A New Frontier.... wasn't actually that bad?
I've held off on playing through ANF because from what I'd heard it was pretty horrible, but I decided a few weeks ago to play through the whole series to get hyped for the final season. I played through season one in a week, season two in another, and season three in a third week. And despite what I'd heard... I actually liked season three. I got attached to the characters, was interested in the story, and found Javi and his family's dynamic to be pretty fun to play through. Yeah, it could have been longer, and yeah, I didn't like the graphics, but other than that? I thought the season was good. I played the first two parts when they first came out and the only characters I got really attached to and found interesting as characters were Mari and Eleanor, (I kinda hated Gabe and Kate), but having completed the game I don't think there was a single character I didn't find interesting. I don't know, I just thought I'd throw in my two cents, as I've seen this game get a lot of hate, or at least strong feelings of dislike. I may be wrong though. So what'd you think of ANF? Why'd you feel that way? And how do you feel ANF stacks up to the other seasons?
EDIT: In no way do I mean any disrespect to those who didn't like the game. I'm more curious to see why people feel the way they do about the game. Hope y'all have a good one!
Comments
Well, not really and yes it kinda was.
The very general, objective problems with it's collective production, direction, depth, and execution are certainly true.
But when you get down to it, the main thing people tend to harp on it the most for is it arguably throwing things off with the series. Which is sorta what it was gonna do anyway, albeit in very different and more visceral ways.
Well, glad you were able to invest yourself with one note, 0 development characters.
In my opinion A New Frontier fails on almost every level as a game, sequel and even story. It disregards Season 2's endings as a direct insult to players, as well as introduce a cast full of undeveloped characters without any backstory or depth to them. The episodes are incredibly short and lackluster at best. It may not have always been the way it was but last minute, half baked rewrites ruined a story that could have been engaging. Season 1 and even Season 2 had moments that made me feel genuine emotion, where as A New Frontier didn't have a single hard hitting moment for me, the insufferable characters I was forced to be around also didn't help. A New Frontier is easily the worst of the 3, probably Telltale's worst game of all time and a huge stain on the series.
I'm glad to see someone liked it. I loved it but obviously it's a pretty unpopular opinion that sometimes it just doesn't feel safe to say it. Especially here on the forums.
EDIT: As you can see by some of the other comments, people aren't going to be very reasonable and respect your opinion.
...
I know, I can't believe it either
People actually liking a video game that other people don't
I mean pffft, how does that happen
Good question?
![](https://www.shitpostbot.com/resize/585/400?img=%2Fimg%2Fsourceimages%2Faction-gamemaster-57d30d32dfb7b.png")
I'm this way about Sonic '06.
The biggest points of contention I've seen are: lack of choice (all Clems are streamlined, characters' relationships are mostly non-determinant), flashbacks doing the very thing people were asking NOT to have (killing off the characters in a very throwaway way), and character inconsistency.
Ooh, yeah... I kinda forgot about the Kenny and Jane stuff (I ended on my own in my playthrough). That was definitely a bad, kinda lazy resolution to their characters. I mostly went along with the forced relationships, because to me they made sense, but I can definitely see how that would turn people off of the game. I also tried to get over the fact that it didn't seem like any of your previous choices with Clem mattered to engage myself in the game. Which, if you have to get over something like that, probably not the best game?
I'm definitely not saying that ANF was my favorite season. I'm just saying I don't think it's as terrible as people have said.
Gabe, Conrad, (technically) Clementine, and (sort of) Kate clearly undergo some degree of development, with Javier and David having undergone some minor but significant changes across between the timeskips as well.
Also, one note would imply that they are all about one thing and one mindset, which isn't true for most of the cast barring Badger and maybe Mariana.
It’s okay if you liked the game. It’s your opinion and you’re entitled to it.
Personally, I dislike it. I’ve voiced my opinion and on it several times here on the forums, so I’ll keep it quick and brief as to why:
Hey dude! Yes, I think I remember you now being one of the popular troops that went to war to defend this game against the avalanche of shit it received last year.. after it concluded around exactly this time last year. I salute your service anniversary sir and folks should acknowledge other's feelings. But I think you guys might of surely lost** The Battle of the Bogus game 2017 **your efforts were not in vain. Though on contrary the game itself pretty much was in vain... and yeah opinion.
