Sorry for intruding (and I probably don't know the whole story) but Everyone'sClemInTime can hate Kenny if they want to. I like Kenny but he definitely isn't the most flawless character in the game. No need to insult them over their opinion.
I'm flattered you took time out of your busy schedule to make it and that my opinion of a character affected you so personally you had to, a… morend still have to act like a petulant child whenever faced with any form of differing opinion from others.
I'd Also just like to say that RAAAAAR at the end was excellent, typed up like a true butthurt crusader.
Honestly, I can see where you're coming from. That meme is just an example of what type of reaction you'll get if you make a post that isn't praising Kenny. Reactions like that are pretty typical. I mean, hell, even in this thread alone you have Jane bashing as Kenny praise and Kenny fans calling people stupid.
Makes posting your opinion not worth it most of the time.
I sided with him and then I accept Kate. I was uncomfortable about that one but then he screwed up my deal with Clint. I didnt pick any sign of show him love in ep5. The way Javi said "Fuck you, David!" was so sincere and mean.
I've since stopped caring about all that quite frankly.
It would appear that a very vocal minority of posters here get upset with any level of opposition toward their beloved "boat-god." It honestly makes me hate him more.
Honestly, I can see where you're coming from. That meme is just an example of what type of reaction you'll get if you make a post that isn't… more praising Kenny. Reactions like that are pretty typical. I mean, hell, even in this thread alone you have Jane bashing as Kenny praise and Kenny fans calling people stupid.
Makes posting your opinion not worth it most of the time.
Although I think his heart is in the right place (The Wellington ending proves this), Kenny was abusive to certain characters over the course of the two games.
While I can't recall all of the instances at the moment, he was definitely abusive to Ben, Arvo and even Clementine at times.
And just to clarify, I'm not a Kenny hater. He's one of my favorite Telltale characters ever.
Ugh honestly it is such a stupid term "kensplainer"'or apologists or whatever term you invented.
Ep 5 at the house...after he gets the truck fixed and everyone leaves and he is in the truck pissed off...his entire speech is about how it is up to he and Clem to save AJ...and Wellington is the only way that AJ will survive...people like Jane...she does not understand what we understand(in a nutshell...that's manipulating an 11 year old and inviting her to the grownup seat in a play to get her from wanting to go back to Howes(The only place they know where it is at that has the formula)
Lol!! No it's not. That is him sprouting off his opinion saying that Jane doesn't know what Lee knew, go watch the scene again. He doesn't even say "Jane doesn't understand what WE understand Clem". Naturally though he wants Clem's support because she's the only one he trusts enough. He never once forces her into agreeing to go to Wellington because as i said, the player can choose to disagree.
The only reason it comes across as manipulating to you is because you hate the character it's as simple as that and you guys have nothing better to do than continuously think up negative things. It's sad really
Dan you are a major Kensplainer.....Ep 5 at the house...after he gets the truck fixed and everyone leaves and he is in the truck pissed off.… more..his entire speech is about how it is up to he and Clem to save AJ...and Wellington is the only way that AJ will survive...people like Jane...she does not understand what we understand(in a nutshell...that's manipulating an 11 year old and inviting her to the grownup seat in a play to get her from wanting to go back to Howes(The only place they know where it is at that has the formula)
You could look at the scene in another way. He technically didn't "leave" Lee to die, he looked towards the exit and thought about it but he didn't leave but yes he did not help which is just as bad. I do wish Telltale had only made that scene if Lee had always gone against Kenny and his family instead of just disagreeing the one time
Kenny leaving Lee to die in the pharmacy is the most unjustifiable thing he can do, leaving a friend to die because they disagreed with you … moreone time. Surely the fact that Lee risks his life to save Katjaa and Duck moments after the Larry situation would be reason enough for Kenny to forgive him. And Kenny must realise how much Lee means to Clem by that point, he's just selfish.
Don't get me wrong, I like Kenny, I just think he's a massive arsehole sometimes.
Kenny is a classic case of a verbal/emotional abuser. He's overbearing, refuses to listen to anyone else's opinions, calls everyone names and constantly questions their intelligence, accuses/blames everyone but himself constantly, threatening, extreme anger on a very constant basis, orders people around, undermines others, trivializes everyone else's problems, I could keep going...
