Telltale should've ended TWD in season 2(the downfall of TWD).
What I'm about to say is the downfall of TWD. The reason why such a great series, ended in an unforgivable and undeserved way.
After the outstanding Season 1, fans were eagerly waiting for a sequel. When season 2 came out, fans were not disappointed, but it didn't come up to the expectations. The sales were lower than Wolf Among Us, and the critics didn't give the game higher than 8/10(consider that season 1 was about 9.5/10 and that 0.5 loss was because of the glitches the game had; otherwise, it would've gotten 10/10).
First I'm going to say why season 2 wasn't as good as the first season:
The main plot: The plot of Season 1 was clear, Lee, a man who killed a senator, has been given a chance in a world gone to hell; He finds a girl named Clementine, and he decides to protect her. He finally gives his life for Clementine but throughout his journey, he teaches Clementine how to take care of herself. But what was the plot for season 2? Was it about Clementine surviving in the apocalypse? Just that? She had no goals in the game but survival. I think Wellington plays an important role in this. For example, Imagine if Clementine's goal was to reach the Wellington, and based on your decisions, she could've reached her goal or not.
The protagonist or the main character: The idea of playing as a child in the zombie apocalypse was interesting, but the execution was poor. We saw a lot of times that Clementine was treated like an adult, in the TV series season 3, we don't see Carl being given responsibility as much as the others, but then you see the opposite in the walking dead season 2 game. I mean like, what kind of an asshole would shoot a little girl?! (Arvo). What kind of an idiot would suggest a little girl smoke?! (Bonnie). What kind of useless people would let a little girl make the decisions?! (All)
The antagonist or the main Villain: First off, Why was Carver killed in episode 3? They could've you know, instead of that Russian group, put Carver and a few of his fellows who survived. That actually could've made the 400Days(DLC) more impactful, as the more people go to the Carver's camp in the 400 Days, the more people will survive the Herd assault.
And also one thing about Carver that bothers me is his motivations. He didn't really have any strong motivations for what he does. We need to know about the Villain. The less we know, understand or connect to the Villain, the weaker the Villain will be. (for example Joan in ANF)Lack of Hub exploration or gameplay: This isn't an animation or an interactive story, this is a game. It needs to have solid gameplay. This is something that Telltale had forgotten for about 5 years.
Characterization: There were only four good characters(character development) in season 2 in my opinion: 1.Kenny, 2. Sarah, 3.Luke, 4.Jane. We failed to connect to the other characters. We reach a point that in ANF when someone dies, we laugh at it! In season 1 there was much more character development. This is another reason why hub explorations are important because, in season 1, you could walk around and connect with the other characters, and learn new things about them.
The Choices: I still wonder, what was the purpose of the choice where you have to choose whether to hug AJ or not? Or whether to kill Rebecca or ask the others for help? These choices literally had no impact on the story nor the player. You might argue that in season 1 the choices had a little impact too, But what makes them better in season 1 is because of 3 things: 1. The reaction of other people to the choices we made in season 1 was more, 2. Some of the choices we made helped to develop a character, 3. Most choices had a moral dilemma.
These are the reasons why I think Season 2 didn't succeed as well as Season 1.
Season 2 was good in general, but that's when TWD started to shake. Now I'm going to talk about why Telltale should've ended The Walking Dead series in 2014(I'm not going to talk about Telltale shutting down or that kind of stuff, I'm exclusively talking about TWD):
The Story: You might all disagree, but I personally think the structure for the story was short, so it would've been better not to continue the story for a long time. I think it could've been better if they ended the series in Season 2.
ANF and Michonne failure: ANF and Michonne mini-series really took us out of Clementine's story. They were weaker and less enjoyable. They could actually succeed if they were made in another time, or in another way, but making these series when they were working on a lot of projects was unnecessary.
The Theme: The Walking Dead universe is popular, but it doesn't mean everything that has TWD as its theme, has to be good. I personally don't agree with Telltale buying licenses from other companies to make games. Not only would it have a lot of problems(such as the contract or the rules and that kind of stuff), but also the game would always be seen as a shadow of the original version.
The Success of Season 1: It might sound a bit surprising, but I think the quality of Season 1 made it harder to create continuations because people's expectations were high, and they would always compare it to the first season(which is literally what I just did).
There are more reasons to it, but I can't exactly recall right now. But anyway what I mean is, it didn't have to end like this. A series that everyone loved, is now isolated by everyone; even by its most supportive fans.
