Am I missing something here with Kenny and Clem?
I see so many Kenny fans and some Season 2 fans claim that Clem and Kenny always had an emotional relationship in the first season. I do not really see that in any way shape or form, yes Kenny cares about Clem, but only in the way any rational person would care about a child in the apocalypse, but Kenny wasn't looking at Clem as his daughter in the first season, as Season 2 thinks. Kenny can even ditch Clem if you don't take his side 100% in episode 4 and this cannot be overlooked because it's a very important scene, if Kenny cared about Clem as much as Season 2 implies then he would've gone with Lee NO MATTER WHAT, and the fact there's no real indication that Kenny and Clem formed some kind of friendship in the first season after the three month time skip doesn't help matters, at least to me. I know I'm going to piss off alot of Kenny fans, but that really doesn't matter, because I simply was looking for solid, concrete evidence that Kenny and Clem were always pals in the first season, and I didn't see it.
EDIT: Season 2 does not count for emotional bonding because, it's written by people who thought Kenny and Clem were friends in the first season, SEASON 2 DOES NOT COUNT.
Comments
I agree. There isn't any evidence to suggest that they had an emotional relationship in season 1. Sure, Kenny cared for Clem, and I'm sure Clem cared for Kenny, but, thats about it.
If you need video evidence of Kenny playing with Clem back at the motor inn then you don't really understand how humans work. I bet you also forgot about Duck's and Katjaa's existence and their interactions with Clem.
Clem's super close relationship with Kenny is a key element of season 2. Yes, there does need to be strong evidence within the game to establish it. "They knew each other" is simply not enough when Kenny is such a polarizing character.
Bringing up Katjaa and Duck actually hurts the angle you're using because we actually do see Clem interact with them. Waking up at Hershel's barn, Katjaa and Clem hang out while Lee and Kenny do some work, and we can ask her about the conversation. After Katjaa's suicide, Clem reminisces about how "she was always nice to me". When the group arrives at the motel, Duck is shown talking to Clem quite excitedly about ordinary things he likes. We know that Clem liked to play tricks on Duck when she complains that he's "always blaming me for stuff". What did she ever do with Kenny? We see a deeper connection between these two characters, yet she never reacted to their presence like she does to Kenny in season 2. If I am to accept this premise, I need to know why.
It's because I do understand how humans operate (to a point. I'm no expert or anything) that I question this relationship.
I agree episode 2 sure shes happy to see him and I'm happy with that, but past that its like Kenny's turned into Lee for her. Oh well
Kenny is the only remaining person from the first group and he reminds her of those days. Plus he was always nice to clem in season 1. They both have a bond because they both remind each other of better times in the za.
I never saw Kenny being nice to Clem at all in Season 1, let alone talking to her. The only dialogue off the top of my head where he even speaks to her is a rather rude "Get ON the train Clementine."
I didn't feel like they were "always pals" in season 1, however there's no doubt in my mind that he cared about her, and in my playthrough he also cared about Lee. The way he acted made perfect sense for my particular playthrough. If I got to know somebody over the course of six months or so, and that person had a daughter (or daughter figure) I'd definitely do my best to look out for her if my friend were to pass away.
If I were to replay the first season I would probably make choices that keep the two more emotionally distant (no hug Kenny, sit with Luke, and so on and so fort). I'm interested to see how that would play out, actually. It might not make as much sense, but I could be wrong
That's the thing, though. No matter how you treat Kenny in season 1, Clem still holds him in higher esteem than everyone else. Season 2 seems to be written from the perspective of someone who was a bro with Kenny the first time around, and it makes a lot of sense to those people. However, I really don't like Kenny as a person (as a character, he was awesome), and I would prefer the game not treat me as if I absolutely love him. I never got that option and the game kept telling me to help Kenny because "I'm his friend".
I don't think there's any concrete evidence for there either or not being a emotional attachment between them; so it's up to the player to make his/her own conclusion.
There is evidence to suggest that Clementine valued Kenny's family as a whole in the drawing of them she makes, but I suppose it's up for interpretation how much Kenny was a part of that. I think Clementine at least canonically appreciates Kenny's role in her life somewhat, even if she dislikes his personality for some people.
Yeah, that's one of the few interactions. Another is in episode 1 where he says spiders could be in her hair because she slept in a barn all night. That's about it, really.
This is what I think hurts the credibility of the connection Season 2 claims that Clementine and Kenny has. Going way back in Season 1, for a very prominent pair of characters that are both introduced in Episode 1 and survive all the way until the end of Season 1, I'm surprised that Clementine and Kenny barely talk to each other.
As far as I know there's only two scenes in Season 1 that shows Kenny and Clementine communicating with each other. In Episode 1 where Kenny teases Clementine about having spiders in her hair, and in Episode 3 where Kenny angrily demands Clementine to get on the train after she brings up the subject about Duck's condition.
Had there been more scenes between each other in Season 1, their new relationship in Season 2 would have been more credible than what we had.
Yeah, but I think this is more of a general problem with the series and not just in the case of Clem and Kenny. Unless Clementine is directly involved in the scene there are a lot of interactions between other characters that would never happen.
I don´t feel like they were especially close in Season 1 but I´d think seeing a familiar face would always bring someone in this situation some joy so I´m not surprised at all that they grew very close.
The gap between episode 1 and 2, he obviously interacted with her then and she's like 8. It's like talking to your friends parents, hardly anyone does that, her friend being Duck of course. And seeing Kenny and Larry get angry in the store probably scared her.
People seen to keep forgetting about Clem's drawing of Kenny and his family, i mean, i know it's not that big of a deal, but it shows that Clem somehow cares about Kenny.
i didnt know that you know everything that happend between episode 1 and 2( 3 months in the motor inn)
can you light us with your wisdom and tell us how do you know they didnt talk to each other??
