Episodes puzzles still not very challenging
Since everyone has over a month to play each episode, cant telltale make these puzzles a lot more difficult? I mean - isnt that the beauty of this game getting stumped?
I remember in curse of monkey island - I went around exploring the islands for hours sometimes trying to figure things out. This is not the case here in Tales.
Lets take the scene at the end of the episode where DeCava traps Morgan and Guybrush in the cages. I mean -was that even supposed to be a puzzle? Lower the cage by grabbing the rope, throw Morgan the sword and you are free? Seriously - with little to no more effort, they could make each of these puzzles much more challenging. Most of these are kind of a joke. Another example is getting Morgan to go on a date with that dork. OK - we'll play guess and check for a total of 2 minutes, send her over to him a couple times and bam - we have his vote. The same is true for the manatee date at the end. Go over a couple times- find the line that works and bam -manatees are in love and you have almost completed the episode. It cant be just me that feels this way.
I would just like to see 1 extremely difficult puzzle per episode that forces the player to search and explore every area and talk to everyone. Again - I think I missed out on some stuff because things were so straight forward.
I remember in curse of monkey island - I went around exploring the islands for hours sometimes trying to figure things out. This is not the case here in Tales.
Lets take the scene at the end of the episode where DeCava traps Morgan and Guybrush in the cages. I mean -was that even supposed to be a puzzle? Lower the cage by grabbing the rope, throw Morgan the sword and you are free? Seriously - with little to no more effort, they could make each of these puzzles much more challenging. Most of these are kind of a joke. Another example is getting Morgan to go on a date with that dork. OK - we'll play guess and check for a total of 2 minutes, send her over to him a couple times and bam - we have his vote. The same is true for the manatee date at the end. Go over a couple times- find the line that works and bam -manatees are in love and you have almost completed the episode. It cant be just me that feels this way.
I would just like to see 1 extremely difficult puzzle per episode that forces the player to search and explore every area and talk to everyone. Again - I think I missed out on some stuff because things were so straight forward.
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Where as I can't speak for everyone there's never been a monkey island puzzle that stumped me for too long.
The hardest parts were usually poor design and abuse of the graphics/ player and everything else on unholy grounds... like finding lice on a jacket that you couldn't really see...pixel hunting :mad:...
Or using a monkey as a wrench....WTF!? :mad:
Things like that.
I think their just like the other games, it's just that the wait makes them seem too easy, all put together I think their spot on for a full monkey island game.
Although I got stuck on getting a piece of 'thread' from Largo for months. That was before I had internet though... doubt I'd last that long these days without finally giving into a *shudders* walkthrough.
Well, while we're at it, the time clock maze in Monkey Island 4, I cheat every time, and i cheat for the guitar playing in 3...I just save and load 7-8 times.
What can I say I've been inspired by a pirate, I still beat the puzzles on my own.
To this day I still wonder whether I would have actually worked out this puzzle. Probably not, I'm yet to actually hear the word "Monkey Wrench" actually be used out of Monkey Island context. Is it an American term?
As for the Worst. Puzzle. Ever? The goat puzzle in Broken Sword, anyone?
Hey, speak for yourself, man.
I agree XuGator, i like the puzzles to be more complex but with such a limited area to explore within the confines of an episode it's difficult to do this. That's my whole arguement for episodic gaming, they're easy and too short. Even the full season could be beat within a day or two.
I love that we have more monkey island to play, its great, but i think over the next few years adventure games will take off again and developers will start making full length games, so eventually we can look forward to some new original games that we can get stuck into!
Sometimes these episodes feel like a kids crossword puzzle or maze on the back of a menu. They keep you occupied for a while but then your looking for something else to do.
I think it is more rewarding if you solve a hard puzzle every now and then. Otherwise it's like watching a movie with a few interaction parts.
I think a lot of the puzzles were brilliant in design but I still think chapter 3 was the easiest chapter by far. I'm really hoping the last two chapters are much more difficult or at the very least a bit more.. Even adventure game rookies should be ready for more of a challenge by chapter 4..
