...Do you mean he blamed Clementine and Jane for taking the meds even if they let him keep the bag? I don't ever recall reading a translation where the other Russians specifically talked about getting the medicine back, even if Clem does take the pills. I thought that Arvo led his group to them because Jane takes his gun no matter what and he assumed Jane was still with them when she had already left.
But if he did in fact blame the medicine being stolen on Clem and Jane if they don't take the bag, there's a whole bunch of reasons he could have done it for and I will forever wonder what his motive was. I've got a lot of ideas, but who knows.
I honestly didn't think of him as a great antagonist at all, considering the only way the writers were able to keep him an antagonist was preventing any genuine player interaction with him. His main hatred of Clementine was because of a misunderstanding. In the fourth episode, he can refer to her as kind even if she does take his medicine so I bet they could have had a fairly good relationship, had Clem got the chance to actually explain to him what really went down with his sister. But the game didn't allow that, and that is part of why I was so disappointed in what the writers did with Arvo in the finale. I like him for the potential he could have had as a character, instead of what he actually amounted to in the end, which wasn't much unfortunately.
I think he became a great antagonist to Clementine, however i have no ill feelings toward him other than lying to his fellow Russians. Sure … morei was mad at him earlier for getting Luke killed but in his perspective, he didn't know Luke, he was just thinking about getting out of a bad situation.
Sometimes i wish the game was more like the television show. After every season, they don't automatically kill every single character off, except Carl.
It worked in S1 because they didn't know it was Season one at the time. When they started The Walking Dead game they had no idea how big it was going to get. The people making it figured it would be a single shot affair with a popular license, like Jurassic Park and Back to the Future. Because they didn't think they'd get a sequel, they worked hard to give every character a purpose and a reason for their deaths.
Now that the series is a big deal, the writers can just kind of stumble from episode to episode, occasionally getting a good idea before moving onto more filler. Which brings the game remarkably in line with the comic and television show. =P
I disagree that they thought it was a one time deal. I'm pretty sure Vanaman at least had a story and plans for Clementine after she sat down on that log, even if they didn't think they may actually be getting a chance to produce a second installment. Unfortunately, Vanaman left leaving us with new writers who were clutching at straws trying to guess what the fuck was supposed to happen with her. They missed their mark. They ended up having her aimlessly march from one important plot happening to another, as you said, before moving into more filler (the filler not even improving character development in the slightest, unlike S1).
It worked in S1 because they didn't know it was Season one at the time. When they started The Walking Dead game they had no idea how big it … morewas going to get. The people making it figured it would be a single shot affair with a popular license, like Jurassic Park and Back to the Future. Because they didn't think they'd get a sequel, they worked hard to give every character a purpose and a reason for their deaths.
Now that the series is a big deal, the writers can just kind of stumble from episode to episode, occasionally getting a good idea before moving onto more filler. Which brings the game remarkably in line with the comic and television show. =P
I'm sure he had a general idea of where he would have gone with followups, but I don't think he actually had a solid plan to work with. I think he even mentioned somewhere he left the general S2 story concept with Nick Breckon an said it'd be in good hands. But I can't find a link right now, so maybe I misread that somewhere else. Still, if he had some master plan I don't see him leaving Telltale when he did. He probably felt fulfilled in getting to tell the story he wanted and that it was so well received it motivated to move on and work other things he flat passionate about.
Not saying he wouldn't have done a better job than what we got, but I don't think he planned to be writing Clementine's story for the rest of career, or even in the next few years of it. He was content to move on and did so probably because that's all he had already planned out for this story.
I disagree that they thought it was a one time deal. I'm pretty sure Vanaman at least had a story and plans for Clementine after she sat dow… moren on that log, even if they didn't think they may actually be getting a chance to produce a second installment. Unfortunately, Vanaman left leaving us with new writers who were clutching at straws trying to guess what the fuck was supposed to happen with her. They missed their mark. They ended up having her aimlessly march from one important plot happening to another, as you said, before moving into more filler (the filler not even improving character development in the slightest, unlike S1).
