You know what, I completely ignored the gun: I was talking about Arvo taking on Kenny in an actual fight that time.
Also, forgive me for being presumptuous, but I think Arvo shooting Kenny would've been karmic given all he did to him; Clementine just happened to show up at the wrong time, under the wrong conditions. Assuming Jane would actually be decent enough to actually help Kenny, I'd be fine with that.
If he shot both Clementine and Kenny, though? Yeah, I'd probably be a little miffed at all of them.
Can you imagine how outraged players would've been if Arvo had stayed instead of "running off like a coward," then Kenny had attempted to attack him and Arvo shot him in self-defense?
I didnt like that guy from the moment I saw him and was severely dispointed I couldn't kill him while I was robbing him. Was disappointed I couldn't help Kenny kick the shit out of him..
Well, I guess I know what sort of person you are.
I dont really get the benefit of arvo in season 3,. A redemption is impossible for such a horrid character and killing him doesnt seem that relevant either
I dont really get the benefit of arvo in season 3,. A redemption is impossible for such a horrid character and killing him doesnt seem that relevant either
There's a time management that befalls games like TWD in which relevant things must be explored in a fairly quick manner and having all these stupid factitious characters that didn't add any real forward momentum to the past season being re-explored because of a conclusion means most likely people know in their heart-of-hearts that they sucked. Why else would people need to feel validated and comforted by a slightly more complete character arc?
I dont really get the benefit of arvo in season 3,. A redemption is impossible for such a horrid character and killing him doesnt seem that relevant either
I am glad that you at least have made an effort to consider his position.
I was half-expecting you to burp out that Arvo does not even deserve comprehension because of the abhorrent tyrant that he is, because a good portion of the users believe that.
I am glad that you at least have made an effort to consider his position.
I was half-expecting you to burp out that Arvo does not even de… moreserve comprehension because of the abhorrent tyrant that he is, because a good portion of the users believe that.
I completely understand why he shot her, but I'm just protective over Clem, and anyone who hurts her just fires up the flames. For example, I wanted Carver dead the moment he smacked Clem in the face if you smart mouth him in the beginning, beating Kenny was just more fuel to the fire. And don't even get me started on Troy, but hands down Arvo to me is just the worst since he really almost killed her.
I am glad that you at least have made an effort to consider his position.
I was half-expecting you to burp out that Arvo does not even de… moreserve comprehension because of the abhorrent tyrant that he is, because a good portion of the users believe that.
I think that's the reason most people don't like Arvo and the other villains/mooks/neutrals/heroes who they feel wronged by. Honestly, Arvo is kinda overrated as a 'villain' since the fact that he took a shot at Clementine that actually hit her is pretty much all he's recognized for.
I know this is technically a critique against Arvo, but I never took him as much of a threat. Maybe its because of his initial lack of nerve, maybe its because Jane makes a similar fuckup with Sarah, or maybe its because I personally can't stand when people are forced into unbalanced situations out of their control. Or maybe it speaks for how much faith I have in Clementine, in which case neutral delivery boys like Arvo or thuggish nihilists like Michelle are barely a threat.
I completely understand why he shot her, but I'm just protective over Clem, and anyone who hurts her just fires up the flames. For example, … moreI wanted Carver dead the moment he smacked Clem in the face if you smart mouth him in the beginning, beating Kenny was just more fuel to the fire. And don't even get me started on Troy, but hands down Arvo to me is just the worst since he really almost killed her.
I really don't see how you can forgive someone literally trying to kill you.
It's because some are able to understand his motivation and mindset, actually.
Was he supposed to take yet another beating from the one-eyed asshole?
Not justifying what Kenny had done to Arvo previously, but after shooting Clementine, I'd say Arvo deserved more than just another beating, to be honest.
before running off like a coward, afraid of the repercussions of his actions.
Are you kidding?
Was he supposed to take yet another beating from the one-eyed asshole?
By this point I think that cripple already died. He cant run away from walkers for too long. I hope Bonnie and Mike died with him. My Clem never wants to see his face again, but if she does she will kill him of course.
If that is how you feel, then I would say that the unjustified beatings that he had received beforehand compensate for those that he won for shooting a kid with a shotgun.
Was he supposed to take yet another beating from the one-eyed asshole?
Not justifying what Kenny had done to Arvo previously, but after shooting Clementine, I'd say Arvo deserved more than just another beating, to be honest.
If that is how you feel, then I would say that the unjustified beatings that he had received beforehand compensate for those that he won for shooting a kid with a shotgun.
