They were most likely thinking, "Oh shit, there are only a few days until we are supposed to release the episode, we don't have time to rewrite the scene or get the voice actors back to re-record it so we have to settle for taking it out and leaving it as is." Clearly the decision to take it out was a very late move and the writers didn't have enough time to fix it.
Still you could tell it was quick and thrown together without any effort. A small dialogue option that changes nothing should not be a main choice, what were they thinking?
I understand where you're coming from and I respect your opinion, but I still love this episode, my 2nd favorite from the series. Were there bullshit moments, yes, but if you look at any episode from this series there are bullshit moments. It doesn't change the fact that, in my opinion at least, it was still a well written episode by Breckon and Shorette. While nothing can top Lee's death from No Time Left, I still found this episode very emotional with the whole Lee dream and the fact that I had to choose between 2 characters I cared about immensely. The Kenny and Jane thing is still the hardest choice I have ever had to make in this game because of how much I cared for both characters.
I don't agree. It was a good episode, but I suppose there's no accounting for taste. Prepare for more of the same kind of writing in season 3 or just don't play it at all.
With every fault Amid the Ruins had, I still felt it at least addressed the futility of life as a threatening thing. Not great, mind you. But it managed to remain quasi-shocking throughout. For example, the choice to convince Jane to save Sarah not amounting to shit was dumb. But perhaps it was placed there to bait people into thinking they could save her. When the carpet was then promptly pulled, it felt at least a little harsh.
I don't know, I kind of liked aspects of the episode. Was it sloppy? Yes. Was it poorly paced? Absolutely. Was there at least interesting aspects that were rushed that could've been truly engaging if it wasn't? Oh, hell yeah.
But playing episode five's horrendous beginning, falling through ice water and surviving, changing direction from the town to buttfuck nowhere within a sentence, having a dream sequence shoehorned into the game, and then the terrible final conflict were only a fraction of the shitty ineptitude that went into episode five.
I don't agree. It was a good episode, but I suppose there's no accounting for taste. Prepare for more of the same kind of writing in season 3 or just don't play it at all.
So tricking the player into thinking they can save Sarah as a cock tease only pisses them off more. The story telling was ridiculous even the choices you made had no effect in that certain situation. It made a canon choice. Yuck! It was a disgrace to Telltale and an embarassing blemish
With every fault Amid the Ruins had, I still felt it at least addressed the futility of life as a threatening thing. Not great, mind you. Bu… moret it managed to remain quasi-shocking throughout. For example, the choice to convince Jane to save Sarah not amounting to shit was dumb. But perhaps it was placed there to bait people into thinking they could save her. When the carpet was then promptly pulled, it felt at least a little harsh.
I don't know, I kind of liked aspects of the episode. Was it sloppy? Yes. Was it poorly paced? Absolutely. Was there at least interesting aspects that were rushed that could've been truly engaging if it wasn't? Oh, hell yeah.
But playing episode five's horrendous beginning, falling through ice water and surviving, changing direction from the town to buttfuck nowhere within a sentence, having a dream sequence shoehorned into the game, and then the terrible final conflict were only a fraction of the shitty ineptitude that went into episode five.
So tricking the player into thinking they can save Sarah as a cock tease only pisses them off more. The story telling was ridiculous even th… moree choices you made had no effect in that certain situation. It made a canon choice. Yuck! It was a disgrace to Telltale and an embarassing blemish
I'm sure they do with everything that's being said repeatedly. I'd like to think that our voices are heard to a certain degree. For example, after many people pointing out that the play time of each episode was rather short compared to the ones in the previous season, TFTB and GOT episodes now have both over 2 hours worth of content on a first play-through. Hopefully we can expect to see improvements like that in S3 of TWD, but Telltale cannot cater to everyone's taste on how things should be done from a writing standpoint, it's just impossible.
I agree. I didn't care for any of the episodes this season besides "In harms way:" that was up to the escape. As soon as they killed Carver off i was sad again, to suffer through another two badly written episodes of the Kenny Khronicles.
