Also, if your tone is going to stay the same, take it to Private Messages, or at least to it's own thread outside the main Ice Station Santa thread, please.
@Maratanos
Again, i have to agree with most of the reviews. I wouldn't give Sam&Max a 9 or 10 yet because it mostly lacks those magic moments which lifts it above the good ones. Graphics, sound animations, eveything is fine most of the time but i'm missing this with the puzzles, the story and some characters.
Jack Keane had a few situations were it shines this way. Also the cops in Sam&Max came up with that feeling or the setup in 201 but it's not a steady companion. I also don't see this as a problem of the past vs. present as you always laugh about a good joke or you always worship a great riddle or a great atmosphere. I think we're scratching but we're just not fully there.
@Jake
Sorry if i offended someone as this wasn't my intention, i'm just curious about the why.
I didn't say anyone was offended, but you guys are arguing back and forth with each other, and have filled nearly a complete page with the two of you. I don't think it's benefiting anyone but you two, so I asked that you take it elsewhere (even just somewhere else on this board).
No, YOU'RE missing the point. Maniac mansion scored in the 8-9 range and yet it's still a VERY SUCKY GAME INDEED. Mojo hits closer with a 2/5.
Maniac Mansion is the best game ever, and Mojo's review is considered unacceptable by all carbon-based organisms, and Alex has since been physically injured. Expect to see a re-review of the game that isn't a shameful outrage sometime before 2025.
Also, if your tone is going to stay the same, take it to Private Messages, or at least to it's own thread outside the main Ice Station Santa thread, please.
Jake, you know that's a death sentence.
Don't really care. I was arguing with terminology anyway.
Ah, the internet... where flame wars start through being over-passionate and having a little thing called annonimity... or is that anemone?
IN all seriousness, did anyone catch the GameTap TV ad for Season 2? I heard it last night when I turned on my TV, but the damn picture didn't show until the title card came up. Stupid analog TV... then again, my HD Monitor on my computer does the same thing.
Well, I hate to say it, but I think I'm growing out of the series. I bought the complete Season 2 set as I want to support the cause no matter if I play all the games or not. I gave Ice Station Santa a try, but I just can't enjoy the recycling of the characters, locations, music and the iffy timing and dialog in certain spots. I just don't enjoy playing these episodes enough. I made it to the end of Reality 2.0.
It was good fun for a while, but I think I'll go back to anticipating the old style full length games, opposed to episodic ones. I enjoy the higher production values of traditional releases. I'm still hopeful that maybe one day these TTG releases will reach such production values with this astonishing release rate.
i'm flashed. i'm not intending to read anything anyone has posted on the last pages. i just have to tell you: TELLTALE GAMES I LOVE YOU. what you've done is incredible. i'm just through ice station santa, couldn't start before sunday night and only had some hours every night since, and now i'm through. and i have to say... it was so incredibly awesome, i can't believe it. you rule. thank you for that experience. this one episode was better than the whole of season one. and i loved season one. if you manage to keep that standard i'll be ashamed you received only 35 bucks from me. wow. i don't find the words. i just want you to know that ep201 was the FLIPPING BEST GAME i ever played. honestly. thank you. and thanks for putting me for the seventh time into the "thank you"-list
Quit dragging your feet in nostalgia and recognize that as long as you idolize old adventure games as the pinnacle of greatness, you'll never find another game that you think lives up to the standard, because you'll always be comparing the two and your memory excises the bad parts of an old game that you loved. It's like getting dumped in a relationship. If you still get hung up on how awesome your ex is, you'll never see a great opportunity for another relationship if it slaps you in the face, because of nostalgia. Wake up, and get on with life.
I don't really care to involve myself in a lenghty argument that much, but I can't just let this go either. played Grim Fandango for the first time this spring. It has plenty of problems: bad movement system, quite a bit of pointless back and forth running and a stupid item interface. But got sucked in the world, I laughed to a lot of the jokes and got engrossed by the story. I wanted to tell about some of the jokes to my friends and was genuinely moved near the end of the game. I also felt empty when I finished it. I absolutely fell in love with Glottis.