To be honest, I think the open-ended conclusion with Clementine seeing those two mysterious figures on the hill WAS the ending to her story. It suggests to us that Clementine will survive in a world where her safety is uncertain, but it wasn't leading in to a sequel. I'd have been happy if we moved on to an entirely new protagonist.
Season 2 doesn't really add anything to that. By the end, she's still alive but either alone or with people whom she can't fully trust.
I'm sure he had a general idea of where he would have gone with followups, but I don't think he actually had a solid plan to work with. I th… moreink he even mentioned somewhere he left the general S2 story concept with Nick Breckon an said it'd be in good hands. But I can't find a link right now, so maybe I misread that somewhere else. Still, if he had some master plan I don't see him leaving Telltale when he did. He probably felt fulfilled in getting to tell the story he wanted and that it was so well received it motivated to move on and work other things he flat passionate about.
Not saying he wouldn't have done a better job than what we got, but I don't think he planned to be writing Clementine's story for the rest of career, or even in the next few years of it. He was content to move on and did so probably because that's all he had already planned out for this story.
It worked in S1 because they didn't know it was Season one at the time. When they started The Walking Dead game they had no idea how big it … morewas going to get. The people making it figured it would be a single shot affair with a popular license, like Jurassic Park and Back to the Future. Because they didn't think they'd get a sequel, they worked hard to give every character a purpose and a reason for their deaths.
Now that the series is a big deal, the writers can just kind of stumble from episode to episode, occasionally getting a good idea before moving onto more filler. Which brings the game remarkably in line with the comic and television show. =P
To be honest, I think the open-ended conclusion with Clementine seeing those two mysterious figures on the hill WAS the ending to her story. It suggests to us that Clementine will survive in a world where her safety is uncertain, but it wasn't leading in to a sequel. I'd have been happy if we moved on to an entirely new protagonist.
I felt it was a natural close to the parental theme running all season. You care for your child, you protect them, you raise them, but all the time you're never actually sure if you're instilling them with the right lessons or not, and eventually they'll have to leave you, and you're left wondering just what kind of person they will become and will they survive in the world without your help.
I'm actually with you on being fine with a whole new protagonist, even back then. I wrote a fan letter to Telltale after season one with the crazy suggestion that they just go with a completely different cast of new characters for season two. But the season ends would end with the reveal that two of these characters are actually the people on the hill. Stupid crazy risk I know, but I really think they needed some breathing room before even attempting to continue Clem's story and if they weren't just willing to wait to make a follow-up, working with a new cast could have kept the franchise fresh while giving them some time to figure out how to properly use Clementine's character in a new story next installment.
To be honest, I think the open-ended conclusion with Clementine seeing those two mysterious figures on the hill WAS the ending to her story.… more It suggests to us that Clementine will survive in a world where her safety is uncertain, but it wasn't leading in to a sequel. I'd have been happy if we moved on to an entirely new protagonist.
Season 2 doesn't really add anything to that. By the end, she's still alive but either alone or with people whom she can't fully trust.
Telltale: BUT THAT'S KIRKMAN'S VISION LOL
I think they confirmed a season two around the time Around Every Corner was being released. And just that. No announcement on what the hell that would entail, just that we're making another one after this one is finished. By then they could probably feel the momentum that was building and realized how profitable it would be to make sequels.
But I really really doubt that when they started the first episode they were like "Here we go! The first in many games following the story of Clementine!" They even said they were close to cutting Clementine from the story just before production because they couldn't find an actress right for the part. Probably fully aware that if the audience found Clem annoying, it'd tank the whole story since she'd be an integral part of it.
I like Arvo because he reminds me of the scientific super villain, he was smart. He was able to manipulate people into doing what he wanted. No one thought much about him, they didn't think he could be a threat. However he is a lot smarter than he lets on.
When he talks to Kenny he pretends like he doesn't understand to enrage Kenny. Causing friction within the group. It was all a strategy he used to escape. I saw right through doing, however no one saw the manipulation of mike within the group, which caused it to play out like it did.
