I would rather the game be as separate from the settings and characters of the comic as possible, and as such am dreading this becoming integral to Season 3.
Don't get me wrong, I would love for the game to take a more comic themed approach in regards to development, atmosphere etc. But I want it to happen without actually relying on the comic material itself, which seems to be the case since we are conveniently in Virginia rather than any other place on the east coast that TellTale could explore.
I guess as long as any comic characters in the series have a minor role similar to those of Hershel and Glenn and are only in it for an episode or two, I'll get over it. However this is one of many vices that's hanging over my head that stops me from getting overly optimistic about ANF.
This is an extremely nitpicky thing. I know TellTale's engine improves with every iteration of TWD. However, the changes to Clementine bugs me a little bit. She seems like a different person each episode. I hope with the flashbacks in ANF, we will see Season 2 Clem in the new engine to sort of add some continuity to her changing model. They sort of did this in Season 2 when we saw Season 1 Clem in the Season 2 engine. I mean, she looks the same but also looks different (a change that isn't related to growing up and being malnourished). Like, her hair is not even curly/frizzle-like anymore in the new ANF model. It looks almost straight now. I know sweat, dirt, and blood will mat down hair, but still... it looks completely different. Even her skin tone changes each season. This is probably just me.
The last third of Long Road Ahead is boring as hell. I understand that it was necessary to introduce Christa and Omid and to further Clementine's character development, but good fucking god did it drag. I can't help but wonder if there was some other alternative where the writers could've accomplished the same goals without boring the audience to tears. But that's just my opinion though. I know a lot of people love this episode and that's fine if they do, but the last third alone is what makes it my least favorite episode of Season 1.
I know this is an old comment but I thought Melissa did a great job in both seasons. Clem has lost so much, her parents, Lee, Omid and Christa etc. I thought Melissa did great in capturing a monotone voice that fit Clementine's character because of all of her losses. And then during heavy scenes like the end of 205, Clem's voice picks up and gets even better.
I know this is an old comment but I thought Melissa did a great job in both seasons. Clem has lost so much, her parents, Lee, Omid and Chris… moreta etc. I thought Melissa did great in capturing a monotone voice that fit Clementine's character because of all of her losses. And then during heavy scenes like the end of 205, Clem's voice picks up and gets even better.
agree. troy is just an asshole. Randall atlest gets some characterization on his view point at the end of episode 2.
telltale should not do evil monster villains anymore in twdg. it seems they can't do it carver is generic as is troy. they should stick to sympathetic villains like the stranger and norma and do the over the top evil on other games.
I guess it's not so much an unpopular opinion but i just can't why Telltale decided to create Jane instead of bringing back Molly. Molly and… more Jane are such similar characters and even their backstory is pretty much the same. The only real difference is that the player actually have a reason to save Molly. The choice at the end became a no-brainer for me because Telltale have had 2 seasons of character development on Kenny while we knew Jane for less than 2 episodes.
Well, less "die" and more "exit chased by a bear," as I accidentally found out on my second playthrough. Unless there's something else I don't know about.
because molly was always ment to be a one shot character. besides people complained she did not gell well in the walking dead setting.
also molly can die in episode 4.
The last third of Long Road Ahead is boring as hell. I understand that it was necessary to introduce Christa and Omid and to further Clement… moreine's character development, but good fucking god did it drag. I can't help but wonder if there was some other alternative where the writers could've accomplished the same goals without boring the audience to tears. But that's just my opinion though. I know a lot of people love this episode and that's fine if they do, but the last third alone is what makes it my least favorite episode of Season 1.
Worry not. I gotcha covered.
First of all, there's a whole thread dedicated to this topic. Lot of good explenations in there. I sugest yo… moreu look at sialark's comment.
Then, we got this wall of text, made by me, responding to some of your dislikes of her character. It's more of a justification of her actions, but if you read in between the lines, you'll find some positives. Namely, the 'What Jane says and stand for' vs 'What she actually decides and does'. This shows that despite having her own ideals of being a loner and avoiding burdens, most of the time she is on screen, she's actually going against those same ideals and helping people (who she doesn't even know!) and carrying burdens. Examples of this is putting Clem and Sarah's life ahead of herself on the save Sarah scenario, despite having earlier said that saving her wasn't worth it; voluntarily going down to save Sarah on the observation deck, despite believing that the girl was to… [view original content]
agree. troy is just an asshole. Randall atlest gets some characterization on his view point at the end of episode 2.
telltale should not … moredo evil monster villains anymore in twdg. it seems they can't do it carver is generic as is troy. they should stick to sympathetic villains like the stranger and norma and do the over the top evil on other games.