Oh I totally agree with most of that. Especially the lack of regard to choices made in the previous games, and the scrapped content that was a lost opportunity. I personally liked the final product, but I totally respect your opinion and can see why other people would dislike it. For me, what I liked outweighed what I disliked. This was the first season that I played where I didn't have the game spoiled for me (I went into season one knowing that Lee died), and so maybe that was why I liked it as much as I did. I don't know. To each his own.
Well I look at this type of scenario as some folks.. might much prefer a few beef jerky sticks and crackers over shrimp Alfredo for dinner . Can I fault or insult a person for what they wish to have for a meal? No. BUT I can in my own opinion believe they have awful taste. And in that unique example quite literally. The latter meal is quite more satisfying and that's what A New Frontier wasn't.... satisfying and left me hungry for so much more after waiting 3 years for that potentially scrumptious dinner only to be all wasted from too many cooks in the kitchen and ultimately dumped in the garbage without a refund might I add....HAHaHAha.
It all ends up as personal perspective. And each side wants the other to agree with them it seems so as not to feel alienated or that they are too mean or too foolish for their own thoughts of the product. For some season 3 was just enough to enjoy. I'd be lying if I said I didn't enjoy anything season 3 offered but those moments were very few and far between. I thought season 3 had the most touching flashback scene with Kenny and Clem the second one of course not the first. Season 3 had the best action sequences which is something we have yet to get so far. And finally season 3 had my favorite comic character Jesus making a cameo. But this was mostly it. Everything else fell flat far as a good haunting story is suppose to be told. They had great ideas but threw them out for like no reason and sabotaged their own project for God knows why so oh well. My two cents. But I hope Telltale weren't paying you a ton of cents to say the game was not bad. just kidding!! well not really....lol
I truly wanted to like ANF. Upon press releases and leaks concerning the game prior to release, the player base had already began to divide. Some were excited at the possibilities, some were dubious and leery of the inclusion of Clementine without the focus on Clementine. I do believe that by releasing so many details of an unfinished product which were ultimately scrapped or altered, it doomed the project before Ep1/2's release. This tactic sets players expectations as well as hyping the game, and right out of the gate those expectations were not met.
Even still, I did attempt to defend the game itself and hope for the best. The game had so much potential, even maintained potential to shape itself into an exciting and less predictable narrative. Tragically, the characters that were given the limelight weren't the characters that a lot of people were interested in exploring, and those that were had already annoyed some players. By this I'm not specifically starting the 'Gabe/Kate hate club', but suggesting that there were many who wanted to explore more with Eleanor, were searching for more of a 'buddy' relationship the game was lacking perhaps with Tripp, ect.
It proved too complicated to make Clementine appear unique or familiar to individuals that had been shaping her story since Season 1, and were less than pleased that just as in Season 2 any surviving character aside from Clementine died swiftly in ANF. AJ's entire plot left a bad taste both in players that liked the idea of the character with Clementine and those that didn't as it had no resolution.
I still stand by that it did possess some characters that were interesting, and that had a lot of potential. It could be crafted using them into a great story, but I would rank it at the bottom of the WD by TT. I'm glad that there were a few people that enjoyed it that much.
Dang, I wish Telltale would pay me! But yeah I totally see what you're saying. Personal preference.
i don't think it was bad, but you're just not that emotionally connected because of Clem being an outsider in the story. The story itself was fine, but I didn't really care all that much.
I would add I think the most emotional aspect of ANF is when Mariana was killed and that was very early in the series. That's not a way to make a game and I didn't even play the game!
A new frontier was good. People, especially these days, forget that the purpose of video games are to have fun and to enjoy yourself, not to analyse them into some major detail and then complain 2 years later about how they don’t like a bunch of moving images, there are games that I absolutely hate but I don’t winge online about them (I’m throwing shade at everyone who does this btw) I don’t care if people dislike it for other reasons such as story and maybe character development, but when they look too far into it to the point that they forget they’re playing a game then... just please stop???But, hey, society is screwed enough as it is so this isn’t really out of the ordinary... you know, video games being looked at in completely different ways.
