Why should I care what Google thinks, I can form my own opinions. Anyway, I guess you forgot that he wasn't "forced" into a chair, he lost a fight after he tried to murder some random stranger. That's a lack of regard for human life. Plus most humans in the apocalypse don't really appreciate life and the ones that do are likely to come off as annoying pacifists causing more harm than good. Pulling the trigger, after she already pulled it once and nix happened means she didn't expect that the bullets would work and didn't want to murder Eli. And after she does kill him, she's obviously very distraught and concerned. So I don't see the "obvious lack of concern for assholes' lives" thing.
Google defines second degree murder as:
"a killing caused by dangerous conduct and the offender's obvious lack of concern for human life.… more"
Note that nowhere does it mention intention to kill, just a killing caused by dangerous and uncaring conduct. Tell me that forcing a man into a chair, and pulling a trigger in his face does not show an "obvious lack of concern for human life."
And of the definitions Google gave me, this was the more favorable one. The other one would have lumped Clem into first degree.
Personally I told the truth too but I understand other people's reasoning. Simply backing up Clementine as she gave you the benefit of the doubt and cut your bindings while agreeing to take you to the junkyard and help your family.
They'd been serving her well up until that point. She KNEW they COULD fire.
I think you're mistaken. She switches guns at the gate of Prescott. She's first using a shotgun and then when she went to use the gun, the bullets didn't work. By her reaction, it looks like that was the first time she used those bullets. It's pretty obvious that she thought all the bullets were faulty. So she was using that to her advantage to intimidate him. I'm not saying what she did was right, but she didn't mean to murder him right there.
No, when you pull a trigger on a gun, you can't call it an accident when a bullet comes out. Even if you thought they were faulty bullets. T… morehey'd been serving her well up until that point. She KNEW they COULD fire. Yet she had Javi force him into the chair, as she pulled the trigger again and again. That's second degree murder.
Other guy pointed that out. Still ridiculous for her to assume that they had a 100% failure rate. Still a murder, when you push a gun in someone's face.
Thanks for at least not being hostile about it though. You're cool, my man.
They'd been serving her well up until that point. She KNEW they COULD fire.
I think you're mistaken. She switches guns at the gate o… moref Prescott. She's first using a shotgun and then when she went to use the gun, the bullets didn't work. By her reaction, it looks like that was the first time she used those bullets. It's pretty obvious that she thought all the bullets were faulty. So she was using that to her advantage to intimidate him. I'm not saying what she did was right, but she didn't mean to murder him right there.
No, when you pull a trigger on a gun, you can't call it an accident when a bullet comes out. Even if you thought they were faulty bullets. T… morehey'd been serving her well up until that point. She KNEW they COULD fire. Yet she had Javi force him into the chair, as she pulled the trigger again and again. That's second degree murder.
Okay, no need to insult others.
Personally I told the truth too but I understand other people's reasoning. Simply backing up Clementine a… mores she gave you the benefit of the doubt and cut your bindings while agreeing to take you to the junkyard and help your family.
Lol, Google was simply defining a legal term. It's not about what Google thinks, it's about a quick definition for second degree murder. And it's accurate.
And then Javi pushed him into the chair. He was forcefully put in the chair. He was forced into the chair.
Two wrongs don't make a right. In a court of law, Clementine would be found a murderer anyways, as he was incapacitated by the time she started shooting at him.
What does people not appreciating life in the apocalypse have to do with anything? People still don't like murder for murder's sake, as Clem committed.
Still, assuming the bullets have a 100% failure rate is ridiculous, and Clementine had no reasonable reason to not understand that, especially after her YEARS of hands on experience with poorly maintained weaponry.
What the fuck was that about annoying pacifists? What? What does that have to do with anything?
She's NOT distraught. Literally her only reaction is, "oh shit, Javi cover this up, make it like it never happened Javi. I ain't going down for this, Javi." Not "Oh shit I just killed a man."
