I hate how so many people want a character like Sarah to die, but want more cookie-cutter survivalists like Jane
God forbid we get some interesting perspectives once in a while right
I don't think I could hate anyone in this game knowing that they're all fictional characters. I comforted, motivated, and saved Sarah at every point up until she fell off the deck, but how are people trying to say that Sarah wasn't useless or a burden? Because if she wasn't, what exactly was she? Certainly not a resourceful ally. She reminds me of that one girl from the TV show who was scared all the time (and killed her sister or something, I don't remember), now I hated her. Ironically didn't feel any hate towards Sarah for the definite burden she was though. Maybe it's because her dad was useful, or maybe it was because I knew that as protagonist, I couldn't die choosing to save her. Sarah could be "sweet and endearing" all day, but she's definitely still useless and can be quite annoying. For anyone who's capable of hating characters in this game, it's certainly fair to hate her.
Edit: Now that I think about it, I probably can say that I hated Nick. Not how he was written, but because he was written. He was a stubborn, jumpy, dibshit and he killed Matt because of it.
I know she was a contrast to show that Clementine would've ended up being that pathetic if not for the aid of Lee. As I said though, the comparison is so blunt and devoid of any subtly that it loses all weight and thus ends up making Sarah a joke of a character.
"Remember when Clementine couldn't shoot and had to learn? Well, here's Sarah to swing a gun around like she's an infant with a piece of cake. Get it? You're her Lee, you teach her how to shoot even though you're not actually teaching her anything. All you're saying is 'it's just a thing.'"
Clementine, can you (an eleven year old girl) protect me and allow me to force myself onto you because TT is trying desperately to show a co… morentrast between 'innocent' and 'worldly survivor' so blatant that it lacks any and all subtly needed to form a decent contrast in the first place. Derp."
Uhh you do realize this is what Clementine in season 1 was basically all about though right? Sarah was a means to show us the player, what would have happened to Clem if Lee never did anything to teach Clem how to protect herself, which he basically never did until Chuck told him to.
Sure Sarah wasn't exactly a resourceful ally, but she wasnt necessarily useless. She was always willing to help whenever she could, she just didn't have a lot of opportunities given to her. But that's besides the point. The thing about the whole sarah hate train is people always bring up that she's a worthless burden. First of all, she isn't a burden at any point whatsoever. The reasons people claim for her to be a liability or screw over the group make no sense (ben on the other hand committed actions that directly disadvantaged the group). Secondly, so f*cking what? Last time I checked, the worth of a human being isn't how practically useful they are, it's the amount of love and kindness they spread, which Sarah has in spades. If you truly feel Sarah's a worthless turd for not being a mega cool survivor, there's legitimately something wrong with your psychology.
I don't think I could hate anyone in this game knowing that they're all fictional characters. I comforted, motivated, and saved Sarah at eve… morery point up until she fell off the deck, but how are people trying to say that Sarah wasn't useless or a burden? Because if she wasn't, what exactly was she? Certainly not a resourceful ally. She reminds me of that one girl from the TV show who was scared all the time (and killed her sister or something, I don't remember), now I hated her. Ironically didn't feel any hate towards Sarah for the definite burden she was though. Maybe it's because her dad was useful, or maybe it was because I knew that as protagonist, I couldn't die choosing to save her. Sarah could be "sweet and endearing" all day, but she's definitely still useless and can be quite annoying. For anyone who's capable of hating characters in this game, it's certainly fair to hate her.
Edit: Now that I think about it, I probably can say that… [view original content]
Sure Sarah wasn't exactly a resourceful ally, but she wasnt necessarily useless. She was always willing to help whenever she could, she just… more didn't have a lot of opportunities given to her. But that's besides the point. The thing about the whole sarah hate train is people always bring up that she's a worthless burden. First of all, she isn't a burden at any point whatsoever. The reasons people claim for her to be a liability or screw over the group make no sense (ben on the other hand committed actions that directly disadvantaged the group). Secondly, so f*cking what? Last time I checked, the worth of a human being isn't how practically useful they are, it's the amount of love and kindness they spread, which Sarah has in spades. If you truly feel Sarah's a worthless turd for not being a mega cool survivor, there's legitimately something wrong with your psychology.
