Well, if you don´t have any idea, why did you think Wellington could be made out?
Why do people create any stories? I dont know widely covering answer to that.
Where? The only examples I can think, of this season, is the 'truck escape plan' and this scene.
Kenny shoots one of Carver's men, even though they have hostages.
After Walter gets shot, Kenny wants to keep shooting and Carver would just kill another hostage.
The truck scene. Alert the walkers and then waste time with Carver. Shooting Rebecca without warning if Clem doesnt do it. Beating Arvo instead of helping Clementine at the house. Plan to go north and putting others in impossible situation, which eventually leads into group splitting. Those are some i can think of.
You said that Kenny puts others in danger just for existing. Please, explain that.
I already did explain it.
She doesn´t say should. She says 'Why not Mike' or 'Why don´t you have it, Kenny?"
Except the dialogue option says "Mike should take it".
Why not?
Because Clementine isnt stupid and desperate? Atleast my Clementine isnt.
She did not even need to calm down to run to car, and show that AJ is alive.
I talk about not being defensive/offensive. If she would let her guard down, Kenny would just attack her right away.
Ah, ah, ah good one.
Oh, wait, you are serious?
If you have no proper counter-argument, theres no point leaving childish provocations.
Look at the video, if Kenny didnt rush at her, she couldnt have reached Kenny in any possible way from the ground.
He knew that Jane was unharmed, that AJ was dead and reached a reasonable conclusion based on those two facts. That´s being rational.
You clearly have no idea what rationality means, so there is no point to continue this part of the debate.
Why could she want to abandon Kenny, regardless of what she believes about him? Clem is not you, zykelator. She is just a little girl.
Because she is given an option to abandon Sarah, simply because she is a liability. Clementine can be selfish and cold if you choose to do so, but the writers kept fucking up with stuff like this.
And? I very much doubt he could have taken the gun for Clem, but even if that was a possibility, she is faster that Kenny and it could have taken him a few seconds, at least, to stand up. She probably could have reached the car already, so she could only have to open the door, showing that AJ is alive and well. Then, there could be no reason to continue the figth.
There is nothing to answer here. Too much speculation from both sides, lets drop it.
And what do you think Jane, as rational as she is, thougth it could happen after Kenny thinks she killed AJ? That Kenny is going to say 'Sure, you fucking babykiller, just leave me behind and take the one person I care about for me. Is not like I will mind or anything'?
Did you ever consider that Jane could have simply explained the situation to him, so Clem would have seen how irrational and crazy Kenny can be? This however didnt come possible, since the fight just escalated.
That was about that Jane intended to kill Kenny for the very beggining, not about if the figth was realisctic or not.
So because she knew Kenny might try to kill her, she was planning to kill him from very begining? Your logic makes no sense.
Said chances of survival, especially in walker infested place in a snowstorm, withouth supplies, maybe as well be zero. And Jane knew. She wanted to leave Kenny behind even thougth she knew it was as good as killing him. So she wanted to kill Kenny for the start.
Try to read my messages... I already said that they survived those 9 days in that weather. They didnt have car or supplies so there is nothing that would have prevented Kenny from surviving on his own. And again, she couldnt have possibly known what would have happened to Kenny if they left him there.
Yeah, thats the question. I have no idea.
Well, if you don´t have any idea, why did you think Wellington could be made out?
Th… moreis happens too often imo, thus the reason i want to leave him.
Where? The only examples I can think, of this season, is the 'truck escape plan' and this scene.
All the situations i have stated before.
What situations? The Arvo situation at the unfished house?
Oh? I wasnt talking about Arvo. I was talking about every possible situation where Kenny puts others in danger
I assume you mean the truck thing.
I have have already given my reasons for that.
gets them killed.
What?
Because he has gone through so much? His judgement is often clouded and all that.
You said that Kenny puts others in danger just for existing. Please, explain that.
Saying that Mike should have it after Kenny wants Clementine to have it is not refusal?
She d… [view original content]
But it is a obvious fact that Kenny deeply cared about Clementine and would do anything to protect her. This is proven in many scenarios throughout the entire game. He also made alot of mistakes and i don't blame you for not liking him.
Its irrelevant that he cares about Clementine, since he still puts her and others in danger/gets them killed anyway. His anger issues also cause him to ignore Clementine, which obviously isnt a good thing.
That being said, he had every right to believe that Jane either killed AJ, or left him behind to die so she can save her own life. I am a father in real life and if i would be Kenny in this situation, i would do far worse things to Jane, then Kenny did.
He had no rational reason to believe that Jane killed AJ, but as we have seen, Kenny isnt very rational person. So you are another idiot who believes that revenge is the way to go? Good for you. People like you should be put in jail, before you get a chance to hurt someone else.
Does this make me a bad person? No, obviously not.
Uhm... Yes it does. Lee murdered his wife and the senator and he goes to jail for it. Revenge isnt justified by todays standards.
Those this make Jane a bad person? Yes, it obviously does. She put the life of a innocent child in serious danger, just to prove a point.
First of all she didnt even put AJ's life in danger. Aj was outside for days and didnt freeze to death, so being alone in a car for some minutes doesnt put him in any greater risk of freezing to death. Walkers were too cold to move properly, so they werent a threat to him either. Cant really think of anything else that could have put AJ in threat.
You know, you should have just stayed away, since you cant make proper arguments for Kenny's defense.
You know, i am trying to avoid all this " Kenny vs Jane " threads as much as possible. But no matter where i go, i always see you posting so… moreme non relevant and illogical Posts and at this point i can not ignore this any longer.
Kenny was far away from being a saint, he was in fact a very flawed man. But it is a obvious fact that Kenny deeply cared about Clementine and would do anything to protect her. This is proven in many scenarios throughout the entire game. He also made alot of mistakes and i don't blame you for not liking him.
That being said, he had every right to believe that Jane either killed AJ, or left him behind to die so she can save her own life. I am a father in real life and if i would be Kenny in this situation, i would do far worse things to Jane, then Kenny did. Does this make me a bad person? No, obviously not. Those this make Jane a bad person? Yes, it obviously does. She put the life of a innocent child in serious … [view original content]
Why do people create any stories? I dont know widely covering answer to that.
No, that´s a bad question. Is more like:
Why could people create any stories in the ZA?
Kenny shoots one of Carver's men, even though they have hostages.After Walter gets shot, Kenny wants to keep shooting and Carver would just kill another hostage.
What was he supposed to do? Give himself out, get killed and leave the group with no defender?
The truck scene.
Why do you mention it again?
Alert the walkers and then waste time with Carver.
Eh, Kenny actually saved time. Who knows how long could they have argued about the morality how killing Carver?
Shooting Rebecca without warning if Clem doesnt do it.
He doesn´t speak Russian.
Beating Arvo instead of helping Clementine at the house.
Why do you mention it again?
. Plan to go north and putting others in impossible situation, which eventually leads into group splitting.
And how he was 'not thinking clearly' here, exactly?
Except the dialogue option says "Mike should take it".
And what does she actually say?
Because Clementine isnt stupid and desperate? Atleast my Clementine isnt.
You said that Kenny could have be just fine if Jane actually managed to leave him to die, because in the Wellington ending they survived just fine. And now you say that Kenny is stupid and desesperate for going to look for Wellington?
Sometimes, I don´t get you at all.
I talk about not being defensive/offensive. If she would let her guard down, Kenny would just attack her right away.
When Jane is trying to poke Kenny´s eyes out, and his on the ground, screaming in pain, she could have stood up and easily run to the car. Kenny could have taken time to stood up, and by time he could run behind her she could at least be halfway to the car. And, of course, Jane is faster that Kenny.
Look at the video, if Kenny didnt rush at her, she couldnt have reached Kenny in any possible way from the ground.
