He raises some good points, and he's entertaining as always, although I'm sure he'll get emails from irate fans pointing out that Ron Gilbert said MI2 WASN'T supposed to invalidate sequels, and about Ron and Dave's involvement with Tales, and general other fanboy "here's-why-you're-wrong"isms.
I had been meaning to say something about Morgan being gaa-gaa over Guybrush, but hadn't bothered to register in order to say anything about it. But since somebody else mentioned it...
It really does feel out-of-place for anyone to think that Guybrush is a pirate worth mention. How does Morgan even know about any of the stuff Guybrush did, anyway? What was the thinking that went into creating that part of the character? Heaven forbid that it was "let's remind everyone how much they liked the old games!"
Guybrush whistling Largo's theme from Monkey 2 was even worse, really. Someone who hasn't played that game will get nothing out of it. The point really is just "hey, remember Monkey Island 2?". That isn't humor.
As a counterexample, the singing manatee which sang a few lines from the musical number in Monkey 3 was ok because it fit in-context; the singing toy in the pirate setting sang a little song about being a pirate. You don't need the referance to find it funny.
I know perhaps the entire audience of Tales are pre-existing Monkey Island fans that will get these jokes, but that's no excuse. "Fan-wank", as Yahtzee would say, has no creativity, no soul. It's nothing but a second-hand emotional experiance that comes from jogging happy memories of something which was actually good. It's the fictional equivalent of a zombie.
"Fan-wank", as Yahtzee would say, has no creativity, no soul. It's nothing but a second-hand emotional experiance that comes from jogging happy memories of something which was actually good. It's the fictional equivalent of a zombie.
That may be, but I think a little bit in moderation is harmless. It's not like the ENTIRE GAME has been fanwank. A few references are not a problem...and very in-keeping with the original Monkey Island games, which constantly referenced Indy, Star Wars, Loom, as well as non-Lucas properties like the Pirates of the Caribbean ride...hell, even one of Guybrush's catchphrases comes from "Get Smart"!
I had been meaning to say something about Morgan being gaa-gaa over Guybrush, but hadn't bothered to register in order to say anything about it. But since somebody else mentioned it...
It really does feel out-of-place for anyone to think that Guybrush is a pirate worth mention. How does Morgan even know about any of the stuff Guybrush did, anyway?
He does meet people who mention his exploits to him in the earlier games as well (the woman at Stan's Shipyard in EMI tells him, "Weren't you the one who killed LeChuck?" "Yeah, three times!").
Guybrush whistling Largo's theme from Monkey 2 was even worse, really. Someone who hasn't played that game will get nothing out of it. The point really is just "hey, remember Monkey Island 2?". That isn't humor.
I laughed.
And games referencing their prequels isn't something new.
a second-hand emotional experiance that comes from jogging happy memories of something which was actually good. It's the fictional equivalent of a zombie.
Yes, because zombies aren't fictional.
You're just nitpicking. Monkey 2 was "actually good", true; so's TMI.
I don't mean to sound so angry but it does feel, at times, that people are just annoyed this isn't LeChuck's Revenge. I'm not sure if it's nostalgia or Ron Gilbert (who, by the way, has praised Tales), but it's starting to get on my nerves.
People still pay attention to this guy? I thought his gimmick already passed over the internet culture and everyone was finished with him. Damn. I haven't watched the review of Tales, but yeah... Grew tired of this guy after day 1 of 'OMG He talks fast and reviews harsh!' and everyone spamming his link.... ugh.
The only thing I respect of him is that he loves Adventures of Dizzy and he is a classic PC gamer who hates Bethesda. Besides that, he tries too hard to be like the Dennis Leary or something of video game reviewing. Just establishing a gimmick and raping it to shreds with no substance or anything. But eh, to each his own.
That may be, but I think a little bit in moderation is harmless. It's not like the ENTIRE GAME has been fanwank. A few references are not a problem...and very in-keeping with the original Monkey Island games, which constantly referenced Indy, Star Wars, Loom, as well as non-Lucas properties like the Pirates of the Caribbean ride...hell, even one of Guybrush's catchphrases comes from "Get Smart"!