Why should I care what Google thinks, I can form my own opinions. Anyway, I guess you forgot that he wasn't "forced" into a chair, he lost a… more fight after he tried to murder some random stranger. That's a lack of regard for human life. Plus most humans in the apocalypse don't really appreciate life and the ones that do are likely to come off as annoying pacifists causing more harm than good. Pulling the trigger, after she already pulled it once and nix happened means she didn't expect that the bullets would work and didn't want to murder Eli. And after she does kill him, she's obviously very distraught and concerned. So I don't see the "obvious lack of concern for assholes' lives" thing.
Bias for Clem and the fact that minutes before I literally saw her life in danger because of what he did, and easily mine because the situation results in being distracted from the horde currently moving in, I just got done fending off the guys knife inches from my face. He had that shit coming.
Murder in the second degree, not manslaughter. Manslaughter is the entirely accidental killing of another person. 2nd degree murder is an assault which had death as a reasonable outcome. Clementine committed murder, not manslaughter.
Just something I wanted to point out.
You definitely know your shit!
But it's hard for me to take you seriously with that avatar.
Murder in the second degree, not manslaughter. Manslaughter is the entirely accidental killing of another person. 2nd degree murder is an as… moresault which had death as a reasonable outcome. Clementine committed murder, not manslaughter.
Just something I wanted to point out.
And yeah, I did that as well.
Lol, Google was simply defining a legal term. It's not about what Google thinks, it's about a quick definition for second degree murder. And… more it's accurate.
And then Javi pushed him into the chair. He was forcefully put in the chair. He was forced into the chair.
Two wrongs don't make a right. In a court of law, Clementine would be found a murderer anyways, as he was incapacitated by the time she started shooting at him.
What does people not appreciating life in the apocalypse have to do with anything? People still don't like murder for murder's sake, as Clem committed.
Still, assuming the bullets have a 100% failure rate is ridiculous, and Clementine had no reasonable reason to not understand that, especially after her YEARS of hands on experience with poorly maintained weaponry.
What the fuck was that about annoying pacifists? What? What does that have to do with anything?
She's NOT distraught. Literally her only reaction i… [view original content]
How is it biased? It's a simple opinion, I agree with her suggestions.
Staying to cover the family was the smarter thing to do to me inst… moreead of just risking anyone else getting shot. And after seeing the new frontier shoot a ten year old in the head, I agreed with her notion that they probably wouldn't bargain, so I didn't sell her out.
It's entirely subjective.
It wasn't accidental—she didn't know whether the bullets would work and she fired nonetheless. If Clementine had become surprised and instinctively pulled the trigger, then it would've been an accident.
Jesus jumped-up Christ. So she accidently killed a thief and a cheat who tried to murder her plus an unknown stranger for being called out o… moren being a piece of scum-fucking thrash. Nothing at that point suggested the bullets worked. She couldn't have known. Yes, it was very irrational and reckless but everyone would be irrational and reckless if they nearly died because they were cheated by a filthy cowardly asshole. As for telling the truth, what can I say? I have a strong personal attachment to her plus she made a convincing argument. Okay, okay she made those puppy eyes. How could I resist? Plus I would side with her regardless. And please, if you're not a new player don't use the "But Javier doesn't know Clementine and whatnot" argument, I'm playing the game, not Javier. And most people only ever use this plot breaker on Javier, yet when Clem met Ava and learnt her secrets I bet 80 % made their choice based on the fact they knew what New F… [view original content]
But if it had been Tripp or anyone else suggesting what she did, I would have backed them up as well.
I like Clementine but I genuinely agree with her.
Still ridiculous for her to assume that they had a 100% failure rate.
I agree, she was being reckless. But saying it was a straight up murder is a bit of an exaggeration since it was an accident. And let's not forget Eli was not some innocent person here, he tried to kill her a few seconds before that. I just didn't see a reason to tell the truth and risk having her locked up or worse when she was the one taking Javier back to the junkyard. Turns out, both got locked up, but obviously Javier/the player doesn't know that. But in that situation, I think covering for her had more benefits for Javier than to tell the truth. When playing these games I don't think about "what is right". It's the apocalypse, why should I be worried in telling the truth to a bunch of people I don't know when I need this girl to take me back to my family? This is not the time or place to have a mindset of "what you did was wrong and you need to suffer the consequences". At least that's how I see it.
