So there are no plans for fixing the game controler then?
Probably if a 360 or PSN port gets done. I was pulled on pretty late to get mouse controls going for MI, and there was no time to even think about getting the W&G hotspot selection stuff running.
MI branches from the Sam & Max scripts, and it doesn't really have much in common with the W&G scripts so porting tech from one to another takes some work.
Well, obviously i can't say from which version it branches but it sounds weird in a way that the menu scene clearly comes from Wallce&Grommit and not from Sam&Max.
Something i really don't get is, there has been so much talk about the controls and alone from this point it must have been obvious how important this aspect seems to be for quite some users, beside of the fact that the way you interact with a game generally is very important. Why does such a fundamental game aspects always gets done in the last minutes then? I don't care if i have depth of field in a game but the way i interact with a scene and characters is so cruical.
Take a look at how many steering setup options you normally get in other games. I don't need this many but there definatley should be better ones than those supported in Monkey Island right now.
I dunno when you'll head for a 360 port and from the statement i also didn't get if this will update the PC versions as well but i'm speaking not only for me here alone. I/we really really really would welcome a fix in the near future which at least enables the Wallace&Grommit steering in Monkey Island. The sooner, the better!
And for the mid/long term, if you don't find any magic trick, i don't see what could beat mouse point&click and a properly done game controller steering, leaving additional upcoming options like SONY's spaceballsticks or Microsoft's Natal aside.
I found it awkward and couldn't get used to it. Kept bumping into things or going completely the wrong way. I think maybe it's too sensitive; like, the size of the circle is too small, so that the slightest movement can end in calamity. Well, maybe not "calamity". I ended up using the keyboard for movement.
I'm calling this the Hula Hoop, after the visible circle around Guybrush's waist. Pretty weird looking, like testing a game in its early stages.
Then use one of the other 3 control mechanisms. I don't think TTG ever said ToMI Ep1 would support gamepads, did they?
Gampad was for W&G because it also came out on XBox. ToMI has to work with a Wiimote, hence the different control setup.
In my opinion it was quite clear that we get the Wallace&Grommit control or a slightly altered version of it plus a mouse steering X. Emily also once said (or another TTG person) that the version they showed at the E3 was steered with the Wallace&Grommit steering if i remember correctly. So they at least left the impression that you'll get one version of a controller steering.
The provided options don't work for me as they are worse than what we had in seasons released before and what you experience in other adventure games as well.
I found it awkward and couldn't get used to it. Kept bumping into things or going completely the wrong way. I think maybe it's too sensitive; like, the size of the circle is too small, so that the slightest movement can end in calamity. Well, maybe not "calamity". I ended up using the keyboard for movement.
I'm calling this the Hula Hoop, after the visible circle around Guybrush's waist. Pretty weird looking, like testing a game in its early stages.
The circle is somewhat distracting, in my opinion a simple arrow would be less distracting, especially one less visible, anyway, it took me 20 minutes to get entirely used to the drag control scheme. First it felt awkward, in the village it became ok, but after reaching the jungle it became quite natural, but I agree the sensitivity is something which should be adjusted somewhat it sort of triggers to intensive, not sure how to describe it, maybe I should fiddle with the general mouse sensitivity on os level.
Anyway, there is a third option you still can use the gamepad for movement, which was the superior method in Wallace and grommit, so gamepad for movement mouse in the other and for the pointer, sort of a reduced wiimote nunchuck setup, this is easier to grasp than both other methods and feels quite nice!
Curently I am constantly switching between pad controls and mouse dragging not sure which I will settle to, both have their merits and downsides. Mouse is nice because it is one handed, pad + mouse does not show the circle and is slightly more precise. I will try pad only also but I am rather sure that controlling the mouse pointer with the second stick will feel awkward. (One of the reasons why I am not so confident into the Monkey Island remake which seems to settle on the console side for controlling the cursor with an analog stick!)
Yeah the magic circle, this is so much nerdware. We have 3D for the cinematic aspect and dragging you more into the game but then you have some artificial steering help floating around you character.
Well, obviously i can't say from which version it branches but it sounds weird in a way that the menu scene clearly comes from Wallce&Grommit and not from Sam&Max.
The menu system actually starts from a common codebase which basically goes back to Bone. And, like most of Monkey, the menu codebase actually has more in common with Sam & Max (especially the Wii-era port) than with Wallace & Gromit. I did the artwork for the Sam & Max, Strong Bad, Wallace & Gromit, and Monkey Island* menus, in that order, which is why Monkey Island's menu looks and works similarly to Wallace & Gromit. The underlying code is not related.
* Ryan Jones did most of the actual drawn artwork on the Monkey menu, I just did the design and actually built it.
In my opinion it was quite clear that we get the Wallace&Grommit control or a slightly altered version of it plus a mouse steering X. Emily also once said (or another TTG person) that the version they showed at the E3 was steered with the Wallace&Grommit steering if i remember correctly.