From the ground, no. But if Kenny did not rush at her, she could have stood up and try to kill him with the knife.
You clearly have no idea what rationality means, so there is no point to continue this part of the debate.
If you have no proper counter-argument, there is no point in leaving childish provocations.
Because she is given an option to abandon Sarah, simply because she is a liability.
Nope. Because she could die if she tried to save her and did not work.
Clementine can be selfish and cold if you choose to do so,
What? No.
There is nothing to answer here. Too much speculation from both sides, lets drop it.
There is a lot to answer there. Why did she not run to the car?
Answer: because she wanted Kenny dead.
Did you ever consider that Jane could have simply explained the situation to him, so Clem would have seen how irrational and crazy Kenny can be?
How about... no. If she wanted to explain anything, she could have done that at any moment.
So because she knew Kenny might try to kill her, she was planning to kill him from very begining? Your logic makes no sense.
Is not that. You know what I mean.
And what do you think Jane, as rational as she is, thougth it could happen after Kenny thinks she killed AJ? That Kenny is going to say 'Sure, you fucking babykiller, just leave me behind and take the one person I care about for me. Is not like I will mind or anything'?
She knew that if she put her plan in motion, there was no going back. One of them could die, one way or another.
Try to read my messages...
I do. You are the only one who doesn´t.
I already said that they survived those 9 days in that weather.
Yes. And?
They didnt have car or supplies
Objection! There is this thing calling scavanging.
so there is nothing that would have prevented Kenny from surviving on his own.
Apart for the cool and the walkers?
And again, she couldnt have possibly known what would have happened to Kenny if they left him there.
What? She knew that Kenny had to shoot, she saw walkers coming for where he had gone, she knew that he did not have supplies and no more weapon that a gun.
Of course she knew what could have happened to him.
Well, if you don´t have any idea, why did you think Wellington could be made out?
Why do people create any stories? I dont know wide… morely covering answer to that.
Where? The only examples I can think, of this season, is the 'truck escape plan' and this scene.
Kenny shoots one of Carver's men, even though they have hostages.
After Walter gets shot, Kenny wants to keep shooting and Carver would just kill another hostage.
The truck scene. Alert the walkers and then waste time with Carver. Shooting Rebecca without warning if Clem doesnt do it. Beating Arvo instead of helping Clementine at the house. Plan to go north and putting others in impossible situation, which eventually leads into group splitting. Those are some i can think of.
You said that Kenny puts others in danger just for existing. Please, explain that.
I already did explain it.
She doesn´t say should. She says 'Why not Mike' or 'Why don´t you … [view original content]
I actually didn't want to respond to you, because it obviously doesn't provide anything, but i am gonna do it either way because some of the arguments you just made are not only unlogical but also insulting.
Its irrelevant that he cares about Clementine, since he still puts her and others in danger/gets them killed anyway. His anger issues also cause him to ignore Clementine, which obviously isnt a good thing.
He did never put Clem in any kind of danger. He also never ignored Clem's opinion, she is in fact the only person that can convince him to do certain things differently.
He had no rational reason to believe that Jane killed AJ, but as we have seen, Kenny isnt very rational person. So you are another idiot who believes that revenge is the way to go? Good for you. People like you should be put in jail, before you get a chance to hurt someone else.
Jane literally said it herself that she killed AJ. She told him that it was an accident, but this simply is not possible. The only thing that could have possible happened is either Jane dieing to protect the baby, or leaving the baby behind to die so she can save herself. Calling me an idiot because i am sharing my opinion with you is very insulting and yes i would in fact try to kill you if you would have killed my innocent little baby.
People like you should be put in jail, before you get a chance to hurt someone else.
This is also very insulting. We don't know each other in real life and i am in fact a very friendly and rational person. I did never hurt anybody, but again this isn't part of the suspect. Of course i would/should be put in jail for killing a other person. But if this person just killed my innocent little baby, my behaviour would be understandable. But this is only a game, so there is no reason to discuss about this.
Uhm... Yes it does. Lee murdered his wife and the senator and he goes to jail for it. Revenge isnt justified by todays standards.
First of all, Lee didn't murder his wife. I am not sure which game you were playing. Secondly...there is a difference between someone cheating on you and someone killing your innocent little baby. But yes, Lee killed someone and this was obviously a horrible thing to do and he deserves to be in jail for it.
First of all she didnt even put AJ's life in danger. Aj was outside for days and didnt freeze to death, so being alone in a car for some minutes doesnt put him in any greater risk of freezing to death. Walkers were too cold to move properly, so they werent a threat to him either. Cant really think of anything else that could have put AJ in threat.
Yes, it does in fact put him in all sorts of serious danger. He could have been eaten alive by Walkers, frozen to death or just could have been forgotten there and starved to death. If AJ wouldn't have cried after the fight was over, Clem/Kenny wouldn't even have known that he was still alive.
But it is a obvious fact that Kenny deeply cared about Clementine and would do anything to protect her. This is proven in many scenarios thr… moreoughout the entire game. He also made alot of mistakes and i don't blame you for not liking him.
Its irrelevant that he cares about Clementine, since he still puts her and others in danger/gets them killed anyway. His anger issues also cause him to ignore Clementine, which obviously isnt a good thing.
That being said, he had every right to believe that Jane either killed AJ, or left him behind to die so she can save her own life. I am a father in real life and if i would be Kenny in this situation, i would do far worse things to Jane, then Kenny did.
He had no rational reason to believe that Jane killed AJ, but as we have seen, Kenny isnt very rational person. So you are another idiot who believes that revenge is the way to go? Good for you. People like you should be put in jail, bef… [view original content]
What was he supposed to do? Give himself out, get killed and leave the group with no defender?
Kenny did the only possible thing that would guarantee hostages would die. You cant honestly defend Kenny on this. Learn something about hostage situations.
Eh, Kenny actually saved time. Who knows how long could they have argued about the morality how killing Carver?
He was planning to kill Carver from very begining, but he first shot Carver's kneecaps off and eventually started bashing his corpse... He wasted a lot of time.
He doesn´t speak Russian.
Even the russians understanded that much english.
And how he was 'not thinking clearly' here, exactly?
Because he wanted to go north and forced others to betray him?
He was naive enough to believe people would just do as he says.
And what does she actually say?
"Kenny no. Mike should take it"
You said that Kenny could have be just fine if Jane actually managed to leave him to die, because in the Wellington ending they survived just fine. And now you say that Kenny is stupid and desesperate for going to look for Wellington?
Of course being there would have put his life at greater risk, but Wellington ending clearly shows that it was possible. The point is that i wouldnt take that kind of risk.
When Jane is trying to poke Kenny´s eyes out, and his on the ground, screaming in pain, she could have stood up and easily run to the car. Kenny could have taken time to stood up, and by time he could run behind her she could at least be halfway to the car. And, of course, Jane is faster that Kenny.
Too much speculation. They were in middle of fight with adrenaline pumping in their veins... You dont just stop and plan ahead.
But if Kenny did not rush at her, she could have stood up and try to kill him with the knife.
She could have threaten Kenny with the knife and talk some sense to Clementine to leave Kenny.
If you have no proper counter-argument, there is no point in leaving childish provocations.
Your childish behaviour is getting really annoying. More of that and i will just ignore you.
Nope. Because she could die if she tried to save her and did not work.
And she could have died by staying with Kenny (which she can acknowledge with the Carver comparison and other dialogues)
What? No.
Are you really that ignorant about the game?
Objection! There is this thing calling scavanging.
Funny. You are contradicting your own arguments.
Apart for the cool and the walkers?
Cold and frozen walkers, which they survived in Kenny & Clementine ending?
