The psychology of hatred -- reactions to Sarah
The general reaction to Sarah brings up some interesting points to me. There's really no reason to hate her at all, even to dislike her. With the exception of the 'pinky swear' thing, she didn't even do anything particularly unsettling, let alone morally objectionable. But somewhere in the mammalian midbrain, somewhere in the limbic system, people 'decide' to hate someone. And then, they leave their frontal cortex (the logical part of the brain) to flail around wildly in an attempt to rationalize their feelings, to make those feelings somehow logical, when they are really anything but.
==> But Sarah talked when Carver was talking!
Ok, you're going to give her shit for not kissing the ass of a psychopath, you be my guest. But frankly, if that's truly your opinion, it says one hell of a lot more about your character (or the lack thereof) than it does about Sarah. Crack a history book, check out what always happens when groups of people humor psychopathic leaders, and then get back to me. There are many reasons why human history is basically one long tale of war, exploitation, and bloodshed. Fear, cowardice, and the abhorrence of nonconformity are three of the biggest.
Congratulations, you're part of the problem. Bravo.
==>It was Sarah's fault that Carver threw Reggie off the roof!
Do you truly believe that a terrified and completely unarmed girl somehow "forced" a psychopath to murder a one-armed man? Why are you holding Sarah responsible for Carver's choices? Again, completely and utterly illogical.
==> Sarah freaked out when her father died!
So what? If you (especially as a teenager) saw your father shot and then chewed on by zombies right in front of you, wouldn't you? Assuming you don't have a serious personality disorder (ASPD), you'd freak out, too. So, we're going to blame her for not respecting a psychopath, and then we're going to blame her for not being one herself?
Damn, this is just getting better and better.... lol...
What I'm most curious about is this -- is this flailing about for thin justifications for one's inappropriate feelings a conscious psychological process, or is it largely an unconscious one? Put simply, are "Sarah haters" (for want of a better term) even aware of how completely irrational they are being, when they offer excuses like these for their attitudes? Are they that attached to their self-image as a good person, or at least a logical one, that they can't look at themselves (let alone Sarah) objectively, even for a moment?
And the real clinching irony of the entire process is the claim that she is autistic. A key hallmark of the autism spectrum is a deficit of empathy. So tell me... are "Sarah haters" truly seeing a deficit in Sarah, or are they seeing a deficit in themselves, one they're psychologically projecting onto Sarah?
Comments
This.
This.
I agree with this post. Honestly I never hated any character in The Walking Dead. Not even Nick during the first encounter with him from the first episode. The only one I really disliked was Ben, but I understood him. The reason I choose not to hate any of these characters except the villain because I see myself and some of my friends as these characters if placed in the same situation. People only want to look at the bad.
It's like working at a retail store. A customer will never remember a modest employee who found him or her merchandise that they couldn't possibly found themselves. They only remember when the employee forgot to serve a customer because he or she got sidetracked by something else.
That's the way I see it at least.
I don't hate Sarah, after episode 4, i tried so hard to save her, i feel numb when she died. Now i feel nothing for the character.
Beautifully said.
You're not crazy anymore, George.
TOO MUCH SCIENCE FOR MEH!!!! JK. I really agree with you on this. I don't understand why people hate Sarah.
Totally agree with everything.
I will always be crazy, PTSD is the way to be.
THIS! THIS IS BEAUTIFUL! Too bad only I could give you a single like, I would've given a 1000 likes! You deserve that much from me. :'D
EDIT: Fixed it up a bit. Don't you just love it when the keyboard stalls in your typing? lol
Greg Miller does strike me as autistic. Loud as fuck, doesn't know how to act nice in formal social situations, and has a very Chris-Channy appearance all around.
THIS IS SPARTA I mean great
I'm giving her s**t for pissing off a psychopath. We all knew how crazy Carver was, and if he says don't talk, I would try and shut up. there's a difference between kissing the ass of a psycopath and not attempting to anger him.
so, the tl;dr version is: "People that don't like Sarah have autism!"
Nice.
^THIS!
Yes, you'd allow your fear and cowardice to make you his compliant tool. The only time humoring such a person would be acceptable at all (from a logical standpoint or a moral one) would be if you were trying to lull him into a false sense of security, so you could get close enough to take him down.