PLEASE.
I am optimistic TTG will manage though, especially for chapter 5 they will surely spend some extra time for the perfect balancing.
Still a great chapter I think, but not challenging enough to give you an emotional reward response for solving any of the puzzles... If that makes any sense..
I thought TT nailed it in just about every episode of S&M s2.
BTW: I hated that puzzle with a passion. I was stumped forever and when I found out the answer I felt cheated.
Although not "Extremely difficult", I thought that getting DeCava to drink the yellow Ichor was tougher than most have been. More puzzles of that level of complexity would be nice.
I think they are coddling the noobs, for the most part though.
Not to everybody.
I just think that, although the game itself does not quite measure up to the pinnacle that is MI:2 (partly to with rose tinted specs as well I suspect), some of ToMI's puzzles have already surpassed some of MI:2 better ones.
Seriously how much time a day do you guys put aside for these games, how much free time do you even have? How long does it usually take you to beat Monkey Island games? I can't remember ever taking longer than a week to get to the final stage or beat a monkey island game.
** just-in-case warning -- spoiler here for Curse of Monkey Island **
VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV
People have mentioned the map tattoo "puzzle" in CMI as an example of a challenging puzzle. For those who have forgotten, that's the one where you need to get the Blood Island map that is tattooed to the back of Palido Domingo. The solution was to poor frying oil on his back so the sun burns him and you can then peel the skin off his back.
To me, this kind of puzzle is a bit stupid. It was gross and funny, but stupid for a puzzle. It's hard not because it takes clever thinking but rather because it defies real-world logic. Granted, the Monkey Island world is a cartoony, offbeat world, but it is still set in the real world and so puzzles should more-or-less follow real world logic. In reality, burned skin doesn't peel in nice big sheets, a tattoo printed on it probably wouldn't readable as the skin would shrivel up all gross-like, and a sleeping man would notice and freak out if someone started to peel the skin off his back. So unless you live in a cartoon world where all of these things seem perfectly logical to you, you could only really solve that puzzle by trying things randomly until you hit on it. And that, to me, isn't very fun or rewarding.
Also worth mentioning is that those of us who played the old Monkey Island games were probably much younger then. I played them when I was a kid. Now I'm older and hopefully smarter, and I expect that contributes to being able to complete these games more easily.
But that time its precious, you are confused but then when you got it, you feel great.
In Tales that time is relly short, its like you always know what you got to do and how to do it. That feeling of accomplishment isnt there.
Its still a great game cause you can tell there is a great ammount of creativity both in story and puzzles lay out, and the fact that it can be a great game even when its easy makes you wish harder for more complexity.
Cause its the only thing that it lacks to be truly awesome.
There's no real idea there, or purpose until after you do it,then it makes all the sense in the World.
I don't particulalary care for those puzzles but I wouldn't say their harder than Tales puzzles. We're simply meant to do things by numbers and steps, we're all programed to work towards specific goals and to serve some sort of function in an event by following events. We all are under laws, and social skills, and rules that teach us to act in a logical sequence of events.
So, do I think those stupid puzzles are harder, no...
Do I like arguing, YES!
From a writting stand point it's much more challenging to write a less than obscure puzzle than to write an obscure one I imagine, because your ultimate goal is to stomp someone with your puzzle, it's harder to do that with an "intelligent" puzzle.
Do I think stupid puzzles are witty...nope nope!
I merely think that Tales took it's own puzzle style route and that it's all about possessing certain skills and experiences to beat them with ease. For instance pirate face isn't all that much different than insult sword fighting/ arm wrestling/ monkey combat...need we go on?
Then you can click on the cooking oil. You know you NEED the cooking oil, because the Cabana boy won't let you have it. I don't like the "wet towel" method of getting rid of him, seems a bit obtuse actually(okay, I just didn't think of it because frankly I'd already used that combination for something else completely different), but once you have the cooking oil, you have the liquid.