What? She knew that Kenny had to shoot, she saw walkers coming for where he had gone, she knew that he did not have supplies and no more weapon that a gun.
Of course she knew what could have happened to him.
Obviously she knew that Kenny dying alone was a possibility. They didnt have any supplies either, so whats the point of this argument?
How old are you? I'm just curios, because you seem very childish from time to time.
Why do people create any stories? I dont know widely covering answer to that.
No, that´s a bad question. Is more like:
Why could … morepeople create any stories in the ZA?
Kenny shoots one of Carver's men, even though they have hostages.After Walter gets shot, Kenny wants to keep shooting and Carver would just kill another hostage.
What was he supposed to do? Give himself out, get killed and leave the group with no defender?
The truck scene.
Why do you mention it again?
Alert the walkers and then waste time with Carver.
Eh, Kenny actually saved time. Who knows how long could they have argued about the morality how killing Carver?
Shooting Rebecca without warning if Clem doesnt do it.
He doesn´t speak Russian.
Beating Arvo instead of helping Clementine at the house.
Why do you mention it again?
. Plan to go north and putting others in impossible situation, which e… [view original content]
Oh? I can list them if you want. You should know what can happen/happens in the game before you start debating about it.
He also never ignored Clem's opinion, she is in fact the only person that can convince him to do certain things differently.
Then why did he force Clementine to take the Radio, even if she wanted Mike to have it? Why did he try to do that idiotic plan in the truck, even if Clementine didnt want any part of it and said its a bad plan? Why did he leave Clem in the walker herd, after what happened to Sarita? Why did he ignore Clementine, if she fell through the ice and she asks Kenny to help her getting warm? Why did he ignore Clementines opinion about where they should go with the car? And why did he drive to north after Clementine wakes up, even if she disagreed with Kenny's plan to go north? Why did he ignore Clementine's request to calm down and listen to Jane's explanation, after he got back inside?
Jane literally said it herself that she killed AJ.
First of all, misuse of word "literally" and she never stated that she killed AJ. All she said was "He's..." "i didnt kill him, it was an accident Kenny"
Calling me an idiot because i am sharing my opinion with you is very insulting and yes i would in fact try to kill you if you would have killed my innocent little baby.
Well there are plenty of crazy people in this world. If you are against murder, why on earth would you revenge a murder with murder?
This is also very insulting. We don't know each other in real life and i am in fact a very friendly and rational person.
Then dont give me reason to insult you. And i highly doubt that, considering what you have just written.
First of all, Lee didn't murder his wife.
His voice actor stated that, so im not sure what to believe anymore.
Secondly...there is a difference between someone cheating on you and someone killing your innocent little baby. But yes, Lee killed someone and this was obviously a horrible thing to do and he deserves to be in jail for it.
That is subjective. What if Lee cared about his wife as much as you care about your child? Is he not justified for as angry reaction as you are, for losing something which has equal meaning to him as your baby has to you?
He could have been eaten alive by Walkers
No. In previous scene, Clementine walks through walkers and even after shooting, they dont go after her. They were too cold to react. They only attack you if you go right next to them.
frozen to death
As i said before, he survived much longer period of cold temperatures and few minutes alone wouldnt harm him.
If AJ wouldn't have cried after the fight was over, Clem/Kenny wouldn't even have known that he was still alive.
I actually didn't want to respond to you, because it obviously doesn't provide anything, but i am gonna do it either way because some of the… more arguments you just made are not only unlogical but also insulting.
Its irrelevant that he cares about Clementine, since he still puts her and others in danger/gets them killed anyway. His anger issues also cause him to ignore Clementine, which obviously isnt a good thing.
He did never put Clem in any kind of danger. He also never ignored Clem's opinion, she is in fact the only person that can convince him to do certain things differently.
He had no rational reason to believe that Jane killed AJ, but as we have seen, Kenny isnt very rational person. So you are another idiot who believes that revenge is the way to go? Good for you. People like you should be put in jail, before you get a chance to hurt someone else.
Jane literally said it herself that she killed AJ. She told him … [view original content]
He did never put Clem in any kind of danger.
Oh? I can list them if you want. You should know what can happen/happens in the game be… morefore you start debating about it.
He also never ignored Clem's opinion, she is in fact the only person that can convince him to do certain things differently.
Then why did he force Clementine to take the Radio, even if she wanted Mike to have it? Why did he try to do that idiotic plan in the truck, even if Clementine didnt want any part of it and said its a bad plan? Why did he leave Clem in the walker herd, after what happened to Sarita? Why did he ignore Clementine, if she fell through the ice and she asks Kenny to help her getting warm? Why did he ignore Clementines opinion about where they should go with the car? And why did he drive to north after Clementine wakes up, even if she disagreed with Kenny's plan to go north? Why did he ignore Clementine's request to calm down and listen to … [view original content]
Kenny did the only possible thing that would guarantee hostages would die. You cant honestly defend Kenny on this. Learn something about hostage situations.
You can´t be possibly be comparing the Moonstar Loodge mess with a hostage situation. Yes, the Cabin Group and Moonstar Loodge group were taken as hostages, but Kenny nor anybody could have negociated with Carver. Shooting was the only option, because Kenny could not be sure he could not get killed if he gave himself out.
He was planning to kill Carver from very begining, but he first shot Carver's kneecaps off and eventually started bashing his corpse... He wasted a lot of time.
He wasted a minute.
And the Cabin Group could have wasted more.
Even the russians understanded that much english.
Oh, really? Why do they keep Arvo around as a traslator, then?
Because he wanted to go north and forced others to betray him? He was naive enough to believe people would just do as he says.
Nope. He wanted to convice the others in the morning. The morning just turned up to be too late.
"Kenny no. Mike should take it"
Well, we still have to consider the situation. What was Kenny supposed to do with the walkie, while Troy was looking at them? If he put the walkie on his pockets, there was a very big chance that Troy could see it. He could not give the walkie to Mike, since Troy could surely see it. So,really, the only option was Clementine.
Of course being there would have put his life at greater risk, but Wellington ending clearly shows that it was possible.
Well, possible doesn´t mean he could have survived. Leaving aside that if Clem actually leaved him being, he could kill himself, that Jane was willing to leave Kenny for death, despite that his chances of survival were not good at all, sure shows her intentions.
The point is that i wouldnt take that kind of risk.
Well, Howe´s was not any better.
Too much speculation.
Speculation? There is no speculation. The car was close enougth to be reached quickly. And Jane is faster that Kenny, especially because of his slashed stomach.
They were in middle of fight with adrenaline pumping in their veins... You dont just stop and plan ahead.
She had plenty of time to plan before that, and you mean to tell me she could not have planned on taking the first chance she got to end the figth, once she "proved" all she wanted to prove? She did not plan on that because her plan was to kill Kenny.
She could have threaten Kenny with the knife and talk some sense to Clementine to leave Kenny.
I don´t think so. She saw words did not work. That´s the whole reason she faked AJ death in the first place. The only thing she could have done, in that case, was go for the kill.
Your childish behaviour is getting really annoying. More of that and i will just ignore you.
You were being needlesly rude with me. Is that not being childish?
And she could have died by staying with Kenny (which she can acknowledge with the Carver comparison and other dialogues)
Examples?
Are you really that ignorant about the game?
Are you? When is she selfish and cold?
That you make a decisions because of these reasons doesn´t mean the character has the same reasons.
Funny. You are contradicting your own arguments.
Nope.
Cold and frozen walkers, which they survived in Kenny & Clementine ending?
Yes, they survived in the Kenny´s endings. And?
Obviously she knew that Kenny dying alone was a possibility. They didnt have any supplies either, so whats the point of this argument?
What was he supposed to do? Give himself out, get killed and leave the group with no defender?
