At the end of the day Kenny has Clem's and AJ's best interests in mind as he proved in Wellington when he sacrificed himself for them.
And to make this possible he messed up everything and caused the death of many ..
Wellington was my goal too. I've always supported Kenny on it. the plan was noble. But the way HE executed the plan, and how all things were falling apart because of his inability to cooperate with others. always pushing everyone so hard, being unnecessarily violent and aggressive, not giving heed to anyone but himself.. That was what made everything complicated and hazy in my opinion. and that was the moment I was no longer sure who Kenny was.
If you spare Kenny he reveals that he thought she purposefully left the baby behind or worse. Considering Jane's track record of ditching pe… moreople and open protest against the baby do you really fucking blame his assumption? As Kenny pointed out, at any moment she could have revealed the baby wasn't dead but she didn't, because she wanted a fight. I know she implied it was an accident but if she hypothetically did kill the baby to save her ass do you really think she would say so?
Jane brought a knife to a fist fight she provoked, she got what she deserved in my playthrough. At the end of the day Kenny has Clem's and AJ's best interests in mind as he proved in Wellington when he sacrificed himself for them.
Jane was always so mysterious. I never really knew what she wanted, even after watching all the endings. So I agree, she was absolutely the larger risk to Clementine.
Lee snapped and killed a man over infidelity, how could you not expect Kenny to react violently over something much much worse? As Kenny poi… morented out after, at any time she could have revealed the baby was alive but she didn't, because she was looking for a fight.
Give examples of how exactly he messed up?
By not trusting the Russians? He was right there.
By wanting to kill Arvo? He was right there again, Arvo's bullet could have easily been fatal and ended Clem. Letting him live after killing his entire group was stupid. Revenge was imminent.
Kenny was pushing the group hard to make sure the baby lived. While the rest of the group was busy bitching about him, he was fixing a truck to get them to Wellington faster.
At the end of the day Kenny has Clem's and AJ's best interests in mind as he proved in Wellington when he sacrificed himself for them.
… more
And to make this possible he messed up everything and caused the death of many ..
Wellington was my goal too. I've always supported Kenny on it. the plan was noble. But the way HE executed the plan, and how all things were falling apart because of his inability to cooperate with others. always pushing everyone so hard, being unnecessarily violent and aggressive, not giving heed to anyone but himself.. That was what made everything complicated and hazy in my opinion. and that was the moment I was no longer sure who Kenny was.
Jane wanted to show Kenny would kill first and ask questions later. He was too much like Carver at that point. I bet even if Jane revealed the baby was alive, Kenny would have killed her anyway.
If you spare Kenny he reveals that he thought she purposefully left the baby behind or worse. Considering Jane's track record of ditching pe… moreople and open protest against the baby do you really fucking blame his assumption? As Kenny pointed out, at any moment she could have revealed the baby wasn't dead but she didn't, because she wanted a fight. I know she implied it was an accident but if she hypothetically did kill the baby to save her ass do you really think she would say so?
Jane brought a knife to a fist fight she provoked, she got what she deserved in my playthrough. At the end of the day Kenny has Clem's and AJ's best interests in mind as he proved in Wellington when he sacrificed himself for them.
Oh I agree and was glad she did it. However it gave you peek at her true character. A conniving person who has no problems manipulating those around her to get what she wants. How the hell can you trust that?
Jane might not be cruel, but neither was Carver, at least to his mind. Both are the kind of people who think they have "figured it out" and … moreothers are just too weak or too stupid to understand how the world works now.
Carver was trying to prove this point to his community. Jane was trying to prove this point to Clem. Both where willing to kill people in order to do so.
While I really liked Jane throughout this episode, and really tried to get her to reconnect with people, the ending only showed that she did in fact not change, and still valued her way of doing things over the life of others. She would have killed Clem or the Baby without a second thought as soon as they'd become a liability, just as she'd have killed Kenny.
Now I won't argue that Kenny was a good leader, but he was a good person. At the end, he's literally the only person in the group besides Clem that has kept his moral compass and would do everything in his (although… [view original content]
Well excuse him for caring about the baby. Any parent would get pretty desperate if there were only a day's worth of food left for their baby and people acted like it wasn't a big deal.
Nah, I'll do what Kenny does...