It was actually the fans who kept insisting that we were using W&G controls when we said time and again that the game would not ship with the W&G controls. The E3 demo was using the game's "use the keyboard to walk and click with the mouse" setup, which is a fully supported way of playing the game on PC in Wallace & Gromit and Monkey Island, which is why people made too many assumptions on their own despite what we said. We didn't do a dual analog gamepad system for the game because the second target platform for this title is the Wii, not the Xbox. The Wii and the PC both share in common: a pointing device, and directional controls, so those are the elements we used when making the controls for the game.
As Robert said, if this really is a dealbreaker for you, you are welcome to write in and we'll return your money. I think you've made your position more than clear in this thread, though, and don't need to keep reiterating yourself.
Thanks a lot for the mouse controls. It's not as pleasant to use as point and click, but I really do appreciate having them there. I'm currently alternating between mouse and keyboard, mouse only, and mouse and controller. Still not sure which I prefer yet. However there is one thing I'd have liked to see. Character relative controls - so W moves forward, and A and D rotate. S could be turn and walk the other direction (as opposed to animating a backwards walk which would probably look out of place). Should be a simple thing to do, and it's beneficial because camera-relative is far less precise than anything else around, especially when the camera is locked off.
Proper gamepad support would have been appreciated, but I'm not too bothered by it. In fact, gamepad for movement in my left hand, chair turned to the left with my mouse in my right hand, and I'm almost in my traditional comfortable adventure-gaming position.
The control system works like a charm, no problem.
At first I was disappointed by the lack of joypad support (I got used to it after W&G), but the direct mouse control is ok.
It's even more confortable than classic point 'n' click in the jungle scenes, where you have to move Guybrush around a lot.
his small section before the opening credits acts as a tutorial and gives the player a feel for the “new” point-and-click control scheme. That’s right – no silly keyboardness here unless you want to, we get the option of a good old-fashioned mouse-based interface, and it works beautifully throughout.
It was actually the fans who kept insisting that we were using W&G controls when we said time and again that the game would not ship with the W&G controls. The E3 demo was using the game's "use the keyboard to walk and click with the mouse" setup, which is a fully supported way of playing the game on PC in Wallace & Gromit and Monkey Island, which is why people made too many assumptions on their own despite what we said. We didn't do a dual analog gamepad system for the game because the second target platform for this title is the Wii, not the Xbox. The Wii and the PC both share in common: a pointing device, and directional controls, so those are the elements we used when making the controls for the game.
As i wrote i'm not 100% sure but i was left with the impression, dunno if it was from the W&G or the MI control thread, that we'll see a W&G steering option in the exact or a slightly different version. If i'm wrong here then i suspect i left the thread before the change came up.
Anyway i also can remember that a) most people wanted mouse point&click and b) that more and more people, icluding me, also got used to the controll style of W&G. Only a minority was fine with the WASD steering option.
Now i don't know about the technical specifications of the telltale tool, still would love to see a feature about it on one season dvd for instance, but from what i read i thought of it as one tool which is enhanced with each iteration and which can publish to different platforms. This might be wrong and you have to think of it more as a pack of tools for each platform and were each one is in a different version state and offers a different featureset.
If it's the first then it shouldn't be a problem enabling gamepad support, right?
If it's the second, due to the importance, it should have been added to the tool you used for the development of Monkey Island. This is a milestone for both, us the gamers and you as a company and again i do not understand how you could come up with these steering options for such an important franchise so many adventure fans have been waiting for almost a decade. This is something i would have tried to get super smooth and invested a reasonable amount of time.
As Robert said, if this really is a dealbreaker for you, you are welcome to write in and we'll return your money. I think you've made your position more than clear in this thread, though, and don't need to keep reiterating yourself.
Thanks, but i'm currently fine with it as i just got Xpadder - not perfect but it does the job for now, still would love to see a fix from TTG -, thanks to werpu, and remapped the input to the controller. Let me just reiterate once again: I find it sad that i have to get a third party tool to get a somehow proper steering in a long awaited Monkey Island game.
A few glitches here, a little bit of stuttering there, sometimes texture resolution a bit too low, not this wisely choosen setups, no information on gfx settings, all these are tiny things i can life with but the steering is really important. This relaxed atmosphere is so much part of what makes adventure games so special.
If i got too harsh, i'm sorry, but i haven't selpt a lot this night and i really fell out of my socks when i first started it up and only felt after $?§&%!.
Btw can you tell how to activate the permanent movement option Dave was speaking about in another thread so that you don't need to press the mouse button all the time when you're walking?
i don't like the mouse controls, but maybe that's because my mouse speed's too fast
The mouse sensitivity is somewhat too high, especially on the narrow ship space, but it becomes better over time. For me the time I was reaching the jungle it already felt natural.