Kenny did the only possible thing tha… moret would guarantee hostages would die. You cant honestly defend Kenny on this. Learn something about hostage situations.
Eh, Kenny actually saved time. Who knows how long could they have argued about the morality how killing Carver?
He was planning to kill Carver from very begining, but he first shot Carver's kneecaps off and eventually started bashing his corpse... He wasted a lot of time.
He doesn´t speak Russian.
Even the russians understanded that much english.
And how he was 'not thinking clearly' here, exactly?
Because he wanted to go north and forced others to betray him?
He was naive enough to believe people would just do as he says.
And what does she actually say?
"Kenny no. Mike should take it"
You said that Kenny could have be just f… [view original content]
You can´t be possibly be comparing the Moonstar Loodge mess with a hostage situation. Yes, the Cabin Group and Moonstar Loodge group were taken as hostages, but Kenny nor anybody could have negociated with Carver. Shooting was the only option, because Kenny could not be sure he could not get killed if he gave himself out.
You completely missed the point. Kenny did the only that that would guarantee that hostages would die. And yes, it was a hostage situation.
He wasted a minute.
2 minutes 40 seconds to be exact.
Oh, really? Why do they keep Arvo around as a traslator, then?
Because because he knows how to speak english best of them? Russians come to the town where i live all the time and pretty much everyone knows how to talk or at least understand english.
Nope. He wanted to convice the others in the morning. The morning just turned up to be too late.
They all thought that going to north was bad idea, because they would just freeze to death. There was no way that Kenny could convince them to go north. He didnt even have solid evidence to prove Wellington exists.
Well, we still have to consider the situation. What was Kenny supposed to do with the walkie, while Troy was looking at them? If he put the walkie on his pockets, there was a very big chance that Troy could see it. He could not give the walkie to Mike, since Troy could surely see it. So,really, the only option was Clementine.
There is nothing here to consider. If Kenny did as Clementine wanted, the radio would have gone to Mike. Mike was more concerned of Clementine's safety than Kenny in this situation and Mike had just met Clem. It also doesnt matter that Kenny knows that Clementine can get things done, because he still puts her in danger.
Well, possible doesn´t mean he could have survived. Leaving aside that if Clem actually leaved him being, he could kill himself, that Jane was willing to leave Kenny for death, despite that his chances of survival were not good at all, sure shows her intentions.
Jane didnt care about Kenny, so why would she care if Kenny dies? She knew very well that Kenny might not make it, but knowing the Wellington ending, it is shown to be possible. It wasnt as good as killing Kenny, just reducing his chances of survival.
Well, Howe´s was not any better.
Maybe not, but south was. If they had proper clothes and supplies, i wouldnt mind searching shit in the north. I actually love cold weather and snow.
Speculation? There is no speculation. The car was close enougth to be reached quickly. And Jane is faster that Kenny, especially because of his slashed stomach.
And i said, people are unable to plan ahead while fighting. Its pretty intense and you dont have time to think.
She had plenty of time to plan before that, and you mean to tell me she could not have planned on taking the first chance she got to end the figth, once she "proved" all she wanted to prove? She did not plan on that because her plan was to kill Kenny.
She could have convinced Clementine already after Kenny tried to punch her the first time. That moment her point was already proven, but as Kenny seemed to calm down, she put her knife away and Kenny attacked her.
I don´t think so. She saw words did not work. That´s the whole reason she faked AJ death in the first place. The only thing she could have done, in that case, was go for the kill.
Kenny attacked her without reason, she already proved her point. If Clementine was still too retarded (thanks writers) to see it, then she would have had to move on alone.
You were being needlesly rude with me. Is that not being childish?
You werent making any counter-arguments, you were just making fun out of my arguments. If you dont understand what is childish behaviour, then i dont see any reason to continue debating with you on any subject in this forum.
Examples?
I really cant bother to play 5th episode through again... Been doing that many times just to back up my arguments with dialogues or what happened in scenes. I'll work on the episode soon and add them to next reply.
When is she selfish and cold?
Havent played first 2 episodes for a while, but one of the choices was leaving the dog to suffer. One is ignoring Krista and not even trying to help her. Letting Kenny shoot more so Alvin dies also (ignoring the fact that there will be more casulties). Doing your own job and ignoring Sarah. Identify with Carver in the office (choosing to agree with Carver about everything). Watch Carver take a beating. Not helping Sarah in the herd. Leave Sarah to die (not saying anything to her). Dont make Jane help Sarah. Make Bonnie to open the door so they get the water. Dont try to save the baby in firefight. Shoot Arvo's sister and dont tell about reanimation (gg writers). Dont say anything to Kenny when walker is behind him. Dont shoot the walker when its on top of Kenny. Dont break the ice and let Luke & Bonnie drown. Dont make Kenny stop beating Arvo. There might be more, but those are the situation i can remember when Clementine can be cold, selfish or both at the same time. Looking forward to your reply.
Objection! There is this thing calling scavanging.
You said it was basically a death sentence to leave him behind without supplies (which they didnt have), but then you say "theres scavenging"
Why?
I suppose you dont even understand when you are being childish because you are just a kid. Well, most likely one day you look back and think how fucking stupid you were . No offense or anything, but kids are kids. If i would meet the 15 years old me, i would hate him.
Kenny did the only possible thing that would guarantee hostages would die. You cant honestly defend Kenny on this. Learn something about hos… moretage situations.
You can´t be possibly be comparing the Moonstar Loodge mess with a hostage situation. Yes, the Cabin Group and Moonstar Loodge group were taken as hostages, but Kenny nor anybody could have negociated with Carver. Shooting was the only option, because Kenny could not be sure he could not get killed if he gave himself out.
He was planning to kill Carver from very begining, but he first shot Carver's kneecaps off and eventually started bashing his corpse... He wasted a lot of time.
He wasted a minute.
And the Cabin Group could have wasted more.
Even the russians understanded that much english.
Oh, really? Why do they keep Arvo around as a traslator, then?
Because he wanted to go north and forced others to betray him? He was naive enough to belie… [view original content]
I don't like the terms "good person" or "bad person" because it's impossible to be entirely good to everyone or entirely bad to everyone. To some, you are a good person, while to others, you are a bad person.
No. I understand what you are saying. I just don´t agree.
Kenny did the only that that would guarantee that hostages would die.
Giving himself out was hardly a better alternative.
And yes, it was a hostage situation.
So what? Like I said, there was no way Kenny could have negotiated with Carver, and giving himself could have gotten him killed, and the group without a chance to escape Carver, so really had only one option: shoot.
2 minutes 40 seconds to be exact.
The point is that it was no that much time.
Because because he knows how to speak english best of them?
No. Buricko, Vitali and Nathasa did not know any English at all. They don´t understand any of what Clem´s group is saying. Only Arvo did.
They all thought that going to north was bad idea, because they would just freeze to death. There was no way that Kenny could convince them to go north. He didnt even have solid evidence to prove Wellington exists.
That´s not the point. You said that ‘he was naïve enough to think the others could blindly follow him’, and I said that nope, he wanted to convince the others, which contradicts what you say.
If Kenny did as Clementine wanted, the radio would have gone to Mike.
You are missing the point. Maybe Kenny could have given the radio to Mike, if Troy did not barge into the room, but at that point there was little choice. If Kenny put the radio on his pockets, Troy could have seen him. If he tried to give the radio to Mike, Troy could have see him. There was really only one option.
Mike was more concerned of Clementine's safety than Kenny in this situation and Mike had just met Clem.
Ah, no. He was just underestimating her. Once Clem delivers the radio, he stops having any protest to Clem doing something dangerous.
It also doesnt matter that Kenny knows that Clementine can get things done, because he still puts her in danger.