I guess it's not so much an unpopular opinion but i just can't why Telltale decided to create Jane instead of bringing back Molly. Molly and… more Jane are such similar characters and even their backstory is pretty much the same. The only real difference is that the player actually have a reason to save Molly. The choice at the end became a no-brainer for me because Telltale have had 2 seasons of character development on Kenny while we knew Jane for less than 2 episodes.
In fact, the point when they arrive at the train is where the boredom starts for me—then I am kept on the edge of my seat when Kenny and Katjaa discuss what to do with Duck, and then I am bored again after Katjaa commits suicide.
The last third of Long Road Ahead is boring as hell. I understand that it was necessary to introduce Christa and Omid and to further Clement… moreine's character development, but good fucking god did it drag. I can't help but wonder if there was some other alternative where the writers could've accomplished the same goals without boring the audience to tears. But that's just my opinion though. I know a lot of people love this episode and that's fine if they do, but the last third alone is what makes it my least favorite episode of Season 1.
I can't speak for BetterToSleepahem Sleepy Sleepster, here, but I can give you my two cents: Molly and Jane have very little in common personality wise. I don't get why, but them both having sisters seems to lead people onto thinking they're the same!?
Molly is a playful and sarcastic person. She has this whole "making a sarcastic joke while insulting you but getting away with it" thing going on. She seemed a tad immature. Calling Vernon a fossil to his face, telling Kenny to stick his finger up his ass, treating the "geek" threat as some sort of funny game. Jane on the other hand socializes with people in a way more "cold"/distant way. While Molly just jumped into sarcasting jokes and insults upon metting people, creating some sort of early trust between everyone, Jane seems to have no time for that. Jane instead of wasting time in formalities and silly talk, goes right to the point, we can see as much in her first line ("Actually, I do it all the time."). No hellos, no ineterst in anything but formulating a plan to escape. Jane only jumps onto making jokes after you're "warm" with her.
Molly is without doubt hot headed and reckless. She goes out of her way to beat a zombie, makes lots of noise while doing so, and then jumps off buildings like it was nothing. She was also overly emotional. Unlike Jane and Troy, she goes out of her way to hunt down vengeance while Jane seems to take no ineterst in such thing, ever. Jane is as we all know, somewhat calculative and cool headed. She doesn't really take interest in vengeance for Troy (he comes to her afterall) showing that she has survival well above the emotional shit in her list of priorities. We never really see her having an outburst of violence, unlike Molly with Logan. In fact, I have a really hard time seeing Jane loosing her cool at all or wasting time with her past. That, when put into hindsight with Molly wasting time beating an already dead man for some silly vengeance, and looking for a picture in a walker filled building while carrying an important object, shows how different they are.
Oooh, polarized as in very different! Okay. I thought he meant that as in they both have hard to figure out morals, which I disagree with.
But yeah, as I said up above, Molly felt like was intentionally trying to irk your nerves, whereas Jane just seemed naturally unpleasant.
We never really see her having an outburst of violence, unlike Molly with Logan. In fact, I have a really hard time seeing Jane loosing her cool at all or wasting time with her past.
Uh, no, we do: that seems to be the main reason she doesn't stop the fight with Kenny. Any intentions on stopping the fight and executing the final step of her plan went out the window when she jumped on him, slashed him with her knife when she was pulled/knocked off, and then insists that he has to die if Clementine tries to get her to stop. In fact, that seems to be the reason she came up with that poorly thought through plan to begin with.
While she doesn't really waste time with her past, it is also the driving force behind much of her reasoning and many of her actions:
She pressures Clementine into potentially leaving Sarah(whose suffering from trauma induced PTSD) because she's suffering from her own PTSD over having no choice but to leave her sister behind.
She tries to convince Clementine that Kenny's losing it(which is pretty obvious by that point) by coming him to Carver, despite barely knowing either for presumably a week or two and apparently failing to see her own similarities to him.
Some theorize that she's obsessed with Clementine as a way of either making up for what she did to Jaime or even pursuing something as dissimilar an experience as possible to replace her.