Ditto, currently unexcited for Season 3 as a result of it sadly x_x actually affected how I'll buy episodic games in the future now, because instead of going for the season passes or anything like that, now I'll just wait for the retail release when a game is complete so I can see it as a whole before I making up my mind on whether it's worth the money. I'm going to be doing that for Resident Evil: Revelations 2 that Capcom's making.
Even so, I haven't even brought the retail version of TWDG Season 2, I was that pooped out by it ;_;
I begged my little sister to buy a season pass, (Or whatever it's called when you get all five episodes at once or whatever) I regret having her spend her money on that. .-. I know she has copious amounts of money stored throughout the house and I don't know how or where she got all of it, so it's not that big a deal since it wasn't mine but still...I definitely think I'm going to just watch youtubers play the game from now on.
Ditto, currently unexcited for Season 3 as a result of it sadly x_x actually affected how I'll buy episodic games in the future now, because… more instead of going for the season passes or anything like that, now I'll just wait for the retail release when a game is complete so I can see it as a whole before I making up my mind on whether it's worth the money. I'm going to be doing that for Resident Evil: Revelations 2 that Capcom's making.
Even so, I haven't even brought the retail version of TWDG Season 2, I was that pooped out by it ;_;
Garbage episode that killed all the interest I had for season 3. Episode 5 goes against everything that is considered good storytelling. You don't fucking create a new location(Wellington) and hype it up for the entire season and then make it a determinant place that will not matter at all in the next season. You also don't fucking name an episode "No Going Back" and make everyone fucking go back to the shithole you were trying to leave 2 episodes ago and then say it's a valid and logical ending. Shorette and Breckon must be fired.
You also don't fucking name an episode "No Going Back" and make everyone fucking go back to the shithole you were trying to leave 2 episodes ago and then say it's a valid and logical ending.
Garbage episode that killed all the interest I had for season 3. Episode 5 goes against everything that is considered good storytelling. You… more don't fucking create a new location(Wellington) and hype it up for the entire season and then make it a determinant place that will not matter at all in the next season. You also don't fucking name an episode "No Going Back" and make everyone fucking go back to the shithole you were trying to leave 2 episodes ago and then say it's a valid and logical ending. Shorette and Breckon must be fired.
Out of nowhere? Lol, everyone knew that was coming.
I wish i had your clairvoyance abilities to know when a trash character is going to make a shit deus ex machina re-introduction. Leave the next day? Jane still lingering around. Wait a couple days? Jane still lingering around. It's a shit come back and it's impossible to deny that.
but i thought keeping them alive was a good idea
Do you ever make a post based on logical points and not "it gud cuz i liked it"?
Jane's return felt badly written. I mean look at it, it came out of no where.
Out of nowhere? Lol, everyone knew that was coming.
… more Now seeing the angle they were pointing in at least 3 people in the group would be dead
People complain people die too fast and too many people die, sure it might be illogical but I thought keeping them alive was a good idea, rather than killing them all off by the beginning of the episode.
but could they do better than rip off Titanic
Uhhh what? Just cause someone dies from falling in a freezing lake does not mean it's ripping off the Titanic, 2 completely different deaths.
I know his original plan was Kenny vs Luke but was changed by those amateurs Petty and Stripe
Except you don't know that, so lol.
Again with these threads using bad writing for examples, if you can't say something better than bad writing for a point then that point isn't very good in the first place.
You also don't fucking name an episode "No Going Back" and make everyone fucking go back to the shithole you were trying to leave 2 episodes ago and then say it's a valid and logical ending.
I never noticed that.
Well he's right even still.. I've said the exact same thing right after the finale was released. Jane's ending felt a lot more strange and less logical and especially with that family of weirdos at the gates.. Jane's ending to me also felt more like a punishment for allowing yourself to be deceived by Jane's mind games.
Well he's right even still.. I've said the exact same thing right after the finale was released. Jane's ending felt a lot more strange and l… moreess logical and especially with that family of weirdos at the gates.. Jane's ending to me also felt more like a punishment for allowing yourself to be deceived by Jane's mind games.
i think IMO Jane's ending was mysterious yet it gets me curious and interested of whats gonna happen next.... i'm enough with those emotional endings as in season 1 , i admit kenny's ending was good but.. it's... -coughs- overrated..
and i'm getting alot of hate because i said that...