@OneWayNoWay said that they believe Arvo deserved more than another beating for shooting Clementine, so I responded that Arvo had received numerous undeserved beatings before; as if things were balanced out like they are now.
If that is how you feel, then I would say that the unjustified beatings that he had received beforehand compensate for those that he won for shooting a kid with a shotgun.
@OneWayNoWay said that they believe Arvo deserved more than another beating for shooting Clementine, so I responded that Arvo had received numerous undeserved beatings before; as if things were balanced out like they are now.
Well, that's where the uncertainty comes in: on one hand, Arvo deciding to hurt Clementine could be seen as unconventional justice for ultimately ruining his life; but on the other, he's mostly acting on typical revenge for the abuse Kenny inflicted on him, which means he's hurting a comparatively innocent child for what a far more guilty adult did. So, whether he was acting a bit disproportionately or not, I think the answer is a bit hard to just up and decide.
I guess the "right" thing to do would be to call him out on it and send him pac'in "before I change my mind," considering what type of person Arvo was/is up till that point; plus, I think the idea of Kenny, who had been excessively mistreating him ever since the firefight due to his slipping rage, unexpectedly giving Arvo a good dress down for truly being a lowlife and then ignoring him in favor of helping Clementine would be an awesomely heroic moment for him since it shows that, when push comes to shove, he's willing to put the life of the people he cares about before personal retribution for his benefit.
Honestly, I think the idea of Arvo having a legitimate reason to be angry with Clementine but going too far because of Kenny should've been developed a little more than it was. Again, Arvo is a character with a relatively solid foundation to him but it feels like certains steps were half-assed or outright skipped. Same thing with Sarah and arguably Rebecca.
@OneWayNoWay said that they believe Arvo deserved more than another beating for shooting Clementine, so I responded that Arvo had received numerous undeserved beatings before; as if things were balanced out like they are now.
Touché. But like I said, Clem getting shot is a pretty big deal. I'm wondering where her mindset is after that. You can't really tell how she's feeling at the end of the episode. Because of said pressing matters.
2 years is a long time to process this type of trauma. Which is a little upsetting imo. Lee dies, let's skip ahead, Omid dies, let's skip ahead, Clem gets shot + cliffhanger ending, let's skip ahead. I really hope they stop the time jumps. She's growing up too fast, dammit. Although more aligned with the comics is pretty awesome. So, whatever.
Sweeping it under the rug, and claiming it as shit happens, is a little lazy, imo.
As would a lot of things. Season 2 already has several instances of that, too.
Oh! I'm really sorry about that. I read the description, but the general trend of previous comments seemed to be about Arvo returning, and I… more think that caused my mind to shift gears a little. Sorry for any frustration. I think that I'll just type up an edited section on my original post that pertains more to your topic.
This doesn't mean that I don't sympathize with her, though! What I am saying is that I do not prefer nor favor her over other survivors for the sole reason that she has had an unimaginably horrific experience.
I feel that Arvo shooting her is something that she would like to keep out of mind, although nonetheless it would occasionally rear its ugly head. I feel that her realizing, hey, this shot was a few inches away from killing me, would cause her some anxiety over how fragile her life is. I get that this is obviously drilled in by the many deaths of others, but I assume the fact that this happened to her would make everything seem more personal and real.
Well said
Also, she would probably feel a deep anger towards Arvo. While she sympathized with his position before the shooting, it's kind of hard to absolve someone of guilt when they deliberately try to physically harm or kill you.
I guess you could say that my Clementine would be in the middle on forgiveness towards Arvo. If they were to cross paths, she wouldn't exact… more revenge on him. She would simply never forget what he did to her, and would still feel unsafe and untrusting towards him. She emphasized with the situation he was in back then, and would never harm him, but she would never be able to form a stable and friendly relationship.
But uh, either way, I don't think that I would want Arvo to return. There are some characters that I am more open to the return of, but Arvo isn't really one of them. I don't mean this to be rude, either.
EDIT: Well, my previous answer was a little off topic. On topic response, her I come!
At this point, Clementine has experienced many near-death experiences. However, Arvo shooting her is the only one which we know of where someone alive deliberately got that close to killing her. (She has been harmed and attacked by others b… [view original content]
Clem getting shot is a pretty big deal. I'm wondering where her mindset is after that. You can't really tell how she's feeling at the end of the episode. Because of said pressing matters.
Agreed. Like I said, at lot of things are glossed over due to pressing matters, particularly where Clementine is involved, but yeah, you'd think GETTING SHOT would leave an impact on her.
She's growing up too fast, dammit.