I can't speak for BetterToSleep ahem Sleepy Sleepster, here, but I can give you my two cents: Molly and Jane have very little in common pers… moreonality wise. I don't get why, but them both having sisters seems to lead people onto thinking they're the same!?
Molly is a playful and sarcastic person. She has this whole "making a sarcastic joke while insulting you but getting away with it" thing going on. She seemed a tad immature. Calling Vernon a fossil to his face, telling Kenny to stick his finger up his ass, treating the "geek" threat as some sort of funny game.
Jane on the other hand socializes with people in a way more "cold"/distant way. While Molly just jumped into sarcasting jokes and insults upon metting people, creating some sort of early trust between everyone, Jane seems to have no time for that. Jane instead of wasting time in formalities and silly talk, goes right to the point, we can see as much in her first line ("Actually, I do… [view original content]
Uh, no, we do: that seems to be the main reason she doesn't stop the fight with Kenny. Any intentions on stopping the fight and executing the final step of her plan went out the window when she jumped on him, slashed him with her knife when she was pulled/knocked off, and then insists that he has to die if Clementine tries to get her to stop. In fact, that seems to be the reason she came up with that poorly thought through plan to begin with.
Ok, you are right, partly. I think she only gets actually pissed as fuck after he tries to attack her a second time (and it's worth noting that that stab was more of a protective reflex from his incoming attack than a murder attempt). After that, she does seem completely mad at Kenny but not to the point of wanting him dead. Instead of trying to kill him with her knife that was inches away from her, she decides to just make him suffer by gouging his eyes. It was an outburst of anger and sadism, there's no denying, but I still believe that Jane never actually seems to actively try to kill Kenny. Hurt him (a lot)? Sure, but never actual direct death.
Back to Molly... my point is that to turn someone like Jane completely over the bend you need to "poke" her quite a lot, but to make someone like Molly go wild you just have to "poke" a few times, hence them being different in that aspect.
While she doesn't really waste time with her past, it is also the driving force behind much of her reasoning and many of her actions:
About your first two points: those are completely different situations from the Molly ones. Making decisions based on your past experiences is wise. Learning from past mistakes and all of that.
Now, Molly wasn't forced onto a decision. She deliberately decided to endanger the battery and Lee's life, because she couldn't leave her past behind. Turning Logan's walker into a pulp, and getting her sister's picture wasn't mandatory in the moment. But making a decision about Sarah and dealing with the incoming Kenny clusterfuck was inevitable.
And I stand by the opinion that Jane wanting to replace her disabled and dare I say weak sister with Clementine, I repeat, Clementine - a super efficient, strong and smart kid - is ridiculous and in my honest opinion unthinkable. Clem has nothing, nothing to do with what we know of Jaime. If Jane really wanted a replacement she would've gone after Sarah.
Oooh, polarized as in very different! Okay. I thought he meant that as in they both have hard to figure out morals, which I disagree with.
… more But yeah, as I said up above, Molly felt like was intentionally trying to irk your nerves, whereas Jane just seemed naturally unpleasant.
We never really see her having an outburst of violence, unlike Molly with Logan. In fact, I have a really hard time seeing Jane loosing her cool at all or wasting time with her past.
Uh, no, we do: that seems to be the main reason she doesn't stop the fight with Kenny. Any intentions on stopping the fight and executing the final step of her plan went out the window when she jumped on him, slashed him with her knife when she was pulled/knocked off, and then insists that he has to die if Clementine tries to get her to stop. In fact, that seems to be the reason she came up with that poorly thought through plan to begin with.
While she doesn't really wast… [view original content]
About your first two points: those are completely different situations from the Molly ones.
Oh no, I didn't mean to actively compare her to Molly there. Sorry bout that!
If Jane really wanted a replacement she would've gone after Sarah.
That much, I more than agree with. But that's also what lends credence to the latter theory: Sarah, who she seemed to be legitimately unable to dissociate from Jaime, would've been the obvious choice if she needed to fill that void. However, instead of seeking to capitalize on this similarity by hooking up with her(which is actually an example of Genre Savviness, now that I think about it), she falls aggressive categorism and harshly rejects her in favor of Clementine, whose similar to Sarah and thus Jaime but also more so to Jane herself. Alas, a running theme with Jane is that she's has so much uncomfortable baggage about her that her intended good traits end being a testament to how fucked up she is, which in this case is the fact that she seems to be psychologically rejecting Jaime in favor of something different.