My efforts have been noticed?
In all seriousness, it's fine if you don't like the game, it's just so frustrating that you can't say you like without getting passive aggressive replies or being outright told that you're wrong.
U can say it was an average game on its own but for a series it wasn't.
I'm with you 100% on this lmao.
Just as how michonne was its own thing and didn't tie into any of the previous games, ANF should've been just like that. clementine shouldn't have been in it at all. they should've made an actual "season 3" that continued from season 2, THEN made a new frontier to serve as an appetizer while we wait for season 4.
To be fair, it's a curse brought by Season 1 being what it was. Now that's all people can use as a standard for their expectations, for better or worse.
That actually sounds like it would've been a great idea.
I think the issue of people complaining about how they don't like the game for whatever reasons comes from Telltale allowing us to import saves from previous games, only to have nothing you ever did really matter. The only purpose imports served in this game was to show players the events(things that happened in clems flashbacks) that happened after season 2 ended, where you're either in Wellington with AJ, with Kenny and AJ, jane and AJ, or alone with AJ. Those outcomes also determine whether or not Clementine loses a finger or gets a scar on her forehead. Other than that, their saves don't really effect anything. A lot of people were under the impression that their imported saves would heavily effect the events that took place in ANF. It being named "A New Frontier" and not "Season 3" should've informed players that it wasn't tied with the previous games, but with Telltale putting Clementine on the cover art, the message didn't really get through to them, even though they did say the game would be from someone elses point of view.
Also, Telltale had leeway to go about creating the story however they wanted, so they should be allowed to do so but if you know you can give the fans what they want while doing things your way, why not just do that?
Yeah I know.. But that's how it is when they're so passionate about something and then letdown from it.. This turns people bitter to any other positive feedback for what they felt failed to please them. Like if you had a bad ex and someone else comes along and tells you they feel they were the best person to love in this world. You might feel strongly about how incorrect their view the same person unless the person in question did a complete 180 degree turn in their ways.
The insinuation I'm getting from your post is that video games are mindless entertainment with no artistic value that are beneath long term discussion. You probably don't mean that, but if you do then I disagree, and I won't throw shade at you for your opinion of that or about A New Frontier being a good game. I'm glad you enjoyed it. I've moved on from A New Frontier. When I made the thread about ANF recently it was because I tried to give it another chance to see if time had changed my opinion and it hadn't. I want to be able to come here to discuss story details and reasons people chose certain choices, not to cynically rip these games into shreds, but I won't refrain from doing so if I feel there's something to add.
The thing is though, that video games are not, and we’re never intended to be art. Sure there’re hints of it here and there and it’s wonderful, but looking for artistic value instead of entertainment is just... not how it’s done???
I'll be honest, I find it strange that a Telltale fan wouldn't believe video games are art, since the emotional resonance in the writing is one of the only things holding their games together. I'm pretty sure you're not in the camp that says Telltale games are not real games but if you are then that's wrong on a technical level.
Video Games were never intended to be art? If you want to say that video games aren't art then okay sure but do you really mean that not a single video game was created for the sake of artistic merit? Your definition of what a game should be does not equate to what video games actually are. I can recall several games that used the medium to make some sort of commentary. Games can be made just so the player can have fun or they can also make the player think about the themes in the storytelling or mesmerize them with the imagery in the graphics. It all depends on the developer's vision.
Also there is entertainment in looking for artistic value. Otherwise people obviously wouldn't do it.
In all honestly these debates on whether or not video games are art made me realize that video games is an archaic label. It doesn't matter to me if it stays or not though.
To be fair, I’m not a telltale fan. I only play the walking dead just cos I like the show and I used to come here just to take the piss but now I come here cos I have nothing better to do. Art to me is anything with a deeper meaning, or anything postmodern and “out there”, I wouldn’t exactly call walking through the woods and talking about banging your brother’s wife art. Just sayin
I have to say that I didn't like how it finished off our season 2 endings, but overall... I very much loved it for what it was, even if it wasn't exactly what I expected. So you aren't completely alone! Just mostly alone.