A month ago I stumbled upon a playthrough of Sam & Max Hit the Road on YouTube. It was late and I had work early in the morning, but I just couldn't stop watching the playthrough. The intro is so incredibly funny no matter how many times you watch it. The chemistry between S&M is incredible. It's good enough for me to enjoy myself when I just *watch someone play the game*. And here we get to the TTG S&M Series. It's not the same. It's not as mesmerising as the games of old. It's good, no doubt about it - especially if you play just one or two episodes. But it also has flaws that aren't just gameplay related, but are related to the storytelling and entertainment aspect of the game, if you understand what I mean.
What I wanted to say this in a nutshell is, that it isn't just nostalgia that makes the classic games so great in my (and others') mind. I find it disrespectful that people brush those games off saying 'oh, they were good back in the day..."
And i also wouldn't say that just the reviews are voting this way as for instance with Ice Station Santa i came to a compareable result as others who were reviewing the episode. I'm enjoying Sam&Max much more than adventures the years before, but it's not sucking me as much into the game like with these old games due to different reasons
Yeah, and this reason is "Nostalgia"...;-)
Jack Keane had a few situations were it shines this way. Also the cops in Sam&Max came up with that feeling or the setup in 201 but it's not a steady companion. I also don't see this as a problem of the past vs. present as you always laugh about a good joke or you always worship a great riddle or a great atmosphere. I think we're scratching but we're just not fully there.
I'm sorry to rain on your parade but "Jack Keane" sucked bad. Laughable atempt from Germans to make a game similar to Monkey Island with a Guybrush Threepwood Clone and even Monkeys on an Island. Plus the typical german Adventure-humour, I hate so much these days. Unfortunatly, Germany is in some sort of way the biggest market for Adventures these days and many Games come from Germany. But most of them suck, suck, suck. Don't try to even compare them to old LA-Classics. And Jack Keana is the perfect example why it doesn't work: They totally fail to copy the humour of old LA-Classics. It was embarassing to me playing Jack Keane. Just because there are no better games on the market, doesn't mean the actual games are similar to old classics.
Point being: Sam&Max is the only game today that caputres the old Adventure Game Spirit an no Jack Keane, Runaway or &/%$&/&( Benoit Sokal games will come close to this.
Point being: Sam&Max is the only game today that caputres the old Adventure Game Spirit an no Jack Keane, Runaway or &/%$&/&( Benoit Sokal games will come close to this.
IT's also the only adventure game still holding an audiance given the failures before it.
As for Jack Keane, yes they tried to deliver a Monkey Island like pirate game and with a few riddles they succeeded and showed those tiny little bit which makes something great and not just average or good. But in a whole it isn't as good as Monkey Island. I wouldn't say that it's like other german adventures beside of Ankh as those mostly go a different route, it's all about Deck13. I also wonder what this german humour is you're talking about. Nail this to certain developers/person and it does make sense, otherwise it more sounds like a rant. Depending on your personal taste for most of the people i've talked to it's on pair with Sam&Max. Some found it slightly better, some slightly worse.
As for TTG's Sam&Max and so also for Ice Station Santa, it's enjoyable and good but just not awesome like some of the old adventures are. For example i've played Loom rather late, many years after it came out with a LucasArts gamepack and although it was so old, it had something which made it great and fascinating. And that's exactly what i'm missing in TTG's adventure episodes so far. Something which makes it really interesting, weird new ideas, great riddles (still no inventory puzzles), a more thrilling story or characters i do care more about. Just something which makes me shiver like Loom managed to.
Sam&Max is polished and aspects like the music are great but no matter how polished it is, it's missing those important edges and as there are veterans with TTG on board i'm asking myself why is this the case? Does it have to do with that making something great would drag too much ressources? Doesn't it fit into the episodic schedule? Did they forget about making something outstanding? Is it a lack of motivation because something good sells as well? Do they think it's on the same level? Do they try to but you just can't plan it? Is this about to come? ...