Berate everyone who disagrees with me!
The Baby needs food
YOU DON'T GET TO TELL ME WHAT THE BABY N… moreEEDS!! YOU ARE STUPID, DUMB, AND STUPID. I DON'T TRUST YOU YOU PIECE OF SHIT
NOW COME HERE ALVIN JR YOU NEED SOME FOOD IN YA
-_-
Kenny was not becoming like Carver. The fact that despite everything that happened he still had no second thoughts about sacrificing his life for the kids proves that deep down he was always himself in the end.
Carver would have never, ever,ever done what Kenny did for AJ and Clem.
"I'm gonna put a bullet in you AND that baby before I let you escape again" - Carver at the end of EP3
Kenny would NEVER become the type of person to even consider saying something like that.
Kenny was becoming the new Carver. there is nothing more dangerous than that.
Kenny was the reason the group have been dismantled. everyo… morene was terrified of his impulsive and violent behavior, and rightly so. Jane made mistakes just like everyone else. but she would never do what Kenny did with Arvo. she already felt bad just for stealing his bag. And she was not the only person who warned Clem about the fact that Kenny was losing his sanity. ALL the group said it. Jane can lie? Yes. everyone can lie.. but not everyone manages to destroy the face of a man with a crowbar until the face becomes nothing but a ruin of flesh and bone.
I'm not saying Kenny was a bad person. I'm just saying that he would have to be stopped. for good.
She was purposely pulling his strings knowing full well that he was a broken man. She faced the consequences of her dumb actions, zero sympathies for the woman. After all, she did tell Clem to stay out of it.
Everyone has their limits and she knew what his was.
Jane wanted to show Kenny would kill first and ask questions later. He was too much like Carver at that point. I bet even if Jane revealed the baby was alive, Kenny would have killed her anyway.
Jane seemed to resemble cynicism while to me Kenny is more hopeful. For the record I like both characters. Though Jane abandoning the baby to try and get me to betray Kenny was downright peculiar.
If it's a choice between volcanic temper and staidness, I'll plump for the later.
Jane came to need Clementine the way Kenny needed AJ. What was it Luke said was the most important thing to people? Family.
Clementine perhaps felt like a successor to the sister Jane lost. I don't know whether that makes her more needy or dangerous or unpredictable than Kenny, but the last two episodes their relationship felt more warm and human than either of those Clementine had started and lost throughout Season 2.
Letting him live after killing his entire group was stupid. Revenge was imminent.
Arvo wasn't the spiteful and vindictive kind of person. of course. after what happened, he was hurt and angry inside. but he was no longer any threat to the group and even offered help guiding everyone to the lake house where there was food and a fireplace. the boy was completely helpless, and Kenny made the situation even worse when doubted his word about the fact that there was food in the house, and beat the shit of him. Jane brought the supplies just to confirm that he hadn't lied about it....
Kenny was pushing the group hard to make sure the baby lived. While the rest of the group was busy bitching about him
"..busy bitching about him." Really...?
Everyone was terrified about Kenny's unstable behavior. and going nuclear with everyone would never solve anything. Kenny was like a runaway train with no brakes heading straight to a cliff. it's was only a matter of time before everything explodes.
I'll tell you one thing. When a person speaks to you that something is wrong with another particular person, it can mean anything or nothing. yet you keep an eye on. but, when ALL people around you warn that there is something wrong with a particular person. means that there probably is something serious going on. if you refuse to see that anyway. you may well be considered an accomplice to whatever happens next.
he was fixing a truck to get them to Wellington faster.
Yes. he fixed the truck. and when all were debating the best destination for the common good of the group. what did he say? "- Since I fixed the car, you will go where I say you must go!"
What kind of selfish and arrogant attitude is this! Mike and Bonnie really betrayed the group? or they simply got tired of being around someone who doesn't listen to anyone but himself? Luke was the only reason the group was still together. after he died it fell apart quickly...
I'll say it again: Kenny was a good person. and I loved him! but he needed to be stopped. for good.
Give examples of how exactly he messed up?
By not trusting the Russians? He was right there.
By wanting to kill Arvo? He was right there a… moregain, Arvo's bullet could have easily been fatal and ended Clem. Letting him live after killing his entire group was stupid. Revenge was imminent.