Uh, no, we do: that seems to be the main reason she doesn't stop the fight with Kenny. Any intentions on stopping the fight and executing th… moree final step of her plan went out the window when she jumped on him, slashed him with her knife when she was pulled/knocked off, and then insists that he has to die if Clementine tries to get her to stop. In fact, that seems to be the reason she came up with that poorly thought through plan to begin with.
Ok, you are right, partly. I think she only gets actually pissed as fuck after he tries to attack her a second time (and it's worth noting that that stab was more of a protective reflex from his incoming attack than a murder attempt). After that, she does seem completely mad at Kenny but not to the point of wanting him dead. Instead of trying to kill him with her knife that was inches away from her, she decides to just make him suffer by gouging his eyes. It was an outburst of anger and sadism, t… [view original content]
Am I a bad person? Perhaps...though I want it noted for the record I would not torture Kenny nor even Arvo....but Randall....well Randall has to learn not to poke the bear.
Am I a bad person? Perhaps...though I want it noted for the record I would not torture Kenny nor even Arvo....but Randall....well Randall has to learn not to poke the bear.
Fine....with Randall I will be sadistic...just like I approve of Jane shooting Troy in his shame stick.....but at least I would not feed anyone to a walker...directly.
I know I've said this before, but the whole "Pick this character over the other because Controversy for the sake of controversy" recurring theme in Season 2 is pretty cheap and stupid:
"Are you Team Luke or Team Kenny?"
"Do you want to rattle Carver's cage with Kenny or is cooperating with Reggie the smarter option?"
"Do you want to help the Cabin Group or join the dark side of Howe's Hardware?"
"Who deserves to be Clementine's girlfriend more: Sarah or Jane?"
"Is Mike wrong for wanting to leave or has Kenny gone too far?"
"Who will Clementine decide should ride or die for her: Kenny or Jane?"
Honestly, Pete or Nick is probably the only good example of that because it's not relying exclusively on internal conflict and it actually affects something.
There was nothing special about him. He was just a good looking and nice guy, but that's it. He was neither rude and aggressive, nor especially saint-ish. He wasn't stupid, but also not really smart. He wasn't heroic, but also not a coward. Luke was just meh. Not special enough to love or hate, he was just there.
Oh, okay I guess. I personally really like what they managed to cobble together by the end of the Season that ties everything together pretty neatly, all things considered. Of course, the main problem with Luke seemed to be that he was trying to hard to be this icon rather than a character; Carver had that problem as well.
There was nothing special about him. He was just a good looking and nice guy, but that's it. He was neither rude and aggressive, nor especia… morelly saint-ish. He wasn't stupid, but also not really smart. He wasn't heroic, but also not a coward. Luke was just meh. Not special enough to love or hate, he was just there.
I know I've said this before, but the whole "Pick this character over the other because Controversy for the sake of controversy" recurring t… moreheme in Season 2 is pretty cheap and stupid:
"Are you Team Luke or Team Kenny?"
"Do you want to rattle Carver's cage with Kenny or is cooperating with Reggie the smarter option?"
"Do you want to help the Cabin Group or join the dark side of Howe's Hardware?"
"Who deserves to be Clementine's girlfriend more: Sarah or Jane?"
"Is Mike wrong for wanting to leave or has Kenny gone too far?"
"Who will Clementine decide should ride or die for her: Kenny or Jane?"
Honestly, Pete or Nick is probably the only good example of that because it's not relying exclusively on internal conflict and it actually affects something.
Thank you for your thorough input, Iron! You mention noticeable differences that I had not taken into consideration.
The point to which I was alluding is that Molly believes that every life is valuable, regardless of whether the person's life is a drawback to the survival of the entire group; this is possibly due to her own case, in which her sister was rejected from a safe community because of her medical condition. Contrastingly, Jane, like Carver, is a utilitarianist, believing that the moral choice is to rid the group of a person that is unable to pull their weight if it means that the other survivors' safety and quality of life will improve.
I can't speak for BetterToSleep ahem Sleepy Sleepster, here, but I can give you my two cents: Molly and Jane have very little in common pers… moreonality wise. I don't get why, but them both having sisters seems to lead people onto thinking they're the same!?
Molly is a playful and sarcastic person. She has this whole "making a sarcastic joke while insulting you but getting away with it" thing going on. She seemed a tad immature. Calling Vernon a fossil to his face, telling Kenny to stick his finger up his ass, treating the "geek" threat as some sort of funny game.