That's true, but those draw from a larger cultural experiance. The references in Tales have been "incestous".
He does meet people who mention his exploits to him in the earlier games as well (the woman at Stan's Shipyard in EMI tells him, "Weren't you the one who killed LeChuck?" "Yeah, three times!").
I honestly can't remember very much about Escape, because I didn't like it much.
Did she think he was awesome for it? Guybrush coming off as a buffonish schlub has always been part of the character. No one respects him. Whenever he gets a crew, they always mutiny on him. Now he's got a fan?
I don't mean to sound so angry but it does feel, at times, that people are just annoyed this isn't LeChuck's Revenge. I'm not sure if it's nostalgia or Ron Gilbert (who, by the way, has praised Tales), but it's starting to get on my nerves.
Where did this focus on Monkey 2 come from? I only mentioned it in referance to the Largo theme whistling.
The fanwank is awful in and of itself, not in comparison to anything.
How does Morgan even know about any of the stuff Guybrush did, anyway?
Maybe she's been reading the books in the Phatt Island library? Maybe she's been to Planet Threepwood? Maybe she's heard people talk about it?
Guybrush whistling Largo's theme from Monkey 2 was even worse, really. Someone who hasn't played that game will get nothing out of it. The point really is just "hey, remember Monkey Island 2?". That isn't humor.
It didn't really bother me...
I know perhaps the entire audience of Tales are pre-existing Monkey Island fans that will get these jokes, but that's no excuse. "Fan-wank", as Yahtzee would say, has no creativity, no soul. It's nothing but a second-hand emotional experiance that comes from jogging happy memories of something which was actually good. It's the fictional equivalent of a zombie.
So... a game should be entirely original, without any throwbacks to anything? Then we might as well close down the game industry right now.
As for Yahtzee's review, I can't tell if he really only likes MI1 and MI2, or if he's joking about that. All I can say is I'm glad they made CMI, still the best game in the series as far as I'm concerned.
First time i watched it i took it a bit seriously and i did live up to some of the fanboy habits by moaning to my friend about this review being a joke, and of course, that the there was a third game planned... so live long, and SUCK IT, YAHTZEE!
But he does raise a good point about the models, however i do believe his merits for the game were few and far between.
Oh yeah, and he never explained why guybursh having a fan was cringeworthy... i thought she was a fantastic twist on the often very boring no one notices what guybrush does. One fan... is that such a big thing?
Oh yeah and i so don't get how the whistle was such a big thing it was worth throwing in the review, rather than say mention what the humor or the overall writing was like.
I guess i still am in a fanboy mood, ah well... i should've expected this from him.
Did she think he was awesome for it? Guybrush coming off as a buffonish schlub has always been part of the character. No one respects him. Whenever he gets a crew, they always mutiny on him. Now he's got a fan?
That's what's so funny about it. Don't worry: they're not going to be throwing parties in his honor any time soon.
Congratulations on your fanwank!
There's always been references to past games (even outside the Monkey Island series). That's OK. This one was cute, and - because it was so out of the blue - funny. That's one of the best things Tales has done, actually. It's not completely cut-off from its prequels, but it's also doing its own thing.
Referencing a classic isn't a wart. Just hit the SCUMM Bar and see how many in-jokes there are in the Monkey series.
That was pretty light for a Yahtzee review, almost sounded like he liked it but wanted to find every excuse not to (which is pretty much his job description).
I giggled. No game is perfect, and as far as Zero Punctuation goes, we might as well have a red carpet for us because we didn't get reamed. "Harmless" is a good thing to get for from a guy who disembowels games for a living. Three cheers!
....Does he know about the keyboard controls? Honestly, I'm preferable to them.
I do have to agree, on the idea of the health of the franchise as a whole, that not continuing after the second game would probably have been the best thing to do. But after the third and fourth games, the damage to the ending at the second game was already done, so we might as well get something good out of it.
The funny part about ...well... being funny, is that our reviews look a lot like the comments Yahtzee got for this ZP. I waded through, and people were anywhere from "Didn't like it" to "I think I cracked a rib laughing." And especially all manner in between.