Kenny was pushing the group hard to make sure the baby lived. While the rest of the group was busy bitching about him, he was fixing a truck to get them to Wellington faster.
Like I said already, Lee snapped and killed a man over infidelity but yet he was a great man who risked his life protecting Clementine. Why is it any different for Kenny? Keep in mind that the death of Sarita and the alleged death of the baby was all in the space of a week..
You know what - that is an excellent point. 0_0 I like that.
even if Jane revealed the baby was alive, Kenny would have killed her anyway.
True, though to be honest so would I. I think leaving a baby is just the same as killing it. Leaving it to die or killing it...not much difference. Though the fact telltale created a character that would cause so much debate among fans to me, proves how strong that character it. It is the mark of a good character. (both Kenny and Jane). I will definitely do two saves.
To me Kenny seemed to be too out of control and was dividing the group, instigating arguements, going downhill and wasn't open to new or better plans of where to go
You know, ironically - after all Jane talks about how she works better being alone - Kenny probably is too (or in a smaller group), they are both isolated at the camp fire and don't do well in groups. And argue and yell under pressure. Both their family perished horribly, but Kenny tried to protect his while Jane gave up...their roles could have been easily reversed (given their depression), Kenny is the optimist, while Jane is the cyanic. I wonder if they are more alike than people give them credit for?
Kenny was not becoming like Carver. The fact that despite everything that happened he still had no second thoughts about sacrificing his lif… moree for the kids proves that deep down he was always himself in the end.
Carver would have never, ever,ever done what Kenny did for AJ and Clem.
"I'm gonna put a bullet in you AND that baby before I let you escape again" - Carver at the end of EP3
Kenny would NEVER become the type of person to even consider saying something like that.
Jane is the worst kind of person in my opinion. Her level of manipulation to get the personal results she wants was very disturbing. Kenny was the best adult in Season 2 even with his flaws. Kinda messed up.
I wonder if TellTale thought Jane could become the new Carver? I mean her endings end up with you back in his camp. And this is right after she coldly picked a fight with Kenny which she KNEW would end up risking their lives. She tried to get Clem to leave Kenny behind stranded in the cold to starve and die after he fixed their truck. And she put a baby's life at risk so she could play her stupid fucking game.
You know - I wonder, maybe whoever you keep alive becomes the new Carver? Controlling and crazy, so Clem has to leave them? If they are both dead then Tavia (hope I spelt her name right) becomes the new Carver. A bit bittersweet, the one you saved is the new big bad. I think episode 2 was amazing, I definitely be up for more crazy dictator tribes.
Yeh I agree with you, she's one to watch for sure. The main difference between the 2 is that Jane eventually gives up on people, even her sister, to kenny that is an impossible thought process, he would die before letting a family member get eaten by zombies (Ben ring any bells?) and that was kenny saving someone he thought he hated.
Yeh I agree with you, she's one to watch for sure. The main difference between the 2 is that Jane eventually gives up on people, even her si… morester, to kenny that is an impossible thought process, he would die before letting a family member get eaten by zombies (Ben ring any bells?) and that was kenny saving someone he thought he hated.
there is no way "Kenny, Duck wouldn't want to see you this way." would have calmed him down.
there is a huge difference between being dangerous and being dangerous to clementine.
kenny was getting exponentially worse while jane gave up on her way of live, risked everything for clementine without gaining anything practical from it.
tell me what hidden agenda could she possible have? ending up with someone reliable to cover her back? if you make saint clementine choices all the time she is fully aware that you would be from a survivalist point of view just a burden.
In my playthrough I was nice to Arvo the whole way through, but yet he still shot Clem. A shot that could have very easily killed her. The only thing we know about Arvo is that he is a junkie liar who put the whole group in danger. Kenny was right, he should have been left behind because had Clem been standing one more foot to the left, the girl we spent all of season 1 protecting would be dead.
What kind of selfish and arrogant attitude is this! Mike and Bonnie really betrayed the group?
No, they 100% betrayed the group. They were going to leave AJ and Clem with no supplies and they ditched Clem when she got shot. How the fuck is that not betrayal? You do understand that if they went through with their plan, Jane, Kenny, AJ and Clem would most like be dead. Kenny was a stubborn fool but he put Clem and AJ's wellbeing ahead of his, as seen in Wellington. He was right about Wellington, just as he was right about most things.