Jane on the other hand socializes with people in a way more "cold"/distant way. While Molly just jumped into sarcasting jokes and insults upon metting people, creating some sort of early trust between everyone, Jane seems to have no time for that. Jane instead of wasting time in formalities and silly talk, goes right to the point, we can see as much in her first line ("Actually, I do… [view original content]
Thank you for your thorough input, Iron! You mention noticeable differences that I had not taken into consideration.
The point to which I… more was alluding is that Molly believes that every life is valuable, regardless of whether the person's life is a drawback to the survival of the entire group; this is possibly due to her own case, in which her sister was rejected from a safe community because of her medical condition. Contrastingly, Jane, like Carver, is a utilitarianist, believing that the moral choice is to rid the group of a person that is unable to pull their weight if it means that the other survivors' safety and quality of life will improve.
BetterToSleep
not "Sleep"
full username
no nickname for me
“Someone's plotting against me!”
Jane is pretty cool but I have to hate her.... I rewatch my season 2 gameplay and I can't even believe the things that she says and does. She reminds me of the darker parts of myself in some ways.... I am glad Kenny killed her in the end.
An accurate way of rephrasing that would be to say that she does not believe that a survivor's capabilities determine how valuable they can be to their respective group.
An accurate way of rephrasing that would be to say that she does not believe that a survivor's capabilities determine how valuable they can be to their respective group.
I know I've said this before, but the whole "Pick this character over the other because Controversy for the sake of controversy" recurring t… moreheme in Season 2 is pretty cheap and stupid:
"Are you Team Luke or Team Kenny?"
"Do you want to rattle Carver's cage with Kenny or is cooperating with Reggie the smarter option?"
"Do you want to help the Cabin Group or join the dark side of Howe's Hardware?"
"Who deserves to be Clementine's girlfriend more: Sarah or Jane?"
"Is Mike wrong for wanting to leave or has Kenny gone too far?"
"Who will Clementine decide should ride or die for her: Kenny or Jane?"
Honestly, Pete or Nick is probably the only good example of that because it's not relying exclusively on internal conflict and it actually affects something.
Comments
I would rather the game be as separate from the settings and characters of the comic as possible, and as such am dreading this becoming integral to Season 3.
Don't get me wrong, I would love for the game to take a more comic themed approach in regards to development, atmosphere etc. But I want it to happen without actually relying on the comic material itself, which seems to be the case since we are conveniently in Virginia rather than any other place on the east coast that TellTale could explore.
I guess as long as any comic characters in the series have a minor role similar to those of Hershel and Glenn and are only in it for an episode or two, I'll get over it. However this is one of many vices that's hanging over my head that stops me from getting overly optimistic about ANF.
This is an extremely nitpicky thing. I know TellTale's engine improves with every iteration of TWD. However, the changes to Clementine bugs me a little bit. She seems like a different person each episode. I hope with the flashbacks in ANF, we will see Season 2 Clem in the new engine to sort of add some continuity to her changing model. They sort of did this in Season 2 when we saw Season 1 Clem in the Season 2 engine. I mean, she looks the same but also looks different (a change that isn't related to growing up and being malnourished). Like, her hair is not even curly/frizzle-like anymore in the new ANF model. It looks almost straight now. I know sweat, dirt, and blood will mat down hair, but still... it looks completely different. Even her skin tone changes each season. This is probably just me.
The last third of Long Road Ahead is boring as hell. I understand that it was necessary to introduce Christa and Omid and to further Clementine's character development, but good fucking god did it drag. I can't help but wonder if there was some other alternative where the writers could've accomplished the same goals without boring the audience to tears. But that's just my opinion though. I know a lot of people love this episode and that's fine if they do, but the last third alone is what makes it my least favorite episode of Season 1.
I know this is an old comment but I thought Melissa did a great job in both seasons. Clem has lost so much, her parents, Lee, Omid and Christa etc. I thought Melissa did great in capturing a monotone voice that fit Clementine's character because of all of her losses. And then during heavy scenes like the end of 205, Clem's voice picks up and gets even better.
Couldn't have said it better myself, mate.
