Season 3 needs to be more like season 1
So I have mixed feelings about season 2, there was lots of action and I enjoyed the general plot of the story line, however there were 4 main issues I had with it which keep annoying me and led to me being disappointed in season 2:
Killing off of very unique characters in ridiculous ways (Luke)
Creating characters just to die ( Nick, Pete, Sarita, Walter etc) & ott killing of characters
Shit hitting the fan the moment clem turns up, think about it, as soon as Clem arrives in season 2 Pete, a survivor of the apocalypse for god-knows-how-long gets bit out of the blue and then carver turns up. A tab more realism and a more down to earth feel would be appreciated.
It felt much more restrictive in season 2 and I felt like I was often just watching a movie with a few quicktime events thrown in.
By saying I felt like I was watching the movie, in season 1 we get to explore and look around, speak to people and generally it felt much more down to earth and a more immersive experience. I can barely recall any moments in season 2 where we got to roam around in a similar way we got to on the farm in season 1.
Killing of characters was way over the top, Omid was killed ridiculously easily and his death felt cheap. They then get rid of Christa to free up slots fr new characters. What happens? At the end of season 2 everyone we meet is dead essentially, the only people who can definitely survive without being killed is Clem, AJ and Mike. Which is straight up stupid. The killing got so ridiculous I started to care less and less. As soon as Luke died I thought fuck it I'm done and didnt care from that point. Luke was a great character and had great potential to carry over ito season 3 being like Clems older brother, it would of been amazing to see them together taking down zombes similar to when they were at the bridge together in season 2, they easily could have written luke into the script at the end fight withou getting in the way, e.g. getting knocked unconscious by a falling shelf whilst laying on the floor resting his leg, when the fight broke out the shelf was knocked loose and fell onto Luke, pretty simple and effective, but still would have been a great addition to the story. Still had a lovely final scene, but I despise Jane so much, luckily I let Kenny stab her and had a great goodbye scene at Wellington, that was the best part of season 2, but I feel on the whole they need to get a bit more like season 1 with their writing style. Many characters acted weird sometimes and didnt fit their profile, unlike season 1 where you could tell the exact reaction you were gonna get from who. Many characters died in completely avoidable ways and even when we save one they die in a stupid way later.
Imo determinable characters need to stop, when a survivor is in a grapple with a zombie if you dont shoot the zombie someone else will, but if you shoot the zombie, you strengthen your relationship with the character and unlocks more dialog with him/her. I dont see why no-one else can ever save another member of the group and its always clem.
so to conclude season 3 should:
- Be writen more carefully, rather have a small group of 4 tight knit battle hardened survivors than 12 idiots
- More focus on character development opposed to character depletion
- Have more of a puzzle/explore feel to it similar to season 1
- Fewer determinable characters, if any, its a stupid concept because anyone with half a brain knows if they can die they will die, so whats the point in saving them? Either have them only able to die e.g. Pete or have them only be able to be saved e.g. if you dont shoot the zombie someone else does
- Just in general be similar to season 1. Season 1 was perfect for me and season 2 was just a "meh, it was pretty good" 7/10, I know tellale can do so much better.
Anyone agree or disagree? Any points you'd like to make? Let me know below!!
Comments
I would love to see a focus on friendship between NPs and how the world the way it is now affects that. Would it motivate them to stick together? Does their change in personalities alter their dynamic?
I liked the foundation that Telltale established with Nick and Luke in season two, where their different outlooks caused some tension in their relationship. Luke is the optimistic, "we can't give up", de-facto leader of his group while Nick struggles a lot internally. I would love to see them explore this type of thing more in season three - destruction of life-long relationships, rebuilding trust, or even the strengthening of their ties to the way they used to live and used to be. Maybe even fully letting go?
I miss how in season one you got to talk to people during hubs and take as long as you need. You got to choose which questions you would ask. In season two, you got little pieces of backstory during conversation. That can get a little tiring since you would have to replay the entire scene afterwards to catch other pieces of dialogue. Imagine if instead of cutting to five days later during the walk to the ski lodge, they set up camp for the night and you got to get to know them. Or maybe you could walk around the cabin and speak to people as they're all packing up to head out.
I loved season two. There were pro's for me and I liked the characters. I do wish it was handled a bit differently.