Aaand you've just said one of the reasons why things like Edgy!Clem and what little I've seen of The New Frontier don't really appeal to me very much.
Touché. But like I said, Clem getting shot is a pretty big deal. I'm wondering where her mindset is after that. You can't really tell how sh… moree's feeling at the end of the episode. Because of said pressing matters.
2 years is a long time to process this type of trauma. Which is a little upsetting imo. Lee dies, let's skip ahead, Omid dies, let's skip ahead, Clem gets shot + cliffhanger ending, let's skip ahead. I really hope they stop the time jumps. She's growing up too fast, dammit. Although more aligned with the comics is pretty awesome. So, whatever.
Once again...[imagine gif of hands weighing agreement/disagreement]
Some characters kinda meh to me sympathy/likable wise for that exact/opposite reason. Its up to you whether who you like more between Clementine and Kenny or Carver and Arvo, but expecting me to put more effort into caring about the traditionally "badass" characters(Kenny, Lilly, Jane, I wish Carver) than those who aren't (Clementine, Ben, Sarah, lopsidedly Arvo) is kinda too...Carver. Or rather, not worth the investment since being badass means they can handle their issues a lot better than they do. I know Kenny has no problem committing murder, I know Jane doesn't care what other people do or think, and I know Carver is a dangerous man, but whether Clementine will keep a healthy conscience or Sarah will gain control over her emotions or Arvo be able to keep himself from cracking is automatically more interesting because there is a growing process involved.
To be fair, everyone has gone through so much.
This doesn't mean that I don't sympathize with her, though! What I am saying is that I do … morenot prefer nor favor her over other survivors for the sole reason that she has had an unimaginably horrific experience.
Edited section
This applies to Kenny as well.
Comments
You know what, I completely ignored the gun: I was talking about Arvo taking on Kenny in an actual fight that time.
Also, forgive me for being presumptuous, but I think Arvo shooting Kenny would've been karmic given all he did to him; Clementine just happened to show up at the wrong time, under the wrong conditions. Assuming Jane would actually be decent enough to actually help Kenny, I'd be fine with that.
If he shot both Clementine and Kenny, though? Yeah, I'd probably be a little miffed at all of them.
Isn't that technically the case with Nick, Rebecca, Bonnie, and Jane anyway? Uneasy foes who became close allies after straightening things out?
As far I see, Lee is giving him what he deserves.
No you don't
You're probably right, but all I thought about when I read that was GTA. Rob someone, shoot em, then kick em while he's down!
You clearly need a new pair of glasses.
Well after that arvo certainly does
I dont really get the benefit of arvo in season 3,. A redemption is impossible for such a horrid character and killing him doesnt seem that relevant either
Hmm...explain?
My glasses work just fine, I see and understand why he did it, but shooting Clem is too far.
After he bounces on the floor, they appear to be just fine.
I agree.
There's a time management that befalls games like TWD in which relevant things must be explored in a fairly quick manner and having all these stupid factitious characters that didn't add any real forward momentum to the past season being re-explored because of a conclusion means most likely people know in their heart-of-hearts that they sucked. Why else would people need to feel validated and comforted by a slightly more complete character arc?
I am glad that you at least have made an effort to consider his position.
I was half-expecting you to burp out that Arvo does not even deserve comprehension because of the abhorrent tyrant that he is, because a good portion of the users believe that.
I think they might be mixing him up with Carver. Easy mistake.
I completely understand why he shot her, but I'm just protective over Clem, and anyone who hurts her just fires up the flames. For example, I wanted Carver dead the moment he smacked Clem in the face if you smart mouth him in the beginning, beating Kenny was just more fuel to the fire. And don't even get me started on Troy, but hands down Arvo to me is just the worst since he really almost killed her.
I think that's the reason most people don't like Arvo and the other villains/mooks/neutrals/heroes who they feel wronged by. Honestly, Arvo is kinda overrated as a 'villain' since the fact that he took a shot at Clementine that actually hit her is pretty much all he's recognized for.
I know this is technically a critique against Arvo, but I never took him as much of a threat. Maybe its because of his initial lack of nerve, maybe its because Jane makes a similar fuckup with Sarah, or maybe its because I personally can't stand when people are forced into unbalanced situations out of their control. Or maybe it speaks for how much faith I have in Clementine, in which case neutral delivery boys like Arvo or thuggish nihilists like Michelle are barely a threat.
You know, as someone who doesn't mind Arvo that much, that's actually pretty funny.
Clementine: Screw you, Arvo. I'm not even that mad--I got other things to spend my time on.