I find Randall to be a much more believable and realistic asshole compared to cartoon Carver and Toontown Troy.
agree. troy is just an asshole. Randall atlest gets some characterization on his view point at the end of episode 2.
telltale should not do evil monster villains anymore in twdg. it seems they can't do it carver is generic as is troy. they should stick to sympathetic villains like the stranger and norma and do the over the top evil on other games.
because molly was always ment to be a one shot character. besides people complained she did not gell well in the walking dead setting.
also molly can die in episode 4.
Well, less "die" and more "exit chased by a bear," as I accidentally found out on my second playthrough. Unless there's something else I don't know about.
The Edgy!Clem and Clem is a badass memes probably got something to do with that.
Yeeeah, that isn't the most replayable episode for exactly that reason.
I love how some of those comments are highlighting my issues with her, but whatever. Reading on...
Am I the only one who enjoyed smashing Randall's fingers to a pulp in the vice?
Molly and Jane are morally polarized characters.
I agree completely!
In fact, the point when they arrive at the train is where the boredom starts for me—then I am kept on the edge of my seat when Kenny and Katjaa discuss what to do with Duck, and then I am bored again after Katjaa commits suicide.
My fictional sadism detector is buzzing.
Not to speak for the guy, but I have no idea what you're getting at with this reply.
I can't speak for BetterToSleep ahem Sleepy Sleepster, here, but I can give you my two cents: Molly and Jane have very little in common personality wise. I don't get why, but them both having sisters seems to lead people onto thinking they're the same!?
Molly is a playful and sarcastic person. She has this whole "making a sarcastic joke while insulting you but getting away with it" thing going on. She seemed a tad immature. Calling Vernon a fossil to his face, telling Kenny to stick his finger up his ass, treating the "geek" threat as some sort of funny game.
Jane on the other hand socializes with people in a way more "cold"/distant way. While Molly just jumped into sarcasting jokes and insults upon metting people, creating some sort of early trust between everyone, Jane seems to have no time for that. Jane instead of wasting time in formalities and silly talk, goes right to the point, we can see as much in her first line ("Actually, I do it all the time."). No hellos, no ineterst in anything but formulating a plan to escape. Jane only jumps onto making jokes after you're "warm" with her.
Molly is without doubt hot headed and reckless. She goes out of her way to beat a zombie, makes lots of noise while doing so, and then jumps off buildings like it was nothing. She was also overly emotional. Unlike Jane and Troy, she goes out of her way to hunt down vengeance while Jane seems to take no ineterst in such thing, ever.
Jane is as we all know, somewhat calculative and cool headed. She doesn't really take interest in vengeance for Troy (he comes to her afterall) showing that she has survival well above the emotional shit in her list of priorities. We never really see her having an outburst of violence, unlike Molly with Logan. In fact, I have a really hard time seeing Jane loosing her cool at all or wasting time with her past. That, when put into hindsight with Molly wasting time beating an already dead man for some silly vengeance, and looking for a picture in a walker filled building while carrying an important object, shows how different they are.
Oooh, polarized as in very different! Okay. I thought he meant that as in they both have hard to figure out morals, which I disagree with.
But yeah, as I said up above, Molly felt like was intentionally trying to irk your nerves, whereas Jane just seemed naturally unpleasant.
Uh, no, we do: that seems to be the main reason she doesn't stop the fight with Kenny. Any intentions on stopping the fight and executing the final step of her plan went out the window when she jumped on him, slashed him with her knife when she was pulled/knocked off, and then insists that he has to die if Clementine tries to get her to stop. In fact, that seems to be the reason she came up with that poorly thought through plan to begin with.
While she doesn't really waste time with her past, it is also the driving force behind much of her reasoning and many of her actions:
Ok, you are right, partly. I think she only gets actually pissed as fuck after he tries to attack her a second time (and it's worth noting that that stab was more of a protective reflex from his incoming attack than a murder attempt). After that, she does seem completely mad at Kenny but not to the point of wanting him dead. Instead of trying to kill him with her knife that was inches away from her, she decides to just make him suffer by gouging his eyes. It was an outburst of anger and sadism, there's no denying, but I still believe that Jane never actually seems to actively try to kill Kenny. Hurt him (a lot)? Sure, but never actual direct death.
Back to Molly... my point is that to turn someone like Jane completely over the bend you need to "poke" her quite a lot, but to make someone like Molly go wild you just have to "poke" a few times, hence them being different in that aspect.
About your first two points: those are completely different situations from the Molly ones. Making decisions based on your past experiences is wise. Learning from past mistakes and all of that.
