No, but it's not something that should be "reversed" lightly, and that's what it seems like Curse did. It tossed aside and explained away the whole concept, which I didn't like at all.
...I didn't mean to have this conversation here.
I don't really think it reversed it either though, in MI2 itself it's very strongly hinted at that Guybrush being a child is just Lechuck putting him under a spell. That's exactly the explanation Curse uses, and Lechuck even does it again at the ending bit of Curse.
And this conversation will happen in every thread on every MI board from now until Ron says what he supposedly would have done for an MI3, and for a while after that too, heh.
I don't really think it reversed it either though, in MI2 itself it's very strongly hinted at that Guybrush being a child is just Lechuck putting him under a spell. That's exactly the explanation Curse uses, and Lechuck even does it again at the ending bit of Curse.
If that was what he was going for, then I take it back. All the years of me enjoying the ending are moot; Ron Gilbert's plan to show us something exciting and different to just go say "Wait, no, that doesn't matter" was stupid, bad writing, deceitful, and a waste of my time.
Main Entry: Yahtzee
Part of Speech: n
Definition: a trademarked board game involving rolling dice and keeping score
Etymology: originally called the 'yacht game'
Usage: trademark
Or:
Zero Punctuation is The Escapist's groundbreaking video review series starring Ben "Yahtzee" Croshaw. Every Wednesday Zero Punctuation picks apart the games so you don't have to. Called "hilariously cutting ... first legitimate breakout hit from the gaming community in recent memory" by Boing Boing, see why gamers love it and developers fear it.
I'm just sick of everyone's MI1+2 nostalgia making them think that anything after those two games is pointless franchise milking, as though Curse was tripe or something.
Yeah, fans like that are annoying. Honestly, MI2 had a stupid ending, and MI3 did it's best to fix that, and was the best MI because of it. TOMI has started off really well and looks set to top even MI3, the series is getting better.
God, so it's ok for him to beg for a beyond good and evil sequel, but when it's a monkey island sequel it's suddenly crap and deserves extreme criticism?
It's stupid!
Have any of you played Yahtzee's Adventure games? One of the puzzles involves kicking a tree, for no reason, cos there's a guy in it. You can't see the guy. There are no whistling noises or anything. You just have to kick it.
For someone so shite at making adventure games, he's quick to judge.
I dont remember exactly, but i think that you were trying to escape the house by climbing the tree, and thats when you realized there was someone there.
heart breaking but he did bring up one of two good points.still love the game tho and i took the review in good humor. also he doesnt really rip the game to shreads tbh
But to give credit where credit is due, Morgan didn't list the "Who got rid of the pesky TOURISTS!" feat, which IS another proof of fan-service, but is also most welcome.
I actually didn't like that. MI4 is the most hated game in the series, but it's not like it NEVER HAPPENED. The freaking game was made, okay? This whole "Oh, well 90% of our fans hate MI4, so we'll just ignore it." idea is pure bullcrap. I'm happy to say that I'm in the 10% that actually LIKED it. How can you not like MI4 (besides Monkey Kombat) It has great humor that goes along with the other games, three new islands, all of which were fun to explore, Otis and Carla (with voices), Stan, Murray (no matter how forced his appearance was). There were minor frustrations, I'll admit. But the whole "plot inconsistencies"? When has a MI game NOT had plot inconsistencies? Graphics and sound? You're complaining constantly about the graphics and sound of TMI! I guess since I started with MI3 and not MI, I'm different.
I'm just sick of everyone's MI1+2 nostalgia making them think that anything after those two games is pointless franchise milking, as though Curse was tripe or something.
Me too. MI3 and MI4 were made, as I said above. Ron Gilbert is an ALRIGHT game maker, but I think the series can prosper without him. Personally, I don't really wish for him to make "MI III" because
1. it would end the series
2. There's really no point now that MI3 and MI4 have been out for a little over a decade.
3. Maybe we're not meant to know the secret of monkey island.
I dont remember exactly, but i think that you were trying to escape the house by climbing the tree, and thats when you realized there was someone there.