I never said that.
Jane didnt care about Kenny, so why would she care if Kenny dies?
That´s the point.
She knew very well that Kenny might not make it, but knowing the Wellington ending, it is shown to be possible.
Possible doesn´t mean likely.
It wasnt as good as killing Kenny, just reducing his chances of survival.
Really, really reducing them.
If they had proper clothes and supplies, i wouldnt mind searching shit in the north.
Yeah. I wish that could have been at option.
And i said, people are unable to plan ahead while fighting. Its pretty intense and you dont have time to think.
Before fighting, not while fighting.
That moment her point was already proven, but as Kenny seemed to calm down, she put her knife away and Kenny attacked her.
Jane(while she sheaths the knife): Don´t you come near me, you son of a bitch.
She is goading him into a fight, and nothing more.
And i said, people are unable to plan ahead while fighting. Its pretty intense and you dont have time to think.
Before fighting, not while fighting.
Kenny attacked her without reason,
AJ is dead and he had rather good reasons to think she had caused his dead.
she already proved her point. If Clementine was still too retarded (thanks writers) to see it, then she would have had to move on alone.
I disagree. But still, you really think that Jane could just left Clementine? Nah. Jane needs her.
You werent making any counter-arguments, you were just making fun out of my arguments. If you dont understand what is childish behaviour, then i dont see any reason to continue debating with you on any subject in this forum.
I do understand. I also understand that insulting someone, without reason at all, is rather childish.
was leaving the dog to suffer.
Same as the Lee situation. She could not bring himself to kill the dog, and nothing more.
One is ignoring Krista and not even trying to help her.
Fear.
Kenny shoot more so Alvin dies also (ignoring the fact that there will be more casulties).
Clem: We have to try!
Doing your own job and ignoring Sarah.
Fear.
Identify with Carver in the office (choosing to agree with Carver about everything).
I have always interpreted this scene as Clem agreeing with Carver out of fear of him.
Watch Carver take a beating.
Clem winces, and can´t bear to look while Kenny is smashing Carve´s face. By the end of it, when her facial expression changes, she is just holding her true feelings down.
Not helping Sarah in the herd.
What?
Leave Sarah to die (not saying anything to her).
If you chose the silent option, she seems unsure of what to say more that anything. At then the walkers come knocking, they are forced to make a hasty escape plan, and Sarah is still not moving. She doesn´t want to risk everyone´s life for Sarah, but is not like she did not regret her. Just look at Clem´s face when Sarah screams for Clementine as the walkers are eating her.
Dont make Jane help Sarah.
She recognizes Sarah is going to die, and doesn´t want to risk Jane´s life for nothing.
Make Bonnie to open the door so they get the water.
Uh, how is this selfish? Yeah, she could have done it herself, but seemed more bitter that anything.
Clem: That´s not funny. I don´t see why I always have to be the one to crawl into danger just because I am the smallest!
Dont try to save the baby in firefight.
Uh, honestly, I have no explanation for this. To me, that choice seems tacked on, for the sake of choice, and was rather out of character.
Shoot Arvo's sister and dont tell about reanimation (gg writers).
Well, I don´t see how this is a choice. But anyway, how was she supposed to know Arvo did not know about reanimation?
Dont say anything to Kenny when walker is behind him.
Watch her facial expression if you chose not to say anything. She seems choked up, to me.
Dont shoot the walker when its on top of Kenny.
Kenny is very close to the walker-she just fears missing the shoot and killing Kenny.
Dont break the ice and let Luke & Bonnie drown.
She was convinced by the others.
“Clementine, stop!”
“Its too late!”
Dont make Kenny stop beating Arvo.
Honestly, I don´t remember this scene very well. I will edit this part when I have the chance to play the game again.
You said it was basically a death sentence to leave him behind without supplies (which they didnt have), but then you say "theres scavenging"
You can´t be possibly be comparing the Moonstar Loodge mess with a hostage situation. Yes, the Cabin Group and Moonstar Loodge group were ta… moreken as hostages, but Kenny nor anybody could have negociated with Carver. Shooting was the only option, because Kenny could not be sure he could not get killed if he gave himself out.
You completely missed the point. Kenny did the only that that would guarantee that hostages would die. And yes, it was a hostage situation.
He wasted a minute.
2 minutes 40 seconds to be exact.
Oh, really? Why do they keep Arvo around as a traslator, then?
Because because he knows how to speak english best of them? Russians come to the town where i live all the time and pretty much everyone knows how to talk or at least understand english.
Nope. He wanted to convice the others in the morning. The morning just turned up to be too late.
They all thought that going to north was … [view original content]
Giving himself out was hardly a better alternative.
We didnt know that by then, but as we saw later, it would have been best solution from the start. Of course you cant predict how kidnappers act, but you NEVER start shooting them, if you cant get all of them at once.
The point is that it was no that much time.
Plenty of time considering it was a escape plan.
No. Buricko, Vitali and Nathasa did not know any English at all. They don´t understand any of what Clem´s group is saying. Only Arvo did.
Simple words like "walkers" is too advanced english for them? You overestimate the language barrier.
That´s not the point. You said that ‘he was naïve enough to think the others could blindly follow him’, and I said that nope, he wanted to convince the others, which contradicts what you say.
What i meant by this is that they wouldnt go to north with Kenny, but plot against him.
You are missing the point. Maybe Kenny could have given the radio to Mike, if Troy did not barge into the room, but at that point there was little choice. If Kenny put the radio on his pockets, Troy could have seen him. If he tried to give the radio to Mike, Troy could have see him. There was really only one option.
Why cant you admit that you are wrong? I already showed how you were wrong in the first place and now you just try to change the subject. If Kenny actually did as Clementine wanted, the radio would have gone to Mike. There is nothing to debate about this.
Ah, no. He was just underestimating her. Once Clem delivers the radio, he stops having any protest to Clem doing something dangerous.
So because she is capable to do things, its ok to put her at risk all the time? Next time the group is trying to make Clem do something, she almost dies (walker inside the little room). I disagreed with Bonnie's plan that Clem would go to that room, simply because it was stupid and suicidal and i was right.
That´s the point.
Well in that case, its pretty poor point.
Really, really reducing them.
Still not the same as killing.
Before fighting, not while fighting.
Kenny attacked her, if you forgot that. "get the fuck off" and all that...
AJ is dead and he had rather good reasons to think she had caused his dead.
I think what you are lacking here is rationality. How much information is required before making decisions. Kenny did not have any proper evidence, only assumption based on other assumptions on a person he didnt like.
I disagree. But still, you really think that Jane could just left Clementine? Nah. Jane needs her.
Both Kenny and Jane respect Clementine's decision in the end.
Same as the Lee situation. She could not bring himself to kill the dog, and nothing more.
Thats pretty harsh... Comparing Lee to some random dog she just met. Still, its a rather cold thing to do, no matter your reasons.
Fear.
Or just being selfish and keeping yourself safe?
Clem: We have to try!
The stupidest decision ever. Completely ignoring the fact that more people will die after that. Thats either being cold or being very stupid.
Fear.
Fear of what? As far as Clementine knew, there was nothing to fear.
I have always interpreted this scene as Clem agreeing with Carver out of fear of him.
Yet she sounds so sincere? And like Carver said, Clem feared Carver in the lodge, but she looked straight to his eyes, kept her nerve. Clem doesnt let fear to control her.
What?
After Carlos dies, Sarah starts panicking and you can decide to be quiet.
She doesn´t want to risk everyone´s life for Sarah, but is not like she did not regret her. Just look at Clem´s face when Sarah screams for Clementine as the walkers are eating her.
Doesnt change the fact that it was cold thing to do, even it was the most rational. Of course you cant keep straight face, when someone you knew is being eaten alive.