The way I played Clem was fully with that aim in mind, but Kenny beat me to it.
kids do dumb things, they're kids.
It wasn't that I hated Sarah, I just wasn't connected to her. She was a liability. And I'm sorry, but for my Clementine, it was too risky to try and hope that she would ever get better. In the case of the trailer scene, my Clementine simply accepted that Sarah's time to go had come, there was no saving her whether she wanted to or not because Sarah didn't seem to want to. And yes, I realize that if my Clem didn't give up then there would have been something in Sarah that wanted to live, but the fact remains my Clementine did give up on her.
Most people hate her because Carver said "Tell that kid to stop talking or I will make you discipline her"
SO CLEMENTINE HOW R U?
WHY DID I GET SMACKED OW
This. It's something that the OP as well as a majority of these crusaders seem to not understand. It's not that people hated Sarah, it's that the way she was, and the events that happened to her, made her continually a liability. Yes, anyone would have freaked out if their dad died in front of them, I don't question that. But it happened to her, and she freaked out. Also listening instead of talking while dealing with a psychopath isn't kissing ass, it's called being intelligent and valuing the safety of you and your loved ones. As far as it being Sarah's fault that Reggie was killed, I doubt it. He wanted Reggie dead anyways, but I digress. It was just another drop in the bucket with bad things linked to her character.
For the record, I tried my best to help her throughout the series, and even got her out of the trailer just to die beneath a balcony.
Not necessarily. A deficit of empathy is seen in a number of different mental health conditions, not just autism. Narcissistic Personality Disorder is one. Antisocial Personality Disorder is another.
I daresay that most of them do not have these things, though. It's just dishonesty and irrationality .... a common, everyday sort of badness, and alas, "asshole" is not a formal diagnosis.
i didn't hate sarah but i didn't like her either, you don't have to like everybody, especially every fictional character.
plus you are talking bullsh*t not psycology, you can't just say words like "mammalian midbrain" or "frontal cortex" and pass off your opinions as fact, the truth is that she either did have some kind of mental disability or she is one of the worst examples of a girl stereotype the walking dead game has had, she was totally naive, she was basically the personification of the word "wimp", she let her emotions control her so much so that she almost died from being so scared and sad and she was overall helpless and a burden to the group.
so it is up to you to decide whether you like stereotypically weak female characters, or if you feel like she did have some kind of mental disability you have to decide whether that means you have to automatically like them else you are an ableist, or that a mental disability shouldn't define somebody and you can choose to like or dislike somebody based on their personality and not her disability
If you didn't hate Sarah, then the OP's post was directed to you. You'd have to have been living under a rock to not realize that there were and are plenty of people who aren't as reasonable as you and straight out thought that Sarah deserved a horrible death for no other reason than because she was "weak" or "annoying".
==>Sarah freaked out when her father died!
I also love how everyone seems to forget that Kenny freaked out and screamed just as loudly as Sarah did when he saw Sarita getting devoured. Double standards much?
She was sort of annoying. It's not her fault, really, but honestly who cares? The story of her character is hapless, but it doesn't take away from the fact that her character was the cause of all sorts of issues. People can sympathize with her, while at the same time being irritated and annoyed by how the events unfold due to her character
I was just responding to this part of your post. See, I'm fine with and completely understand why some people would dislike Sarah; she isn't exactly the definition of a capable survivor. But I'd think (or hope) that you'd at least agree that the several people who are very vocal about their belief that Sarah "deserved what she got" (and those people do exist) are being unreasonable.
There's a difference in obeying someone in order to survive and being a compliant tool. Sarah had no intention of trying to be some rebel.
I like Sarah but this angle is too contrived and is trying to cast her in some heroic light when her intents weren't anything heroic.
Carver is an angry man, giving them a second chance. He beat her dad to a pulp right infront of her and broke his fingers. The next day infront of a rally held by this same man who mercilessly maimed her father and determinant slapped Clementine for looking at him funny. And she spoke up about how her day was or something without kind of realizing that brutal man would punish her.
The social cue was not to anger Carver because they wanted to escape. They follow your logic of trying to lull him into a false sense of security. Why do you think everyone was sneaking around in the first place? Sarah's a sheltered girl who spoke at an extremely stupid moment for her to speak. And that's because she isn't accustomed to this violent kind of lifestyle.