When games (or anything) center in on humor, it's not easy to tell what will do it for people and what won't, so I think it's much more subjective than addictively-playable games. Interesting to look at, very fractal.
Well, good humor gets across in any form - which is why we're still fangirling over a franchise that started almost 20 years ago. But I know what you mean.
For what it's worth, I think you guys have done a stellar job. I wouldn't want it any other way.
Well, as far as Yahtzee goes, Tales got off really lightly.
And come on, bad Irish accent was hilarious.
P.S. Too all of you who somehow took his review personally and got "insulted" for some weird reason or another, a) first check out some of his other reviews to get some perspective and b) instead of creating snobbish posts like "heh that guy is a loser he stopped being funny even before he started his first video" please just take each of Yahtzee's points and frikkin COUNTERARGUMENT IT. Seriously, one thing has to be said and that it that Yahtzee is one perceptive bastard - sure he stomps all over each and every game but darn it he never really trolls - each of his points is valid and grounded in reality.
....Does he know about the keyboard controls? Honestly, I'm preferable to them.
Perhaps if the tutorial at the start of the first episode had mentioned the controls? I've seen multiple reviewers apparently unaware of WASD and especially the fact that you can use I to bring up your inventory.
Great stuff, tho shame it means he probably won't review the whole series once its said and done.
I agreed with all the nitpicks he nitpicked out, but then TOMI was my first MI game [then SOMI: SE], despite witnessing my brother play through the first four. :cool:
I was just thinking the other day I wonder how Yahtzee would rate Tales of Monkey Island. Overall the review was pretty funny, but I agree that it didn't seem like he actually hated the game. If he hated it there would have been a lot more shouting and cursing and the like, but he was relatively mild about it.
1. I don't even know which characters he's referring to when he talks about the character models. I don't particularly remember lots of characters looking alike, nor lots of characters sounding alike (quite possibly the more important of the two). However, lots of people have mentioned it and I can see how it might be annoying if you notice it. But I would be very surprised if there weren't a bunch of other people like me saying "wait, what's this about reused character models?"
2. He's totally right about the inventory. It hasn't been much of a problem because it's almost always been really obvious when two items should be combined. But it really is a lot more complicated than it needs to be.
3. I liked the Morgan scenes because she's a fan that's trying to cut off his hand and kidnap him. And she's not the sort of crazy demented fan you might logically expect that from, either. It was funny because it's so... off.
He does meet people who mention his exploits to him in the earlier games as well (the woman at Stan's Shipyard in EMI tells him, "Weren't you the one who killed LeChuck?" "Yeah, three times!").
I laughed.
And games referencing their prequels isn't something new.
No, but the main problem isn't the actual whistle. It's Guybrush basically saying afterwards "that's a reference from an earlier game. Did you get it, did you?! Hur-dur-dur."
When Guybrush makes Indy references or the like in previous games, it's subtle & even a lot of people who know Indy may not have got it first time round. Guybrush doesn't make a reference & then inform you immediately afterwards that it was one. It was up to you to notice it or not.
That shouldn't have happened & Yahtzee was right to point it out. To people that have never played MI2 it would have just been a whistle, nothing more & they'd have thought no more about it. But to MI fans it would have been an inside joke that we can all appreciate. It didn't need Guybrush to comment on it afterwards making new people to the series feel left out of the gag, or old timers feel slightly patronised.
I didn't really see Guybrush's comment as drawing attention to the reference. I just saw it as him wondering why he was whistling a song he hadn't heard in years. Every day, I get songs stuck in my head without knowing why, so I was very amused that Guybrush has the same problem.
Also, part of me wondered if it was supposed to be foreshadowing for later in the season.
I didn't really see Guybrush's comment as drawing attention to the reference. I just saw it as him wondering why he was whistling a song he hadn't heard in years. Every day, I get songs stuck in my head without knowing why, so I was very amused that Guybrush has the same problem.
Except it was intended to draw attention to the reference.