I really like this character and hope he is the new antagonist in S3. Instead of using physical violence, he uses lies, manipulation or half truths to change the situation to his advantage. Who wouldn't feel sorry for crippled Potter, he looks pathetic, but looks can be deceiving.
He lied to his group?
...Do you mean he blamed Clementine and Jane for taking the meds even if they let him keep the bag? I don't ever re… morecall reading a translation where the other Russians specifically talked about getting the medicine back, even if Clem does take the pills. I thought that Arvo led his group to them because Jane takes his gun no matter what and he assumed Jane was still with them when she had already left.
But if he did in fact blame the medicine being stolen on Clem and Jane if they don't take the bag, there's a whole bunch of reasons he could have done it for and I will forever wonder what his motive was. I've got a lot of ideas, but who knows.
I honestly didn't think of him as a great antagonist at all, considering the only way the writers were able to keep him an antagonist was preventing any genuine player interaction with him. His main hatred of Clementine was because of a misunderstanding. In the fourth episod… [view original content]
I'm actually not sure how I feel on the interpretation of him as a manipulative genius, even though I've seen some good points for it, I like to try and argue against it.
Like you mentioned, when he is talking to Kenny, a lot of people believe he pretended not to understand, but I think that his drop in fluency was mostly due to trauma. I don't speak another language well so I'm not the best example to use here, but I'm taking German and whenever I have to speak in front of the class I usually get so nervous that I forget everything I was going to say, perhaps the same thing happened to Arvo, but obviously his circumstances were a thousand times worse than getting scared in front of people. All the times Kenny interacted with Arvo, it was usually Kenny insulting, pushing him around, and yelling 'Speak English!' at him and that most likely didn't help him out of shock any. Arvo was probably at his worst point emotionally when he was trying to bring his sister back to life, and when Kenny grabs him he speaks completely in Russian the whole time. At a crucial moment like that where he believed his sister's life was at stake, if he was so fluent in English he would have begged to be let go in that language, instead of Russian. But he didn't, because he was in a traumatic situation, and I think later on his skills in English dropped because he was still emotionally fucked up, for lack of a better term. Also, I doubt he'd purposely try pissing off a man who is very volatile and has attempted to kill him numerous times.
However, I've heard it is somewhat common for those who are bilingual to speak in other languages to piss people off so I could be wrong, but I find it hard to believe he'd try pulling something like that on purpose given the risks of it outweighed the benefits. (Or maybe not, since Mike did end up freeing him.)
Speaking of Mike, I doubt he was manipul8ed all that much, and if Arvo actually did have a part to play in getting him to want to leave, I don't think he had to try very hard. It was Kenny's behavior that did it for them, and they have been frightened of Kenny before Arvo was even introduced. Kenny's first interaction with Mike was at Howe's when Kenny got into a fight with him, which ended up letting walkers into the building. Then, when Sarita dies, he goes to talk to Kenny and gets screamed at, which alienated Mike further. Watching him nearly beat Arvo to death and all the other times Kenny previously abused him when he didn't really need to was probably the icing on the shit cake, or however that saying goes.
I think Mike and Bonnie were already well on the way to making their choice before Arvo was even in the picture, and decided they'd take pity on the poor, beaten kid and drag him along. If that was the case, then Arvo appearing as a pathetic woobie wouldn't have been because Arvo tricked them into believing he was one, but simply because he was constantly treated like shit by Kenny, and that scared Mike/Bonnie and made them feel bad for him. Considering what he did to Clem, I'm sure they are regretting it somewhat by now.
I like Arvo because he reminds me of the scientific super villain, he was smart. He was able to manipulate people into doing what he wanted.… more No one thought much about him, they didn't think he could be a threat. However he is a lot smarter than he lets on.
When he talks to Kenny he pretends like he doesn't understand to enrage Kenny. Causing friction within the group. It was all a strategy he used to escape. I saw right through doing, however no one saw the manipulation of mike within the group, which caused it to play out like it did.