I mean with such members it somehow feels hard to believe to think of that they don't know how to do it or that they don't understand what some people (gamers as critics) are talking about.
Bringing it back to 201 i think that riddles like the portal ones are really nothing i do expect in a great adventure. You do one two things and whoops it's solved, Now to this another two times and you're through. This felt constructed to me and not nicely fitting into the game/story. I miss some longer riddles in between here which evlove with the current situation or the story. And and and
Depending on your personal taste for most of the people i've talked to it's on pair with Sam&Max. Some found it slightly better, some slightly worse.
No way...are you just trying to compare the humour in "Jack Keane" to "Sam&Max"? Or the game itself?
For the rest:Okay, I understand your point, but in the end, it all comes down to the personal taste. For me, and I played Sam&Max when it was released with no Voice Acting at all, the new Game is the best, modern Adventure to date. While for example "Grim Fandango" was great in Design, Flair etc. the Characters looked teribble and the Controls were horrible. Monkey Island 4 was a desaster! I'm so glad, Telltale made S&M and it went out beautyiful!
A perfect example for a bad german Adventure is "Geheimakte Tunguska". Good 2-D Graphics but a promising story going from awesome in the beginning to boring in the end. Lame humour + NO Sympathy for the characters.
The game in a whole. Finally i don't care this much about technical issues if the game is working. It's always a relief if that's nicely done but it's not in the main focus unless it turns into something really annoying.
I haven't following this thread, so I'm just jumping right in, as it is the thread about Ice Station Santa, isn't it?
Okay.
I liked it, because it probably was the first S&M adventure (or -any- adventure for that matter, since The Hobbit on my ZX Spectrum back in '83 ...) that I managed to complete without too much cheating
What I didn't quite like was the continuation of Season 1: Max still being president, the C.O.P.S. still being around, Lincoln's head. If it was only Sybil, Bosco and Jimmy Two-teeth, it'd be okay for me.
I also liked the 'Back to the future' paradox
with Jimmy, as he was wearing the boxing glove that he lost in the past, but was given back to him from the present time in the past... you know what I mean..!
No way...are you just trying to compare the humour in "Jack Keane" to "Sam&Max"? Or the game itself?
For the rest:Okay, I understand your point, but in the end, it all comes down to the personal taste. For me, and I played Sam&Max when it was released with no Voice Acting at all, the new Game is the best, modern Adventure to date. While for example "Grim Fandango" was great in Design, Flair etc. the Characters looked teribble and the Controls were horrible. Monkey Island 4 was a desaster! I'm so glad, Telltale made S&M and it went out beautyiful!
A perfect example for a bad german Adventure is "Geheimakte Tunguska". Good 2-D Graphics but a promising story going from awesome in the beginning to boring in the end. Lame humour + NO Sympathy for the characters.
You dare to mock the great Grim Fandango?!? You shall pay!
Hear me, oh powers of Klatha and Mana;
Turn now Toothbrush Creepwood into species called rana!
I must agree about MI4 however. Never cared for like I love the first three.
I think everyone agrees the grim fandango control system was a hassle..
I don't. Sure it had its problems, but I still think it was a great idea by Schafer. The bugs could have been worked out with future games. Either way, it doesn't really bother me much every time I replay it through the game. And MI4's was even better than GF's, anyway.
I used to love Sam & Max. Back in the old "Hit the Road" days. But there's just not enough for me now to purchase any more games. I bought the very first game. Arr. It was kind of fun. And now, I just don't play computer games no more. The games just don't grab me anymore. Not even Sam & Max. It feels as though they lost their soul when they turned 3D. Like, a shadow of their former selves. Arr. Arr. Arr.
I used to love Sam & Max. Back in the old "Hit the Road" days. But there's just not enough for me now to purchase any more games. I bought the very first game. Arr. It was kind of fun. And now, I just don't play computer games no more. The games just don't grab me anymore. Not even Sam & Max. It feels as though they lost their soul when they turned 3D. Like, a shadow of their former selves. Arr. Arr. Arr.
I'd have to disagree there.
3-D has made a number of things possible that just weren't before.