Well he's right even still.. I've said the exact same thing right after the finale was released. Jane's ending felt a lot more strange and l… moreess logical and especially with that family of weirdos at the gates.. Jane's ending to me also felt more like a punishment for allowing yourself to be deceived by Jane's mind games.
Garbage episode that killed all the interest I had for season 3. Episode 5 goes against everything that is considered good storytelling. You… more don't fucking create a new location(Wellington) and hype it up for the entire season and then make it a determinant place that will not matter at all in the next season. You also don't fucking name an episode "No Going Back" and make everyone fucking go back to the shithole you were trying to leave 2 episodes ago and then say it's a valid and logical ending. Shorette and Breckon must be fired.
Garbage episode that killed all the interest I had for season 3. Episode 5 goes against everything that is considered good storytelling. You… more don't fucking create a new location(Wellington) and hype it up for the entire season and then make it a determinant place that will not matter at all in the next season. You also don't fucking name an episode "No Going Back" and make everyone fucking go back to the shithole you were trying to leave 2 episodes ago and then say it's a valid and logical ending. Shorette and Breckon must be fired.
Why exactly are we judging them solely on a single flop? Or more importantly, judging them on episodes that really weren't a flop outside of the general opinion of this single forum, since the reception for episodes 3 and 5 have actually been pretty good in accordance to just about everything that isn't this forum, a forum which itself probably isn't indicative of any more than 5% of the total playerbase?
Maybe there's a possibility that these episodes are not as bad as you make them out to be, but you're just blowing faults out of proportion to justify all of the vitriol you continue to pump out all over season 2?
Maybe there's a possibility that these episodes are not as bad as you make them out to be, but you're just blowing faults out of proportion to justify all the vitriol you continue to pump out all over season 2?
Nick Breckon and Pierre Shorette are good writers
Why exactly are we judging them solely on a single flop? Or more importantly, judging t… morehem on episodes that really weren't a flop outside of the general opinion of this single forum, since the reception for episodes 3 and 5 have actually been pretty good in accordance to just about everything that isn't this forum, a forum which itself probably isn't indicative of any more than 5% of the total playerbase?
Maybe there's a possibility that these episodes are not as bad as you make them out to be, but you're just blowing faults out of proportion to justify all of the vitriol you continue to pump out all over season 2?
Out of nowhere? Lol, everyone knew that was coming.
I wish i had your clairvoyance abilities to know when a trash character is going… more to make a shit deus ex machina re-introduction. Leave the next day? Jane still lingering around. Wait a couple days? Jane still lingering around. It's a shit come back and it's impossible to deny that.
but i thought keeping them alive was a good idea
Do you ever make a post based on logical points and not "it gud cuz i liked it"?
Not everything a writer writes is perfect, there will always be the things that are good and the things that are bad or viewed as one or the other in varying outlooks, and that's just how it goes. I'd rather they learn and improve than say they should quit or be fired, that's silly.
Although to your forum comment I have to disagree in some ways. Just because we're on this forum and no matter how great or few our numbers are, doesn't make our opinions any less or more valid than main reviewers out there that play and score the game, or just gamers or fans in general who do the same. Singling out one place out of the entire net where where negative or positive opinions are expressed, and putting a percentage to it as if we don't matter is wrong. And on terms of negative opinions, they're not isolated here alone, nothing ever is for any game or show.
Isn't this one of the reasons why forums exist, that aside from discussing and chatting with other fans, people can give an honest opinion on whether they liked something or not? If we only pointed out the good things we liked and not the bad, that would be like ignoring the negatives completely, and if you ignore the negatives how would Telltale ever know to take it into account the next time or work on it if they did indeed choose to listen to that?
Even so, if a fan wants to make a thread praising a game for it's every detail that they loved, then a fan should be allowed to make a thread saying the things they didn't like or hated even. People should be allowed to talk about what they want, so long as they aren't abusive to others in the process and that includes Telltale themselves.