Other guy pointed that out. Still ridiculous for her to assume that they had a 100% failure rate. Still a murder, when you push a gun in someone's face.
Thanks for at least not being hostile about it though. You're cool, my man.
It wasn't accidental—she didn't know whether the bullets would work and she fired nonetheless. If Clementine had become surprised and instinctively pulled the trigger, then it would've been an accident.
Murder in the second degree, not manslaughter. Manslaughter is the entirely accidental killing of another person. 2nd degree murder is an as… moresault which had death as a reasonable outcome. Clementine committed murder, not manslaughter.
Just something I wanted to point out.
You definitely know your shit!
But it's hard for me to take you seriously with that avatar.
Is that Pooger? Badger? What's the name?
Okay. The other guy pointed that out, too. I'll say the same thing I said there. It's ridiculous for someone as experienced with poorly maintained bullets and weaponry as Clem is to not know what a misfired bullet was. It's ridiculous that she would think 100% of them were intentionally misfiring. It's ridiculous that she would pull the trigger in the man's face. She should have known the risks, and definitely performed a 2nd degree murder.
Bias for Clem and the fact that minutes before I literally saw her life in danger because of what he did, and easily mine because the situat… moreion results in being distracted from the horde currently moving in, I just got done fending off the guys knife inches from my face. He had that shit coming.
I ended up in the cage but it wasn't for Clementine's sake. It was because Eli deserved it. I'm a player of the first two seasons as well but I'm not going to favor her in regards to my choices. I found it ridiculous that she gets mad at you for telling the truth.
Well no it isn't. You're thinking of first degree murder. First degree murder is the only type of murder that has to be planned out prior to the moment, unless it's a "heat of the passion" crime, or something like that. Second degree murder just has to be acting without regard for human life. She was acting without regard for human life.
But the thing is, Clementine knew that bullets come out when you pull the trigger. Clementine knew there were bullets in the gun. Clementine had enough experience with poorly maintained bullets and guns to know what a misfiring bullet is. Clementine had enough experience to know that just because 1 or 2 or even 3 bullets misfire, does not mean they ALL misfire. That's a ridiculous assumption she made, and is definitely second degree murder because of it.
Eli wasn't innocent entirely, but at the moment of his death, Eli was incapacitated, and not fighting back.
And yeah, those are valid reasons to pick the Clem option, but I'm just tired of people justifying murder. What Clementine did was murder.
Still ridiculous for her to assume that they had a 100% failure rate.
I agree, she was being reckless. But saying it was a straight … moreup murder is a bit of an exaggeration since it was an accident. And let's not forget Eli was not some innocent person here, he tried to kill her a few seconds before that. I just didn't see a reason to tell the truth and risk having her locked up or worse when she was the one taking Javier back to the junkyard. Turns out, both got locked up, but obviously Javier/the player doesn't know that. But in that situation, I think covering for her had more benefits for Javier than to tell the truth. When playing these games I don't think about "what is right". It's the apocalypse, why should I be worried in telling the truth to a bunch of people I don't know when I need this girl to take me back to my family? This is not the time or place to have a mindset of "what you did was wrong and you need to suffer the consequences". At least that's how I see it.
Well, the definition of accident is an incident that happens unexpectedly and unintentionally. Clementine didn't intend to kill Eli, and you can see by the shock on her face that she didn't expect that to happen. So... it was an accident.
You can't call it an accident when you point a loaded gun at someone and it goes off. Regardless of whether Clem thought the bullets were faulty or not, she should have known that just because a few bullets misfire doesn't mean they all will. She's been handling poorly maintained guns for YEARS. Since she was NINE. You're telling me not one gun has misfired on her?
Well, the definition of accident is an incident that happens unexpectedly and unintentionally. Clementine didn't intend to kill Eli, and you can see by the shock on her face that she didn't expect that to happen. So... it was an accident.