You know what I think the real problem is? Around the same time things went 3-D, FPSs became popular. Insanely so, actually. Now, not only is the market is flooded with crappy licensed games based off of cookie cutter ideas (which it actually was before if you think about it; "Where's Waldo?" anyone?), you've also got FPS games made by lazy companies that knew they would make money off of it.
That's just my take, of course.
Just looking at games like Ratchet & Clank on the PlayStation shows that you can have soul within 3D. Plenty of other examples out there but that came into my mind first as a very soulful game, quite like the adventure games of old especially in its humour.
What I didn't quite like was the continuation of Season 1: Max still being president, the C.O.P.S. still being around, Lincoln's head. If it was only Sybil, Bosco and Jimmy Two-teeth, it'd be okay for me.
If there's one thing I hate more than shows that end with a Cliffhanger for next season, yet that season never materializes *cough*Berserk Anime*cough* is continuations of a property that completly sheds what happened previously. Just screams a lack of continuity/universe to me. While I'll admit the Soda Poppers weren't needed, but I loves me some C.O.P.S.. And the Abe Lincoln appearence means some character development for Sybil, which is a plus in my book too. (
Plus it gives her an exscuse to be out of her shop when it's thrown by the Kill-o-Tron
I noticed how the music video said Santa was put in Jail where the performance verison said he was killed. Guess it was an edit done to prevent the comp,lete traumaization of a child that happens to catch the video on TV. (lol Playing music videos on tv! a good one! ) But personally I think the trauma they would experience by saying santa was killed would be a drop in the hat compared to trauma caused by the REST of the video. >_>
I'm glad you liked my musical pick! Now, does this song keeps on playing in your head, just like Mika was playing in my head whenever I saw Hugh Bliss?
Maybe TTG should do a Machinima with this Yankovic song! (okay, I admit - Santa was possessed, not stressed with cheap whiskey on his breath) We already have some elves, the helpers could be the Soda Poppers...
I will have to agree with a few posts up that the change to 3-D made S&M loose some of its charm. I think the new S&M just looks TOOOOO good. to much out of the computer. the old version had some hand-drawn feeling, at least in the backgrounds which made it somehow superior to newer products.
like the old Tom&Jerry cartoons have artistic value, handpainted sets and such, but the new ones just looked generic. but all those complaints have been levelled for me by the top-notch writing and timing of the digital "puppets". and the soundtrack of course. that's one of the best game soundtracks ever. because it sounds like real music, not some temp "keep-the-tension" computer generated special effects choir.
Comments
Again, i have to agree with most of the reviews. I wouldn't give Sam&Max a 9 or 10 yet because it mostly lacks those magic moments which lifts it above the good ones. Graphics, sound animations, eveything is fine most of the time but i'm missing this with the puzzles, the story and some characters.
Jack Keane had a few situations were it shines this way. Also the cops in Sam&Max came up with that feeling or the setup in 201 but it's not a steady companion. I also don't see this as a problem of the past vs. present as you always laugh about a good joke or you always worship a great riddle or a great atmosphere. I think we're scratching but we're just not fully there.
@Jake
Sorry if i offended someone as this wasn't my intention, i'm just curious about the why.
Maniac Mansion is the best game ever, and Mojo's review is considered unacceptable by all carbon-based organisms, and Alex has since been physically injured. Expect to see a re-review of the game that isn't a shameful outrage sometime before 2025.
Jake, you know that's a death sentence.
Don't really care. I was arguing with terminology anyway.
IN all seriousness, did anyone catch the GameTap TV ad for Season 2? I heard it last night when I turned on my TV, but the damn picture didn't show until the title card came up. Stupid analog TV... then again, my HD Monitor on my computer does the same thing.
It was good fun for a while, but I think I'll go back to anticipating the old style full length games, opposed to episodic ones. I enjoy the higher production values of traditional releases. I'm still hopeful that maybe one day these TTG releases will reach such production values with this astonishing release rate.
Here's hoping for a great future,
Linque
That's the question, is it due to the episodic format or are the reasons somewhere else.