Even if the re-appearing character in EP2 was Lilly I think Clem would be glad. She'd also be a familiar face and a tether to memories of Lee. But Kenny was more than that... He showed affection for Clementine numerous times in the first season.
They know each other longer than that they know the others, so of course also thanks to Lee their relationship is good.
Plus they both thought they were dead
They both had history with each other and Kenny seemed to like Clem from the dialogue interactions between Lee and him when talking about her. Plus Clem got along with Katjaa and played with Duck so why wouldn't she like Kenny or at the very least Kenny would be happy to see her. You can still get the options to be kind of a bitch to Kenny, but he's not the kind of person to just go away.
I, as Lee, did not go along with everything Kenny said or did.
But I did have his back when it mattered.
So when Clementine went missing, he immediately jumped into help find her, even though I had Lee volunteer to go alone.
And incidentally, I did not have Lee reveal his bite at that point.
Kenny only found out after Lee collapsed at the hospital.
So your saying: "If you don't have Kenny's back 100%, he abandons both Lee and Clementine," is not true in my case.
And when making decisions in the game, I made them based on my conscious.
And I found myself agreeing with Kenny for the most part.
Two biggest things I did not agree with him on were: Leaving that girl at the drugstore as bait, so they would've have enough time to gather all the supplies that were left.
To just leave to suffer such a horrible death, I just could not do that.
The second thing was: Dropping Ben from the bell tower.
After seeing how remorseful he was about Katja and Duck, I just couldn't drop him.
I felt it was the wrong thing to do.
And besides doing so; would make the group no better than Crawford, or the St John's.
And in spite of that, Kenny still jumped at the chance to help Lee find Clementine.
Agreed.
There was a 2 month time skip remember? Plus kenny wanted to help lee save clem on ep. 5.
I know.. I like Kenny and Clem but the only line I remember between them was "Get on the train Clementine"
Well, I guess its up for interpretation about the 2 month skip. I don't think Kenny talked much with her though. The people who talked with 8 year old Clem seemed to enjoy giving her things and talking with her. Lily gave her hair thingies. Ben gave her stickers for her walkie talkie. Carley gave her batteries for her walkie talkie. Duck and Katjaa loved talking to her. And Kenny's willingness to help Clem is purely based on how your Lee interacted with him. If you had his back 100% of the time or chose Clem is family while supporting him mostly, then he will help. If you didn't have his back 100% of the time, he will flat out refuse your plea for help at the end of Ep. 4.
It's only a picture though, it was heavily implied to be PITY for Kenny not emotional attachment.
Both ways you have to convince him, if this was Season 2 Kenny , he would've gone with Lee no matter what, but it's not.
Clem liked Kenny's** FAMILY**, didn't really seem to have much of a relationship with Kenny himself, they barely interact with each other.
There's no proper evidence in Starved For Help that Kenny and Clem formed a bond.
First time I've ever read that so you probably just made it up
WishfulThinking
Same could be said for Kenny and Clem having this emotional attachment in Season 1 according to Kenny fans, so Wishful thinking to you, brotha.
I know I'm probably not right, but at least it's legitimate evidence that I would come to that conclusion.
Oh look, it's a Kenny fan.
damn it carly...
cuz they are/were the only ones left from season 1. and again youre using shit from season 1 to compare to s2. different scenarios. I choose to be ok with Kenny and he said all that clem is family. so to me it was a good relationship. and again shes a kid, the biggest reason why they shared that relation is because of what they had with lee, again depending of relationship with Kenny on season 1. ohh and again who cares... it has passed. you don't like Kenny you killed him or left him or whatever, and he might not even be in season 3
Clem and Kenny weren't close in season 1 and I think it's because Clem already had Lee, he was taking care of her and they became friends, he took care of her better than any other group member. I never really liked Kenny in season 1 because of all the moments he left Lee to die because he didn't agree with him on everything he said and the fact that he can refuse to help Lee find Clem.
However, I think that the reason why Kenny and Clem can form a strong relationship in season 2 is because he is the only one left that Clem knows, the only one left who knew Lee, who knows everything she's been through, they share common experiences and memories. Clem was there when Kenny lost his family, and he was there for the most part whenever she was with Lee. In season 2, Clem was surrounded by strangers, people she had only just met a few days ago, so finding someone she knew must have been a relief after everything that happened to her regardless of whether they liked each other before or not.
Absolutley this, Honestly if anything clem seemed scared of Kenny in season 1, Especially with the meat locker and ben stuff
Personally I think clem mainly kept it due to the family, She had a great bond with Duck and Kat which was shown onscreen
yeah kenny really "cares" about clementine
You Just Got Rekt Son
I'm a HUGE Kenny fan... but I do kind of agree with you...... In season 1 episode 1 I could tell that Kenny did know that Clementine was a strong little girl.... and I did know that Clementine did kind of care about Kenny and his family as you can tell by how she drew a picture of them. But I didn't really see much of a relationship between Kenny and Clem until Season 2 Episode 2.... You could tell that Clem and Kenny started to build a relationship in season 2 episode 2.
Like they build such a relationship.... that Clem was like Kenny's daughter.....
Like.....
Season 2
Episode 2:
Episode 3:
Episode 4:
Episode 5:
Even though Kenny lost everything that meant something to him... he still kept moving, and he made sure that Clementine and AJ were safe.
TeamKennyandClementine
What the fuck does this show? Nothing. Duck was about to die and Kenny was consequently scared and pissed. He never demonstrates any viciousness towards Clem, and all he's doing here is insulting Lee by claiming he's not a real father.