Comments
I generally agree that Telltale should’ve ended the series at S2, However; TFS is turning out to become amazing and I think they can end the series off better then S2 imo. I also wanted to say that I do think a lot of your criticisms towards S2 are very subjective. While some of your criticisms towards S2 are spot on like the choices and characterization, your criticisms towards S2’s plot, protagonist, and antagonist are definitely debatable.
Season 1's success was the start of Telltale's downfall as ironic as that is.
They hired too many people and started working on too many projects at once, The Walking Dead suffered a lot because of this.
You're not the first to say.
The Walking Dead: S3 should've been what TFS is right now.
ANF should've been a new series all along.
The title sorta suggests that, doesn't it?
They never should have wasted their time on Michonne, Guardians, Minecraft Season 2 and Game of Thrones (It wasn't bad but they left it on cliffhanger and I assume that HBO has no interest in continuing the story).
Whatever, man. I'm grateful they made so many TWD and have enjoyed them all. If the seasons you don't like bug you so much, stop thinking about them so much. Pretend they're not "canon" or whatever. Just move on.
Well Season 2 should've been Alone ending only (with variations) and after that is The Final Season. Then you've got A New Frontier. Ah, it fits perfectly! Telltale's The Walking Dead Trilogy
Maybe in retrospect it would have been better if it ended after S2. But me personally? I regret absolutely nothing...
I take that back, I regret one thing
I too enjoyed all the TWD games, but I'm just not happy that it didn't come up to the potential it had.
I didn't say that Season 2 was weak. I was comparing it to Season 1. I was trying to focus on the parts that Season 1, in general, did better. But for example Season 2 I think had better graphics, menu, music, and I think Season 2 episode 5 was one of the best(if not the best) episodes in TWD.
Innuendo Studios had a video on this that gave a compelling possible answer to why the choices felt so different in Season Two:
As for the choices outside of Kenny, like deciding whether to give water to the dying man or to go with Nick or Pete, help Sarah with her work or not, he also goes into detail about that too:
But otherwise, I agree with you. For example, choosing whether or not to help kill Larry had a significant effect on your relationship with Kenny or Lily later. The only equivalent in the second season is your choice regarding Luke, even though he dies either way. If you help him, Bonnie will be nicer, but if you cover him (even if later, you try to save him by breaking the ice), Bonnie will be harsh to you, even telling Mike to leave you behind, even after you're shot.
So let's talk about theming. The first Season's theme was pretty clear and pretty emphasized: the importance of family.
Clem is trying to find her parents, Lee eventually becomes a surrogate father, Kenny is a family man willing to do anything protect his wife and son, The Stranger was a dad, Larry is trying to protect his daughter Lily, Christa is pregnant with a child of her own, etc.
And the second season also brings up family.
If we look at it this way, Kenny's return is no accident. Rebecca's baby, Carver saying "We're going home. As a family." etc.
But what also gets brought up is trust.
And I feel like this is the ultimate thesis the game is presenting, and again, it's no accident that you're asked to choose between the group you're with, Kenny, Jane, or even rejecting all of these choices and trekking out alone. You can ask Jane to take you with her when she leaves the first time, you can also ask for Mike to take you with them when they're leaving in the middle of the night, and then you have the third option of going out alone on your own, ultimately trusting no one.
I will agree that this all got muddled by the inconsistent writing but I can at least appreciate what they were trying to do.
Thanks for the feedback.
I stopped reading once you started validating the thoughts of "critics". I could care less what IGN has to say about my favorite game. Especially their track record of perjury, and getting paid for favorable critiques. They can kindly go fuck themselves and I don't care if they gave TFS EP2 a 5-6. (Which they did for the record) It's a masterpiece and a fantastic episode.
But in short TFS is better than S2 imo and TNF was very close if not tied. S2 was special only solely because of Kenny the boat god himself. So powerful enough to carry the season on his back. The side characters were complete duds. You listed Sarah into your good character list. She was a annoying hinderance. Really it was Kenny vs Jane simulator. Kenny was the saving grace for sure. But if you like Jane she probably was. The season hedge on two characters quite a bit. But I don't think we should weight out Luke or Nick. 4 characters if you include them. Everyone else is irrelevant. Carver had 1 main episode to shine. He's the greatest TWD villain imo.