I did not like Sarah. It's one thing for her to be naive about the ZA and not able to do certain survival tasks but seriously. She is able to know that she can't be seen by Carver, but can't assess the situation after being captured? She can't stfu when Clem tells her she needs to be quiet. She can't realize the man who shot Walter in cold blood and broke a few of Carlos's fingers in front of her is the reason she got hit by her father. She can't trim plants. There is only so much I can sympathize with her.
No, I agree though. Just cause a character's personality is someone model, nice, and sincere doesn't mean I'll take the bait and just automatically like them for no other reason than "she's nice though!" She was boring, dense, and borderline idiotic. Standing around for an unknown amount of elapsed time holding a pair of plyers not doing the task she was very carefully explained how to do is plain idiotic. I don't care that she was earlier hit either. If she would've kept her mouth shut in front of the ruthless tyrant, she would've been fine.
I don't know, it seems a lot of people here simply can't make a case for her, they say "she was a good person." And? She was lazily written and a bore to interact with throughout the duration of her time in the game. I guess being naïve and extremely stupid but kind is enough for a character to amass a fan base as ravenous and sensitive as hers. Whatever, Sarah was boring.
Being "always willing to help whenever she could" is hardly an attribute when she can't/wont do shit she's asked. How the hell do you figure she wasn't a liability when for instance she barely got through the herd, and after Carlos gets shot runs off and has to have Clementine/Luke (determinately) save her?
the worth of a human being isn't how practically useful they are, it's the amount of love and kindness they spread
This made me lol, what the hell is this? I eat sweet food almost everyday but this single post may have given me diabetes.
If you truly feel Sarah's a worthless turd for not being a mega cool survivor, there's legitimately something wrong with your psychology
And if you believe this you are not only a shallow bigot, but sincerely stupid. You don't have to be "mega cool" to want to survive, btw. Which Sarahs character obviously doesn't want too. It's how her character was written and it was brilliant, but she's still useless whether you like it or not.
Sure Sarah wasn't exactly a resourceful ally, but she wasnt necessarily useless. She was always willing to help whenever she could, she just… more didn't have a lot of opportunities given to her. But that's besides the point. The thing about the whole sarah hate train is people always bring up that she's a worthless burden. First of all, she isn't a burden at any point whatsoever. The reasons people claim for her to be a liability or screw over the group make no sense (ben on the other hand committed actions that directly disadvantaged the group). Secondly, so f*cking what? Last time I checked, the worth of a human being isn't how practically useful they are, it's the amount of love and kindness they spread, which Sarah has in spades. If you truly feel Sarah's a worthless turd for not being a mega cool survivor, there's legitimately something wrong with your psychology.
Being "always willing to help whenever she could" is hardly an attribute when she can't/wont do shit she's asked. How the hell do you figure… more she wasn't a liability when for instance she barely got through the herd, and after Carlos gets shot runs off and has to have Clementine/Luke (determinately) save her?
the worth of a human being isn't how practically useful they are, it's the amount of love and kindness they spread
This made me lol, what the hell is this? I eat sweet food almost everyday but this single post may have given me diabetes.
If you truly feel Sarah's a worthless turd for not being a mega cool survivor, there's legitimately something wrong with your psychology
And if you believe this you are not only a shallow bigot, but sincerely stupid. You don't have to be "mega cool" to want to survive, btw. Which Sarahs character obviously doesn't want too. It's how her character was written and it was brilliant, but she's still useless whether you like it or not.