Oh okay. I don't mean to claim that A New Frontier has some sense of sophistication by calling it art but the game does try to elicit emotions out of the player through it's themes (the major ones that I could discern were brothership and familial responsibility) and from someone who thoroughly dislikes ANF I thought it succeeded at times, so I don't really have a problem calling it art even if I don't exactly feel like it's a quality game.
I'm not an art critic or anything, I just prefer video games with a strong emphasis on storytelling, and I feel that as video games becomes more and more accepted as an art form we'll see more of those types of games with higher production values and quality. At least that's what I hope to see.
I enjoyed the first two seasons start to finish. I found some enjoyment in ANF but nothing compared to the first two games. That said, I was still excited when each new episode came out and I don't feel like it was a waste of my money. ANF had it's problems but it isn't as awful as a lot of people make it out to be. I am excited for the final season. Batman The Enemy Within was really good and I have heard that many of the people who were on that team are now working on the final season so I'm really excited to see what Telltale cooks up.
Gabe has 0 change, Conrad suddenly goes "sorry for being mean ;'(" and has like 3 minutes of determinate screen time after episode 2, cant think of any meaningful change Clem goes through, shes just cold to everyone and wants to find Aj, and Kate stays exactly the same except for the extremely random flip flop of not wanting to leave Richmond that made no sense
If you're not a Telltale fan, then why bother always defending their game and being upset with Telltale fans who were disappointed with the series thus post about it to give feedback on how to make the next game not bad lmao
Gabe starts out being very moody, standoffish about his personal issues, tending to complain and even rage when things don't go the way he(and/or whoever he's siding with) would like, tried to hard to make himself seem hard and willing to do anything, frequently got into arguments with Kate, and overidolizing David despite indications that he's got a serious aggressive streak. By the time the story is over, he is more emotionally mature, expresses his feelings in a much more positive manner, respectful and tolerant of the feelings and opinions of others, accepts that doing what's right and rational is the way to go, is on much better terms with Kate(even expressing regret that he was never able to tell her that he loved her if she dies), and comes to recognize and eventually accept David for his flaws, even trying to convince him to stay on his own terms.
Conrad's arc is partly about accepting that death. By extension, he recognizes that his grief was causing him to behave quite erratically & hostile and thus steps towards putting that behind him and moving on with his life.
Clementine was supposed to be dealing with her bitter feelings towards the New Frontier(well, mostly David) for seemingly allowing AJ to die and having her faith renewed by seeing the Garcias work things out, leaving the installment with a more positive resolve to reunited with AJ.
And finally, Kate goes from constantly running away from her bigger problems and trying to force complicationed connections/relationships with Gabe and Javier to being undetterant in taking responsibility for a problem she feels responsible for and respectful of Gabe's wishes while believing he'd rather be with David than with her.
I will at least say that the story progression didn't provide quite enough development and pacing to make these things feel wholly satisfying in implementation and execution, but they are there.
Gabe doesnt change. He is just an angsty teenager the whole game who flips flops from good to negative just like every annoying Teen character. Whole season he goes from being annoyingly "good and helpful" to annoyingly "bad and unhelpful" he does not change.
Again, Conrad goes "sry i tried 2 kil u i was upsetti ;'(" and then all his scenes are just extremely quick and dont take his character anywhere else.
Clem is pretty emotionless the whole season, even after hearing Aj is still alive. Her "change" at the end is just her being determined to find Aj. She really doesnt change, its an extreme minimal change that isnt even worth saying is a "development for Clem's character" because it isnt
Dont really recall Kate running away from her problems. And again, its character development not character changing. It has to develop overtime, or else it feels out of character, like Kate suddenly wanting to stay. You cant just make a character do something they would never do without anything happening beforehand to lead to it and then go "Now thats character development!"
I get pissed at anyone who complains and expects things to change