Would that make everyone at that rally a compliant tool for not speaking up? Because they weren't oblivious to how dangerous Carver was, and that pacifying him gave them time to make a decisive escape/strike? I mean look at Carver. He shoots Walter, can torture or shoot Alvin, slap and use Clem as a hostage, tortures Carlos, and shrugs off a bullet wound to his shoulder. And he tracked them for days. This is all before Carver made Carlos slap Sarah, killed Reggie and nearly killed Kenny. And Carver could've been a rapist for all we know with Rebecca.
I'd rather tell Carver 'Fuck you', when I know I'm safe and alive. Not when he can determine if I'd die for speaking about how the weather was.
So you're okay with kids getting hit, that's cool. I'm sure you'd love to hit someone when they interrupt you.
I just don't like her but thats probably her fathers fault
she was always scared and couldn't do shit even though she was older then Clem (right?)
1) Oh, really? I have a degree in psychology, do you? Didn't think so.
2) Oh, so it's the "truth" that she had a mental disability or was just meant as a stereotype? Evidence, please?
3) Naivete and emotional immaturity are the usual outcomes, when a child has been prevented from striving for a healthy, age-appropriate autonomy by overprotective, overbearing parents. That is her father's fault, not hers, so why are you blaming her?
4) Again, her father got shot and was eaten in front of her, essentially forcing her to not only come to terms with his death, but also forcing her to come to terms with a world he had long denied her the right to face. Can you see why her freaking out was not only understandable, but (unless you have no understanding of human nature whatsoever) something you would even expect to happen?
5) A lot of people didn't like Ben and saw him as a liability. That's reasonable, considering he stole from the group and then lied about it, and also because of the deaths his actions caused. Who did Sarah cause to die? What did she steal? Who did she lie to? Nobody, nothing, and no one.
Thanks for providing a perfect example of what I was referring to though, in terms of irrational dislike trying to pass itself off as something it isn't.
Seems like people tend to be more comfortable with blaming women than men...
Sarah's actions, whatever the intent, did nothing to help the group whatsoever, so I don't get this angle of 'standing up to a psychopath'. It is better, as another poster said, to play along until you know where you are and what risks are worth taking.
1) bullsh*t
2) what do you mean? that game is proof, and i didn't say it was meant as a stereotype i said "or she is one of the worst examples of a girl stereotype the walking dead game has had" it is probably unintentionally a stereotype
3) i didn't blame anybody i just stated what she was
4) i didn't say it wasn't understandable (for her) i just stated it and said she almost died because of it
you're the one who has no understanding and you are just reading things that i didn't write to prove your point and actually you have a point about "seeing a deficit in themselves, one they're psychologically projecting onto" me
edit because you added it later
5)i liked bens personality, i don't like sarah's, and that is all i need to form an opinion on whether i like a fictional character or not
A hyper-emotional meltdown to a calm, thought-out response. Please calm down.
Anyone can have a degree in psychology on the internet. Just sayin'.
I personally enjoyed Sarah. She wasn't a bland character. She needed alot of work to survive in a zombie apocalypse, but i wanted Clem to be her guardian, her teacher. I really hoped it would end up that way, especially after Carlos died.
What i believe is the reason that people are hating on Sarah or disliking her, is because people aren't immersed in the game anymore. They don't see a scared teen, they see another character in a game that's going to cause problems, so lets be crude and just try to get rid of her, because its only a game. I felt totally disconnected myself when they just had to kill her off, and Nick. Because game mechanics... You were able to let her die once. So her death is unpreventable no matter what you do. Same with Nick. I didnt feel sad, or bad, or annoyed or even angry. The moment i chose to save her in that house, thats when i knew i wasnt going to be the teacher to her. People you save once are empty characters, just look at Nick. In season 1 this was handled alot better. Even Carley/Doug eventually dies, she/he still had character development throughout some episodes.
And its a sad thing. Choices don't matter. So why would we care about who lives and who dies? Why would people care about Sarah?
I hope choices will matter again in season 3.
yeah good one, say I'm sexist, that makes you win arguments
That was my initial reaction to Omid The Ruins - the deaths of the determinant characters felt like loose ends being written off, rather than scenarios with actual emotional resonance or plausibility.
Wasn't applying it to you, but you can go ahead if you want.
no emotion in that response, just refuting an inaccurate assessment of what i wrote