Do you think Christa failed?
As Lee I asked Christa and Omid to take care of Clementine, because she would be relatively happy with them (as Lee said). In more than 16 months Christa has found no safe place to live at and Clementine seems to have lost a lot of her spirit. We start the game waiting for a rodent on a stick to be cooked, it's evening, it's cold, Clementine has not even a jacket. When Jane showed Clementine how to take out walkers in a safe and fast way (I didn't think it was a good method, but the game wanted to present it like that) or what to look for on dead bodies we had no option of saying: "I already know that, Christa taught me." Even Clementine's "stitching skills" were more of a danger than a help. And when talking about her past Christa doesn't seem to have made a great impact on Clementine. Then we got assaulted (and were overwhelmed of course, because Christa prefers to stay away from groups), fell into a river and wandered around in soaking wet clothes .... well, Clementine was real lucky to survive that. Sure, she managed to keep Clementine alive for 16 months. But we don't know how - maybe they had tons of luck, maybe they stole from others, maybe they just ran out of people to take advantage of. And finally Christa's plan was to go to Wellington, an idea lots of you, especially those who don't like Kenny, regard as a foolish trip to nowhere.
What do you think? Has Christa failed? Are these just writing oversights or is this just nitpicking on my part?
Comments
Probably just writing oversights.
I give christa a lot of credit. After 2 minutes by herself clementine had already nearly drowned been mauled by a dog and was about to be eaten by walkers.
She did the best she could under the circumstances. Clementine is still alive, isn't she?
Christa kept Clementine healthy and nourished. She looked, although a bit ragged, very much well-fed and clean. No bruises, lacerations, any noticeable injuries. And although they seemed to be struggling a bit with the food what with the rain putting out their fire, they were at least doing a far better job than Kenny just wanting to continue traversing the frozen wastes looking aimlessly for a hidden community with dwindling resources and low food supplies. Even after everyone either left or died and a newborn was running out of formula AND they had a young child who had just been shot AND a vehicle with very limited gas.
So if Christa failed, Kenny failed just to watch himself fail even harder and then failed some more... Kenny's a failure is the point I'm trying to get across.
Christa was a very smart survivor, but after the death of Omid, I think she looked at taking care of Clementine as not only a burden, but a moral obligation. She acts very coldly towards Clementine in the beginning of Episode 1, and if that's any indication as to how she treated Clem during those 16 months after Omid's death, then that would explain why Clementine had lost a lot of her spirit. Being around someone who blames you for the death of their husband/boyfriend and refuses to join other groups would definitely have a huge mental effect on anyone, especially someone as young as Clementine. Christa seems to hold a small resentment towards Clem, but at the same time, knows she can't just abandon a young girl like her to fend for herself, and like I said, that resentment seemed to have had a huge effect on Clem's mentality. So while she does try to take care of Clementine, she doesn't properly do so and fails to teach her anything of importance, such as tending a fire. All she really did was keep her alive, and that's it. The reason Lee has such an impact was not only because he kept her alive, he taught her how to shoot a gun, cut her hair so she can be safe, and actually acted like a father figure towards Clem, while Christa failed to act as a sort of mother type of figure. So this could explain why Clem rarely talks about Christa, despite the fact that she was with her longer than anyone. So in that regard, I think she failed, as she not only held the death of Omid over Clem's head the entire time, but failed to really provide Clem with any sort of care and didn't provide her with any useful survival tools compared to Lee, and that is why she doesn't really talk about her.
TLDR: Christa emotionally neglected Clem compared to Lee and made her feel guilty about Omid, so yeah, she failed.
You have a point, but I think the death of Omid really hit the pair hard. Before he died they looked really happy, and seemed to have their shib together. Clem looked a little sad, but I think she was still lingering on Lee and her parents. Christa and Omid couldn't look more happy. After he died things(Rick voice) took a nosedive. I think Clem somewhat feels responsible for his death. And by the way Christa conversed with her, I think Christa blamed her for it. But she took care of her for 16 months single handed. To say that she failed is a huge slap in the face. I say she won gold.
Clementine already knew about the knee trick before Jane. Episode 2 as a proof.
She kept Clementine alive for 4 times as long as Lee did.
That is not failure.
When does she kick someone in the back of the knee in episode 2 in order to incapacitate them?
She kept Clementine alive for 16 months, I think she did a pretty good job of protecting her the best she could.
One way or another Clementine survived for 16 months with her. I'm very grateful to her.
I think Christa deserved more credit than she got.
It's actually a determinant scene on the bridge. But Aron's still wrong as there is a difference between doing something while being aware that it works and doing something while just trying to survive.
Doesn't matter which part of the knee. She can kick two walkers or just one, at the bridge
That's not determinant, watch the whole bridge action moment.