That's all I wanted to say ;_; please don't murder me.
Nick Breckon and Pierre Shorette are good writers
Why exactly are we judging them solely on a single flop? Or more importantly, judging t… morehem on episodes that really weren't a flop outside of the general opinion of this single forum, since the reception for episodes 3 and 5 have actually been pretty good in accordance to just about everything that isn't this forum, a forum which itself probably isn't indicative of any more than 5% of the total playerbase?
Maybe there's a possibility that these episodes are not as bad as you make them out to be, but you're just blowing faults out of proportion to justify all of the vitriol you continue to pump out all over season 2?
I wasn't trying to undervalue anyone's opinions, nor was I trying to undervalue the opinions of this forum, so I apologize if that comment came off that way. I was more trying to put into perspective that the beliefs/opinions of these forums, no matter how valid they are, are not fully representative of the general reception of the season/episodes. As in, the word of this forum is not the ultimate say (although I think most people realize that). People here do indeed have very valid complaints, and there's people here that are able to voice them in a civil manner, and that's great, and they definitely deserve to be heard, I'm not doubting that at all. I'm mainly calling out the select few that are quite... "vocal" about their opinions and thoughts on this season.
Not everything a writer writes is perfect, there will always be the things that are good and the things that are bad or viewed as one or the… more other in varying outlooks, and that's just how it goes. I'd rather they learn and improve than say they should quit or be fired, that's silly.
Although to your forum comment I have to disagree in some ways. Just because we're on this forum and no matter how great or few our numbers are, doesn't make our opinions any less or more valid than main reviewers out there that play and score the game, or just gamers or fans in general who do the same. Singling out one place out of the entire net where where negative or positive opinions are expressed, and putting a percentage to it as if we don't matter is wrong. And on terms of negative opinions, they're not isolated here alone, nothing ever is for any game or show.
Isn't this one of the reasons why forums exist, that aside from discussing and chatting wi… [view original content]
Luke's death ripped off Titanic? Yeah, because we all know Titantic totally invented drowning. LOL. Yeah, but seriously, I do kinda see where you're coming from though.
I think it struggled with direction after In Harm's Way. The effect of losing a direct antagonist really set in. Look how bad Resident Evil is without Wesker
I agree. I didn't care for any of the episodes this season besides "In harms way:" that was up to the escape. As soon as they killed Carver off i was sad again, to suffer through another two badly written episodes of the Kenny Khronicles.
Before you go disrespecting writers and calling them amateurs with this:
'I don't blame Breckon entirely since I know his original plan was Kenny vs Luke but was changed by those amateurs Petty and Stripe, so he only had so much to work with.'
Maybe know how a lead writer works and have something to backup your claim, or at least put your 'opinion' across more respectfully. He was in charge of the project overall, so everything would have been given the all clear by him. (As an aside, depending on how Telltale works, he might not have been in total charge of the story's direction either. Companies work differently, but generally, a lead writer has a big hand in shaping the story.)
And, as mentioned above by Lilac, not everything a writer writes is perfect. In fact, pretty much nothing is. There just comes a point where you have to stop agonising over every little detail and ship it out, because you could be making changes forever. Plenty of things are subjective as well. (You were the one who said forum members have thought of a better story, right? It might please you, but does it please everyone else? It's not a question to be answered either, as you can't possibly know the answer even if you may claim you speak for the majority. And it's in no shape or form easy to write a good story.) To touch on the 'nothing is perfect' argument further too, I could call Stephen King a rubbish writer because I disliked Insomnia. It was overly long, tedious and took ages to start (200+ pages), with the only positives being that the writing and characters were as good as always. But if I were to do that, I would never have read Salem's Lot or Under the Dome, which I enjoyed (despite Salem's Lot having some corny elements in my view). Also, something isn't lazy just because you would have done something differently. People really should stop throwing that word around.
I should make it clear my issue with your original post isn't because you're criticising season 2 either, despite myself thinking it was pretty good overall, but it's how you're wording your criticism. And by the way, I do agree that logically, someone would have likely been hurt/killed during the gunfight.