He is mostly not abusive towards Clementine, although at times like with Sarita's death, we see he can be even towards her. I don't believe there was really any evidence that he was towards Katjaa and Duck either. But he was a bully throughout season 1, although on a much less aggressive/scary level, he constantly bullied the group. He would constantly freak out at Lilly and never showed her any respect what so ever, regardless of the fact that she was basically keeping the group together...Obviously he was right about leaving the motor inn (and Kenny was right about a lot of things, don't get me wrong), but he never talked to her in a reasonable, civil way even once on screen that I can think of. It was always aggressive and undermining her intelligence and capabilities. He was similar towards Lee if you choose to disagree with him. I don't think that these really fully represent full on "abuse" but he definately gets to that point near the end of season 1, especially towards Ben (even though he redeems himself if Ben is alive), but it's evidence that it's in his nature from when we first meet him.
When season 2 rolls around, I get it. His mind "broke". He went into a fit of rage over the course of a few days, and he acted abusive towards basically everyone. Kenny has been through a lot, it's understandable that he goes off the handle sometimes....Everyone does. But I feel like people make WAY too many excuses for him. Yes, he lost his family. Yes, he has done heroic and noble things. Yes, he cares deeply about people he considers "family" and truly cared about Clementine and AJ, but that doesn't mean that he's not abusive towards the people around him...Even if we don't count the Arvo stuff (which was pretty bad, and it should be taken into consideration really), he was aggressive and overbearing towards everyone regardless. Literally everyone in the group mentions that Kenny is scaring them. As a player, I was scared of him and what he was going to do....But I don't see how people think it's fine? Yes Kenny lost everything...BUT SO HAS EVERYONE ELSE. Why is he special? Why does he have the right to be horrible towards everyone? Clementine lost everyone, Luke lost everyone, Mike, Bonnie, Jane, and even Arvo..... There is no real excuse for Kenny to act the way he does, and weather you want to believe it, the standard textbook journals will tell you if you do a real honest comparison that yes, Kenny is abusive.
It doesn't mean he is a bad person. It also doesn't mean he can't change, either, which we did see after Jane's death during season 3. I think he's a good person at heart, and he thinks in his mind he's doing right by people..I definitely sympathize with him, and I do understand why people are very quick to his defenses...I don't even completely hate the guy...I usually feel sorry for people who are abusive or bullies, it usually means they need help. But unfortunately looking at the facts, he has all of the telltale signs of a verbal abuser.
You could look at the scene in another way. He technically didn't "leave" Lee to die, he looked towards the exit and thought about it but he… more didn't leave but yes he did not help which is just as bad. I do wish Telltale had only made that scene if Lee had always gone against Kenny and his family instead of just disagreeing the one time
Was Kenny abusive? Well, personally I don't think that was one of his traits, I'd more so call him 'Hot-Headed' because he only becomes phys… moreically and vocally violent in a state of anger and boy does it happen often, particularly in Season Two.
* He gets mad and lashes out on people who don't fully or at least partially agree with him - he ends up belittling other peoples' opinions and even letting people die in a fit of irrational rage.
* He acts mostly with emotions rather than logic, he's willing to get people killed to be a heroic figure unless it's someone important to him who's at stake and he'll jump to conclusions before assessing the situation.
* He's merciless. Do him any form of harm that may just possibly threaten him, but mostly someone he cares about, and he'll be willing to harm you and even kill you.
Despite Kenny's flaws, he has many good characteristics, but unfortunately, he's done the most worst things out of any non-playable character.
Dan you are a major Kensplainer.....
Ugh honestly it is such a stupid term "kensplainer"'or apologists or whatever term you invented… more.
Ep 5 at the house...after he gets the truck fixed and everyone leaves and he is in the truck pissed off...his entire speech is about how it is up to he and Clem to save AJ...and Wellington is the only way that AJ will survive...people like Jane...she does not understand what we understand(in a nutshell...that's manipulating an 11 year old and inviting her to the grownup seat in a play to get her from wanting to go back to Howes(The only place they know where it is at that has the formula)
Lol!! No it's not. That is him sprouting off his opinion saying that Jane doesn't know what Lee knew, go watch the scene again. He doesn't even say "Jane doesn't understand what WE understand Clem". Naturally though he wants Clem's support because she's the only one he trusts enough. He never once forces … [view original content]
Abusive yes (in the final 2 episodes). Manipulative no. Don't you dare call me delusional. By doing that you are instantly provoking an argument and trying to piss me off. You see him as manipulative but you are wrong here, sorry but you are. I have already explained why and typically you ignored my argument. But of course it's never enough for a Kenny hater.