She recognizes Sarah is going to die, and doesn´t want to risk Jane´s life for nothing.
But i thought you Kenny fans are all about doing everything you can so save those who cant help themselves? I suppose you also agree with me on leaving AJ behind then?
"That´s not funny. I don´t see why I always have to be the one to crawl into danger just because I am the smallest!"
Seems like you dont understand what selfishness means. Bonnie asks you to help, you decline because you dont want to risk your life.
Uh, honestly, I have no explanation for this. To me, that choice seems tacked on, for the sake of choice, and was rather out of character.
Well considering that you have failed to recognize any of Clementine's selfish actions past 4 episodes, i think you are wrong once again.
Watch her facial expression if you chose not to say anything. She seems choked up, to me.
Why would she suddenly choke, after all she has gone through?
Kenny is very close to the walker-she just fears missing the shoot and killing Kenny.
Clementine is master marksman, did you not know? Molly, season 1, Crawford, Hatchet scene, Lee misses/takes too long, Clementine is with you.
She was convinced by the others.
“Clementine, stop!”
“Its too late!”
Yes, stopping was the most rational thing to do, but also the the warmest. She cared about Luke and not breaking the ice would lead to the death of Bonnie also.
Honestly, I don´t remember this scene very well. I will edit this part when I have the chance to play the game again.
If you dont say/do anything, Mike gives you a disappointed/angry look and pulls Kenny away. Seems like he expected you to look after Kenny, so he doesnt do anything stupid.
You completely missed the point.
No. I understand what you are saying. I just don´t agree.
Kenny did the only that that would … moreguarantee that hostages would die.
Giving himself out was hardly a better alternative.
And yes, it was a hostage situation.
So what? Like I said, there was no way Kenny could have negotiated with Carver, and giving himself could have gotten him killed, and the group without a chance to escape Carver, so really had only one option: shoot.
2 minutes 40 seconds to be exact.
The point is that it was no that much time.
Because because he knows how to speak english best of them?
No. Buricko, Vitali and Nathasa did not know any English at all. They don´t understand any of what Clem´s group is saying. Only Arvo did.
They all thought that going to north was bad idea, because they would just freeze to death. There was no way that Kenny could convince them to g… [view original content]
Comments
Why do people create any stories? I dont know widely covering answer to that.
Kenny shoots one of Carver's men, even though they have hostages.
After Walter gets shot, Kenny wants to keep shooting and Carver would just kill another hostage.
The truck scene. Alert the walkers and then waste time with Carver. Shooting Rebecca without warning if Clem doesnt do it. Beating Arvo instead of helping Clementine at the house. Plan to go north and putting others in impossible situation, which eventually leads into group splitting. Those are some i can think of.
I already did explain it.
Except the dialogue option says "Mike should take it".
Because Clementine isnt stupid and desperate? Atleast my Clementine isnt.
I talk about not being defensive/offensive. If she would let her guard down, Kenny would just attack her right away.
Oh, wait, you are serious?
If you have no proper counter-argument, theres no point leaving childish provocations.
Look at the video, if Kenny didnt rush at her, she couldnt have reached Kenny in any possible way from the ground.
You clearly have no idea what rationality means, so there is no point to continue this part of the debate.
Because she is given an option to abandon Sarah, simply because she is a liability. Clementine can be selfish and cold if you choose to do so, but the writers kept fucking up with stuff like this.
There is nothing to answer here. Too much speculation from both sides, lets drop it.
Did you ever consider that Jane could have simply explained the situation to him, so Clem would have seen how irrational and crazy Kenny can be? This however didnt come possible, since the fight just escalated.
So because she knew Kenny might try to kill her, she was planning to kill him from very begining? Your logic makes no sense.
Try to read my messages... I already said that they survived those 9 days in that weather. They didnt have car or supplies so there is nothing that would have prevented Kenny from surviving on his own. And again, she couldnt have possibly known what would have happened to Kenny if they left him there.
Its irrelevant that he cares about Clementine, since he still puts her and others in danger/gets them killed anyway. His anger issues also cause him to ignore Clementine, which obviously isnt a good thing.
He had no rational reason to believe that Jane killed AJ, but as we have seen, Kenny isnt very rational person. So you are another idiot who believes that revenge is the way to go? Good for you. People like you should be put in jail, before you get a chance to hurt someone else.
Uhm... Yes it does. Lee murdered his wife and the senator and he goes to jail for it. Revenge isnt justified by todays standards.
First of all she didnt even put AJ's life in danger. Aj was outside for days and didnt freeze to death, so being alone in a car for some minutes doesnt put him in any greater risk of freezing to death. Walkers were too cold to move properly, so they werent a threat to him either. Cant really think of anything else that could have put AJ in threat.
You know, you should have just stayed away, since you cant make proper arguments for Kenny's defense.
No, that´s a bad question. Is more like:
Why could people create any stories in the ZA?
What was he supposed to do? Give himself out, get killed and leave the group with no defender?
Why do you mention it again?
Eh, Kenny actually saved time. Who knows how long could they have argued about the morality how killing Carver?
He doesn´t speak Russian.
Why do you mention it again?
And how he was 'not thinking clearly' here, exactly?
And what does she actually say?
You said that Kenny could have be just fine if Jane actually managed to leave him to die, because in the Wellington ending they survived just fine. And now you say that Kenny is stupid and desesperate for going to look for Wellington?
Sometimes, I don´t get you at all.
When Jane is trying to poke Kenny´s eyes out, and his on the ground, screaming in pain, she could have stood up and easily run to the car. Kenny could have taken time to stood up, and by time he could run behind her she could at least be halfway to the car. And, of course, Jane is faster that Kenny.
From the ground, no. But if Kenny did not rush at her, she could have stood up and try to kill him with the knife.
If you have no proper counter-argument, there is no point in leaving childish provocations.
Nope. Because she could die if she tried to save her and did not work.
What? No.
There is a lot to answer there. Why did she not run to the car?
Answer: because she wanted Kenny dead.
How about... no. If she wanted to explain anything, she could have done that at any moment.
Is not that. You know what I mean.
And what do you think Jane, as rational as she is, thougth it could happen after Kenny thinks she killed AJ? That Kenny is going to say 'Sure, you fucking babykiller, just leave me behind and take the one person I care about for me. Is not like I will mind or anything'?
She knew that if she put her plan in motion, there was no going back. One of them could die, one way or another.
I do. You are the only one who doesn´t.
Yes. And?
Objection! There is this thing calling scavanging.
Apart for the cool and the walkers?
What? She knew that Kenny had to shoot, she saw walkers coming for where he had gone, she knew that he did not have supplies and no more weapon that a gun.
Of course she knew what could have happened to him.
Yes, and there are 117 uses of 'Jane' in this comment thread alone, and over 280 uses of 'Kenny'. Lel. No thanks.
I actually didn't want to respond to you, because it obviously doesn't provide anything, but i am gonna do it either way because some of the arguments you just made are not only unlogical but also insulting.
He did never put Clem in any kind of danger. He also never ignored Clem's opinion, she is in fact the only person that can convince him to do certain things differently.
Jane literally said it herself that she killed AJ. She told him that it was an accident, but this simply is not possible. The only thing that could have possible happened is either Jane dieing to protect the baby, or leaving the baby behind to die so she can save herself. Calling me an idiot because i am sharing my opinion with you is very insulting and yes i would in fact try to kill you if you would have killed my innocent little baby.
This is also very insulting. We don't know each other in real life and i am in fact a very friendly and rational person. I did never hurt anybody, but again this isn't part of the suspect. Of course i would/should be put in jail for killing a other person. But if this person just killed my innocent little baby, my behaviour would be understandable. But this is only a game, so there is no reason to discuss about this.