Letting him live after killing his entire group was stupid. Revenge was imminent.
Arvo wasn't the spiteful and vindictive kind of pe… morerson. of course. after what happened, he was hurt and angry inside. but he was no longer any threat to the group and even offered help guiding everyone to the lake house where there was food and a fireplace. the boy was completely helpless, and Kenny made the situation even worse when doubted his word about the fact that there was food in the house, and beat the shit of him. Jane brought the supplies just to confirm that he hadn't lied about it....
Kenny was pushing the group hard to make sure the baby lived. While the rest of the group was busy bitching about him
"..busy bitching about him." Really...?
Everyone was terrified about Kenny's unstable behavior. and going nuclear with everyone would never solve anything. Kenny was like a runaway train with no brakes heading straight to a cl… [view original content]
Comments
And to make this possible he messed up everything and caused the death of many ..
Wellington was my goal too. I've always supported Kenny on it. the plan was noble. But the way HE executed the plan, and how all things were falling apart because of his inability to cooperate with others. always pushing everyone so hard, being unnecessarily violent and aggressive, not giving heed to anyone but himself.. That was what made everything complicated and hazy in my opinion. and that was the moment I was no longer sure who Kenny was.
Jane was always so mysterious. I never really knew what she wanted, even after watching all the endings. So I agree, she was absolutely the larger risk to Clementine.
He was about to kill her over an "accident"...
Give examples of how exactly he messed up?
By not trusting the Russians? He was right there.
By wanting to kill Arvo? He was right there again, Arvo's bullet could have easily been fatal and ended Clem. Letting him live after killing his entire group was stupid. Revenge was imminent.
Kenny was pushing the group hard to make sure the baby lived. While the rest of the group was busy bitching about him, he was fixing a truck to get them to Wellington faster.
Jane wanted to show Kenny would kill first and ask questions later. He was too much like Carver at that point. I bet even if Jane revealed the baby was alive, Kenny would have killed her anyway.
I let her die, and don't regret it one bit.
What if the baby would of been eaten in that car, where she left it. You don't leave a baby unattended. Jane never had a chance against kenny.
Well excuse him for caring about the baby. Any parent would get pretty desperate if there were only a day's worth of food left for their baby and people acted like it wasn't a big deal.
Kenny was not becoming like Carver. The fact that despite everything that happened he still had no second thoughts about sacrificing his life for the kids proves that deep down he was always himself in the end.
Carver would have never, ever,ever done what Kenny did for AJ and Clem.
"I'm gonna put a bullet in you AND that baby before I let you escape again" - Carver at the end of EP3
Kenny would NEVER become the type of person to even consider saying something like that.
She was purposely pulling his strings knowing full well that he was a broken man. She faced the consequences of her dumb actions, zero sympathies for the woman. After all, she did tell Clem to stay out of it.
Everyone has their limits and she knew what his was.
Jane seemed to resemble cynicism while to me Kenny is more hopeful. For the record I like both characters. Though Jane abandoning the baby to try and get me to betray Kenny was downright peculiar.
No, she proved that Kenny was the next Lily/Carver and Kenny agreed.
Not to mention hypothermia, which babies are especially prone to.
If it's a choice between volcanic temper and staidness, I'll plump for the later.
Jane came to need Clementine the way Kenny needed AJ. What was it Luke said was the most important thing to people? Family.
Clementine perhaps felt like a successor to the sister Jane lost. I don't know whether that makes her more needy or dangerous or unpredictable than Kenny, but the last two episodes their relationship felt more warm and human than either of those Clementine had started and lost throughout Season 2.
Arvo wasn't the spiteful and vindictive kind of person. of course. after what happened, he was hurt and angry inside. but he was no longer any threat to the group and even offered help guiding everyone to the lake house where there was food and a fireplace. the boy was completely helpless, and Kenny made the situation even worse when doubted his word about the fact that there was food in the house, and beat the shit of him. Jane brought the supplies just to confirm that he hadn't lied about it....
"..busy bitching about him." Really...?
