Most of what I'd like to see has already been said. In general I'd like more time to develop on characters and variable relationships within a story arc that doesn't kill everyone off as an afterthought. Let me interact, let me care.
I completely agree without about determinant characters surviving. I hate how determinant status always equals a death sentence. I find that to be kind of lazy on TTG's part. This is a choice based game, after all, and the choices should make an actual difference to the progression of the story, rather than just shuffle around a few bits of dialogue.
Um, you do know that in episode 4, Kenny says essentially the same about Jane? He says no-one cares about her, no-one loves her, and that makes her nothing.
Also, you don't know she was trying to prove a point when you let him murder her. You let him murder her for, as we knew, losing a baby accidentally. He killed a woman for losing a baby accidentally.
I personally, stuck by Kenny.
I saw Jane as nothing but manipulative, selfish, and down-right crazy.
The way she berated and ridiculed K… moreenny in the truck, questioning him as a husband and father, was completely inappropriate and cruel.
I stuck up for Kenny again, like I had been doing the whole time.
And then Jane proved how crazy she was, when she was willing to kill Kenny, all just to prove some bullshit point!
I had stuck by Kenny ever since season 1.
And I stuck by him in season 2.
Jane proved what kind of person she was.
Completely self-centered!
Kenny is selfless.
When it game to going into Wellington, Kenny pleaded for them to take the kids, even if meant he stayed behind.
That's what I call a REAL man.
And one hell of a guy!
It was more a game with nice balance between letting you control the main character and had an illusion of being "less linear." Let's not forget that every character in that game was likable at least someway, even if they were total jerks or not. Also cast of characters you actually cared about somewhat was bigger and well developed. Pacing also was better.
With season 1 you could argue if it was truly a visual novel but season 2 made it clear that yeah, those are. This is not really a negative point that much but they went too deep with it by restricting the players even more.
Essentially season 2 has only four characters that are actually well developed when it comes to their backstories and stuff like that.
Clementine (Due Season 1)
Kenny (Due season 1)
Carver (The big bad of the season 2 and a well designed character)
Jane (Discount Molly and actually insane.)
Well for one thing, Jane was selfish, which she proved time and again.
And selfishness has no bounds.
No matter how much people may beg to differ, the TRUTH is that it doesn't.
I know cause I've seen it first hand!
And selfish-self-centered people, do in essence wind up as nothing.
So Kenny knew and understood that principle.
So his figuring that Jane Killed Alvy to save herself, was not entirely unrealistic.
Honestly, you'd be surprised what levels a selfish person will sink to, when their ass is on the line.
I've seen it, and it is truly appalling.
And anyone who would commit such a heinous crime, will of course deny it, and they'll try to be as convincing as possible, cause they know what the repercussions for their crime will be.
Um, you do know that in episode 4, Kenny says essentially the same about Jane? He says no-one cares about her, no-one loves her, and that ma… morekes her nothing.
Also, you don't know she was trying to prove a point when you let him murder her. You let him murder her for, as we knew, losing a baby accidentally. He killed a woman for losing a baby accidentally.
You do realise that every single thing she was doing throughout the episode is to protect Clem? Like she says she loses the baby to show that Kenny would be a danger for clem if she did the same. That's not selfishness.
Saving her from the ice water. That's not selfishness. Accepting Clem's offer to try to comfort the baby. That's not selfishness.
STAYING while Bonnie and Mike left, because of Clem? That is not selfishness.
I suppose you could argue she's selfish for Clem and no-one else, but Kenny only cares about the baby and determinantly Clem anyway.
Well for one thing, Jane was selfish, which she proved time and again.
And selfishness has no bounds.
No matter how much people may beg to… more differ, the TRUTH is that it doesn't.
I know cause I've seen it first hand!
And selfish-self-centered people, do in essence wind up as nothing.
So Kenny knew and understood that principle.
So his figuring that Jane Killed Alvy to save herself, was not entirely unrealistic.
Honestly, you'd be surprised what levels a selfish person will sink to, when their ass is on the line.
I've seen it, and it is truly appalling.