Oh, and Clem_Is_Awesome (above was obviously to the OP), I love you. Calling for writers to be fired. Needn't worry about the state of the forum with people like you here.
I see it as TellTale trying to imitate what Yager did with Spec Ops' choices. Y'know, the one's that didn't amount to shit. But made you feel like the choices you were making had a bigger impact on the larger scheme of things.
Killing the angry mob or just walking away = Nothing, but was such an interesting point in and of itself because choosing the ladder was kind of a hidden thing and the game itself tried pushing players to violence. Never would I had thought the first time playing that you had to actually aim your weapons (which auto locks to the crowd and then aim UP toward the air and fire a warning shot). I mean, it was manipulative as all hell.
The difference, unfortunately, is that TellTale games has always been about the choices affecting things whereas with Spec Op's the choices were just placed there to make gamers feel alienated and detached from the game itself. You can't have it both ways unfortunately.
Thing is, the consequences of the choices Clem is "allowed" to make SHOULD have an impact.
The game treats starving at the observation deck with no food & water as having the same outcome as leaving immediately. Doesn't anyone else see how dumb this is? The leaked choices for Amid The Ruins even considered this decision noteworthy enough to take percentages of, before it was quickly changed to "how many of you like babies?"
I see it as TellTale trying to imitate what Yager did with Spec Ops' choices. Y'know, the one's that didn't amount to shit. But made you fee… morel like the choices you were making had a bigger impact on the larger scheme of things.
Killing the angry mob or just walking away = Nothing, but was such an interesting point in and of itself because choosing the ladder was kind of a hidden thing and the game itself tried pushing players to violence. Never would I had thought the first time playing that you had to actually aim your weapons (which auto locks to the crowd and then aim UP toward the air and fire a warning shot). I mean, it was manipulative as all hell.
The difference, unfortunately, is that TellTale games has always been about the choices affecting things whereas with Spec Op's the choices were just placed there to make gamers feel alienated and detached from the game itself. You can't have it both ways unfortunately.
Before you go disrespecting writers and calling them amateurs with this:
'I don't blame Breckon entirely since I know his original plan w… moreas Kenny vs Luke but was changed by those amateurs Petty and Stripe, so he only had so much to work with.'
Maybe know how a lead writer works and have something to backup your claim, or at least put your 'opinion' across more respectfully. He was in charge of the project overall, so everything would have been given the all clear by him. (As an aside, depending on how Telltale works, he might not have been in total charge of the story's direction either. Companies work differently, but generally, a lead writer has a big hand in shaping the story.)
And, as mentioned above by Lilac, not everything a writer writes is perfect. In fact, pretty much nothing is. There just comes a point where you have to stop agonising over every little detail and ship it out, because you could be making changes forever. Pl… [view original content]
Don't care. Word your criticism better. It's common decency. Think about how you'd feel if someone said that about you.
There are plenty of ways of saying what you did without calling them amateurs. It's not that I think they're going to be hurt from it either, but what it is about is the mentality that people can be as rude or as disrespectful as they want without harm. Things would go much more smoothly online without the insults and you're more likely to be listened to (when it comes to those you're trying to reach, the developers/writers). If it was me personally, the moment you start throwing an insult around, I wouldn't really listen.
And I would look into your facts about those two writers being responsible for changing the story's direction. That's what I meant about backing up your claim, because all I can see regarding that is 'someone thinks that happened' without anything to back it up. Something that doesn't hold much water, as it is likely that Nick was okay with it.
Don't care. Word your criticism better. It's common decency. Think about how you'd feel if someone said that about you.
There are plenty … moreof ways of saying what you did without calling them amateurs. It's not that I think they're going to be hurt from it either, but what it is about is the mentality that people can be as rude or as disrespectful as they want without harm. Things would go much more smoothly online without the insults and you're more likely to be listened to (when it comes to those you're trying to reach, the developers/writers). If it was me personally, the moment you start throwing an insult around, I wouldn't really listen.