Anyway you can reduce the mouse sensitivity in windows give it a try it might improve the results!
Such a thing exists, but I got it working very late into development and so we didn't have time to make a good way of changing mosue control modes. Look for it in Ep 2, maybe.
Interesting, I didn't actually think this was possible (after the whole W&G discussion). If this comes to fruition, could it be added to an update for episode 1? Not having consistency between episodes in the end would be odd. Actually, I think I may have seen an error and a bug in LSN that would have to be fixed at some point, although I can't remember precisely where it occurred...
Personally, I wish S&M had been updated with mouse wheel clicking for inventory. That is so very nice to have.
I gotta say, after a few minutes I really dug the controls! I can see why the standard point&click system wouldn't have worked. And it is a vast improvement over the EMI controls. They really sucked in my opinion.
I am really thankful that we got the mouse only controls last minute.
I would have also preferred point&click, but since that was not possible it is a great compromise.
It took me some seconds to figure it out, and in the beginning i tried to P&C out of habit, but after that it worked quite well. I would have been sad if it hadn't been there.
Those who think it's awkward might not have tried it long enough to see how it's working. I was making false assumptions on that as well when I started, because i thought it was kind of like a steering wheel which you could turn left and right which created some confusion. Eventually it is good as it is.
Agreed Havent tried it yet, but its nice to have mouse only control. As long as the control is better than it was in EfMI. I tried replaying all the Monkey games again before this one, but stopped at EfMI. I will probably get the will to try it again while waiting for some of these episodes. But for now I am off to try this first episode Yipee.
Very nice to have mouse control added, it really shows you care about the fans Even though it is mouse n click, its still nice to be able to play with mouse only.
Comments
We certainly have no intention of keeping your money if you want a refund. Somebody in the support forum should be able to help you.
So there are no plans for fixing the game controller then?
Double-click + drag will make you run from the get go.
It's not broken.
Starting up Wallace&Grommit, it works.
Starting up Monkey Island, it doesn't.
Gampad was for W&G because it also came out on XBox. ToMI has to work with a Wiimote, hence the different control setup.
Probably if a 360 or PSN port gets done. I was pulled on pretty late to get mouse controls going for MI, and there was no time to even think about getting the W&G hotspot selection stuff running.
MI branches from the Sam & Max scripts, and it doesn't really have much in common with the W&G scripts so porting tech from one to another takes some work.
Something i really don't get is, there has been so much talk about the controls and alone from this point it must have been obvious how important this aspect seems to be for quite some users, beside of the fact that the way you interact with a game generally is very important. Why does such a fundamental game aspects always gets done in the last minutes then? I don't care if i have depth of field in a game but the way i interact with a scene and characters is so cruical.
Take a look at how many steering setup options you normally get in other games. I don't need this many but there definatley should be better ones than those supported in Monkey Island right now.
I dunno when you'll head for a 360 port and from the statement i also didn't get if this will update the PC versions as well but i'm speaking not only for me here alone. I/we really really really would welcome a fix in the near future which at least enables the Wallace&Grommit steering in Monkey Island. The sooner, the better!
And for the mid/long term, if you don't find any magic trick, i don't see what could beat mouse point&click and a properly done game controller steering, leaving additional upcoming options like SONY's spaceballsticks or Microsoft's Natal aside.
I'm calling this the Hula Hoop, after the visible circle around Guybrush's waist. Pretty weird looking, like testing a game in its early stages.
The provided options don't work for me as they are worse than what we had in seasons released before and what you experience in other adventure games as well.
The circle is somewhat distracting, in my opinion a simple arrow would be less distracting, especially one less visible, anyway, it took me 20 minutes to get entirely used to the drag control scheme. First it felt awkward, in the village it became ok, but after reaching the jungle it became quite natural, but I agree the sensitivity is something which should be adjusted somewhat it sort of triggers to intensive, not sure how to describe it, maybe I should fiddle with the general mouse sensitivity on os level.
Anyway, there is a third option you still can use the gamepad for movement, which was the superior method in Wallace and grommit, so gamepad for movement mouse in the other and for the pointer, sort of a reduced wiimote nunchuck setup, this is easier to grasp than both other methods and feels quite nice!
Curently I am constantly switching between pad controls and mouse dragging not sure which I will settle to, both have their merits and downsides. Mouse is nice because it is one handed, pad + mouse does not show the circle and is slightly more precise. I will try pad only also but I am rather sure that controlling the mouse pointer with the second stick will feel awkward. (One of the reasons why I am not so confident into the Monkey Island remake which seems to settle on the console side for controlling the cursor with an analog stick!)