In a gaudy, annoying "WINK WINK, NUDGE NUDGE, hey, hey, did you see what we did there? Guess what, guess what, we just referenced the old games. How cool is that?"
The line was written. By a writer. Really, what do you think the intention was when the thing was written? It's annoying and patronizing.
Except it was intended to draw attention to the reference.
In a gaudy, annoying "WINK WINK, NUDGE NUDGE, hey, hey, did you see what we did there? Guess what, guess what, we just referenced the old games. How cool is that?"
The line was written. By a writer. Really, what do you think the intention was when the thing was written? It's annoying and patronizing.
Refresh my memory... what exactly does Guybrush say after whistling the tune? I mustn't have thought it to be too egregious, considering I can't even remember. But now I'm curious considering it seems to have raised some hackles.
He said "Why do I have THAT tune stuck in my head?" I don't see what's annoying about that line. The tune he was whistling could have been completely original and the line would still have made sense for a character to say.
Yeah, by Yahtzee's standards he wasn't too harsh, probably because he knew he was reviewing a good game. But some of his criticisms ring true... Guybrush still needs to be pathetic sometimes, and escalating him to this heroic, bafflingly competent level does almost make it feel like the designers are MI fans idolising the series. As much as I love the classic references, since many of them are hilarious, you still want to move forward in the game design, not be stuck worshipping MI1 and 2. Only we get to do that, not the people making new gamrs.
He said "Why do I have THAT tune stuck in my head?" I don't see what's annoying about that line. The tune he was whistling could have been completely original and the line would still have made sense for a character to say.
No it wouldn't. Yahtzee was right on the money about this - they made an semi-unnecessary fan-service reference and then they took lengths to POINT IT OUT. Not a big issue, but demonstrative nonetheless.
I liked the Morgan scenes because she's a fan that's trying to cut off his hand and kidnap him. And she's not the sort of crazy demented fan you might logically expect that from, either. It was funny because it's so... off.
I don't think there's a problem with Morgan as a new haracter, but with the fact that Guybrush is now a "famous pirate" for some reason and there was no reason for him being that because he is still a bit of a nobody in Monkey Island world. Sure, he is popular in the minds of the fans of the series, but that's not the same thing, now, init?
Think about it. How WOULD Morgan have become Guybrush's fan exactly? Are there books about him in Monkey Island universe? Movies? It simply doesn't make sense. So yes, perhaps Morgan IS there to make fun of the "crazy fan" concept, but she also reeks of Mary Sue-ism and that cannot easily be refuted.
1. I don't even know which characters he's referring to when he talks about the character models. I don't particularly remember lots of characters looking alike, nor lots of characters sounding alike (quite possibly the more important of the two). However, lots of people have mentioned it and I can see how it might be annoying if you notice it. But I would be very surprised if there weren't a bunch of other people like me saying "wait, what's this about reused character models?"
You're kidding me right?
To be honest the fact that pretty much every character looks like another character almost kills the game experience for me. If they use the same models again in Episode 3 chances are I will not even bother to download episode 4. I mean the Wii ports of Tales of Monkey island are Awe full anyway. So why ruin the PC versions as well just so that you can also offer it on Wii-ware. It doesn't make any sense.
Anyway, on-topic, I thought that the Yahtzee review was pretty fair and he mentioned some things that, even if you really like the Tales series, you can not deny are true.
Think about it. How WOULD Morgan have become Guybrush's fan exactly? Are there books about him in Monkey Island universe? Movies? It simply doesn't make sense. So yes, perhaps Morgan IS there to make fun of the "crazy fan" concept, but she also reeks of Mary Sue-ism and that cannot easily be refuted.
I actually don't see LeFlay as a problem like I do the "Oh golly garsh gee, where-ever did I get that oh-so catchy tune? HMMMM.....". LeFlay is a pirate hunter, she'd be clued in to the pirate world to a far greater extent than most people.
By the start of Monkey Island 2, Guybrush had become a bit of a success. He starts out with a cool jacket and a lot of loot. A few people here and there knew that he was the guy that beat LeChuck. Really, if you happen to know a lot about pirates, I think that the name Guybrush might come up here and there...even just in jest.