Right sorry, that still doesn't prove that she knew this trick, otherwise we probably would have had the option to tell that to Jane.
Episode 4 was terrible written. The writer probably didn't watch the previous episodes carefully.
Honestly, yes, for the reasons you said and because of... Well, I'll just copy and paste something I wrote earlier:
Christa and Omid: "Hey, 9 year old Clem, go check out the bathroom without us even though it's extremely possible that there's murderers, bandits, rapists, and/or walkers in there who might outnumber you and the bullets in your gun! Us having sex is more important than your safety right now! Man oh man, we sure are making Lee proud! Parents of the year award! More than 16 months later after having reunited and I still haven't taught you how to make a fire! Yep, definitely a better guardian than Lee just because I was with you longer!"
I truly believe that not even Ben would've done something as stupid as that.
My Lee is rolling in his grave.
They have all made mistakes. Even Lee was worried that he wasnt doing the best for Clem all the time. Maybe Christa tried to teach her to make fire amd it just didnt click. Thats no reason to throw away Sixteen months of care that she gave her. Who knows if Lee could have done any better.
Right but Jane's trick was more than just 'kick walkers', the whole point is to kick them in the back of the knee to make them collapse forward..
Isn't it kinda funny that Kenny haters are obssesed with him, and bring him up every chance they get? Aren't those the things you'd expect from a fanboy?
I said it doesn't matter which part of the knee you should kick.
I see alot of people blaming Clem for getting mauled by a starving animal.
She's 11 yrs old, she obviously never had a dog or been exposed to any animals (predator or otherwise) extensively. Cut her some slack, she was lonely, by herself and trying to do something good for another living being no matter how misguided she was in her actions. The only thing she could have done differently in that situation, is use the dog bowl under the barbeque to put some food in for Sam before she started eating herself. And i consider that the developers fault, not Clems, as they put the bowl there but didn't give Clem the chance to use it.
As to your next fault of Clem, almost drowning. Jeez man, she fell off of a cliff, into a river, after being chased through the forest by a creepy dude, who either killed or kidnapped her companion. Oh, and don't forget the zombies wandering around, and all of this happening within 5 minutes. None of which is on Clem, or directly related to a conscious decision that she made one way or the other. What did you want her to do? Actually drown?
Christa has probably failed the least in comparison to pretty much every other character that gets labeled as 'Clementine's new guardian.'
Now that's a very one-dimensional argument.
Rhetorically asking a loaded question doesn't help to make Kenny look any better. If you have an actual defense to present to me, speak it. Otherwise, you're just wasting my time.
I'm still a bit sour about the Christa situation as it is
She took care of Clementine for what, 4 times as long as Lee did?
For the Lee/Clementine relationship being such a key component to the first season, the time spent with Christa undervalues the time spent with Lee, and at worst, almost makes that relationship look like a joke in comparison
The problem I have with Kenny's Wellington trip wasn't necessarily Wellington. The problem was Kenny's particular execution in getting them there. Christa probably would have taken a much more calculated and structured route to do so. For example Christa (if she was in Kenny's shoes), instead of choosing between Howe's and Wellington like an ultimatum, would have had the soundness of mind to at least consider stopping at Howe's before ultimately heading to Wellington, taking their time and regrouping at Howe's--which they actually knew the location of--and getting some food and rest before continuing on their dangerous journey to find Wellington. If the winter had come on too strongly too quickly, Christa could've considered waiting until it got warmer before looking for Wellington, while Kenny literally had no idea where it was or how close they were, and was forcing his group to look and look and look with a hungry baby through bitter cold and snow. Instead of just walking up to the Wellington gates, I'd imagine Christa could have taken a page out of Rick's book with how he approached Terminus in the show, and she probably could've buried at least the one gun Kenny/Clem/AJ had had for safe-keeping weeeell out of sight of Wellington if something went wrong once they did enter (if they had taken the time to scavenge before heading straight to Wellington, they could've buried even more back-up supplies as well) and then they could've tried to scope out Wellington from a distance for a little while and observe what they could about the Wellingtonians, or at least scope out the entire boundary of this little civilization. More research always helps.
That's how I imagine a more sane, cautious person like Christa would've done it.
Also, 16 months is a hell of a long time to keep a kid alive, especially a kid who accidentally caused you so much pain in the past. So yes, you are nitpicking. Quite a lot.
Christa did her job to the best of her ability given her situation. Obviously her relationship with Clementine soured after Omid's passing, but in no way she failed. We know they had a plan and Christa made sure Clem knew or was going to know how to survive properly. They survived together for a long time, job well done.
I love how people think when they run into a problem with the story they just immediately blame the "bad writing". Freaking scapegoat.
are you trying to say that Christa emotionally neglected Clem in the 16 months?That sounds like a legit reason that Clem wouldn't mention her. Damn, I feel bad for Clem now.