I don't really care to involve myself in a lenghty argument that much, but I can't just let this go either. played Grim Fandango for the first time this spring. It has plenty of problems: bad movement system, quite a bit of pointless back and forth running and a stupid item interface. But got sucked in the world, I laughed to a lot of the jokes and got engrossed by the story. I wanted to tell about some of the jokes to my friends and was genuinely moved near the end of the game. I also felt empty when I finished it. I absolutely fell in love with Glottis.
A month ago I stumbled upon a playthrough of Sam & Max Hit the Road on YouTube. It was late and I had work early in the morning, but I just couldn't stop watching the playthrough. The intro is so incredibly funny no matter how many times you watch it. The chemistry between S&M is incredible. It's good enough for me to enjoy myself when I just *watch someone play the game*. And here we get to the TTG S&M Series. It's not the same. It's not as mesmerising as the games of old. It's good, no doubt about it - especially if you play just one or two episodes. But it also has flaws that aren't just gameplay related, but are related to the storytelling and entertainment aspect of the game, if you understand what I mean.
What I wanted to say this in a nutshell is, that it isn't just nostalgia that makes the classic games so great in my (and others') mind. I find it disrespectful that people brush those games off saying 'oh, they were good back in the day..."
Yeah, and this reason is "Nostalgia"...;-)
I'm sorry to rain on your parade but "Jack Keane" sucked bad. Laughable atempt from Germans to make a game similar to Monkey Island with a Guybrush Threepwood Clone and even Monkeys on an Island. Plus the typical german Adventure-humour, I hate so much these days. Unfortunatly, Germany is in some sort of way the biggest market for Adventures these days and many Games come from Germany. But most of them suck, suck, suck. Don't try to even compare them to old LA-Classics. And Jack Keana is the perfect example why it doesn't work: They totally fail to copy the humour of old LA-Classics. It was embarassing to me playing Jack Keane. Just because there are no better games on the market, doesn't mean the actual games are similar to old classics.
Point being: Sam&Max is the only game today that caputres the old Adventure Game Spirit an no Jack Keane, Runaway or &/%$&/&( Benoit Sokal games will come close to this.
...there is no such thing as a typical german humour. anybody knows we have no humour at all.
I'm from germany, so you're right...^^
And that's why most "funny" games made in germany suck!
As for Jack Keane, yes they tried to deliver a Monkey Island like pirate game and with a few riddles they succeeded and showed those tiny little bit which makes something great and not just average or good. But in a whole it isn't as good as Monkey Island. I wouldn't say that it's like other german adventures beside of Ankh as those mostly go a different route, it's all about Deck13. I also wonder what this german humour is you're talking about. Nail this to certain developers/person and it does make sense, otherwise it more sounds like a rant. Depending on your personal taste for most of the people i've talked to it's on pair with Sam&Max. Some found it slightly better, some slightly worse.
As for TTG's Sam&Max and so also for Ice Station Santa, it's enjoyable and good but just not awesome like some of the old adventures are. For example i've played Loom rather late, many years after it came out with a LucasArts gamepack and although it was so old, it had something which made it great and fascinating. And that's exactly what i'm missing in TTG's adventure episodes so far. Something which makes it really interesting, weird new ideas, great riddles (still no inventory puzzles), a more thrilling story or characters i do care more about. Just something which makes me shiver like Loom managed to.
Sam&Max is polished and aspects like the music are great but no matter how polished it is, it's missing those important edges and as there are veterans with TTG on board i'm asking myself why is this the case? Does it have to do with that making something great would drag too much ressources? Doesn't it fit into the episodic schedule? Did they forget about making something outstanding? Is it a lack of motivation because something good sells as well? Do they think it's on the same level? Do they try to but you just can't plan it? Is this about to come? ...
I mean with such members it somehow feels hard to believe to think of that they don't know how to do it or that they don't understand what some people (gamers as critics) are talking about.
Bringing it back to 201 i think that riddles like the portal ones are really nothing i do expect in a great adventure. You do one two things and whoops it's solved, Now to this another two times and you're through. This felt constructed to me and not nicely fitting into the game/story. I miss some longer riddles in between here which evlove with the current situation or the story. And and and
...back to work.