Clementine had just watched me shoot an unarmed guy in the back so lying about a murder fit the path I am on in this game and she owes me now which could pan out or not.
Why should I care what Google thinks, I can form my own opinions. Anyway, I guess you forgot that he wasn't "forced" into a chair, he lost a… more fight after he tried to murder some random stranger. That's a lack of regard for human life. Plus most humans in the apocalypse don't really appreciate life and the ones that do are likely to come off as annoying pacifists causing more harm than good. Pulling the trigger, after she already pulled it once and nix happened means she didn't expect that the bullets would work and didn't want to murder Eli. And after she does kill him, she's obviously very distraught and concerned. So I don't see the "obvious lack of concern for assholes' lives" thing.
I believe we can agree—at the very least—that Clementine thought that all of the bullets loaded in the handgun were faulty, but did not check them to make sure that they didn't work.
Well, the definition of accident is an incident that happens unexpectedly and unintentionally. Clementine didn't intend to kill Eli, and you can see by the shock on her face that she didn't expect that to happen. So... it was an accident.
Then Telltale should realize the type of people that actually buy their games, if people want actionpacked Michael Bay games, why not buy Doom, or Metal Gear Solid 5, Noone is gonna buy The Walking Dead for the amazing action sequences, its almost like theyre completely ignoring what the heck even made their games popular in the first place
Clementine had just watched me shoot an unarmed guy in the back so lying about a murder fit the path I am on in this game and she owes me now which could pan out or not.
The fact that she does not shoot Javier, and the fact that she frees him from his bonds and give him a gun, she seems good in my book.
I havent ever shot the truck driver, but I feel like it should play a big role in whether or not Clem trusts you, considering, why should she not shoot you, after she just watched you shoot a guy?
Maybe not an ally, but the only person at the time that was going to take Javi back to the junkyard. Besides, compared to Tripp, Conrad and … morethe other people at Prescott, she's more of an ally to Javi than those people are, at least in that moment. And she didn't carjacked Javier. She simply asked for something in return for helping him. Why would she help a stranger if there was nothing in for her? Considering Javier's situation (he was tied up, not knowing where he was and how to get back to the junkyard) he should be smart enough to take her deal. If he doesn't, she basically knows where his van is so she uses that to her advantage saying she can simply go there and take it. At that point, she could've just left him there, tie him up to a tree or simply kill him and take his van anyway, but she still agreed to help him even if he doesn't agree to her deal. I don't know why people are so hard on her considering she's a kid who has been survi… [view original content]
but did not check them to make sure that they didn't work.
How exactly would she check that? I mean if there was some distinction from normal bullets then she cant have realised when she traded for them. I mean without firing every shot she couldnt check them
Okay, we are discussing semantics now. Let's not.
I believe we can agree—at the very least—that Clementine thought that all of the bullets loaded in the handgun were faulty, but did not check them to make sure that they didn't work.
Whatever you told them, they would most likely believe you. They had no reason not to, after all, you weren't the one who shot the guy, you actually did get attacked by him (and you had a proof of that on your face), they know you aren't with Clem for too long and Tripp said he was a rate-a-certified dipshit, so i doubt anyone would be willing to dig that whole situation.
On other hand, Clem will be really pissed if you tell them the truth. You're gonna piss a person off for no reason other than being rightful, justice, bla bla and so on. Not really a smart move in a zombie apocalypse. I much rather have allies rather than enemies.
Basically, lying gives you a + on Clem's side, and saying the truth doesn't give you jack shit.
Comments
Why should I care what Google thinks, I can form my own opinions. Anyway, I guess you forgot that he wasn't "forced" into a chair, he lost a fight after he tried to murder some random stranger. That's a lack of regard for human life. Plus most humans in the apocalypse don't really appreciate life and the ones that do are likely to come off as annoying pacifists causing more harm than good. Pulling the trigger, after she already pulled it once and nix happened means she didn't expect that the bullets would work and didn't want to murder Eli. And after she does kill him, she's obviously very distraught and concerned. So I don't see the "obvious lack of concern for assholes' lives" thing.