In the current Monkey Island plotline, I really don't know how "being the guy who killed LeChuck" can give you even a smidgeon of fame, since the guy keeps popping back up again more often then a Jack-in-the-box. It worked in context of MI2, but at this point LeChuck is more of a constant irritation and token villain in Guybrush's microverse then some sort of notorious ghost pirate of the Monkey Island universe. Also, as far as I remembered, MI2 opened with noone knowing/believing that Guybrush was the one killing LeChuck.. why is now the opposite suddenly general knowledge??
But what bothered me personally (and Yahtzee thankfully reminded me in a superbly amusing way) was that Morgan l explicitely points out the highlights from actual GAMES, as if she literally PLAYED THROUGH THEM.
Check out her lines:
"It's an honor to finally face off against the legendary Guybrush Threepwood." - Seriously? Legendary?
"Pirate who single-handledly beat ghost pirate LeChuck? (that's a solid fact for her even though it was made painfully obvious noone believed in it before to Guybrush's utter frustration? Hmm.. I guess she played MI1)Who found the mythical treasure of Big Whoop?(how does she know this? Did Guybrush advertise it somewhere? And wasn't it established that there was NO Big Whoop, it was all either a giant mind***k or LeChuck's sneaky trap, the latter not making much sense but that's another story? Gee.. .I guess she also got her hands on MI2..) Who escaped the inescapable Carnival of the Damned?(OK, NOW you're really stretching it! Big Whoop WAS Carnival of the Damned, and how the hell she KNOWS both that Guybrush escaped as well as has knowledge about the Carnival itself?? Hmm.. I guess she ALSO got a hold of MI3...)
And THOSE are the only things she lists! No pirate feats that must have happened to raise Guybrush to "legendary" status but happened "between the games".. just stuff personally witnessed by the fans while playing the actual games!
But to give credit where credit is due, Morgan didn't list the "Who got rid of the pesky TOURISTS!" feat, which IS another proof of fan-service, but is also most welcome.
He said "Why do I have THAT tune stuck in my head?" I don't see what's annoying about that line. The tune he was whistling could have been completely original and the line would still have made sense for a character to say.
Actually when you think about it, it makes a lot of sense he would say that. Why THAT tune, indeed ? In MI2, you discover Largo is wearing bras, hinting at a taste for cross-dressing. It is funny - and quite subtle, IMO - Guybrush would unconsciously think of him when dealing with the merfolk whose gender is hard to guess. I don't think they put that line to point at the (obvious) fan-service, more to point at the fact there was MORE than just fan-service behind that whistling. It worked that way for me, anyway.
Yahtzee is awesome, when I saw him doing ToMI I immediately came over here to say so, but others have already beaten me to it. It does seem that he actually liked it, I kept expecting him to claim that ToMI was everything that is wrong with adventure gaming and that the whole genre should be scourged from the face of the earth and that he hates developer's mother...you know, the usual, but he actually seemed to really like it. Good points on the flaws too, I'm sure none of us here have allowed ourselves to be blinded by them, I mean who would be such a fanboy as to allow that...
But what bothered me personally (and Yahtzee thankfully reminded me in a superbly amusing way) was that Morgan l explicitely points out the highlights from actual GAMES, as if she literally PLAYED THROUGH THEM.
Check out her lines:
"It's an honor to finally face off against the legendary Guybrush Threepwood." - Seriously? Legendary?
"Pirate who single-handledly beat ghost pirate LeChuck? (that's a solid fact for her even though it was made painfully obvious noone believed in it before to Guybrush's utter frustration? Hmm.. I guess she played MI1)Who found the mythical treasure of Big Whoop?(how does she know this? Did Guybrush advertise it somewhere? And wasn't it established that there was NO Big Whoop, it was all either a giant mind***k or LeChuck's sneaky trap, the latter not making much sense but that's another story? Gee.. .I guess she also got her hands on MI2..) Who escaped the inescapable Carnival of the Damned?(OK, NOW you're really stretching it! Big Whoop WAS Carnival of the Damned, and how the hell she KNOWS both that Guybrush escaped as well as has knowledge about the Carnival itself?? Hmm.. I guess she ALSO got a hold of MI3...)