You know the map is on his back. So you have to get him to turn over to even see the map. He says he's tanning. You can get him to turn over by getting him more tan. I actually tried the cooking oil on this step, but it didn't work. So when I turned him red with the dye, the cooking oil was a natural step forward. It was a liquid, the mechanic of the cup was already established, so you don't even need to know WHY you need to put cooking oil in to jump to the conclusion that it's something to try. And at that point, you can realize why it would be useful. It's actually a really good puzzle with a lot of pieces across a large area.
i REALLY understand u... im like u, i like hard, the harder, the better.
But everytime reading "i loved the hard puzzles" i feel sad...
Once and again, i repeat asking to TTG to make it harder... and i got responses like "go play another thing" "its better a good argument" bla bla bla...
Its like talking to a Chimp...
Im quite sure they will not make the game hard, so imgetting rdy to say... "Tales of Monkey Island, te easyest Graphic Adventure ever made".
Thanks telltales, u made an excellent game, but, as i said before... It would be better to make a Movie, than an easy game like this.
PS: Sorry my bad english.
It's a game, how easy it is for you is irrelevant and it's a damn good game with a damn good story! It's 100 perecent game play just about mixed with a filmatic feeling but it's a game...difficulty is irrelevant and different for everyone. MAybe a poll is in order but I don't think a thread like that is a good idea.
right on!
honestly I do not have the patients to get stuck either I always end up looking up the solution online... and way back when I used to buy those pocket sized walkthroughs remember those?
I think TTG has made their games pretty balanced... I sound like a fanboy....
As for "just about right", I'd say MI3's Mega-monkey nailed it right on the head.
Because let's face it, the majority of gamers are brain dead zombies who like to use the word 'gay' in every sentence they can. And unless you plan on going bankrupt, you'll need to comprimise a bit.
The majority? What does that make you, a brilliant talking chimp, who likes to use the words "the majority"!?
I admit playing an action game is not usually as hard as an adventure game but lose the mast in your pants that you have going for yourself! The majority of people are rather intelligent.
As far as a adventure games go, which they aren't really going...it's a perfect game to try to get the genre back to life. It goes beyond sales and compromises. People aren't dumb, the World is making us that way and this game is easing our brains and senses for adventure games back into place. People have potentinal and don't deserve your crude egotist insults.
Why can't you people accept the role that Tales has, it's to revive the damn genre! Can't you people have sentiment for that and respect that!?
I agree that puzzles should be logical, and Telltale does achieve that. But even for logical puzzles there can be differences in how obvious the solution is. In ToMI you usually have only a few items in your inventory, and only a few places to go with puzzles that need solving. That may be a result of the episodic nature, since the portions of the game are strictly so divided. You can´t be misguided and try to solve something that is not meant to be solved at the time because you are limited to the places that really are important for the chapter.
Now in chapter 3 the puzzles were much too easy imho; the problem is that it was neither hard nor did it offer enough content to keep me entertained for long. Two hours is just not a long play-time. I am just getting into the MI-world again, and when I really cought fire it is over. Having seen the whole story of the chapter there is no replay value for me. I only started with ToMI on Talk-like-a-pirate-day, but if I had waited for 6 weeks to play the chapter, a mere two short hours of entertainment would be a disappointment.
For that reason I believe that somewhat more complicated puzzles would be welcome. It doesn´t have to be so much that you get stuck for long, but there has to be enough to do so that you probably won´t play it through in one short session.
The thing that drives me away from these games so far is the fact that it feels like playing with "large dolls in a small box" rather than, say, small Lego-size figures exploring a large box (which, to me, is what much of the original games felt like). I am aware of the size constraints for this format, but I am not necessarily saying the number of rooms needs to be increased - rather I am suggesting that the large visuals hamper the feeling of immensity. Consider the fact that MI1 didn't have all that many rooms, but still managed to portray a "large" world. When everything is in your face with these large characters and zooming of objects - I personally feel that the puzzle solutions are thrust more blatantly in my face.