I'm sure some people understand Lilly's mindset and motivation but nobody's gonna forgive her.
Ah, I never got to play TFTBL due to money reasons. I played the demo but it's been so long ago that I forgot almost everything about it. lmao
Not justifying what Kenny had done to Arvo previously, but after shooting Clementine, I'd say Arvo deserved more than just another beating, to be honest.
By this point I think that cripple already died. He cant run away from walkers for too long. I hope Bonnie and Mike died with him. My Clem never wants to see his face again, but if she does she will kill him of course.
If that is how you feel, then I would say that the unjustified beatings that he had received beforehand compensate for those that he won for shooting a kid with a shotgun.
I forgave her.
Ehhhhh...?
[Imagine gif of shaking hand weighing agreement/disagreement]
If she comes back and shows legitimate remorse and/or signs of becoming a better person, I'll gladly forgive her.
@OneWayNoWay said that they believe Arvo deserved more than another beating for shooting Clementine, so I responded that Arvo had received numerous undeserved beatings before; as if things were balanced out like they are now.
er... shotgun?
Well, that's where the uncertainty comes in: on one hand, Arvo deciding to hurt Clementine could be seen as unconventional justice for ultimately ruining his life; but on the other, he's mostly acting on typical revenge for the abuse Kenny inflicted on him, which means he's hurting a comparatively innocent child for what a far more guilty adult did. So, whether he was acting a bit disproportionately or not, I think the answer is a bit hard to just up and decide.
I guess the "right" thing to do would be to call him out on it and send him pac'in "before I change my mind," considering what type of person Arvo was/is up till that point; plus, I think the idea of Kenny, who had been excessively mistreating him ever since the firefight due to his slipping rage, unexpectedly giving Arvo a good dress down for truly being a lowlife and then ignoring him in favor of helping Clementine would be an awesomely heroic moment for him since it shows that, when push comes to shove, he's willing to put the life of the people he cares about before personal retribution for his benefit.
Honestly, I think the idea of Arvo having a legitimate reason to be angry with Clementine but going too far because of Kenny should've been developed a little more than it was. Again, Arvo is a character with a relatively solid foundation to him but it feels like certains steps were half-assed or outright skipped. Same thing with Sarah and arguably Rebecca.
I think he'll at least get a mention, but hopefully, he'll show up in a recap or flashback of Season Two.
If I ever see him again, I'm gonna beat him to death with my pistol.
Ah, fuck me, Raven.
Touché. But like I said, Clem getting shot is a pretty big deal. I'm wondering where her mindset is after that. You can't really tell how she's feeling at the end of the episode. Because of said pressing matters.
2 years is a long time to process this type of trauma. Which is a little upsetting imo. Lee dies, let's skip ahead, Omid dies, let's skip ahead, Clem gets shot + cliffhanger ending, let's skip ahead. I really hope they stop the time jumps. She's growing up too fast, dammit. Although more aligned with the comics is pretty awesome. So, whatever.
Right? She's gone through so much, but this was just the cherry on top.
I forgive you my child. lol, no it's my fault. Should've picked a better title, as this discussion is more about Clem.
To be fair, everyone has gone through so much.
This doesn't mean that I don't sympathize with her, though! What I am saying is that I do not prefer nor favor her over other survivors for the sole reason that she has had an unimaginably horrific experience.
Edited section
This applies to Kenny as well.
Well said
I agree.
Agreed. Like I said, at lot of things are glossed over due to pressing matters, particularly where Clementine is involved, but yeah, you'd think GETTING SHOT would leave an impact on her.
Aaand you've just said one of the reasons why things like Edgy!Clem and what little I've seen of The New Frontier don't really appeal to me very much.
Once again...[imagine gif of hands weighing agreement/disagreement]
Some characters kinda meh to me sympathy/likable wise for that exact/opposite reason. Its up to you whether who you like more between Clementine and Kenny or Carver and Arvo, but expecting me to put more effort into caring about the traditionally "badass" characters(Kenny, Lilly, Jane, I wish Carver) than those who aren't (Clementine, Ben, Sarah, lopsidedly Arvo) is kinda too...Carver. Or rather, not worth the investment since being badass means they can handle their issues a lot better than they do. I know Kenny has no problem committing murder, I know Jane doesn't care what other people do or think, and I know Carver is a dangerous man, but whether Clementine will keep a healthy conscience or Sarah will gain control over her emotions or Arvo be able to keep himself from cracking is automatically more interesting because there is a growing process involved.
Sanji and that guy were basically the same person.