This is exactly what I was going to say. I got the impression from their brief campfire scene together that Christa had been holding Clem in some kind of contempt for Omid's death. Maybe even unconsciously, but still. Their interactions in that scene were in such stark contrast to what we'd just seen in the previous scene when Omid was still alive. They didn't act like friends at all. Just like two emotionally distant strangers surviving together cause, what other choice was there? I'm not blaming Christa per se, I certainly understand where she's coming from. (And let's not forget she lost her child somehow along the way too). But everyone is always complaining about how Clem spent more time with Christa than anyone else, so why does Clem place so much emphasis on Lee or even Luke? Because Lee and Luke were Clem's friends, her family even. She had a strong emotional connection with both. Whereas I believe that connection with Christa was severed before it ever really began. It's a really sad thought.
I'm praising christa not blaming clementine, shes a kid I expect her to not be great.
Basically, yes, that sums it up pretty well.
That's probably the reason why Christa was written out and quickly replaced by Kenny, she would have caused the least amount of conflict in the group and would have created the least amount of drama in the story.
What really bothers me is that the writers didn't seem to put much thought into the implications of the 16-months-later skip. Season 2 could have taken place just a month after Season 1 and virtually nothing would have been different.
Season 2's writers seem to mistake immaturity for drama.
Plot holes ARE bad writing.
The "she kept her alive for 16 months" argument is weak in my eyes. Would you also say Carlos did a great job with Sarah, because he kept her alive for 16 months+? And once again, we don't know how they survived. Maybe they barely escaped death on a regularly basis. Christa's qualities as a mentor or guardian can only be measured on Clementine's knowledge and behaviour. Based on what I and some other posters stated she did way worse than one could have expected of her. Kenny or Vernon as possible guardians don't look so bad in comparison to me. O̶r̶ ̶e̶v̶e̶n̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶s̶t̶r̶a̶n̶g̶e̶r̶?̶ ̶I̶ ̶m̶e̶a̶n̶ ̶h̶e̶ ̶h̶a̶d̶ ̶a̶ ̶c̶a̶r̶.̶
The problem is, we don't see just how bad Christa supposedly was as Clementine's guardian to make us feel sorry for Clementine that she had to put up with Christa for nearly two years. Sure Christa was emotionally distant, but there's no sign of abuse or neglect, and in spite of Christa's cold attitude towards Clementine not once does she abandon her nor sell her out to the bandits that ambushes them at the beginning of Season 2. Clementine was well fed, had a realistic outlook on how to survive in a zombie apocalypse, and was certainly not sheltered and coddled.
Clementine barely seems to mention much or care much about Christa on her own initiative, and requires the player's input to say 'where's Christa?' and 'I'm worried that she's dead'. Seeing how quickly she forgets about her and bonds with Luke, a guy she known for about a week, and Kenny, who barely spoke to her in the entirety of Season 1 and suddenly becomes his best friend upon their reunion...I can't help but feel that the writers are telling us that we're supposed to not care about Christa having bothering to look after a girl of nine years for the sake of a dying man's wish, and continues to watch out for her in spite of losing her beloved partner and her unborn child.
If anything, Clementine comes across as ungrateful and selfish for not caring enough and subsequently forgetting about the fate of a woman who gave up everything to keep her alive for nearly two years, just because their relationship was a little strained after what happened to Omid and the unborn child.
Actually I'm not trying to belittle what Christa has done. I just dislike how they handled everything that has got to do with Christa and that strange 16 month timeskip. The search for Christa could have delivered at least some kind of connection between the happenings of ep 1 - 5 and some overarching task for Clementine. If they would have emphasised Clementine's refusal of Christa we could have accompanied Clementine on the travel of realising that just because you nearly spent 2 years with someone doesn't mean you have to stay with her and like her and there's other people you feel more drawn to because they make you laugh or give you hope instead of just "keeping you alive".
Or you could use every chance you get to look for Christa even if that means you risk the life of your new friends (or are they?), because you feel you owe it to her and this one time it's you that has to keep her alive or save her.
But they did neither.
If you still try to look favourable at the writing the possible conclusions are either that Clementine is ungrateful or selfish, as you said, or Christa failed at building a relationship of trust between them and at giving Clementine something she has to be grateful for. Or maybe Clementine suffers from amnesia?
Not everyone is affectionate and physically demonstrative. I got the impression that Christa was just not that type of person. She never hugged or kissed Omid and they were clearly devoted to each other. I think saying Clem was emotionally neglected was too harsh. She never mentions her parents either. Maybe some subjects are too painful to talk about.
What has Kenny and Vernon taught her that makes Christa look worse in comparison?