I really like this character and hope he is the new antagonist in S3. Instead of using physical violence, he uses lies, manipulation or half truths to change the situation to his advantage. Who wouldn't feel sorry for crippled Potter, he looks pathetic, but looks can be deceiving.
Comments
He lied to his group?
...Do you mean he blamed Clementine and Jane for taking the meds even if they let him keep the bag? I don't ever recall reading a translation where the other Russians specifically talked about getting the medicine back, even if Clem does take the pills. I thought that Arvo led his group to them because Jane takes his gun no matter what and he assumed Jane was still with them when she had already left.
But if he did in fact blame the medicine being stolen on Clem and Jane if they don't take the bag, there's a whole bunch of reasons he could have done it for and I will forever wonder what his motive was. I've got a lot of ideas, but who knows.
I honestly didn't think of him as a great antagonist at all, considering the only way the writers were able to keep him an antagonist was preventing any genuine player interaction with him. His main hatred of Clementine was because of a misunderstanding. In the fourth episode, he can refer to her as kind even if she does take his medicine so I bet they could have had a fairly good relationship, had Clem got the chance to actually explain to him what really went down with his sister. But the game didn't allow that, and that is part of why I was so disappointed in what the writers did with Arvo in the finale. I like him for the potential he could have had as a character, instead of what he actually amounted to in the end, which wasn't much unfortunately.
Personally, I prefer Christa and Omid over Carley any day. Not a big fan of Carley. I found her character to be rather boring after episode 1. :P
I wish this too. It worked in S1 but seemed repeated and even forced in S2.
It worked in S1 because they didn't know it was Season one at the time. When they started The Walking Dead game they had no idea how big it was going to get. The people making it figured it would be a single shot affair with a popular license, like Jurassic Park and Back to the Future. Because they didn't think they'd get a sequel, they worked hard to give every character a purpose and a reason for their deaths.
Now that the series is a big deal, the writers can just kind of stumble from episode to episode, occasionally getting a good idea before moving onto more filler. Which brings the game remarkably in line with the comic and television show. =P
I disagree that they thought it was a one time deal. I'm pretty sure Vanaman at least had a story and plans for Clementine after she sat down on that log, even if they didn't think they may actually be getting a chance to produce a second installment. Unfortunately, Vanaman left leaving us with new writers who were clutching at straws trying to guess what the fuck was supposed to happen with her. They missed their mark. They ended up having her aimlessly march from one important plot happening to another, as you said, before moving into more filler (the filler not even improving character development in the slightest, unlike S1).
I'm sure he had a general idea of where he would have gone with followups, but I don't think he actually had a solid plan to work with. I think he even mentioned somewhere he left the general S2 story concept with Nick Breckon an said it'd be in good hands. But I can't find a link right now, so maybe I misread that somewhere else. Still, if he had some master plan I don't see him leaving Telltale when he did. He probably felt fulfilled in getting to tell the story he wanted and that it was so well received it motivated to move on and work other things he flat passionate about.
Not saying he wouldn't have done a better job than what we got, but I don't think he planned to be writing Clementine's story for the rest of career, or even in the next few years of it. He was content to move on and did so probably because that's all he had already planned out for this story.
To be honest, I think the open-ended conclusion with Clementine seeing those two mysterious figures on the hill WAS the ending to her story. It suggests to us that Clementine will survive in a world where her safety is uncertain, but it wasn't leading in to a sequel. I'd have been happy if we moved on to an entirely new protagonist.
Season 2 doesn't really add anything to that. By the end, she's still alive but either alone or with people whom she can't fully trust.
Telltale: BUT THAT'S KIRKMAN'S VISION LOL
I believe the second season was confirmed before episode 2 of season 1 even came out.
I felt it was a natural close to the parental theme running all season. You care for your child, you protect them, you raise them, but all the time you're never actually sure if you're instilling them with the right lessons or not, and eventually they'll have to leave you, and you're left wondering just what kind of person they will become and will they survive in the world without your help.