Everyone was terrified about Kenny's unstable behavior. and going nuclear with everyone would never solve anything. Kenny was like a runaway train with no brakes heading straight to a cliff. it's was only a matter of time before everything explodes.
I'll tell you one thing. When a person speaks to you that something is wrong with another particular person, it can mean anything or nothing. yet you keep an eye on. but, when ALL people around you warn that there is something wrong with a particular person. means that there probably is something serious going on. if you refuse to see that anyway. you may well be considered an accomplice to whatever happens next.
Yes. he fixed the truck. and when all were debating the best destination for the common good of the group. what did he say? "- Since I fixed the car, you will go where I say you must go!"
What kind of selfish and arrogant attitude is this! Mike and Bonnie really betrayed the group? or they simply got tired of being around someone who doesn't listen to anyone but himself? Luke was the only reason the group was still together. after he died it fell apart quickly...
I'll say it again: Kenny was a good person. and I loved him! but he needed to be stopped. for good.
I agree with the OP 100%
so true LMAO.
You know what - that is an excellent point. 0_0 I like that.
True, though to be honest so would I. I think leaving a baby is just the same as killing it. Leaving it to die or killing it...not much difference. Though the fact telltale created a character that would cause so much debate among fans to me, proves how strong that character it. It is the mark of a good character. (both Kenny and Jane). I will definitely do two saves.
You know, ironically - after all Jane talks about how she works better being alone - Kenny probably is too (or in a smaller group), they are both isolated at the camp fire and don't do well in groups. And argue and yell under pressure. Both their family perished horribly, but Kenny tried to protect his while Jane gave up...their roles could have been easily reversed (given their depression), Kenny is the optimist, while Jane is the cyanic. I wonder if they are more alike than people give them credit for?
I think Kenny was going the way of Walter White. A good man who does really bad things. Whereas Carver had not morality left in him.
Jane is the worst kind of person in my opinion. Her level of manipulation to get the personal results she wants was very disturbing. Kenny was the best adult in Season 2 even with his flaws. Kinda messed up.
I wonder if TellTale thought Jane could become the new Carver? I mean her endings end up with you back in his camp. And this is right after she coldly picked a fight with Kenny which she KNEW would end up risking their lives. She tried to get Clem to leave Kenny behind stranded in the cold to starve and die after he fixed their truck. And she put a baby's life at risk so she could play her stupid fucking game.
Well, of course Jane is dangerous! I'm pretty sure she proved that from her first impression when she shot Troys junk off!
You know - I wonder, maybe whoever you keep alive becomes the new Carver? Controlling and crazy, so Clem has to leave them? If they are both dead then Tavia (hope I spelt her name right) becomes the new Carver. A bit bittersweet, the one you saved is the new big bad. I think episode 2 was amazing, I definitely be up for more crazy dictator tribes.
Yeh I agree with you, she's one to watch for sure. The main difference between the 2 is that Jane eventually gives up on people, even her sister, to kenny that is an impossible thought process, he would die before letting a family member get eaten by zombies (Ben ring any bells?) and that was kenny saving someone he thought he hated.
Kenny also did not hesitate to pull Arvo up from the ice.
there is no way "Kenny, Duck wouldn't want to see you this way." would have calmed him down.
there is a huge difference between being dangerous and being dangerous to clementine.
kenny was getting exponentially worse while jane gave up on her way of live, risked everything for clementine without gaining anything practical from it.
tell me what hidden agenda could she possible have? ending up with someone reliable to cover her back? if you make saint clementine choices all the time she is fully aware that you would be from a survivalist point of view just a burden.
In my playthrough I was nice to Arvo the whole way through, but yet he still shot Clem. A shot that could have very easily killed her. The only thing we know about Arvo is that he is a junkie liar who put the whole group in danger. Kenny was right, he should have been left behind because had Clem been standing one more foot to the left, the girl we spent all of season 1 protecting would be dead.
No, they 100% betrayed the group. They were going to leave AJ and Clem with no supplies and they ditched Clem when she got shot. How the fuck is that not betrayal? You do understand that if they went through with their plan, Jane, Kenny, AJ and Clem would most like be dead. Kenny was a stubborn fool but he put Clem and AJ's wellbeing ahead of his, as seen in Wellington. He was right about Wellington, just as he was right about most things.