And I would look into your facts about those two writers being responsible for changing the story's direction. That's what I meant about backing up your claim, because all I can see regarding that is 'someone thinks that happened' without anything to back it up. Something that doesn't hold much water, as it is likely that Nick was okay with it.
Comments
Ask TTG. They did it.
They were most likely thinking, "Oh shit, there are only a few days until we are supposed to release the episode, we don't have time to rewrite the scene or get the voice actors back to re-record it so we have to settle for taking it out and leaving it as is." Clearly the decision to take it out was a very late move and the writers didn't have enough time to fix it.
I understand where you're coming from and I respect your opinion, but I still love this episode, my 2nd favorite from the series. Were there bullshit moments, yes, but if you look at any episode from this series there are bullshit moments. It doesn't change the fact that, in my opinion at least, it was still a well written episode by Breckon and Shorette. While nothing can top Lee's death from No Time Left, I still found this episode very emotional with the whole Lee dream and the fact that I had to choose between 2 characters I cared about immensely. The Kenny and Jane thing is still the hardest choice I have ever had to make in this game because of how much I cared for both characters.
I don't agree. It was a good episode, but I suppose there's no accounting for taste. Prepare for more of the same kind of writing in season 3 or just don't play it at all.
With every fault Amid the Ruins had, I still felt it at least addressed the futility of life as a threatening thing. Not great, mind you. But it managed to remain quasi-shocking throughout. For example, the choice to convince Jane to save Sarah not amounting to shit was dumb. But perhaps it was placed there to bait people into thinking they could save her. When the carpet was then promptly pulled, it felt at least a little harsh.
I don't know, I kind of liked aspects of the episode. Was it sloppy? Yes. Was it poorly paced? Absolutely. Was there at least interesting aspects that were rushed that could've been truly engaging if it wasn't? Oh, hell yeah.
But playing episode five's horrendous beginning, falling through ice water and surviving, changing direction from the town to buttfuck nowhere within a sentence, having a dream sequence shoehorned into the game, and then the terrible final conflict were only a fraction of the shitty ineptitude that went into episode five.
I really hope the writers know how much of a mistake Season 2's flaws were and at least improve on it
So tricking the player into thinking they can save Sarah as a cock tease only pisses them off more. The story telling was ridiculous even the choices you made had no effect in that certain situation. It made a canon choice. Yuck! It was a disgrace to Telltale and an embarassing blemish
Oh, I know. It was handled poorly, but perhaps the intention of the choice was more justified than the outcome...
There would still be something to be desired.
I'm sure they do with everything that's being said repeatedly. I'd like to think that our voices are heard to a certain degree. For example, after many people pointing out that the play time of each episode was rather short compared to the ones in the previous season, TFTB and GOT episodes now have both over 2 hours worth of content on a first play-through. Hopefully we can expect to see improvements like that in S3 of TWD, but Telltale cannot cater to everyone's taste on how things should be done from a writing standpoint, it's just impossible.
Can't argue with this, I hated the episode. The fact that this was supposed to be a finale episode makes it even worse. .-.
I agree. I didn't care for any of the episodes this season besides "In harms way:" that was up to the escape. As soon as they killed Carver off i was sad again, to suffer through another two badly written episodes of the Kenny Khronicles.
Ditto, currently unexcited for Season 3 as a result of it sadly x_x actually affected how I'll buy episodic games in the future now, because instead of going for the season passes or anything like that, now I'll just wait for the retail release when a game is complete so I can see it as a whole before I making up my mind on whether it's worth the money. I'm going to be doing that for Resident Evil: Revelations 2 that Capcom's making.
Even so, I haven't even brought the retail version of TWDG Season 2, I was that pooped out by it ;_;
I begged my little sister to buy a season pass, (Or whatever it's called when you get all five episodes at once or whatever) I regret having her spend her money on that. .-. I know she has copious amounts of money stored throughout the house and I don't know how or where she got all of it, so it's not that big a deal since it wasn't mine but still...I definitely think I'm going to just watch youtubers play the game from now on.
Amid The Ruins was worse, but both were the worst in the entire series.
