true character. Honestly he's the secret weakest link.
You're right, the Ericson kids DON'T owe Clem and AJ shit.
Thus, neither do Clem and AJ owe the kids any gratitude or concessions once they are kicked out and thrown into vicinity of the raiders.
Therefore, why should it be a problem if we tell Louis to fuck off? He doesn't need to forgive us and we don't need to "forgive" him.
See this is the problem. People are antagonizing either AJ or Louis which shouldn’t be the case. Y’all have to realize that there is more than one perspective. First, with AJ. He viewed Marlon as a threat so he did what he thought someone was supposed to do in that situation because he is seeing the world as black and white, no grey area. He didn’t know the concept of surrending until after the situation. Now with Louis I think it is pretty messed up that a lot of people are blaming him for his actions as well. Think about it: if people you met for only two days, see them as good and nonthreatening, then BAM! one of the people killed your bestfriend that you have known for the majority of your life, how would you feel? Like I said before, AJ or Louis should not be blamed for their actions.
"You're asking me to empathize with people who did not empathize with AJ. To understand people who refused to understand. I'll never not hold a grudge."
Even more FACTS.
It's not Clem and AJ's problem. It's everyone else's problem. They refuse to compromise, so it's on them not Clem.
Above all else, Clem is going to stand by AJ, just like Louis and mostly everyone else stood by Marlon's child trafficking piece of shit corpse.
Since when fucking kids are allowed to kill unarmed people and then expect everyone else to feel safe around them?
And besides - you are excusing AJ's actions by saying that he is a kid and you are not excusing Louis' actions by saying that he has lost his best friend and that he realized how many mistakes he has made in his whole life.
That's being H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T-E dude.
And you are misinterpreting a big picture in that scene. Louis cared for him, but when he asked him that question you could see how many thoughts at once he had in his head. Just watch the scene. When he was saying "Just get some sleep, okay?", his voice while saying "okay" looked like he was about to start crying the shit out of himself.
It's not easy to simply forgive someone like this. It was not that much time for Louis to get over it. He was grieving, he was feeling guilty. He was mad at himself, at Marlon, at AJ, at Clementine. Also raiders appeared so if you ask me it's not like he was having an easy time.
What Episode 2 showed in fact is that he - just like every other person - is a HUMAN BEING that gets touched by actions like this and you can't simply expect him to be "Hey kid, you unnecessary shot my best friend, but you know what? I forgive you, it's okay, I'll live with that.. wanna play cards?"
When he got more time, he thought about everying, he got over himself. He apologized to Clem and AJ even though he didn't have to. A normal player should also at least once (since we had two or three possibilities) apologize for what happened during that night, but if someone wants to play cocky Clementine then fine.
Since the apocalypse.
There's a lot of things people shouldn't generally do in a civilization but this isn't exactly one, is it? Why does Clem rob Javi in the beginning of ANF?
How come Louis doesn't give a shit about Brodie? (actually everyone besides Violet, but let's focus on Louis).
Why does Louis show no concern for the other long-time friend that died?
No. The right answer is since NEVER.
Violet also doesn't give any shit about her to be honest. It's not just Louis. It's everyone. Pretty much like the writers forgot that she has ever existed.
I´m not sure about this "huge" bond.
I'm sure Louis is AJ's favorite, just like Omid was Clem's favorite (according to Lee). Because they're fun characters to be around.
But hey, Omid sent 9 year old Clem into an abondened building all by herself, so what the heck do kids know anyway?
I don't see such a "huge bond", AJ likes Louis just because he makes him laugh and he's a funny guy for him, but he also said he likes Tennessee and Violet aswell.
He likes Tenn because they are both little kids and it's natural for them to like each other since they understand each other quite much. He likes Violet, but obviously not as much as Louis.
Which I really didn't care for. She should've been just as much a part of the trauma and recovery topic, if not moreso.
The only characters who actually paid her any mind once are Tenn and Willy.