Manipulation is when someone is being negative to get what they want. Kenny was in no way being negative when persuading Clem to persuade the group for what he believed was in the best interests of everyone even though on this occasion the plan was debatably bad. Let me give you another example. If an advertisment presents a product in an attractive manner and promotes its best features, that's persuasion. However, if an advertisement misrepresents the
product, or uses misleading terms in describing it, that is
manipulation. So just think on that for a moment.
And it was good that he came back because the majority of the fan base would agree that Season 2 would have been much worse without him and the drama he brought to it. These boards would have been dead 3 or 4 years ago during the time of release in my opinion because most of the topics were about Telltale's most polarised character aka Kenny.
Dan....ahhh...it's ok...you love Kenny. That's fine....but you are delusional if you think he was not being manipulative and abusive in season.
Kenny should never have come back to the series...sorry.
Dan....ahhh...it's ok...you love Kenny. That's fine....but you are delusional if you think he was not being manipulative and abusive in season.
Kenny should never have come back to the series...sorry.
In Episode 1 of Season 1, letting Shawn die regardless of who Lee tries to save first, he instead just carries Duck all the way to the barn.
In Episode 2 of Season 1, if you tried to save Larry, Kenny won't even try to stop Danny St. John from attacking and, if the QTE is failed, killing Lee.
In Episode 3 of Season 1, if you're not on good terms with him because you tried to save Larry, he'll let Lee die if you fail the QTE.
In Episode 3 of Season 1, if Lee fails to convince Kenny to stop the train because Duck is turning, then a zombified Duck will have killed everyone (bar Kenny and Chuck).
In Episode 2 of Season 2, if Clementine fails to convince Kenny to surrender to Carver, he will get Alvin killed.
I agree that Jane is a monster... But Kenny? His heart was always in the right place, he just had trouble controlling his emotions. He's lost a lot in his life, I think that'd make anyone go crazy and yet, he still managed to hold onto his humanity (for the most part).
Hell yeah he is abusive. But Jane is no better.
In fact, I think Jane is worse because she is covert.
Pretending that AJ died just to sh… moreow that Kenny would react strongly? If you knew that doing something to someone would make them react in such a way, WHY would you do it?
Sure, it made him look like the unstable monster that she painted him out to be, but when it's all over and you find out what she did (Or rather, what she didn't do), that's when you see just how twisted she really is.
And then, if you choose to go on your own, Kenny respects your choice whilst Jane tries to excuse her behavior.
That final choice is basically like trying to choose the lesser of the two evils.
Manipulation is when someone is being negative to get what they want. Kenny was in no way being negative when persuading Clem to persuade the group for what he believed was in the best interests of everyone even though on this occasion the plan was debatably bad. Let me give you another example. If an advertisment presents a product in an attractive manner and promotes its best features, that's persuasion. However, if an advertisement misrepresents the
product, or uses misleading terms in describing it, that is
manipulation. So just think on that for a moment.
That absolutely is not what manipulation is.
Definition of manipulate
manipulated; manipulating
transitive verb
1
to treat or operate with or as if with the hands or by mechanical means especially in a skillful manner manipulate a pencil manipulate a machine
2
a : to manage or utilize skillfully
quantify our data and manipulate it statistically — S. L. Payne
b : to control or play upon by artful, unfair, or insidious means especially to one's own advantage
being used and manipulated by the knowing men around him — New Republic
3
to change by artful or unfair means so as to serve one's purpose : doctor
suspected that the police reports were manipulated — Evelyn G. Cruickshanks
b is what Kenny was doing to Clementine.
As for agreeing S2 would have been worse if he had not been in it...that is an unprovable statement.
Abusive yes (in the final 2 episodes). Manipulative no. Don't you dare call me delusional. By doing that you are instantly provoking an argu… morement and trying to piss me off. You see him as manipulative but you are wrong here, sorry but you are. I have already explained why and typically you ignored my argument. But of course it's never enough for a Kenny hater.