And anyone who would commit such a heinous crime, will of course deny it, and they'll try to be as convincing as possible, cause they know what the repercussions for their crime will be.
I don't know, I honestly think there won't be season 3 because of two reasons:
It would probably exceed comic book storyline
There are too many endings, and telltale usually doesn't do many different ending this one has 3 significant endings, maybe 4 and it would be SO much work making episode for people who chose Jane, and people who chose Kenny and People who chose AJ.
But she was dead-wrong about Kenny.
He proved what he was, when he begged that Clementine and AJ be allowed to stay in Wellington, even if he couldn't.
Yes, Kenny was angry, prone to be violent.
But you've got to remember how much he's been through.
He lost his family in Season 1; all in one day, and was on his own for a long time afterwards.
He was nearly beaten to death by Carver, which he endured to protect Clementine.
And then he lost Sarita; watching her die.
Losing someone close to you, can literally take years to get over.
I know that for a fact.
And there are some who never quite recover.
Now he had just lost Sarita a few days before the events of episode 5, and that's hardly enough time to recover.
So when he heard that something happened to Alvin Jr, it was to much, and he snapped.
And I can't really blame him!
But Kenny proved that he was STILL a good man.
How far he went to protect Clementine and the baby, and then his heartfelt plea on their behalf, proved what he was inside.
And Jane's antagonistic and disrespectful attitude, showed exactly what she was.
If she abandoned Clementine once, she'd do so again, given the right circumstances.
You heard her talk about how she felt when one person was in danger, and 5 guys died trying to save him.
She acted like that guy didn't matter.
She was not someone who would put her life on the line for someone else.
That's not how Lee acted.
He looked after everyone, even the one.
And he was willing to put his life on the line to save someone else.
And eventually gave his life to save Clementine.
Kenny also put his life on the line for Clementine.
And if necessary, wouldn't have hesitated to give it to protect them.
Really?
Returning to the group is selfish how?
You do realise that every single thing she was doing throughout the episode is to prote… morect Clem? Like she says she loses the baby to show that Kenny would be a danger for clem if she did the same. That's not selfishness.
Saving her from the ice water. That's not selfishness. Accepting Clem's offer to try to comfort the baby. That's not selfishness.
STAYING while Bonnie and Mike left, because of Clem? That is not selfishness.
I suppose you could argue she's selfish for Clem and no-one else, but Kenny only cares about the baby and determinantly Clem anyway.
I don't know, I honestly think there won't be season 3 because of two reasons:
* It would probably exceed comic book storyline
* The… morere are too many endings, and telltale usually doesn't do many different ending this one has 3 significant endings, maybe 4 and it would be SO much work making episode for people who chose Jane, and people who chose Kenny and People who chose AJ.
I really hope I'm wrong.
You said Jane is selfish. I was specifically talking about that idea.
REGARDLESS of whether you believe she was wrong about Kenny, the facts are that she still did it in an attempt to protect Clem. Regardless if you think she was wrong, she still did it because she thought it would help clem. Which isn't selfish.
For some reason, you're now talking about how Kenny's actions are amazing and he's a hero and the only true choice blah blah.
You wrote three paragraphs about how Kenny's actions were justifiable when I wasn't talking about that.
Please dignify me by responding to what I actually say, not what you thought I was going to say.
But she was dead-wrong about Kenny.
He proved what he was, when he begged that Clementine and AJ be allowed to stay in Wellington, even if … morehe couldn't.
Yes, Kenny was angry, prone to be violent.
But you've got to remember how much he's been through.
He lost his family in Season 1; all in one day, and was on his own for a long time afterwards.
He was nearly beaten to death by Carver, which he endured to protect Clementine.
And then he lost Sarita; watching her die.
Losing someone close to you, can literally take years to get over.
I know that for a fact.
And there are some who never quite recover.
Now he had just lost Sarita a few days before the events of episode 5, and that's hardly enough time to recover.
So when he heard that something happened to Alvin Jr, it was to much, and he snapped.
And I can't really blame him!
But Kenny proved that he was STILL a good man.
How far he went to protect Clementine and the baby, and … [view original content]
About Jane, her intentions may have been good, but her method was totally wrong.