Yeah, fans like that are annoying. Honestly, MI2 had a stupid ending, and MI3 did it's best to fix that, and was the best MI because of it. TOMI has started off really well and looks set to top even MI3, the series is getting better.
Romeo and Juliet had a stupid ending, let's say that their deaths was a bad dream on the part of Juliet and make a sequel in which they have romantic adventures.
The whole Oedipus saga needs a redo in which he is able to triumph against all odds, and does not marry his mother.
Macbeth should realize the deceptions of the witches in time to avert their prophecies. It's so dumb that he died. Now they can't make more stories, idiots.
God, so it's ok for him to beg for a beyond good and evil sequel, but when it's a monkey island sequel it's suddenly crap and deserves extreme criticism?
Beyond Good and Evil hadn't been made as long ago, hadn't become "iconic", and didn't have a controversial ending with a myriad of interpretations.
For someone so shite at making adventure games, he's quick to judge.
For someone who's never attempted to make an adventure game, you're sure quick to judge.
I actually didn't like that. MI4 is the most hated game in the series, but it's not like it NEVER HAPPENED. The freaking game was made, okay?
It's true: Escape gets too little credit...and Curse gets far too much. It's always 1-3 and then kicking the crap out of Escape, when Curse and Escape should be lumped together.
Curse and Escape really SHOULDN'T have happened..but they're alright, have a few great qualities, and do no real *harm*, so whatever.
1. it would end the series
Oh no, how scary, a series actually ending with dignity. Sometimes it's actually nice to draw a line before you're just shambling on because the name attracts money.
2. There's really no point now that MI3 and MI4 have been out for a little over a decade.
That's true. At this point, sadly, the damage is done.
3. Maybe we're not meant to know the secret of monkey island.
The Secret of Monkey Island doesn't matter to me, it's the Secret of Big Woop that has my attention.
Romeo and Juliet had a stupid ending, let's say that their deaths was a bad dream on the part of Juliet and make a sequel in which they have romantic adventures.
The whole Oedipus saga needs a redo in which he is able to triumph against all odds, and does not marry his mother.
Macbeth should realize the deceptions of the witches in time to avert their prophecies. It's so dumb that he died. Now they can't make more stories, idiots.
I don't think the plot of Monkey Island 1 and 2 is even close to being on par with the works of Shakespeare (not to mention there's a clear difference between an ending where the main character literally DIES, and an ending that is left open to interpretation), but that's just me.
Mi3 and Mi4 did NOT ruin the series. Heck, they made it better. Mi1 and 2 were great games, but Mi3 brought the series to a younger audience, myself included. Mi4 wasn't super, but it was still enjoyable the first time round, even if it wasn't nearly as good as 3.
Just because MI2 is old and people grew up with it doesn't mean it's good. The majority of the game was awesome, but the "It's all a dream" ending was an annoying cliche that has been done too many times. It was lazy, and I don't get why people keep saying it's a climatic ending, as I finished MI2 I thought, Gee, that's stupid.
MI3 resurrected the series from that godawful ending, and it is by no means a crappy fan-made ripoff. It's better. And Yahtzee is a fool for not seeing that.
Mi3 and Mi4 did NOT ruin the series. Heck, they made it better. Mi1 and 2 were great games, but Mi3 brought the series to a younger audience, myself included.
I can draw an arrow to something awesome in a turd shaped like that awesome thing, but that doesn't make the turd itself worthwhile. And I have no reason to CARE who it "brought to the series", because *I* already knew it. I don't NEED new people in who are afraid of any drastic dramatic changes coming into play. I didn't NEED the modern fanbase.
Mi4 wasn't super, but it was still enjoyable the first time round, even if it wasn't nearly as good as 3.