Manipulation is when someone is being negative to get what they want. Kenny was in no way being negative when persuading Clem to persuade the group for what he believed was in the best interests of everyone even though on this occasion the plan was debatably bad. Let me give you another example. If an advertisment presents a product in an attractive manner and promotes its best features, that's persuasion. However, if an advertisement misrepresents the
product, or uses misleading terms in describing it, that is
manipulation. So just think on that for a moment.
And it was good tha… [view original content]
Kenny is a classic case of a verbal/emotional abuser. He's overbearing, refuses to listen to anyone else's opinions, calls everyone names … moreand constantly questions their intelligence, accuses/blames everyone but himself constantly, threatening, extreme anger on a very constant basis, orders people around, undermines others, trivializes everyone else's problems, I could keep going...
He is mostly not abusive towards Clementine, although at times like with Sarita's death, we see he can be even towards her. I don't believe there was really any evidence that he was towards Katjaa and Duck either. But he was a bully throughout season 1, although on a much less aggressive/scary level, he constantly bullied the group. He would constantly freak out at Lilly and never showed her any respect what so ever, regardless of the fact that she was basically keeping the group together...Obviously he was right about leaving the motor inn (and Kenny was r… [view original content]
I notice they ignored his apology and admittance that he was wrong to lash out at her like that.
Of all the things to complain about kenny that season that is like the least thing. A grieving man lashes out at someone he cares about? Guess what? That's called being human. In grief people frequently lash out, and when the thing or person responsible is not available, that anger gets misplaced. It's simply being human. What makes someone a dick is when they refuse to admit they fucked up, but that ain't kenny. Shortly thereafter he apologises and tells clem it wasn't her fault. An abusive person would never apologise.
How are you not getting this KSDIS1? Ok here we go:
b : to control or play upon by artful, unfair, or insidious means
Are you high? How was Kenny being unfair when he was simply asking Clementine to help him and not forcing/controlling her? How the fuck was he being insidious? Lol jeez! He accepts what she says if she disagrees as well so seriously why do you ignore this evidence?
especially to one's own advantage
Again not to his own advantage where evidence clearly shows he was considering the welfare of Clem and AJ and the rest of the group but as i said before even though his plan was debatably bad, the good intent was still there. You refuse to see this though predictably.
Manipulation is perceived as a negative trait, Kenny was not doing so in a negative light in any way during that scene. He was persuading Clementine for what he felt was for the good of everyone and not thinking of himself regardless of what you blindly think.
I think you should rewatch/play that scene and try out different choices
Manipulation is when someone is being negative to get what they want. Kenny was in no way being negative when persuading Clem to persuade th… moree group for what he believed was in the best interests of everyone even though on this occasion the plan was debatably bad. Let me give you another example. If an advertisment presents a product in an attractive manner and promotes its best features, that's persuasion. However, if an advertisement misrepresents the
product, or uses misleading terms in describing it, that is
manipulation. So just think on that for a moment.
That absolutely is not what manipulation is.
Definition of manipulate manipulated; manipulating transitive verb 1 to treat or operate with or as if with the hands or by mechanical means especially in a skillful manner manipulate a pencil manipulate a machine
2
a : to manage or utilize skillfully
quantify our data and manipulate it statistically — S. L. Payne
b : to… [view original content]
Jane is someone you should be labelling as manipulative after what she did in that final scene and i reaaaalllyyy don't think we want to go into that discussion.
At least Kenny has never lied to Clem like Jane had.
Manipulation is when someone is being negative to get what they want. Kenny was in no way being negative when persuading Clem to persuade th… moree group for what he believed was in the best interests of everyone even though on this occasion the plan was debatably bad. Let me give you another example. If an advertisment presents a product in an attractive manner and promotes its best features, that's persuasion. However, if an advertisement misrepresents the
product, or uses misleading terms in describing it, that is
manipulation. So just think on that for a moment.
That absolutely is not what manipulation is.
Definition of manipulate manipulated; manipulating transitive verb 1 to treat or operate with or as if with the hands or by mechanical means especially in a skillful manner manipulate a pencil manipulate a machine
2
a : to manage or utilize skillfully
quantify our data and manipulate it statistically — S. L. Payne
b : to… [view original content]
Hey I have stopped defending her because I put what happened down to bad writing as they felt they needed a fight and got cold feet about the original intent to make the fight between Luke and Kenny....and believe me....way more people would have sided with Luke and not blindly defended Kenny.