Okay, no need to insult others.
Personally I told the truth too but I understand other people's reasoning. Simply backing up Clementine as she gave you the benefit of the doubt and cut your bindings while agreeing to take you to the junkyard and help your family.
I think you're mistaken. She switches guns at the gate of Prescott. She's first using a shotgun and then when she went to use the gun, the bullets didn't work. By her reaction, it looks like that was the first time she used those bullets. It's pretty obvious that she thought all the bullets were faulty. So she was using that to her advantage to intimidate him. I'm not saying what she did was right, but she didn't mean to murder him right there.
Other guy pointed that out. Still ridiculous for her to assume that they had a 100% failure rate. Still a murder, when you push a gun in someone's face.
Thanks for at least not being hostile about it though. You're cool, my man.
Clementine didn't know the bullets could fire. Before she tried to use her pistol she was using a shotgun.
I would tell the truth if I didn't like Clem...
I'm not sure that she would be that generous! She even said to Javi "How'bout I shoot u, and take the van anyway."
I'm like wtf?!
Lol, Google was simply defining a legal term. It's not about what Google thinks, it's about a quick definition for second degree murder. And it's accurate.
And then Javi pushed him into the chair. He was forcefully put in the chair. He was forced into the chair.
Two wrongs don't make a right. In a court of law, Clementine would be found a murderer anyways, as he was incapacitated by the time she started shooting at him.
What does people not appreciating life in the apocalypse have to do with anything? People still don't like murder for murder's sake, as Clem committed.
Still, assuming the bullets have a 100% failure rate is ridiculous, and Clementine had no reasonable reason to not understand that, especially after her YEARS of hands on experience with poorly maintained weaponry.
What the fuck was that about annoying pacifists? What? What does that have to do with anything?
She's NOT distraught. Literally her only reaction is, "oh shit, Javi cover this up, make it like it never happened Javi. I ain't going down for this, Javi." Not "Oh shit I just killed a man."
Bias for Clem and the fact that minutes before I literally saw her life in danger because of what he did, and easily mine because the situation results in being distracted from the horde currently moving in, I just got done fending off the guys knife inches from my face. He had that shit coming.
You definitely know your shit!
But it's hard for me to take you seriously with that avatar.
Is that Pooger? Badger? What's the name?
I'm not even going to read this. Think what you want. I'm wasting time anyway.
It was foolish assuming that no bullet would fire.
Like we saw, at least one of them did.
It's biased because you favor Clementine because you like her.
It is no more complicated than that!
It wasn't accidental—she didn't know whether the bullets would work and she fired nonetheless. If Clementine had become surprised and instinctively pulled the trigger, then it would've been an accident.
But if it had been Tripp or anyone else suggesting what she did, I would have backed them up as well.
I like Clementine but I genuinely agree with her.
The choice is explicitly "lie for Clementine" or "tell the truth."
Oh! In that case it's not biased.
I agree, she was being reckless. But saying it was a straight up murder is a bit of an exaggeration since it was an accident. And let's not forget Eli was not some innocent person here, he tried to kill her a few seconds before that. I just didn't see a reason to tell the truth and risk having her locked up or worse when she was the one taking Javier back to the junkyard. Turns out, both got locked up, but obviously Javier/the player doesn't know that. But in that situation, I think covering for her had more benefits for Javier than to tell the truth. When playing these games I don't think about "what is right". It's the apocalypse, why should I be worried in telling the truth to a bunch of people I don't know when I need this girl to take me back to my family? This is not the time or place to have a mindset of "what you did was wrong and you need to suffer the consequences". At least that's how I see it.
Even if you believe that, it changes nothing.
Scooter. Scooter is a GOD.
CATCH A RIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIDE!
It's not a matter up for discussion, though. That wasn't an accident.
She didn't intend for Eli to die, but she knowingly pulled the trigger.