Monkey Island 3 and 4 were enjoyable the first time around, even if they weren't as good as 1 or 2. Escape and Curse are the same level of enjoyment. They're good adventures. Curse gets too much credit, Escape gets too little.
Just because MI2 is old and people grew up with it doesn't mean it's good. The majority of the game was awesome, but the "It's all a dream" ending was an annoying cliche that has been done too many times. It was lazy, and I don't get why people keep saying it's a climatic ending, as I finished MI2 I thought, Gee, that's stupid.
It's NOT an "it was all a dream" ending, Curse's idiotic and insipid decision to completely gloss over the sequence is.
"It was a trick" is stupid, insipid, blatant rip-off when you look at the ending in Monkey Island 2. The whole thing begs to be explored in detail, and the one thing that absolutely ruins the entire narrative of the third game is that it does away with any sense of ambiguity and outright says that it was all a magic trick by LeChuck.
THAT is a "it was a dream" ending, because it INVALIDATES what we saw. It being a fantasy does NOT dillute it, we already KNOW it's a fantasy. It's just now a fantasy with two parts, with depth, with some kind of INTELLIGENCE to it. And because people constantly fear and turn away from the light because the idea that reality isn't quite what it seems is scary.
"It was a dream" is reviled FOR THE VERY SAME REASONS that the Curse ending exists! WHY is it bad? Because often we see some drastic change, usually a character death, and then brought back to safe and cozy status quo land. They want the dramatic impact of the event without having to CHANGE anything, and you CAN'T have it both ways. Whether it is Gilbert or the writers of Curse, if you make a huge revelation and then find a way to drop it without exploring the concept further...THAT IS THE "IT WAS ALL A DREAM" ENDING. Curse was the equivalent of the television trope, NOT the ending of LeChuck's Revenge.
MI3 resurrected the series from that godawful ending, and it is by no means a crappy fan-made ripoff. It's better. And Yahtzee is a fool for not seeing that.
I *like* the ending just fine, thanks. I love it. It's probably my favorite video game ending.
Beyond Good and Evil hadn't been made as long ago, hadn't become "iconic", and didn't have a controversial ending with a myriad of interpretations.
Not to mention that BG&E was written as the first of trilogy. It's designed to have a sequel.
Also, Fury? Repeatedly stating an opinion does not make it more true. Try making arguements more often.
You at least said something worth discussing in being unimpressed with the ending of MI2.
I'll grant that "it was all a dream"(although "Chucky's" last second face-pull complicates it) isn't a great ending, but Gilbert apparently had a third game in mind; this wasn't supposed to be the end. You're judging a story based on the mid-point, but since we're likely never to see the "real" MI3, this is indeed a serious problem.
It's just that in the beginning, Yahtzee wasn't that bad, he praised Portal and Psychonauts. But now he seems to criticize just for the sake of criticism, however "valid" they may be.
I completely agree. Yahtzee has sold out. His reviews lack balance. You can't take anything away from them except maybe he hates this game more then he hates that game. He even admits he's not really allowed to praise games anymore because he fans revolt.
He just bashes games because that's what made him popular. As long as he hates on every game he reviews he gets to keep making a weekly segment and sell the t-shirts.
It's like that episode of the Simpsons where Homer becomes a food critic. At the start he praises all the restaurant he goes to because he loves food. Then the other critics tell him he needs throw in a negative review every once in a while, so does a negative review and all the readers love it. So all he does from then on is write negative reviews. (Then all the restaurant owners try to murder him but the plot had completely fallen apart by that point.)
Yahtzee has turned out just like Homer. All he does is produce crowd-pleasing negative reviews and because of that his opinions will never have any artistic merit for me. (I'm not going to try to murder him or anything, just continue to write snide posts on forums )
What kind of last word would it be to find out that Vader is Luke's father, and to have Luke run away about being beaten?
Actually..... we are getting 3 more Starwars movies that are squeals.
Lucas said he is definitely going to make them but needs a couple of years as a breather before he does.