Jane is someone you should be labelling as manipulative after what she did in that final scene and i reaaaalllyyy don't think we want to go into that discussion.
At least Kenny has never lied to Clem like Jane had.
He was being artful in the way he was building her up with flattery...as the definition clearly states it could have been artful, unfair, or insidious means....I would argue he was both artful using flattery and insidious by painting members of the group in a less than stellar light. So Dan...yes Kenny was abusive...and yes Dan...he was being manipulative.
And No Dan...he should not have been in season 2...end of argument.
How are you not getting this KSDIS1? Ok here we go:
b : to control or play upon by artful, unfair, or insidious means
Are you … morehigh? How was Kenny being unfair when he was simply asking Clementine to help him and not forcing/controlling her? How the fuck was he being insidious? Lol jeez! He accepts what she says if she disagrees as well so seriously why do you ignore this evidence?
especially to one's own advantage
Again not to his own advantage where evidence clearly shows he was considering the welfare of Clem and AJ and the rest of the group but as i said before even though his plan was debatably bad, the good intent was still there. You refuse to see this though predictably.
Manipulation is perceived as a negative trait, Kenny was not doing so in a negative light in any way during that scene. He was persuading Clementine for what he felt was for the good of everyone and not thinking of himself regardless of w… [view original content]
She is the only person left he knows from way back when it started and trusts. He puts all his trust into her and makes that obvious for her to notice. Manipulating someone, whether we agree on a definition or not, is usually used when you sneakily move someone to do as you will. And Kenny doesn't do that. He asks/begs her, is being Kenny all the while at it (AKA "I know you're smart so that's what you will do!"). You misinterpret Kenny being himself as a sneaky attempt to manipulate.
When Kenny thinks he's right, he'll project this onto someone he trusts, expecting him to join in. But it's way too blunt and obvious for it be an attempt to manipulate.
He isn't only projecting onto Clementine either, it happened multiple times in Season One as well; with Lee.
Edit: And as dan mentioned, Kenny accepts disagreement. A manipulative person wouldn't do so. As Jane, she begged for Clem to stay when Clem decides to head off alone. Kenny doesn't discuss and accepts Clem leaving. I don't hate Jane, but she always came off as a tad bit manipulative.
He was being artful in the way he was building her up with flattery...as the definition clearly states it could have been artful, unfair, or… more insidious means....I would argue he was both artful using flattery and insidious by painting members of the group in a less than stellar light. So Dan...yes Kenny was abusive...and yes Dan...he was being manipulative.
And No Dan...he should not have been in season 2...end of argument.
You always find way to impres me.
You 9\6 image remind of an old funny story.
Two guys saw something black moving from a distance, the first one of them said that a Crow the other said no its a goat,his friend said no its a Crow he said no its a goat and they stayed like this till a while the black thing gone flying, his friend said see its a crow
he said its a goat even if he flew.
Haha well in a situation like that, someone had to be wrong but opinions about Kenny do not apply because you either like him or you don't and no one is right or wrong about him depending on the topic
You always find way to impres me.
You 9\6 image remind of an old funny story.
Two guys saw something black moving from a distance, the fi… morerst one of them said that a Crow the other said no its a goat,his friend said no its a Crow he said no its a goat and they stayed like this till a while the black thing gone flying, his friend said see its a crow
he said its a goat even if he flew.
He was being artful in the way he was building her up with flattery...
Oh jesus! Are you for real? Kenny is ALWAYS nice to Clem apart from the one time he yelled at her over Sarita's death which was his grief taking over because he never meant to and he says this later and in Season 3. He wasn't flattering her to get her on his side. Have you not read anything i said? Are Kenny haters so ignorant they ignore what is put in front of them and can't counter an argument properly? I told you that Clem can clearly disagree with Kenny's plan or him asking her to help him persuade the group and i gave you a very good example of how persuasion is different to manipulation but as usual you ignored it. So I'm sorry to crush your hopes and dreams but you are wrong and very misinformed.
I would argue he was both artful using flattery and insidious by painting members of the group in a less than stellar light.