Now, Molly wasn't forced onto a decision. She deliberately decided to endanger the battery and Lee's life, because she couldn't leave her past behind. Turning Logan's walker into a pulp, and getting her sister's picture wasn't mandatory in the moment. But making a decision about Sarah and dealing with the incoming Kenny clusterfuck was inevitable.
And I stand by the opinion that Jane wanting to replace her disabled and dare I say weak sister with Clementine, I repeat, Clementine - a super efficient, strong and smart kid - is ridiculous and in my honest opinion unthinkable. Clem has nothing, nothing to do with what we know of Jaime. If Jane really wanted a replacement she would've gone after Sarah.
Oh no, I didn't mean to actively compare her to Molly there. Sorry bout that!
That much, I more than agree with. But that's also what lends credence to the latter theory: Sarah, who she seemed to be legitimately unable to dissociate from Jaime, would've been the obvious choice if she needed to fill that void. However, instead of seeking to capitalize on this similarity by hooking up with her(which is actually an example of Genre Savviness, now that I think about it), she falls aggressive categorism and harshly rejects her in favor of Clementine, whose similar to Sarah and thus Jaime but also more so to Jane herself. Alas, a running theme with Jane is that she's has so much uncomfortable baggage about her that her intended good traits end being a testament to how fucked up she is, which in this case is the fact that she seems to be psychologically rejecting Jaime in favor of something different.
I'm not a fan of the whole "this character fucked up and therefore they deserve die" mentality, with Kenny and/or Jane being the only exception(s).
Am I a bad person? Perhaps...though I want it noted for the record I would not torture Kenny nor even Arvo....but Randall....well Randall has to learn not to poke the bear.
It's still sadistic.
Fine....with Randall I will be sadistic...just like I approve of Jane shooting Troy in his shame stick.....but at least I would not feed anyone to a walker...directly.
I didn't care at all for Luke.
Okay then. Care to go into why?
I know I've said this before, but the whole "Pick this character over the other because Controversy for the sake of controversy" recurring theme in Season 2 is pretty cheap and stupid:
"Are you Team Luke or Team Kenny?"
"Do you want to rattle Carver's cage with Kenny or is cooperating with Reggie the smarter option?"
"Do you want to help the Cabin Group or join the dark side of Howe's Hardware?"
"Who deserves to be Clementine's girlfriend more: Sarah or Jane?"
"Is Mike wrong for wanting to leave or has Kenny gone too far?"
"Who will Clementine decide should ride or die for her: Kenny or Jane?"
Honestly, Pete or Nick is probably the only good example of that because it's not relying exclusively on internal conflict and it actually affects something.
There was nothing special about him. He was just a good looking and nice guy, but that's it. He was neither rude and aggressive, nor especially saint-ish. He wasn't stupid, but also not really smart. He wasn't heroic, but also not a coward. Luke was just meh. Not special enough to love or hate, he was just there.
Oh, okay I guess. I personally really like what they managed to cobble together by the end of the Season that ties everything together pretty neatly, all things considered. Of course, the main problem with Luke seemed to be that he was trying to hard to be this icon rather than a character; Carver had that problem as well.
I agree completely!
I completely agree.
Sounds about right.
Not sure if that's appropriate for this thread.
Thank you for your thorough input, Iron! You mention noticeable differences that I had not taken into consideration.
The point to which I was alluding is that Molly believes that every life is valuable, regardless of whether the person's life is a drawback to the survival of the entire group; this is possibly due to her own case, in which her sister was rejected from a safe community because of her medical condition. Contrastingly, Jane, like Carver, is a utilitarianist, believing that the moral choice is to rid the group of a person that is unable to pull their weight if it means that the other survivors' safety and quality of life will improve.
“Someone's plotting against me!”
Which is why she tries to kill Lee and Kenny a few times.
Jane is pretty cool but I have to hate her.... I rewatch my season 2 gameplay and I can't even believe the things that she says and does. She reminds me of the darker parts of myself in some ways.... I am glad Kenny killed her in the end.
An accurate way of rephrasing that would be to say that she does not believe that a survivor's capabilities determine how valuable they can be to their respective group.
Um...sure, let's go with that.
EDIT: OH! You meant what I was responding to? In that case, I would agree if she wasn't a loner.
What's with you and talking about Clem having a girlfriend?