I completely agree. Yahtzee has sold out. His reviews lack balance. You can't take anything away from them except maybe he hates this game more then he hates that game. He even admits he's not really allowed to praise games anymore because he fans revolt.
He just bashes games because that's what made him popular. As long as he hates on every game he reviews he gets to keep making a weekly segment and sell the t-shirts.
It's like that episode of the Simpsons where Homer becomes a food critic. At the start he praises all the restaurant he goes to because he loves food. Then the other critics tell him he needs throw in a negative review every once in a while, so does a negative review and all the readers love it. So all he does from then on is write negative reviews. (Then all the restaurant owners try to murder him but the plot had completely fallen apart by that point.)
Yahtzee has turned out just like Homer. All he does is produce crowd-pleasing negative reviews and because of that his opinions will never have any artistic merit for me. I for one am over it. (I'm not going to try to murder him or anything, just post snide posts on forums )
Lol that's true. Nice work. You should send that as an email to Yahtzee.
I wonder if Yahtzee checks this forum. He might. Probably not.
Still, I was expecting another positive review like Psychonauts.
Let's hope he doesn't destroy Brutal Legend as well. If he does that, then he's sold out completely.
I thought he was on the side of the indy gamer? Guess I was wrong.
Lol that's true. Nice work. You should send that as an email to Yahtzee.
I wonder if Yahtzee checks this forum. He might. Probably not.
Still, I was expecting another positive review like Psychonauts.
Let's hope he doesn't destroy Brutal Legend as well. If he does that, then he's sold out completely.
I thought he was on the side of the indy gamer? Guess I was wrong.
So every indie game is brilliant with no flaws whatsoever and should never be challenged ever or else you're an enemy?
By his standards the ToMI review was almost a positive, and if you look at the comments he's actually getting flack for reviewing a game most people don't seem to know about (according to the people making the comments), and are complaining that he isn't reviewing enough mainstream games.
I like Yatzee's stuff, but I definitely don't agree with everything he says. If you want a proper review go somewhere else, but if you want to watch something funny, cutting, childish and peurile then Yahtzee's your man.
I agreed with some of the stuff he said, but he simply let spite and stubborness get in the way of a thoroughly enjoyable game, I doubt any new Monkey Island no matter what could have appeased him.
If you want a proper review go somewhere else, but if you want to watch something funny, cutting, childish and peurile then Yahtzee's your man.
I wouldn't say that, the man makes great points and is an intelligent reviewer, giving the industry a slap here and there for the laziness and lack of creativity that's inherent in a lot of it, just cos he talks about wee-wee's and boobs makes him a bit more entertaining, but no less valid than the next opinion
The thing I REALLY disagreed with and which discredits his entire monologue completely is the fact that the called the Secret of Monkey Island 2: LeChuck's Revenge the last game in the series and that the game ended with an ender, that after this game there could never be another Monkey Island game, thus making the Curse of Monkey Island and Escape of Monkey Island pretty much redundant, while it was pretty much a well known fact that the Secret of Monkey Island was originally supposed to be a trilogy, concluding with the revelation of the actual Secret of Monkey Island, although due to the fact that the main people working on the previous two games left other people just had to make up a new storyline to continue the saga.
And yes, there's zero punctuation in that line, aside from some commas.
I wouldn't say that, the man makes great points and is an intelligent reviewer, giving the industry a slap here and there for the laziness and lack of creativity that's inherent in a lot of it, just cos he talks about wee-wee's and boobs makes him a bit more entertaining, but no less valid than the next opinion
Oh, I agree, that's what I meant by cutting, he gets some insightful comments in, which I should have explained better. It is peurile (is that spelt right? Do I care?) and childish because of the language he uses and stuff, but that is the style of humour he is going for so it's not a problem, its all part of the show.
Seeing all the unquestioning worship of MI3 is to me a bit like seeing a bunch of people worshiping Godfather III as the greatest in the series because it feels more modern and was the first one they saw.