Garbage episode that killed all the interest I had for season 3. Episode 5 goes against everything that is considered good storytelling. You don't fucking create a new location(Wellington) and hype it up for the entire season and then make it a determinant place that will not matter at all in the next season. You also don't fucking name an episode "No Going Back" and make everyone fucking go back to the shithole you were trying to leave 2 episodes ago and then say it's a valid and logical ending. Shorette and Breckon must be fired.
I never noticed that.
I wish i had your clairvoyance abilities to know when a trash character is going to make a shit deus ex machina re-introduction. Leave the next day? Jane still lingering around. Wait a couple days? Jane still lingering around. It's a shit come back and it's impossible to deny that.
Do you ever make a post based on logical points and not "it gud cuz i liked it"?
The Jane non-canon ending.
You're probably going to get shit for saying that.
Cool. Let me say that again.
Garbage
Non-canon
Ending
I'll be watching, have fun.
Well he's right even still.. I've said the exact same thing right after the finale was released. Jane's ending felt a lot more strange and less logical and especially with that family of weirdos at the gates.. Jane's ending to me also felt more like a punishment for allowing yourself to be deceived by Jane's mind games.
I didn't disagree...I just didn't want to be apart of what was coming.
i think IMO Jane's ending was mysterious yet it gets me curious and interested of whats gonna happen next.... i'm enough with those emotional endings as in season 1 , i admit kenny's ending was good but.. it's... -coughs- overrated..
and i'm getting alot of hate because i said that...
If Shorette was fired, we wouldn't have had Zero Sum.
I'm sure the only reason you feel this way is because Kenny is determinant now.
Nick Breckon and Pierre Shorette are good writers
Why exactly are we judging them solely on a single flop? Or more importantly, judging them on episodes that really weren't a flop outside of the general opinion of this single forum, since the reception for episodes 3 and 5 have actually been pretty good in accordance to just about everything that isn't this forum, a forum which itself probably isn't indicative of any more than 5% of the total playerbase?
Maybe there's a possibility that these episodes are not as bad as you make them out to be, but you're just blowing faults out of proportion to justify all of the vitriol you continue to pump out all over season 2?
Stop, and think about what you just said. Then laugh, laugh really, really hard.
Not everything a writer writes is perfect, there will always be the things that are good and the things that are bad or viewed as one or the other in varying outlooks, and that's just how it goes. I'd rather they learn and improve than say they should quit or be fired, that's silly.
Although to your forum comment I have to disagree in some ways. Just because we're on this forum and no matter how great or few our numbers are, doesn't make our opinions any less or more valid than main reviewers out there that play and score the game, or just gamers or fans in general who do the same. Singling out one place out of the entire net where where negative or positive opinions are expressed, and putting a percentage to it as if we don't matter is wrong. And on terms of negative opinions, they're not isolated here alone, nothing ever is for any game or show.
Isn't this one of the reasons why forums exist, that aside from discussing and chatting with other fans, people can give an honest opinion on whether they liked something or not? If we only pointed out the good things we liked and not the bad, that would be like ignoring the negatives completely, and if you ignore the negatives how would Telltale ever know to take it into account the next time or work on it if they did indeed choose to listen to that?
Even so, if a fan wants to make a thread praising a game for it's every detail that they loved, then a fan should be allowed to make a thread saying the things they didn't like or hated even. People should be allowed to talk about what they want, so long as they aren't abusive to others in the process and that includes Telltale themselves.
That's all I wanted to say ;_; please don't murder me.
I wasn't trying to undervalue anyone's opinions, nor was I trying to undervalue the opinions of this forum, so I apologize if that comment came off that way. I was more trying to put into perspective that the beliefs/opinions of these forums, no matter how valid they are, are not fully representative of the general reception of the season/episodes. As in, the word of this forum is not the ultimate say (although I think most people realize that). People here do indeed have very valid complaints, and there's people here that are able to voice them in a civil manner, and that's great, and they definitely deserve to be heard, I'm not doubting that at all. I'm mainly calling out the select few that are quite... "vocal" about their opinions and thoughts on this season.