Yeah, I liked it but it just could have been that much better if they did it in the proper telltale fashion. I liked the luke and nick relationship, I remember Luke saying how they we friends before the apocalypse and they both set up a business together, ran it into the ground but they had fun. Thats why I'm so intensely bitter towards Telltale for striking off nick so quickly, which I've got over, but no Luke. Luke's death still boggles me, bonnie was stupid for going towards him, he is clearly able to get out and is taking his time. The overall naivety of characters is insane and it frustrates me so much how shitty a death Luke received. Damn. That luke death really has made me bitter maybe because i have a big brother and Luke just reminds me of that kind of caring and awesome relationship. They seemed like a great team, better than Clem and Jane because Jane is a loner whilst Clem survives together with others, Lees dying words are to tell her to find a group! But I don know how to get through to telltale that we need season 3 to be more like season 1. I also dont like the idea of the borderlands game they're making, i dont really think the multiple choice works well in those kinds of games, TWAU yes, but i didnt feel that emotional connection with characters, however the walking dead game is so unique, its perfect and I really wish they focused on that primarily or hire more staff..
I dont want telltale to become a jack of all trades, making average-good skyrim, borderlands, TWAU & TWD seasons, I would rather have them make KICKASS walking dead seasons with very good TWAU seasons. I dont see why they are expanding onto 2 more games at once. They dont seem to have the workforce considering they were just about churning out an episode every 2 months or so when they had only TWD and TWAU. I dont know if TWD season3 will be worth playing, they might be under a lot of pressure and it could be a swing and a miss due to stretched resources
definitely agree with you there. I was brainstorming an idea for the start of season 3 and was thinking about having all the Clem;s end up at wellington, when you go with jane she wanted to head to carvers and then go back up to wellington, so its possible!
Take a read of this thread i posted, if you have the patience to read it all the way through I think you'll like the idea I have for the start of it:
http://www.telltalegames.com/community/discussion/81869/brainstorming-season-3-start
I agree. I can understand Luke not talking about Nick very much after his passing since he's the type to internalize his grief and not talk to people about it (it's a common way to grieve, I get it), but why not give us hubs so we can learn about them before Nick died? There's a lot of ways they could have incorporated little touches of this. Maybe by looking at an object we would get Luke laughing about some dumb thing he and Nick did once upon a time. Or we could have talked to Nick after he and Luke had the argument on the bridge and got Nick to spill about how Luke is too hard on him sometimes. Ahhh, the potential. Their dynamic was interesting to me.
Luke reminds me of my brother too! As for the staff thing, they have separate teams working on each game. I think they tried out a lot of new things in season two, like the change of pace and wanting the game to appeal to people who play through one sitting, so they're just trying to see what works and is received best. I liked what they did in season one, though.
I think they didn't focus enough on the cabin group. Imo a better thing is to have a starting cast from Ep1 and whittle them down slowly so they all get character development like S1. In S2 they had a big group and killed them much too fast just to add new characters or shock value like Omid
totally. Hence why I said i'd rather have a small group of5 hardeed survivors. I mean wht its like a year or two since the outbreak? There should be no Bens anymore, they should all be strong individuals, so I feel that having about a group of 5 is ideal, because its a preciously small number, and if you lose someone it really matters, not only because the groups size will significantly be decreased and therefore the luxury of brushing a death off isnt there, but with a smaller group deeper character development is possible so the player can become closer attached to the character and at this point in the apocalypse they should all be expert survivors so I expect to see less ridiculous deaths such as Lukes where if Bonnie had just fucked off I'm positive he;d have survived
Season 2 was different from Season 1 and Season 2 was better in my opinion, so I think Season 3 shouldn't try to copy the other Seasons.
Nick came to be my favorite character in season 2 and the way he died infuriated me. I'm still fuming about it.
feel the same about luke tbh
Yeah. I'd like a couple of screwup characters on occasion like Nick because they're relatable but not as clumsy as Ben. It should also be harder to convince new people that we're friendly when we meet them, instead of just becoming best friends asap
Yeah, I like that in S1 the eps almost feel kind of standalone but continuous. In S2 and TWAU it's all one big overarching story so each hub or theme of each ep gets explored less. They seem less memorable unlike Hershel's farm, the Drug Store, St Johns, Crawford etc.