Otherwise, Rather Dashing has rather eloquently expressed almost my exact thoughts on this subject. I'm quite impressed he has the patience to keep it up, frankly.
Seeing all the unquestioning worship of MI3 is to me a bit like seeing a bunch of people worshiping Godfather III as the greatest in the series because it feels more modern and was the first one they saw.
Personally, I mainly liked Curse because it was a good game.
On its own I think Curse is quite a decent and enjoyable game; on its own I think Godfather III is quite a decent and enjoyable film. But taken as latter-day additions to what for years appeared to be a self contained duo, there are some issues I can't just pretend aren't there. The lack of necessity isn't the least of these.
What makes the third Monkey Island game any less necessary than the first two? When you get down to it, all that is really necessary is food and drink (and shelter depending on the climate), everything else is just optional.
Curse is in fact my favourite Monkey Island game; to hell with if it's necessary or not. I just loved the visual style of that game, the characters (pretty much all of them are memorable), the music, everything. The thing is, the first two MI games are a bit limited in what they could achieve, due to the technology of the time. By 1997 however, they could create pretty much perfect games (CMI, Grim Fandango, etc). After that, it was all about perfecting all the aspects of video games.
That said, I absolutely love the first two Monkey Island games as well, and for the record, yes, I played those first, before CMI was released.
Yahtzee has just published a ToMI-related feature on sequels for The Escapist; it confirms my impression: his main problem with Tales is that he considers it only a timid, "harmless" fanboy creation. Although I agree with the central idea of the article (sequels must at least try to improve the prototype), I think he's wrong about the game itself: Telltale is indeed brave enough to show some healthy disrespect for the franchise (merfolk?!). They're doing it right.
Oh, I agree, that's what I meant by cutting, he gets some insightful comments in, which I should have explained better. It is peurile (is that spelt right? Do I care?) and childish because of the language he uses and stuff, but that is the style of humour he is going for so it's not a problem, its all part of the show.
Correct! Anyway, he didn't like TOMI, therefore I automatically hate him and am going to send him anthrax in the post. That'll show him that viral game reviews truly are serious business!
Correct! Anyway, he didn't like TOMI, therefore I automatically hate him and am going to send him anthrax in the post. That'll show him that viral game reviews truly are serious business!
Yahtzee just made it serious business by writing an article about it though. Apparently, he's really bitter about people making Monkey Island sequels. Well, good for him.
It sounds like his biggest problem with it was just the fact that it's a new Monkey Island, and any Monkey Island after 2 is illegitimate.
What makes you think that? His point was that sequels should try to be better than what came before rather than wallow in fandom, not that sequels should never be made(that was just wishful thinking).
What makes the third Monkey Island game any less necessary than the first two? When you get down to it, all that is really necessary is food and drink (and shelter depending on the climate), everything else is just optional.
Actually, food is mostly optional. People can live weeks without food. People can die within a few days without fluids.
Seeing all the unquestioning worship of MI3 is to me a bit like seeing a bunch of people worshiping Godfather III as the greatest in the series because it feels more modern and was the first one they saw.
Ah! That is going to be the analogy I use from now on. The one I thought of was the Star Wars prequels, but really Curse and Escape are too competent to be compared to those. Godfather III is a competent enough film to be compared to Curse and Escape, because they really are fairly good games at their core(with some excellent aspects, like Curse's background art and Dominic Armato's performance).
Otherwise, Rather Dashing has rather eloquently expressed almost my exact thoughts on this subject. I'm quite impressed he has the patience to keep it up, frankly.
I'd call it a lack of patience, really. I decide "Okay, I've said what I want to", and then decide to try and not make incendiary remarks to this group again, because I don't want to show up just to ruffle feathers. But the praise for Curse as equal to or even BETTER THAN the first two games builds up, and the pressure just "pops the cork" and I show up again.
What makes the third Monkey Island game any less necessary than the first two? When you get down to it, all that is really necessary is food and drink (and shelter depending on the climate), everything else is just optional.