I'm actually with you on being fine with a whole new protagonist, even back then. I wrote a fan letter to Telltale after season one with the crazy suggestion that they just go with a completely different cast of new characters for season two. But the season ends would end with the reveal that two of these characters are actually the people on the hill. Stupid crazy risk I know, but I really think they needed some breathing room before even attempting to continue Clem's story and if they weren't just willing to wait to make a follow-up, working with a new cast could have kept the franchise fresh while giving them some time to figure out how to properly use Clementine's character in a new story next installment.
I think they confirmed a season two around the time Around Every Corner was being released. And just that. No announcement on what the hell that would entail, just that we're making another one after this one is finished. By then they could probably feel the momentum that was building and realized how profitable it would be to make sequels.
But I really really doubt that when they started the first episode they were like "Here we go! The first in many games following the story of Clementine!" They even said they were close to cutting Clementine from the story just before production because they couldn't find an actress right for the part. Probably fully aware that if the audience found Clem annoying, it'd tank the whole story since she'd be an integral part of it.
I like Arvo because he reminds me of the scientific super villain, he was smart. He was able to manipulate people into doing what he wanted. No one thought much about him, they didn't think he could be a threat. However he is a lot smarter than he lets on.
When he talks to Kenny he pretends like he doesn't understand to enrage Kenny. Causing friction within the group. It was all a strategy he used to escape. I saw right through doing, however no one saw the manipulation of mike within the group, which caused it to play out like it did.
I really like this character and hope he is the new antagonist in S3. Instead of using physical violence, he uses lies, manipulation or half truths to change the situation to his advantage. Who wouldn't feel sorry for crippled Potter, he looks pathetic, but looks can be deceiving.
I'm actually not sure how I feel on the interpretation of him as a manipulative genius, even though I've seen some good points for it, I like to try and argue against it.
Like you mentioned, when he is talking to Kenny, a lot of people believe he pretended not to understand, but I think that his drop in fluency was mostly due to trauma. I don't speak another language well so I'm not the best example to use here, but I'm taking German and whenever I have to speak in front of the class I usually get so nervous that I forget everything I was going to say, perhaps the same thing happened to Arvo, but obviously his circumstances were a thousand times worse than getting scared in front of people. All the times Kenny interacted with Arvo, it was usually Kenny insulting, pushing him around, and yelling 'Speak English!' at him and that most likely didn't help him out of shock any. Arvo was probably at his worst point emotionally when he was trying to bring his sister back to life, and when Kenny grabs him he speaks completely in Russian the whole time. At a crucial moment like that where he believed his sister's life was at stake, if he was so fluent in English he would have begged to be let go in that language, instead of Russian. But he didn't, because he was in a traumatic situation, and I think later on his skills in English dropped because he was still emotionally fucked up, for lack of a better term. Also, I doubt he'd purposely try pissing off a man who is very volatile and has attempted to kill him numerous times.
However, I've heard it is somewhat common for those who are bilingual to speak in other languages to piss people off so I could be wrong, but I find it hard to believe he'd try pulling something like that on purpose given the risks of it outweighed the benefits. (Or maybe not, since Mike did end up freeing him.)
Speaking of Mike, I doubt he was manipul8ed all that much, and if Arvo actually did have a part to play in getting him to want to leave, I don't think he had to try very hard. It was Kenny's behavior that did it for them, and they have been frightened of Kenny before Arvo was even introduced. Kenny's first interaction with Mike was at Howe's when Kenny got into a fight with him, which ended up letting walkers into the building. Then, when Sarita dies, he goes to talk to Kenny and gets screamed at, which alienated Mike further. Watching him nearly beat Arvo to death and all the other times Kenny previously abused him when he didn't really need to was probably the icing on the shit cake, or however that saying goes.
I think Mike and Bonnie were already well on the way to making their choice before Arvo was even in the picture, and decided they'd take pity on the poor, beaten kid and drag him along. If that was the case, then Arvo appearing as a pathetic woobie wouldn't have been because Arvo tricked them into believing he was one, but simply because he was constantly treated like shit by Kenny, and that scared Mike/Bonnie and made them feel bad for him. Considering what he did to Clem, I'm sure they are regretting it somewhat by now.