To some people, especially in an apocalyptic situation, how useful someone is could very much determine their worth. It's not very compassionate and deeply self-interested, but there's no way to prove it's wrong
To some people, especially in an apocalyptic situation, how useful someone is could very much determine their worth. It's not very compassionate and deeply self-interested, but there's no way to prove it's wrong
Why is not having compassion or being self-interested wrong? Can you prove that it's wrong? What makes something right or wrong? Do we like those attributes(compassion, selflessness, etc) because they're intrinsically good? Or are those attributes good because we like them? The same applies for things that are considered morally wrong/bad. You can't prove moral rightness or wrongness. Morals can be rationally attacked or defended, but moral arguments don't lead to any external truths
I'm just very curious, on how keeping someone that useless around is bad morally. Liking someone as a person and not as a tool is just how the world should work. I dont get how only caring about yourself and only keeping around those who are more useful is good. i agree that morals arent good or bad, but its also really hard to not see things like that as bad
Why is not having compassion or being self-interested wrong? Can you prove that it's wrong? What makes something right or wrong? Do we like … morethose attributes(compassion, selflessness, etc) because they're intrinsically good? Or are those attributes good because we like them? The same applies for things that are considered morally wrong/bad. You can't prove moral rightness or wrongness. Morals can be rationally attacked or defended, but moral arguments don't lead to any external truths
Why is treating people as a means to an end wrong? Just b/c Sarah's nice, why is wrong to leave Sarah behind? But like said, do you dislike it b/c it's bad or is it it bad b/c you dislike it?
I'm just very curious, on how keeping someone that useless around is bad morally. Liking someone as a person and not as a tool is just how t… morehe world should work. I dont get how only caring about yourself and only keeping around those who are more useful is good. i agree that morals arent good or bad, but its also really hard to not see things like that as bad
I dont know i always just get upset about this whole Sarah deal and all her hate. I was thinking with my own morals in mind without thinking of yours of any of the others. my apologies. I can't see the same way, i couldnt, but i do understand a decent amount of people here DO think that way, it just hurts when i think of the sarah situation in amid the ruins
Why is treating people as a means to an end wrong? Just b/c Sarah's nice, why is wrong to leave Sarah behind? But like said, do you dislike it b/c it's bad or is it it bad b/c you dislike it?
Their excuse is that Clementine was at least useful (and "likable"). Guess a lot of them either forget or just don't care that Sarah got Clementine peroxide for her bite.
Now, did Sarah do a lot? No, I won't deny that. My fondness for her isn't just because she was nice; I personally found her character interesting, and I wanted to help her.
Exactly. If she had that unforgiving, survivalist mentality that folks seem to want to glorify, Sarah would've identified Clementine as a threat to the group, trying to steal valuable supplies. Which leads to her calling for the rest of the group who catch Clementine red handed, which than leads to them either stuffing her back into the shed and locking it down tighter (where she than dies from blood loss or infection), or just flat out killing her on the spot. Look at that, Sarah's kind hearted weakness saved a life.
Their excuse is that Clementine was at least useful (and "likable"). Guess a lot of them either forget or just don't care that Sarah got Cle… morementine peroxide for her bite.
Now, did Sarah do a lot? No, I won't deny that. My fondness for her isn't just because she was nice; I personally found her character interesting, and I wanted to help her.
No need to apologize. I saved Sarah, or at least tried to anyway. I can understand why people may have disliked her, but I think hating her is a bit much...but a lot of people don't like others who are 'too' cheerful all the time...they find that annoying in itself, probably b/c they lack the capacity to have a cheerful demeanor. The game shows us a lot about the moral code of the writers of the show and where they stand on these issues
Because i dislike it, you're correct.
I dont know i always just get upset about this whole Sarah deal and all her hate. I was thinking wi… moreth my own morals in mind without thinking of yours of any of the others. my apologies. I can't see the same way, i couldnt, but i do understand a decent amount of people here DO think that way, it just hurts when i think of the sarah situation in amid the ruins
I replied to that person agreeing about his thoughts on sarah, and why she isn't a burdon. I do see the insulting nature of the end in it, and he shouldn't have said that either. Its like, you two are both basically saying the other has issues if you have a certain opinion
Didn't ask you what the rules were either.
My retort was no more indirect or a "personal offense" than DarkTimeCop, yet your reply to that person was "Amen".
Hop off. Thanks.