Well I'm coming from the perspective that I always assumed (and still believe) MI2 was basically intended to be the end, though with a potential 'get out clause' thrown in there with the whole LeChuck spell thing. I like my stories to conclude and I thought that was a great note to end on. So when a mostly new team decides they want to bring the series back years later I'm going to question its necessary more than if they were picking things up from a straightforward open ending.
Unfortunately the wider aim of Curse seemed to be restore the series status quo so we can have more and more Monkey Islands for however long it's still profitable to make them. This isn't the end of the world, because even these latter day MIs are pleasant enough for the most part. But from a 'games as art' perspective I definitely think the series would've been better left as a consistent and self contained duo with a controversial enigmatic finale, instead of The Infinite Adventures of Guybrush Threepwood.
Comments
I don't really think it reversed it either though, in MI2 itself it's very strongly hinted at that Guybrush being a child is just Lechuck putting him under a spell. That's exactly the explanation Curse uses, and Lechuck even does it again at the ending bit of Curse.
And this conversation will happen in every thread on every MI board from now until Ron says what he supposedly would have done for an MI3, and for a while after that too, heh.
It's when you get 5 six-sided dice to all land on the same number when you roll them.
Part of Speech: n
Definition: a trademarked board game involving rolling dice and keeping score
Etymology: originally called the 'yacht game'
Usage: trademark
Or:
Zero Punctuation is The Escapist's groundbreaking video review series starring Ben "Yahtzee" Croshaw. Every Wednesday Zero Punctuation picks apart the games so you don't have to. Called "hilariously cutting ... first legitimate breakout hit from the gaming community in recent memory" by Boing Boing, see why gamers love it and developers fear it.
Yeah, fans like that are annoying. Honestly, MI2 had a stupid ending, and MI3 did it's best to fix that, and was the best MI because of it. TOMI has started off really well and looks set to top even MI3, the series is getting better.
God, so it's ok for him to beg for a beyond good and evil sequel, but when it's a monkey island sequel it's suddenly crap and deserves extreme criticism?
It's stupid!
Have any of you played Yahtzee's Adventure games? One of the puzzles involves kicking a tree, for no reason, cos there's a guy in it. You can't see the guy. There are no whistling noises or anything. You just have to kick it.
For someone so shite at making adventure games, he's quick to judge.
I actually didn't like that. MI4 is the most hated game in the series, but it's not like it NEVER HAPPENED. The freaking game was made, okay? This whole "Oh, well 90% of our fans hate MI4, so we'll just ignore it." idea is pure bullcrap. I'm happy to say that I'm in the 10% that actually LIKED it. How can you not like MI4 (besides Monkey Kombat)
Me too. MI3 and MI4 were made, as I said above. Ron Gilbert is an ALRIGHT game maker, but I think the series can prosper without him. Personally, I don't really wish for him to make "MI III" because
1. it would end the series
2. There's really no point now that MI3 and MI4 have been out for a little over a decade.
3. Maybe we're not meant to know the secret of monkey island.
Nah, you have to gather people for a meeting.
Yahtzee sucks.
MI pwns.
Nuff said.
The whole Oedipus saga needs a redo in which he is able to triumph against all odds, and does not marry his mother.
Macbeth should realize the deceptions of the witches in time to avert their prophecies. It's so dumb that he died. Now they can't make more stories, idiots.
Beyond Good and Evil hadn't been made as long ago, hadn't become "iconic", and didn't have a controversial ending with a myriad of interpretations.
For someone who's never attempted to make an adventure game, you're sure quick to judge.
It's true: Escape gets too little credit...and Curse gets far too much. It's always 1-3 and then kicking the crap out of Escape, when Curse and Escape should be lumped together.
Curse and Escape really SHOULDN'T have happened..but they're alright, have a few great qualities, and do no real *harm*, so whatever.