Granted, she did do some good things, and did save Clementine's life.
I think it was how antagonized and berated Kenny in the truck, is what made me completely disgusted with her.
She didn't even stop to consider, that this poor man had just gone through a very severe mental and emotional trauma, and was in a very deep state of grief.
And then, when she started calling him a monster, and started questioning him as a husband and father; and saying his family was terrified of him, something she knew absolutely nothing about, that's what did it for me.
Her words whether she meant them or not were so cruel, cause basically what she was doing was abusing an emotional cripple, and I found her completely repugnant.
After that, I viewed her as nothing but selfish and self-centered.
And then, when Kenny and Clementine found Alvin alive, that clinched it for me.
And just on a personal note, I can totally empathize with Kenny, and his feeling angry all the time.
I suffered a series of very VERY deep personal losses several years back.
In my state of grief, I became very angry, all the time.
I mean the slightest thing would set me off into a rage!
And I remained that way for years.
Recently I've been able to regain my self-control, which I am so grateful for, cause now I have my life back.
And my family and friends are so happy cause of it.
So anyway, when she did that to Kenny in the truck, and since I understand and able to relate to where Kenny was coming from so well, that's why I have such a negative view of Jane.
Her actions, to me, just showed her to be both selfish and cruel.
You've completely ignored what my point was.
You said Jane is selfish. I was specifically talking about that idea.
REGARDLESS of wheth… moreer you believe she was wrong about Kenny, the facts are that she still did it in an attempt to protect Clem. Regardless if you think she was wrong, she still did it because she thought it would help clem. Which isn't selfish.
For some reason, you're now talking about how Kenny's actions are amazing and he's a hero and the only true choice blah blah.
You wrote three paragraphs about how Kenny's actions were justifiable when I wasn't talking about that.
Please dignify me by responding to what I actually say, not what you thought I was going to say.
Comments
Most of what I'd like to see has already been said. In general I'd like more time to develop on characters and variable relationships within a story arc that doesn't kill everyone off as an afterthought. Let me interact, let me care.
I completely agree without about determinant characters surviving. I hate how determinant status always equals a death sentence. I find that to be kind of lazy on TTG's part. This is a choice based game, after all, and the choices should make an actual difference to the progression of the story, rather than just shuffle around a few bits of dialogue.
Um, you do know that in episode 4, Kenny says essentially the same about Jane? He says no-one cares about her, no-one loves her, and that makes her nothing.
Also, you don't know she was trying to prove a point when you let him murder her. You let him murder her for, as we knew, losing a baby accidentally. He killed a woman for losing a baby accidentally.
I liked season 1 more overall.
It was more a game with nice balance between letting you control the main character and had an illusion of being "less linear." Let's not forget that every character in that game was likable at least someway, even if they were total jerks or not. Also cast of characters you actually cared about somewhat was bigger and well developed. Pacing also was better.
With season 1 you could argue if it was truly a visual novel but season 2 made it clear that yeah, those are. This is not really a negative point that much but they went too deep with it by restricting the players even more.
Essentially season 2 has only four characters that are actually well developed when it comes to their backstories and stuff like that.
Clementine (Due Season 1)
Kenny (Due season 1)
Carver (The big bad of the season 2 and a well designed character)
Jane (Discount Molly and actually insane.)
Well for one thing, Jane was selfish, which she proved time and again.
And selfishness has no bounds.
No matter how much people may beg to differ, the TRUTH is that it doesn't.
I know cause I've seen it first hand!
And selfish-self-centered people, do in essence wind up as nothing.
So Kenny knew and understood that principle.
So his figuring that Jane Killed Alvy to save herself, was not entirely unrealistic.
Honestly, you'd be surprised what levels a selfish person will sink to, when their ass is on the line.
I've seen it, and it is truly appalling.
And anyone who would commit such a heinous crime, will of course deny it, and they'll try to be as convincing as possible, cause they know what the repercussions for their crime will be.
Really?
Returning to the group is selfish how?
You do realise that every single thing she was doing throughout the episode is to protect Clem? Like she says she loses the baby to show that Kenny would be a danger for clem if she did the same. That's not selfishness.