God I wish telltale wrote season 2 like season 1. I feel a bit like the wolf amonf us affected the walking dead, like the teams may have got a bit too focused on action opposed to character development and hubs. I just feel deflated after season 2 and straight up disappointed..
Just straight up disappointed in season 2, not going to lie, I feel deflated and almost sad how season 2 was a let down on the emotional rollercoaster of season 1. I got the Kenny ending and went into Wellington and left him, which I feel was just as sad as lee's passing, however I feel that end should have been compulsory tbh, it was the best ending and the choice you should get should be to stay with kenny or leave him. Just disappointed many players went with Jane and got a horribly sloppy ending, wish more got to experience the best bit of the season, the kenny ending. I feel actually a bit depressed about 2 things. Lukes death, oh my days it keeps repeating itself in my head and I just get straight up saddened by it an angry at Telltale for killing a unique character like Luke of with such stupidity from Bonnie or Clem, why would anyone ever go over and put more pressure on already cracked ice, he was clearly gonna get out of there alive if you were patient and just covered him and if Bonnie wasnt a tard.
Just why was it so....the way it was, why was it so just action action action opposed to the heart warming story of season 1..
The only thing I want them to return to is the consistency in writing. It felt like due the amount of other projects Season 2's story wasn't as coherent.
yeah, but consistency in writing covers everything I have a problem with, the killing of characters too early, not enough hubs, exploration or character development. I feel Telltale is expanding and losing the quality in their games. Season 1 was absolutely amazing, blown away and it was an immensely emotional and immersive experience, season 2 was like a 7/10 tops for me. It feels like it was relying on season 1's success, because if that was the first season of the walking dead game, it wouldnt have been anyway near as successful. I think the need to buck their ideas up and go back to the concepts behind season 1, otherwise they're soon gonna be doing the walking dead, one of the most unique games i've ever played and possibly ever play, justice & soon they'll be butchering the quality they once displayed in season 1
I don't mind the lack of hubs because this time they explored a different theme. Last Season had an overarching goal which drove the protagonists from city to city. This time the overarching goal was to survive and finding a place to stay. Moving from city to city wouldn't have made much sense in season 2.
At least in my opinion.
yeah i get what you're saying and respect it. But i dont think the addition of hubs would have been a bad idea, it just seemed a bit lazy. I know the idea was to survive, but there was never really a structured plan, in season 1 you had Lee and Kenny calling the shots and there was a structured sort of "we go here-here then here" in season 2 it was, we'll meet at this site here then decide what to do, then no-one ever really decided what to do, it was much more spur of the moment, whihc meant there was never really any leaders in the group as everyone was quit "wishy-washy" about where to go.
Personally I think season 2's writing was much more polished than season 1. If anything, it needs to be a mix between season 1 and season 2. More hubs like season 1 + the high quality writing of season 2.
Yeah, i know what you mean, season 2 introduced a lot of new ideas which i thought worked quite well, but I definitely feel they need to look back at season 1 to see why it was so effective, it was because of a few main things:
Killing off characters and having a big effect in doing so, it was effective and not over done like season 2
As for the writing in season 2 i do and dont agree with you, overall I thought it was sloppy because it was lazy in killing off characters. I feel that season 2 had better speaking, it felt much more natural, however, there was very minimal dialogue, showing why it needs to be combined with season 1, as season 1 had much more dialogue and felt more in depth and effective, you could hold much larger conversations with characters whilst in season 1 it wasnt the case.
They need these things:
To make use of unique and great characters e.g. Luke like season 1 did
Just my opinion but I feel season 2 did a lot wrong and could've been written much better. If season 3 needs anything its season 1 writing in my opinion
Yeah. I like S2 more than I did on replay, I suppose I like S1 better for all the reasons mentioned here, but it's nice to not feel like I need to examine several objects before the story continues in S2, I love that in S1, but S2 has a different kind of pace which is kind of nice, like it's easier to jump into for a speedy replay of an amazing story. With S1 I like to take longer on episodes because they're so atmospheric. Both have good and bad points. I agree TWAU seems to have affected TWDG, I love it but if Telltale want more GOTY awards, Sorry you're disappointed though ;/ I think they really kick ass with Ep5 of S2, best episode in ages
think they should focus on one game at a time, at least till they get a bigger budget and bigger team
It need's to be a mix of Season 1 and 2 with new stuff.