well it really depends on what you want her to be but there's no way she's lesbian but if you want her to be bi than shes bi if you want her to be straight then shes straight....and so on
We're going around in fucking circles here. Look, Nikolaj-11 and I are trying to say the same thing to you, and I'm not sure what you're not getting about the distinction between fake video game characters and real life.
Alright, let's look at it a different way. In RPG games like Fallout, you craft your character, and that includes physical aspects of a person that, much like sexuality, a normal person in real life cannot change. However, because it's a game, the player can choose that stuff. A player can choose that character's race, for example, because the game gives them the ability to be as such. A person can choose to have that character be black, that option is there, but that doesn't mean all versions of that character are black if one person decides to be as such.
While TWD does not contain the same RPG aspects of Fallout, the logic works in the same way.
In a choice based game, yes it is.
Alright, let's look at it a different way. In RPG games like Fallout, you craft your character, and th… moreat includes physical aspects of a person that, much like sexuality, a normal person in real life cannot change. However, because it's a game, the player can choose that stuff. A player can choose that character's race, for example, because the game gives them the ability to be as such. A person can choose to have that character be black, that option is there, but that doesn't mean all versions of that character are black if one person decides to be as such.
While TWD does not contain the same RPG aspects of Fallout, the logic works in the same way.
But the issue isn't one based on the definitions of sexuality, Clementine's sexuality is not governed by the same rules as ours are in the real world. She does not have any biology or psychological background that determines it like you an I do, she's a bunch of numbers on our devices and her traits are made up by people who wrote her story and created the framework for the game.
But the issue isn't one based on the definitions of sexuality, Clementine's sexuality is not governed by the same rules as ours are in the r… moreeal world. She does not have any biology or psychological background that determines it like you an I do, she's a bunch of numbers on our devices and her traits are made up by people who wrote her story and created the framework for the game.
Ellie's gay if that's what's stated within the game or by the people that made the game. I haven't played TLOU so I can't really argue within that specific comparison. I already told you another example with Dragon Age 2 for example.
Ellie is gay because we can't control her in the same way as Clem and she was confirmed gay by the writers and designers. The player doesn't have the freedom to control Ellie's sexuality, she is at the behest of the writers.
The player never sat down and chose Clem's sexuality: they never chose if she was gonna be straight, gay, bisexual, etc. We can choose her personality but her sexuality is not included in that, just like how we can't choose her gender or her race because that's settled. That is out of our control. But the player CAN choose who she romances. The fact that Clem can romance either Louis or Violet implies that she can be attracted to boys and girls. Choosing Louis over Violet =/= Clem is straight, Choosing Violet over Louis =/= Clem is a lesbian.
I thought we had settled this LOL and what's wrong with her being bisexual rather than straight? She can still like dudes and she can still like girls, it's genuinely the best of both worlds for all players
If she's confirmed bi, nothing. The debated issue is whether the player has the freedom to determine who our individual Clem is. I say her sexuality is up to the player to decide because nothing concrete was given in the game that confirms she is bi. The only thing is the potential to pursue Violet over Louis, and that's not enough. Being presented with choices does not exactly correlate to considerations the character is making, but different pathways and options for the player to pursue that will determine who your character is.
I thought we had settled this LOL and what's wrong with her being bisexual rather than straight? She can still like dudes and she can still like girls, it's genuinely the best of both worlds for all players
The choices doesn't imply anything unless Telltale says it does, they haven't stated anything so far, as far as I am aware.
When it comes to multiple-choice story telling there are usually two ways to interpret the way the choices are meant to represent the character: 1) All choices are thoughts that the player character has, therefore they all make up the basis of their character and their capacity to act. 2) Only the choice the player picks represent the character, the other three choices as such never crossed the characters mind. I don't recall Telltale ever confirming that it's one or the other interpretation that's correct so in reality people can imagine Clementine as defined by either way. I lean towards the second interpretation since, at least since season 2 Telltale has been pushing that our choices determine what kind of person Clementine is.
The player never sat down and chose Clem's sexuality: they never chose if she was gonna be straight, gay, bisexual, etc. We can choose her p… moreersonality but her sexuality is not included in that, just like how we can't choose her gender or her race because that's settled. That is out of our control. But the player CAN choose who she romances. The fact that Clem can romance either Louis or Violet implies that she can be attracted to boys and girls. Choosing Louis over Violet =/= Clem is straight, Choosing Violet over Louis =/= Clem is a lesbian.
I would argue that her being able to pursue Violet over Louis IS the concrete proof that she is bisexual. Unless this is an RPG where you get to choose from the beginning that this character is explicitly straight/gay/bi/etc, the choice of the player doesn't determine that aspect of her identity. It's not like Clem's past actions determine whether she's bisexual, that's just a part of her identity that isn't determined or changeable.