It's a tad sad imo, because the writers should be neutral instead of being biased. Episode 4 was the least received episode due to the writer(s) having an obvious dislike for Nick and Sarah, and too much care for Jane and Kenny. I think being cheerful in dark times is a good thing though, staying positive and being nice is what matters a lot to me. I do see why people could dislike her like you said, just not hate
No need to apologize. I saved Sarah, or at least tried to anyway. I can understand why people may have disliked her, but I think hating her … moreis a bit much...but a lot of people don't like others who are 'too' cheerful all the time...they find that annoying in itself, probably b/c they lack the capacity to have a cheerful demeanor. The game shows us a lot about the moral code of the writers of the show and where they stand on these issues
She had plenty of personality, much more than the rest of the cabin group...and all the season 2 characters for that matter. Unless he cheered for every single character's death than it's fucked up he cheered for the mentally disabled child character
I don't hate her personally, she was a great character. Now what i'm about say may piss some of you off, so please don't take offence to this. Its her fucking fanbase that pisses me off. Have any of you lads been to Tumbler during post-Amid to Ruins after Sarah's death. I have and let me tell you, those guys hated Season 2 more than any of the forum users here combine. Shivers
I do see the insulting nature of the end in it, and he shouldn't have said that either. Its like, you two are both basically saying the other has issues if you have a certain opinion
Good job piecing that together all by yourself. I'm so proud of you. A jab for a jab, maybe next time stay out of it.
I replied to that person agreeing about his thoughts on sarah, and why she isn't a burdon. I do see the insulting nature of the end in it, a… morend he shouldn't have said that either. Its like, you two are both basically saying the other has issues if you have a certain opinion
I do see the insulting nature of the end in it, and he shouldn't have said that either. Its like, you two are both basically saying the othe… morer has issues if you have a certain opinion
Good job piecing that together all by yourself. I'm so proud of you. A jab for a jab, maybe next time stay out of it.
I don't hate her personally, she was a great character. Now what i'm about say may piss some of you off, so please don't take offence to thi… mores. Its her fucking fanbase that pisses me off. Have any of you lads been to Tumbler during post-Amid to Ruins after Sarah's death. I have and let me tell you, those guys hated Season 2 more than any of the forum users here combine. Shivers
She had plenty of personality, much more than the rest of the cabin group...and all the season 2 characters for that matter. Unless he cheered for every single character's death than it's fucked up he cheered for the mentally disabled child character
I'm fully capable of behaving myself on the internet, thanks mom. All you ended up doing was derailing the thread to the point of this current subsection of conversation. All because you wanted some part. Your response was unnecessary. For future reference; I know the forum rules.
Comments
I hate how so many people want a character like Sarah to die, but want more cookie-cutter survivalists like Jane
God forbid we get some interesting perspectives once in a while right
Amen.
I don't think I could hate anyone in this game knowing that they're all fictional characters. I comforted, motivated, and saved Sarah at every point up until she fell off the deck, but how are people trying to say that Sarah wasn't useless or a burden? Because if she wasn't, what exactly was she? Certainly not a resourceful ally. She reminds me of that one girl from the TV show who was scared all the time (and killed her sister or something, I don't remember), now I hated her. Ironically didn't feel any hate towards Sarah for the definite burden she was though. Maybe it's because her dad was useful, or maybe it was because I knew that as protagonist, I couldn't die choosing to save her. Sarah could be "sweet and endearing" all day, but she's definitely still useless and can be quite annoying. For anyone who's capable of hating characters in this game, it's certainly fair to hate her.
Edit: Now that I think about it, I probably can say that I hated Nick. Not how he was written, but because he was written. He was a stubborn, jumpy, dibshit and he killed Matt because of it.
You just repeated what I had already stated.
I know she was a contrast to show that Clementine would've ended up being that pathetic if not for the aid of Lee. As I said though, the comparison is so blunt and devoid of any subtly that it loses all weight and thus ends up making Sarah a joke of a character.