To be fair, many of the problems you put forward actually contradict each other. You complain about how she seems to know so much, but also complain about how she gets things wrong. Quite obviously, she's heard about him second hand and through stories, and in MI2 we see that Guybrush has been going around telling people about him defeating LeChuck single-handedly to such an extent that they are telling him to shut up about it, so it's fairly well-known. We also see that he tells at least the pirates on Scabb beach that he is looking for Big Whoop, who seem reasonably impressed with this, and it's not hard to see that in all the confusion Big Whoop and Carnival of the Damned getting separated as the stories get passed around. Morgan thinks she knows Guybrush, but doesn't really, and may feel let down when she discovers what he's really like...
Comments
Gotta appreciate his lousy accent that kept popping up every time he talked about Tales.
It really does feel out-of-place for anyone to think that Guybrush is a pirate worth mention. How does Morgan even know about any of the stuff Guybrush did, anyway? What was the thinking that went into creating that part of the character? Heaven forbid that it was "let's remind everyone how much they liked the old games!"
Guybrush whistling Largo's theme from Monkey 2 was even worse, really. Someone who hasn't played that game will get nothing out of it. The point really is just "hey, remember Monkey Island 2?". That isn't humor.
As a counterexample, the singing manatee which sang a few lines from the musical number in Monkey 3 was ok because it fit in-context; the singing toy in the pirate setting sang a little song about being a pirate. You don't need the referance to find it funny.
I know perhaps the entire audience of Tales are pre-existing Monkey Island fans that will get these jokes, but that's no excuse. "Fan-wank", as Yahtzee would say, has no creativity, no soul. It's nothing but a second-hand emotional experiance that comes from jogging happy memories of something which was actually good. It's the fictional equivalent of a zombie.
This guy treats every single game like this
That may be, but I think a little bit in moderation is harmless. It's not like the ENTIRE GAME has been fanwank. A few references are not a problem...and very in-keeping with the original Monkey Island games, which constantly referenced Indy, Star Wars, Loom, as well as non-Lucas properties like the Pirates of the Caribbean ride...hell, even one of Guybrush's catchphrases comes from "Get Smart"!
(Although he disses CMI. HANG HIM.)
He does meet people who mention his exploits to him in the earlier games as well (the woman at Stan's Shipyard in EMI tells him, "Weren't you the one who killed LeChuck?" "Yeah, three times!").
I laughed.
And games referencing their prequels isn't something new.
Yes, because zombies aren't fictional.
You're just nitpicking. Monkey 2 was "actually good", true; so's TMI.
I don't mean to sound so angry but it does feel, at times, that people are just annoyed this isn't LeChuck's Revenge. I'm not sure if it's nostalgia or Ron Gilbert (who, by the way, has praised Tales), but it's starting to get on my nerves.
The only thing I respect of him is that he loves Adventures of Dizzy and he is a classic PC gamer who hates Bethesda. Besides that, he tries too hard to be like the Dennis Leary or something of video game reviewing. Just establishing a gimmick and raping it to shreds with no substance or anything. But eh, to each his own.
That's true, but those draw from a larger cultural experiance. The references in Tales have been "incestous".
Did she think he was awesome for it? Guybrush coming off as a buffonish schlub has always been part of the character. No one respects him. Whenever he gets a crew, they always mutiny on him. Now he's got a fan?
Congratulations on your fanwank!
Poor choice of words; it's the joke-writing equivalent of a zombie
Picking at warts, more like. These things make me feel a little ill.
Where did this focus on Monkey 2 come from? I only mentioned it in referance to the Largo theme whistling.
The fanwank is awful in and of itself, not in comparison to anything.
It didn't really bother me...
So... a game should be entirely original, without any throwbacks to anything? Then we might as well close down the game industry right now.
As for Yahtzee's review, I can't tell if he really only likes MI1 and MI2, or if he's joking about that. All I can say is I'm glad they made CMI, still the best game in the series as far as I'm concerned.