If she's confirmed bi, nothing. The debated issue is whether the player has the freedom to determine who our individual Clem is. I say her s… moreexuality is up to the player to decide because nothing concrete was given in the game that confirms she is bi. The only thing is the potential to pursue Violet over Louis, and that's not enough. Being presented with choices does not exactly correlate to considerations the character is making, but different pathways and options for the player to pursue that will determine who your character is.
Comments
well it really depends on what you want her to be but there's no way she's lesbian but if you want her to be bi than shes bi if you want her to be straight then shes straight....and so on
No it's not, and this person's not getting it.
I'm not sure what you're not getting about se.xuality is not a choice, in any situations
and sexuality is not a choice in either of them.
Nope
I don't think you understand the difference between real life and a video game
Could say the same for you.
In real life, sure. In video games where you get to pick aspects about your character it absolutely is.
Yes it is.
In what way? You say there is no difference at all.
You can say that as many times you want, still doesn't make it true.
Sexuality is not something you just pick, so no
In a choice based game, yes it is.
Alright, let's look at it a different way. In RPG games like Fallout, you craft your character, and that includes physical aspects of a person that, much like sexuality, a normal person in real life cannot change. However, because it's a game, the player can choose that stuff. A player can choose that character's race, for example, because the game gives them the ability to be as such. A person can choose to have that character be black, that option is there, but that doesn't mean all versions of that character are black if one person decides to be as such.
While TWD does not contain the same RPG aspects of Fallout, the logic works in the same way.
Personal attacks now? I was obviously talking about sexuality
Yes it does. I don't know about you, but I have a bachelor's degree in Games Design & Creative Writing, I actually know what I'm talking about.
In role playing games it can be,
I was talking about that as well. I wasn't attacking you
In what way was that a personal attack? Don't start claiming a false victimhood.
You don't pick who you wanna play as in twd, so you can't compare it.
And i know what i'm talking about when it comes to sexuality.
I acknowledged the difference between Fallout and TWD, what I said was the logic behind both of these equally applies to both scenarios.
As do I.
In what way was it not? saying that i'm to dumb to know the difference between fiction and reality.
Not sure i believe that
But the issue isn't one based on the definitions of sexuality, Clementine's sexuality is not governed by the same rules as ours are in the real world. She does not have any biology or psychological background that determines it like you an I do, she's a bunch of numbers on our devices and her traits are made up by people who wrote her story and created the framework for the game.
He never said that.
Why not. I acknowledge my sexuality and how I was born, why does that not make me an authority to speak on it.
So is characters in other games, like Ellie from TLAU, but she's still gay, or other characters who's straight
He clearly was implying i was
Ellie's gay if that's what's stated within the game or by the people that made the game. I haven't played TLOU so I can't really argue within that specific comparison. I already told you another example with Dragon Age 2 for example.
Ellie is gay because we can't control her in the same way as Clem and she was confirmed gay by the writers and designers. The player doesn't have the freedom to control Ellie's sexuality, she is at the behest of the writers.
Implying something is subjective, actually saying it is objective.
The player never sat down and chose Clem's sexuality: they never chose if she was gonna be straight, gay, bisexual, etc. We can choose her personality but her sexuality is not included in that, just like how we can't choose her gender or her race because that's settled. That is out of our control. But the player CAN choose who she romances. The fact that Clem can romance either Louis or Violet implies that she can be attracted to boys and girls. Choosing Louis over Violet =/= Clem is straight, Choosing Violet over Louis =/= Clem is a lesbian.
No, not really. I'm not dumb.
No one ever said or implied that you were, and nothing in his statement implied that you were.
I thought we had settled this LOL and what's wrong with her being bisexual rather than straight? She can still like dudes and she can still like girls, it's genuinely the best of both worlds for all players
If she's confirmed bi, nothing. The debated issue is whether the player has the freedom to determine who our individual Clem is. I say her sexuality is up to the player to decide because nothing concrete was given in the game that confirms she is bi. The only thing is the potential to pursue Violet over Louis, and that's not enough. Being presented with choices does not exactly correlate to considerations the character is making, but different pathways and options for the player to pursue that will determine who your character is.
The choices doesn't imply anything unless Telltale says it does, they haven't stated anything so far, as far as I am aware.
When it comes to multiple-choice story telling there are usually two ways to interpret the way the choices are meant to represent the character: 1) All choices are thoughts that the player character has, therefore they all make up the basis of their character and their capacity to act. 2) Only the choice the player picks represent the character, the other three choices as such never crossed the characters mind. I don't recall Telltale ever confirming that it's one or the other interpretation that's correct so in reality people can imagine Clementine as defined by either way. I lean towards the second interpretation since, at least since season 2 Telltale has been pushing that our choices determine what kind of person Clementine is.
No I wasn't.
I would argue that her being able to pursue Violet over Louis IS the concrete proof that she is bisexual. Unless this is an RPG where you get to choose from the beginning that this character is explicitly straight/gay/bi/etc, the choice of the player doesn't determine that aspect of her identity. It's not like Clem's past actions determine whether she's bisexual, that's just a part of her identity that isn't determined or changeable.