The menu system actually starts from a common codebase which basically goes back to Bone. And, like most of Monkey, the menu codebase actually has more in common with Sam & Max (especially the Wii-era port) than with Wallace & Gromit. I did the artwork for the Sam & Max, Strong Bad, Wallace & Gromit, and Monkey Island* menus, in that order, which is why Monkey Island's menu looks and works similarly to Wallace & Gromit. The underlying code is not related.
* Ryan Jones did most of the actual drawn artwork on the Monkey menu, I just did the design and actually built it.
It was actually the fans who kept insisting that we were using W&G controls when we said time and again that the game would not ship with the W&G controls. The E3 demo was using the game's "use the keyboard to walk and click with the mouse" setup, which is a fully supported way of playing the game on PC in Wallace & Gromit and Monkey Island, which is why people made too many assumptions on their own despite what we said. We didn't do a dual analog gamepad system for the game because the second target platform for this title is the Wii, not the Xbox. The Wii and the PC both share in common: a pointing device, and directional controls, so those are the elements we used when making the controls for the game.
As Robert said, if this really is a dealbreaker for you, you are welcome to write in and we'll return your money. I think you've made your position more than clear in this thread, though, and don't need to keep reiterating yourself.
Thanks a lot for the mouse controls. It's not as pleasant to use as point and click, but I really do appreciate having them there. I'm currently alternating between mouse and keyboard, mouse only, and mouse and controller. Still not sure which I prefer yet. However there is one thing I'd have liked to see. Character relative controls - so W moves forward, and A and D rotate. S could be turn and walk the other direction (as opposed to animating a backwards walk which would probably look out of place). Should be a simple thing to do, and it's beneficial because camera-relative is far less precise than anything else around, especially when the camera is locked off.
Proper gamepad support would have been appreciated, but I'm not too bothered by it. In fact, gamepad for movement in my left hand, chair turned to the left with my mouse in my right hand, and I'm almost in my traditional comfortable adventure-gaming position.
At first I was disappointed by the lack of joypad support (I got used to it after W&G), but the direct mouse control is ok.
It's even more confortable than classic point 'n' click in the jungle scenes, where you have to move Guybrush around a lot.
I agree.
Anyway i also can remember that a) most people wanted mouse point&click and b) that more and more people, icluding me, also got used to the controll style of W&G. Only a minority was fine with the WASD steering option.
Now i don't know about the technical specifications of the telltale tool, still would love to see a feature about it on one season dvd for instance, but from what i read i thought of it as one tool which is enhanced with each iteration and which can publish to different platforms. This might be wrong and you have to think of it more as a pack of tools for each platform and were each one is in a different version state and offers a different featureset.
If it's the first then it shouldn't be a problem enabling gamepad support, right?
If it's the second, due to the importance, it should have been added to the tool you used for the development of Monkey Island. This is a milestone for both, us the gamers and you as a company and again i do not understand how you could come up with these steering options for such an important franchise so many adventure fans have been waiting for almost a decade. This is something i would have tried to get super smooth and invested a reasonable amount of time.
Thanks, but i'm currently fine with it as i just got Xpadder - not perfect but it does the job for now, still would love to see a fix from TTG -, thanks to werpu, and remapped the input to the controller. Let me just reiterate once again: I find it sad that i have to get a third party tool to get a somehow proper steering in a long awaited Monkey Island game.
A few glitches here, a little bit of stuttering there, sometimes texture resolution a bit too low, not this wisely choosen setups, no information on gfx settings, all these are tiny things i can life with but the steering is really important. This relaxed atmosphere is so much part of what makes adventure games so special.
If i got too harsh, i'm sorry, but i haven't selpt a lot this night and i really fell out of my socks when i first started it up and only felt after $?§&%!.
Btw can you tell how to activate the permanent movement option Dave was speaking about in another thread so that you don't need to press the mouse button all the time when you're walking?
The mouse sensitivity is somewhat too high, especially on the narrow ship space, but it becomes better over time. For me the time I was reaching the jungle it already felt natural.
Anyway you can reduce the mouse sensitivity in windows give it a try it might improve the results!
Interesting, I didn't actually think this was possible (after the whole W&G discussion). If this comes to fruition, could it be added to an update for episode 1? Not having consistency between episodes in the end would be odd. Actually, I think I may have seen an error and a bug in LSN that would have to be fixed at some point, although I can't remember precisely where it occurred...
Personally, I wish S&M had been updated with mouse wheel clicking for inventory. That is so very nice to have.
So good work here!
I would have also preferred point&click, but since that was not possible it is a great compromise.
It took me some seconds to figure it out, and in the beginning i tried to P&C out of habit, but after that it worked quite well. I would have been sad if it hadn't been there.
Those who think it's awkward might not have tried it long enough to see how it's working. I was making false assumptions on that as well when I started, because i thought it was kind of like a steering wheel which you could turn left and right which created some confusion. Eventually it is good as it is.
You are great Telltale for listening to us.
Very nice to have mouse control added, it really shows you care about the fans