Lol if i got a truck working for the whole group and they weren't grateful for it (because they weren't btw) then i would be pretty pissed off with them but Kenny does not paint them in a bad light. Sure he says they "act like he shit in their cereal" and says he "thought Mike would have more sense" but that is not running them down, that is him telling Clem how disappointed he is that they are acting this way after he got the truck working for everyone and is no way a tactic or being manipulative so it has fuck all to do with the crap you're saying sweetheart. Sorry.
So Dan...yes Kenny was abusive...and yes Dan...he was being manipulative.
Abusive yes, manipulative no. Already explained why, you chose to ignore, i choose to repeat as many times as possible until you counter what i have said.
And No Dan...he should not have been in season 2...end of argument.
And yes whatever your name is, he should have been in Season 2 and i am glad he was because as i also mentioned, he made the season more interesting. End of argument? Oh we both know that's not true lol
He was being artful in the way he was building her up with flattery...as the definition clearly states it could have been artful, unfair, or… more insidious means....I would argue he was both artful using flattery and insidious by painting members of the group in a less than stellar light. So Dan...yes Kenny was abusive...and yes Dan...he was being manipulative.
And No Dan...he should not have been in season 2...end of argument.
Comments
I'm glad someone understands, at long last.
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Honestly, I can see where you're coming from. That meme is just an example of what type of reaction you'll get if you make a post that isn't praising Kenny. Reactions like that are pretty typical. I mean, hell, even in this thread alone you have Jane bashing as Kenny praise and Kenny fans calling people stupid.
Makes posting your opinion not worth it most of the time.
Sincere & mean ? What?
Is Kenny abusive?
I've since stopped caring about all that quite frankly.
It would appear that a very vocal minority of posters here get upset with any level of opposition toward their beloved "boat-god." It honestly makes me hate him more.
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Please make more constructive comments for the topic at hand instead of passively trolling people.
[removed]
[removed]
I am saying that he meant what he said.
For your own agenda, of course.
Although I think his heart is in the right place (The Wellington ending proves this), Kenny was abusive to certain characters over the course of the two games.
While I can't recall all of the instances at the moment, he was definitely abusive to Ben, Arvo and even Clementine at times.
And just to clarify, I'm not a Kenny hater. He's one of my favorite Telltale characters ever.
Ugh honestly it is such a stupid term "kensplainer"'or apologists or whatever term you invented.
Lol!! No it's not. That is him sprouting off his opinion saying that Jane doesn't know what Lee knew, go watch the scene again. He doesn't even say "Jane doesn't understand what WE understand Clem". Naturally though he wants Clem's support because she's the only one he trusts enough. He never once forces her into agreeing to go to Wellington because as i said, the player can choose to disagree.
The only reason it comes across as manipulating to you is because you hate the character it's as simple as that and you guys have nothing better to do than continuously think up negative things. It's sad really
You could look at the scene in another way. He technically didn't "leave" Lee to die, he looked towards the exit and thought about it but he didn't leave but yes he did not help which is just as bad. I do wish Telltale had only made that scene if Lee had always gone against Kenny and his family instead of just disagreeing the one time
Kenny is a classic case of a verbal/emotional abuser. He's overbearing, refuses to listen to anyone else's opinions, calls everyone names and constantly questions their intelligence, accuses/blames everyone but himself constantly, threatening, extreme anger on a very constant basis, orders people around, undermines others, trivializes everyone else's problems, I could keep going...
He is mostly not abusive towards Clementine, although at times like with Sarita's death, we see he can be even towards her. I don't believe there was really any evidence that he was towards Katjaa and Duck either. But he was a bully throughout season 1, although on a much less aggressive/scary level, he constantly bullied the group. He would constantly freak out at Lilly and never showed her any respect what so ever, regardless of the fact that she was basically keeping the group together...Obviously he was right about leaving the motor inn (and Kenny was right about a lot of things, don't get me wrong), but he never talked to her in a reasonable, civil way even once on screen that I can think of. It was always aggressive and undermining her intelligence and capabilities. He was similar towards Lee if you choose to disagree with him. I don't think that these really fully represent full on "abuse" but he definately gets to that point near the end of season 1, especially towards Ben (even though he redeems himself if Ben is alive), but it's evidence that it's in his nature from when we first meet him.