"Remember when Clementine couldn't shoot and had to learn? Well, here's Sarah to swing a gun around like she's an infant with a piece of cake. Get it? You're her Lee, you teach her how to shoot even though you're not actually teaching her anything. All you're saying is 'it's just a thing.'"
She doesn't do anything- that's why people hate her. She's sweet, but utterly useless...that's why people hate her.
But I must add, although I think she's useless, I liked sarah. I saved her from the trailer park and tried to save her at Parker's Run.
But she was written to be a minor plot device to test the PCs morality when it comes to pragmatic survivalism.
I just found her annoying....
Sure Sarah wasn't exactly a resourceful ally, but she wasnt necessarily useless. She was always willing to help whenever she could, she just didn't have a lot of opportunities given to her. But that's besides the point. The thing about the whole sarah hate train is people always bring up that she's a worthless burden. First of all, she isn't a burden at any point whatsoever. The reasons people claim for her to be a liability or screw over the group make no sense (ben on the other hand committed actions that directly disadvantaged the group). Secondly, so f*cking what? Last time I checked, the worth of a human being isn't how practically useful they are, it's the amount of love and kindness they spread, which Sarah has in spades. If you truly feel Sarah's a worthless turd for not being a mega cool survivor, there's legitimately something wrong with your psychology.
Hm, I was the person who was relatively neutral about her. She was never a favourite but I didn´t see anything wrong with her either.
I tried to let her do her own thing at Carver´s, for example, but didn´t let her die at the trailer.
Amen
She was annoying and useless.
I did not like Sarah. It's one thing for her to be naive about the ZA and not able to do certain survival tasks but seriously. She is able to know that she can't be seen by Carver, but can't assess the situation after being captured? She can't stfu when Clem tells her she needs to be quiet. She can't realize the man who shot Walter in cold blood and broke a few of Carlos's fingers in front of her is the reason she got hit by her father. She can't trim plants. There is only so much I can sympathize with her.
"You're evil!" Shouted all the Sarah fans.
No, I agree though. Just cause a character's personality is someone model, nice, and sincere doesn't mean I'll take the bait and just automatically like them for no other reason than "she's nice though!" She was boring, dense, and borderline idiotic. Standing around for an unknown amount of elapsed time holding a pair of plyers not doing the task she was very carefully explained how to do is plain idiotic. I don't care that she was earlier hit either. If she would've kept her mouth shut in front of the ruthless tyrant, she would've been fine.
I don't know, it seems a lot of people here simply can't make a case for her, they say "she was a good person." And? She was lazily written and a bore to interact with throughout the duration of her time in the game. I guess being naïve and extremely stupid but kind is enough for a character to amass a fan base as ravenous and sensitive as hers. Whatever, Sarah was boring.
Being "always willing to help whenever she could" is hardly an attribute when she can't/wont do shit she's asked. How the hell do you figure she wasn't a liability when for instance she barely got through the herd, and after Carlos gets shot runs off and has to have Clementine/Luke (determinately) save her?
This made me lol, what the hell is this? I eat sweet food almost everyday but this single post may have given me diabetes.
And if you believe this you are not only a shallow bigot, but sincerely stupid. You don't have to be "mega cool" to want to survive, btw. Which Sarahs character obviously doesn't want too. It's how her character was written and it was brilliant, but she's still useless whether you like it or not.
please don't resort to personal offenses yo, and usefulness still doesn't equal how worthy they are to be alive
To some people, especially in an apocalyptic situation, how useful someone is could very much determine their worth. It's not very compassionate and deeply self-interested, but there's no way to prove it's wrong
that immediately makes it wrong though
Why is not having compassion or being self-interested wrong? Can you prove that it's wrong? What makes something right or wrong? Do we like those attributes(compassion, selflessness, etc) because they're intrinsically good? Or are those attributes good because we like them? The same applies for things that are considered morally wrong/bad. You can't prove moral rightness or wrongness. Morals can be rationally attacked or defended, but moral arguments don't lead to any external truths
I never "hated" Sarah, but I knew she wouldn't last long and was a liability to the other's so I was glad when she died.. That risk was gone!