Okay. The other guy pointed that out, too. I'll say the same thing I said there. It's ridiculous for someone as experienced with poorly maintained bullets and weaponry as Clem is to not know what a misfired bullet was. It's ridiculous that she would think 100% of them were intentionally misfiring. It's ridiculous that she would pull the trigger in the man's face. She should have known the risks, and definitely performed a 2nd degree murder.
I thought he was annoying.
Well, I kinda think it had nothing to do with my honesty... or me being rational and honest
I ended up in the cage but it wasn't for Clementine's sake. It was because Eli deserved it. I'm a player of the first two seasons as well but I'm not going to favor her in regards to my choices. I found it ridiculous that she gets mad at you for telling the truth.
Well no it isn't. You're thinking of first degree murder. First degree murder is the only type of murder that has to be planned out prior to the moment, unless it's a "heat of the passion" crime, or something like that. Second degree murder just has to be acting without regard for human life. She was acting without regard for human life.
But the thing is, Clementine knew that bullets come out when you pull the trigger. Clementine knew there were bullets in the gun. Clementine had enough experience with poorly maintained bullets and guns to know what a misfiring bullet is. Clementine had enough experience to know that just because 1 or 2 or even 3 bullets misfire, does not mean they ALL misfire. That's a ridiculous assumption she made, and is definitely second degree murder because of it.
Eli wasn't innocent entirely, but at the moment of his death, Eli was incapacitated, and not fighting back.
And yeah, those are valid reasons to pick the Clem option, but I'm just tired of people justifying murder. What Clementine did was murder.
Well, the definition of accident is an incident that happens unexpectedly and unintentionally. Clementine didn't intend to kill Eli, and you can see by the shock on her face that she didn't expect that to happen. So... it was an accident.
You can't call it an accident when you point a loaded gun at someone and it goes off. Regardless of whether Clem thought the bullets were faulty or not, she should have known that just because a few bullets misfire doesn't mean they all will. She's been handling poorly maintained guns for YEARS. Since she was NINE. You're telling me not one gun has misfired on her?
Clementine had just watched me shoot an unarmed guy in the back so lying about a murder fit the path I am on in this game and she owes me now which could pan out or not.
Did you SERIOUSLY just say you could form your own opinion on what second-degree murder was?
Jesus CHRIST.
Okay. That's your prerogative. No need to insult me.
Okay, we are discussing semantics now. Let's not.
I believe we can agree—at the very least—that Clementine thought that all of the bullets loaded in the handgun were faulty, but did not check them to make sure that they didn't work.
Wasn't it "Cover for Clementine" or "Tell them it was an accident"?
Don't sound like Jav thinks it was intentional lol
I should've said "essentially" instead of "explicitly."
Then Telltale should realize the type of people that actually buy their games, if people want actionpacked Michael Bay games, why not buy Doom, or Metal Gear Solid 5, Noone is gonna buy The Walking Dead for the amazing action sequences, its almost like theyre completely ignoring what the heck even made their games popular in the first place
Well, I've tried to watch my tone... and I didn't shot him in the first place, so it's like no big deal
The fact that she does not shoot Javier, and the fact that she frees him from his bonds and give him a gun, she seems good in my book.
I havent ever shot the truck driver, but I feel like it should play a big role in whether or not Clem trusts you, considering, why should she not shoot you, after she just watched you shoot a guy?
How exactly would she check that? I mean if there was some distinction from normal bullets then she cant have realised when she traded for them. I mean without firing every shot she couldnt check them
Personally, i see it this way:
Whatever you told them, they would most likely believe you. They had no reason not to, after all, you weren't the one who shot the guy, you actually did get attacked by him (and you had a proof of that on your face), they know you aren't with Clem for too long and Tripp said he was a rate-a-certified dipshit, so i doubt anyone would be willing to dig that whole situation.
On other hand, Clem will be really pissed if you tell them the truth. You're gonna piss a person off for no reason other than being rightful, justice, bla bla and so on. Not really a smart move in a zombie apocalypse. I much rather have allies rather than enemies.
Basically, lying gives you a + on Clem's side, and saying the truth doesn't give you jack shit.