First of all, Lee didn't murder his wife. I am not sure which game you were playing. Secondly...there is a difference between someone cheating on you and someone killing your innocent little baby. But yes, Lee killed someone and this was obviously a horrible thing to do and he deserves to be in jail for it.
Yes, it does in fact put him in all sorts of serious danger. He could have been eaten alive by Walkers, frozen to death or just could have been forgotten there and starved to death. If AJ wouldn't have cried after the fight was over, Clem/Kenny wouldn't even have known that he was still alive.
Kenny did the only possible thing that would guarantee hostages would die. You cant honestly defend Kenny on this. Learn something about hostage situations.
He was planning to kill Carver from very begining, but he first shot Carver's kneecaps off and eventually started bashing his corpse... He wasted a lot of time.
Even the russians understanded that much english.
Because he wanted to go north and forced others to betray him?
He was naive enough to believe people would just do as he says.
"Kenny no. Mike should take it"
Of course being there would have put his life at greater risk, but Wellington ending clearly shows that it was possible. The point is that i wouldnt take that kind of risk.
Too much speculation. They were in middle of fight with adrenaline pumping in their veins... You dont just stop and plan ahead.
She could have threaten Kenny with the knife and talk some sense to Clementine to leave Kenny.
Your childish behaviour is getting really annoying. More of that and i will just ignore you.
And she could have died by staying with Kenny (which she can acknowledge with the Carver comparison and other dialogues)
Are you really that ignorant about the game?
Funny. You are contradicting your own arguments.
Cold and frozen walkers, which they survived in Kenny & Clementine ending?
Of course she knew what could have happened to him.
Obviously she knew that Kenny dying alone was a possibility. They didnt have any supplies either, so whats the point of this argument?
How old are you? I'm just curios, because you seem very childish from time to time.
Oh? I can list them if you want. You should know what can happen/happens in the game before you start debating about it.
Then why did he force Clementine to take the Radio, even if she wanted Mike to have it? Why did he try to do that idiotic plan in the truck, even if Clementine didnt want any part of it and said its a bad plan? Why did he leave Clem in the walker herd, after what happened to Sarita? Why did he ignore Clementine, if she fell through the ice and she asks Kenny to help her getting warm? Why did he ignore Clementines opinion about where they should go with the car? And why did he drive to north after Clementine wakes up, even if she disagreed with Kenny's plan to go north? Why did he ignore Clementine's request to calm down and listen to Jane's explanation, after he got back inside?
First of all, misuse of word "literally" and she never stated that she killed AJ. All she said was "He's..." "i didnt kill him, it was an accident Kenny"
Well there are plenty of crazy people in this world. If you are against murder, why on earth would you revenge a murder with murder?
Then dont give me reason to insult you. And i highly doubt that, considering what you have just written.
His voice actor stated that, so im not sure what to believe anymore.
That is subjective. What if Lee cared about his wife as much as you care about your child? Is he not justified for as angry reaction as you are, for losing something which has equal meaning to him as your baby has to you?
No. In previous scene, Clementine walks through walkers and even after shooting, they dont go after her. They were too cold to react. They only attack you if you go right next to them.
As i said before, he survived much longer period of cold temperatures and few minutes alone wouldnt harm him.
Jane clearly didnt think it would come to this.
Care to elaborate?
Carver, definitely.
I've been debating all day and i really cant bother to list my every reason. In short, Kenny put Clementine in danger with his very existance.
Jesus Christ, are you fucking kidding me?
I had to scroll for soooo long to get below this bickering trolololfest.
ha! my name is noah.
man fuck arvo i would shoot him 20 times! shooting a little girl, Thats low, but shooting clemycloo?! that bitch deserves to die.
man spiderman sucks go watch batman for a change
also you fogot jolene, st johns, vernon and his group, troy, natasha, duck, that walker who bit lee, lilly, ben, and the girl who killed omid.
and the bandits
You can´t be possibly be comparing the Moonstar Loodge mess with a hostage situation. Yes, the Cabin Group and Moonstar Loodge group were taken as hostages, but Kenny nor anybody could have negociated with Carver. Shooting was the only option, because Kenny could not be sure he could not get killed if he gave himself out.
He wasted a minute.
And the Cabin Group could have wasted more.
Oh, really? Why do they keep Arvo around as a traslator, then?
Nope. He wanted to convice the others in the morning. The morning just turned up to be too late.
Well, we still have to consider the situation. What was Kenny supposed to do with the walkie, while Troy was looking at them? If he put the walkie on his pockets, there was a very big chance that Troy could see it. He could not give the walkie to Mike, since Troy could surely see it. So,really, the only option was Clementine.
Well, possible doesn´t mean he could have survived. Leaving aside that if Clem actually leaved him being, he could kill himself, that Jane was willing to leave Kenny for death, despite that his chances of survival were not good at all, sure shows her intentions.
Well, Howe´s was not any better.
Speculation? There is no speculation. The car was close enougth to be reached quickly. And Jane is faster that Kenny, especially because of his slashed stomach.
She had plenty of time to plan before that, and you mean to tell me she could not have planned on taking the first chance she got to end the figth, once she "proved" all she wanted to prove? She did not plan on that because her plan was to kill Kenny.
I don´t think so. She saw words did not work. That´s the whole reason she faked AJ death in the first place. The only thing she could have done, in that case, was go for the kill.
You were being needlesly rude with me. Is that not being childish?
Examples?
Are you? When is she selfish and cold?
That you make a decisions because of these reasons doesn´t mean the character has the same reasons.
Nope.
Yes, they survived in the Kenny´s endings. And?
The point is that she was leaving Kenny to die.
Fifteen.
Why?
You completely missed the point. Kenny did the only that that would guarantee that hostages would die. And yes, it was a hostage situation.
2 minutes 40 seconds to be exact.
Because because he knows how to speak english best of them? Russians come to the town where i live all the time and pretty much everyone knows how to talk or at least understand english.
They all thought that going to north was bad idea, because they would just freeze to death. There was no way that Kenny could convince them to go north. He didnt even have solid evidence to prove Wellington exists.
There is nothing here to consider. If Kenny did as Clementine wanted, the radio would have gone to Mike. Mike was more concerned of Clementine's safety than Kenny in this situation and Mike had just met Clem. It also doesnt matter that Kenny knows that Clementine can get things done, because he still puts her in danger.
Jane didnt care about Kenny, so why would she care if Kenny dies? She knew very well that Kenny might not make it, but knowing the Wellington ending, it is shown to be possible. It wasnt as good as killing Kenny, just reducing his chances of survival.
Maybe not, but south was. If they had proper clothes and supplies, i wouldnt mind searching shit in the north. I actually love cold weather and snow.
And i said, people are unable to plan ahead while fighting. Its pretty intense and you dont have time to think.
She could have convinced Clementine already after Kenny tried to punch her the first time. That moment her point was already proven, but as Kenny seemed to calm down, she put her knife away and Kenny attacked her.
Kenny attacked her without reason, she already proved her point. If Clementine was still too retarded (thanks writers) to see it, then she would have had to move on alone.
You werent making any counter-arguments, you were just making fun out of my arguments. If you dont understand what is childish behaviour, then i dont see any reason to continue debating with you on any subject in this forum.
I really cant bother to play 5th episode through again... Been doing that many times just to back up my arguments with dialogues or what happened in scenes. I'll work on the episode soon and add them to next reply.