But he does raise a good point about the models, however i do believe his merits for the game were few and far between.
Oh yeah, and he never explained why guybursh having a fan was cringeworthy... i thought she was a fantastic twist on the often very boring no one notices what guybrush does. One fan... is that such a big thing?
Oh yeah and i so don't get how the whistle was such a big thing it was worth throwing in the review, rather than say mention what the humor or the overall writing was like.
I guess i still am in a fanboy mood, ah well... i should've expected this from him.
That's what's so funny about it. Don't worry: they're not going to be throwing parties in his honor any time soon.
There's always been references to past games (even outside the Monkey Island series). That's OK. This one was cute, and - because it was so out of the blue - funny. That's one of the best things Tales has done, actually. It's not completely cut-off from its prequels, but it's also doing its own thing.
Referencing a classic isn't a wart. Just hit the SCUMM Bar and see how many in-jokes there are in the Monkey series.
I find your whole stance completely baffling.
....Does he know about the keyboard controls? Honestly, I'm preferable to them.
When games (or anything) center in on humor, it's not easy to tell what will do it for people and what won't, so I think it's much more subjective than addictively-playable games. Interesting to look at, very fractal.
For what it's worth, I think you guys have done a stellar job. I wouldn't want it any other way.
And come on, bad Irish accent was hilarious.
P.S. Too all of you who somehow took his review personally and got "insulted" for some weird reason or another, a) first check out some of his other reviews to get some perspective and b) instead of creating snobbish posts like "heh that guy is a loser he stopped being funny even before he started his first video" please just take each of Yahtzee's points and frikkin COUNTERARGUMENT IT. Seriously, one thing has to be said and that it that Yahtzee is one perceptive bastard - sure he stomps all over each and every game but darn it he never really trolls - each of his points is valid and grounded in reality.
Perhaps if the tutorial at the start of the first episode had mentioned the controls? I've seen multiple reviewers apparently unaware of WASD and especially the fact that you can use I to bring up your inventory.
I agreed with all the nitpicks he nitpicked out, but then TOMI was my first MI game [then SOMI: SE], despite witnessing my brother play through the first four. :cool:
1. I don't even know which characters he's referring to when he talks about the character models. I don't particularly remember lots of characters looking alike, nor lots of characters sounding alike (quite possibly the more important of the two). However, lots of people have mentioned it and I can see how it might be annoying if you notice it. But I would be very surprised if there weren't a bunch of other people like me saying "wait, what's this about reused character models?"
2. He's totally right about the inventory. It hasn't been much of a problem because it's almost always been really obvious when two items should be combined. But it really is a lot more complicated than it needs to be.
3. I liked the Morgan scenes because she's a fan that's trying to cut off his hand and kidnap him. And she's not the sort of crazy demented fan you might logically expect that from, either. It was funny because it's so... off.
No, but the main problem isn't the actual whistle. It's Guybrush basically saying afterwards "that's a reference from an earlier game. Did you get it, did you?! Hur-dur-dur."
When Guybrush makes Indy references or the like in previous games, it's subtle & even a lot of people who know Indy may not have got it first time round. Guybrush doesn't make a reference & then inform you immediately afterwards that it was one. It was up to you to notice it or not.
That shouldn't have happened & Yahtzee was right to point it out. To people that have never played MI2 it would have just been a whistle, nothing more & they'd have thought no more about it. But to MI fans it would have been an inside joke that we can all appreciate. It didn't need Guybrush to comment on it afterwards making new people to the series feel left out of the gag, or old timers feel slightly patronised.
Also, part of me wondered if it was supposed to be foreshadowing for later in the season.
In a gaudy, annoying "WINK WINK, NUDGE NUDGE, hey, hey, did you see what we did there? Guess what, guess what, we just referenced the old games. How cool is that?"
The line was written. By a writer. Really, what do you think the intention was when the thing was written? It's annoying and patronizing.
Refresh my memory... what exactly does Guybrush say after whistling the tune? I mustn't have thought it to be too egregious, considering I can't even remember. But now I'm curious considering it seems to have raised some hackles.