When season 2 rolls around, I get it. His mind "broke". He went into a fit of rage over the course of a few days, and he acted abusive towards basically everyone. Kenny has been through a lot, it's understandable that he goes off the handle sometimes....Everyone does. But I feel like people make WAY too many excuses for him. Yes, he lost his family. Yes, he has done heroic and noble things. Yes, he cares deeply about people he considers "family" and truly cared about Clementine and AJ, but that doesn't mean that he's not abusive towards the people around him...Even if we don't count the Arvo stuff (which was pretty bad, and it should be taken into consideration really), he was aggressive and overbearing towards everyone regardless. Literally everyone in the group mentions that Kenny is scaring them. As a player, I was scared of him and what he was going to do....But I don't see how people think it's fine? Yes Kenny lost everything...BUT SO HAS EVERYONE ELSE. Why is he special? Why does he have the right to be horrible towards everyone? Clementine lost everyone, Luke lost everyone, Mike, Bonnie, Jane, and even Arvo..... There is no real excuse for Kenny to act the way he does, and weather you want to believe it, the standard textbook journals will tell you if you do a real honest comparison that yes, Kenny is abusive.
It doesn't mean he is a bad person. It also doesn't mean he can't change, either, which we did see after Jane's death during season 3. I think he's a good person at heart, and he thinks in his mind he's doing right by people..I definitely sympathize with him, and I do understand why people are very quick to his defenses...I don't even completely hate the guy...I usually feel sorry for people who are abusive or bullies, it usually means they need help. But unfortunately looking at the facts, he has all of the telltale signs of a verbal abuser.
Huh, whadduya know. Even Season 1 had that issue of petty determinate factors in places.
That s more bad writing from telltale than David being an asshole inthis case
((David fighting Javier even if Javier Always sided with him.))
What do you mean letting people die?
Ah, of course. Whatever that means.
Dan....ahhh...it's ok...you love Kenny. That's fine....but you are delusional if you think he was not being manipulative and abusive in season.
Kenny should never have come back to the series...sorry.
Abusive yes (in the final 2 episodes). Manipulative no. Don't you dare call me delusional. By doing that you are instantly provoking an argument and trying to piss me off. You see him as manipulative but you are wrong here, sorry but you are. I have already explained why and typically you ignored my argument. But of course it's never enough for a Kenny hater.
Manipulation is when someone is being negative to get what they want. Kenny was in no way being negative when persuading Clem to persuade the group for what he believed was in the best interests of everyone even though on this occasion the plan was debatably bad. Let me give you another example. If an advertisment presents a product in an attractive manner and promotes its best features, that's persuasion. However, if an advertisement misrepresents the
product, or uses misleading terms in describing it, that is
manipulation. So just think on that for a moment.
And it was good that he came back because the majority of the fan base would agree that Season 2 would have been much worse without him and the drama he brought to it. These boards would have been dead 3 or 4 years ago during the time of release in my opinion because most of the topics were about Telltale's most polarised character aka Kenny.
Nobody's perfect
Something everyone here should know especially when it comes to difference of opinion about Kenny:
Just to name a few instances.
I agree that Jane is a monster... But Kenny? His heart was always in the right place, he just had trouble controlling his emotions. He's lost a lot in his life, I think that'd make anyone go crazy and yet, he still managed to hold onto his humanity (for the most part).
This ending is proof of that:
product, or uses misleading terms in describing it, that is
manipulation. So just think on that for a moment.
That absolutely is not what manipulation is.
2
a : to manage or utilize skillfully
quantify our data and manipulate it statistically — S. L. Payne
b : to control or play upon by artful, unfair, or insidious means especially to one's own advantage
being used and manipulated by the knowing men around him — New Republic
3
suspected that the police reports were manipulated — Evelyn G. Cruickshanks
b is what Kenny was doing to Clementine.
As for agreeing S2 would have been worse if he had not been in it...that is an unprovable statement.
I notice they ignored his apology and admittance that he was wrong to lash out at her like that.
Of all the things to complain about kenny that season that is like the least thing. A grieving man lashes out at someone he cares about? Guess what? That's called being human. In grief people frequently lash out, and when the thing or person responsible is not available, that anger gets misplaced. It's simply being human. What makes someone a dick is when they refuse to admit they fucked up, but that ain't kenny. Shortly thereafter he apologises and tells clem it wasn't her fault. An abusive person would never apologise.
Truer words have never been spoken.