Oh no, how scary, a series actually ending with dignity. Sometimes it's actually nice to draw a line before you're just shambling on because the name attracts money.
That's true. At this point, sadly, the damage is done.
The Secret of Monkey Island doesn't matter to me, it's the Secret of Big Woop that has my attention.
I don't think the plot of Monkey Island 1 and 2 is even close to being on par with the works of Shakespeare (not to mention there's a clear difference between an ending where the main character literally DIES, and an ending that is left open to interpretation), but that's just me.
Please don't refer to Curse as "damage."
Just because MI2 is old and people grew up with it doesn't mean it's good. The majority of the game was awesome, but the "It's all a dream" ending was an annoying cliche that has been done too many times. It was lazy, and I don't get why people keep saying it's a climatic ending, as I finished MI2 I thought, Gee, that's stupid.
MI3 resurrected the series from that godawful ending, and it is by no means a crappy fan-made ripoff. It's better. And Yahtzee is a fool for not seeing that.
Monkey Island 3 and 4 were enjoyable the first time around, even if they weren't as good as 1 or 2. Escape and Curse are the same level of enjoyment. They're good adventures. Curse gets too much credit, Escape gets too little.
It's NOT an "it was all a dream" ending, Curse's idiotic and insipid decision to completely gloss over the sequence is.
"It was a trick" is stupid, insipid, blatant rip-off when you look at the ending in Monkey Island 2. The whole thing begs to be explored in detail, and the one thing that absolutely ruins the entire narrative of the third game is that it does away with any sense of ambiguity and outright says that it was all a magic trick by LeChuck.
THAT is a "it was a dream" ending, because it INVALIDATES what we saw. It being a fantasy does NOT dillute it, we already KNOW it's a fantasy. It's just now a fantasy with two parts, with depth, with some kind of INTELLIGENCE to it. And because people constantly fear and turn away from the light because the idea that reality isn't quite what it seems is scary.
"It was a dream" is reviled FOR THE VERY SAME REASONS that the Curse ending exists! WHY is it bad? Because often we see some drastic change, usually a character death, and then brought back to safe and cozy status quo land. They want the dramatic impact of the event without having to CHANGE anything, and you CAN'T have it both ways. Whether it is Gilbert or the writers of Curse, if you make a huge revelation and then find a way to drop it without exploring the concept further...THAT IS THE "IT WAS ALL A DREAM" ENDING. Curse was the equivalent of the television trope, NOT the ending of LeChuck's Revenge.
I *like* the ending just fine, thanks. I love it. It's probably my favorite video game ending.
Not to mention that BG&E was written as the first of trilogy. It's designed to have a sequel.
Also, Fury? Repeatedly stating an opinion does not make it more true. Try making arguements more often.
You at least said something worth discussing in being unimpressed with the ending of MI2.
I'll grant that "it was all a dream"(although "Chucky's" last second face-pull complicates it) isn't a great ending, but Gilbert apparently had a third game in mind; this wasn't supposed to be the end. You're judging a story based on the mid-point, but since we're likely never to see the "real" MI3, this is indeed a serious problem.
As far as video game endings go, it's pretty poor. Even for a part 2 of 3.
Take any trilogy and take off the third part. Let's try Star Wars, since we're taking about a Lucas Arts series.
What kind of last word would it be to find out that Vader is Luke's father, and to have Luke run away about being beaten?
I completely agree. Yahtzee has sold out. His reviews lack balance. You can't take anything away from them except maybe he hates this game more then he hates that game. He even admits he's not really allowed to praise games anymore because he fans revolt.
He just bashes games because that's what made him popular. As long as he hates on every game he reviews he gets to keep making a weekly segment and sell the t-shirts.
It's like that episode of the Simpsons where Homer becomes a food critic. At the start he praises all the restaurant he goes to because he loves food. Then the other critics tell him he needs throw in a negative review every once in a while, so does a negative review and all the readers love it. So all he does from then on is write negative reviews. (Then all the restaurant owners try to murder him but the plot had completely fallen apart by that point.)