Luke's death ripped off Titanic? Yeah, because we all know Titantic totally invented drowning. LOL. Yeah, but seriously, I do kinda see where you're coming from though.
I think it struggled with direction after In Harm's Way. The effect of losing a direct antagonist really set in. Look how bad Resident Evil is without Wesker
Before you go disrespecting writers and calling them amateurs with this:
'I don't blame Breckon entirely since I know his original plan was Kenny vs Luke but was changed by those amateurs Petty and Stripe, so he only had so much to work with.'
Maybe know how a lead writer works and have something to backup your claim, or at least put your 'opinion' across more respectfully. He was in charge of the project overall, so everything would have been given the all clear by him. (As an aside, depending on how Telltale works, he might not have been in total charge of the story's direction either. Companies work differently, but generally, a lead writer has a big hand in shaping the story.)
And, as mentioned above by Lilac, not everything a writer writes is perfect. In fact, pretty much nothing is. There just comes a point where you have to stop agonising over every little detail and ship it out, because you could be making changes forever. Plenty of things are subjective as well. (You were the one who said forum members have thought of a better story, right? It might please you, but does it please everyone else? It's not a question to be answered either, as you can't possibly know the answer even if you may claim you speak for the majority. And it's in no shape or form easy to write a good story.) To touch on the 'nothing is perfect' argument further too, I could call Stephen King a rubbish writer because I disliked Insomnia. It was overly long, tedious and took ages to start (200+ pages), with the only positives being that the writing and characters were as good as always. But if I were to do that, I would never have read Salem's Lot or Under the Dome, which I enjoyed (despite Salem's Lot having some corny elements in my view). Also, something isn't lazy just because you would have done something differently. People really should stop throwing that word around.
I should make it clear my issue with your original post isn't because you're criticising season 2 either, despite myself thinking it was pretty good overall, but it's how you're wording your criticism. And by the way, I do agree that logically, someone would have likely been hurt/killed during the gunfight.
Oh, and Clem_Is_Awesome (above was obviously to the OP), I love you. Calling for writers to be fired. Needn't worry about the state of the forum with people like you here.
@Deltino,
Season 2, on Steam, has a 96% positive rating and Season 1 has a 97%. I might have the wrong figures, but there's only a 1% difference.
I see it as TellTale trying to imitate what Yager did with Spec Ops' choices. Y'know, the one's that didn't amount to shit. But made you feel like the choices you were making had a bigger impact on the larger scheme of things.
Killing the angry mob or just walking away = Nothing, but was such an interesting point in and of itself because choosing the ladder was kind of a hidden thing and the game itself tried pushing players to violence. Never would I had thought the first time playing that you had to actually aim your weapons (which auto locks to the crowd and then aim UP toward the air and fire a warning shot). I mean, it was manipulative as all hell.
The difference, unfortunately, is that TellTale games has always been about the choices affecting things whereas with Spec Op's the choices were just placed there to make gamers feel alienated and detached from the game itself. You can't have it both ways unfortunately.
Thing is, the consequences of the choices Clem is "allowed" to make SHOULD have an impact.
The game treats starving at the observation deck with no food & water as having the same outcome as leaving immediately. Doesn't anyone else see how dumb this is? The leaked choices for Amid The Ruins even considered this decision noteworthy enough to take percentages of, before it was quickly changed to "how many of you like babies?"
Look at how many voted on both
Don't care. Word your criticism better. It's common decency. Think about how you'd feel if someone said that about you.
There are plenty of ways of saying what you did without calling them amateurs. It's not that I think they're going to be hurt from it either, but what it is about is the mentality that people can be as rude or as disrespectful as they want without harm. Things would go much more smoothly online without the insults and you're more likely to be listened to (when it comes to those you're trying to reach, the developers/writers). If it was me personally, the moment you start throwing an insult around, I wouldn't really listen.
And I would look into your facts about those two writers being responsible for changing the story's direction. That's what I meant about backing up your claim, because all I can see regarding that is 'someone thinks that happened' without anything to back it up. Something that doesn't hold much water, as it is likely that Nick was okay with it.
You're making this personal and trying to turn it into a heated argument.