Saving her from the ice water. That's not selfishness. Accepting Clem's offer to try to comfort the baby. That's not selfishness.
STAYING while Bonnie and Mike left, because of Clem? That is not selfishness.
I suppose you could argue she's selfish for Clem and no-one else, but Kenny only cares about the baby and determinantly Clem anyway.
I don't know, I honestly think there won't be season 3 because of two reasons:
It would probably exceed comic book storyline
There are too many endings, and telltale usually doesn't do many different ending this one has 3 significant endings, maybe 4 and it would be SO much work making episode for people who chose Jane, and people who chose Kenny and People who chose AJ.
I really hope I'm wrong.
But she was dead-wrong about Kenny.
He proved what he was, when he begged that Clementine and AJ be allowed to stay in Wellington, even if he couldn't.
Yes, Kenny was angry, prone to be violent.
But you've got to remember how much he's been through.
He lost his family in Season 1; all in one day, and was on his own for a long time afterwards.
He was nearly beaten to death by Carver, which he endured to protect Clementine.
And then he lost Sarita; watching her die.
Losing someone close to you, can literally take years to get over.
I know that for a fact.
And there are some who never quite recover.
Now he had just lost Sarita a few days before the events of episode 5, and that's hardly enough time to recover.
So when he heard that something happened to Alvin Jr, it was to much, and he snapped.
And I can't really blame him!
But Kenny proved that he was STILL a good man.
How far he went to protect Clementine and the baby, and then his heartfelt plea on their behalf, proved what he was inside.
And Jane's antagonistic and disrespectful attitude, showed exactly what she was.
If she abandoned Clementine once, she'd do so again, given the right circumstances.
You heard her talk about how she felt when one person was in danger, and 5 guys died trying to save him.
She acted like that guy didn't matter.
She was not someone who would put her life on the line for someone else.
That's not how Lee acted.
He looked after everyone, even the one.
And he was willing to put his life on the line to save someone else.
And eventually gave his life to save Clementine.
Kenny also put his life on the line for Clementine.
And if necessary, wouldn't have hesitated to give it to protect them.
They already confirmed season 3 a while ago
You've completely ignored what my point was.
You said Jane is selfish. I was specifically talking about that idea.
REGARDLESS of whether you believe she was wrong about Kenny, the facts are that she still did it in an attempt to protect Clem. Regardless if you think she was wrong, she still did it because she thought it would help clem. Which isn't selfish.
For some reason, you're now talking about how Kenny's actions are amazing and he's a hero and the only true choice blah blah.
You wrote three paragraphs about how Kenny's actions were justifiable when I wasn't talking about that.
Please dignify me by responding to what I actually say, not what you thought I was going to say.
Longer episodes
More hubs
Determinant characters can actually survive
No more or way less meaningless deaths
Please except my apology.
About Jane, her intentions may have been good, but her method was totally wrong.
Granted, she did do some good things, and did save Clementine's life.
I think it was how antagonized and berated Kenny in the truck, is what made me completely disgusted with her.
She didn't even stop to consider, that this poor man had just gone through a very severe mental and emotional trauma, and was in a very deep state of grief.
And then, when she started calling him a monster, and started questioning him as a husband and father; and saying his family was terrified of him, something she knew absolutely nothing about, that's what did it for me.
Her words whether she meant them or not were so cruel, cause basically what she was doing was abusing an emotional cripple, and I found her completely repugnant.
After that, I viewed her as nothing but selfish and self-centered.
And then, when Kenny and Clementine found Alvin alive, that clinched it for me.
And just on a personal note, I can totally empathize with Kenny, and his feeling angry all the time.
I suffered a series of very VERY deep personal losses several years back.
In my state of grief, I became very angry, all the time.
I mean the slightest thing would set me off into a rage!
And I remained that way for years.
Recently I've been able to regain my self-control, which I am so grateful for, cause now I have my life back.
And my family and friends are so happy cause of it.
So anyway, when she did that to Kenny in the truck, and since I understand and able to relate to where Kenny was coming from so well, that's why I have such a negative view of Jane.
Her actions, to me, just showed her to be both selfish and cruel.