Havent played first 2 episodes for a while, but one of the choices was leaving the dog to suffer. One is ignoring Krista and not even trying to help her. Letting Kenny shoot more so Alvin dies also (ignoring the fact that there will be more casulties). Doing your own job and ignoring Sarah. Identify with Carver in the office (choosing to agree with Carver about everything). Watch Carver take a beating. Not helping Sarah in the herd. Leave Sarah to die (not saying anything to her). Dont make Jane help Sarah. Make Bonnie to open the door so they get the water. Dont try to save the baby in firefight. Shoot Arvo's sister and dont tell about reanimation (gg writers). Dont say anything to Kenny when walker is behind him. Dont shoot the walker when its on top of Kenny. Dont break the ice and let Luke & Bonnie drown. Dont make Kenny stop beating Arvo. There might be more, but those are the situation i can remember when Clementine can be cold, selfish or both at the same time. Looking forward to your reply.
You said it was basically a death sentence to leave him behind without supplies (which they didnt have), but then you say "theres scavenging"
I suppose you dont even understand when you are being childish because you are just a kid. Well, most likely one day you look back and think how fucking stupid you were
. No offense or anything, but kids are kids. If i would meet the 15 years old me, i would hate him.
Okay, that's not elaborating in anyway, but sure. I mean, I can't see your point at all, and 100% disagree with you, but sure.
Line them all up bar Nate and shoot them all through the head with one bullet.
I don't like the terms "good person" or "bad person" because it's impossible to be entirely good to everyone or entirely bad to everyone. To some, you are a good person, while to others, you are a bad person.
jane for sure. what a piece of shit
No. I understand what you are saying. I just don´t agree.
Giving himself out was hardly a better alternative.
So what? Like I said, there was no way Kenny could have negotiated with Carver, and giving himself could have gotten him killed, and the group without a chance to escape Carver, so really had only one option: shoot.
The point is that it was no that much time.
No. Buricko, Vitali and Nathasa did not know any English at all. They don´t understand any of what Clem´s group is saying. Only Arvo did.
That´s not the point. You said that ‘he was naïve enough to think the others could blindly follow him’, and I said that nope, he wanted to convince the others, which contradicts what you say.
You are missing the point. Maybe Kenny could have given the radio to Mike, if Troy did not barge into the room, but at that point there was little choice. If Kenny put the radio on his pockets, Troy could have seen him. If he tried to give the radio to Mike, Troy could have see him. There was really only one option.
Ah, no. He was just underestimating her. Once Clem delivers the radio, he stops having any protest to Clem doing something dangerous.
I never said that.
That´s the point.
Possible doesn´t mean likely.
Really, really reducing them.
Yeah. I wish that could have been at option.
Before fighting, not while fighting.
Jane(while she sheaths the knife): Don´t you come near me, you son of a bitch.
She is goading him into a fight, and nothing more.
Before fighting, not while fighting.
AJ is dead and he had rather good reasons to think she had caused his dead.
I disagree. But still, you really think that Jane could just left Clementine? Nah. Jane needs her.
I do understand. I also understand that insulting someone, without reason at all, is rather childish.
Same as the Lee situation. She could not bring himself to kill the dog, and nothing more.
Fear.
Clem: We have to try!
Fear.
I have always interpreted this scene as Clem agreeing with Carver out of fear of him.
Clem winces, and can´t bear to look while Kenny is smashing Carve´s face. By the end of it, when her facial expression changes, she is just holding her true feelings down.
What?
If you chose the silent option, she seems unsure of what to say more that anything. At then the walkers come knocking, they are forced to make a hasty escape plan, and Sarah is still not moving. She doesn´t want to risk everyone´s life for Sarah, but is not like she did not regret her. Just look at Clem´s face when Sarah screams for Clementine as the walkers are eating her.
She recognizes Sarah is going to die, and doesn´t want to risk Jane´s life for nothing.
Uh, how is this selfish? Yeah, she could have done it herself, but seemed more bitter that anything.
Clem: That´s not funny. I don´t see why I always have to be the one to crawl into danger just because I am the smallest!
Uh, honestly, I have no explanation for this. To me, that choice seems tacked on, for the sake of choice, and was rather out of character.
Well, I don´t see how this is a choice. But anyway, how was she supposed to know Arvo did not know about reanimation?
Watch her facial expression if you chose not to say anything. She seems choked up, to me.
Kenny is very close to the walker-she just fears missing the shoot and killing Kenny.
She was convinced by the others.
“Clementine, stop!”
“Its too late!”
Honestly, I don´t remember this scene very well. I will edit this part when I have the chance to play the game again.
Because you said ‘without a car or supplies’.
i would shoot kenny.
i see him as season 2's antagonist.
protecting the people around him and putting him out of his misery seems to me like the right thing to do.
For me it's a close tie between Arvo and the stranger.
We didnt know that by then, but as we saw later, it would have been best solution from the start. Of course you cant predict how kidnappers act, but you NEVER start shooting them, if you cant get all of them at once.
Plenty of time considering it was a escape plan.
Simple words like "walkers" is too advanced english for them? You overestimate the language barrier.
What i meant by this is that they wouldnt go to north with Kenny, but plot against him.
Why cant you admit that you are wrong? I already showed how you were wrong in the first place and now you just try to change the subject. If Kenny actually did as Clementine wanted, the radio would have gone to Mike. There is nothing to debate about this.
So because she is capable to do things, its ok to put her at risk all the time? Next time the group is trying to make Clem do something, she almost dies (walker inside the little room). I disagreed with Bonnie's plan that Clem would go to that room, simply because it was stupid and suicidal and i was right.
Well in that case, its pretty poor point.
Still not the same as killing.
Kenny attacked her, if you forgot that. "get the fuck off" and all that...
I think what you are lacking here is rationality. How much information is required before making decisions. Kenny did not have any proper evidence, only assumption based on other assumptions on a person he didnt like.
Both Kenny and Jane respect Clementine's decision in the end.
Thats pretty harsh... Comparing Lee to some random dog she just met. Still, its a rather cold thing to do, no matter your reasons.
Or just being selfish and keeping yourself safe?
The stupidest decision ever. Completely ignoring the fact that more people will die after that. Thats either being cold or being very stupid.
Fear of what? As far as Clementine knew, there was nothing to fear.
Yet she sounds so sincere? And like Carver said, Clem feared Carver in the lodge, but she looked straight to his eyes, kept her nerve. Clem doesnt let fear to control her.
After Carlos dies, Sarah starts panicking and you can decide to be quiet.
Doesnt change the fact that it was cold thing to do, even it was the most rational. Of course you cant keep straight face, when someone you knew is being eaten alive.
But i thought you Kenny fans are all about doing everything you can so save those who cant help themselves? I suppose you also agree with me on leaving AJ behind then?
Seems like you dont understand what selfishness means. Bonnie asks you to help, you decline because you dont want to risk your life.
Well considering that you have failed to recognize any of Clementine's selfish actions past 4 episodes, i think you are wrong once again.
Why would she suddenly choke, after all she has gone through?
Clementine is master marksman, did you not know? Molly, season 1, Crawford, Hatchet scene, Lee misses/takes too long, Clementine is with you.
“Clementine, stop!”
“Its too late!”
Yes, stopping was the most rational thing to do, but also the the warmest. She cared about Luke and not breaking the ice would lead to the death of Bonnie also.
If you dont say/do anything, Mike gives you a disappointed/angry look and pulls Kenny away. Seems like he expected you to look after Kenny, so he doesnt do anything stupid.
Stranger.
Fuck that guy, he got Lee bitten, took my Clemmy-cloo, and tricked her into thinking her parents were alive.
Motherfucker.
carver, jane, duck, duck, duck, duck, the stranger, duck and duck... did i mention duck?
i replayed S2 atcually, i really like and understand arvo now.
I don't consider Larry and Arvo like antagonists.
Arvo. Let him die. Wanted to kill him after the ambush, was sickened that I wasn't able to.