Please don't tell me what to do, yo.
This is subjective.
I'm just very curious, on how keeping someone that useless around is bad morally. Liking someone as a person and not as a tool is just how the world should work. I dont get how only caring about yourself and only keeping around those who are more useful is good. i agree that morals arent good or bad, but its also really hard to not see things like that as bad
I'm not telling you what to do, it's a forum rule to not use personal offenses at other users.
Didn't ask you what the rules were either.
My retort was no more indirect or a "personal offense" than DarkTimeCop, yet your reply to that person was "Amen".
Hop off. Thanks.
Why is treating people as a means to an end wrong? Just b/c Sarah's nice, why is wrong to leave Sarah behind? But like said, do you dislike it b/c it's bad or is it it bad b/c you dislike it?
That's pretty fucked up. You were happy that a little girl with mental problems died pretty horribly?
Because i dislike it, you're correct.
I dont know i always just get upset about this whole Sarah deal and all her hate. I was thinking with my own morals in mind without thinking of yours of any of the others. my apologies. I can't see the same way, i couldnt, but i do understand a decent amount of people here DO think that way, it just hurts when i think of the sarah situation in amid the ruins
I guess Sarah haters are going to pretend that Clementine hasn't gotten people killed too. (Lee)
Their excuse is that Clementine was at least useful (and "likable"). Guess a lot of them either forget or just don't care that Sarah got Clementine peroxide for her bite.
Now, did Sarah do a lot? No, I won't deny that. My fondness for her isn't just because she was nice; I personally found her character interesting, and I wanted to help her.
Exactly. If she had that unforgiving, survivalist mentality that folks seem to want to glorify, Sarah would've identified Clementine as a threat to the group, trying to steal valuable supplies. Which leads to her calling for the rest of the group who catch Clementine red handed, which than leads to them either stuffing her back into the shed and locking it down tighter (where she than dies from blood loss or infection), or just flat out killing her on the spot. Look at that, Sarah's kind hearted weakness saved a life.
No need to apologize. I saved Sarah, or at least tried to anyway. I can understand why people may have disliked her, but I think hating her is a bit much...but a lot of people don't like others who are 'too' cheerful all the time...they find that annoying in itself, probably b/c they lack the capacity to have a cheerful demeanor. The game shows us a lot about the moral code of the writers of the show and where they stand on these issues
I replied to that person agreeing about his thoughts on sarah, and why she isn't a burdon. I do see the insulting nature of the end in it, and he shouldn't have said that either. Its like, you two are both basically saying the other has issues if you have a certain opinion
Or that a character with zero personality was finally out of the narrative perhaps?
It's a tad sad imo, because the writers should be neutral instead of being biased. Episode 4 was the least received episode due to the writer(s) having an obvious dislike for Nick and Sarah, and too much care for Jane and Kenny. I think being cheerful in dark times is a good thing though, staying positive and being nice is what matters a lot to me. I do see why people could dislike her like you said, just not hate
She had plenty of personality, much more than the rest of the cabin group...and all the season 2 characters for that matter. Unless he cheered for every single character's death than it's fucked up he cheered for the mentally disabled child character
I don't hate her personally, she was a great character. Now what i'm about say may piss some of you off, so please don't take offence to this. Its her fucking fanbase that pisses me off. Have any of you lads been to Tumbler during post-Amid to Ruins after Sarah's death. I have and let me tell you, those guys hated Season 2 more than any of the forum users here combine. Shivers
Good job piecing that together all by yourself. I'm so proud of you. A jab for a jab, maybe next time stay out of it.
Trying to make things peaceful, i don't want these forums to go apeshit again
I saw a few of the long blog posts about it, some of them had some valid points but most of it was needless accusations and rants.
Name me one personality trait she had outside of being a young dense naïve child...
I'm fully capable of behaving myself on the internet, thanks mom. All you ended up doing was derailing the thread to the point of this current subsection of conversation. All because you wanted some part. Your response was unnecessary. For future reference; I know the forum rules.