No way...are you just trying to compare the humour in "Jack Keane" to "Sam&Max"? Or the game itself?
For the rest:Okay, I understand your point, but in the end, it all comes down to the personal taste. For me, and I played Sam&Max when it was released with no Voice Acting at all, the new Game is the best, modern Adventure to date. While for example "Grim Fandango" was great in Design, Flair etc. the Characters looked teribble and the Controls were horrible. Monkey Island 4 was a desaster! I'm so glad, Telltale made S&M and it went out beautyiful!
A perfect example for a bad german Adventure is "Geheimakte Tunguska". Good 2-D Graphics but a promising story going from awesome in the beginning to boring in the end. Lame humour + NO Sympathy for the characters.
Okay.
I liked it, because it probably was the first S&M adventure (or -any- adventure for that matter, since The Hobbit on my ZX Spectrum back in '83 ...) that I managed to complete without too much cheating
What I didn't quite like was the continuation of Season 1: Max still being president, the C.O.P.S. still being around, Lincoln's head. If it was only Sybil, Bosco and Jimmy Two-teeth, it'd be okay for me.
I also liked the 'Back to the future' paradox
The story was very funny, and I had this song of 'Weird' Al Yankovic playing in my head: 'The Night Santa Went Crazy':
Animation with gory* scenes: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tb-Mce9VpmY
Live performance of the "Extra gory* version": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7iKRAnJ6u3M
I hope the next episode will just be as enjoyable for me as this one
Marc
* 'Gory' to a 4 year old, not to S&M players
You dare to mock the great Grim Fandango?!? You shall pay!
Hear me, oh powers of Klatha and Mana;
Turn now Toothbrush Creepwood into species called rana!
I must agree about MI4 however. Never cared for like I love the first three.
I don't. Sure it had its problems, but I still think it was a great idea by Schafer. The bugs could have been worked out with future games. Either way, it doesn't really bother me much every time I replay it through the game. And MI4's was even better than GF's, anyway.
I used to love Sam & Max. Back in the old "Hit the Road" days. But there's just not enough for me now to purchase any more games. I bought the very first game. Arr. It was kind of fun. And now, I just don't play computer games no more. The games just don't grab me anymore. Not even Sam & Max. It feels as though they lost their soul when they turned 3D. Like, a shadow of their former selves. Arr. Arr. Arr.
3-D has made a number of things possible that just weren't before.
You know what I think the real problem is? Around the same time things went 3-D, FPSs became popular. Insanely so, actually. Now, not only is the market is flooded with crappy licensed games based off of cookie cutter ideas (which it actually was before if you think about it; "Where's Waldo?" anyone?), you've also got FPS games made by lazy companies that knew they would make money off of it.
That's just my take, of course.
If there's one thing I hate more than shows that end with a Cliffhanger for next season, yet that season never materializes *cough*Berserk Anime*cough* is continuations of a property that completly sheds what happened previously. Just screams a lack of continuity/universe to me. While I'll admit the Soda Poppers weren't needed, but I loves me some C.O.P.S.. And the Abe Lincoln appearence means some character development for Sybil, which is a plus in my book too. (
I noticed how the music video said Santa was put in Jail where the performance verison said he was killed.
Maybe TTG should do a Machinima with this Yankovic song! (okay, I admit - Santa was possessed, not stressed with cheap whiskey on his breath) We already have some elves, the helpers could be the Soda Poppers...
He's just kidding....
This was explained earlier. Its a planned hiatus between episode 201 and 202.
cool, I hope they get many strikes.
I doubt it, probably the director will write the shows.
like the old Tom&Jerry cartoons have artistic value, handpainted sets and such, but the new ones just looked generic. but all those complaints have been levelled for me by the top-notch writing and timing of the digital "puppets". and the soundtrack of course. that's one of the best game soundtracks ever. because it sounds like real music, not some temp "keep-the-tension" computer generated special effects choir.