Now if only some people can get that through their fuckin skull.
How are you not getting this KSDIS1? Ok here we go:
Are you high? How was Kenny being unfair when he was simply asking Clementine to help him and not forcing/controlling her? How the fuck was he being insidious? Lol jeez! He accepts what she says if she disagrees as well so seriously why do you ignore this evidence?
Again not to his own advantage where evidence clearly shows he was considering the welfare of Clem and AJ and the rest of the group but as i said before even though his plan was debatably bad, the good intent was still there. You refuse to see this though predictably.
Manipulation is perceived as a negative trait, Kenny was not doing so in a negative light in any way during that scene. He was persuading Clementine for what he felt was for the good of everyone and not thinking of himself regardless of what you blindly think.
I think you should rewatch/play that scene and try out different choices
Jane is someone you should be labelling as manipulative after what she did in that final scene and i reaaaalllyyy don't think we want to go into that discussion.
At least Kenny has never lied to Clem like Jane had.
You always find a way to blow my mined
Lol meaning?
Hey I have stopped defending her because I put what happened down to bad writing as they felt they needed a fight and got cold feet about the original intent to make the fight between Luke and Kenny....and believe me....way more people would have sided with Luke and not blindly defended Kenny.
He was being artful in the way he was building her up with flattery...as the definition clearly states it could have been artful, unfair, or insidious means....I would argue he was both artful using flattery and insidious by painting members of the group in a less than stellar light. So Dan...yes Kenny was abusive...and yes Dan...he was being manipulative.
And No Dan...he should not have been in season 2...end of argument.
She is the only person left he knows from way back when it started and trusts. He puts all his trust into her and makes that obvious for her to notice. Manipulating someone, whether we agree on a definition or not, is usually used when you sneakily move someone to do as you will. And Kenny doesn't do that. He asks/begs her, is being Kenny all the while at it (AKA "I know you're smart so that's what you will do!"). You misinterpret Kenny being himself as a sneaky attempt to manipulate.
When Kenny thinks he's right, he'll project this onto someone he trusts, expecting him to join in. But it's way too blunt and obvious for it be an attempt to manipulate.
He isn't only projecting onto Clementine either, it happened multiple times in Season One as well; with Lee.
Edit: And as dan mentioned, Kenny accepts disagreement. A manipulative person wouldn't do so. As Jane, she begged for Clem to stay when Clem decides to head off alone. Kenny doesn't discuss and accepts Clem leaving. I don't hate Jane, but she always came off as a tad bit manipulative.
You always find way to impres me.
You 9\6 image remind of an old funny story.
Two guys saw something black moving from a distance, the first one of them said that a Crow the other said no its a goat,his friend said no its a Crow he said no its a goat and they stayed like this till a while the black thing gone flying, his friend said see its a crow
he said its a goat even if he flew.
Haha well in a situation like that, someone had to be wrong but opinions about Kenny do not apply because you either like him or you don't and no one is right or wrong about him depending on the topic
Oh jesus! Are you for real? Kenny is ALWAYS nice to Clem apart from the one time he yelled at her over Sarita's death which was his grief taking over because he never meant to and he says this later and in Season 3. He wasn't flattering her to get her on his side. Have you not read anything i said? Are Kenny haters so ignorant they ignore what is put in front of them and can't counter an argument properly? I told you that Clem can clearly disagree with Kenny's plan or him asking her to help him persuade the group and i gave you a very good example of how persuasion is different to manipulation but as usual you ignored it. So I'm sorry to crush your hopes and dreams but you are wrong and very misinformed.
Lol if i got a truck working for the whole group and they weren't grateful for it (because they weren't btw) then i would be pretty pissed off with them but Kenny does not paint them in a bad light. Sure he says they "act like he shit in their cereal" and says he "thought Mike would have more sense" but that is not running them down, that is him telling Clem how disappointed he is that they are acting this way after he got the truck working for everyone and is no way a tactic or being manipulative so it has fuck all to do with the crap you're saying sweetheart. Sorry.
Abusive yes, manipulative no. Already explained why, you chose to ignore, i choose to repeat as many times as possible until you counter what i have said.
And yes whatever your name is, he should have been in Season 2 and i am glad he was because as i also mentioned, he made the season more interesting. End of argument? Oh we both know that's not true lol