No it wouldn't. Yahtzee was right on the money about this - they made an semi-unnecessary fan-service reference and then they took lengths to POINT IT OUT. Not a big issue, but demonstrative nonetheless.
I don't think there's a problem with Morgan as a new haracter, but with the fact that Guybrush is now a "famous pirate" for some reason and there was no reason for him being that because he is still a bit of a nobody in Monkey Island world. Sure, he is popular in the minds of the fans of the series, but that's not the same thing, now, init?
Think about it. How WOULD Morgan have become Guybrush's fan exactly? Are there books about him in Monkey Island universe? Movies? It simply doesn't make sense. So yes, perhaps Morgan IS there to make fun of the "crazy fan" concept, but she also reeks of Mary Sue-ism and that cannot easily be refuted.
You're kidding me right?
To be honest the fact that pretty much every character looks like another character almost kills the game experience for me. If they use the same models again in Episode 3 chances are I will not even bother to download episode 4. I mean the Wii ports of Tales of Monkey island are Awe full anyway. So why ruin the PC versions as well just so that you can also offer it on Wii-ware. It doesn't make any sense.
Anyway, on-topic, I thought that the Yahtzee review was pretty fair and he mentioned some things that, even if you really like the Tales series, you can not deny are true.
By the start of Monkey Island 2, Guybrush had become a bit of a success. He starts out with a cool jacket and a lot of loot. A few people here and there knew that he was the guy that beat LeChuck. Really, if you happen to know a lot about pirates, I think that the name Guybrush might come up here and there...even just in jest.
But what bothered me personally (and Yahtzee thankfully reminded me in a superbly amusing way) was that Morgan l explicitely points out the highlights from actual GAMES, as if she literally PLAYED THROUGH THEM.
Check out her lines:
"It's an honor to finally face off against the legendary Guybrush Threepwood." - Seriously? Legendary?
"Pirate who single-handledly beat ghost pirate LeChuck? (that's a solid fact for her even though it was made painfully obvious noone believed in it before to Guybrush's utter frustration? Hmm.. I guess she played MI1) Who found the mythical treasure of Big Whoop? (how does she know this? Did Guybrush advertise it somewhere? And wasn't it established that there was NO Big Whoop, it was all either a giant mind***k or LeChuck's sneaky trap, the latter not making much sense but that's another story? Gee.. .I guess she also got her hands on MI2..) Who escaped the inescapable Carnival of the Damned? (OK, NOW you're really stretching it! Big Whoop WAS Carnival of the Damned, and how the hell she KNOWS both that Guybrush escaped as well as has knowledge about the Carnival itself?? Hmm.. I guess she ALSO got a hold of MI3...)
And THOSE are the only things she lists! No pirate feats that must have happened to raise Guybrush to "legendary" status but happened "between the games".. just stuff personally witnessed by the fans while playing the actual games!
But to give credit where credit is due, Morgan didn't list the "Who got rid of the pesky TOURISTS!" feat, which IS another proof of fan-service, but is also most welcome.
Actually when you think about it, it makes a lot of sense he would say that. Why THAT tune, indeed ? In MI2, you discover Largo is wearing bras, hinting at a taste for cross-dressing. It is funny - and quite subtle, IMO - Guybrush would unconsciously think of him when dealing with the merfolk whose gender is hard to guess. I don't think they put that line to point at the (obvious) fan-service, more to point at the fact there was MORE than just fan-service behind that whistling. It worked that way for me, anyway.
To be fair, many of the problems you put forward actually contradict each other. You complain about how she seems to know so much, but also complain about how she gets things wrong. Quite obviously, she's heard about him second hand and through stories, and in MI2 we see that Guybrush has been going around telling people about him defeating LeChuck single-handedly to such an extent that they are telling him to shut up about it, so it's fairly well-known. We also see that he tells at least the pirates on Scabb beach that he is looking for Big Whoop, who seem reasonably impressed with this, and it's not hard to see that in all the confusion Big Whoop and Carnival of the Damned getting separated as the stories get passed around. Morgan thinks she knows Guybrush, but doesn't really, and may feel let down when she discovers what he's really like...