Now honestly if I had to rank the seasons so far.
So no, I don't think they should have stopped with S2 because TFS is incredible and the only reason people hate TNF is because of biased critics thoughts and not their own, overly comparing it to other seasons and other plots and just hating that their were little to no returning characters and people had distain for Javier. It was a great season imo. Very unfairly hated.
I'm sorry, what is this about/reply?
I think that's partly because he was supposed to BE "Carver" himself.
The games were not the cause of failure...it was the stupid over hiring of people...having a business model that relied on investment capital as your main source of cash flow...not reinvesting into technology...relying on nothing but ips from other companies. Mishandling the talent they had. Not looking into other forms of revenue generation like hiring out their voice over studio. Management backseat driving when it comes to scripts and changing scripts so far into the development process you have to call back Voice actors so much they have no idea how to play a scene because of tonal shifts in the story. If you look at things....they were only a couple of steps ahead of the wolves wanting their investment repaid(funny that) They never had breathing room...and perhaps this is why an original Ip never manifested.
Right
I can agree that the Final Season is very good, but the company has shut down, the employees have fired, and the series reputation has shattered. That's why the final season will not be a great success.
About ANF, It wasn't bad but it was made at the wrong time and in the wrong way. You might disagree, but I think ANF, should've been made after TFS. But generally, thanks for the opinion.
Do you have a source for this?
I’m kind a happy with the final season, I don’t think there’s no need for it just to seasons...Honestly.
That's an interesting observation.
Someone should model swap the Russians for Carvers group and i guarantee the scene would make a lot more sense and would be 10x better.
A New Frontier should have never existed. I will never understand the cancellation of Season 3.
No, they should've published the ''original'' season 3 and not Anf.
Maybe you’re grateful paying money for shitty quality/content but i wasn’t. Season 3 was a disgrace and not even really a game to me. Most episodes were just choosing dialogue choices, little to no gameplay and the story and characters were nothing to remember. I had no emotional impact with that trash. At least Season 1 and 2 gave me something
I must say, I enjoyed reading these responses!
https://kotaku.com/ign-pulls-ex-editors-posts-after-dozens-more-plagiarism-1828357792
https://variety.com/2018/gaming/news/ign-filip-miucin-plagiarism-1202906110/
https://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2018/08/07/ign-investigating-dead-cells-review-allegedly-plagiarized-by-its-nintendo-editor/
https://www.zeldadungeon.net/former-ign-employee-admits-review-scores-are-skewed-due-to-public-relations/
And the most damning evidence
Call of Duty Ghosts - 8.8/10 (Acclaimed as the worst COD of all time by the community)
NBA 2K18 - 8.4/10 (Micro Trans game that crashed at launch, almost all players got deleted, still has buggy servers and is pay to win formula)
The Walking Dead TFS EP2- 5/10
The Walking Dead TFS EP1 - 6/10
The Walkign Dead S2 - 7.5/10
See the difference between AAA devs who can pay heinous amounts of money on a whim and a borderline indie dev in infacy stages struggling to keep the lights on who obviously didn't pay?
The bias of IGN is disgusting. Deplorable. Laughable. And anyone who supports them wishes Clementine was dead. IGN played one of the largest roles in TTs collapse. IGN has been actively discrediting the hard work of TT since S2 and always will. While us the pure consumer base that loves the content and game genre (unlike IGN who clearly hates PNC games and TT in general) revel in the fact that TFS EP1 and EP2 were episodic masterpieces and some of the best of the franchise. IGN is in the corner telling people who aren't die hards, who are the essential consumer base that need to be swayed to buy the game "This is trash, it's unplayable, it's worst literally worst than no man's sky" that's a fucking problem.
The trifecta of what killed telltale. IGN, Let's Play Youtubers and TT's decisions playing the smallest part.
Who'd play the games when you can just watch PewDiePie play them for free and just play along? Who would ever buy them when they are getting a 6/10 even though they masterpieces.
It's a perfect storm. And IGN played imo the largest part.
Thanks for the roundup!
I'd argue that that claim is completely false. TT's internal decisions play the biggest part on why they failed. YouTubers play other story-driven games, like Life is Strange, that do really well. Life is Strange S1 was also reviewed rather mixed by critics and still sold a lot of copies thanks to big Youtubers.
I can agree on that a bit because I see some of the games that are literally awful getting more credits than TWD in IGN, and it's really terrible.