Yahtzee has turned out just like Homer. All he does is produce crowd-pleasing negative reviews and because of that his opinions will never have any artistic merit for me. (I'm not going to try to murder him or anything, just continue to write snide posts on forums
Actually..... we are getting 3 more Starwars movies that are squeals.
Lucas said he is definitely going to make them but needs a couple of years as a breather before he does.
Lol that's true. Nice work. You should send that as an email to Yahtzee.
I wonder if Yahtzee checks this forum. He might. Probably not.
Still, I was expecting another positive review like Psychonauts.
Let's hope he doesn't destroy Brutal Legend as well. If he does that, then he's sold out completely.
I thought he was on the side of the indy gamer? Guess I was wrong.
So every indie game is brilliant with no flaws whatsoever and should never be challenged ever or else you're an enemy?
By his standards the ToMI review was almost a positive, and if you look at the comments he's actually getting flack for reviewing a game most people don't seem to know about (according to the people making the comments), and are complaining that he isn't reviewing enough mainstream games.
I like Yatzee's stuff, but I definitely don't agree with everything he says. If you want a proper review go somewhere else, but if you want to watch something funny, cutting, childish and peurile then Yahtzee's your man.
I wouldn't say that, the man makes great points and is an intelligent reviewer, giving the industry a slap here and there for the laziness and lack of creativity that's inherent in a lot of it, just cos he talks about wee-wee's and boobs makes him a bit more entertaining, but no less valid than the next opinion
And yes, there's zero punctuation in that line, aside from some commas.
I see what you did there.
Yeah, that's what I meant.
Oh, I agree, that's what I meant by cutting, he gets some insightful comments in, which I should have explained better.
Otherwise, Rather Dashing has rather eloquently expressed almost my exact thoughts on this subject. I'm quite impressed he has the patience to keep it up, frankly.
Personally, I mainly liked Curse because it was a good game.
Curse is in fact my favourite Monkey Island game; to hell with if it's necessary or not. I just loved the visual style of that game, the characters (pretty much all of them are memorable), the music, everything. The thing is, the first two MI games are a bit limited in what they could achieve, due to the technology of the time. By 1997 however, they could create pretty much perfect games (CMI, Grim Fandango, etc). After that, it was all about perfecting all the aspects of video games.
That said, I absolutely love the first two Monkey Island games as well, and for the record, yes, I played those first, before CMI was released.
Correct! Anyway, he didn't like TOMI, therefore I automatically hate him and am going to send him anthrax in the post. That'll show him that viral game reviews truly are serious business!
...or failing that this CD
What makes you think that? His point was that sequels should try to be better than what came before rather than wallow in fandom, not that sequels should never be made(that was just wishful thinking).
Actually, food is mostly optional. People can live weeks without food. People can die within a few days without fluids.
I'd call it a lack of patience, really. I decide "Okay, I've said what I want to", and then decide to try and not make incendiary remarks to this group again, because I don't want to show up just to ruffle feathers. But the praise for Curse as equal to or even BETTER THAN the first two games builds up, and the pressure just "pops the cork" and I show up again.
Well I'm coming from the perspective that I always assumed (and still believe) MI2 was basically intended to be the end, though with a potential 'get out clause' thrown in there with the whole LeChuck spell thing. I like my stories to conclude and I thought that was a great note to end on. So when a mostly new team decides they want to bring the series back years later I'm going to question its necessary more than if they were picking things up from a straightforward open ending.
Unfortunately the wider aim of Curse seemed to be restore the series status quo so we can have more and more Monkey Islands for however long it's still profitable to make them. This isn't the end of the world, because even these latter day MIs are pleasant enough for the most part. But from a 'games as art' perspective I definitely think the series would've been better left as a consistent and self contained duo with a controversial enigmatic finale, instead of The Infinite Adventures of Guybrush Threepwood.